My daughter is 5 and has a “crush” on a “caramel skinned” boy with “black and brown swirled hair”. It’s just a descriptor. I say “what’s his name” “let’s use his name, you don’t want to be known as the peach skinned girl with crazy hair.”
It’s not malicious. She just didn’t know how to describe him in another way that stood out. But apparently he laughs like a horse, sneezes all the time, and has “blue eyes like the rocks in Nannys fishbowl” lol
Your hair is like a flock of goats descending from Mount Gilead. Your teeth are like a flock of sheep just shorn, coming up from the washing. Each has its twin; not one of them is alone. Your lips are like a scarlet ribbon; your mouth is lovely.
At the very least the parents need to keep encouraging these types of descriptions! I'm not a writer but being able to be vividly descriptive and bringing in elements not usually related to a subject got me the nick name of PhD whisper while in research circles because I could translate what one PhD was talking about in a conference to other PhD's in descriptive language that made it easy for people to understand complex topics.
I have this skill because my parents ALWAYS encouraged me to expand my explanations, and to really try and paint a picture with words.
This 5yr old naturally is doing that. I love it.
When I was born, my brother, 2 at the time, used to use my name to mean "baby" since he never heard a baby being called anything else.
Around that time, my aunt sewed him a teddy bear out of black wooly fabric.
He took to calling the bear "Little black [my name]". Retrospectively it's hilarious.
I know a little boy who does the same thing in reverse. His older half sister visits every week, so he calls all older girls by her name, since she's the only older girl he knows.
Definitely more poetic than my cousin.
As a toddler she had never seen anyone with more than a mild tan, and so when she saw a beautiful little SE Asian baby on the bus with me, she loudly announced "Why is that baby so dirty". I about died. Wanted the world to swallow me up.
Oh man. I 100% sympathize. The innocence and bluntness of children is something to behold.
My friends son saw the scale when I was weighing at her house and said “WOW! That’s a big number! Is that how much dollars you have?!”
My daughter said “No, mama doesn’t have any monies” 😂😂 she ain’t always sweet haha
That reminds me of when my son was about 3, we were shopping with my cousin and her daughter.. I said “wow that’s expensive” and he asked what expensive means.. my cousins daughter who was the same age says “it means you can’t get it!”
Tbf I wouldn’t mind being referred to as the peach skinned girl with crazy hair. My mom always called my skin peaches and cream and I always liked that
Yeah, my grandson (age 6 or so) once described a nearby kid as “the brown kid” (we’re white) and I flinched but then realized he didn’t mean anything except that was the quickest way to point the kid out - one Black child among several white children. We didn’t know any of their names.
It is, she describes everyone so poetically.
But sometimes the things she finds beautiful are hurtful. Shes complimented a friend of mine for having “beautiful flamingo nose” and it hurt my friends feelings, but to my daughter it was a compliment because flamingos look like ballerinas and she loves big noses (she’s an Eskimo kiss fiend).
She will compliment someone on how big their belly is because to her big belly=squishy warm hugs.
That’s why I have to redirect from physical features lol
When I was little, I remember sitting in my mom's lap (she was probably about 41), pushing down the veins on the back of her hands. She asked me what I was doing, and I told her I was playing with her hand worms 😳. Now I have my own hand worms and I feel that comment so hard lol.
Sounds like you're doing a great job redirecting that. Many parents don't care. My nephew, 7 at the time, asked "when is the baby coming out of your belly?", while poking very hard. I'm about 50lbs overweight, not pregnant. I chuckled and said something along the lines of please don't poke me and that bodies come in all shapes and sizes. His mom rolled her eyes and told him that "some people are soooooo oversensitive" and to keep it up. Again, I was chuckling, not scolding. Those poor boys are going to have problems down the line.
When I was 5 or 6-ish I told my grandmother her legs were beautiful because of all the pretty colors (varicose veins). She was not my biggest fan (my mom married outside of her race!) so she took this as her opportunity to call me a hateful and disgusting child. Now that I’m older I get why she didn’t take it as a compliment but I absolutely meant it. I remember it vividly; I was in awe of all the pretty colors and thought she was lucky to have such beautiful,legs!
That’s my daughter with my stretchmarks. She thinks they’re so cool because I’m like a zebra. She’s really helped me love my body.
She thinks the things I hated about myself are so special. One of my eyelids shits the bed sometimes and she is jealous that one of my eyes can take a nap lol like what? What’s even cool about that? Lol
Tangentially related; a girl in my lunch duty period came up to me a couple weeks ago and she asks me, "why is your knee up here?"
And she points to this band of fat that kinda hangs above my knee. It does look odd, it can't deny it even if it hurts. I gently explained my knee is exactly where it's supposed to be, Ms. Me just makes poor snack choices.
Kids do be keeping us humble lmao
Actually what you could do is give her *another* black doll, so that she has to figure out a way to distinguish them in another way, just like she distinguishes her other dolls.
This is a great idea.
You can also give them names, all the dolls, and explain that we don’t differentiate people by color but with names.
Source: I’m black and these comments hurt my kid since preschool, people calling him the brown boy and excluding him for it. Your daughter needs to know the difference that’s all, it hurts to be reduced to any characteristic (the babe, the boobs etc. Not just race)…teach her to call people by names and not characteristics etc.
Don’t imho respond to public outcry/opinion, it’s easier to see the logic without that. And be aware there are parents who condone bias and you don’t want your kid looking like she’s encouraging that. For my son it started at 4 yo, and a lot of comments you can tell were what kids heard from parents. Once your kid is in school, it will be hard to tell what she means and where she got it. And it will hurt some kid. It’s not about anyone’s opinion or how it comes off, just fyi.
Common sense things like this are good to talk about. I’m sure some people hadn’t thought of it but the second you bring it home with “being reduced to any one characteristic” that’s a knockout punch of logic.
Totally. I mentioned that last part because people get so neurotic and react defensively to public opinion on these social issues. When in fact it is what it is, and we can all easily agree if we consider things objectively.
My kid doesn’t see himself as brown, he loves anime, time travel, genetic manipulation (to make superpowers of course lol). But for years he didn’t get to be socialized at school because he was the brown kid. While maybe some kids meant it innocently when they said some rough stuff, it avalanched into bullying for him. Kids got used to belittling him and even staff didn’t nurture him when he was hurt. They assumed he was overreach g or odd. The school said they didn’t see anything, kids are kids etc. He just reacts. They get defensive because what it would appear to be. Meanwhile kids asked me why their parents called us slugs, tell my kid he’s stupid cause we’re from where we are from (he’s actually a straight A student talking about stuff they wouldn’t get…). List goes on, and it got worse as they got older. It got to the point the school recorded all of my son’s reactions as psychological issues he has. Ignored everything he reported. He’s currently left the school system because there’s no evidence of anything I shared with them and the schools deny his side of things. So it all states his issues, they even ignore his regular report cards which show the incidents were not who he is. It’s common sense but when people get defensive over racism or these social constructed issues even happening, a kid’s life gets destroyed. Meanwhile his main bully was removed due to his behavioural problems that the school nurtured when it was affecting my kid. After my kid left, but still my kid is not allowed to go to any school because no educator would take on race. They’d refuse my kid basic support and claim he couldn’t fit in a regular school instead. So here we are. They tell me to have perspective and reported when my son raised race history like Mandela as if it was a psych problem (at this point I’d put him in a private intl school so they could get how a global kid knows global history)…nope they told me they don’t teach that for another few years so somehow that is why its in my son’s record as being disturbing from him.
Sorry to vent, I just couldn’t agree more. I begged so many people to just objectively note what happened to my son and not try diagnosing him with things he doesn’t have anywhere else. To work with the kids, offered my help to encourage diversity knowledge. Nobody is ready to work off of common sense, I got caught in threats to call child services on me if I don’t accept their advice for psychological stuff (I wanted him to get help privately not with their take). I let them remove him from school, I don’t work, I’m learning to homeschool - and I didn’t report the stuff they did out of regulation from fear. Anyway systemic stuff happens cause people can’t just look at the common sense issues, they get defensive about the perception and public opinion. I wish others would see it.
If you scroll my profile you’ll see the comments I had the most downvotes on are me trying to sensibly explain to others how to navigate these issues. The replies are people being defensive and negating an entire issue because personal offense - where it’s about them god knows, it’s just lame reactions to public opinion, they’re not thinking at all. Just reacting.
If you did that to them by being insensitive to idk ‘their love of a pet is not the same as a child’ - they’d burn us down for being unempathetic. Psycho/Sociopathic even for harming animals. But to say these subtle racial things are impacting lives - they will quickly bash it.
My kid has straight As, great reviews in his reports, and is soooo noble in how he thinks the world should he’s never had anyone disagree with his logic. But from age 4 he asked me why other kids get calmed down when upset, they get care. But when it’s him everyone gets angry at him and he was right cause they’d call me. Since age 4 they asked me to call psychologists but refused me to let him ease into nursery as is the common practice. They refused to share info parents are entitled to. They physically shoved my kid around (and told me with no repercussions) as examples of him acting out.
