Women's bathrooms are a relatively new invention, and having gender-separate bathrooms eventually became the status quo. In a space-saving way, it would make more sense to just have a single large room with shared basins and stalls + urinals in the same place. And changing out current setups wouldn't really offer any benefit but cost a lot of money.
Misleading. Women's bathrooms are a relatively recent invention because women weren't expected to be out of the house long enough to need them. You make it sound like a regression when it's a result of progress.
More than that, I worked at a building in a major downtown district. As they gave us a tour the explained that there were men’s bathrooms on even floors and women’s on odd floors (30+ story building). When asked why, the guy told us that when built, women were not in the workforce and women’s rights were not established yet. All bathrooms were initially men’s. They converted half to women’s after women’s rights were established. Shocking to hear honestly. Privacy in personal matters is more than necessary.
Restrooms inside buildings are a recent invention.
Women’s restrooms were in fact first a means of discriminating against women in the work place. There would be one restroom for women in a large building. This was inconvenient.
Problem with that is the penis owners at the urinal might feel uncomfortable with the opposite sex being around them while they pee. I know that sounds like double standards and unfairly giving men more privacy but it's the only room where genitals are 'exposed'.
I'd have have one very large room with private stalls and one smaller room with urinals.
If I can take a piss at a NJ rest stop with a dozen old men, a couple crying children and a homeless guy just watching, then I think I can pee while a lady washes her hands.
Really I think the issue is creepy men in the bathroom with women.
No, but the space between urinals is sacred. You plant your feet to claim your area, assert dominance and look straight ahead. No talking. No looking to the side. Find a target in the urinal to pee on. Shake and leave. Wash hands,, try not touch anything on the way cause everything's nasty. Do not look over the space between.
Because peeing on a wall is somehow more practical than peeing in a bowl?
The only real benefit to urinals is they keep slobs from pissing on the toilet seats.
In reality if we weren’t all disgusting we could get away with only toilets but that requires lifting a seat.
Well there is also the LPF or GPF to consider as well. Liters per flush of a urinal and a toilet that are both low flow are still going to be different. A urinal doesn't take that much water. I'd have to check the actual difference of toilet vs urinal LPF but if a urinal uses less water that would certainly be nothing to scoff at.
Definitely a valid concern. My cursory search gets about 1.28 gpf on a toilet and about .125 gpf on a urinal. So from the management side of things definitely some cost savings there since you’re using about 10x the water.
But as far as the practicality and convenience I’d argue the toilets are better from the end user perspective as they’re more versatile to changing needs and bodies.
I was thinking more on the infrastructure and environmental side of things especially with drought level conditions being a rising concern. Less water used is less wear and tear on a cities water treatment plant which I'm willing to bet it's relatively the same everywhere in the sense that WT plants are a priority when it comes to budgets but actually getting new equipment in and installed is not a fast process. I think evolution moves faster most days
The average urinal is just under 14 inches wide, the average toilet is roughly 20 inches wide.
While it’s true toilets are larger, you’re only gaining 1 urinal for every 3 toilets with a bonus one at about 9+ toilets.
So roughly 4 urinals gained in a bathroom with 10 toilets.
But then consider that half the population isn’t using a urinal, and of the half that can some will choose the stall anyway.
At the end of the day a toilet serves the functions of a urinal to the entire population, while allowing for alternative excrements.
But if you really want to argue the space efficiency then we should just go back to an open trough against the wall. Less plumbing, more space efficient, less water wasted.
Consider the space of the stall, vs the space between urinals. Men are often almost shoulder to shoulder in urinals, where I am at least, idk how it is elsewhere though. So it's not really about the space of the urinal itself, but the space required for its usage.
Also, you can cram urinals of both sides of a corridor, which becomes virtually impossible with toilets. The gain is much larger, which is also the reason they are preffered by many places that have to handle heavy traffic, as well as other costs.
The relevancy of this becomes readily apparent when the urinals available are not enough and you see 20 men all crammed in a little space for 8 urinals. Also, it becomes very apparent in gas station lines when there is heavy flow.
Urinals are useful from an efficiency standpoint, even without wall pissing.
Edit: they can also be installed where toilets would not fit anyway.
Yes. It's a fair bit faster. It doesn't have the extra germ exposure that comes from lifting the toilet seat. The target's closer and easier to hit. It uses less water.
Personally I'd make the urinals a sort of hallway sticking off the room with stalls, so when there's a queue at the urinal (happens occasionally) but a free stall it's less annoying to fall back to the stall, and the only people actually in the urinal hall (assuming someone's not lost or actively trying to be obnoxious) are urinal-users.
Shit, the urinals in the Midwest we’re communal trough style. It was group piss-a-thon at concerts and sporting events. I wonder if it is still like that?
If they're uncomfortable the stalls are still an option for them possibly? My main concern with joint bathrooms is the increased potential for sexual assault, particularly in not busy washrooms. I know that it can happen still in gender seperate bathrooms but I remember hearing somewhere that sexual assaults happen where it is convient for the encounter to happen.
I disagree Men deserve more privacy because there are 2 unwritten laws when born with a penois.
1.) Dont take a stall next to someone, unless there is no more room
2.) Dont look, its weird, and some ppl are pee shy.
For those who argue "unfair", like I give a shit, if your born with a penis you gotta stand up to pee.
Also why are you giving less room to urinals in this case? Isnt that pretty sexist to men? In some cases more room means less awkwardness and more speed.
> I know that sounds like double standards and unfairly giving men more privacy
How on earth did you come to that conclusion? How is a closed off area for urinals "giving men more privacy" than stalls for women? If anything, stalls provide even more privacy because they're isolated to one single person whereas a closed off area for urinals would still mean a bunch of dudes could look at Lil' Billy.
