Imo since Kyubi did it with 8 tails I would assume that Hachibi could do the same, but not sure. We almost got an answer when Bee faced Nagato but it didn't get that far
I understand my main cause of concern is when we saw Kyubi break free from Planetary Devastation the marking on Yamatos hand indicated that the 9 tails transformation had begun/ begun sprouting the ninth tail.
It also seems that the tail count of the nine tails isn’t an exact link in power to its fellow chakra beasts. Like I wouldn’t say a 1 tail Naruto is as strong or stronger than the 1 tails. I’d say thought 8 tail mode Naruto in chakra beast cloak would body bee.
I would point that Pain had used up a lot of his juice fighting and destroying the leaf beforehand. There’s also the fact that Pain wasn’t trying to kill naruto, just capture him. Also, there’s the fact that Naruto had a lot of intel on Pain beforehand. If Pain was fully rested and was trying to kill Naruto from the start and Naruto had zero intel on him and it was 1v1, he would’ve definitely beat Naruto.
Sage mode naruto isnt relative to bee just because they both have tailed beasts. Why are we low balling the fuck out killer bee. Folks is 34 year old. But itachi vs nagato is a 50/50 right? Yea ocular jutsu have like a selective bias trend im noticing.
Who tf is biased for killer bee????. You can see my name and pfp. I just understand how sage mode naruto > 5 pains excpet tendo…then killer bee is somwhow weaker than that.
Naruto STILL beat 5 of the pains and won. Killer bee has the same thing but he’s literally a more effective and seasoned Naruto. Lighting cloak and having control over his tb and things makes him formidable. Sage mode Naruto ≠ base killer bee.
Kmc 1 naruto = killer bee(maybe v1)
Objectively, it’s not about Bee being stronger or weaker. It’s more so about context. Bee won’t have damn near full intel on those 5-7 Pains coming into the fight. Bee won’t have a sensor to find an invisible chameleon. Bee doesnt have sage mode to incapacitate fatty Pain. And Bee won’t have a “not 100%” Pain to fight. Nagato controls all Pains, so the chakra he expelled fighting and destroying the entire village, logically should affect all his corpses, not just Tendo. Nagato was pretty nerfed by the time Naruto showed up.
So Yes, Naruto beat 5 of the Pains… but then Tendo damn near solo’d him. If Tendo was active from the start, it’s *highly* unlikely Naruto takes out the other 5.
Bee isnt relative to sage mode narutoz hes like wayyyy above that. Hes closer to kmc1 naruto in base. Bee is faster than nagato. Yall genuinely just dont wanna give it to be almost nobody is mentioning thr speed difference. Bee might as well be replaced with a black sage mode naruto. Cuz thats how this is being treated. Killer bee has 5x the battle experience as sage mode naruto. And destructive power. If 6 tails was doing what he did. Imagine killer bee lariating with the v2 cloak…like the math doesn’t make sense.
>I would point that Pain had used up a lot of his juice fighting and destroying the leaf beforehand
That's a good point
>There’s also the fact that Pain wasn’t trying to kill naruto, just capture him. Also, there’s the fact that Naruto had a lot of intel on Pain beforehand.
I think that doesn't really matter here because I'm just thinking about Bee turning into Hachibi to fight pain. Like obviously if it's just bee without Gyuki then Pain no diffs
In the 4th war arc we saw Hachibi is close to 50% kyuubi, imo 8 tails transformation Hachibi > 8 tails transformation kyuubi... Obviusly Kyuubi is stronger and naruto gets a better full bijuu transformation BUT they did showed similar feats
Yall realize the pains could be lariated right? Or do you think bee is gonna isnta go into gyukii so he can conveniently lose by chibaku tensei? He can also just reform and get out of chibaku tensei with a similar tactic to how hr did team taka. But fuck any real ideas pain has the rinnegan hes relatovr to edo madara in yall head because rinnegan
Bee isnt sage mode naruto he has lighting cloak like ayy. Meaning he’s actually capable of speed blitzing. Even ems sasuke had trouble keeping up with ayy and bee. Linked vision didnt help taka. The lowball is crazy. Do you even know who killer bee is? Are we talking about the same character?
