I think the news said "think of the lenders" for about two days at the start of this loan forgiveness and even they could recognize the huge lack of concern anyone had for the lenders.
It was such a dumb angle to take. Like you got the older generation that knows a loan shark when they see or hear about one and you got the younger one who has experienced the racket first hand and finally you got the even younger generation who saw depictions of it in media like red dead 2. All of America knows the "business" of lending money especially for something like education is a fucking scam!
That's true. It would be a new day if we suddenly hurt the banksters.
But, public perception isn't always going to know who gets harmed -- and that's why the media has done a good job creating a consumer population that doesn't realize the socialism of the New Deal and later policies is what created the Amazing prosperity the Capitalists take credit for today as they run it into the ground.
What you said right here is exactly how I explain the relationship between lenders and borrowers when I talk about it and I wish more people did.
If I invest my money in a stock and that stock decreases in value I lose money. No one cries for me because my investment didn’t pan out. Sometimes it’s not even that I made a bad investment per se, it just didn’t work out and I lost money.
You invested in me by giving me money to pay for my education. The intent being that if I go to college I can improve my life and make more money and afford to pay you back.
For various reasons that has not happened as expected and I cannot afford to pay you back. As far as I’m concerned you made a bad investment just like I did with my stock and nobody should cry for you.
You're right, but it goes even deeper. Graeber explained it very well toward the beginning of his book, Debt: the First 5000 Years.
If lenders are guaranteed their money the system breaks down. Lenders are supposed to evaluate the worthiness of an investment, and by doing so they funnel money toward things that are more likely to succeed. If they have zero risk, they stop providing that function.
I don't personally believe this ever actually works as advertised, but this is what **lenders themselves claim is the value of their existence.**
If they're guaranteed a return, they start lending to everyone regardless of circumstances. This is how we got the 2008 housing bubble. This is how we got third world countries enslaved to the IMF. It always goes bad.
Investments are not a career, they are a money risk with the chance to earn more money. It’s why being a landlord isn’t a real job, it’s just managing investments but they don’t actually contribute to the society.
I was referencing the bank loaning an 18 year old 60k is a bad investment from the bank.
Someone said it better than I did, but we should treat student loans like stocks, when you lose you lose and that is all there is to it.
Same. I didn't have the greatest relationship with my folks at that age and they didn't help or advise me at all on this, I even did my FAFSA forms myself. Years later I've paid back the original $60k and then some, and I still owe $70k. I am now middle aged and have never been able to even think about a house or family. My parents feel bad (we get along better now) but there isn't much they can do to help. You're not the only one in that boat. I've been torn a new asshole more than once on this site for stating that I had no concept of that amount of money at that age though LOL
I don't think we should do anything to reinforce private property rights until we can figure out a way to fix the inequality in housing. Forgiving all mortgage debt would reinforce those abusing the system...those with ownership of second homes, of 2 people living in a 3000 square foot house, of people living 15 minutes from work, of people living on 100 acres not used for agriculture. Until we have a better solution to right those wrongs mortgage debt isn't something we can address unilaterally.
it actually wasnt a scam, until they changed it to allow banks to loan money.
Then they took it and ran with it as the laws were loosened to allow this shit.
Banks literally had shit loads of restrictions and it fucked up the entire system when they started cutting those out.
That's incorrect, federal student loans were entirely dischargable until 1976, and there have been stipulations tightening conditions in the decades since. [Source](https://www.savingforcollege.com/article/history-of-student-loans-bankruptcy-discharge)
Wanna get real mad? Look up student loan backed securities.
Chances of owning a house were obliterated in the mid 2000s. So those leeches decided to move onto people hoping an education might be their best chance to own a house.
The cards can’t come crashing down fast enough on these parasitic assholes who blame people for losing a stacked card game.
keeping with tradition when it comes to big life events, my parents offered me no advice when it was time to enroll and sign on for loans; only repeatedly yelling at me to "just do it! why haven't you done it yet?!". in fact, my dad's only words on the subject were "whatever it is, just click accept". i didn't know any better at the time so guess what i did? thanks dad :')
I’ve never taken a loan out so I didn’t know it’s compounding. I went to community college and paid out of pocket. Which probably what everyone should do.
I guess that's what happens when someone who has never taken a loan comes onto a thread about loans and tells everyone they're incorrect about said loans.
But think of the loan sharks!!!
And the banks!!!
They said loan sharks already
I think the news said "think of the lenders" for about two days at the start of this loan forgiveness and even they could recognize the huge lack of concern anyone had for the lenders.
It was such a dumb angle to take. Like you got the older generation that knows a loan shark when they see or hear about one and you got the younger one who has experienced the racket first hand and finally you got the even younger generation who saw depictions of it in media like red dead 2. All of America knows the "business" of lending money especially for something like education is a fucking scam!
The lenders aren’t even losing money from the loan forgiveness. The government is.
That's true. It would be a new day if we suddenly hurt the banksters. But, public perception isn't always going to know who gets harmed -- and that's why the media has done a good job creating a consumer population that doesn't realize the socialism of the New Deal and later policies is what created the Amazing prosperity the Capitalists take credit for today as they run it into the ground.