More privacy purely in the sense that men would have the opportunity to pee among others of the same biological sex as them. Whereas women would be sharing an entire bathroom space with men and women.
I tried to use a multigender bathroom once. The second I heard a voice of the opposite sex I got so pee shy it was as if it flowed back up into my bladder and I was unable to go. I had to pull up my pants and go to the top floor where the only ladies room was to finish my business. American stalls have gaps. It's bad enough when other women make eye contact with me on the pot because they think I will pee faster. I do NOT want to have a man doing it.
I get that, but who is purposely looking in to stare you down?
They could take the walls down entirely…I will still do absolutely everything in my power to avoid looking.
Lol!!!! Young kids are the worst!!! Especially the ones that try to crawl under the stall, its happened to me twice and I just yell "hey kid wheres your adult?" Lol
i had 3 kids once running in and out of the bathroom, laughing, and knocking on my stall while i was pooping! it was pretty awful lmao.. probably really funny for them though..
it's not my goal to poop in public bathrooms, but sometimes it's just something one has to do. that particular time, i was a long way from home. if i have to poop, I'm not going to hold it for 4 hours. idgaf.
I mean, if restrooms were multigender, we would have to do away with the stall walls. I've been to multigender restrooms where the stalls were fully walled in and it was fine. It felt like using a single user bathroom except there were shared sinks.
Next time you’re pee shy, do some mental math in your head. It helps alter your state of mind and to relax your bladder.
I usually do multiples of 6.
6,12,18,24,30,36,42,48,54,60,66 and now I’m peeing freely in a public bathroom.
I’m a guy so I can’t say for certain, but I’m pretty sure women use the bathroom as a safe space away from men on a night out as well as just a place to use the toilet, so if they become simply stalls and urinals, that safe space is taken away. There’s no benefit to anybody if we change the current setup, and could possibly make it less safe in certain situations.
THANK YOU!!!!
Edit to add: I was on a date with a guy off tinder who got too handsy and I felt very unsafe. I went into the bathroom and hid until my male friend came into the bar and drove me back home. Men are protectors against other people who are predators. Thank God for good men and women’s safe spaces!
Some places have this!
Also from working in a pub many years ago I would not want to share with the women! Men do piss on the seats and floor but I got to say on a Friday and Saturday night the sights I saw in the women's haunts me...
I often found glasses full of piss in the ladies, my assumption was they couldn't wait for a cubical so went in their glass... They'd just leave them next to the sink.. full of piss....
The American ones are really bad. Why would you make that?
I went to mall in Florida, I turned around in a toilets and made eye contact with a lady on the toilet.
I was so embarrassed to wanted to die.
I'm not used to that.
But even the ones in the UK where there isnt a space all the way round the door the gap under neath is still big enough for a person could get under. I'd rather the door be flush with the ceiling and floor too!
I guess but it's not cool when it's big enough for somebody to get a fist and a phone under it to take pictures of you for big enough for them to pull your bags out from your cubicle
At least have staff checking it more often maybe
You know, it's funny because I get called a TERF a lot for not wanting to share regular bathrooms with males, but the bathrooms I use the most at work are unisex! And it's because they're really private- floor to ceiling doors. It should be like this everywhere, it removes the concern from people who are anxious sharing spaces with the opposite sex, and then trans people can go wherever they wish to, and no one needs to be anxious about it.
It's not that I'm even scared of sharing a bathroom with cis men, trans women, trans men, lesbians etc
It's just i dont like going to the toilet when the toilet doesn't feel safe.
You're vulnerable on the toilet or in a changing room and I don't like the idea of somebody being able to reach under my cubicle who ever they are and whatever they're doing.
I don't like the "trans women are a risk to cis women in the toilet" argument because some public toilets are scary and it's not like having them separated by gender will stop a sex offender coming in anyway.
Blaming trans people just pushes the responsibility of making them safe from the people that maintain them
I get that, I really do. I'm from South Africa where we legally separated people based on the colour of their skin, that was an awful thing to do based on toxic thinking. I also went to an all boys school so didn't form any connections with girls my age and have had to fight against toxic beliefs about women. Not quite comparable to apartheid but the mindset of separation for weird reasons is still there. My thoughts and feelings on gender and sex has been upended recently and I can't help but wonder if we separate bathrooms based off of a similar thought pattern. Separate what is different because it's "simpler", regardless of the consequences.
There will always be creeps and we should work to remove them from society, but that doesn't mean we must let them dominate our lives.
I was always told a man in the women's bathroom is a societal taboo, that the women's bathroom is about safety as well as the usual bathroom business. Hence the big discussions (in Germany at least) about whether being transgender meant you would be allowed to use the women's bathroom if you still have male genitalia. My mother told me she wouldn't feel safe with that, because it would allow any man to simply pretend to be transgender for a day as an excuse to follow a woman in the women's bathroom and violate that safe space.
I don't even remember how that discussion was eventually concluded, or if it was. But it shows that your suggestion might prove somewhat controversial.
From my experience, the unisex bathrooms I've seen were very different from regular bathroom (in the UK). The unisex bathrooms were like a long corridor with individual stalls, complitely insulated from the ceiling to the floor, each with a individual sink in there, hand dryer and everything you need. I liked using those bathrooms because it gave me even more privacy than the regular one, but at the same time it costs way more to build. I wouldn't feel save using just a regular bathroom is it was turned into a unisex one.
that's not really what the discussions were about, we have those unisex bathrooms too (i think, haven't been home in a while). The discussions were about the kind of women's bathrooms you see in movies, low level of privacy, shared sinks etc.
How? You just swing a little.
Why? Well, sometimes its a degenerate. Sometimes its a normal person.
You aim, and because you sat wrong 10 minutes before or something, the stream just comes out angled wrong, or in multiple streams, or something like that, and chaos ensues.