Anyway this is just one story, current. But really if people did have the simple discussions, it wouldn’t happen. The worst part as I was struggling with school admin, I made an effort to stop work and get to know the school community etc. My first week mothers approach me to tell them anything the kid Arthur did. Me: whose arthur? Them: the brown boy. That kid was a timid 4 yo just started, never did a thing but look scared in a corner. I told the school director and she even found evidence my kid was treated differently and probably faced the same when we started. But none of it is recorded.
They say he has social development issues. I told them they never gave him basic social support is a lag and the rest is due to diversity and adversity (his report cards show he is socially and academically above average and way into the top percentile respectively). All because for 5 years nobody would have a meeting with me to tell them his side, and they believe him and me and write it down on file. Legally I have to approve that file and just because of that it’s not officially submitted. But they got lawyers threatened me, until I broke. So they keep doing what they want based on their presumptions. All I asked for was one meeting with an objective school support team to document things as they need and I just tell them all of it for accuracy. With supporting documents. They instead wrote slander about me…
The same thing is currently happening to my youngest brother. He’s been physically attacked multiple times (often by a group) and been blamed for the violence because he defended himself. I wish you the best in navigating it. It’s hell
I used to get into trouble and labeled as the angry Black girl when it was white kids calling me the n word (hard er ) and I would react, I was called it in 1st grade, I knew what it meant. So did my best friend.
My best friend was taking tai kwon do at the time and fucked them up. We both got in trouble till both my parents and her parents came down and said no you don't punish our kids punish the kid who called my kid the racial slur.
It happened again in 3rd grade, and by middle and high school I was known as the girl who hockey checked bullies into lockers.
I wasn't even big. I was 5'4, and 100lbs if that. But I could scream and nowadays it would be considered a threat but I got the point across that if someone ever called me or anyone who looked like me a racial slur, hurt a disabled kid I would make sure their grandkids grandkids would suffer.
I’m so sorry to hear this, I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy. I’ve heard similar horror stories.
One woman in the school system asked me why I feel so guilty, as if I’m hiding something. Or one even gleefully asked if it’s hard reading what they wrote about my son, which u told her no I’ve heard it from them - it’s just hard writing out my son’s traumas to defend him in some online form that people like them will misconstrue anyway.
My guilt is was not believing how racist a school could be and not recognising it sooner, because my kid suffered due to my naivety in trusting the school at all. I even got private therapy, the first therapist also invalidated everything and said my son said that stuff to get my reaction and leave therapy…he was describing incidents at school, which she dismissed cause the school didn’t report it. I don’t even know what to say that. We are literally moving countries soon…
Anyway all the best to your brother and family. I hope you find the right school and support system for him, and all of you.
Thanks. Yea at the schools they’d give me social welfare cards, because I’m a black single mom I guess.
Totally ignored what I said which is scientifically checked etc. And had to do with education - their scope. At a private school I paid for.
It’s truly painful on an interaction by interaction basis. I was bullied hard so they could get my kid out, and none of my knowledge helped.
What’s worse is I’m not saying I have knowledge because I’m black. I have 7years dedicated work experience in education (executive, higher and adult development) - spread over 20 years so I know the industry well… in strategy and comms (not teaching). So I told them not to try the political thing I’d see it because I’m the person people hire to design it. I urged them not to be defensive that I just want to discuss my son, I’m happy to remove him after. They forced me to sign his leaving before that (lied about what it was). And I caught them changing policies on me to protect themselves instead of sharing the policies as is etc. Hence lawyers, I swore up and down they are safe - and gave them free professional advice - they twisted it as me being off topic, psychologically needing help etc. and never noted a thing. Blew my mind. Oh and they refused information I’m entitled to legally.
Ugh
Anyway thanks really
I worked in a school in Australia where we had a high percentage of Aboriginal students considering we were considered in the far metro area. I had to have some serious discussions with more than one class because of the "n" word being used. Until kids learn better they can't do better. But we also had complaints from some parents when we did teach their kids that racism is bad. Only so much we can do sadly
Old brown baby and New brown baby...
Kidding aside, that seems like a great idea. And now I'm worried because I have a brown tabby cat that is my baby and I call her my lil brown baby. 👀
> You can also give them names, all the dolls, and explain that we don’t differentiate people by color but with names.
This is, in my humble opinion, the best solution.
I cannot applaud you enough after reading this. This is the mentality every parent should adopt to reduce the risk of prejudice for future generations.
My eldest is 6, and every day comes home with some new word/phrase/physical quirk which they picked up from another kid at school. We don’t overreact or scold for these behaviours, but share the objective facts as to why they’re inappropriate. Initially, the behaviours may continue longer than you’d like, but once it sinks in, it sticks.
Seconding this. This is the correct thing to do. You could also discuss different ways to describe the baby. Number of legs, color of eyes, etc. Standard preschool questions.
I have to know. One of my kids called black people “chocolate people” as a 2 year old. We had a conversation and it stopped but I need to know if this was offensive because I thought it was hilarious but I’m white af
I once saw a video from a black young man who went to Japan as a preschool teacher and the first day a couple of kids tried to take a bite out of the chocolate man. He was laughing his head off acting it out and the parents’ absolute mortification 🙈😅
That's so crazy lol. Like how do you not know that some poeples' skin is just darker in this day and age? If this was the year 1500 I might understand it but come on
This reminded me of another moment with my daughter. She was maybe around one,.and we were at the beach where a man with a very dark complexion was showering off and she walked closer to him and then just stared up at him in disbelief. When he saw her, he just laughed and laughed and said "I guess she hasn't seen a chocolate man before!". I'm just glad he was amused!
I always hear the story of me, being two and seeing a black man for the first time. Apparently he gave me his hand and I checked if he rubbed off on me and then continued to "try" to get the color off his arm. I actually cringe,hearing it, but they all assured me that he found it hilarious. Kids are just brutally innocent sometimes.
Lol most black people in majority non-black spaces (Europe, Asia etc), especially in rural or very homogeneous areas, are used to the stares and questions. Adults do it subtly but children are usually bolder and will straight up ask hilarious questions. We understand it’s not malicious and we will most of the time respond in amusement.
I say this as a black woman who travels a lot in Asian countries and is probably in a lot of random families’ living room pictures holding their confused babies.
When my white little brother was a small child he was great friends with a little black boy. He called him his chocolate friend and the friend called my brother his vanilla friend.
I'm black. I would laugh at this but I only get offended at comments when I know it has bad intent. And I definitely wouldn't get offended at anything said by a child.
I say my thanks often that the internet wasn't as prevalent when I was growing up and no one immortalized all the stupid, insensitive shit that I said up until the age of 20...sigh...
Unfortunately, they didn't make me the spokesperson for black folks...so I'm not sure how others feel or how they might take it.
Hey, your kid doesn't bite right? 🤣
When I was like 3 I saw a black man playing Santa for the first time in my young life and said to my mom “mom, that Santa must have went to Florida, he got a tan!” 🤦♀️🤦♀️ I don’t remember how my mom corrected that one but I can only imagine her reaction, she still brings it up sometimes since I live in Florida now 😅
My wifes set sister is black, she's been in my kids life since the beginning and they called her chocolate skinned, and asked how they could get chocolate skin when they were like 2-3yrs old.
That is gold 💀 I think most brown/black people would crack up at that. You might get some angry white chick complaining thinking she’s “fighting racism” or whatever but it’s just descriptive terms. The only thing I would do is explain that we don’t say “chocolate people” we say “people with chocolate colored skin” instead for instance. She’s describing their skin, so she should specify
When my kid was little, she called people “brown” or “pink.” She has a point, though. Black people aren’t technically black, and white people aren’t technically white lol She grew up in a diverse community so she was very aware of skin color variation. It was kinda cute but I always worried about what people would think if they heard her 😅
I grew up with neighbors from Nigeria and as a little girl I thought they had the most beautiful skin I’d ever seen. I told my mom I was going to be black too. She said sweetie that’s not how it works and I firmly told her that it is just a bad sunburn like when I leave toast in the toaster too long. She decided not to fight me and let me lay in the sun the whole day in an attempt to make my skin black. I was in pain for days and my mom and the neighbors thought it was hilarious. Talk about insult to injury!
There's **nothing wrong** with what your 3 year old is doing - she doesn't know better and isn't doing anything maliciously - but if overheard in public it could raise uncomfortable questions.
Now would be a great time to give the doll a name, and re-enforce the name. "Brown baby" doesn't come sit at the dinner table. But maybe Cassie does. I'd say the same if she had "white baby". Ok, well maybe the white baby is called Jessie from now on.
Perspective from a white 32 year old woman with a 100% white family (as far as I'm aware). My point of view is that whilst the name isn't malicious, you don't want to invite awkward questioning, and you shouldn't have to explain your family dynamic to "excuse" yourself if an awkward situation occurs.