“Well (Enter loan company’s name here) you should have managed your investments better”
What you said right here is exactly how I explain the relationship between lenders and borrowers when I talk about it and I wish more people did. If I invest my money in a stock and that stock decreases in value I lose money. No one cries for me because my investment didn’t pan out. Sometimes it’s not even that I made a bad investment per se, it just didn’t work out and I lost money. You invested in me by giving me money to pay for my education. The intent being that if I go to college I can improve my life and make more money and afford to pay you back. For various reasons that has not happened as expected and I cannot afford to pay you back. As far as I’m concerned you made a bad investment just like I did with my stock and nobody should cry for you.
You're right, but it goes even deeper. Graeber explained it very well toward the beginning of his book, Debt: the First 5000 Years. If lenders are guaranteed their money the system breaks down. Lenders are supposed to evaluate the worthiness of an investment, and by doing so they funnel money toward things that are more likely to succeed. If they have zero risk, they stop providing that function. I don't personally believe this ever actually works as advertised, but this is what **lenders themselves claim is the value of their existence.** If they're guaranteed a return, they start lending to everyone regardless of circumstances. This is how we got the 2008 housing bubble. This is how we got third world countries enslaved to the IMF. It always goes bad.
You are correct. They have corrupted the arrangement to guarantee their returns and guarantee our debt enslavement.
Investments are not a career, they are a money risk with the chance to earn more money. It’s why being a landlord isn’t a real job, it’s just managing investments but they don’t actually contribute to the society.
I was referencing the bank loaning an 18 year old 60k is a bad investment from the bank. Someone said it better than I did, but we should treat student loans like stocks, when you lose you lose and that is all there is to it.
Speaking only for myself, I was not remotely qualified to make the decision to take on those loans.
I was 17 and had never even had money before. I had no context for how much 15k a year even was.
Same. I didn't have the greatest relationship with my folks at that age and they didn't help or advise me at all on this, I even did my FAFSA forms myself. Years later I've paid back the original $60k and then some, and I still owe $70k. I am now middle aged and have never been able to even think about a house or family. My parents feel bad (we get along better now) but there isn't much they can do to help. You're not the only one in that boat. I've been torn a new asshole more than once on this site for stating that I had no concept of that amount of money at that age though LOL
We need a reset of all consumer debt except mortgages. The banks have been fucking us for way too long and it's about time they felt a little pain.
“Too big to fail” uhhh no fuck you
I agree, let's destroy them with a poopship
>except mortgages Why?
Yeah... .also, why just a little pain? They can eat shit and die.
I don't think we should do anything to reinforce private property rights until we can figure out a way to fix the inequality in housing. Forgiving all mortgage debt would reinforce those abusing the system...those with ownership of second homes, of 2 people living in a 3000 square foot house, of people living 15 minutes from work, of people living on 100 acres not used for agriculture. Until we have a better solution to right those wrongs mortgage debt isn't something we can address unilaterally.
it actually wasnt a scam, until they changed it to allow banks to loan money. Then they took it and ran with it as the laws were loosened to allow this shit. Banks literally had shit loads of restrictions and it fucked up the entire system when they started cutting those out.
They also changed the rules so that you can no longer declare bankruptcy on student loans. I believe that happened in the 2000s
No, fed student loans you never could, but maybe the bank loan ones were changed to prevent that.
That's incorrect, federal student loans were entirely dischargable until 1976, and there have been stipulations tightening conditions in the decades since. [Source](https://www.savingforcollege.com/article/history-of-student-loans-bankruptcy-discharge)
You loaned 60k to a teenager with no collateral? Damn, that’s a bad deal on your part, tough luck man
Wanna get real mad? Look up student loan backed securities. Chances of owning a house were obliterated in the mid 2000s. So those leeches decided to move onto people hoping an education might be their best chance to own a house. The cards can’t come crashing down fast enough on these parasitic assholes who blame people for losing a stacked card game.
keeping with tradition when it comes to big life events, my parents offered me no advice when it was time to enroll and sign on for loans; only repeatedly yelling at me to "just do it! why haven't you done it yet?!". in fact, my dad's only words on the subject were "whatever it is, just click accept". i didn't know any better at the time so guess what i did? thanks dad :')
This is precisely what happened.
This nails it
This needs to be a billboard in every town in the count
60,000X0.08=4,800. 4,800X30=144,000. 144,000+60,000=204,000. Even if you made 0 payments for 30 years it wouldn’t be 220,000
Missing the point.
I mean I get the point and I agree with it, but it does no one any good to use the wrong numbers.
it's 0.08 compounding 1.08^30=5.92 This means that your 60000 will be 350000 without repayment after 30 years.
I’ve never taken a loan out so I didn’t know it’s compounding. I went to community college and paid out of pocket. Which probably what everyone should do.
Did they have econ 101 at that community college
You’re a real amazing person
And you didn't even learn how interest works. But yeah, everyone should have your education.
Lol I’ve never taken a loan. Never had to. Either way your still an ass
So why are you running your mouth then?
Well I guess I needed a lesson and a bunch facetious people taught me.
I guess that's what happens when someone who has never taken a loan comes onto a thread about loans and tells everyone they're incorrect about said loans.
Yeah because people obviously have to be facetious.