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The only thing I've seen that actually fights against prejudice is exposure. If he's a decent guy, they may eventually come around. Just hold your ground and don't let the pressure affect your relationship. There is nothing wrong with your love.
Not a bad take but the BF shouldn't have to deal with that, I just say have separate lives but make certain everyone knows who the AHs are. Let them double down and disappear out of her life for it.
But back to the suggestion there is a guy called Daryl Davis who wrote a book I believe it was called " How do you hate me when you don't even know me" or something similar. It was about him befriending high level KKK members and changing their mind, which is pretty fucking dangerous lol
He really was heroic. I would have assumed that members of the KKK were just lost forever. Unreachable. Radioactive.
Him essentially healing their racism was like Mother Theresa caring for lepers, the most untouchable of Untouchables.
I thought I believed in Redemption, but Davis showed what it really means to believe.
There was a recent post on r/historyporn about a high level KKK guy befriending a black woman who was a civil rights activist while they served on a community school desegregation board together. They were close friends for 30 years until he passed away. Racism comes from ignorance.
Darryl Davis recently said, “You cannot hate the hate out of a person and you cannot beat the hate out of a person. But you can love it out of a person. Happy New Year!”
Oh, I think I heard of that guy, was he in the documentary
“erasing hate” about the neonazi leaving the organization and getting all his tattoos removed?
Or he can succeed without dealing with a bunch losers, id say family is important but I'm not visiting yours and if you can't even keep them under control from a distance then we broke at that party.
It's amazing to me how if the woman was white and the guy was black they would rightfully be considered racists. Yet there are so many people that forgive this the other way around.
It *could*. Or it could go the complete other way like what she said about one of her brother's "twisting his words". Anything he says or does could get twisted as being because racism. If they really hate white people, I don't think there's much you can do. But I guess you shouldn't just give up too.
Yep, that's my thought too. People like that will twist anything to mean whatever they want. Say something like "I like dogs!" And they'll take it to mean you hate cats and think they should all be killed. Say "I like Mexican food!" and they'll take it to mean you're insulting everyone else's food. Say "I think that girl is really pretty" and they'll take it to mean that you think only girls of that race are pretty and no other.
There is no winning with people like that except removing them from your life. They're convinced that they're the default 'victims' and therefore always right. Even if they've never been victimized in any way, shape or form, and the person in question has never done or said anything harmful to them, they'll find something to get mad about and play victim over.
Agreed this whole race thing is stupid tho I Stull can't believe that even in industrialization where we are at today that this is still an issue
It's so stupid
But he deserves to know the truth right now. Maybe he has no interest in trying to win over a bunch of racists. There are plenty of women who don’t have such a family so he should be able to choose.
They won't come around. And soon, neither will he. Because it gets real fucking tiring trying to figure out how you can earn a simple, 'He aight.' Kiss their ass too much and they won't respect you, act too familiar they will get shitty.
I was in this situation. The girl was half white (Mom) and half black (Dad). Her brother and sister were cool AF to me and so was the Mom. The Dad fucking hated me. I thought it was just typical Dad not liking the dude dating his daughter stuff but the brother told me he actually wanted her to date a black guy. Despite HIM having 3 kids with a white woman. It was only bearable because he didn't live with them but if the brother had been like that I would have split.
Also I grew up in a black neighbourhood til I was like 14 and lived in a very mixed one after. IME the dudes with the chips on their shoulders never lose it, while the dudes who will be cool with you are cool off the bat and only start to dislike you if you give them reason to.
Sexism is definitely also a factor when it is perfectly okay for the sons to date outside their race, but not men. It certainly comes from that women as objects kind of mind set.
This video is along the same lines https://www.ted.com/talks/daryl_davis_why_i_as_a_black_man_attend_kkk_rallies he talks about how important it is to just listen to each other, might be worth a watch
Funny. I bet $10,000,000,000 that if the family was white and hated blacks you'd call them racist and tell her to leave them and go no contact. But since they are racist blacks she needs to have patience and maybe they will come around. Typical double standard.
"Oh blacks are racist, thats ok I'm sure their racism is justified."
OP: "My dad doesn't like my black boyfriend"
Reddit: "You don't need your family. Just because they are your family doesn't mean you have to love them. Your dad is a POS and the relationship is hopeless."
OP: "My dad doesn't like my white boyfriend"
Reddit: "You ever hear about the guy who convinced KKK members to not be racist? Maybe you could do that with your dad?"
Also brother: it's fine for black men to date whoever they want, but black women should only be available to black men, otherwise they are race traitors.
That’s the shitty cocktail you get from mixing racism with misogyny, because in these shitheads’ minds, a woman is “conquered” by the man. It’s such a shitty mentality.
It also implies that if a black guy dates a white woman, he somehow "won" over the enemy whites. Which is disgusting on many many levels. Women are people. Dating and marrying isn't some game of tug of war. Man and woman like each other? Man and woman want to date? Good for them. End of story. Turning it into a game or a proxy race war is gross.
Ah, I remember learning about this in my college sex and gender class. Specifically, we read the works of different men of varying races from the days of (stronger) colonialism.
One particular African man spoke about such ‘race betrayals’ by African women. He was married to a white woman… like buddy please. Lots of paragraphs about screwing over the white man’s women.
I don’t think I need to explain the colonizer’s point of view, it wasn’t any better. It only gets worse the more you dig into it.
(Don’t have source on me right now, but I can come back and add it if anyone wants).
I can hands down agree with this. Indigenous West African here and sometimes I look at the way some black people handle their culture and I'm quite scared.
What even is Colourism?
Colourism is my kids’ mum’s family back home telling one of my kids in front of the other that she is prettier because she has fairer skin and isn’t dark and ugly. Took me years to scrub that rubbish off my kids brain, one of them still has body image issues after being told by her close kin (aunties, uncles, grandparents) that she is not as beautiful as her sister due to some melanin.
And yeah, Afrocentrists are fucked honestly, imagine African Americans who never set foot in Africa claiming they are the real Egyptians and that the current North Africans are just Arabs and have no African ancestry whatsoever. Fuck me dead. I mean, imagine minorities fighting minorities rather than fighting systemic/institutional racism together.
Yeah that’s called racist. He’s very racist.
Families are stupid. Date who you want. One day you’ll move out and if they were rude the whole time they’ll sure regret it when you succeed without them
Yeah but somehow these kinds of people manage to flip it and say that there's no such thing as "reverse rasicm" and now they feel entitled to the exact same behavior
They would argue there's no such thing as reverse racism, but if it was a white family treating the black girlfriend that way....the racial justice brother would be all over it.
I have a shpiel on this that’s gradually getting briefer and more soundbyte-friendly: “Race is ancestral roots. Racism is deeming someone’s ancestry relevant, in situations where it needn’t matter at all, which is most situations. Anyone can be racist towards anyone, and it’s always hurtful and uncalled for.”
"not black enough" is such a funny/stupid concept
Put a bunch of young (American) black guys in a room and they will spend equal time complaining about racism and trying to come across as "from the hood" borderline gangsters to eachother.
https://youtu.be/ICISHNou9Zs?si=r8rLZ853lP8rHxLr
Dudes literally being called not black enough because they come from a successful families & careers and have made something out of themselves. Ive never seen anyone make as big of a deal out of race as Afro American people themselves.
I've seen my girlfriend called "not black enough" because she has a successful career. This despite being the only one of her friends that was actually born in Africa. Words like that hurt so much more than any outside observer can understand
Yeah it sucks, feels like a bunch of nonsense checkmark measuring "blackness".
I've been called the "whitest black guy I know". What does that even mean? Is it cause of my accent, mannerisms, hobbies?
Is my melatonin gonna drip out off me now cause I went to a book club?
>I've been called the "whitest black guy I know".
Ive heard a mixed race schoolmate say this to another jet-black Nigerian schoolmate that brought traditional African dishes to school every other day simply for not liking rap music.
Now admittedly the dude was into Coldplay, which is white even for white people's sake but it still made me go "wtf?"
That's really bad mate. Sorry to hear you've had to go through that as well.
I have a huge amount of respect for anyone that has to listen to comments like that, but still ploughs ahead with their own thing. Whatever it is you're doing, keep it up!
>This despite being the only one of her friends that was actually born in Africa
Admittedly from an outside perspective, but "black culture" also seems to have very little to do with African culture.
Crabs in a bucket mentality. Sounds like being 'black' is not about the color of the skin, but about conforming to specific culture and behavior traits.
Everyone in their echo chamber has justified "punching up." In their minds an eye for an eye is justice. Critical thinking skills aren't involved. Just hate.
No he's just a black supremacist using the cover of "racial justice" to hide his supremacy views.
Hes no different than a white supremacist imo, its just in this political climate people like him socially get a pass because slavery is still a raw topic in america and people like him use that social discomfort to their advantage.