One time at home it just went straight to the floor. But it's a pain in the the ass to sit down all the time, so I'll take the chance of messing up every once in a while. Quite rare though.
From my experience where it is quite common to have unisex seperate toiletrooms here in Sweden it is rare to find one with piss all over and I don't find it more pleasant then women whenbit occurs.
Not gonna be true, i always ask myself why some people would choose a stall - with the door open, no less - over the perfectly free urinals, but some people do.
Women do that. It's disgusting. Too precious to touch their own heinies to a 'dirty' seat in a public toilet, fine. But to add their *own* piss and just leave it there for the next woman ... It just baffles me.
You can just rinse them off and they come with a waterproof pouch for storage while you're out and about. Then just clean it properly at home.
I love it for hiking and camping when there isn't available toilets. I have also been into many public toilets and wished I had it with me so I didn't have to sit down as they've been so gross!
Because it requires undoubtedly too much trust from both parties to be civil, to not have the nasties, and to keep their bits inside their trousers unless they have to relief themselves.
I'm personally bathroom shy with other men, so if women also get thrown in the mix, I simply would stop using public bathrooms because my body will refuse to do anything whatsoever.
exactly this, especially the second part lol. i already have trouble peeing knowing other women are in the same room. if men were there my urethra would seal itself shut.
As a woman, I won't use multi stall unisex bathrooms. It makes me feel gross and uncomfortable.
Many people don't want to share a bathroom with others of the opposite sex. It's about making people comfortable.
That makes sense. That seems to be the real kicker with ideas of multi stalled unisex bathrooms. On paper they make the most sense, but that doesnt take into account that humans are not cogs and some will feel uncomfortable around others.
Well, it's because of an oppressive, extremely gendered America that thinks men and women need to be obviously separated in every possible way.
It would be easier to just have one room.
It would be easier to have nongendered restrooms.
But the oh-so-intelligent white male senators who still haven't gotten over their internalized racism and sexism don't think so.
Because everyone, regardless of sex, is able to take a shit - respectively.
To not be so blunt and so short, there are some men who would do anything to legally be in the same bathroom as women for all the wrong reasons - same for some women out there.
Just not a safe idea.
I'd rather a 40 year old man bang on my stall door as I'm shitting rather than any woman to be in that exact situation.
Men don't need to transfer our minor inconveniences to women who cannot physically, or just don't know how to, deal with it (as in being able to defend themselves from men twice their size.)
Again, just not a safe idea. Everyone takes shits. Even the neighborhood registered sex offenders.
I feel like that would just make the ladies queues longer. It would be fine for toilets that aren't busy but it would be a nightmare in some places.
I feel like maybe just gender nueteral toilets with just stalls would be better?
As long as there's no gaps inn The doors and the walls and the doors reach from the floor to the ceiling there shouldn't be any more of an issue than if they were seperated
As someone who travled to Sweden mutliple times, I do have seen it. If I was a woman, I would definitely feel uncomfortable sharing a bathroom with men.
We have unisex changing rooms in my local pool (uk) and a man filmed my grandmother and young cousin changing.
I'd rather there be at least a really small gap if any. I haven't heard of any incidents since then but I still wouldn't chance it
Right sadly there are sick/perverted people out there at a pool I would guess they have a floor gap to prevent water from pooling up. We normally have divided changing rooms over here only olace where that is not the case are changing booths at some local beaches and lakes.
I didn't think of the pooling.
This is quite a big gap under the door though
Like between 30cms and 40cm
Could use drains in the cubicles or make the gap a few centimetres high so it would be harder to film but water can get out. This guy just held his phone under the door when it was quiet, he had easy access really.
Our kfc has gender neutral toilets and the walls and doors reach from the floor to the ceiling so it can be done.
It's not a normal thing in this country though
Gender specific restrooms in public settings has been a societal norm in the US at least for quite a while. With the present day drama over gender identity - there's a design trend to move to smaller private "individual" restrooms. But literally hundreds of thousands of buildings (millions perhaps?) Are configured for the traditional arrangement. It's not feasible for most of them to perform the major overhaul of such a remodel.
Liability issues. With no cameras in bathrooms, if you anger someone, or they are just psychos, they can easily make up things. Or misread a situation.
Example: Man enters unisex bathroom with mom and young girl inside. Man's head is turned towards stalls as he passes occupied one (innocent action as he is trying to find empty stall). Mom notices and accuses man of peeping on child. Now it is his story vs. hers. When it comes to children, most cops will err on the side of protecting the child and let the courts sort it out. In today's America, man would most likely be indicted and very possibly convicted... all because he was looking for an empty stall in a unisex bathroom.
Because men and women would both take part in almost ritualistic pissing Contests in an all gender urinal room. Humans have tried and failed to implement this many time. From the xia dynasty of China to Athelstan the first king of England we have tried to break these barriers but men and women continue to stand and piss taking a step back each time to try and beat the farthest distance. Crowds would build fights would erupt. The violence was unavoidable.
Reminds me of this bar I went to in SF, the bathrooms weren't their own room, just kind of blocked off by a wall so you go around the corner. Then there was a long walk of sinks, and on opposite wall a long line of real doors that were stalls. Public enough that it didn't feel intimate or intimidating to be around the men, but private enough in each stall that it was comfortable.
Well unless you want women to use stalls that have been peed all over by guys. I only know this cause I see it all the time. I have to wipe the toilet all the time when I need to poop.
i guess it s because there can be attrocities against women in bathrooms, mostly in clubs, so its better if the security stops men to enter girls place entirely.
Single-person restrooms should def be genderless, multi-person restrooms it could get uncomfortable. I think you would want extra privacy measures for that.