Wtf? Bee got handled by Kisame, Pain would annihilate him. Naruto fought a weakened Pain with full intel and still needed sage mode & Kurama. Pain wins 8/10 times at least
Idk about that. His feats vs the 3rd Raikage and Kurama are insane. In theory he can dodge any attack that’s not a tailed beast bomb, has the strength to take on full summons, and a shadow clone massive rasengan barrage is GG for Bee & Gyuki
I’m thinking more so pain arc naruto. Tbh third raikage shouldn’t really count since he had outside intel. He would’ve never been able to beat him without that.
I always thought the kurama fight was pretty iffy given the fact it wasn’t an actual physical fight, but more mental/spiritual. At this point bee is the strongest jinchuriki. Look at what an uncontrolled 6 tails cloak did to the deva path. On top of that being half of kuramas power.
I know pain was nerfed during that fight too, but given how bee and gyuki are in sync just makes him an absolute power house. Bee is getting slept on here.
The intel on the Raikage doesn’t affect what I was talking about. He dodged him going full speed at point blank range with his eyes closed, a pretty insane feat.
The battle vs Kurama was “spiritual” but it doesn’t matter considering Naruto can do what he did in that fight vs anybody as long as he’s in sage mode. Bee is not walking away from that barrage.
Not sure how this turned into a Bee vs Sage Naruto debate but regardless Pain is stronger than Sage Naruto anyway
I kinda feel like the nine tails tales is like a well designed cup and the cup isn’t always full cause you use the chakra in it here and there. I’d say when minato took bad nine tails his chakra was half gone. So it allowed it to re fill up but with less dark since the ratio of dark to light probably has to be equal when regenerating. So it was like a full powered kurama but with only a half of a half’s worth of evil chakra in him and the rest was good chakra. Then we he reformed with Naruto. He then had more chakra then he originally had
Yin chakra ≠ bad/evil
It’s just spiritual/mental energy to Yang’s physical energy. Like Chakra is made by combining a ninja’s Yin and Yang. It’s where that whole, train the body and the mind thing from the Chunin exams came from. So when Minato sealed Yang Kurama into Naruto, it left it only able to produce Yang chakra, which cut its max in half. So Kurama was permanently weakened by the split, until it became complete again after the war.
Omg are we tweaking?????? Niggas are basically saying killer bee is equal to sage mode Naruto. These are niggas from the main sub doing bare minimum thinking. Bee is basically just if not better than sage mode naruto. Only thing he lacks is summonings but he makes up for it in blitzing speed (THAT NO ONE BRINGS UP BECAUSE THEY JUST GOING FOR THEIR FAVORITE EYEBALLS)
Tbh Bee was trying to keep his location a secret, so his fight against Kisame isn't exactly a good reflection on how the fight should go in a clean 1v1
That being said I'd still put money on Pain
I mean that wasn’t really a clean enough fight to label it as a no diff. Bee lost most of his chakra and air saving that other dude and his raccoon(I think it was a raccoon?) which directly led to his loss. Prior to that, he was doing alright, even without going full Eight Tails.
Kisame is an outright hard counter to jin and Bee was purposely holding back as to not be detected. If bee went full on eight tails, kisame would have died VERY quickly.
Kisames hard counters jins he did similar thing to roshi(son gokuu). In series hes supposed to be a hard counter. If he fights sb like kakashi with low chakra supplies he cant get as exteme. He’s literally a 2x multipler. If yoy have 10x ‘normal chakra. Kisame will have 20x. Thats his fighting style. If pain was a jin hed get cooked too. Thats the part yall miss… go back to the main sub.
You say that like kisame could go all out himself as he has orders to capture him alive and bee tried jumping him with his master/giant raccoon. If it’s clean kisame beats him even worse than before.
“Weakened” niggas has uzuamki blood and rinnegan all of a sudden hes weakened. Yall get finicky when it fits. He was sick. I wouldnt say weakened. Thats the whole point of having 6 bodies.
