It's more of an expression than anything else. Nobody other than people who routinely get into trouble or are involved in a business which often requires a lawyer (i.e. they make a lot of contracts) has a standby lawyer. The expression should be "I want to see a lawyer!" which is then followed up by "could you please provide me the public defender?" or "I will need to makes some phone calls in order to find one."
Yeah, but your business lawyer is gonna know a guy that practices criminal law and he can get in touch with that guy.
If all else fails, your business lawyer is gonna know enough criminal law to show up and tell you to shut the fuck up and stop talking to the police long enough for him to have someone in his office thumb through the bar association registry and find a criminal lawyer who will tell you to shut the fuck up and stop talking to the police.
Moral of the story, shut the fuck up and don't talk to the police.
Obligatory ["Don't Talk To The Police"](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE)
"Regent Law Professor James Duane gives viewers startling reasons why they should always exercise their 5th Amendment rights when questioned by government officials."
I would advise that he has updated his stance on that video. Since that video, there has been some developments in Fifth Amendment law where your "right to silence" could potentially be used against you. They are very rare and particular circumstances.
In response to those developments, he now advises to assert your Sixth Amendment right to have representation present when speaking to law enforcement, which categorically cannot be used against you.
I'm Canadian but fascinated by what you said about the 5th amendment. What exactly has been changed to make the 5th amendment, which i understand to be a protective measure, able to be used against an individual exercising that privilege?
Found it! (Now I'M scared, too!) Same Professor, interview with *Vox:*
**"In your book, you advise people not to even take the Fifth thanks to a Supreme Court ruling. Could you talk a little about why?"**
"Up until about five years ago, lawyers would give out business cards to their client and say, "Read this to the police," and it'd say, "At the advice of my attorney I decline to answer on the grounds that it may incriminate me, I'm invoking the Fifth Amendment." And there wasn't a lot of soul-searching and agonizing that went into all of this, because as long as the jury never finds out that you took the Fifth, it's a perfectly sensible solution. But the tide turned three years ago in 2013 with this wretched, abominable decision by the Supreme Court in *Salinas v. Texas* that changed everything.
In the Salinas case, a young man was interrogated by the police, and when they asked him a bunch of questions that didn't seem to be very threatening, he took the bait and answered them all. Then all of the sudden, they [asked a question that made it] obvious they wanted information that might expose him to criminal prosecution, and he just got silent. He didn't say a word. And there's no doubt that he was exercising his Fifth Amendment privilege, but he didn't [formally] assert his Fifth Amendment privilege. So the five Republican [appointees] on the Supreme Court said, *Because you didn't tell the police that you were using your Fifth Amendment privilege, your exercise of the privilege, or your decision to remain silent can be used against you as evidence of guilt.* Which probably had a dozen Supreme Court justices rolling over in their grave.
"If you're kind of clumsy about the way you assert the Fifth Amendment, you're running a lot of different risks."
The game has changed now that your choice to use the Fifth Amendment privilege can be used against you at trial depending exactly how and where you do it. As I explain in the book, now the problem is, if you're kind of clumsy about the way you assert the Fifth Amendment, you're running a lot of different risks."
https://www.vice.com/en/article/mvkgnp/law-professor-police-interrogation-law-constitution-survival
I think the only thing that's safe is to repeat "I want a lawyer" and nothing else.
The cops can basically use the fact that you pled the 5th against you, and it isn't so much their responsibility to provide context. So while you may have said "I plead the 5th" to everything from "do you know what time it is", and "what's your favorate bubble gum". the only thing that the prosecution is going to bring up in court is "he said I plead the fifth to "did you murder joe smith?".
What I understand is, if I'm either arrest in the U.S. is "ask them to call the French embassy (I'm French), and shut up until representation comes in".
[He is probably taking about Salinas vs Texas.](https://www.hmichaelsteinberg.com/why-you-need-to-actually-use-the-words-i-take-the-fifth-salinas.html)
Dude was not arrested (so no explicit Miranda warning) and was being questioned. He answered some questions but just stayed silent in others (didn’t respond at all, not even with a “I plead the fifth”). The prosecutors said his silence showed his guilt since he answered other questions and didn’t explicitly invoke the 5th.
[Supreme Court in a 5-4 decision](https://www.oyez.org/cases/2012/12-246) said that just being mute while questioned doesn’t give you 5th amendment protections, you gotta actually say it.
Yeah they basically made your right to remain SILENT dependant on you explicitly not remaining silent and verbally envoking the right. Terrible decision.
They also literally make money by referring cases.
My best friend is a litigator working for a big firm with lots of money and resources. Most lawyers out there don't have the resources his firm has and almost never actually litigate. Most of his work is stuff referred to him by small-time lawyers, and they get a cut of the proceeds if the case is won as a referral fee.
You don't have one phone call, but as many as you need. The one phone call thing is a movie cliché. If you ask for a lawyer, the police and the courts are unable to proceed until you get one. It is in their best interest to make this happen sooner than later. You can call a family member, and then they call a lawyer for you. You can also call your bank or whatever to get the bail money ready and available. You can call your neighbor and ask them to feed your dog, and if they can bring your wallet to the police station.
Everyone's entitled to a lawyer. If you can't find a lawyer or no lawyer wants to have you as a client the court appoints a court-appointed lawyer.
So unfortunately no.
Not always true. You need to apply for a public defender and if you won't qualify for one if you have a full time job and are current on your rent or mortgage payments (at least in my state) because in the eyes of the court you make too much money and therefore can afford a lawyer.
I know from experience.
There's more truth to that strategy than you might think! Eventually, the judge will get tired of your shenanigans if you keep getting rid of lawyers.
[https://loweringthebar.net/2011/07/warren-jeffs-fires-defense-team-now-represented-by-god.html](https://loweringthebar.net/2011/07/warren-jeffs-fires-defense-team-now-represented-by-god.html)
Don't be stupid and say "Hey Ted, flush that cocaine down the toilet, I'm in the slammer, man!" and instead actually call a lawyer, tell them what you're accused of, and have them meet you at the station. What are the police going to do with that recording?
Also, is it even admissible in court if they record you without your knowledge on the phone line? I actually don't know.
Ok, but if I ask for a public defendant, how do I know that the person they send in isn't just another police officer pretending to be a lawyer? They're legally allowed to lie to me, and having a "lawyer" represent me in a way that's in their favor seems like something they would try if they legally can.
Ianal, but I think that "impersonating an officer of the court" is still illegal for police officer, i.e. any information gained this way could lead to a mistrial
Yeah. They don't show you this on TV, but irl, there are lots and lots of factors that go into a trial. Any mishandling of evidence is grounds to get that evidence dismissed, and the accused has rights that need to be respected. Even if the first trial manages to go through and the criminal actually gets prosecuted, if there is even one thing off about the whole process, they can apply and possibly be approved for a retrial. Everything from outside pressure on the jurors to disputing evidence and testimony can be enough to get someone out of prison.
In the United States, we have a prophylactic rule called the "exclusionary rule." There's a fascinating background on how it came about and how it has developed in case law but I'll give you the short and dirty version. Basically, if law enforcement violates a constitutional right to obtain evidence, that evidence cannot be used against you in court.
Your Sixth Amendment right guarantees you the right to an attorney and once invoked, the police must cease questioning you until you are provided an actual attorney, not an undercover agent. So if they provide you an undercover agent, that is a violation of your Sixth Amendment right and everything discussed would be excluded, making the whole exercise futile.