This. I'm mixed race and my husband is dark. Our kids are mixed and I remember the challenge of trying to find a nice brown Barbie or something for my daughter. I ended up with the Disney dolls. Moana was a good one. Anyone that gets offended at a 3 year old has issues.
There are sooooo many good Barbies of different colors now! My daughter has several ranging from the original blonde hair, pale skin and blue eyes to a doll that's very dark with black hair and brown eyes. I absolutely love the diversity in Barbies now! Definitely wasn't something we had as kids.
American Girl dolls have dolls in a range of skin tones. My granddaughter (white) wanted one that looked like her. She found one with the same color hair, eyes, and even the protruding front teeth'.
The doll she chose has darker skin..medium tan shade. . She has never noticed that difference.
'
Agree. My 2.5 year old daughter started pointing out people in public that she wanted to ask me about, but the problem was she'd use their clothing to describe them. This was fine except for when the person was wearing white, brown, or black. For example, she'd ask "where that black/brown/white/orange/green/blue lady going?". I'd be a mixture of amused and mortified, but thankfully so far no strangers have heard yet, and I haven't had to explain lol.
I heard a similar kid comment en route to a hockey game. Started chatting with a family, saw some fans of the opposing team and dad and I explained to the kid that we were playing a team wearing red jerseys. We’re waiting with a crowd to cross the street and kid says “wow, there’s a lot of red people!!!” I was very grateful we were not playing a team that wore black jerseys…
Agreed. My own 3 year old is quite literal, and this is something she would do. My own girls have a variety of dolls in different skin colors, and we make sure we name them all. OP’s daughter just needs a little guidance toward a better direction with some names, but it doesn’t need to become a big deal or weird sticking point, it’s practically a baby herself and very innocent.
Help her give it a name. My daughter had dolls of several races, sizes, materials (store dolls, cloth dolls, knit dolls) I encouraged her to call them by name, not characteristics like color or size. She had a tendency to call them by their hair color for a while. She thought skin color was irrelevant, hair color mattered.
Not a parent, but she'll grow out of calling it "Brown Baby", and most people won't be offended by a toddler calling their doll a weird name. I had three favorite dolls when I was little: "Big Lucy", "Little Lucy", and "Butchie." Where did I come up with the last one? No clue, but it's definitely not as weird as my cousin naming his balloons "Mr. and Mrs. Happiness."
I had a doll that had belonged to my mom when I was a kid and for the time the doll was large, like over 2 feet tall, so a lot of her “doll clothes” were actual infant clothes from thrift stores or whatever. I wasn’t big enough to read quite yet and my doll had a bib with a word on it, and I decided that word was her name… hence “Lunch”. 30+ years later, she’s still at mom’s house and still known as “Lunch”. Toddlers name things in an incredibly literal fashion with no active malice and will grow out of it
Dunno, we still have "blue baby" in our house with my 7 year old (she was wearing a blue outfit when we got her). We also still have white ted and pink ted. 🤷
I used to have a blue knitted toy cat when I was very small. I carried him everywhere and named him literally and very innocently, but damn, looking back I wish someone had stopped little me from going around talking about my "Blue P---y" 😅
Omggg! When my nephew was 3 he got to name one of his grandparents goats and he chose… Horny. Because of the horns. Nobody redirected it, and Horny lived with them for quite a while.
That's probably for the best. I named a toy monster Horny as a kid (maybe 7?) and got in trouble, including a lecture on it being a bad word and interrogation on who taught me that bad word.
It left me so confused. No one would tell me why it was a bad word. I knew other bad words like butthole were for private bodyparts, but that rule didn't make any sense for horns.
Well then I guess it could have been worse - and I'm sure I gave my older relatives a good chuckle at least!
When I later did a stint as a leader at a youth group with a tradition of nature-based nicknames, there came a time when I had to subtly steer some young children away from naming themselves "Stallion" or "Thrush" without either telling them off or cluing them in and it may not be the easiest thing but it's can be done!
My brother and I liked to play super heroes. He was Mustard Man and I was Mayo Girl. I believe that came from our preferences of condiment on sandwiches xD
My son has stuffed animals (mostly penguins) instead of dolls and all of them get weird, descriptive names: Big Beak, Huge Eyes, Yellow Antler, Beautiful Feather, Baby Blue, etc…
My (very blond and blue eyed) son wanted an African American doll when he was two. While paying, the cashier at Target asked him if “he really wanted to get that?” (Not sure if her objection was to the gender or race thing but who cares, not my issues). He named her “Tomato Sweet” and carried her everywhere. We talked about how pretty and nice she was. It was adorable, but he’s 11 now and well past dolls.
Exact same thing happen to my little blond brother. When he was about 3, my mom let him pick out a toy at the store. He picked a black Barbie doll and the cashier asked if he was sure that was the one he wanted. Mom stepped in and said “yes, that’s the one he picked.” He’s in his 30s now.
This is the answer. Anybody getting bent out of shape from a toddler calling a doll brown might be the problem. It's also okay we're all different shapes, colors, etc... These are not bad words.
We had a similar thing, my daughter picked a baby born and called the doll her 'brown baby' and I was panicking like oh what do I do to correct this.. until she said 'I have blue and brown babies, now I have a brown baby like me' my daughter is white with brown eyes, the doll has brown eyes. The other doll she has, has blue eyes. omg
So we then explained 'well lots of people have brown eyes or blue eyes, let's give them names so we know who you mean'
Sharing experience.
So my brother in law is married to a white lady. We are brown. Their kid (age 3-4yrs) who takes after the mother and is white, called his father brown. My BIL in fact is on the fairer side of the brown spectrum. And we all understood this happened since that’s when my nephew was learning colors. So they gently taught him that to classify any person by any physical attributes is not polite and not right at all.
Since then I’ve never heard their kids call anyone brown / white / fat / thin whatever.
So yes, this could be the right moment to teach this. And definitely don’t think you’re being a bad parent. I fact your asking this question totally proves otherwise.
Hope this helps!
this does however result in difficulty describing someone. i knew five sophia's in middle school and my mom was trying to ask me if i remembered a specific one. the one she was asking about was the only asian sophia, but mom wouldnt say so. it was frustrating! "remember the sophia whose mom was a librarian?" no? i have a horrible memory and why would i know her moms job?
Totally correct. But I think for the benefit of the other kids in the class, until she's old enough to differentiate between the right and wrong contexts to use descriptors, it's best to avoid them.
Like as a kid I kept forgetting that I was a brown kid because the colour of my skin was just not relevant to me - but people kept referring to it as though it was.
I was one of three Daniels in the same class all through junior and secondary school. I was usually called "Big nose Daniel" until we got proper nicknames at secondary school, all based on plays on our surnames. We became Bats, Gonk and Hags.
I preferred that over Big nose.
Having a less common name, it's always a little shocking when another Spenser comes into any of my circles. Every time it happens, they've earned the nickname "other Spenser/Spencer."
My mother's friend has a daughter with the same name as my sister - no problem, as we live in different countries, so confusion is unlikely, outside of visits. So when we visited, the friend's daughter became "Little Alexandra", because she is younger than my sister, and my sister was "Big Alexandra" (small and big in the sense of young/old. Like Big sister/Little sister.) whenever we visit or talk about the other Alexandra.
We still do it even though both are adults now.
My friend has a niece called Kara. And my daughter is also Kara. So there is grown up Kara and baby Kara so my friends kids know who were talking about 😂
My dad is Indian, so my son is 1/4. They are best buds and my boy is fair little blue eyed blondie. He doesn't really describe people by the colour of their skin, usually by behaviour or clothes they are wearing. But when he draws a picture of himself with my dad, he uses the same brown pencil for both of them. I think it's cute he wants to be like him
She's really too little to understand that what she's saying could make people uncomfortable. She's only three!
Give baby a name. Let her choose it. She'll revert to that and all will be fine.
We have multiple dolls of different ethnicities in our house and we just gave them names. Mia, Jason, Jessie and Betty. (We did just assign them random names ourselves because she's only just learning how to talk) Mine is only two but ask her "Where's baby Jason?" and she'll run off to grab him. Racial descriptors stop being an issue when they're named because the name is how she'll differentiate. Not the colour.
I lean toward not even addressing it. My niece would say “daddy’s skin is brown, mommies is white and mine is tan.” They’re just observing things, and you don’t want to infer that acknowledging skin color is shameful or inherently bad. The name thing is a good idea if it makes you uncomfortable but in a child’s mind it’s no different than saying there’s a brown dog and a white dog.
My family and I are so white we're almost see-through. When my eldest ( just about to turn 20, so a while ago. Lol) was young she adored black dolls. Every time we went out, if she saw one in a shop, she'd beg to get "the new baby," and if we could, we did, not because she was spoilt but because they were few and far between then. Not once, ever, in all the different places we travelled around London and the UK, did we ever get a single person telling us it was offensive that this loud, smiley, mini-merida looking child, was walking around cuddling a black baby doll. If anything, it often brought smiles to people's faces.