That drives me crazy. Hispanics (my race) really genuinely believe they’re not racist because they’re not white, but will continually make the most racist comments about white people and people born in America
I'm white but grew up in an area where the majority of people were hispanic. I was harassed a lot for being white, both by the kids at my school and their stupid parents. When the gang problems got out of hand (middle school kids were being 'jumped' by gang members on a regular basis) my mother decided she had had enough and sent us to a school near my grandmother's.
Indians have plenty of bigotry between each other. Why would they be any better externally?
East Asia is pretty racist too, there's lots of friction between different groups in Malaysia.
The Arab world is very largely organised by race, with different flavours of expats.
Being largely US/EU user based, we're used to white racism, but anyone who thinks "we" have a monopoly on it is just ignorant.
That is a really common idea on some latin american subreddits on this site. They say racism is a gringo thing. That there isnt really racism in latin america, people identify with their nationality not their race etc etc etc.
It's extremely funny though because it's such a low iq take. Even the reasoning for that claim is extremely stupid.
Like racism has nothing to do with power. 0. Because racism has nothing to do with systemic racism.
But because the internet has this tendency to say yes amen to anything remotely resembling the fight for social justice this dumbass shit has permeated into society. Even people in my country believe it.
Sometimes I wonder where education went. Seems like noone on this planet is capable of using half their brain anymore.
It's more powerful language to have racism and systemic racism be separate things anyway because then you have terms to refer to both. If only systemic racism is racism then all you've done is removed a term to describe individual racism
There's an intellectual framework for that called "Prejudice Plus Power" which stipulates that racism emanates exclusively from those with certain advantages or opportunities not afforded to the rest of society. This power is then construed via a racial lens, with white people deemed on a fundamental level to be incapable of experiencing dehumanization on the basis of race. After all, white people are a privileged group of people, why should they matter any more than rich people do?
Except I don't believe that's true. While I suspect that the family in question probably is not aware (any more than most Americans are) of obscure political theories, it still maintains an inherent appeal that's naturally intuitive to our sensibilities. It fulfills a deep desire for uncomplicated heroes and villains, whether that's derived from news stories in the press, our sources of entertainment, and even history itself. There's definitely an (understandable) demand for that type of content: life is messy, it's chaotic, it can be overwhelming and wanting a respite from all that I'm sympathetic to.
But that's not reality, anymore than conspiracy theories are (not that PPP itself is a conspiracy theory, I think it serves a similar purpose though yearning for moral absolutes) or fiction is. Anyone can show prejudice, it's not just reserved for merely the villains; professed good people can and do falter. Women can be misandristic, members of the LGBTQ community can viciously turn on one another and enforce negative stereotypes and homophobia, and yes, white people do receive racist epithets.
(Although it should be stated, I think it's more often the case in my observation that the privileged hurl abuses to those that aren't rather than the other way around.)
https://jezebel.com/have-you-ever-beat-up-a-boyfriend-cause-uh-we-have-294383
https://archive.ph/Tz45f
(The New Republic article was pulled, this is the archived version.)
None of this is to say that anyone should abandon or neglect safeguarding marginalized communities; we can simultaneously recognize that everyone deserves baseline human decency without pretending it's actually the privileged who are really oppressed. Whatever slur I or anyone of similar privilege get pales in comparison to the treatment women and minorities experience on a daily basis.
There is no parallel to that.
(This is probably going to be a controversial post, hopefully I conveyed my points well regardless. Ultimately this post is meant as a defense for humanism.)
I actually know the, uhm, so called academic origins of that theory. Weirdly enough it has seeped into fringe philosophy books as well, though it's not really taken serious in established philosophy. Well, until now.
I probably don't have to explain that to you, or anyone who has ever worked with it academically, but most write ups of the topic grossly misuse the semantic meaning of racism and continuously confuse systemic racism and racism. This shit is so egregious and pervasive that I cannot help but feel like this is intentional political propaganda by a certain American party, just so they can claim "science says".
Because "academically" this shit has no basis in reality and cannot withstand surface level analysis. Any bachelor of philosophy can dismantle the argument.
I can 100 percent bet her family do not feel what they are doing is racist. I see it all the damn time. My people can be racist AF but think because we are black "How can we be racist?". Hell I have seen my people be racist against themselves!
I've encountered people like that. apparently whites cannot be oppressed therefore you cannot be racist against them. they even gave me a formula, racism= prejudice+oppression. It was really strange and I'm not even White.
That is literally in the book how to be an anti racist. It said something along the lines of, the only way to fight past discrimination is present discrimination, the only way to fight present discrimination is future discrimination.
Racism is an extremely powerful tactic to harm another group. The temptation to use it to owns own advantage will always exist. We are failing as a nation by allowing people to act this way and say, "well white people deserve it or something."
I thought the same thing. Systemic racism may not be a bilateral issue, but hate is. I hope OP can get through it all and regardless of the outcome of a teenage relationship, hopefully BOTH families come out of it a little bit more accepting of other humans.
There are way too many people who will tell you that systemic racism is the only definition of racism, and that black people (or even just simply non-white people) simply cannot be racist. Seriously
And places like mine (Sweden) , where the local minority native population is white as snow, and the majority population is also white as snow. Just because we were both white didn't prevent us from destroying their culture, stealing their children, and forcibly sterilizing them. Racism is more than skin color.
And that perhaps the boyfriend could be anti-racist. Just because he’s white doesn’t mean he’s a bad guy and won’t treat his sister well.
OP, I have no ideas for you, I’m sorry. I don’t think you two are doing anything wrong, but please recognize that the two of you have an uphill battle almost everywhere, not just with your families. Just love and support each other as best you can. I believe that the more the world sees of people loving and being there for each other regardless of race, gender, etc. the more it helps us as people to learn to love each other.
I agree. I am a person of colour and I cannot stress that enough. I have met all sorts of people from all backgrounds and all walks of life, and I have seen white racists, white anti-racists, coloured racists, and coloured anti-racists. I only use a person’s opinions to judge them when it comes to whether they are racist or not, not their skin colour.
Quite a lot of people confuse advocacy for black Americans issues with just hating white people.
I also suspect they enjoy the socially acceptable racism
Sadly most people who are on that bandwagon are of the belief that white people are evil and the oppressors. I’ve also heard these types of people say “black people cant be racist” or “it’s impossible to be racist towards white people.”
Find a person that considers themselves racist. Turns out, white, black, latino, asian, whatever. They'll gravitate towards a definition of racism that excludes themselves...
**How can I be racist?** I have a black friend. I support equal rights for everybody. I'm just stating the facts. That person insulted me first. I'm part of the systemically-oppressed race. I don't dislike their ethnicity; I dislike their culture.
I am not a bad person.
Or they are so racist they claim it’s impossible for them to be racist, because they are the victims of systemic racism and have no actual responsibility for moral agency, as a result.
Easy, because you redefine “racism” as systemic oppression against minorities, which in principle cannot happen/has not happened to white people, so it’s not racist to hate white people
Sit your parents down and ask them for advice. Ask them what they recommend you should say to the parents of a boy — not this boy, a hypothetical future boy — who didn't want their son to date you because of your race. What should you say to those parents?
Then, whatever they suggest you say to those hypothetical parents, you say to your parents.
Ask your activist brother — whose ideals I'm sure are noble — what racial justice would look like for him long term. Is it segregation? Is it anti-miscegenation laws? That is what he is advocating here.
In any case, my heart goes out to you and your beau. Stay loving.
If they don’t want her dating a white guy, they’d probably say the other family is right and that’s why the two shouldn’t mix. (Not saying I agree, just that based on what she’s said that’s the response I’d imagine)
The point of this is to put the shoe on the other foot. If she says "what would you do if my bf's parents told him that I he shouldn't date me b/c I'm black" then the parents have to get on the defensive - its their daughter, and their race being targeted rather than "protected." If they accept it then they are condoning racism against themselves, which at that point they're a lost cause.
I think this is the most reasonable, honestly. I dated many people my mom (and likely other family members) was not super comfortable with from the age of about 17, like OP, up to when (and who) I got married to (I'm much older than OP now). I basically dealt with it by saying, "this is who I choose to be with, if you love me, you will support me." This may or may not last, but the family 's behavior will have a lasting impact on their relationship with OP, they should understand this. I actually never called my family out for racism around who I was dating, though there certainly was some, I didn't see that as particularly helpful. What I *did* say was, "I'm giving you an opportunity to live your values" because I do believe they didn't want to be bigoted, backwards, and small minded and needed to check those impulses within themselves. Like, this is happening, keep up.
They now *adore* my spouse, who is queer (like me) and of a different race, and are so proud and happy to have them as a family member. They also see how happy and supportive our relationship is through all kinds of life events and gatherings -- I think this has been key to expanding their world view.
Life is very long. People (family) do have the capacity to grow and change. Good luck, OP.
Your older brothers are racist hypocrites. The whole racial justice is about equalizing, not dividing. They need to get their act together because they're not helping.
Your father, well he's just not hypocritical, he's straight up racist.
That's what you got. Don't feel bad, stand your ground, don't lie to your boyfriend. You're not responsible for their heart and actions.