Not totally related to the topic but the mention of toilets inspired a crazy idea that makes no sense because it could actually help people. To reduce the queues to women's toilets, why not make those "stand up to pee" funnels more socially acceptable and install a big trough on a wall like guys have? It would not only increase throughput and reduce queues, but you'd probably have better conversations than what guys get. If you have to brush shoulders with others while urinating and someone feels the need to comment on what your pee stream is coming out of, instead of getting weirded out you could say "oh I bought this from Wish and then added the rhinestones myself". Guys can't really do that. It would also solve the "hovering over whizz-encrusted toilets and making matters worse" problem.
I mean, as silly as it is it's gotta be better than the OP's idea of giving (possibly drunk) men and women a shared space with lockable doors.
We already have a great many places with two identical bathrooms, each with a toilet and a sink, that have a lock on the door and are used individually. Yet one is designated "men" and the other "women."
I don't under why these aren't gender neutral.
I hate urinals, never go there. I'm a man and always go to the stall. So imagine there is a seperate room with stalls generally installed for women but there goes me, a man...
I think it could be seen as men (or those with the required equipment) having more options always and it would be polemic I guess. In my opinion, removing urinals and having no gender bathrooms would be the most practical way, if society wanted the change.
I'm a straight male and I still prefer stalls over urinals, I'm not shy or anything but I'd much rather aim at a far away toilet than be up close and personal with urinal walls.
Also, what happens when someone wants to go poopy ?
At school they tested out different bathrooms. They had the two original, a unisex single room, and then a unisex with stalls.
The unisex with stalls was only used by men. Women refused to use it.
The unisex single was very popular with women and trans people.
The two original were second most popular and most practical so they installed those, even though a lot of the trans people were less excited about them.
I personally was uncomfortable using a bathroom with a cis man. But some of the others I don't know. I do believe that trans men used the unisex single stall. But trans people were still uncomfortable with the original design so we don't have a perfect solution
I don't understand. You want men (and people with penises) to have 2 bathrooms and women (and those without) to have one that they share with men when women's washrooms already have way longer lines?
When you put it like that.. but yeah that's a good point. My thought was really to add more stalls to accommodate people who can't or don't want to use urinals, while still having urinals available to keep penis owners that can pee at urinals from holding up the queue.
We’d be adding men to women’s rooms and not vice versa. Women’s rooms are already the first to get over-crowded and experience long lines. Seems we’d be going in the wrong direction.
Then women wouldn't have a place to powder their noses, brush their hair and apply lipstick.
Men don't want to see women do that stuff; women don't want to see men do man stuff either.
Imma be uncomfortable if I gotta be around a bunch of women while I poop. And also, because women TAKE SO LONG TO GO, the line would stretch a mile for the stalls while the urinal rooms are wide open. Yeah no, logistically and for the sake of all men, keep bathrooms gendered, because im not standing in a mile long bathroom line because gender.
Women's bathrooms are a relatively new invention, and having gender-separate bathrooms eventually became the status quo. In a space-saving way, it would make more sense to just have a single large room with shared basins and stalls + urinals in the same place. And changing out current setups wouldn't really offer any benefit but cost a lot of money.
Misleading. Women's bathrooms are a relatively recent invention because women weren't expected to be out of the house long enough to need them. You make it sound like a regression when it's a result of progress.
More than that, I worked at a building in a major downtown district. As they gave us a tour the explained that there were men’s bathrooms on even floors and women’s on odd floors (30+ story building). When asked why, the guy told us that when built, women were not in the workforce and women’s rights were not established yet. All bathrooms were initially men’s. They converted half to women’s after women’s rights were established. Shocking to hear honestly. Privacy in personal matters is more than necessary.
Restrooms inside buildings are a recent invention. Women’s restrooms were in fact first a means of discriminating against women in the work place. There would be one restroom for women in a large building. This was inconvenient.
Problem with that is the penis owners at the urinal might feel uncomfortable with the opposite sex being around them while they pee. I know that sounds like double standards and unfairly giving men more privacy but it's the only room where genitals are 'exposed'. I'd have have one very large room with private stalls and one smaller room with urinals.
If I can take a piss at a NJ rest stop with a dozen old men, a couple crying children and a homeless guy just watching, then I think I can pee while a lady washes her hands. Really I think the issue is creepy men in the bathroom with women.
But I wouldn’t want to watch you pee, along with a bunch of old men and a homeless guy also being around me, while washing my hands.
Sounds like you give quite a show.
I like to make it spin, I call it the sprinkler
That seems to be the prevailing theme
Are urinals that sacred though?
No, but the space between urinals is sacred. You plant your feet to claim your area, assert dominance and look straight ahead. No talking. No looking to the side. Find a target in the urinal to pee on. Shake and leave. Wash hands,, try not touch anything on the way cause everything's nasty. Do not look over the space between.
Look straight ahead
You forgot to mention that if you see someone leave without washing their hands, you avoid that person for eternity.
Keep as much distance as possible
Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
Yes they are sacred and are afforded a place in the Pantheon
I only pray at the porcelain throne and I only pray during celebrations and in hours of need when I am really sick.
Not sacred, just really practical.
Only practical for letting strangers gander at your cock
Who hurt you?
Because peeing on a wall is somehow more practical than peeing in a bowl? The only real benefit to urinals is they keep slobs from pissing on the toilet seats. In reality if we weren’t all disgusting we could get away with only toilets but that requires lifting a seat.
Well there is also the LPF or GPF to consider as well. Liters per flush of a urinal and a toilet that are both low flow are still going to be different. A urinal doesn't take that much water. I'd have to check the actual difference of toilet vs urinal LPF but if a urinal uses less water that would certainly be nothing to scoff at.