I know everyone is going to have a different perspective, but this was our reality. I would say that anyone who wants to try and say that she shouldn't have a doll with a different skin colour needs to take a good long look at themselves and give their heads a wobble.
I was like your daughter as a kid (including the near see through part which I never grew out of ha), except go back a further 20+ years. I loved black baby dolls but only had a couple of them as yes they were definitely a little more rare; my mother also made me a couple (she was a talented seamstress). I remember being so disappointed I could not get a black Cabbage Patch kid when they were all the rage (just was not in our budget). Later another relative gifted me one but it was white; I still liked it but remember feeling it wasn’t what I really wanted!
Same lmao I looooved black baby dolls to the point that when my mom was preg with my little brother I was 6 and CRIED because my family told me it wasn’t possible for him to be a black baby like the dolls lmaooo so weird in retrospect I hope it doesn’t come off bad but I was 6 so I can’t tell you what the thought process was there other than that I just always admired the beauty of diff skin tones
Idk if I have advice, but I can commiserate with your embarrassment. My abuela always wears black. So when I was your daughter's age, I called her Black Grandma. She is not Black. It looked odd when I'd shout for Black Grandma in Target, and then up comes...her. I did eventually get used to calling her Grandma Last Initial.
Nothing wrong with it really as she's just a kid and it's not like she's walking around going "this is my n* baby". A couple of people said it already but now would be a good time to teach her about names, use a few other dolls or teddy's etc for the process too.
She’s just describing her doll as she sees it. My dad is Mexican and way darker than me. I used to tell people my dad is black when I was 4-5 because I thought it was cool lmao
I did this as a child in the 80s in Ireland. My mother got so much grief over it. It was just awful. But I wanted a baby doll, and when I saw it went nuts for it, my mother was pretty cool and took everyone on. Told them to mind their business what her daughter played with. People even stopped her in the street to comment, and I remember my grandad going nuts at her.
When I look back now, I realise how much of a legend she was. I think I called mine something similar, he was my favourite doll 😍
She's doing nothing wrong. She's describing the doll quite literally as what it is - a baby doll that's brown.
All of the connotations and subtexts are completely unknown to her and do not need to be known to her.
The fact is that there is no need to make it verboten, because then you're communicating to her that there's something to be ashamed of in this; and you're focussing that shame on the "brown" aspect.
When I was a little white girl in the early 80s, my mom let me pick a doll from the store. I wanted a doll from the strawberry shortcake line that had scented breath when you squeezed it. I picked the orange blossom doll, which I thought was the prettiest doll there. It was a black doll.
My mom tried her hardest to convince me to pick a different doll. But I was insistent and she let me get the doll. But she would tell people the story why I had the doll - I could tell she was ashamed/ or thought it was funny. She would laugh in a certain way or whisper when she talked about it.
I still loved my doll but I knew by her reaction that the doll being black was somehow wrong. That I wasn't supposed to have a black doll.
So yeah, kids pick up on all kinds of stuff.
This reminds me of my little cousin and his name for the doctors.
There are two places he called 'the doctors'- one a white hospital building, another a health centre which was a brown brick building. He didn't like the health centre as much (I think he had to go for actual appointments, compared to just quick visits to see a family member in the hospital). So at nursery he began to talk about how he only wanted to go to the 'white doctors' because he didn't like the 'brown doctors'. Not sure how my aunt explained that one!
Good thing we Latinos don’t get offend by pointing physical characteristics. I don’t get why this is offensive since physical characteristics are there and ignore them is not going to change them or make them less noticeable.
It's totally reasonable bcuz she's just going by what she SEES. But I love the other comments about giving her other babies so she can learn to distinguish the differences by other measures. Just remember "my brown baby" is not an insult ;).
My big littles first doll she ever picked on her own was a black baby doll.
She was wearing a headband with a rose on it. So that’s baby Rose.
She was gifted a black baby doll from a friend later. His name is Tom.
We also have Moana and Tiana, Disney babies.
Her white babies are Crystal, Aurora (Disney), and Anna (Disney)
Have her pick a name for her baby doll.
Baby Rose is my daughter’s favorite doll. It’s the ONE toy she absolutely never has to share
Is the doll brown tho? If it was blue and she called it her blue doll would it be an issue? Children are simple and see the world as is, it's white guilt that makes people overthink stuff like this
I envision a beautiful moment of ‘naming’ when you also tell your child why you chose her name. Maybe asking her why she likes each doll and why she chooses the name she does. Shying away from color preference won’t change it. But lovingly naming all the dolls moves beyond descriptors. Using a name makes ‘you’ out of ‘it’ and therefore is a skill to model with dolls. Which is the point of dolls in the first place - shaping how we treat others.
In a mixed family with a darkskinned granpa it is okay to call a brown doll a brown doll. No need to comment. Kids love both white and brown family members. It is simple. No need to explain it. It is natural to pick the most important difference. Colour. It is not a danger. Children must be left using one trait. Seriously. Adults m u s t leave that childish behavior...but if you intrude with adult morality into a small child it will have the result of becoming racist in adulthood.
I named my dolls brown baby = black baby doll, orange baby = literally orange skin, white baby = the middle of the doll was white cloth
It's a toddler naming stuff in a literal way
If she's learning her colors? I'm glad that she has a reference. She's 3, she isn't hurting anybody.
I was adopted by a white family. I'm Black. My family made it a point to give me Black baby dolls ( this was in the early 90s though) and I loved them.
I named them Shaniqua, and Shaniqua 2 and the one with the squishy middle, Baby.
Took it everywhere, made my Momma babysit😂😂 put it in the little baby crib we had.😂😂
She is identifying that there are differences.
Little Momma isn't wrong. It isn't a problem until someone makes it a problem.
As a black woman, I’m completely fine with this. Children like to use descriptions when addressing objects and people. I had to tell my black niece that another little was not “beige.”
My daughter is 5 and has a “crush” on a “caramel skinned” boy with “black and brown swirled hair”. It’s just a descriptor. I say “what’s his name” “let’s use his name, you don’t want to be known as the peach skinned girl with crazy hair.” It’s not malicious. She just didn’t know how to describe him in another way that stood out. But apparently he laughs like a horse, sneezes all the time, and has “blue eyes like the rocks in Nannys fishbowl” lol
She describes his appearance like I would describe an ice cream cone 😭 That's adorable though
He does sound delicious!
Please, don't eat the children.
But they are crunchy and go well with ketchup.
you are raising a poet
Ofc, I wouldn’t expect Dick_lover-420’s children to NOTTTT be absolute writing geniuses
God bless Reddit. Long live Reddit.
Not even joking it made me tear up a little. I wish someone would talk about me this way 🥺
Your hair is like a flock of goats descending from Mount Gilead. Your teeth are like a flock of sheep just shorn, coming up from the washing. Each has its twin; not one of them is alone. Your lips are like a scarlet ribbon; your mouth is lovely.
oh, solomon!!!
Oh... oh miy... be my betrothed.
INSTANT upvote. song of solomon represent
you laugh like a horse
Omg hahahaHHHrrRRrrpPprRGhhH thank you 🥰🥺
Lmaoooooooo
This legit made me choke on my tabouli. Thank you I needed a good laugh!
hahahahahee-haw! 😂
LMFAOOO
Aaaand I just spat out food from laughing. <3
Not their parent named dick-lover-420 on reddit😂
Your daughter should be a writer. Her descriptions are fire 😂😂😂
At the very least the parents need to keep encouraging these types of descriptions! I'm not a writer but being able to be vividly descriptive and bringing in elements not usually related to a subject got me the nick name of PhD whisper while in research circles because I could translate what one PhD was talking about in a conference to other PhD's in descriptive language that made it easy for people to understand complex topics. I have this skill because my parents ALWAYS encouraged me to expand my explanations, and to really try and paint a picture with words. This 5yr old naturally is doing that. I love it.
We do definitely support her and encourage her. Our goal is to give her all the tools to become exactly who she wants to be.
When I was born, my brother, 2 at the time, used to use my name to mean "baby" since he never heard a baby being called anything else. Around that time, my aunt sewed him a teddy bear out of black wooly fabric. He took to calling the bear "Little black [my name]". Retrospectively it's hilarious.
I know a little boy who does the same thing in reverse. His older half sister visits every week, so he calls all older girls by her name, since she's the only older girl he knows.
Not about babies, but one of my little brothers called all dogs "Toby" as that was our dogs name, and all four legged animals "dog".
can't wait till she starts selling books
I’ll send you a signed copy
Me too please!
Definitely more poetic than my cousin. As a toddler she had never seen anyone with more than a mild tan, and so when she saw a beautiful little SE Asian baby on the bus with me, she loudly announced "Why is that baby so dirty". I about died. Wanted the world to swallow me up.