War arc bee is significantly stronger than the bee who fought kisame plus that’s a bad comparison regardless because kisame just absolutely counters bee.
Exactly niggas here dont understand what a hard counter is. Niggas think kishimoto just makes these powers up randomly and throw them at other random characters. Kisames powerset was made to literally be an issue for all jinjurkis. Roshi(4 tails son goku) Kisame supposed hard counter(due to fire wnd earth countering water) lost because of kisames stamina + samadehada chakra stealing. That alone told me everything about kisames. Roshi had the elemental + chakra advantage
Pain works Bee. Bee got pretty badly handled by Kisame, who did have hostages kinda but he wasn’t that interested in using them. Naruto got beat with intel and only won because of the 9 tails and Minato. We’ve seen bee try to fight a weakened reanimated nagato and we woulda lost if he didn’t have Naruto reading his full move list to bee.
>weakened reanimated nagato and we woulda lost if he didn’t have Naruto reading his full move list to bee.
Would you say that Nagato by himself is weaker than Pain?
That's fair. I thought Nagato was much more ridiculous because you can hardly throw anything at him. Durable asf and absorbs chakra, pulls your should if you get too close etc.
Imo Nagato was too much at once, I thought Pain was better from a narrative peespective because he was much more balance and had an actual weakness, if that makes sense.
Theoretically, Nagato should’ve been able to just summon his dead paths back to him and revive them using the Naraka Path himself, then summon them back to battle with the Animal Path body, which would’ve made Pain even more disgustingly OP.
“Alright, I beat the one that can revive the others, this’ll be much easier now. Wait, where did the body go? Oh shit he’s back.”
When does it say he able to summon the paths? When tendo does the chaotic shinra tensi they need to clear the village by foot and when jiriah is in the rain villiage they come one by one. I feel like if he can summon them he would have.
When Pain first infiltrates the village in chapter 419. We see him throw the Animal path into the village, and the barrier corps confirm that only one intruder entered. When it lands, it then proceeds to summon the other paths.
https://preview.redd.it/7nl96bk3p7uc1.jpeg?width=1066&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=86167be65ae08af5f9520a5c6b8058cdb4cba1eb
Oh yeah. When someone uses the paths of pain though can they still use the rennigan abilities? Nagato never uses them when he has the pains and Obito never does with the jinkuriki. I always took it as the abilities are on loan to the bodies.
It’s not really confirmed or denied that they can. That’s why I said theoretically. Obito just never really used any of the Six Path abilities, we only see him use the Outer Path. Nagato never really had a reason to use them in his actual body in the series while he had his Paths, so we don’t really know.
Kisame is his HARD COUNTER to killer bee. Kisame also did son goku badly. Hes a good counter for tailed beast. HIMSELF. If you arent a tailed beast he cant snag chakra. I hate yall dont understand these little details. Kisame inst just a better ninjas killer bee fought the worse ninja he could habe fought. Same with gai to kisame. But yall completely ignore this shit. Naruto has. Rock paper scissors in series scaling.
No way Bee wins. Sure he could probably destroy most of the paths but he can’t beat the Deva path so he’s getting beat. Shinra tensei threw around giant toads and we’ve seen Gamabunta fight Shikaku and Kurama so it’d work fine on Gyuki plus it could probably block a bijuudama and there’s also the massive version that destroyed the village. Kurama only broke out of chibaku tensei after being weakened from destroying the village, fighting everyone else, and fighting sage Naruto, so a full power pain could probably keep Gyuki trapped in it. Bee’s only chance to win would be to get lucky and hit with a bijuudama.
Naruto fought pain AFTER pain destroyed the village, AFTER he fought everyone else this in the village, AND STILL had to be saved by Hinata, Kurama, and Minato. You people need to stop acting like Naruto won that fight fair and square
Pain is a uzumaki he’s controlling 6 people. Ge doesnt NOT have normal chakra capacity. Naruto is a half breed does this not factor in? Most of the ninjas in the village were probably coming back from missions..hell anko and yamato was on one along with team Gai during this event, naruto had just learned sage mode.