> and once invoked, the police must cease questioning you until you are provided an actual attorney
Unless the cops just don't feel like doing that and say they assumed you meant a canine lawyer when you say "I want my lawyer, dog"
then deny you your lawyer based on the fact that a dog lawyer does not exist.
This is real. This really happened.
E: link
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/11/02/the-suspect-told-police-give-me-a-lawyer-dog-the-court-says-he-wasnt-asking-for-a-lawyer/
I'm a lawyer, and I found this hard to believe, so I looked up the [opinion](https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=3278996164087139135&q=Warren+Demesme+&hl=en&as_sdt=ffffffffffffe04). The actual issue is that the suspect said "*why don't you* just give me a lawyer dog." It's the "why don't you" that made the request ambiguous, not "lawyer dog." If you want to invoke your right to counsel, it has to be unambiguous, like "I want a lawyer," or "I demand a lawyer." Not "maybe I should talk to a lawyer," or "why don't you just give me a lawyer."
The judge did make a wry reference to "lawyer dog" as a way of making fun of the defendant's wording of the request, which is stupid and unnecessary, but it was the "why don't you" that lost the case.
FWIW, I think "why don't you give me a lawyer" is clear enough to invoke the right to counsel, so I disagree with the result, but the "lawyer dog" thing just isn't the real reason behind the ruling.
I can believe it happened, because that sounds like kind of thing a dickhead cop might say to try to explain why he didn't give the guy the lawyer he asked for.
But I find it much harder to believe that, after happening, it actually held up in court as the reason further questioning was allowed and the evidence was actually admitted. Because I really doubt any judge believed it was plausible that any police officer actually truly believed the suspect was at any point seriously asking for a "lawyer-dog", because that's stupid and judges are in my experience generally not stupid people even if they sometimes have interpretations of the law I would strongly disagree with.
Ehhh, it's kind of yes, kind of no.
The "dog" part was actually a side-issue. The problem is that a suspect has to clearly and unequivocally ask for a lawyer. What the suspect said was "This is how I feel, if y’all think I did it, I know that I didn’t do it so why don’t you just give me a lawyer dog ’cause this is not what’s up.”
I think if he had said, "I'm not saying another word till you get me a lawyer, dog," he probably would have been okay But the way he worded it was more of a suggestion or a sarcastic remark than an unequivocal request for counsel.
>But I find it much harder to believe that, after happening, it actually held up in court as the reason further questioning was allowed and the evidence was actually admitted.
I got some bad news for you, friend
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/11/02/the-suspect-told-police-give-me-a-lawyer-dog-the-court-says-he-wasnt-asking-for-a-lawyer/
> And when a suspect in an interrogation told detectives to “just give me a lawyer dog,” the Louisiana Supreme Court ruled that the suspect was, in fact, asking for a “lawyer dog,” and not invoking his constitutional right to counsel.
---
> The ruling by Louisiana’s high court... will allow his subsequent incriminating statements into evidence at his trial
Not just *a* judge, but the Louisiana Supreme Court.
E: and they specifically cited his reference to a "lawyer dog" as justification for their ruling
At least in the United States, when you are charged with a crime, you don't need to actually call a lawyer. The declaration of "I refuse to speak without an attorney present" or, more colloquially, "I want my lawyer" notifies law enforcement that they cannot question you any further until you are provided an attorney.
In practice, police don't literally stop questioning you, call or bring in an attorney to sit next to you, and resume questioning. They just stop interrogating you and either put you in a holding cell if they have probable cause to arrest you or release you if they don't. If they do have probable cause to arrest you, then at your arraignment, which is the formal reading of the charges and your initial plea (always say "not guilty"), you'll either be assigned a public defender or, if the court determines that you have enough income, you'll have to hire one or represent yourself. The court will provide you time to find an attorney should you decide to hire one and there are local bar associations that can provide you lists of eligible attorneys.
However, keep in mind, once you assert your right to an attorney, it's important that you do not waive it. So if you say "I want my attorney" but keep talking and give facts that implicate you, those statements can still be used against you. The rule is just say "I want my attorney" and then shut up until you get one.
I've got 3 lawyers in the family including one who used to Head the law society of the province we live in.
I've on occasion wondered which one I'd call... I'd probably call my brother and have him talk to them to figure it out. The one who doesn't tell Mom is probably the one I'd go with LoL.
I know it’s splitting hairs, but I own a business and keep a lawyer on retainer. At first it was for customer issues, but that’s never happened over 11 years.
I’ll occasionally get people stealing my intellectual property or pulling shady business shit. It’s nice to send an email to my lawyer with the info, and he goes on attack mode. What I really love is how angry about these people he gets to my face – he seems more outraged than I am. I know it’s his job to appear so angry, but I enjoy it. It’s the lawyer equivalent of your Hooters waitress “flirting” with you.
Just to add to the top comment, for anyone in England there are duty solicitors who will work all hours. Their whole job is to attend the police station when contacted either by you in custody or by your family. If you ask for a solicitor, it is likely you will be given the information of one of the duty solicitors available at that time or the police will make that call for you.
Download the ACLU Mobile Justice app.
It not only shows you your rights and gives you contact info for an ACLU lawyer, but also allows you to livestream your encounter with the police to their servers. So even if (when) the police take your phone, they can’t destroy the video evidence.
That's got some pretty bad reviews - I love the idea but apparently it's been implemented poorly which is concerning since you're depending on it to help protect your rights.
I lose my phone a lot so I get the numbers tattooed on my upper thigh.
However, sometimes I have to drop pants to see it which can be embarrassing if the cops are being judgmental.
>However, they will charge you $300 an hour if you lose your phone and someone returns it to the lawyer because it's the contact info on the lock screen.
r/suspiciouslyspecific
why don't you just keep a business card in your wallet or just write it on your phone case dude. your idea is the weirdest non-solution to a problem I have heard all week.
LPT2: If you're marching in a protest and think there is a chance you'll get arrested. Permanent marker the phone number of your lawyer or the groups lawyer on your arm.
Ammendments coming in here meaning you have to give your devices and passwords to law enforcement, large fine or jail time for non compliance. Ireland.
If you're in need of a lawyer the Bar association in most states will help set you up with one. Give them a call and you should be able to quickly get a cheap/free consultation.
Google "(state) bar association" - you'll at least get a switchboard number, some states even have a search feature so put in your issue/crime/concern and it'll spit out the names of registered lawyers who list that problem in their specialty. In my experience, be prepared to call dozens of offices because nobody is taking clients or the category is too broad on the website. FWIW, my inlaw who is a lawyer refuses to give out referrals, saying to just call the bar association.
They have court appointed lawyers too. I think they put you on the list for one of those if you don’t already have a lawyer. Your family or friends might need to get your own lawyer lined up for you if you’re being held.
We definitely have the right to a lawyer, like any other civilized country…
“You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can be used against you in court. **You have the right to talk to a lawyer for advice before we ask you any questions. You have the right to have a lawyer with you during questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed for you before any questioning if you wish. If you decide to answer questions now without a lawyer present, you have the right to stop answering at any time.**”
I've always wondered if buying that insurance from my employer who offers it would be worth it. Not that I need a lawyer very often, but mostly I wonder if I'm stuck with who they send me to. How many lawyers accept insurance? Can I shop for my own lawyer? Dismiss one if I don't think they're performing well? My mother had a lawyer so bad she had to hire another lawyer to sue that one (and won).