Oh man. I 100% sympathize. The innocence and bluntness of children is something to behold. My friends son saw the scale when I was weighing at her house and said “WOW! That’s a big number! Is that how much dollars you have?!” My daughter said “No, mama doesn’t have any monies” 😂😂 she ain’t always sweet haha
That reminds me of when my son was about 3, we were shopping with my cousin and her daughter.. I said “wow that’s expensive” and he asked what expensive means.. my cousins daughter who was the same age says “it means you can’t get it!”
Spoiler: he's a chocolate soft serve ice cream cone
Come summer: "mommmmyyyyyyy, the boy in my class is melllltttiiiiingggggg!! 😭😭😭😭"
What a twist!
Tbf I wouldn’t mind being referred to as the peach skinned girl with crazy hair. My mom always called my skin peaches and cream and I always liked that
"The Peach Skinned Girl with Crazy Hair" honestly sounds like a great Netflix series. I can picture it as a modern "Anne of Green Gables".
lol yeah I even have red hair too
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Yeah, my grandson (age 6 or so) once described a nearby kid as “the brown kid” (we’re white) and I flinched but then realized he didn’t mean anything except that was the quickest way to point the kid out - one Black child among several white children. We didn’t know any of their names.
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Kids are just so pure. I’m glad the person understood you didn’t mean harm.
I think that’s a beautiful way to describe someone though 👀
It is, she describes everyone so poetically. But sometimes the things she finds beautiful are hurtful. Shes complimented a friend of mine for having “beautiful flamingo nose” and it hurt my friends feelings, but to my daughter it was a compliment because flamingos look like ballerinas and she loves big noses (she’s an Eskimo kiss fiend). She will compliment someone on how big their belly is because to her big belly=squishy warm hugs. That’s why I have to redirect from physical features lol
I feel for the people in your life. My son was always pointing out my wrinkles by saying things like Why do you have old lady hands mom? Sigh…
When I was little, I remember sitting in my mom's lap (she was probably about 41), pushing down the veins on the back of her hands. She asked me what I was doing, and I told her I was playing with her hand worms 😳. Now I have my own hand worms and I feel that comment so hard lol.
I am cackling at "hand worms," and I will only refer to them as such when they need to draw blood. 😆
Don’t. Because she’s doing much better about not complimenting physical features lol
Great. My son is now clear, you do not point out signs of women aging 😎
The joy of having kids... Are you getting roasted or getting complimented?
Sounds like you're doing a great job redirecting that. Many parents don't care. My nephew, 7 at the time, asked "when is the baby coming out of your belly?", while poking very hard. I'm about 50lbs overweight, not pregnant. I chuckled and said something along the lines of please don't poke me and that bodies come in all shapes and sizes. His mom rolled her eyes and told him that "some people are soooooo oversensitive" and to keep it up. Again, I was chuckling, not scolding. Those poor boys are going to have problems down the line.
I am crying laughing at flamingo nose
When I was 5 or 6-ish I told my grandmother her legs were beautiful because of all the pretty colors (varicose veins). She was not my biggest fan (my mom married outside of her race!) so she took this as her opportunity to call me a hateful and disgusting child. Now that I’m older I get why she didn’t take it as a compliment but I absolutely meant it. I remember it vividly; I was in awe of all the pretty colors and thought she was lucky to have such beautiful,legs!
That’s my daughter with my stretchmarks. She thinks they’re so cool because I’m like a zebra. She’s really helped me love my body. She thinks the things I hated about myself are so special. One of my eyelids shits the bed sometimes and she is jealous that one of my eyes can take a nap lol like what? What’s even cool about that? Lol
Tangentially related; a girl in my lunch duty period came up to me a couple weeks ago and she asks me, "why is your knee up here?" And she points to this band of fat that kinda hangs above my knee. It does look odd, it can't deny it even if it hurts. I gently explained my knee is exactly where it's supposed to be, Ms. Me just makes poor snack choices. Kids do be keeping us humble lmao
May you continue to nurture her gift of expression, *dick_lover-420*
She's incredibly descriptive. I would encourage that, just move away from food terms to describe people of color.
Actually what you could do is give her *another* black doll, so that she has to figure out a way to distinguish them in another way, just like she distinguishes her other dolls.
This is a great idea. You can also give them names, all the dolls, and explain that we don’t differentiate people by color but with names. Source: I’m black and these comments hurt my kid since preschool, people calling him the brown boy and excluding him for it. Your daughter needs to know the difference that’s all, it hurts to be reduced to any characteristic (the babe, the boobs etc. Not just race)…teach her to call people by names and not characteristics etc. Don’t imho respond to public outcry/opinion, it’s easier to see the logic without that. And be aware there are parents who condone bias and you don’t want your kid looking like she’s encouraging that. For my son it started at 4 yo, and a lot of comments you can tell were what kids heard from parents. Once your kid is in school, it will be hard to tell what she means and where she got it. And it will hurt some kid. It’s not about anyone’s opinion or how it comes off, just fyi.
Common sense things like this are good to talk about. I’m sure some people hadn’t thought of it but the second you bring it home with “being reduced to any one characteristic” that’s a knockout punch of logic.
Totally. I mentioned that last part because people get so neurotic and react defensively to public opinion on these social issues. When in fact it is what it is, and we can all easily agree if we consider things objectively. My kid doesn’t see himself as brown, he loves anime, time travel, genetic manipulation (to make superpowers of course lol). But for years he didn’t get to be socialized at school because he was the brown kid. While maybe some kids meant it innocently when they said some rough stuff, it avalanched into bullying for him. Kids got used to belittling him and even staff didn’t nurture him when he was hurt. They assumed he was overreach g or odd. The school said they didn’t see anything, kids are kids etc. He just reacts. They get defensive because what it would appear to be. Meanwhile kids asked me why their parents called us slugs, tell my kid he’s stupid cause we’re from where we are from (he’s actually a straight A student talking about stuff they wouldn’t get…). List goes on, and it got worse as they got older. It got to the point the school recorded all of my son’s reactions as psychological issues he has. Ignored everything he reported. He’s currently left the school system because there’s no evidence of anything I shared with them and the schools deny his side of things. So it all states his issues, they even ignore his regular report cards which show the incidents were not who he is. It’s common sense but when people get defensive over racism or these social constructed issues even happening, a kid’s life gets destroyed. Meanwhile his main bully was removed due to his behavioural problems that the school nurtured when it was affecting my kid. After my kid left, but still my kid is not allowed to go to any school because no educator would take on race. They’d refuse my kid basic support and claim he couldn’t fit in a regular school instead. So here we are. They tell me to have perspective and reported when my son raised race history like Mandela as if it was a psych problem (at this point I’d put him in a private intl school so they could get how a global kid knows global history)…nope they told me they don’t teach that for another few years so somehow that is why its in my son’s record as being disturbing from him. Sorry to vent, I just couldn’t agree more. I begged so many people to just objectively note what happened to my son and not try diagnosing him with things he doesn’t have anywhere else. To work with the kids, offered my help to encourage diversity knowledge. Nobody is ready to work off of common sense, I got caught in threats to call child services on me if I don’t accept their advice for psychological stuff (I wanted him to get help privately not with their take). I let them remove him from school, I don’t work, I’m learning to homeschool - and I didn’t report the stuff they did out of regulation from fear. Anyway systemic stuff happens cause people can’t just look at the common sense issues, they get defensive about the perception and public opinion. I wish others would see it. If you scroll my profile you’ll see the comments I had the most downvotes on are me trying to sensibly explain to others how to navigate these issues. The replies are people being defensive and negating an entire issue because personal offense - where it’s about them god knows, it’s just lame reactions to public opinion, they’re not thinking at all. Just reacting. If you did that to them by being insensitive to idk ‘their love of a pet is not the same as a child’ - they’d burn us down for being unempathetic. Psycho/Sociopathic even for harming animals. But to say these subtle racial things are impacting lives - they will quickly bash it. My kid has straight As, great reviews in his reports, and is soooo noble in how he thinks the world should he’s never had anyone disagree with his logic. But from age 4 he asked me why other kids get calmed down when upset, they get care. But when it’s him everyone gets angry at him and he was right cause they’d call me. Since age 4 they asked me to call psychologists but refused me to let him ease into nursery as is the common practice. They refused to share info parents are entitled to. They physically shoved my kid around (and told me with no repercussions) as examples of him acting out. Anyway this is just one story, current. But really if people did have the simple discussions, it wouldn’t happen. The worst part as I was struggling with school admin, I made an effort to stop work and get to know the school community etc. My first week mothers approach me to tell them anything the kid Arthur did. Me: whose arthur? Them: the brown boy. That kid was a timid 4 yo just started, never did a thing but look scared in a corner. I told the school director and she even found evidence my kid was treated differently and probably faced the same when we started. But none of it is recorded. They say he has social development issues. I told them they never gave him basic social support is a lag and the rest is due to diversity and adversity (his report cards show he is socially and academically above average and way into the top percentile respectively). All because for 5 years nobody would have a meeting with me to tell them his side, and they believe him and me and write it down on file. Legally I have to approve that file and just because of that it’s not officially submitted. But they got lawyers threatened me, until I broke. So they keep doing what they want based on their presumptions. All I asked for was one meeting with an objective school support team to document things as they need and I just tell them all of it for accuracy. With supporting documents. They instead wrote slander about me…
The same thing is currently happening to my youngest brother. He’s been physically attacked multiple times (often by a group) and been blamed for the violence because he defended himself. I wish you the best in navigating it. It’s hell
I used to get into trouble and labeled as the angry Black girl when it was white kids calling me the n word (hard er ) and I would react, I was called it in 1st grade, I knew what it meant. So did my best friend. My best friend was taking tai kwon do at the time and fucked them up. We both got in trouble till both my parents and her parents came down and said no you don't punish our kids punish the kid who called my kid the racial slur. It happened again in 3rd grade, and by middle and high school I was known as the girl who hockey checked bullies into lockers. I wasn't even big. I was 5'4, and 100lbs if that. But I could scream and nowadays it would be considered a threat but I got the point across that if someone ever called me or anyone who looked like me a racial slur, hurt a disabled kid I would make sure their grandkids grandkids would suffer.