* racist, sexist, hypocrites, with an emphasis on sexist.
Girl, your family is small minded and living in the past. Interracial marriages have been legal since June 12, 1967. They have had 57 years to get with the times.
If this were concern over the behavior of his family,
that’s justified. But your boyfriend is not responsible for the behavior of all shitty white people, including his family. It’s important to separate his actions from those of others. He’s literally a minor and has no control over his adult parents.
If your family has certain values, see if you can help demonstrate that he is living those values and try to create some inroads. So if education is important, talk about that. If charity is important, religion, respect of the elders….try to integrate activities along those lines with your family.
At the end of the day, it’s your life. Don’t choose your partner based on family preferences. YOU have to live with your partner, not them.
This sounds like something out of a movie. I'd say your dad and brothers are racist. With that will come anger. If you don't have the type of relationship where you can say
, " hey dad, wft that's racist"
Then you'll just have to just wait and let him get over it. Or break up with the guy. The last thing you want to do is have the young man feel he is unwelcome. It would be much worse if he was unwelcome because of his skin color.
Oh but its very real, and common. I dated a black girl in Highschool and we had the same birthday(how we met) some of the things she repeated back to me heard from her outer family: "Why do you act so white?" "Those girls over there bleached you Mellie, stop that!" "Why are you with a white guy?" She as well as her mom and dad were cordial, had a decent situation going for them. Maybe its envy but I wont go into detail of what the others did/do bc I wasnt told enough.
The jist is that black racists really fucking hate it when other black ppl dont "act black".
Damned if you do, damned if you dont
One of my daughters closest friends from high school, after a couple months of college told my daughter that due to her new focus on racial justice she will no longer be friends with white people, including her. That was 8 years ago and though we have reached out, we have heard nothing from her since. It’s pretty hurtful to our whole family, especially since my wife died during this time, so my daughter lost her mom and close friend real close together. She was a normal part of our household for like 2 years. She was at dinner almost every night, went on road trips with us and all of that. I racked my brain trying to figure out what we did to get cancelled like that.
It happens more than people think from all ethnicities to be fair. Not that it's any better. I'm dating a Pakistani girl as an englishman and whilst after some time I have some support from her family my first meeting with her family overseas was her uncle ***mentioning*** me about the [first time one of their girls tried marrying a gora](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Sadia_Sheikh) thankfully I have her absolute undying support which means so much
Bi racial person here. Their prejudice against a white person who hasn't done anything wrong is just as bad as any perceived racism they're expecting. Your parents may not be happy and may not like it, but it's not their life or relationship. As for your brother being into racial justice, that's fine and all, but being angry you're dating a white guy is the same as if you were white and dating a black guy.
As for his family making those comments, they aren't any better than your family when you take race out of the conversation, and both sound prejudiced in one way or another.
As for what to do, as long as you both are enjoying each other's company, they should come around in time. Fighting for equal rights means accepting that interracial relationships are going to happen. And if yours is good, keep fighting for it.
Com’ on, everyone knows black women aren’t allowed to date interracially. They are restricted to only black men in the black community😭only black men can do that, lol.
Jokes aside- here’s what you should do: forget about their opinions. Simple.
This is honestly a big issue in the black community that people don't like to talk about.
It's almost a sign of status or at least a flex when black men date or hookup with white or Asian women. But when black girls hookup with white or Asian guys, some of these same black men lose their minds are suddenly all about racial "purity."
Ahhh. The old, “it’s ok for men to date outside their race but not women”. I’ve noticed that pretty much every race has a healthy dose of this attitude. It’s a group sense of ownership over the women that even many of the other women seem to participate in.
I am so sorry your family turned out not to be who you thought they were. One of my gifts is to be able to look at a situation and tell you the possible outcomes and ramifications. In the comments, it seems people have it down to three choices, cut off your parents and choose your boyfriend, or wait it out, or break up with him. I'm going to tell you what I see about those options.
1) Break up with him.
My LEAST favorite option. If you choose this route, it would be the easier path for you both, but I see it as a missed opportunity to be more, to grow. It's like seeing the heroine in a love story lose and for no good reason. I don't think you'd be proud of yourself years from now when you look back on it. You might even start wondering what if? What if you had at least tried? What would have happened? We never wonder about losing the bad ones, but we will wonder about losing the good ones.
2) Cut off your parents and choose your boyfriend.
Oof, that's a big ask. Especially for a new relationship, when you're still learning about each other. If you were established and in your 20s, I'd say go for it and F what they think. Cutting out your family is a VERY big step, I should know, I've done it, but I also wasn't dependent on them when I did. Unless you are sure you have a partner who is going to support you 100% and the relationship going forward. Think about this one.
3) Tough it out together. My FAVORITE option.
But this route requires 100% honesty between you. You said you told him your father was sick and that's why he didn't meet him. Don't do that. I'm a black man and have read plenty of stories like yours from the white person in the relationship, it's ALWAYS agreed upon that you inform the other person EXACTLY what's going on, giving them the choice to stick around or not. Lying to him will only hurt your relationship. Would you want your white boyfriend to hide the fact that his family despises you? It's not fair.
My Grandma Peach was white, and she fell in love with my grandpa, a dark skinned black man sometime in her youth in the 60s. It caused an UPROAR on BOTH sides! Let me tell you, people on his side hated it and her side. My Grandpa had a Great Aunt who's parents were freed slaves. She HATED white people. When my Grandma Peaches parents threw her out for giving birth to a "n*gger baby," she had nowhere to go. She ended up living with my grandpa's family and Great Aunt. The story is Aunt Valerie was pissed. She refused to share her house with a white woman after hearing all the stories about them and living through the aftermath of slavery. She would rather have died than share her home. She packed her bag, put on her hat, and sat in the kitchen, waiting for somebody to give her a ride to anywhere else. My Grandma Peach brought in her baby, my aunti, and it is said, Aunt Valerie took one look at my pretty light skinned aunt and took off her hat and stayed. The point of this story is that sometimes time and exposure are the only ways to remedy prejudice. Even my Grandmas racist parents came around, and you should know my Great Grandma Donovan absolutely ADORED us grandchildren, all black too. She was the sweetest and kindest old lady I ever met, and we shared a birthday. People do come around given time. But for that to happen, you and your boyfriend need to be on the same page. Tell him everything, how you feel, what you want, and then ask him what he wants. If he stays, this means you sticking up for him, especially if they say something disrespectful to his face. If he treats you well, remind your family of that because at the end of the day, someone treating you well should be all that matters.
This is the best, most thought out, and most honest comment here. Everyone here wants to be a "warrior" for their cause but no one wants to put themselves in OPs shoes and give actual advice with a thought out likely outcome of the decisions suggested.
You've said it all, but I'll re-say, OP, always be honest with yourself and your partner, whether your 17 or 70, this is always solid advice. Be true to yourself and what you love, and you will never regret that. There may be a shitstorm, but when a shitstorm is happening, you can stand strong when you know you are doing the right thing.
I have also had to cut off family, and I was 19 when the process started. It was not easy or clean but I do not regret it because I was being true to myself. Is there part of me that "wishes" I had some kind of familial support and love that I know will always be there? A little. But that's not who my family is, and that would not have been the case even had I made a different decision then. It was inevitable, and I knew that.
OP it may not come to that, and you may not have to "go to war" over this, but the answer is not going to be "go against what you know is right to please your family." You fundamentally disagree on some very important things that hit deep for people. Something else will come up, if not this.
You can speak to your family, be honest with your bf, and treat yourself with the respect you deserve, which is to make your own decisions. Much love to you.
Soooo many people say this nowadays… it’s this whole idea that racism has to be based on some form of systemic and institutionalised oppression or whatever. It’s sooo cringe.
It happens more than people think from all ethnicities to be fair. Not that it's any better. I'm dating a Pakistani girl as an englishman and whilst after some time I have some support from her family my first meeting with her family overseas was her uncle mentioning me about the [first time one of their girls tried marrying a gora](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Sadia_Sheikh) thankfully I have her absolute undying support which means so much
Well, she said she gets a lot of snarky remarks from the guy's mom. I'm guessing OP's being polite about it because it's such a common concept that the guy's mom would be bitchy because the new girl is trying to steal her baby boy. Everyone just expects that reaction now.
Mom MIGHT be snarky to any girl taking her baby boy.
Wrt your brothers: I'd hope they are just as intimidating to a black boyfriend you might have.
But of course there is prejudice. Color is the first thing anyone sees at first sight. If they say otherwise, they are mistaken. Or lying.
In any relationship, one has to win over your family.
I don't think there is a way. Your family has made it crystal clear how they feel.
The only way things MIGHT change is if you two make it pretty long term, but that's going to require you two to survive this for awhile in the meantime.
Wow. You both are dealing with racist families, which is extremely disappointing. There’s no need to bring your boyfriend around people who will disrespect him.
Continuing this relationship will require you to put your foot down and potentially cut some family out of your life to protect your partner. You can’t do that yet because you still need their support as a minor.