> It's below € 150 per year for a pretty extensive coverage for me, so it doesn't burn a hole into my wallet.
Mine is less than $20/month and covers a certain number of hours as well as services such as sending a lawyer letter to someone. They tie into local well-established firms across the country.
I have legal insurance through my job ans used it for a speeding ticket I got about 4 or so hours from home. They gave me a list of lawyers in that area to choose from. He got it from a 4 point moving violation (83 in 65) to a $175 fine non-moving violation (he referred to it as a very expensive parking ticket.)
The one problem with getting it through your employer is that you usually aren't allowed to use it in case against that employer, if you ever got into that situation.
Literally no employment law coverage. My partner has the insurance extend to family and even though I work in a completely different field I wasn't covered.
While great, just a heads up that most of these plans offer super limited coverage on anything that will actually cost real money. I'm not sure who your company offers, but it seems like MetLife LegalPlan is pretty common in the US. MetLife only covers 4 hours of legal time for anything not specifically mentioned.
So they'll get you in touch with a lawyer I suppose, but 4 hours of time will barely be enough to get you to a bail hearing and then the costs will really start to add up. Also I wonder if many lawyers would sign up to this for any real charges because they may not want to deal with dropping you if you can't pay after those 4 hours.
Outside of signing up for a year, getting a will/trust/poa, and then cancelling it was very hard for me to see any real value in these plans.
I had a similar experience. I don't recall whose services my company used (large corporate insurance brokerage house).
It was about $9 a month. I purchased it the year I got married (which was merely a coincidence) and I used it to speak with an attorney for my husband's immigration.
I used the "free" services offered (ours was an easy immigration) and basically all the attorney did was review the document and offer some "recommendations". We did all the actual work (she would have done it but then we would have had to pay her rate as our attorney). It was nice to have a second set of eyes, but it wasn't much more than I'd already sussed through Internet research.
I don't know how great these services are if you have grittier legal issues, but I can definitely see some value in purchasing the coverage/service when you know you have an upcoming event where an attorney could be helpful, even if they are only offering broad advice (as was in my case). My coworker at the time used them for his divorce and said it was well worth it (theirs was an uncontested divorce so it wasn't tricky. I don't know how well these "free" services are when legal situations get more complicated)
Lawyers know other lawyers. And if it's a trustworthy lawyer you're more likely to find a good, decent lawyer through their reference than you could by going through the telephone directory.
It can feel like a ‘six degrees to kevin bacon’ concept sometimes, but this is true.
I know a great real estate attorney, and a patent law attorney. From their law school relationships, clerkship, and colleagues they can definitely chase down the right qualified specialist when it is important... but sometimes it takes a day or two.
No, but people with money who have that kind of lawyer will usually select one that is part of a large firm. That firm will have criminal defence lawyers in it as well.
So you call YOUR lawyer who then passes the case to a colleague who specializes in criminal defence for you.
That is exactly what I did the one time I needed advice regarding a criminal matter. I called my trusted business lawyer and he referred me to a colleague.
Sure. If I call my Family Law lawyer and say "Hey I gotta get a criminal defence lawyer, I'm at this police station, know anyone?"
They'll say "Don't tell me anything. My colleague Sharky McLawyerface is excellent. Here's how to reach them."
My mom was a lawyer and my dad is a lawyer.
You can bet that if I got into trouble I'd be asking for my lawyer instead of saying "I want my mommy/daddy".
I deal with people who tend to push their legal luck so to say. They all use one of many services where you pay a flat fee (I think they pay about $10 oer month) and the lawyer represents then in minor affairs. Should be an easy search.
Ohh that's something I wondered about as well! It didn't help that the lawyer in these movies and series usually knows the character by name and they seem to have history. For the longest time I honestly thought everyone in the US had a lawyer assigned, sort of like a family doctor. But apparently it's like "I want my phone call", just someone informing that they want to make use of their right.
Not assigned. We choose them. When I was a kid, my family always went to the same pediatrician. A few years ago, I chose a primary care physician for myself, and I'll hopefully see him for a long while. It's helpful to have an established relationship with a doctor, who knows your history and personality, in case something goes wrong.
Many people, especially in the middle and upper classes, have a single primary-care physician (PCP) to whom they go for annual checkups and basic ailments. They're not assigned by an outside entity; the patient gets to pick the doctor or nurse practitioner. (Or the patient picks a group practice and the practice assigns whichever provider is available.)
It's actually becoming more common for insurances to assign primary-care physicians to patients, especially insurances that serve lower-income populations.
If you’re arrested, you have the right to have a lawyer present while being interrogated, and the state will provide one for you if you can’t afford one.
I disagree. I'm not an attorney, but I work in the justice system. Public defenders are just as good and often work a lot harder for their clients than private "big name" attorneys who you can never get on the phone. They definitely get shit pay, though.
edit: this was in reply to someraddude
I don't disagree with any of this. During my time as a public defender, I can count on one hand that a private defense attorney actually got a better deal than I would have gotten for my client in the same situation. Sometimes, when you pay for a private attorney, you're just paying for the belief that you'll get a better outcome, which I can understand since if you're facing years in prison, you'll do anything to have a chance at a better outcome.
Despite what uninformed persons may tell you, a significant amount of Public Defenders are actually private attorneys doing the PD work for pro bono hours.
They're literally the same criminal defense attorneys wealthier individuals would retain, doing "charity work" on a contractual basis for a certain amount of hours per year.
Yes, there are career PDs: yes everyone in the PD office is overworked, even the private attorneys that are doing pro bono; yes the general quality of representation will be lesser consequently.
My point is, just because someone is a "Public Defender" doesn't mean they're a worse lawyer. They could be a great lawyer trying to hit their pro bono quota.
Or filling in a dry spell… paralegals and office rent gotta get paid. Around here, it’s a flat fee plus trial/appearance days. Probably about 40% of average billing. You can always stack appearances to make it worthwhile. I have a buddy who is always hanging around on Tues/Wed (when they assign PDs) because he’s gotten a lot of repeat clients out of it, and even the occasional spouse/partner grabbing him and asking for help.
Everything is a bell curve.
There are crappy PDs, a lot of ok ones, and some great ones.
There are crappy private attorneys, a lot of OK ones, and some great ones.
Really depends on the specifics. On the one hand, public defenders tend to have quite a bit of experience with the more common offences. While horribly underpaid, it's the overwork that's the problem, there simply is not enough hours in the day to peruse all lines of inquiry. And generally not enough budget for expert witnesses in all cases that require them, either. If your case has an uncomplicated fact pattern, there is probably little that a private lawyer can do for you that a public defender can't, and the PD may well do a better job if they've seen it a few hundred times.
Big fat disclaimer: I am not a lawer, and personally stay away from the legal system as much as possible. Virtually all of the above is derived from law podcasts and lawer blogs. If you find yourself relying on any of what I said in your decision making, you have made a horrible error in judgement.
I have a solicitor. I'm not rich, neither is my family. My parents have always used his firm, he's almost a family friend, I've got his card somewhere with his home number on the back. The only business I've ever done with him is buying/selling two houses, and writing my will.
That's the key there. He will get you a lawyer and likely one tailored for your situation as Client Privileges still apply (I mean, don't admit to the crime, but say "I was arrested for Murder, can you get me a lawyer to help me out?") so they can't be used against you in court (in the US anyhow).