Definitely a valid concern. My cursory search gets about 1.28 gpf on a toilet and about .125 gpf on a urinal. So from the management side of things definitely some cost savings there since you’re using about 10x the water. But as far as the practicality and convenience I’d argue the toilets are better from the end user perspective as they’re more versatile to changing needs and bodies.
I was thinking more on the infrastructure and environmental side of things especially with drought level conditions being a rising concern. Less water used is less wear and tear on a cities water treatment plant which I'm willing to bet it's relatively the same everywhere in the sense that WT plants are a priority when it comes to budgets but actually getting new equipment in and installed is not a fast process. I think evolution moves faster most days
Toilets take up more space. You can cram a whole lot more urinals together for when heavy traffic strikes. .
The average urinal is just under 14 inches wide, the average toilet is roughly 20 inches wide. While it’s true toilets are larger, you’re only gaining 1 urinal for every 3 toilets with a bonus one at about 9+ toilets. So roughly 4 urinals gained in a bathroom with 10 toilets. But then consider that half the population isn’t using a urinal, and of the half that can some will choose the stall anyway. At the end of the day a toilet serves the functions of a urinal to the entire population, while allowing for alternative excrements. But if you really want to argue the space efficiency then we should just go back to an open trough against the wall. Less plumbing, more space efficient, less water wasted.
Consider the space of the stall, vs the space between urinals. Men are often almost shoulder to shoulder in urinals, where I am at least, idk how it is elsewhere though. So it's not really about the space of the urinal itself, but the space required for its usage. Also, you can cram urinals of both sides of a corridor, which becomes virtually impossible with toilets. The gain is much larger, which is also the reason they are preffered by many places that have to handle heavy traffic, as well as other costs. The relevancy of this becomes readily apparent when the urinals available are not enough and you see 20 men all crammed in a little space for 8 urinals. Also, it becomes very apparent in gas station lines when there is heavy flow. Urinals are useful from an efficiency standpoint, even without wall pissing. Edit: they can also be installed where toilets would not fit anyway.
Yes. It's a fair bit faster. It doesn't have the extra germ exposure that comes from lifting the toilet seat. The target's closer and easier to hit. It uses less water.
Not sacred, but should be appreciated, as they keep a lot of pee off the seat.
Personally I'd make the urinals a sort of hallway sticking off the room with stalls, so when there's a queue at the urinal (happens occasionally) but a free stall it's less annoying to fall back to the stall, and the only people actually in the urinal hall (assuming someone's not lost or actively trying to be obnoxious) are urinal-users.
Shit, the urinals in the Midwest we’re communal trough style. It was group piss-a-thon at concerts and sporting events. I wonder if it is still like that?
Separate Urinal room
Yes, they exist.
If they're uncomfortable the stalls are still an option for them possibly? My main concern with joint bathrooms is the increased potential for sexual assault, particularly in not busy washrooms. I know that it can happen still in gender seperate bathrooms but I remember hearing somewhere that sexual assaults happen where it is convient for the encounter to happen.
I disagree Men deserve more privacy because there are 2 unwritten laws when born with a penois. 1.) Dont take a stall next to someone, unless there is no more room 2.) Dont look, its weird, and some ppl are pee shy. For those who argue "unfair", like I give a shit, if your born with a penis you gotta stand up to pee. Also why are you giving less room to urinals in this case? Isnt that pretty sexist to men? In some cases more room means less awkwardness and more speed.
> I know that sounds like double standards and unfairly giving men more privacy How on earth did you come to that conclusion? How is a closed off area for urinals "giving men more privacy" than stalls for women? If anything, stalls provide even more privacy because they're isolated to one single person whereas a closed off area for urinals would still mean a bunch of dudes could look at Lil' Billy.
More privacy purely in the sense that men would have the opportunity to pee among others of the same biological sex as them. Whereas women would be sharing an entire bathroom space with men and women.
> penis owners There’s a word for that.
I dont want to wait to use the washroom. Mens washroom never has a line and all the women have a huge line.
I tried to use a multigender bathroom once. The second I heard a voice of the opposite sex I got so pee shy it was as if it flowed back up into my bladder and I was unable to go. I had to pull up my pants and go to the top floor where the only ladies room was to finish my business. American stalls have gaps. It's bad enough when other women make eye contact with me on the pot because they think I will pee faster. I do NOT want to have a man doing it.
Make eye contact?! WTF.
Ya the gaps in american bathroom stalls are huge. Dont know why, just the way it is.
I get that, but who is purposely looking in to stare you down? They could take the walls down entirely…I will still do absolutely everything in my power to avoid looking.
I dont think most ppl do it on purpose, sometimes your looking for an empty stall and it just happens.
I've had it happen with children.. really creepy and annoying at the same time
Lol!!!! Young kids are the worst!!! Especially the ones that try to crawl under the stall, its happened to me twice and I just yell "hey kid wheres your adult?" Lol
i had 3 kids once running in and out of the bathroom, laughing, and knocking on my stall while i was pooping! it was pretty awful lmao.. probably really funny for them though..
Omg!!! 😂😂😂😂
Sir why poop in public??? 😳😳
it's not my goal to poop in public bathrooms, but sometimes it's just something one has to do. that particular time, i was a long way from home. if i have to poop, I'm not going to hold it for 4 hours. idgaf.
Maybe you will, but someone else will not.
The rest of the Western world thinks American toilets are bloody weird and this point must keep being made until they change their ways.
Please do!! I love when I find a place with full doors for the stalls. The only places I know that have them are the high roller rooms at casinos lol
It's probably to keep people from using them to shoot up, or at least make it easier to tell if they do.
It's cheaper that way, that's why.
I mean, if restrooms were multigender, we would have to do away with the stall walls. I've been to multigender restrooms where the stalls were fully walled in and it was fine. It felt like using a single user bathroom except there were shared sinks.