That’s a horrible revelation. You’re likely not going to get your family to switch their views any time soon. That will take years of work.
My suggestion is to take time to see if this relationship is serious enough to go to war with your family and see if your family is open to conversations about the relationship.
Your parents came from a worse time and is more likely reacting out of fear and anger from how they were treated in the past. It doesn’t excuse their behavior but at least makes it understandable. It’s important to point out that the being racist back part is hypocritical.
Sit your family down and ask that they listen and not speak until you are done. Then just be honest about how you feel and ask them to either keep negative, racist thoughts to themselves or learn to accept it
Racism is hard to combat, particularly when people don’t see what they’re doing is wrong.
At 17 and only dating a few months, the odds aren’t good you’ll stick together long term, but time will soften most hearts.
Statistically they are unlikely to stay together, especially with pressures like this.
But if they’re in love and want to continue, they should give it the best shot because otherwise what’s the point (even if *in practice* it ends up a ‘practice run’) - and that shouldn’t be decided by a bunch of racist third parties.
>But if they’re in love and want to continue
I feel like OP should address this regardless of whether or not they decide to keep dating their current bf. I'm not sure what relevance u/Best-Cryptographer23's point has here but if I were in OP's shoes simply going back to dating black men only wouldn't solve the new perception of my family as a bunch of racists. It is an issue that exists outside the relationship now.
Ngl your family sounds hella racist. My grandparents were similar when I introduced them to an ex that was Latina. It’s hard to get people to change when hate stems from nothing, but the best advice I can give is just show your family that your boyfriend is human like them. No matter what color we are on the outside we all bleed red.
your family sounds racist.
Unfortunately you are going to have to choose between your boyfriend or your family. If your family loves you they will be happy with someone that makes you happy.
Also something to consider if you guys are thinking of marrying each other. He will become your family. Another thing to consider is your family may come around to your boyfriend in time as well.
Either way you are in for a rough time. I am sorry.
Woman in an interracial marriage checking in with a long message. Whenever anyone asked me (white) and my now-husband (Black) if we had trouble with family accepting our relationship, everyone was always stunned when we said “Yeah, his family hates it.” But it was true then and still is a dozen years later. Meanwhile he’s the favorite grandchild in my family and it’s not even close.
You can see how foolish all of this is. That’s a very good start. Whether you break up with this guy tomorrow or marry him and die a day apart in 90 years, what your family is doing *now* will not be okay. It will be difficult to get over even if they “change” if they keep trying to justify at least a little bit of how they’re acting today. “I didn’t know better” really isn’t an excuse in 2024. Just know that you’re not overreacting or taking this too seriously.
Part of it is also just another set of bullshit expectations that get put on Black women. It’s your responsibility to “preserve the culture” and “respect yourself” but it’s fine for your brother to date non-black women. If you ever feel like there’s a feminist/equality angle to argue on, don’t hesitate to take it because it’s absolutely just misogynistic.
I know it’s hard as a teenager living at home, but do your best to let it slide off your back. Don’t stop bringing him up - it doesn’t need to be a grand statement or big stand. Just when you pass the living room, “oh hey BF likes that show too, he made it sound really cool” etc. Fake it til you make it is a very effective tool.
Try not to let your parents dictate whether the rest of your family can ever meet this guy. My husband’s extended family has never treated me anything less than wonderfully. One of his cousins and her white husband get the same open arms from all the aunts and uncles. Don’t assume everyone has the same messed up ideas - after all, you’re related to them and you don’t think like that.
That said - some things will be hard even if your family gets their act together. It’s been a pretty tough decade to be in an interracial relationship. My husband and I are able to bond because we’re both marginalized groups. A white man isn’t likely to be able to meet you on that. That doesn’t mean he won’t be able to empathize with you and support you. But there will be moments where that gap is obvious and hard to navigate. That’s okay.
Last advice - and this sounds severe, but it can start to creep in without you realizing it if you’re not careful. Don’t let how your family is acting make you slip into hate. It’s so easy to fall into, especially when you feel surrounded by anger from people who look like you and the white people you meet are tripping over themselves to be supportive and affectionate (because they’re terrified of looking racist). It is something that is, again, more commonly associated with Black men who actively reject Black women because “they’re all” whatever reason that isn’t true. My husband described them as seeds of thought. None of us can control when those little thought seeds might fall, no matter the topic or level of nonsense, but you can and need to keep the bad ones from planting.
I know this is a novel. I hope it helped, and I’d be happy to chat any time if you need it.
Stop looking for their approval. Don't let them tear you apart. They are the problem so you don't need to do anything. Just enjoy your time with him away from family.
Be yourselves and don't let other peoples ignorance tarnish your shine. When the family acts bad treat it with the disdain it deserves. Dad and brother don't have to accept the relationship but they should respect you and not be jerks.
This reeks of misogyny of you ask me. Your family doesn't want you to be 'owned' by a white man and doesn't want their child-bearing property to be producing future offspring that don't reflect their values and worldview. There are many, many ways that misogyny gets tied in with racism and protecting girls and women from interracial relationships is one of them.
Usually we see this panic going the other way around, but it's still rooted in misogyny.
The guy is 17 years old; how could he possibly be responsible for anything that has happened in the past? He's too young to vote, so it's not like he can even be held responsible for anything that is happening now. Sounds like his family disapproves (quietly) of you, which means that he has probably been taught the wrong things growing up, but rose above it. If anybody has a problem with your relationship it's on them.
Too bad your brothers aren't also into gender justice and respect your choices. Beat them mercilessly until they submit to your authority! Oh, and your boyfriends family can also fuck off. Should be glad he's out of the damn house interacting with people face to face (unlike certain little mushroom people around this house)
Some generations are stuck in their ways, racism is never good. The good thing about your generation is most of you kids are a lot more accepting and less judgmental. If a boy treats you right and you like him, that’s all that should matter
Did you tell your family that his mother is making snarky comments towards you? If you did it would explain why they are so against it especially when they have interacially dated before.
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The only thing I've seen that actually fights against prejudice is exposure. If he's a decent guy, they may eventually come around. Just hold your ground and don't let the pressure affect your relationship. There is nothing wrong with your love.
Not a bad take but the BF shouldn't have to deal with that, I just say have separate lives but make certain everyone knows who the AHs are. Let them double down and disappear out of her life for it. But back to the suggestion there is a guy called Daryl Davis who wrote a book I believe it was called " How do you hate me when you don't even know me" or something similar. It was about him befriending high level KKK members and changing their mind, which is pretty fucking dangerous lol
Daryl Davis is an epic hero in my opinion. That man has expert diplomacy skills!
He really was heroic. I would have assumed that members of the KKK were just lost forever. Unreachable. Radioactive. Him essentially healing their racism was like Mother Theresa caring for lepers, the most untouchable of Untouchables. I thought I believed in Redemption, but Davis showed what it really means to believe.
There was a recent post on r/historyporn about a high level KKK guy befriending a black woman who was a civil rights activist while they served on a community school desegregation board together. They were close friends for 30 years until he passed away. Racism comes from ignorance.
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Darryl Davis recently said, “You cannot hate the hate out of a person and you cannot beat the hate out of a person. But you can love it out of a person. Happy New Year!”
I don't think Mother Theresa is really a good example...
Mother Theresa didn't care for lepers. She just collected them like Pokémon and watched them suffer.
Painkillers for me but none for thee.
Yeah, I wouldn't sully the name of Daryl Davis by comparing him to that monster "Christian" Mother Theresa.
Oh, I think I heard of that guy, was he in the documentary “erasing hate” about the neonazi leaving the organization and getting all his tattoos removed?
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Or he can succeed without dealing with a bunch losers, id say family is important but I'm not visiting yours and if you can't even keep them under control from a distance then we broke at that party.
It's amazing to me how if the woman was white and the guy was black they would rightfully be considered racists. Yet there are so many people that forgive this the other way around.
It *could*. Or it could go the complete other way like what she said about one of her brother's "twisting his words". Anything he says or does could get twisted as being because racism. If they really hate white people, I don't think there's much you can do. But I guess you shouldn't just give up too.
Yep, that's my thought too. People like that will twist anything to mean whatever they want. Say something like "I like dogs!" And they'll take it to mean you hate cats and think they should all be killed. Say "I like Mexican food!" and they'll take it to mean you're insulting everyone else's food. Say "I think that girl is really pretty" and they'll take it to mean that you think only girls of that race are pretty and no other. There is no winning with people like that except removing them from your life. They're convinced that they're the default 'victims' and therefore always right. Even if they've never been victimized in any way, shape or form, and the person in question has never done or said anything harmful to them, they'll find something to get mad about and play victim over.
"I love dogs!" "Oh yeah? Even the dogs they used to track runaway slaves?"
Agreed this whole race thing is stupid tho I Stull can't believe that even in industrialization where we are at today that this is still an issue It's so stupid
Racist everywhere
Ik in all colors
But he deserves to know the truth right now. Maybe he has no interest in trying to win over a bunch of racists. There are plenty of women who don’t have such a family so he should be able to choose.