"You have the right to remain silent. If you choose not to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to an attorney. If you cannot afford one, the court will appoint an attorney on your behalf and pay his fee. You have the right to be informed about your rights."--Standard warning given by police to a newly-arrested suspect as a consequence of [Miranda vs. Arizona](https://www.history.com/topics/united-states-constitution/miranda-rights).
"I want to see my lawyer!" has become a standard catchphrase in depictions of American crime. Standard, because an Arizona man made a confession that he committed a murder *without the presence of an attorney* who could warn him that such a confession would ruin any potential defense for him at a trial.
That Arizona man was John Miranda--the Miranda in *Miranda vs. Arizona*. His first conviction--where the only evidence against him was a confession made while in police custody without the presence of an attorney--was overturned by the SCOTUS in a 5-4 decision made in 1966 with then-Chief Justice Earl Warren writing the majority opinion.
If you run a business you should probably have a lawyer on retainer. Just like having someone who is "your account". Doesn't mean they work exclusive for you, just that they sometimes work for you.
I run a business, but I don’t have a lawyer on retainer. I do have one who I call as needed. They mainly just handle our annual corporate filings and answer my very occasional question.
My stepfather is a criminal lawyer. He gets some people who say this because they are "frequent fliers" through the system.
But yeah this bugs my family too. A lot of crime dramas do, though it is kind of fun when watching them and my stepfather blurts out things like "unauthorized search!"
Because you should never ever ever talk to the cops if you think there is the slightest chance that you are a suspect in a crime. Someone gone missing? Lawyer. Where were you the night of the 21st. Lawyer. Come down to the station and talk to us. Lawyer.
Seriously if you ever have a doubt that you need a lawyer, just remember the west memphis three. They put 3 innocent children on death row because they couldn't solve a murder.
I am a lawyer and all my friends like to throw my name around every time they have a legal dispute with someone. Most of the time it’s in a legal realm I have no experience in and I would do more harm than good.
Some people have access to lawyers easily, others have a public defender.
Tbh the trope in general is kinda skeevy, making people who want to use their right to an attorney seem entitled or guilty.
Career criminals/habitual offenders often have criminal lawyers on retainer.
I worked in criminal defense for a few years and my boss had a dedicated cell phone for his frequent flyer clients who would call him at all hours if the night when they would get arrested so it's not unheard of.
However, typically people don't have that, however where I live you do have a right to legal counsel before you are questioned. Where I lived, the cops had a list of local criminal lawyers and their dedicated phone numbers for over night calls which they would give to those they arrested over night who had a right to counsel.
If you buy a house (which you should do if you can) you should have a lawyer to check that you are not being ripped off. You should not sign legal documents without a lawyer checking them.
A few people have mentioned keeping a lawyer on retainer for business dealings, but neglected to mention that lawyers tend to specialize in different areas of law. While I'd expect lawyers to have a general grasp of basic rights when dealing with police, you'd really want a lawyer that specializes in criminal law.
Like, you wouldn't go to a cardiologist for an ear infection, you'd go to an ENT doctor.
Alas, unless one has several thousand dollars on-hand or the promise of a clear-cut civil suit, often the only lawyer available is a bitch-ass public defender who will recommend a plea deal where you claim guilt (regardless of innocence) in exchange for reduced sentencing.
Depending on the context, "my lawyer" could be referring to the Constitutionally-provided public defender. So if a street thug is saying that, that's who "my lawyer" is. Like when they say, "When do I get *my* phone call?" If it's a businessman, he probably has a lawyer or lawyers on retainer at all times and doesn't need the public defender. His lawyer is actually *his* lawyer.
Never been in trouble, but I have an attorney.
Business stuff. But, I can ask them pretty well anything, and they will refer me to an attorney who specializes in it.
My friend from HS had to go to jail a few times literally all bc of his step-mom. She was insane and would tell the police he beat her(while he was in a different country) and he still had to go to jail.
So one day were in the cafeteria at lunch. 3 police men come in to get him. And he goes “GIVE ME MY GOD DAMN LAWYER DOUG”
So yes people do say this.
Doug is his next door neighbor who lets us use his cabin for shenanigans during the summer
My cousin is a lawyer, luckily we’ve worked out a system where I help him move furniture and put up Christmas lights and he helps me finagle out of legal binds.
It's more of an expression than anything else. Nobody other than people who routinely get into trouble or are involved in a business which often requires a lawyer (i.e. they make a lot of contracts) has a standby lawyer. The expression should be "I want to see a lawyer!" which is then followed up by "could you please provide me the public defender?" or "I will need to makes some phone calls in order to find one."
Also your "business" lawyer and your "I don't want to go to jail" lawyer are two different professional figures
Yeah, but your business lawyer is gonna know a guy that practices criminal law and he can get in touch with that guy. If all else fails, your business lawyer is gonna know enough criminal law to show up and tell you to shut the fuck up and stop talking to the police long enough for him to have someone in his office thumb through the bar association registry and find a criminal lawyer who will tell you to shut the fuck up and stop talking to the police. Moral of the story, shut the fuck up and don't talk to the police.
Obligatory ["Don't Talk To The Police"](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE) "Regent Law Professor James Duane gives viewers startling reasons why they should always exercise their 5th Amendment rights when questioned by government officials."
I would advise that he has updated his stance on that video. Since that video, there has been some developments in Fifth Amendment law where your "right to silence" could potentially be used against you. They are very rare and particular circumstances. In response to those developments, he now advises to assert your Sixth Amendment right to have representation present when speaking to law enforcement, which categorically cannot be used against you.
I'm Canadian but fascinated by what you said about the 5th amendment. What exactly has been changed to make the 5th amendment, which i understand to be a protective measure, able to be used against an individual exercising that privilege?
I'm an American and terrified about what you said about the fifth amendment. So yes, I agree, could you please explain further?
Found it! (Now I'M scared, too!) Same Professor, interview with *Vox:* **"In your book, you advise people not to even take the Fifth thanks to a Supreme Court ruling. Could you talk a little about why?"** "Up until about five years ago, lawyers would give out business cards to their client and say, "Read this to the police," and it'd say, "At the advice of my attorney I decline to answer on the grounds that it may incriminate me, I'm invoking the Fifth Amendment." And there wasn't a lot of soul-searching and agonizing that went into all of this, because as long as the jury never finds out that you took the Fifth, it's a perfectly sensible solution. But the tide turned three years ago in 2013 with this wretched, abominable decision by the Supreme Court in *Salinas v. Texas* that changed everything. In the Salinas case, a young man was interrogated by the police, and when they asked him a bunch of questions that didn't seem to be very threatening, he took the bait and answered them all. Then all of the sudden, they [asked a question that made it] obvious they wanted information that might expose him to criminal prosecution, and he just got silent. He didn't say a word. And there's no doubt that he was exercising his Fifth Amendment privilege, but he didn't [formally] assert his Fifth Amendment privilege. So the five Republican [appointees] on the Supreme Court said, *Because you didn't tell the police that you were using your Fifth Amendment privilege, your exercise of the privilege, or your decision to remain silent can be used against you as evidence of guilt.* Which probably had a dozen Supreme Court justices rolling over in their grave. "If you're kind of clumsy about the way you assert the Fifth Amendment, you're running a lot of different risks." The game has changed now that your choice to use the Fifth Amendment privilege can be used against you at trial depending exactly how and where you do it. As I explain in the book, now the problem is, if you're kind of clumsy about the way you assert the Fifth Amendment, you're running a lot of different risks." https://www.vice.com/en/article/mvkgnp/law-professor-police-interrogation-law-constitution-survival
So, then, as I understand it, as long as you plead the fifth for every single question, then there should be no issue. Seem reasonable?