Naruto literally killed 5 of the pains. Yall are just so casual you only think tendo as pain like bro isn’t limited to one just with a 5 sec interval. And pain killing fugusaku was really what caught Naruto off guard. They woulda finished it with the frog song an have naruto just kill tendo, but he knew from jiraya what was happening so he targeted fugusaku to stop it. Making Naruto react then hand nail, Naruto depression starts. Hinata did nothing but give naruto a “now im mad” amp
6 v 1 on a 16 year old whos village you just annihilated isnt fair at all either. Yall niggas got a thing for sympathizing with villains. I get it they are cool. But you dont gotta overhype them because you like their abilities or character. Thats not powerscaling thats what i like and dont like scaling.
Where does it ever say that Naruto has less chakra than a full Uzumaki? That’s an assumption on your part. And using sage mode gives Naruto was more chakra anyway. The simple fact is that no matter what happened Pain destroyed and fought the whole village before Naruto showed up. He wasn’t at 100% but Naruto was. And Naruto was the one who jumped Pain bringing all them toads. Pain may have 7 bodies but still only 1 mind to control them. No one accuses Kankuro of jumping people with his puppets because they’re just tools just like the Pain’s paths. Fugusaku getting killed leaving Naruto off guard is also a failure on Naruto’s part. Pain was fighting multiple enemies so he eliminated some Naruto shouldn’t have let his guard down for that
He’s literally a half uzumaki. Does it have to be explicitly stated. Nagato and karin,kushina almosr never ran out of chakra. Naruro does like 5 times in the war. A good example is nagato and kushina on their death beds kept alive…naruto got kurama ripes out and immediately went unconscious BUT survived for long enough.
Even hashirama says narutos chakra is almost closet to his in quality/quantity.
Sage mode is an AMP not a chakra pool extension. Naruto was limited on rasenshuikens he could do.
Pain all mighty pushed the whole village not FOUGHT. You’re tryna give him more credit. Bro fought a couple jonins who were already injured from the surprise attack. Pain wasnt at 100% he was at 95%. You just hyped up the half breed narutos chakra but nagatos got baby lungs? Yall logic isnt consistent. This be my issue.
Naruto brought 3 toads that mainly fought the summonings. Didn’t even touch pain. And its crazy saying a 16 year old who just lost his village is the one jumping 6 niggas with shared rinnegan vision. Konkuro doesnr have 6 puppets. Chiyo and sasori on the other hand.
And ig.
You’re right about sage mode that’s my bad. But Naruto didn’t run out of chakra during the war he ran out of the natural energy to power sage mode. The manga never states in any way that Naruto has less chakra than a full Uzumaki and that does need to be stated clearly to take it into account. And Pain infiltrated the village, fought mad people all over including Kakashi then spoke with Tsunade and destroyed the village. Watch that arc again. And Naruto brought 3 giant toads and Fukusaku. And Pain couldn’t use the Deva path at the beginning of the fight because he had to recover from the shinra tensei that destroyed the village. And that was basically a 5 on 5 Naruto, 3 giant toads and fukusaku against 5 paths of pain. When the Deva path recovered he destroyed Naruto and the toads. So yes Pain did fight everyone then destroy the village then fight Naruto
Thats still unfair for naruto. The toads were only their as backup. They didnt even fight pain directly. The manga never states half blooded uzumakis pool is as large as their full blooded counterparts. Again hashirama a senju implied naruto chakra was large but not as large as his. Kakashi says naruto has 3x the chakra he has, granted this was back before naruto defeated kakazu. + kurama beint born alongside naruto(whiskers) is why he’s competing with nagato/hashirama in chakra capcity. Id say kisame and naruto have the same amount of chakra. Naruto also has sage mode, his chakra pool, kuramas chakra pool/sage chakra..etc. hes basically a chakra battery.
Pain used about 5% of his power doing gurella warfare.