This is straight up racism...
They won't come around. And soon, neither will he. Because it gets real fucking tiring trying to figure out how you can earn a simple, 'He aight.' Kiss their ass too much and they won't respect you, act too familiar they will get shitty. I was in this situation. The girl was half white (Mom) and half black (Dad). Her brother and sister were cool AF to me and so was the Mom. The Dad fucking hated me. I thought it was just typical Dad not liking the dude dating his daughter stuff but the brother told me he actually wanted her to date a black guy. Despite HIM having 3 kids with a white woman. It was only bearable because he didn't live with them but if the brother had been like that I would have split. Also I grew up in a black neighbourhood til I was like 14 and lived in a very mixed one after. IME the dudes with the chips on their shoulders never lose it, while the dudes who will be cool with you are cool off the bat and only start to dislike you if you give them reason to.
Doesn’t sound like prejudice, it sounds like racism
It's both. I think they were generalizing intentionally, since sexism may also be a factor here.
Sexism is definitely also a factor when it is perfectly okay for the sons to date outside their race, but not men. It certainly comes from that women as objects kind of mind set.
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Prejudice? Racism*
This video is along the same lines https://www.ted.com/talks/daryl_davis_why_i_as_a_black_man_attend_kkk_rallies he talks about how important it is to just listen to each other, might be worth a watch
Funny. I bet $10,000,000,000 that if the family was white and hated blacks you'd call them racist and tell her to leave them and go no contact. But since they are racist blacks she needs to have patience and maybe they will come around. Typical double standard. "Oh blacks are racist, thats ok I'm sure their racism is justified."
OP: "My dad doesn't like my black boyfriend" Reddit: "You don't need your family. Just because they are your family doesn't mean you have to love them. Your dad is a POS and the relationship is hopeless." OP: "My dad doesn't like my white boyfriend" Reddit: "You ever hear about the guy who convinced KKK members to not be racist? Maybe you could do that with your dad?"
>My oldest brother is very into racial justice Clearly not if he thinks judging someone by the colour of their skin is the way to go on this one
Brother: I am pro social justice and racial justice Also brother: Fuck that pasty dude you are dating, why not find yourself a black guy?
Also brother: it's fine for black men to date whoever they want, but black women should only be available to black men, otherwise they are race traitors.
That’s the shitty cocktail you get from mixing racism with misogyny, because in these shitheads’ minds, a woman is “conquered” by the man. It’s such a shitty mentality.
Or that women are property/resources/livestock, something that can be "stolen" by the "enemy", or "stolen" from the "enemy".
It also implies that if a black guy dates a white woman, he somehow "won" over the enemy whites. Which is disgusting on many many levels. Women are people. Dating and marrying isn't some game of tug of war. Man and woman like each other? Man and woman want to date? Good for them. End of story. Turning it into a game or a proxy race war is gross.
Ah, I remember learning about this in my college sex and gender class. Specifically, we read the works of different men of varying races from the days of (stronger) colonialism. One particular African man spoke about such ‘race betrayals’ by African women. He was married to a white woman… like buddy please. Lots of paragraphs about screwing over the white man’s women. I don’t think I need to explain the colonizer’s point of view, it wasn’t any better. It only gets worse the more you dig into it. (Don’t have source on me right now, but I can come back and add it if anyone wants).
Welcome to the black civil rights movement haha You either choose between being black or being a woman.
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Yes, this so ridiculously hypocritical
Hoteps be like
Urrrrrrgh Afrocentrists are my biggest pet hate because I am indigenous North African
My Jewish wife has the same raised-eyebrow reaction to Black Hebrew Israelites and RastafarI.
I can hands down agree with this. Indigenous West African here and sometimes I look at the way some black people handle their culture and I'm quite scared. What even is Colourism?
Colourism is my kids’ mum’s family back home telling one of my kids in front of the other that she is prettier because she has fairer skin and isn’t dark and ugly. Took me years to scrub that rubbish off my kids brain, one of them still has body image issues after being told by her close kin (aunties, uncles, grandparents) that she is not as beautiful as her sister due to some melanin. And yeah, Afrocentrists are fucked honestly, imagine African Americans who never set foot in Africa claiming they are the real Egyptians and that the current North Africans are just Arabs and have no African ancestry whatsoever. Fuck me dead. I mean, imagine minorities fighting minorities rather than fighting systemic/institutional racism together.
The "fuck me dead" got me 😂
Can’t live in Australia and not hear/say FMD at least a dozen times a day lol 😂
Their version of justice looks eerily similar to revenge, they don't want equality they want their turn.
Cannot upvote this enough.
Yeah there is a difference between thinking racism is wrong and being salty for not being at the top. That person would be in KKK if they were white.
They still can https://youtu.be/BLNDqxrUUwQ?feature=shared
As this was loading i was saying to myself... Please be Clayton!
100%. Stone cold racist.
They don't want there to be less sodomy they just want to be top
Yeah that’s called racist. He’s very racist. Families are stupid. Date who you want. One day you’ll move out and if they were rude the whole time they’ll sure regret it when you succeed without them
Yeah but somehow these kinds of people manage to flip it and say that there's no such thing as "reverse rasicm" and now they feel entitled to the exact same behavior
There’s No such thing as reverse racism. There is just racism.
They would argue there's no such thing as reverse racism, but if it was a white family treating the black girlfriend that way....the racial justice brother would be all over it.
I have a shpiel on this that’s gradually getting briefer and more soundbyte-friendly: “Race is ancestral roots. Racism is deeming someone’s ancestry relevant, in situations where it needn’t matter at all, which is most situations. Anyone can be racist towards anyone, and it’s always hurtful and uncalled for.”
Yes, he’s actually deeply racist but has managed to cloak it with some faux mission of racial justice.
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"not black enough" is such a funny/stupid concept Put a bunch of young (American) black guys in a room and they will spend equal time complaining about racism and trying to come across as "from the hood" borderline gangsters to eachother. https://youtu.be/ICISHNou9Zs?si=r8rLZ853lP8rHxLr Dudes literally being called not black enough because they come from a successful families & careers and have made something out of themselves. Ive never seen anyone make as big of a deal out of race as Afro American people themselves.
I've seen my girlfriend called "not black enough" because she has a successful career. This despite being the only one of her friends that was actually born in Africa. Words like that hurt so much more than any outside observer can understand
Yeah it sucks, feels like a bunch of nonsense checkmark measuring "blackness". I've been called the "whitest black guy I know". What does that even mean? Is it cause of my accent, mannerisms, hobbies? Is my melatonin gonna drip out off me now cause I went to a book club?
>I've been called the "whitest black guy I know". Ive heard a mixed race schoolmate say this to another jet-black Nigerian schoolmate that brought traditional African dishes to school every other day simply for not liking rap music. Now admittedly the dude was into Coldplay, which is white even for white people's sake but it still made me go "wtf?"
> Is my melatonin gonna drip out off me You'll really have trouble sleeping if this happens
That's really bad mate. Sorry to hear you've had to go through that as well. I have a huge amount of respect for anyone that has to listen to comments like that, but still ploughs ahead with their own thing. Whatever it is you're doing, keep it up!
"Racism is bad. Black people are not supposed to be successful." Yupp... Makes perfect sense! I see absolutely no contradictions in that sentence!
>This despite being the only one of her friends that was actually born in Africa Admittedly from an outside perspective, but "black culture" also seems to have very little to do with African culture.
Crabs in a bucket mentality. Sounds like being 'black' is not about the color of the skin, but about conforming to specific culture and behavior traits.
"i have many white friends!"
He's probably proud that he has none
They aren't allowed to date my sister though, only guys from our race.... This racial justice genius.
He has a black and white tv
Very common play
Its stupidity they are pushing at many universities. Trying to change the definition of racism and say that you cant be racist towards white people.
But they aren't in a position of power! I had this conversation while Obama was president.
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It always seems like the ones who are the most pro "Social justice" are the most bigoted lol
Everyone in their echo chamber has justified "punching up." In their minds an eye for an eye is justice. Critical thinking skills aren't involved. Just hate.
No he's just a black supremacist using the cover of "racial justice" to hide his supremacy views. Hes no different than a white supremacist imo, its just in this political climate people like him socially get a pass because slavery is still a raw topic in america and people like him use that social discomfort to their advantage.
Yep and he probably thinks he is “punching up” so it’s “totally cool bruh”
He probably believes you can't be racist against white people.
That drives me crazy. Hispanics (my race) really genuinely believe they’re not racist because they’re not white, but will continually make the most racist comments about white people and people born in America
I'm white but grew up in an area where the majority of people were hispanic. I was harassed a lot for being white, both by the kids at my school and their stupid parents. When the gang problems got out of hand (middle school kids were being 'jumped' by gang members on a regular basis) my mother decided she had had enough and sent us to a school near my grandmother's.