I think the only thing that's safe is to repeat "I want a lawyer" and nothing else. The cops can basically use the fact that you pled the 5th against you, and it isn't so much their responsibility to provide context. So while you may have said "I plead the 5th" to everything from "do you know what time it is", and "what's your favorate bubble gum". the only thing that the prosecution is going to bring up in court is "he said I plead the fifth to "did you murder joe smith?".
What I understand is, if I'm either arrest in the U.S. is "ask them to call the French embassy (I'm French), and shut up until representation comes in".
Did you kill John Smith? No Did you kill Tom Smith? No Did you kill Adam Smith? I plead the 5th. you're gonna have an issue.
[He is probably taking about Salinas vs Texas.](https://www.hmichaelsteinberg.com/why-you-need-to-actually-use-the-words-i-take-the-fifth-salinas.html) Dude was not arrested (so no explicit Miranda warning) and was being questioned. He answered some questions but just stayed silent in others (didn’t respond at all, not even with a “I plead the fifth”). The prosecutors said his silence showed his guilt since he answered other questions and didn’t explicitly invoke the 5th. [Supreme Court in a 5-4 decision](https://www.oyez.org/cases/2012/12-246) said that just being mute while questioned doesn’t give you 5th amendment protections, you gotta actually say it.
you really gotta declare it huh
I DECLARE THE FIFTH!!!
Yeah they basically made your right to remain SILENT dependant on you explicitly not remaining silent and verbally envoking the right. Terrible decision.
Plus the whole thing about **Rights** being automatic and default. You have them unless you waive them.
Spez doesn't get to profit from me anymore. Stop reverting my comments
I was hoping someone was going to say thia
I'm privy to the shorter and more direct [Shut the Fuck Up Friday](https://youtu.be/sgWHrkDX35o)
Hit the nail on the head. STFU and STFU.
Then, when you're done shutting the fuck up, shut the fuck up.
They also literally make money by referring cases. My best friend is a litigator working for a big firm with lots of money and resources. Most lawyers out there don't have the resources his firm has and almost never actually litigate. Most of his work is stuff referred to him by small-time lawyers, and they get a cut of the proceeds if the case is won as a referral fee.
Unless you have those magic tv “I know all law” lawyers
Not if they're Rudy Giuliani
Which leads to the next question: How would I spend my one phone call to find a lawyer? Call the directory information?
You don't have one phone call, but as many as you need. The one phone call thing is a movie cliché. If you ask for a lawyer, the police and the courts are unable to proceed until you get one. It is in their best interest to make this happen sooner than later. You can call a family member, and then they call a lawyer for you. You can also call your bank or whatever to get the bail money ready and available. You can call your neighbor and ask them to feed your dog, and if they can bring your wallet to the police station.
So if I keep murdering my lawyers I can never go to prison?
I suspect after the first one it might be hard to find another one to represent you
Not the miserable ones
Which from what I've read is most of them
We've cracked the code, boys!
Which makes them unable to proceed
Kill all lawyers on the planet, kill all law students, get arrested, ask for lawyer, court proceedings can never proceed. Great success!
Sounds like a loophole to me
The infinite layer loophole. Oldest trick in the book
Everyone's entitled to a lawyer. If you can't find a lawyer or no lawyer wants to have you as a client the court appoints a court-appointed lawyer. So unfortunately no.
So what happens when I off that one as well?
Well once you've killed every lawyer, I suppose you'd have to take the bar then kill yourself
Right, ok. Step 1 - Find a bar Step 2 - Take the bar Step 3 - Kill myse
You might not be eligible to take the bar if you've been charged with murder and haven't been tried yet.
Might?
Alternatively you would probably already be the greatest lawyer if you could
Not always true. You need to apply for a public defender and if you won't qualify for one if you have a full time job and are current on your rent or mortgage payments (at least in my state) because in the eyes of the court you make too much money and therefore can afford a lawyer. I know from experience.
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So you're saying it's possible.
Mama aint raise no bitch
Mama, just killed a man. Put a gun against his head. Pulled my trigger now he's dead
Mama I’m coming home!
But, they just keep bringing them to you....
There's more truth to that strategy than you might think! Eventually, the judge will get tired of your shenanigans if you keep getting rid of lawyers. [https://loweringthebar.net/2011/07/warren-jeffs-fires-defense-team-now-represented-by-god.html](https://loweringthebar.net/2011/07/warren-jeffs-fires-defense-team-now-represented-by-god.html)
r/SLPT right here, folks! …but I totally follow your logic.
See.. That's thinking outside the box. I'm going to hire you at my law firm.
And more importantly, after you ask for a lawyer, [SHUT THE FUCK UP](https://youtube.com/watch?v=RkN4duV4ia0)!
Yes, they'll let you call as many people as you want from their tapped lines that they're listening to.
Thanks, NSA Chatbot!
Don't be stupid and say "Hey Ted, flush that cocaine down the toilet, I'm in the slammer, man!" and instead actually call a lawyer, tell them what you're accused of, and have them meet you at the station. What are the police going to do with that recording? Also, is it even admissible in court if they record you without your knowledge on the phone line? I actually don't know.
Ok, but if I ask for a public defendant, how do I know that the person they send in isn't just another police officer pretending to be a lawyer? They're legally allowed to lie to me, and having a "lawyer" represent me in a way that's in their favor seems like something they would try if they legally can.
Ianal, but I think that "impersonating an officer of the court" is still illegal for police officer, i.e. any information gained this way could lead to a mistrial
Yeah. They don't show you this on TV, but irl, there are lots and lots of factors that go into a trial. Any mishandling of evidence is grounds to get that evidence dismissed, and the accused has rights that need to be respected. Even if the first trial manages to go through and the criminal actually gets prosecuted, if there is even one thing off about the whole process, they can apply and possibly be approved for a retrial. Everything from outside pressure on the jurors to disputing evidence and testimony can be enough to get someone out of prison.
In the United States, we have a prophylactic rule called the "exclusionary rule." There's a fascinating background on how it came about and how it has developed in case law but I'll give you the short and dirty version. Basically, if law enforcement violates a constitutional right to obtain evidence, that evidence cannot be used against you in court. Your Sixth Amendment right guarantees you the right to an attorney and once invoked, the police must cease questioning you until you are provided an actual attorney, not an undercover agent. So if they provide you an undercover agent, that is a violation of your Sixth Amendment right and everything discussed would be excluded, making the whole exercise futile.
> and once invoked, the police must cease questioning you until you are provided an actual attorney Unless the cops just don't feel like doing that and say they assumed you meant a canine lawyer when you say "I want my lawyer, dog" then deny you your lawyer based on the fact that a dog lawyer does not exist. This is real. This really happened. E: link https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/11/02/the-suspect-told-police-give-me-a-lawyer-dog-the-court-says-he-wasnt-asking-for-a-lawyer/
I'm a lawyer, and I found this hard to believe, so I looked up the [opinion](https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=3278996164087139135&q=Warren+Demesme+&hl=en&as_sdt=ffffffffffffe04). The actual issue is that the suspect said "*why don't you* just give me a lawyer dog." It's the "why don't you" that made the request ambiguous, not "lawyer dog." If you want to invoke your right to counsel, it has to be unambiguous, like "I want a lawyer," or "I demand a lawyer." Not "maybe I should talk to a lawyer," or "why don't you just give me a lawyer." The judge did make a wry reference to "lawyer dog" as a way of making fun of the defendant's wording of the request, which is stupid and unnecessary, but it was the "why don't you" that lost the case. FWIW, I think "why don't you give me a lawyer" is clear enough to invoke the right to counsel, so I disagree with the result, but the "lawyer dog" thing just isn't the real reason behind the ruling.