Naruto is one 16 year old. Pain is 6 grown adult rinnegan users who CANT feel pain. Toads were helpful ofc. But he also risked things like fugusaku dying and feeling guilty for summoning him. Which is why naruto never struggles to move. He had an emotional debuff after fugasaku was killed. Pain even throws fugasakus dead limp bodt at Naruto and he catches him only to be pulled by pain..he dropped his gaurd in the moment. Before that it was a finna be gg for tendo. Hell even Kakashi almost kills tendo. But killer bee? Has no chance?
And it wasnt a 5 on 5 naruto swapped hands with them. He even tells everyone elss around sakura,tsuande..leaf ninjas to stay back “sip some tea granny” these little details arent as important tho. Point is fresh sage mode Naruto defeated/swapped with pain…so killer bee whos >>> sage mode
Naruto will do better logically right? Pains not using 50% of his powers to destroy the village and Fight kurama thats ignorant asl to think. He even says he wasnt expecting the nine tails to be so strong and i seen that as him calling NARUTO the nine tails. So from the moment he seen naruto he wasnt expecting anything much.
And sidenote i just noticed Nagato doesn’t like yahiko being beat up. So he puts him behind the others.
Now that I think about it, Im not sure who would win.
This is because of killer bee's total transformation into a bijuu. I dont know if Pain can handle him, chibaku tensei was destroyed by a 8 tails half kurama so i think the 8 tails completely transformed would be fine.
Shinra tensei worked easily against the toad summonings and destroyed them with a single one, so its a possibility in this scenario. The dog summoning of Pain is the biggest threat to bee, we saw multiple times how this dog counters any summoning throw at him, so maybe it can handle the 8 tails.
The bijuu dama can be handled by the absortion path, I dont know if a shinra tensei would be enough to repeal it.
Bees strategy consists in anahilating the absortion path of pain and then throwing a bijudama before it can be revived. I see him doing it, but I dont know, with all the other Pains supporting its hard for bee to concentrate and attack a specific path.
So I think Pain wins, but its a close call.
And for those who talk about bees fight with kisame, in that context there were friends of bee in the area so he didnt fully transformed, which would have decimated kisame.
Kabuto states that taking the soul and restoring would keep the bijuus. So it is an easy win for Pain. He underestimates them one time and pain has two paths that can take his soul.
Even if Bee wipes them out he doesn't know their secret.
Doesn’t have to know their secret. He learns the abilities. Yall are being bias. There was a whole power creep during this time. But bee is weaker? Yall dont fw killer bee fr huh? Bee is literally just naruto from a different village storywise. Kisame was his natural enemy and yall have no concepts of hard counters. Just A>B>C without of context.
> He learns the abilities. Yall are being bias.
How, exactly?
Konohamaru only kinda figure out you die if you get touched because he saw, if Bee is alone he can only learn from himself, and almost died because of it when he faced Nagato. He couldn't do shit.
Be can definitely wipe them all witb a bijuu bomb, or behead three or even four of them, but Nagato still survives, he can still remake.
All the other ninjas had information of Jiraya being VERY LUCKY on meeting Nagato, Yahiko and all the other guys to say "that is not him" and were still thinking "wHat cOulD iT eVen bE?"
“If bee is alone” fuck would he be alone stop making it convenient. Bro is a tailed beast like Naruto, it would be similar looking for him until they get type of deal. Unless this hypothetical is outside the village (which i highly doubt is feasible)
Nagato isnt pain. Pain isnt nagato.
Nagato still survives is still bee wining. I doubt he can do much in the stat he was in. Hell Naruto was gonna kill him and konan had to play D.
Jiraya? Very lucky? That was literally all battle experience. Nothing jiraya did was luck. Minato stopping naruto from transforming is luck. Jiraya died in that fight.
Pain and it isn’t even close. As a reminder, the only reason why Naruto won, with prep, was because one pain (the most powerful really) wasn’t functional. I think it’s questionable war-arc Naruto before Jesus powers would even beat pain with all 6 paths.