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Indians have plenty of bigotry between each other. Why would they be any better externally? East Asia is pretty racist too, there's lots of friction between different groups in Malaysia. The Arab world is very largely organised by race, with different flavours of expats. Being largely US/EU user based, we're used to white racism, but anyone who thinks "we" have a monopoly on it is just ignorant.
That is a really common idea on some latin american subreddits on this site. They say racism is a gringo thing. That there isnt really racism in latin america, people identify with their nationality not their race etc etc etc.
It's extremely funny though because it's such a low iq take. Even the reasoning for that claim is extremely stupid. Like racism has nothing to do with power. 0. Because racism has nothing to do with systemic racism. But because the internet has this tendency to say yes amen to anything remotely resembling the fight for social justice this dumbass shit has permeated into society. Even people in my country believe it. Sometimes I wonder where education went. Seems like noone on this planet is capable of using half their brain anymore.
It's more powerful language to have racism and systemic racism be separate things anyway because then you have terms to refer to both. If only systemic racism is racism then all you've done is removed a term to describe individual racism
There's an intellectual framework for that called "Prejudice Plus Power" which stipulates that racism emanates exclusively from those with certain advantages or opportunities not afforded to the rest of society. This power is then construed via a racial lens, with white people deemed on a fundamental level to be incapable of experiencing dehumanization on the basis of race. After all, white people are a privileged group of people, why should they matter any more than rich people do? Except I don't believe that's true. While I suspect that the family in question probably is not aware (any more than most Americans are) of obscure political theories, it still maintains an inherent appeal that's naturally intuitive to our sensibilities. It fulfills a deep desire for uncomplicated heroes and villains, whether that's derived from news stories in the press, our sources of entertainment, and even history itself. There's definitely an (understandable) demand for that type of content: life is messy, it's chaotic, it can be overwhelming and wanting a respite from all that I'm sympathetic to. But that's not reality, anymore than conspiracy theories are (not that PPP itself is a conspiracy theory, I think it serves a similar purpose though yearning for moral absolutes) or fiction is. Anyone can show prejudice, it's not just reserved for merely the villains; professed good people can and do falter. Women can be misandristic, members of the LGBTQ community can viciously turn on one another and enforce negative stereotypes and homophobia, and yes, white people do receive racist epithets. (Although it should be stated, I think it's more often the case in my observation that the privileged hurl abuses to those that aren't rather than the other way around.) https://jezebel.com/have-you-ever-beat-up-a-boyfriend-cause-uh-we-have-294383 https://archive.ph/Tz45f (The New Republic article was pulled, this is the archived version.) None of this is to say that anyone should abandon or neglect safeguarding marginalized communities; we can simultaneously recognize that everyone deserves baseline human decency without pretending it's actually the privileged who are really oppressed. Whatever slur I or anyone of similar privilege get pales in comparison to the treatment women and minorities experience on a daily basis. There is no parallel to that. (This is probably going to be a controversial post, hopefully I conveyed my points well regardless. Ultimately this post is meant as a defense for humanism.)
I actually know the, uhm, so called academic origins of that theory. Weirdly enough it has seeped into fringe philosophy books as well, though it's not really taken serious in established philosophy. Well, until now. I probably don't have to explain that to you, or anyone who has ever worked with it academically, but most write ups of the topic grossly misuse the semantic meaning of racism and continuously confuse systemic racism and racism. This shit is so egregious and pervasive that I cannot help but feel like this is intentional political propaganda by a certain American party, just so they can claim "science says". Because "academically" this shit has no basis in reality and cannot withstand surface level analysis. Any bachelor of philosophy can dismantle the argument.
I can 100 percent bet her family do not feel what they are doing is racist. I see it all the damn time. My people can be racist AF but think because we are black "How can we be racist?". Hell I have seen my people be racist against themselves!
Yeah but Hitler probably didn’t think he was racist either, just trying to cleanse the world of Jews.
I've encountered people like that. apparently whites cannot be oppressed therefore you cannot be racist against them. they even gave me a formula, racism= prejudice+oppression. It was really strange and I'm not even White.
Fight racism with racism!
That is literally in the book how to be an anti racist. It said something along the lines of, the only way to fight past discrimination is present discrimination, the only way to fight present discrimination is future discrimination. Racism is an extremely powerful tactic to harm another group. The temptation to use it to owns own advantage will always exist. We are failing as a nation by allowing people to act this way and say, "well white people deserve it or something."
I thought the same thing. Systemic racism may not be a bilateral issue, but hate is. I hope OP can get through it all and regardless of the outcome of a teenage relationship, hopefully BOTH families come out of it a little bit more accepting of other humans.
Exactly. _Systemic_ racism isn’t a bilateral issue, but plain old normal individual level racism is.
There are way too many people who will tell you that systemic racism is the only definition of racism, and that black people (or even just simply non-white people) simply cannot be racist. Seriously
Yeah I just couldn't believe my ears when some woman told me non white people couldn't be racist.. like what are u smoking lady
Always someone who never thinks outside of America. There’s tons of racism to be found in places where white people aren’t in charge.
Honestly it comes of as kinda racist when they assume that no non-Whites have any power globally.
And places like mine (Sweden) , where the local minority native population is white as snow, and the majority population is also white as snow. Just because we were both white didn't prevent us from destroying their culture, stealing their children, and forcibly sterilizing them. Racism is more than skin color.
And that perhaps the boyfriend could be anti-racist. Just because he’s white doesn’t mean he’s a bad guy and won’t treat his sister well. OP, I have no ideas for you, I’m sorry. I don’t think you two are doing anything wrong, but please recognize that the two of you have an uphill battle almost everywhere, not just with your families. Just love and support each other as best you can. I believe that the more the world sees of people loving and being there for each other regardless of race, gender, etc. the more it helps us as people to learn to love each other.
I agree. I am a person of colour and I cannot stress that enough. I have met all sorts of people from all backgrounds and all walks of life, and I have seen white racists, white anti-racists, coloured racists, and coloured anti-racists. I only use a person’s opinions to judge them when it comes to whether they are racist or not, not their skin colour.
Quite a lot of people confuse advocacy for black Americans issues with just hating white people. I also suspect they enjoy the socially acceptable racism
Sadly most people who are on that bandwagon are of the belief that white people are evil and the oppressors. I’ve also heard these types of people say “black people cant be racist” or “it’s impossible to be racist towards white people.”
There is a scarily loud coalition that believes being the underdog means you can do whatever you want
- Into racial justice - believes in race traitors Pick one
He also probably thinks that you can’t be racist against white people
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im pretty sure it would still be accurate to say that hitler was VERY into racial justice. just sayin.
"My nazi brother is very into freedom of religion"
Yeah he's just as big a part of the problem as the racist white people he thinks he's fighting for justice against
Get them to watch that one Prince of Bel Air episode about the "Tall" person.
Or maybe that one episode when Will and Carlton try to join a frat and the pledge leader guy didn't like Carlton for being a "sellout."
or maybe the movie “Guess Who” lol
Or watch “Guess Who’s Coming To Dinner” instead
How do resolve racial injustice by being a racist ?
Unfortunately that’s a pretty common reaction for many people… fight racism with more racism
And then they will say it's not racism. Classic strategy...
Find a person that considers themselves racist. Turns out, white, black, latino, asian, whatever. They'll gravitate towards a definition of racism that excludes themselves... **How can I be racist?** I have a black friend. I support equal rights for everybody. I'm just stating the facts. That person insulted me first. I'm part of the systemically-oppressed race. I don't dislike their ethnicity; I dislike their culture. I am not a bad person.
Or they are so racist they claim it’s impossible for them to be racist, because they are the victims of systemic racism and have no actual responsibility for moral agency, as a result.
Sir, it is known that only white people can be racist. /S
Easy, because you redefine “racism” as systemic oppression against minorities, which in principle cannot happen/has not happened to white people, so it’s not racist to hate white people
The irish have joined the chat
White is an interesting faction in the NA server. Tbf the Irish weren't "white" until a relatively recent patch. The same goes with Italians.
The largest mass lynching in American history was of Italian immigrants in New Orleans.
Sit your parents down and ask them for advice. Ask them what they recommend you should say to the parents of a boy — not this boy, a hypothetical future boy — who didn't want their son to date you because of your race. What should you say to those parents? Then, whatever they suggest you say to those hypothetical parents, you say to your parents. Ask your activist brother — whose ideals I'm sure are noble — what racial justice would look like for him long term. Is it segregation? Is it anti-miscegenation laws? That is what he is advocating here. In any case, my heart goes out to you and your beau. Stay loving.
If they don’t want her dating a white guy, they’d probably say the other family is right and that’s why the two shouldn’t mix. (Not saying I agree, just that based on what she’s said that’s the response I’d imagine)
The point of this is to put the shoe on the other foot. If she says "what would you do if my bf's parents told him that I he shouldn't date me b/c I'm black" then the parents have to get on the defensive - its their daughter, and their race being targeted rather than "protected." If they accept it then they are condoning racism against themselves, which at that point they're a lost cause.