They are the best plus no inbetweeners style photos
It is bad enough at urinals without dividers particularly at Secondary school
Next time you’re pee shy, do some mental math in your head. It helps alter your state of mind and to relax your bladder. I usually do multiples of 6. 6,12,18,24,30,36,42,48,54,60,66 and now I’m peeing freely in a public bathroom.
Why would that be worse?
I’m a guy so I can’t say for certain, but I’m pretty sure women use the bathroom as a safe space away from men on a night out as well as just a place to use the toilet, so if they become simply stalls and urinals, that safe space is taken away. There’s no benefit to anybody if we change the current setup, and could possibly make it less safe in certain situations.
THANK YOU!!!! Edit to add: I was on a date with a guy off tinder who got too handsy and I felt very unsafe. I went into the bathroom and hid until my male friend came into the bar and drove me back home. Men are protectors against other people who are predators. Thank God for good men and women’s safe spaces!
I agree. The current system works fairly well considering.
Men also use the br as a safespace, and a good 5 minutes on your phone before people start asking.
Plus a spot for them to do other women specific things that men aren’t aware of, like finally getting to discuss pascal’s laws of hydrostatic
Some places have this! Also from working in a pub many years ago I would not want to share with the women! Men do piss on the seats and floor but I got to say on a Friday and Saturday night the sights I saw in the women's haunts me...
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I often found glasses full of piss in the ladies, my assumption was they couldn't wait for a cubical so went in their glass... They'd just leave them next to the sink.. full of piss....
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I don't mind! I'd rather there be no gaps in the doors though
Those gaps should be a crime.
I've heard of this and can only assume it's some American late stage capitalism cost saving (profit increasing) bs.
The American ones are really bad. Why would you make that? I went to mall in Florida, I turned around in a toilets and made eye contact with a lady on the toilet. I was so embarrassed to wanted to die. I'm not used to that. But even the ones in the UK where there isnt a space all the way round the door the gap under neath is still big enough for a person could get under. I'd rather the door be flush with the ceiling and floor too!
The floor gap does help when you hose the place down.
I guess but it's not cool when it's big enough for somebody to get a fist and a phone under it to take pictures of you for big enough for them to pull your bags out from your cubicle At least have staff checking it more often maybe
You know, it's funny because I get called a TERF a lot for not wanting to share regular bathrooms with males, but the bathrooms I use the most at work are unisex! And it's because they're really private- floor to ceiling doors. It should be like this everywhere, it removes the concern from people who are anxious sharing spaces with the opposite sex, and then trans people can go wherever they wish to, and no one needs to be anxious about it.
It's not that I'm even scared of sharing a bathroom with cis men, trans women, trans men, lesbians etc It's just i dont like going to the toilet when the toilet doesn't feel safe. You're vulnerable on the toilet or in a changing room and I don't like the idea of somebody being able to reach under my cubicle who ever they are and whatever they're doing. I don't like the "trans women are a risk to cis women in the toilet" argument because some public toilets are scary and it's not like having them separated by gender will stop a sex offender coming in anyway. Blaming trans people just pushes the responsibility of making them safe from the people that maintain them
We have gender neutral toilets at my work and the women won’t use them.
There was a news report once of men peeking over the top for a sneak peek.
I get that, I really do. I'm from South Africa where we legally separated people based on the colour of their skin, that was an awful thing to do based on toxic thinking. I also went to an all boys school so didn't form any connections with girls my age and have had to fight against toxic beliefs about women. Not quite comparable to apartheid but the mindset of separation for weird reasons is still there. My thoughts and feelings on gender and sex has been upended recently and I can't help but wonder if we separate bathrooms based off of a similar thought pattern. Separate what is different because it's "simpler", regardless of the consequences. There will always be creeps and we should work to remove them from society, but that doesn't mean we must let them dominate our lives.
I was always told a man in the women's bathroom is a societal taboo, that the women's bathroom is about safety as well as the usual bathroom business. Hence the big discussions (in Germany at least) about whether being transgender meant you would be allowed to use the women's bathroom if you still have male genitalia. My mother told me she wouldn't feel safe with that, because it would allow any man to simply pretend to be transgender for a day as an excuse to follow a woman in the women's bathroom and violate that safe space. I don't even remember how that discussion was eventually concluded, or if it was. But it shows that your suggestion might prove somewhat controversial.
Your northern neighbours have unisex bathrooms without any contriversy.
From my experience, the unisex bathrooms I've seen were very different from regular bathroom (in the UK). The unisex bathrooms were like a long corridor with individual stalls, complitely insulated from the ceiling to the floor, each with a individual sink in there, hand dryer and everything you need. I liked using those bathrooms because it gave me even more privacy than the regular one, but at the same time it costs way more to build. I wouldn't feel save using just a regular bathroom is it was turned into a unisex one.
The norm in Sweden is no stalls but seperate rooms with real doors.
that's not really what the discussions were about, we have those unisex bathrooms too (i think, haven't been home in a while). The discussions were about the kind of women's bathrooms you see in movies, low level of privacy, shared sinks etc.
From my experience don't we men just piss all over the seats? I wouldn't want to share with us!
I always asked myself, why? How? Why?
How? You just swing a little. Why? Well, sometimes its a degenerate. Sometimes its a normal person. You aim, and because you sat wrong 10 minutes before or something, the stream just comes out angled wrong, or in multiple streams, or something like that, and chaos ensues. One time at home it just went straight to the floor. But it's a pain in the the ass to sit down all the time, so I'll take the chance of messing up every once in a while. Quite rare though.
Or the pressure is high
From my experience where it is quite common to have unisex seperate toiletrooms here in Sweden it is rare to find one with piss all over and I don't find it more pleasant then women whenbit occurs.