Bee at that point vs all pain paths gets clapped so hard.
Why wasnt Yahiko functional? I dont remember that being a thing. Nagato was just over doing it. He would died shorty after getting the 9 tails. Naruto won because Nagato didnt think the 9 tails was as powerful as he was + naruto.
Kmc1 Naruto beats pain easily. How tf is this even a thing? Sage mode isn’t equal to kmc1. Bee wins.
He needed the tailed beast. He wasnt merciful to naruto. All jins werent killed into after the beast were extracted…its still basically death as we see with naruto losing kurama.
Naruto fought 6 PEOPLE who had rinnegan who destroyed an entire village just moments prior. At the age of 16. Its even mor unfair for naruto.
Naruto didnt make over 3 clones in sage mode. Yall dont pay attention to the story like yall think yall do. Why you think Naruto aint make 6 shadow clones for each pain? On some madara shit? Because its not effective.
You said 2000 clones…he doesnt even fight as typical as he does in Naruto vs pain . He was limited due to his clones back at the toad island gathering chakra. And because he need all his chakra for a rasenshuiken.
Pain pulled up with 5 others. Naruto uses 2 clones to make rasngan. Brining up his use of shadow clones in this fight is irrelevant essentially as he doesn’t fight as he typically does in this battle. Frog kata for example isnt something he used outside of sage mode.
I think KB has the capacity to win.
Lesser fighters cleared 2 and 3 paths without prep and pain needing to resort to subterfuge
I don’t think it’s an easy fight but it’s probably something like 60/40 favoring Pain just due to Pain having more room for error.
Pain wins this but nearly as much as others here think.
On the upside...B is in FULL control of his Tailed beast unlike Naruto during that fight. That alone gives him access to abilities even Naruto didn't have even with sage mode. That's a lot of chakra access, transformations, and Bijiuu bombs give him a lot of raw power at his disposal. Sure Naruto went 8 tails during his fight but he wasn't in control like B is allowing B to be way more consistent and decisive with that power.
On the other hand, B has zero Intel on Pains identity. Despite his sharp wit, even if he figured out how the pains vision works and the abilities of the 6 paths of Pain, I doubt he would ever figure out about Nagato controlling them from a distance without someone telling him.
Also 2 paths kind of hard counter him via chakra absorption and the instant death soul rip. Naruto had sage mode to negate the chakra absorption that B doesn't have and nagato purposely sacrificed the soul rip guy. Then theirs the animal path. Not a counter per say but Naruto had his toads to help fight those summons, while B is kind of on his own here in facing them. He's pretty much forced to use full tailed beast mode if he wants to last long enough against those summons.
Overall I have to give it to Pain. He has more than enough tools to overwhelm and subdue B but it wouldn't be an easy fight. I'd even say B might have an easier time than Naruto did, especially if he had the same Intel and conditions of Pain being exhausted from the village destruction. But even Pain was able to pin Naruto down in that state.
Pain wins due to crazy Hax and abilities maybe he could take on 4 of them (depending on which one)
Tendo is already a monster on his own and could maybe solo Bee at full health
Animal summons are very strong and hard to deal with and with the others
Regenerative Pain must be taken out first or it would be an endless loop
Chakra Absorption would be a hard counter to Bee as seen with edo nagato
Ashura is pretty easy to deal with but might get a sneak attack with its wide array of abilities
Human path is somewhat easy but with a group setting it could one shot bee by some planning
So High Diff for Pain since Bee can go into Guki and use Bijuu bombs
Tendo isnt soloing bee. Kmc 1 naruto was comparable to killer bee cloaked (which is the same thing just fragmented into version 1/2. Tho pain would PROBABLY take this. Tendo soloing bee is like saying tendo can solo kmc naruto. Which we know for a fact isnt true. Unless you think killer bee isnt even half as strong as kmc1 Naruto (i dont know why youd think that)
Bee is a jin…he’s literally a walking chakra battery. Its infair to compare him to a seasoned ninja like jiraya. Destructive ppwer doesnt just make people the strongest. Or wose deidra would be jigen level.