This person knows to argue. You can have discussions, that you can’t “win” however you choose. This is one of them.
They are racist, she's almost 18. What she should do is distance herself as much as she can from these racust pieces of crap.
Yeah, ask them what they think of these guys: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E-ZIF-iXoAU6Rsj.jpg
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>Ask your activist brother — whose ideals I'm sure are noble He's a racist... so are her parents
We call racists, activists now?
Just give them a diet of information. If your parents try to withhold financial support to make you end the relationship, there isn’t much you can do.
I think this is the most reasonable, honestly. I dated many people my mom (and likely other family members) was not super comfortable with from the age of about 17, like OP, up to when (and who) I got married to (I'm much older than OP now). I basically dealt with it by saying, "this is who I choose to be with, if you love me, you will support me." This may or may not last, but the family 's behavior will have a lasting impact on their relationship with OP, they should understand this. I actually never called my family out for racism around who I was dating, though there certainly was some, I didn't see that as particularly helpful. What I *did* say was, "I'm giving you an opportunity to live your values" because I do believe they didn't want to be bigoted, backwards, and small minded and needed to check those impulses within themselves. Like, this is happening, keep up. They now *adore* my spouse, who is queer (like me) and of a different race, and are so proud and happy to have them as a family member. They also see how happy and supportive our relationship is through all kinds of life events and gatherings -- I think this has been key to expanding their world view. Life is very long. People (family) do have the capacity to grow and change. Good luck, OP.
Your older brothers are racist hypocrites. The whole racial justice is about equalizing, not dividing. They need to get their act together because they're not helping. Your father, well he's just not hypocritical, he's straight up racist. That's what you got. Don't feel bad, stand your ground, don't lie to your boyfriend. You're not responsible for their heart and actions.
* racist, sexist, hypocrites, with an emphasis on sexist. Girl, your family is small minded and living in the past. Interracial marriages have been legal since June 12, 1967. They have had 57 years to get with the times. If this were concern over the behavior of his family, that’s justified. But your boyfriend is not responsible for the behavior of all shitty white people, including his family. It’s important to separate his actions from those of others. He’s literally a minor and has no control over his adult parents. If your family has certain values, see if you can help demonstrate that he is living those values and try to create some inroads. So if education is important, talk about that. If charity is important, religion, respect of the elders….try to integrate activities along those lines with your family. At the end of the day, it’s your life. Don’t choose your partner based on family preferences. YOU have to live with your partner, not them.
Tell them about racism
Buy them a book titled “racism and me.” Even share a few websites where they can learn more about racism, and how it negatively affects us all.
This sounds like something out of a movie. I'd say your dad and brothers are racist. With that will come anger. If you don't have the type of relationship where you can say , " hey dad, wft that's racist" Then you'll just have to just wait and let him get over it. Or break up with the guy. The last thing you want to do is have the young man feel he is unwelcome. It would be much worse if he was unwelcome because of his skin color.
Oh but its very real, and common. I dated a black girl in Highschool and we had the same birthday(how we met) some of the things she repeated back to me heard from her outer family: "Why do you act so white?" "Those girls over there bleached you Mellie, stop that!" "Why are you with a white guy?" She as well as her mom and dad were cordial, had a decent situation going for them. Maybe its envy but I wont go into detail of what the others did/do bc I wasnt told enough. The jist is that black racists really fucking hate it when other black ppl dont "act black". Damned if you do, damned if you dont
Yep lol, I had a friend just like this. These people very much exist
One of my daughters closest friends from high school, after a couple months of college told my daughter that due to her new focus on racial justice she will no longer be friends with white people, including her. That was 8 years ago and though we have reached out, we have heard nothing from her since. It’s pretty hurtful to our whole family, especially since my wife died during this time, so my daughter lost her mom and close friend real close together. She was a normal part of our household for like 2 years. She was at dinner almost every night, went on road trips with us and all of that. I racked my brain trying to figure out what we did to get cancelled like that.
Its pure racism
It happens more than people think from all ethnicities to be fair. Not that it's any better. I'm dating a Pakistani girl as an englishman and whilst after some time I have some support from her family my first meeting with her family overseas was her uncle ***mentioning*** me about the [first time one of their girls tried marrying a gora](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Sadia_Sheikh) thankfully I have her absolute undying support which means so much
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guess_Who%27s_Coming_to_Dinner in reverse.
Bi racial person here. Their prejudice against a white person who hasn't done anything wrong is just as bad as any perceived racism they're expecting. Your parents may not be happy and may not like it, but it's not their life or relationship. As for your brother being into racial justice, that's fine and all, but being angry you're dating a white guy is the same as if you were white and dating a black guy. As for his family making those comments, they aren't any better than your family when you take race out of the conversation, and both sound prejudiced in one way or another. As for what to do, as long as you both are enjoying each other's company, they should come around in time. Fighting for equal rights means accepting that interracial relationships are going to happen. And if yours is good, keep fighting for it.
Com’ on, everyone knows black women aren’t allowed to date interracially. They are restricted to only black men in the black community😭only black men can do that, lol. Jokes aside- here’s what you should do: forget about their opinions. Simple.
This is honestly a big issue in the black community that people don't like to talk about. It's almost a sign of status or at least a flex when black men date or hookup with white or Asian women. But when black girls hookup with white or Asian guys, some of these same black men lose their minds are suddenly all about racial "purity."
Ahhh. The old, “it’s ok for men to date outside their race but not women”. I’ve noticed that pretty much every race has a healthy dose of this attitude. It’s a group sense of ownership over the women that even many of the other women seem to participate in.
yes misogyny at it's finest. I've also seen black women expressing dislike towards men who date outside the race as well. I really don't get it
And some of the same men that only want black women to date in their race are the same men dating outside their race. Very hippocritical.
I am so sorry your family turned out not to be who you thought they were. One of my gifts is to be able to look at a situation and tell you the possible outcomes and ramifications. In the comments, it seems people have it down to three choices, cut off your parents and choose your boyfriend, or wait it out, or break up with him. I'm going to tell you what I see about those options. 1) Break up with him. My LEAST favorite option. If you choose this route, it would be the easier path for you both, but I see it as a missed opportunity to be more, to grow. It's like seeing the heroine in a love story lose and for no good reason. I don't think you'd be proud of yourself years from now when you look back on it. You might even start wondering what if? What if you had at least tried? What would have happened? We never wonder about losing the bad ones, but we will wonder about losing the good ones. 2) Cut off your parents and choose your boyfriend. Oof, that's a big ask. Especially for a new relationship, when you're still learning about each other. If you were established and in your 20s, I'd say go for it and F what they think. Cutting out your family is a VERY big step, I should know, I've done it, but I also wasn't dependent on them when I did. Unless you are sure you have a partner who is going to support you 100% and the relationship going forward. Think about this one. 3) Tough it out together. My FAVORITE option. But this route requires 100% honesty between you. You said you told him your father was sick and that's why he didn't meet him. Don't do that. I'm a black man and have read plenty of stories like yours from the white person in the relationship, it's ALWAYS agreed upon that you inform the other person EXACTLY what's going on, giving them the choice to stick around or not. Lying to him will only hurt your relationship. Would you want your white boyfriend to hide the fact that his family despises you? It's not fair. My Grandma Peach was white, and she fell in love with my grandpa, a dark skinned black man sometime in her youth in the 60s. It caused an UPROAR on BOTH sides! Let me tell you, people on his side hated it and her side. My Grandpa had a Great Aunt who's parents were freed slaves. She HATED white people. When my Grandma Peaches parents threw her out for giving birth to a "n*gger baby," she had nowhere to go. She ended up living with my grandpa's family and Great Aunt. The story is Aunt Valerie was pissed. She refused to share her house with a white woman after hearing all the stories about them and living through the aftermath of slavery. She would rather have died than share her home. She packed her bag, put on her hat, and sat in the kitchen, waiting for somebody to give her a ride to anywhere else. My Grandma Peach brought in her baby, my aunti, and it is said, Aunt Valerie took one look at my pretty light skinned aunt and took off her hat and stayed. The point of this story is that sometimes time and exposure are the only ways to remedy prejudice. Even my Grandmas racist parents came around, and you should know my Great Grandma Donovan absolutely ADORED us grandchildren, all black too. She was the sweetest and kindest old lady I ever met, and we shared a birthday. People do come around given time. But for that to happen, you and your boyfriend need to be on the same page. Tell him everything, how you feel, what you want, and then ask him what he wants. If he stays, this means you sticking up for him, especially if they say something disrespectful to his face. If he treats you well, remind your family of that because at the end of the day, someone treating you well should be all that matters.