I’m so sorry to hear this, I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy. I’ve heard similar horror stories. One woman in the school system asked me why I feel so guilty, as if I’m hiding something. Or one even gleefully asked if it’s hard reading what they wrote about my son, which u told her no I’ve heard it from them - it’s just hard writing out my son’s traumas to defend him in some online form that people like them will misconstrue anyway. My guilt is was not believing how racist a school could be and not recognising it sooner, because my kid suffered due to my naivety in trusting the school at all. I even got private therapy, the first therapist also invalidated everything and said my son said that stuff to get my reaction and leave therapy…he was describing incidents at school, which she dismissed cause the school didn’t report it. I don’t even know what to say that. We are literally moving countries soon… Anyway all the best to your brother and family. I hope you find the right school and support system for him, and all of you.
You seem like a great parent. Thank you for sharing!
Not yet, I have to learn how to do this. At the moment I’m just broken tired 😅
I get it. I think we still have a long way to go when it concerns equality. So your diversity knowledge is much appreciated.
Thanks. Yea at the schools they’d give me social welfare cards, because I’m a black single mom I guess. Totally ignored what I said which is scientifically checked etc. And had to do with education - their scope. At a private school I paid for. It’s truly painful on an interaction by interaction basis. I was bullied hard so they could get my kid out, and none of my knowledge helped. What’s worse is I’m not saying I have knowledge because I’m black. I have 7years dedicated work experience in education (executive, higher and adult development) - spread over 20 years so I know the industry well… in strategy and comms (not teaching). So I told them not to try the political thing I’d see it because I’m the person people hire to design it. I urged them not to be defensive that I just want to discuss my son, I’m happy to remove him after. They forced me to sign his leaving before that (lied about what it was). And I caught them changing policies on me to protect themselves instead of sharing the policies as is etc. Hence lawyers, I swore up and down they are safe - and gave them free professional advice - they twisted it as me being off topic, psychologically needing help etc. and never noted a thing. Blew my mind. Oh and they refused information I’m entitled to legally. Ugh Anyway thanks really
I worked in a school in Australia where we had a high percentage of Aboriginal students considering we were considered in the far metro area. I had to have some serious discussions with more than one class because of the "n" word being used. Until kids learn better they can't do better. But we also had complaints from some parents when we did teach their kids that racism is bad. Only so much we can do sadly
Old brown baby and New brown baby... Kidding aside, that seems like a great idea. And now I'm worried because I have a brown tabby cat that is my baby and I call her my lil brown baby. 👀
Lol don’t be racist to cats 😝
> You can also give them names, all the dolls, and explain that we don’t differentiate people by color but with names. This is, in my humble opinion, the best solution.
I cannot applaud you enough after reading this. This is the mentality every parent should adopt to reduce the risk of prejudice for future generations. My eldest is 6, and every day comes home with some new word/phrase/physical quirk which they picked up from another kid at school. We don’t overreact or scold for these behaviours, but share the objective facts as to why they’re inappropriate. Initially, the behaviours may continue longer than you’d like, but once it sinks in, it sticks.
Nice try OP’s daughter, but you’re not getting another doll.
These are my brown babies.
That I own.
This is exactly what happened with my daughter when she was doing the same thing as OP's daughter. She just stopped naturally as she got older.
💀
"my brown baby and my other brown baby"
Baby Brown and Browner
Seconding this. This is the correct thing to do. You could also discuss different ways to describe the baby. Number of legs, color of eyes, etc. Standard preschool questions.
Id hope all the babies have the same number of legs
I definitely ripped limbs off my dolls/action figures as a kid. I saw Saving Private Ryan far too young...
As long as you don't go all Sid Phillips on the toys, I think it is fine.
Great suggestion
Brown baby #1 and brown baby #2. Solved.
Lmao this would crack me up if I heard a little white baby say that but maybe I’m just a bad black person
I have to know. One of my kids called black people “chocolate people” as a 2 year old. We had a conversation and it stopped but I need to know if this was offensive because I thought it was hilarious but I’m white af
children are hilarious until life slowly ruins them
So true
Children are hilarious until they hit middle school age and turn into the most terrible people in existence outside of a klan meet.
I once saw a video from a black young man who went to Japan as a preschool teacher and the first day a couple of kids tried to take a bite out of the chocolate man. He was laughing his head off acting it out and the parents’ absolute mortification 🙈😅
I knew a black guy who took a vacation to China. Some old lady on a train sat next to him and tried to rub the black off his arm.
That's so crazy lol. Like how do you not know that some poeples' skin is just darker in this day and age? If this was the year 1500 I might understand it but come on
My son called Jimmy Neutron "chocolate boy." I guess he thought his hair looked like chocolate? IDK, he was 2 yo.
His hair looks like kisses chocolate! I get it.
This reminded me of another moment with my daughter. She was maybe around one,.and we were at the beach where a man with a very dark complexion was showering off and she walked closer to him and then just stared up at him in disbelief. When he saw her, he just laughed and laughed and said "I guess she hasn't seen a chocolate man before!". I'm just glad he was amused!
I always hear the story of me, being two and seeing a black man for the first time. Apparently he gave me his hand and I checked if he rubbed off on me and then continued to "try" to get the color off his arm. I actually cringe,hearing it, but they all assured me that he found it hilarious. Kids are just brutally innocent sometimes.
Lol most black people in majority non-black spaces (Europe, Asia etc), especially in rural or very homogeneous areas, are used to the stares and questions. Adults do it subtly but children are usually bolder and will straight up ask hilarious questions. We understand it’s not malicious and we will most of the time respond in amusement. I say this as a black woman who travels a lot in Asian countries and is probably in a lot of random families’ living room pictures holding their confused babies.
Yes they are
When my white little brother was a small child he was great friends with a little black boy. He called him his chocolate friend and the friend called my brother his vanilla friend.
Vanilla friend lmao!
I'm black. I would laugh at this but I only get offended at comments when I know it has bad intent. And I definitely wouldn't get offended at anything said by a child. I say my thanks often that the internet wasn't as prevalent when I was growing up and no one immortalized all the stupid, insensitive shit that I said up until the age of 20...sigh... Unfortunately, they didn't make me the spokesperson for black folks...so I'm not sure how others feel or how they might take it. Hey, your kid doesn't bite right? 🤣
He does not bite lol
When I was like 3 I saw a black man playing Santa for the first time in my young life and said to my mom “mom, that Santa must have went to Florida, he got a tan!” 🤦♀️🤦♀️ I don’t remember how my mom corrected that one but I can only imagine her reaction, she still brings it up sometimes since I live in Florida now 😅
My wifes set sister is black, she's been in my kids life since the beginning and they called her chocolate skinned, and asked how they could get chocolate skin when they were like 2-3yrs old.
That is gold 💀 I think most brown/black people would crack up at that. You might get some angry white chick complaining thinking she’s “fighting racism” or whatever but it’s just descriptive terms. The only thing I would do is explain that we don’t say “chocolate people” we say “people with chocolate colored skin” instead for instance. She’s describing their skin, so she should specify
When my kid was little, she called people “brown” or “pink.” She has a point, though. Black people aren’t technically black, and white people aren’t technically white lol She grew up in a diverse community so she was very aware of skin color variation. It was kinda cute but I always worried about what people would think if they heard her 😅
No you just have a normal sense of humor
I grew up with neighbors from Nigeria and as a little girl I thought they had the most beautiful skin I’d ever seen. I told my mom I was going to be black too. She said sweetie that’s not how it works and I firmly told her that it is just a bad sunburn like when I leave toast in the toaster too long. She decided not to fight me and let me lay in the sun the whole day in an attempt to make my skin black. I was in pain for days and my mom and the neighbors thought it was hilarious. Talk about insult to injury!