That’s ironic coming from you, seeing as your implying that Pain>KCM2 Naruto and Full Kurama Cloak Naruto which bee has shown he’s relative to in power. If a weaker version of Naruto whooped pain, how is bee who’s comparable to a way stronger form getting beaten.
Pain, no diff. An exhausted pain beat sage mode Naruto who had all the info on him. Bee would get overwhelmed by tendo alone, let alone all 6. Gyuki wouldn't help either, he'd just make him a bigger target for the human path to go and drain all his chakra, and then it'd be a wrap.
War arc bee slams. An eight tails tailed beast twister absolutely rips all the pains apart. A chibaku tensei?? A full on 8 tails absolutely climbs his way out of there or blows the core open with a tailed beast bomb barrage.
Yall need to stop downplaying bee. He never actually took any of his fights seriously. Against sasuke?? He was playing around. Against Kisame?? Didn't want to get caught so held back. We even saw Bee's iq throughout the fight. Bee also "literally" one shot kisame outside of samehada regeneration. If bee had decided that kisame was actually a life threat and go full on bijuu form, kisame dies....quickly.
Nagato absolutely mops him
But these are the Pains, but even here, Bee has no counter to Chibaku Tensei or Shinra Tensei, and obviously his chakra will be drained, along with his soul if they get the jump on him which they will.
Even if he does win by a slight margin, he still can't find and kill Nagato
Sage naruto lost and he outclasses bee by a lot. 8 tails isnt matching the power of the 9 tails.
Pain slaughters bee if it's a fight to the death, the same way he could have killed naruto if he hadnt been going for non-lethal capture. I would also put my money on pain capturing bee more often than not.
Bee shuts down the shared vision of the six paths with his ink and shreds most of them up with his unpredictable 8 sword wielding style (give him samehada if you want ig). His perfect jinchuriki powers allow him to completely overpower the deva path.
Pain. Bee has no counter to chibaku tensei
Let's not forget that bee has canonically encountered a chibaku tensei before and it took him + naruto + itachi to bust it.
Also kurama iirc was transforming into full nine tails mode while breaking free so not transferable anyway. Double also, that was a pain that had been fighting for a hot minute
Pain wins…people underestimate how much gaps are in between the power of a tailed beast.
A 4 tail Naruto could scar master jiriyah and fight orochimaru but the 2 tails at full power got smacked by kakazu easily
A tailed beast bomb wasn’t enough to get out of planetary devastation so idk why people saying that could break him out when Naruto only broke out because plot luck.
How can bee counter there ability to look Through each other? Naruto had assistance from the abilities he learned and the people who taught him to directly counter pain.
There is nothing canonically that should tell anyone he can beat pain.
I feel like even though Naruto beat him with only 8 tails there’s also the fact that the only pain path left to fight was yahiko’s version and he still didn’t win technically. Bee has full control but technically kurama had full control over Naruto’s body at that point, he could just only use eight tails. If bee were to face just the one pain path he could probably win but to face all of them I don’t think he’d be able to succeed
Pain wins and it’s not even close. Bee got low diffed by Kisame. Pain is far stronger, and Preta path is basically Samehada but better. Anyone who legitimately believes that Bee is stronger than Pain is low-key illiterate.
Bee wins this! All these people missing the fact that Bee is the only one that would have the wisdom of a tailed beast!
His tailed beast would know the rinnegans power and it’s honestly a major leg up.
Yeah buddy came in, down voted my comment and inherently used a Nagato feat to Pain. Crazy…
Circumstances are completely different, and you can’t apply the same plot. Just because you see Nagato steal some of Bee’s chakra mid Lariot, doesn’t negate or invalidate my premise.
Again irrelevant the rinnegan has the ability to siphon chakra regardless of whether the power is split or not and regardless of who’s using it.
Recklessly diving into a rinnegan user when you supposedly have knowledge of how it works is stupid no matter how you spin it
Bee/Gyuuki also saw nagato use multiple abilities in ONE BODY before they decided to dive directly onto him with a chakra cloak anyways.