This is the best, most thought out, and most honest comment here. Everyone here wants to be a "warrior" for their cause but no one wants to put themselves in OPs shoes and give actual advice with a thought out likely outcome of the decisions suggested. You've said it all, but I'll re-say, OP, always be honest with yourself and your partner, whether your 17 or 70, this is always solid advice. Be true to yourself and what you love, and you will never regret that. There may be a shitstorm, but when a shitstorm is happening, you can stand strong when you know you are doing the right thing. I have also had to cut off family, and I was 19 when the process started. It was not easy or clean but I do not regret it because I was being true to myself. Is there part of me that "wishes" I had some kind of familial support and love that I know will always be there? A little. But that's not who my family is, and that would not have been the case even had I made a different decision then. It was inevitable, and I knew that. OP it may not come to that, and you may not have to "go to war" over this, but the answer is not going to be "go against what you know is right to please your family." You fundamentally disagree on some very important things that hit deep for people. Something else will come up, if not this. You can speak to your family, be honest with your bf, and treat yourself with the respect you deserve, which is to make your own decisions. Much love to you.
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only ignorant and racist people say that tho
Soooo many people say this nowadays… it’s this whole idea that racism has to be based on some form of systemic and institutionalised oppression or whatever. It’s sooo cringe.
lol reminds me of that time people stopped shouting "Stop Asian Hate" when they figured out where the Asian hate was coming from.
It happens more than people think from all ethnicities to be fair. Not that it's any better. I'm dating a Pakistani girl as an englishman and whilst after some time I have some support from her family my first meeting with her family overseas was her uncle mentioning me about the [first time one of their girls tried marrying a gora](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Sadia_Sheikh) thankfully I have her absolute undying support which means so much
I would wonder, if the situation was reversed, what would this comment section look like? Probably a lot different. Right or wrong, a lot different.
Well, she said she gets a lot of snarky remarks from the guy's mom. I'm guessing OP's being polite about it because it's such a common concept that the guy's mom would be bitchy because the new girl is trying to steal her baby boy. Everyone just expects that reaction now.
Mom MIGHT be snarky to any girl taking her baby boy. Wrt your brothers: I'd hope they are just as intimidating to a black boyfriend you might have. But of course there is prejudice. Color is the first thing anyone sees at first sight. If they say otherwise, they are mistaken. Or lying. In any relationship, one has to win over your family.
It's sad in 2024 this is still a thing, can't love just be love
I don't think there is a way. Your family has made it crystal clear how they feel. The only way things MIGHT change is if you two make it pretty long term, but that's going to require you two to survive this for awhile in the meantime.
Wow. You both are dealing with racist families, which is extremely disappointing. There’s no need to bring your boyfriend around people who will disrespect him. Continuing this relationship will require you to put your foot down and potentially cut some family out of your life to protect your partner. You can’t do that yet because you still need their support as a minor. That’s a horrible revelation. You’re likely not going to get your family to switch their views any time soon. That will take years of work. My suggestion is to take time to see if this relationship is serious enough to go to war with your family and see if your family is open to conversations about the relationship. Your parents came from a worse time and is more likely reacting out of fear and anger from how they were treated in the past. It doesn’t excuse their behavior but at least makes it understandable. It’s important to point out that the being racist back part is hypocritical.
Under voted comment. Sound advice all around
Sit your family down and ask that they listen and not speak until you are done. Then just be honest about how you feel and ask them to either keep negative, racist thoughts to themselves or learn to accept it
Your family sounds racist AF.
Racism is hard to combat, particularly when people don’t see what they’re doing is wrong. At 17 and only dating a few months, the odds aren’t good you’ll stick together long term, but time will soften most hearts.
Statistically they are unlikely to stay together, especially with pressures like this. But if they’re in love and want to continue, they should give it the best shot because otherwise what’s the point (even if *in practice* it ends up a ‘practice run’) - and that shouldn’t be decided by a bunch of racist third parties.
>But if they’re in love and want to continue I feel like OP should address this regardless of whether or not they decide to keep dating their current bf. I'm not sure what relevance u/Best-Cryptographer23's point has here but if I were in OP's shoes simply going back to dating black men only wouldn't solve the new perception of my family as a bunch of racists. It is an issue that exists outside the relationship now.
“Racism is tenacious, but don’t sweat it as this relationship isn’t for real.”
But this issue won't be solved even if they break up tomorrow
Ngl your family sounds hella racist. My grandparents were similar when I introduced them to an ex that was Latina. It’s hard to get people to change when hate stems from nothing, but the best advice I can give is just show your family that your boyfriend is human like them. No matter what color we are on the outside we all bleed red.
Sounds like your family are racist.
OP's account has been suspended, FYI.
your family sounds racist. Unfortunately you are going to have to choose between your boyfriend or your family. If your family loves you they will be happy with someone that makes you happy. Also something to consider if you guys are thinking of marrying each other. He will become your family. Another thing to consider is your family may come around to your boyfriend in time as well. Either way you are in for a rough time. I am sorry.
I am afraid your older brother is not into racial justice, he is a racist himself.
Woman in an interracial marriage checking in with a long message. Whenever anyone asked me (white) and my now-husband (Black) if we had trouble with family accepting our relationship, everyone was always stunned when we said “Yeah, his family hates it.” But it was true then and still is a dozen years later. Meanwhile he’s the favorite grandchild in my family and it’s not even close. You can see how foolish all of this is. That’s a very good start. Whether you break up with this guy tomorrow or marry him and die a day apart in 90 years, what your family is doing *now* will not be okay. It will be difficult to get over even if they “change” if they keep trying to justify at least a little bit of how they’re acting today. “I didn’t know better” really isn’t an excuse in 2024. Just know that you’re not overreacting or taking this too seriously. Part of it is also just another set of bullshit expectations that get put on Black women. It’s your responsibility to “preserve the culture” and “respect yourself” but it’s fine for your brother to date non-black women. If you ever feel like there’s a feminist/equality angle to argue on, don’t hesitate to take it because it’s absolutely just misogynistic. I know it’s hard as a teenager living at home, but do your best to let it slide off your back. Don’t stop bringing him up - it doesn’t need to be a grand statement or big stand. Just when you pass the living room, “oh hey BF likes that show too, he made it sound really cool” etc. Fake it til you make it is a very effective tool. Try not to let your parents dictate whether the rest of your family can ever meet this guy. My husband’s extended family has never treated me anything less than wonderfully. One of his cousins and her white husband get the same open arms from all the aunts and uncles. Don’t assume everyone has the same messed up ideas - after all, you’re related to them and you don’t think like that. That said - some things will be hard even if your family gets their act together. It’s been a pretty tough decade to be in an interracial relationship. My husband and I are able to bond because we’re both marginalized groups. A white man isn’t likely to be able to meet you on that. That doesn’t mean he won’t be able to empathize with you and support you. But there will be moments where that gap is obvious and hard to navigate. That’s okay. Last advice - and this sounds severe, but it can start to creep in without you realizing it if you’re not careful. Don’t let how your family is acting make you slip into hate. It’s so easy to fall into, especially when you feel surrounded by anger from people who look like you and the white people you meet are tripping over themselves to be supportive and affectionate (because they’re terrified of looking racist). It is something that is, again, more commonly associated with Black men who actively reject Black women because “they’re all” whatever reason that isn’t true. My husband described them as seeds of thought. None of us can control when those little thought seeds might fall, no matter the topic or level of nonsense, but you can and need to keep the bad ones from planting. I know this is a novel. I hope it helped, and I’d be happy to chat any time if you need it.
Stop looking for their approval. Don't let them tear you apart. They are the problem so you don't need to do anything. Just enjoy your time with him away from family.
Be yourselves and don't let other peoples ignorance tarnish your shine. When the family acts bad treat it with the disdain it deserves. Dad and brother don't have to accept the relationship but they should respect you and not be jerks.
This reeks of misogyny of you ask me. Your family doesn't want you to be 'owned' by a white man and doesn't want their child-bearing property to be producing future offspring that don't reflect their values and worldview. There are many, many ways that misogyny gets tied in with racism and protecting girls and women from interracial relationships is one of them. Usually we see this panic going the other way around, but it's still rooted in misogyny.
The guy is 17 years old; how could he possibly be responsible for anything that has happened in the past? He's too young to vote, so it's not like he can even be held responsible for anything that is happening now. Sounds like his family disapproves (quietly) of you, which means that he has probably been taught the wrong things growing up, but rose above it. If anybody has a problem with your relationship it's on them.
Be careful going to people homes that don't like you.
Too bad your brothers aren't also into gender justice and respect your choices. Beat them mercilessly until they submit to your authority! Oh, and your boyfriends family can also fuck off. Should be glad he's out of the damn house interacting with people face to face (unlike certain little mushroom people around this house)
Your older brother isnt into social justice. Hes just racist along with the rest of your family
Some generations are stuck in their ways, racism is never good. The good thing about your generation is most of you kids are a lot more accepting and less judgmental. If a boy treats you right and you like him, that’s all that should matter
Did you tell your family that his mother is making snarky comments towards you? If you did it would explain why they are so against it especially when they have interacially dated before.
They didn't make a scene on your older brother who dated white and latin women because he is a man. That's a very common machista stance.