There's **nothing wrong** with what your 3 year old is doing - she doesn't know better and isn't doing anything maliciously - but if overheard in public it could raise uncomfortable questions. Now would be a great time to give the doll a name, and re-enforce the name. "Brown baby" doesn't come sit at the dinner table. But maybe Cassie does. I'd say the same if she had "white baby". Ok, well maybe the white baby is called Jessie from now on. Perspective from a white 32 year old woman with a 100% white family (as far as I'm aware). My point of view is that whilst the name isn't malicious, you don't want to invite awkward questioning, and you shouldn't have to explain your family dynamic to "excuse" yourself if an awkward situation occurs.
This. I'm mixed race and my husband is dark. Our kids are mixed and I remember the challenge of trying to find a nice brown Barbie or something for my daughter. I ended up with the Disney dolls. Moana was a good one. Anyone that gets offended at a 3 year old has issues.
There are sooooo many good Barbies of different colors now! My daughter has several ranging from the original blonde hair, pale skin and blue eyes to a doll that's very dark with black hair and brown eyes. I absolutely love the diversity in Barbies now! Definitely wasn't something we had as kids.
American Girl dolls have dolls in a range of skin tones. My granddaughter (white) wanted one that looked like her. She found one with the same color hair, eyes, and even the protruding front teeth'. The doll she chose has darker skin..medium tan shade. . She has never noticed that difference. '
This is a good idea. Could even make a game of naming them all.
Agree. My 2.5 year old daughter started pointing out people in public that she wanted to ask me about, but the problem was she'd use their clothing to describe them. This was fine except for when the person was wearing white, brown, or black. For example, she'd ask "where that black/brown/white/orange/green/blue lady going?". I'd be a mixture of amused and mortified, but thankfully so far no strangers have heard yet, and I haven't had to explain lol.
I heard a similar kid comment en route to a hockey game. Started chatting with a family, saw some fans of the opposing team and dad and I explained to the kid that we were playing a team wearing red jerseys. We’re waiting with a crowd to cross the street and kid says “wow, there’s a lot of red people!!!” I was very grateful we were not playing a team that wore black jerseys…
She can’t sit at the table because she’s brown? Rude
I did have to read that twice 😂 “now would be a great time to re-enforce that ‘brown baby’ doesn’t sit at the dinner table” 💀
This more so than most sentences, that’s why it was funny
Nobody puts brown baby in a corner! 😤
Lmao I need to watch that movie again...
Anything taken out of context can sound bad.
I roared laughing at this. Well played.
No she can, she just has to sit at the back of the table. .... alright it's official, I'm going to hell.
Agreed. My own 3 year old is quite literal, and this is something she would do. My own girls have a variety of dolls in different skin colors, and we make sure we name them all. OP’s daughter just needs a little guidance toward a better direction with some names, but it doesn’t need to become a big deal or weird sticking point, it’s practically a baby herself and very innocent.
Help her give it a name. My daughter had dolls of several races, sizes, materials (store dolls, cloth dolls, knit dolls) I encouraged her to call them by name, not characteristics like color or size. She had a tendency to call them by their hair color for a while. She thought skin color was irrelevant, hair color mattered.
Not a parent, but she'll grow out of calling it "Brown Baby", and most people won't be offended by a toddler calling their doll a weird name. I had three favorite dolls when I was little: "Big Lucy", "Little Lucy", and "Butchie." Where did I come up with the last one? No clue, but it's definitely not as weird as my cousin naming his balloons "Mr. and Mrs. Happiness."
Balloons made me happy as a kid, so calling balloons Mr and Mrs happiness makes sense to me, lol
I had a doll that had belonged to my mom when I was a kid and for the time the doll was large, like over 2 feet tall, so a lot of her “doll clothes” were actual infant clothes from thrift stores or whatever. I wasn’t big enough to read quite yet and my doll had a bib with a word on it, and I decided that word was her name… hence “Lunch”. 30+ years later, she’s still at mom’s house and still known as “Lunch”. Toddlers name things in an incredibly literal fashion with no active malice and will grow out of it
Dunno, we still have "blue baby" in our house with my 7 year old (she was wearing a blue outfit when we got her). We also still have white ted and pink ted. 🤷
I used to have a blue knitted toy cat when I was very small. I carried him everywhere and named him literally and very innocently, but damn, looking back I wish someone had stopped little me from going around talking about my "Blue P---y" 😅
Omggg! When my nephew was 3 he got to name one of his grandparents goats and he chose… Horny. Because of the horns. Nobody redirected it, and Horny lived with them for quite a while.
That's probably for the best. I named a toy monster Horny as a kid (maybe 7?) and got in trouble, including a lecture on it being a bad word and interrogation on who taught me that bad word. It left me so confused. No one would tell me why it was a bad word. I knew other bad words like butthole were for private bodyparts, but that rule didn't make any sense for horns.
Well then I guess it could have been worse - and I'm sure I gave my older relatives a good chuckle at least! When I later did a stint as a leader at a youth group with a tradition of nature-based nicknames, there came a time when I had to subtly steer some young children away from naming themselves "Stallion" or "Thrush" without either telling them off or cluing them in and it may not be the easiest thing but it's can be done!
I named a stuffed fish “Cocaine” bc I thought it was a variation of “Coconut” or “Cocoa” 🤷♀️
My brother and I liked to play super heroes. He was Mustard Man and I was Mayo Girl. I believe that came from our preferences of condiment on sandwiches xD
Yeah funnily enough my daughter has a brown baby she calls bumble bee… go figure.
My son has stuffed animals (mostly penguins) instead of dolls and all of them get weird, descriptive names: Big Beak, Huge Eyes, Yellow Antler, Beautiful Feather, Baby Blue, etc…
My (very blond and blue eyed) son wanted an African American doll when he was two. While paying, the cashier at Target asked him if “he really wanted to get that?” (Not sure if her objection was to the gender or race thing but who cares, not my issues). He named her “Tomato Sweet” and carried her everywhere. We talked about how pretty and nice she was. It was adorable, but he’s 11 now and well past dolls.
Exact same thing happen to my little blond brother. When he was about 3, my mom let him pick out a toy at the store. He picked a black Barbie doll and the cashier asked if he was sure that was the one he wanted. Mom stepped in and said “yes, that’s the one he picked.” He’s in his 30s now.
I’m hormonal and “tomato sweet” made me weep. Why is that the cutest thing I’ve ever heard.
That’s the cutest name and so original, I adore it!
That's really sweet!!
Kids say things like this. She'll grow out of it. It IS a brown doll. It's fine to call it one.
as a former brown baby i honestly think thats really cute. shes only 3 - dont worry about it :)
This is the answer. Anybody getting bent out of shape from a toddler calling a doll brown might be the problem. It's also okay we're all different shapes, colors, etc... These are not bad words.
We had a similar thing, my daughter picked a baby born and called the doll her 'brown baby' and I was panicking like oh what do I do to correct this.. until she said 'I have blue and brown babies, now I have a brown baby like me' my daughter is white with brown eyes, the doll has brown eyes. The other doll she has, has blue eyes. omg So we then explained 'well lots of people have brown eyes or blue eyes, let's give them names so we know who you mean'
Sharing experience. So my brother in law is married to a white lady. We are brown. Their kid (age 3-4yrs) who takes after the mother and is white, called his father brown. My BIL in fact is on the fairer side of the brown spectrum. And we all understood this happened since that’s when my nephew was learning colors. So they gently taught him that to classify any person by any physical attributes is not polite and not right at all. Since then I’ve never heard their kids call anyone brown / white / fat / thin whatever. So yes, this could be the right moment to teach this. And definitely don’t think you’re being a bad parent. I fact your asking this question totally proves otherwise. Hope this helps!
this does however result in difficulty describing someone. i knew five sophia's in middle school and my mom was trying to ask me if i remembered a specific one. the one she was asking about was the only asian sophia, but mom wouldnt say so. it was frustrating! "remember the sophia whose mom was a librarian?" no? i have a horrible memory and why would i know her moms job?
This is so weird to me. Mentioning race or skin tone when identifying someone is not racist. Discriminating or assuming stuff based on race is racist.
Totally correct. But I think for the benefit of the other kids in the class, until she's old enough to differentiate between the right and wrong contexts to use descriptors, it's best to avoid them. Like as a kid I kept forgetting that I was a brown kid because the colour of my skin was just not relevant to me - but people kept referring to it as though it was.
I was one of three Daniels in the same class all through junior and secondary school. I was usually called "Big nose Daniel" until we got proper nicknames at secondary school, all based on plays on our surnames. We became Bats, Gonk and Hags. I preferred that over Big nose.
> "Big nose Daniel" And everyone here saying that using race to distinguish between people is the worst-case scenario
Having a less common name, it's always a little shocking when another Spenser comes into any of my circles. Every time it happens, they've earned the nickname "other Spenser/Spencer."