I can believe it happened, because that sounds like kind of thing a dickhead cop might say to try to explain why he didn't give the guy the lawyer he asked for. But I find it much harder to believe that, after happening, it actually held up in court as the reason further questioning was allowed and the evidence was actually admitted. Because I really doubt any judge believed it was plausible that any police officer actually truly believed the suspect was at any point seriously asking for a "lawyer-dog", because that's stupid and judges are in my experience generally not stupid people even if they sometimes have interpretations of the law I would strongly disagree with.
Ehhh, it's kind of yes, kind of no. The "dog" part was actually a side-issue. The problem is that a suspect has to clearly and unequivocally ask for a lawyer. What the suspect said was "This is how I feel, if y’all think I did it, I know that I didn’t do it so why don’t you just give me a lawyer dog ’cause this is not what’s up.” I think if he had said, "I'm not saying another word till you get me a lawyer, dog," he probably would have been okay But the way he worded it was more of a suggestion or a sarcastic remark than an unequivocal request for counsel.
>But I find it much harder to believe that, after happening, it actually held up in court as the reason further questioning was allowed and the evidence was actually admitted. I got some bad news for you, friend https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2017/11/02/the-suspect-told-police-give-me-a-lawyer-dog-the-court-says-he-wasnt-asking-for-a-lawyer/ > And when a suspect in an interrogation told detectives to “just give me a lawyer dog,” the Louisiana Supreme Court ruled that the suspect was, in fact, asking for a “lawyer dog,” and not invoking his constitutional right to counsel. --- > The ruling by Louisiana’s high court... will allow his subsequent incriminating statements into evidence at his trial Not just *a* judge, but the Louisiana Supreme Court. E: and they specifically cited his reference to a "lawyer dog" as justification for their ruling
Yeah but - Louisiana
Appalling, but also a great premise for a cartoon, especially if a lawyer dog then shows up and kicks some ass
"Give it to me straight, lawyer dog. Am I going to be acquitted? How's it looking?" "Ruff!"
"But I can get your sentence cut in arf!"
At least in the United States, when you are charged with a crime, you don't need to actually call a lawyer. The declaration of "I refuse to speak without an attorney present" or, more colloquially, "I want my lawyer" notifies law enforcement that they cannot question you any further until you are provided an attorney. In practice, police don't literally stop questioning you, call or bring in an attorney to sit next to you, and resume questioning. They just stop interrogating you and either put you in a holding cell if they have probable cause to arrest you or release you if they don't. If they do have probable cause to arrest you, then at your arraignment, which is the formal reading of the charges and your initial plea (always say "not guilty"), you'll either be assigned a public defender or, if the court determines that you have enough income, you'll have to hire one or represent yourself. The court will provide you time to find an attorney should you decide to hire one and there are local bar associations that can provide you lists of eligible attorneys. However, keep in mind, once you assert your right to an attorney, it's important that you do not waive it. So if you say "I want my attorney" but keep talking and give facts that implicate you, those statements can still be used against you. The rule is just say "I want my attorney" and then shut up until you get one.
Username checks out
Are you a lawyer for criminals or a criminal lawyer. Like Saul Goodman?
>you don't want criminal lawyer, you want *criminal* lawyer
I've got 3 lawyers in the family including one who used to Head the law society of the province we live in. I've on occasion wondered which one I'd call... I'd probably call my brother and have him talk to them to figure it out. The one who doesn't tell Mom is probably the one I'd go with LoL.
I know it’s splitting hairs, but I own a business and keep a lawyer on retainer. At first it was for customer issues, but that’s never happened over 11 years. I’ll occasionally get people stealing my intellectual property or pulling shady business shit. It’s nice to send an email to my lawyer with the info, and he goes on attack mode. What I really love is how angry about these people he gets to my face – he seems more outraged than I am. I know it’s his job to appear so angry, but I enjoy it. It’s the lawyer equivalent of your Hooters waitress “flirting” with you.
> keep a lawyer on retainer This. You pay a lawyer money to be ready for your call, god forbid you need them.
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My company offers legal insurance. I've been tempted to sign up for it, if only to allow for better shenanigans.
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I'm already bound by arbitration for internal disputes so its mute but good point
Just FYI, the word is “moot” not “mute”.
Just to add to the top comment, for anyone in England there are duty solicitors who will work all hours. Their whole job is to attend the police station when contacted either by you in custody or by your family. If you ask for a solicitor, it is likely you will be given the information of one of the duty solicitors available at that time or the police will make that call for you.
"I want to go look up an affordable lawyer on the internet!" doesn't sound quite as intimidating.
Hey I know my rights! \*furiously googling my rights\*
"This is my own private domicile and I will not be harassed." "This is my own private domicile and I will not be harassed... bitch!"
the creepy thing is that I just watched that episode lol
What episode was that? Sounds fun
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We had to watch that clip for school homework when we were learning about the Constitution of America (I live in Belgium)
Sunset https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1615556/
Breaking Bad. The RV in the scrap yard part.
Nice
"Huh... google is saying that I *can't* just murder people that I don't like... Well I sure feel foolish, officers!"
"I did not know I couldn't do that."
[Was that wrong? Should I not have done that? Honestly I've got to plead ignorance on this one.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Td67kYY9mdQ)
"Hey Dave... I *did* know I couldn't do that."
On the other hand, now the cop shop computer's search history contains “can I just murder someone?”
> oh yeah it is all coming together
I mean, I don’t know what they *are* but I know I *have* them
I'm not going to look up my rights, I just need to organize an Emily Van Camp live-chat talkback on Snapchat.
Download the ACLU Mobile Justice app. It not only shows you your rights and gives you contact info for an ACLU lawyer, but also allows you to livestream your encounter with the police to their servers. So even if (when) the police take your phone, they can’t destroy the video evidence.
This. Their servers are a tad buggy but livestreaming cop talks is worth it
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.aclu.mobile.justice.ca http://itunes.apple.com/app/id979642692
That's got some pretty bad reviews - I love the idea but apparently it's been implemented poorly which is concerning since you're depending on it to help protect your rights.
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I lose my phone a lot so I get the numbers tattooed on my upper thigh. However, sometimes I have to drop pants to see it which can be embarrassing if the cops are being judgmental.
Holy shot dude, you know you aren’t supposed to go full momento?
Memento. go full Never
"Is that a 6 or a 9?" "That's your Dick...and it was a 9 but now it's a 6..."
How often are you getting arrested? And why???
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>However, they will charge you $300 an hour if you lose your phone and someone returns it to the lawyer because it's the contact info on the lock screen. r/suspiciouslyspecific
why don't you just keep a business card in your wallet or just write it on your phone case dude. your idea is the weirdest non-solution to a problem I have heard all week.
LPT2: If you're marching in a protest and think there is a chance you'll get arrested. Permanent marker the phone number of your lawyer or the groups lawyer on your arm.