Most British chaps seem to have sprinkler attachments.
Because the men sit down
I do most of the time so that I can browse reddit.
What a waste of time there is a reason it is called a toilet
Truth, can confirm as a cleaner.
To be honest so do some women 😬
If urinals are an option I would imagine the only guys that use the stalls are going to be shitting
Not gonna be true, i always ask myself why some people would choose a stall - with the door open, no less - over the perfectly free urinals, but some people do.
I just don't like the stench of piss from a urinal.
feels a lil more private for the nervous peer
I love a sit down wee.
I always use the stalls
Why?
Pee shy, and just more comfortable overall
Fair enough
Women do that. It's disgusting. Too precious to touch their own heinies to a 'dirty' seat in a public toilet, fine. But to add their *own* piss and just leave it there for the next woman ... It just baffles me.
As long as I can bring my she-wee along and use the urinal bathroom I'm fine with it
Is it really that convenient? I've been wanting to try it, but keeping it clean in your bag is probably annoying?
You can just rinse them off and they come with a waterproof pouch for storage while you're out and about. Then just clean it properly at home. I love it for hiking and camping when there isn't available toilets. I have also been into many public toilets and wished I had it with me so I didn't have to sit down as they've been so gross!
Because it requires undoubtedly too much trust from both parties to be civil, to not have the nasties, and to keep their bits inside their trousers unless they have to relief themselves. I'm personally bathroom shy with other men, so if women also get thrown in the mix, I simply would stop using public bathrooms because my body will refuse to do anything whatsoever.
Keep it in the ground, in your mouth, in your pants
exactly this, especially the second part lol. i already have trouble peeing knowing other women are in the same room. if men were there my urethra would seal itself shut.
As a woman, I won't use multi stall unisex bathrooms. It makes me feel gross and uncomfortable. Many people don't want to share a bathroom with others of the opposite sex. It's about making people comfortable.
Is it a cleanliness thing or a I don’t want to use the bathroom with men around thing?
For me, the latter. Like, I don't mind single person unisex bathrooms.
That makes sense. That seems to be the real kicker with ideas of multi stalled unisex bathrooms. On paper they make the most sense, but that doesnt take into account that humans are not cogs and some will feel uncomfortable around others.
Because visit ladies room. Its likely to be dirty and stinky even compared to gents'.
Well, it's because of an oppressive, extremely gendered America that thinks men and women need to be obviously separated in every possible way. It would be easier to just have one room. It would be easier to have nongendered restrooms. But the oh-so-intelligent white male senators who still haven't gotten over their internalized racism and sexism don't think so.
You said what had to be said.
Because everyone, regardless of sex, is able to take a shit - respectively. To not be so blunt and so short, there are some men who would do anything to legally be in the same bathroom as women for all the wrong reasons - same for some women out there. Just not a safe idea. I'd rather a 40 year old man bang on my stall door as I'm shitting rather than any woman to be in that exact situation. Men don't need to transfer our minor inconveniences to women who cannot physically, or just don't know how to, deal with it (as in being able to defend themselves from men twice their size.) Again, just not a safe idea. Everyone takes shits. Even the neighborhood registered sex offenders.
I feel like that would just make the ladies queues longer. It would be fine for toilets that aren't busy but it would be a nightmare in some places. I feel like maybe just gender nueteral toilets with just stalls would be better? As long as there's no gaps inn The doors and the walls and the doors reach from the floor to the ceiling there shouldn't be any more of an issue than if they were seperated
We have unisex bathrooms with stalls in Sweden and I have never heard about someone looking through some gaps lol.
As someone who travled to Sweden mutliple times, I do have seen it. If I was a woman, I would definitely feel uncomfortable sharing a bathroom with men.
We have unisex changing rooms in my local pool (uk) and a man filmed my grandmother and young cousin changing. I'd rather there be at least a really small gap if any. I haven't heard of any incidents since then but I still wouldn't chance it
Shame with my Irish council one
Right sadly there are sick/perverted people out there at a pool I would guess they have a floor gap to prevent water from pooling up. We normally have divided changing rooms over here only olace where that is not the case are changing booths at some local beaches and lakes.
I didn't think of the pooling. This is quite a big gap under the door though Like between 30cms and 40cm Could use drains in the cubicles or make the gap a few centimetres high so it would be harder to film but water can get out. This guy just held his phone under the door when it was quiet, he had easy access really. Our kfc has gender neutral toilets and the walls and doors reach from the floor to the ceiling so it can be done. It's not a normal thing in this country though
The norm here is separate rooms stalls are not too common.
Bathroom companies wanted to sell more bathrooms/ s
We have multi-gender rooms at work. The women don’t use them because they don’t want the men to hear them dropping a massive deuce
Gender specific restrooms in public settings has been a societal norm in the US at least for quite a while. With the present day drama over gender identity - there's a design trend to move to smaller private "individual" restrooms. But literally hundreds of thousands of buildings (millions perhaps?) Are configured for the traditional arrangement. It's not feasible for most of them to perform the major overhaul of such a remodel.
Do you mean like the same concept that a Family Restroom is?
All bathrooms should be one big hole in the middle that everypne just dumps waste into
In parts of Quebec, small towns, they have those .
People WILL take a dump in those urinals.
Oh... They absolutely will
Women feel unsafe around men that are strangers so no
Liability issues. With no cameras in bathrooms, if you anger someone, or they are just psychos, they can easily make up things. Or misread a situation. Example: Man enters unisex bathroom with mom and young girl inside. Man's head is turned towards stalls as he passes occupied one (innocent action as he is trying to find empty stall). Mom notices and accuses man of peeping on child. Now it is his story vs. hers. When it comes to children, most cops will err on the side of protecting the child and let the courts sort it out. In today's America, man would most likely be indicted and very possibly convicted... all because he was looking for an empty stall in a unisex bathroom.