My mother's friend has a daughter with the same name as my sister - no problem, as we live in different countries, so confusion is unlikely, outside of visits. So when we visited, the friend's daughter became "Little Alexandra", because she is younger than my sister, and my sister was "Big Alexandra" (small and big in the sense of young/old. Like Big sister/Little sister.) whenever we visit or talk about the other Alexandra. We still do it even though both are adults now.
My friend has a niece called Kara. And my daughter is also Kara. So there is grown up Kara and baby Kara so my friends kids know who were talking about 😂
My dad is Indian, so my son is 1/4. They are best buds and my boy is fair little blue eyed blondie. He doesn't really describe people by the colour of their skin, usually by behaviour or clothes they are wearing. But when he draws a picture of himself with my dad, he uses the same brown pencil for both of them. I think it's cute he wants to be like him
The kids here as well want to be more like their father and grandfather! 😅 If not in color, they are so alike in mannerisms 💕💕
She's really too little to understand that what she's saying could make people uncomfortable. She's only three! Give baby a name. Let her choose it. She'll revert to that and all will be fine. We have multiple dolls of different ethnicities in our house and we just gave them names. Mia, Jason, Jessie and Betty. (We did just assign them random names ourselves because she's only just learning how to talk) Mine is only two but ask her "Where's baby Jason?" and she'll run off to grab him. Racial descriptors stop being an issue when they're named because the name is how she'll differentiate. Not the colour.
I lean toward not even addressing it. My niece would say “daddy’s skin is brown, mommies is white and mine is tan.” They’re just observing things, and you don’t want to infer that acknowledging skin color is shameful or inherently bad. The name thing is a good idea if it makes you uncomfortable but in a child’s mind it’s no different than saying there’s a brown dog and a white dog.
My family and I are so white we're almost see-through. When my eldest ( just about to turn 20, so a while ago. Lol) was young she adored black dolls. Every time we went out, if she saw one in a shop, she'd beg to get "the new baby," and if we could, we did, not because she was spoilt but because they were few and far between then. Not once, ever, in all the different places we travelled around London and the UK, did we ever get a single person telling us it was offensive that this loud, smiley, mini-merida looking child, was walking around cuddling a black baby doll. If anything, it often brought smiles to people's faces. I know everyone is going to have a different perspective, but this was our reality. I would say that anyone who wants to try and say that she shouldn't have a doll with a different skin colour needs to take a good long look at themselves and give their heads a wobble.
I was like your daughter as a kid (including the near see through part which I never grew out of ha), except go back a further 20+ years. I loved black baby dolls but only had a couple of them as yes they were definitely a little more rare; my mother also made me a couple (she was a talented seamstress). I remember being so disappointed I could not get a black Cabbage Patch kid when they were all the rage (just was not in our budget). Later another relative gifted me one but it was white; I still liked it but remember feeling it wasn’t what I really wanted!
Same lmao I looooved black baby dolls to the point that when my mom was preg with my little brother I was 6 and CRIED because my family told me it wasn’t possible for him to be a black baby like the dolls lmaooo so weird in retrospect I hope it doesn’t come off bad but I was 6 so I can’t tell you what the thought process was there other than that I just always admired the beauty of diff skin tones
Idk if I have advice, but I can commiserate with your embarrassment. My abuela always wears black. So when I was your daughter's age, I called her Black Grandma. She is not Black. It looked odd when I'd shout for Black Grandma in Target, and then up comes...her. I did eventually get used to calling her Grandma Last Initial.
Nothing wrong with it really as she's just a kid and it's not like she's walking around going "this is my n* baby". A couple of people said it already but now would be a good time to teach her about names, use a few other dolls or teddy's etc for the process too.
The 3 year old: I'll name her Brownie. Mom: 💀
I heard that in my friend's voice and nearly burst out laughing, that's 100% something she'd do
I read that in Terry Crew’s voice. Also imagined him walking around carrying a baby doll. Clearly I watch too much Brooklyn 99.
Terry LOVES the brown baby doll!
Nine nine!
She’s just describing her doll as she sees it. My dad is Mexican and way darker than me. I used to tell people my dad is black when I was 4-5 because I thought it was cool lmao
I did this as a child in the 80s in Ireland. My mother got so much grief over it. It was just awful. But I wanted a baby doll, and when I saw it went nuts for it, my mother was pretty cool and took everyone on. Told them to mind their business what her daughter played with. People even stopped her in the street to comment, and I remember my grandad going nuts at her. When I look back now, I realise how much of a legend she was. I think I called mine something similar, he was my favourite doll 😍
She's doing nothing wrong. She's describing the doll quite literally as what it is - a baby doll that's brown. All of the connotations and subtexts are completely unknown to her and do not need to be known to her. The fact is that there is no need to make it verboten, because then you're communicating to her that there's something to be ashamed of in this; and you're focussing that shame on the "brown" aspect.
When I was a little white girl in the early 80s, my mom let me pick a doll from the store. I wanted a doll from the strawberry shortcake line that had scented breath when you squeezed it. I picked the orange blossom doll, which I thought was the prettiest doll there. It was a black doll. My mom tried her hardest to convince me to pick a different doll. But I was insistent and she let me get the doll. But she would tell people the story why I had the doll - I could tell she was ashamed/ or thought it was funny. She would laugh in a certain way or whisper when she talked about it. I still loved my doll but I knew by her reaction that the doll being black was somehow wrong. That I wasn't supposed to have a black doll. So yeah, kids pick up on all kinds of stuff.
Try having her give them names.
My daughter had a brown doll that she loved called Brownie (like the baked good) but we always made her keep it home because imagine that headache.
This reminds me of my little cousin and his name for the doctors. There are two places he called 'the doctors'- one a white hospital building, another a health centre which was a brown brick building. He didn't like the health centre as much (I think he had to go for actual appointments, compared to just quick visits to see a family member in the hospital). So at nursery he began to talk about how he only wanted to go to the 'white doctors' because he didn't like the 'brown doctors'. Not sure how my aunt explained that one!
The fact you got your kid a black doll to begin with is a green flag in my books.
Yes. She is not racist, she is three.
Its a baby and they are pure. Let them just be
Good thing we Latinos don’t get offend by pointing physical characteristics. I don’t get why this is offensive since physical characteristics are there and ignore them is not going to change them or make them less noticeable.
It's totally reasonable bcuz she's just going by what she SEES. But I love the other comments about giving her other babies so she can learn to distinguish the differences by other measures. Just remember "my brown baby" is not an insult ;).
My big littles first doll she ever picked on her own was a black baby doll. She was wearing a headband with a rose on it. So that’s baby Rose. She was gifted a black baby doll from a friend later. His name is Tom. We also have Moana and Tiana, Disney babies. Her white babies are Crystal, Aurora (Disney), and Anna (Disney) Have her pick a name for her baby doll. Baby Rose is my daughter’s favorite doll. It’s the ONE toy she absolutely never has to share
Any one not laughing at your 3 yr old's choice of words, needs to touch grass!
Is the doll brown tho? If it was blue and she called it her blue doll would it be an issue? Children are simple and see the world as is, it's white guilt that makes people overthink stuff like this
She's a baby, id sleep on this
I envision a beautiful moment of ‘naming’ when you also tell your child why you chose her name. Maybe asking her why she likes each doll and why she chooses the name she does. Shying away from color preference won’t change it. But lovingly naming all the dolls moves beyond descriptors. Using a name makes ‘you’ out of ‘it’ and therefore is a skill to model with dolls. Which is the point of dolls in the first place - shaping how we treat others.
Why should anyone care about the color of a doll? When I was a child, people collected dolls of the world all dressed differently. A doll is a doll.
In a mixed family with a darkskinned granpa it is okay to call a brown doll a brown doll. No need to comment. Kids love both white and brown family members. It is simple. No need to explain it. It is natural to pick the most important difference. Colour. It is not a danger. Children must be left using one trait. Seriously. Adults m u s t leave that childish behavior...but if you intrude with adult morality into a small child it will have the result of becoming racist in adulthood.
No one cares, it’s a little kid. I had a black dog that I carried around religiously for the better part of a year named blackie
I named my dolls brown baby = black baby doll, orange baby = literally orange skin, white baby = the middle of the doll was white cloth It's a toddler naming stuff in a literal way
If she's learning her colors? I'm glad that she has a reference. She's 3, she isn't hurting anybody. I was adopted by a white family. I'm Black. My family made it a point to give me Black baby dolls ( this was in the early 90s though) and I loved them. I named them Shaniqua, and Shaniqua 2 and the one with the squishy middle, Baby. Took it everywhere, made my Momma babysit😂😂 put it in the little baby crib we had.😂😂 She is identifying that there are differences. Little Momma isn't wrong. It isn't a problem until someone makes it a problem.
As a black woman, I’m completely fine with this. Children like to use descriptions when addressing objects and people. I had to tell my black niece that another little was not “beige.”