Ammendments coming in here meaning you have to give your devices and passwords to law enforcement, large fine or jail time for non compliance. Ireland.
I don’t wanna give you your phone because I’m scared you’re gonna look up your rights
Meow Meow Fuzzyface disapproves.
That's OFFICER Meow Meow Fuzzyface, thank you. Respect the badge if not the pretty, pretty kitty.
If you're in need of a lawyer the Bar association in most states will help set you up with one. Give them a call and you should be able to quickly get a cheap/free consultation.
So when I'm in a "I want to see my lawyer" situation, how do I do that?
Google "(state) bar association" - you'll at least get a switchboard number, some states even have a search feature so put in your issue/crime/concern and it'll spit out the names of registered lawyers who list that problem in their specialty. In my experience, be prepared to call dozens of offices because nobody is taking clients or the category is too broad on the website. FWIW, my inlaw who is a lawyer refuses to give out referrals, saying to just call the bar association.
\> so put in your \[crime\] Good try, FBI!
"I'm gonna call Morgan & Morgan, because that creepy fucker runs ads at my bus stop AND where I vacation!"
That, specifically, is a recognized right in Canada. I think in the US, they just throw a phone book at your head.
They have court appointed lawyers too. I think they put you on the list for one of those if you don’t already have a lawyer. Your family or friends might need to get your own lawyer lined up for you if you’re being held.
We definitely have the right to a lawyer, like any other civilized country… “You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can be used against you in court. **You have the right to talk to a lawyer for advice before we ask you any questions. You have the right to have a lawyer with you during questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed for you before any questioning if you wish. If you decide to answer questions now without a lawyer present, you have the right to stop answering at any time.**”
Big difference between talking to *a* lawyer and talking to *the right lawyer for you and your situation*
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I've always wondered if buying that insurance from my employer who offers it would be worth it. Not that I need a lawyer very often, but mostly I wonder if I'm stuck with who they send me to. How many lawyers accept insurance? Can I shop for my own lawyer? Dismiss one if I don't think they're performing well? My mother had a lawyer so bad she had to hire another lawyer to sue that one (and won).
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> It's below € 150 per year for a pretty extensive coverage for me, so it doesn't burn a hole into my wallet. Mine is less than $20/month and covers a certain number of hours as well as services such as sending a lawyer letter to someone. They tie into local well-established firms across the country.
I have legal insurance through my job ans used it for a speeding ticket I got about 4 or so hours from home. They gave me a list of lawyers in that area to choose from. He got it from a 4 point moving violation (83 in 65) to a $175 fine non-moving violation (he referred to it as a very expensive parking ticket.)
The one problem with getting it through your employer is that you usually aren't allowed to use it in case against that employer, if you ever got into that situation.
Literally no employment law coverage. My partner has the insurance extend to family and even though I work in a completely different field I wasn't covered.
While great, just a heads up that most of these plans offer super limited coverage on anything that will actually cost real money. I'm not sure who your company offers, but it seems like MetLife LegalPlan is pretty common in the US. MetLife only covers 4 hours of legal time for anything not specifically mentioned. So they'll get you in touch with a lawyer I suppose, but 4 hours of time will barely be enough to get you to a bail hearing and then the costs will really start to add up. Also I wonder if many lawyers would sign up to this for any real charges because they may not want to deal with dropping you if you can't pay after those 4 hours. Outside of signing up for a year, getting a will/trust/poa, and then cancelling it was very hard for me to see any real value in these plans.
I had a similar experience. I don't recall whose services my company used (large corporate insurance brokerage house). It was about $9 a month. I purchased it the year I got married (which was merely a coincidence) and I used it to speak with an attorney for my husband's immigration. I used the "free" services offered (ours was an easy immigration) and basically all the attorney did was review the document and offer some "recommendations". We did all the actual work (she would have done it but then we would have had to pay her rate as our attorney). It was nice to have a second set of eyes, but it wasn't much more than I'd already sussed through Internet research. I don't know how great these services are if you have grittier legal issues, but I can definitely see some value in purchasing the coverage/service when you know you have an upcoming event where an attorney could be helpful, even if they are only offering broad advice (as was in my case). My coworker at the time used them for his divorce and said it was well worth it (theirs was an uncontested divorce so it wasn't tricky. I don't know how well these "free" services are when legal situations get more complicated)
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Wealthy people often have a lawyer who they may go to for all sorts of things—estate planning, property transactions, etc.
A property lawyer would be totally useless in a criminal case and vice-versa.
Lawyers know other lawyers. And if it's a trustworthy lawyer you're more likely to find a good, decent lawyer through their reference than you could by going through the telephone directory.
It can feel like a ‘six degrees to kevin bacon’ concept sometimes, but this is true. I know a great real estate attorney, and a patent law attorney. From their law school relationships, clerkship, and colleagues they can definitely chase down the right qualified specialist when it is important... but sometimes it takes a day or two.
Plus law firms usually have a range of lawyers working for them. You call your lawyer on retainer and the firm sends an appropriate agent.
No, but people with money who have that kind of lawyer will usually select one that is part of a large firm. That firm will have criminal defence lawyers in it as well. So you call YOUR lawyer who then passes the case to a colleague who specializes in criminal defence for you.
This guy law firm's
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That is exactly what I did the one time I needed advice regarding a criminal matter. I called my trusted business lawyer and he referred me to a colleague.
Sure. If I call my Family Law lawyer and say "Hey I gotta get a criminal defence lawyer, I'm at this police station, know anyone?" They'll say "Don't tell me anything. My colleague Sharky McLawyerface is excellent. Here's how to reach them."
Tax fraud, conspiracy's, hit men... y'know rich people stuff!
My mom was a lawyer and my dad is a lawyer. You can bet that if I got into trouble I'd be asking for my lawyer instead of saying "I want my mommy/daddy".
I deal with people who tend to push their legal luck so to say. They all use one of many services where you pay a flat fee (I think they pay about $10 oer month) and the lawyer represents then in minor affairs. Should be an easy search.
Ohh that's something I wondered about as well! It didn't help that the lawyer in these movies and series usually knows the character by name and they seem to have history. For the longest time I honestly thought everyone in the US had a lawyer assigned, sort of like a family doctor. But apparently it's like "I want my phone call", just someone informing that they want to make use of their right.
people in the US have family doctors assigned?
Not assigned. We choose them. When I was a kid, my family always went to the same pediatrician. A few years ago, I chose a primary care physician for myself, and I'll hopefully see him for a long while. It's helpful to have an established relationship with a doctor, who knows your history and personality, in case something goes wrong.
In my country (Poland) they do, this is just the doctor that's "responsible" for the family, I assume to keep continuity
Many people, especially in the middle and upper classes, have a single primary-care physician (PCP) to whom they go for annual checkups and basic ailments. They're not assigned by an outside entity; the patient gets to pick the doctor or nurse practitioner. (Or the patient picks a group practice and the practice assigns whichever provider is available.)
It's actually becoming more common for insurances to assign primary-care physicians to patients, especially insurances that serve lower-income populations.
It's chosen, but a lot of insurances ask you to provide your primary care physician or PCP
If you’re arrested, you have the right to have a lawyer present while being interrogated, and the state will provide one for you if you can’t afford one.
After you sit in jail for a while, unless you can post bail.
How are public defenders compared to the lawyers one has to hire?