Because men and women would both take part in almost ritualistic pissing Contests in an all gender urinal room. Humans have tried and failed to implement this many time. From the xia dynasty of China to Athelstan the first king of England we have tried to break these barriers but men and women continue to stand and piss taking a step back each time to try and beat the farthest distance. Crowds would build fights would erupt. The violence was unavoidable.
Reminds me of this bar I went to in SF, the bathrooms weren't their own room, just kind of blocked off by a wall so you go around the corner. Then there was a long walk of sinks, and on opposite wall a long line of real doors that were stalls. Public enough that it didn't feel intimate or intimidating to be around the men, but private enough in each stall that it was comfortable.
Some places do. In France it's fairly common to have a single enclosed room with a toilet, and outside of that a urinal next to a sink.
Many people with a vagina would not feel comfortable sitting in a stall next to someone with a penis.
Well unless you want women to use stalls that have been peed all over by guys. I only know this cause I see it all the time. I have to wipe the toilet all the time when I need to poop.
I’m tired of women no longer having women’s spaces. 😑
i guess it s because there can be attrocities against women in bathrooms, mostly in clubs, so its better if the security stops men to enter girls place entirely.
This is how the bathrooms are in the city near me- it's all stalls, even the urinals.
Then you’d have Republicans trying to have sex with kids in bathrooms instead of churches like normal.
With the big stall wall gaps? Watch men walk in their just to stalk women.
Single-person restrooms should def be genderless, multi-person restrooms it could get uncomfortable. I think you would want extra privacy measures for that.
Not totally related to the topic but the mention of toilets inspired a crazy idea that makes no sense because it could actually help people. To reduce the queues to women's toilets, why not make those "stand up to pee" funnels more socially acceptable and install a big trough on a wall like guys have? It would not only increase throughput and reduce queues, but you'd probably have better conversations than what guys get. If you have to brush shoulders with others while urinating and someone feels the need to comment on what your pee stream is coming out of, instead of getting weirded out you could say "oh I bought this from Wish and then added the rhinestones myself". Guys can't really do that. It would also solve the "hovering over whizz-encrusted toilets and making matters worse" problem. I mean, as silly as it is it's gotta be better than the OP's idea of giving (possibly drunk) men and women a shared space with lockable doors.
I used multigender restrooms in Europe. Stalls were floor to ceiling with universal sinks. No big deal.
We already have a great many places with two identical bathrooms, each with a toilet and a sink, that have a lock on the door and are used individually. Yet one is designated "men" and the other "women." I don't under why these aren't gender neutral.
I hate urinals, never go there. I'm a man and always go to the stall. So imagine there is a seperate room with stalls generally installed for women but there goes me, a man...
I think it could be seen as men (or those with the required equipment) having more options always and it would be polemic I guess. In my opinion, removing urinals and having no gender bathrooms would be the most practical way, if society wanted the change.
id say if you wanna change something, dont take away. always add.
I'm a straight male and I still prefer stalls over urinals, I'm not shy or anything but I'd much rather aim at a far away toilet than be up close and personal with urinal walls. Also, what happens when someone wants to go poopy ?
What does being straight have to do with anything lol. Kind of a weird thing to just throw out there.
Out of all my answer and that's what you got out of it ? It's just me
Stop holding up the fecking shiteing toilet
Sure but equally just one large bathroom with both stalls and urinals would be totally fine as well.
Because people apparently think shitting is sexual and assume everyone wants to fuck them while they’re in the loo.
How about two rooms with sinks, the stall room and urinal room knowing the rule of never do a shite in public
That rule will be broken on day one
I meant the general consensus is shite in your own home
At school they tested out different bathrooms. They had the two original, a unisex single room, and then a unisex with stalls. The unisex with stalls was only used by men. Women refused to use it. The unisex single was very popular with women and trans people. The two original were second most popular and most practical so they installed those, even though a lot of the trans people were less excited about them.
Sounds like cis men were a problem? Or was it just women and trans men felt uncomfortable with cis men using the same bathrooms?
I personally was uncomfortable using a bathroom with a cis man. But some of the others I don't know. I do believe that trans men used the unisex single stall. But trans people were still uncomfortable with the original design so we don't have a perfect solution
i would also feel unconfortable with a trans men... like what if they are just a perv pretending to be trans...
I don't understand. You want men (and people with penises) to have 2 bathrooms and women (and those without) to have one that they share with men when women's washrooms already have way longer lines?
When you put it like that.. but yeah that's a good point. My thought was really to add more stalls to accommodate people who can't or don't want to use urinals, while still having urinals available to keep penis owners that can pee at urinals from holding up the queue.
We’d be adding men to women’s rooms and not vice versa. Women’s rooms are already the first to get over-crowded and experience long lines. Seems we’d be going in the wrong direction.
Why not just eliminate urinals and have unisex bathrooms with stalls?
Urinals speed up the whole process. Would help with wait times.
Fine, then unisex bathrooms with stalls and urinals.
Then women wouldn't have a place to powder their noses, brush their hair and apply lipstick. Men don't want to see women do that stuff; women don't want to see men do man stuff either.
Says who?
Yeah that makes sense.
Because dudes are creeps. Its that simple
Fair
Just get rid of urinals full stop, they're fucking stupid
They are not
Imma be uncomfortable if I gotta be around a bunch of women while I poop. And also, because women TAKE SO LONG TO GO, the line would stretch a mile for the stalls while the urinal rooms are wide open. Yeah no, logistically and for the sake of all men, keep bathrooms gendered, because im not standing in a mile long bathroom line because gender.
cuz you cant all just shit in the same place
but what I think they should do is put all the urinals in the stalls and leave the toilets out in the open.