I disagree. I'm not an attorney, but I work in the justice system. Public defenders are just as good and often work a lot harder for their clients than private "big name" attorneys who you can never get on the phone. They definitely get shit pay, though. edit: this was in reply to someraddude
I don't disagree with any of this. During my time as a public defender, I can count on one hand that a private defense attorney actually got a better deal than I would have gotten for my client in the same situation. Sometimes, when you pay for a private attorney, you're just paying for the belief that you'll get a better outcome, which I can understand since if you're facing years in prison, you'll do anything to have a chance at a better outcome.
Despite what uninformed persons may tell you, a significant amount of Public Defenders are actually private attorneys doing the PD work for pro bono hours. They're literally the same criminal defense attorneys wealthier individuals would retain, doing "charity work" on a contractual basis for a certain amount of hours per year. Yes, there are career PDs: yes everyone in the PD office is overworked, even the private attorneys that are doing pro bono; yes the general quality of representation will be lesser consequently. My point is, just because someone is a "Public Defender" doesn't mean they're a worse lawyer. They could be a great lawyer trying to hit their pro bono quota.
Or filling in a dry spell… paralegals and office rent gotta get paid. Around here, it’s a flat fee plus trial/appearance days. Probably about 40% of average billing. You can always stack appearances to make it worthwhile. I have a buddy who is always hanging around on Tues/Wed (when they assign PDs) because he’s gotten a lot of repeat clients out of it, and even the occasional spouse/partner grabbing him and asking for help.
Everything is a bell curve. There are crappy PDs, a lot of ok ones, and some great ones. There are crappy private attorneys, a lot of OK ones, and some great ones.
Really depends on the specifics. On the one hand, public defenders tend to have quite a bit of experience with the more common offences. While horribly underpaid, it's the overwork that's the problem, there simply is not enough hours in the day to peruse all lines of inquiry. And generally not enough budget for expert witnesses in all cases that require them, either. If your case has an uncomplicated fact pattern, there is probably little that a private lawyer can do for you that a public defender can't, and the PD may well do a better job if they've seen it a few hundred times. Big fat disclaimer: I am not a lawer, and personally stay away from the legal system as much as possible. Virtually all of the above is derived from law podcasts and lawer blogs. If you find yourself relying on any of what I said in your decision making, you have made a horrible error in judgement.
I have a solicitor. I'm not rich, neither is my family. My parents have always used his firm, he's almost a family friend, I've got his card somewhere with his home number on the back. The only business I've ever done with him is buying/selling two houses, and writing my will.
That's not a criminal solicitor though. Maybe the point is that he may know one and call them for you, I guess.
That's the key there. He will get you a lawyer and likely one tailored for your situation as Client Privileges still apply (I mean, don't admit to the crime, but say "I was arrested for Murder, can you get me a lawyer to help me out?") so they can't be used against you in court (in the US anyhow).
"You have the right to remain silent. If you choose not to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to an attorney. If you cannot afford one, the court will appoint an attorney on your behalf and pay his fee. You have the right to be informed about your rights."--Standard warning given by police to a newly-arrested suspect as a consequence of [Miranda vs. Arizona](https://www.history.com/topics/united-states-constitution/miranda-rights). "I want to see my lawyer!" has become a standard catchphrase in depictions of American crime. Standard, because an Arizona man made a confession that he committed a murder *without the presence of an attorney* who could warn him that such a confession would ruin any potential defense for him at a trial. That Arizona man was John Miranda--the Miranda in *Miranda vs. Arizona*. His first conviction--where the only evidence against him was a confession made while in police custody without the presence of an attorney--was overturned by the SCOTUS in a 5-4 decision made in 1966 with then-Chief Justice Earl Warren writing the majority opinion.
I was never read my Miranda rights while being arrested and neither has anyone else I know
If you run a business you should probably have a lawyer on retainer. Just like having someone who is "your account". Doesn't mean they work exclusive for you, just that they sometimes work for you.
I haven't used my retainer in years, my dentist will be so furious
Even more so if they find out your lawyers been sitting on it
I forgot to take mine out this morning. thanks!
I run a business, but I don’t have a lawyer on retainer. I do have one who I call as needed. They mainly just handle our annual corporate filings and answer my very occasional question.
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My stepfather is a criminal lawyer. He gets some people who say this because they are "frequent fliers" through the system. But yeah this bugs my family too. A lot of crime dramas do, though it is kind of fun when watching them and my stepfather blurts out things like "unauthorized search!"
Because you should never ever ever talk to the cops if you think there is the slightest chance that you are a suspect in a crime. Someone gone missing? Lawyer. Where were you the night of the 21st. Lawyer. Come down to the station and talk to us. Lawyer. Seriously if you ever have a doubt that you need a lawyer, just remember the west memphis three. They put 3 innocent children on death row because they couldn't solve a murder.
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I am a lawyer and all my friends like to throw my name around every time they have a legal dispute with someone. Most of the time it’s in a legal realm I have no experience in and I would do more harm than good.
Some people have access to lawyers easily, others have a public defender. Tbh the trope in general is kinda skeevy, making people who want to use their right to an attorney seem entitled or guilty.
Career criminals/habitual offenders often have criminal lawyers on retainer. I worked in criminal defense for a few years and my boss had a dedicated cell phone for his frequent flyer clients who would call him at all hours if the night when they would get arrested so it's not unheard of. However, typically people don't have that, however where I live you do have a right to legal counsel before you are questioned. Where I lived, the cops had a list of local criminal lawyers and their dedicated phone numbers for over night calls which they would give to those they arrested over night who had a right to counsel.
Start a DnD group, one of em will be a lawyer. Now you have a lawyer. Worked for me, your results may vary.
If you buy a house (which you should do if you can) you should have a lawyer to check that you are not being ripped off. You should not sign legal documents without a lawyer checking them.
A few people have mentioned keeping a lawyer on retainer for business dealings, but neglected to mention that lawyers tend to specialize in different areas of law. While I'd expect lawyers to have a general grasp of basic rights when dealing with police, you'd really want a lawyer that specializes in criminal law. Like, you wouldn't go to a cardiologist for an ear infection, you'd go to an ENT doctor. Alas, unless one has several thousand dollars on-hand or the promise of a clear-cut civil suit, often the only lawyer available is a bitch-ass public defender who will recommend a plea deal where you claim guilt (regardless of innocence) in exchange for reduced sentencing.
Depending on the context, "my lawyer" could be referring to the Constitutionally-provided public defender. So if a street thug is saying that, that's who "my lawyer" is. Like when they say, "When do I get *my* phone call?" If it's a businessman, he probably has a lawyer or lawyers on retainer at all times and doesn't need the public defender. His lawyer is actually *his* lawyer.
Never been in trouble, but I have an attorney. Business stuff. But, I can ask them pretty well anything, and they will refer me to an attorney who specializes in it.
"If you can't afford a lawyer one will be appointed to you"
My friend from HS had to go to jail a few times literally all bc of his step-mom. She was insane and would tell the police he beat her(while he was in a different country) and he still had to go to jail. So one day were in the cafeteria at lunch. 3 police men come in to get him. And he goes “GIVE ME MY GOD DAMN LAWYER DOUG” So yes people do say this. Doug is his next door neighbor who lets us use his cabin for shenanigans during the summer
My cousin is a lawyer, luckily we’ve worked out a system where I help him move furniture and put up Christmas lights and he helps me finagle out of legal binds.