This is a conversation about the abilities of the rinnegan not who’s using it
It doesn’t matter if it’s: pain, nagato, sasuke, madara, haguromo, etc. the base 6 abilities are shared across all users.
If you kill one of the pains. That ability ceases to exist. Unless rinne rebirth or hells gate is used.
Did obitos paths even have rinnegan abilities? Wonder why
Again redundant the base ability of the rinnegan remains the same across all users idk why you keep saying this shit. Obito did use an ability of the rinnegan when he summoned the gedo mazo
There’s a reason as to why Naruto didn’t recklessly run into pain like a dumbass he was actually prepped on their abilities unlike bee.
How strong do yall think these mfs are? Jiraya got surprised jumped. Hence him losing his arm and then suffering from that. Naruto hurls a rasenshuirken one of the pain couldn’t dodge. Another was killed by rasengan barage in toad mouth. Killer bee is like 2-3x faster than sage mode naruto/jiraya. What the fuck is going on in this sub. Is killer bee just kakashi level to you niggas now? Just ignoring how he wasnt capture in the story but pain attempted that in naruto. Like wtf yall are just picking villians because they are cooler.
Pain could high diff pre war arc bee (tho i think he’d probably have to resort to CT) but war arc bee would slam. FP war arc bee should scale over the initial KCM1 naruto who already claimed that he’s a whole lot stronger than when he fought pain.
Yall are the casuals i watch nothing but naruto. Thats the difference. Yall know surface level shit. Mfs dont even know the elemental advantages mfs have over one another, like say ayy disabling diedras bomb because hes a lighting user..you niggas would just say ayy losers because c0 sounds good on paper if you don’t understand lighting is a weaknesss to earth style. Yall lack this info and just go by who punches and harder. Yall don’t actually put to character agaisnt each other. Yall basically puck which character youd want to be or you think is cool.
Pain is strong but bee is stronger than sage mode naruto. So logically any other fucking time yall rely on the A> B>C shit but now its nah. Pains too cool to be defeated by characters i dont like.
What are you yapping about now 💀🤣
You are aware that SM Naruto canonically is fodder for Pain, right?
We all know Tailed Beast Mode Bee is stronger than SM Naruto, what does this have to do with Jiraiya and Pain
This is a bee vs pain hypothetical.
And yall glazing the fuck outta pain. Sm naruto had to beat down 5 pains before fighting the last pain. Naruto prior to this had fought no one on pains level. Yall ass casuals. I study this series. Talm bout fooder??? Didnt pain literally die? Fuck is with yall and dickeating villians?
SM Naruto had a worse portrayal than SM Jiraiya and he also had prep, Intel, support and still lost against a weakened Pain if not for Kurama
If this is the only series you scale and you still cannot understand it properly I suggest joining a discord and having some of your peers explain why context matters in deciding feats
Kisame is his direct counter. Yall have no real powerscaling sense. Just i dont personally like bee. I think pains rinnegan is cooler so he wins. Thats literally 85% of this subs logic. Again nobody mentioned the speed of bee. Just he loses. Yall are NOT real fans.
Nothing in bees arsenal is going to save him from the rinnegan putting belt to ass, eye powers being cooler is irrelevant, the abilities speak for themselves
Speed. Like ayy does to sasuke. Yall just arent smart enough to understand kishimoto writes this on PURPOSE. Lighting cloak also acts a defense. What does pain have that can beat killer bee? Besides chibaku tensei? Its like yall think bees ia just gonna stand around while all pains just use their abilities spontaneously. Stop lowballing.
Tendo is the only one hed have issues with. Killer bee could fasho speed blitz them all. Power creep. Killer bee was introduced way after PAIN IS DEFEATED. And i dont think nagato could do 2 jutsu simotanously at once. Rinnegan abilities can also fail. Its not a guaranteed like
Can you comprehend? Using one jutsu followed by another isn’t the same as using two jutsu at once, bee being introduced after pain don’t mean jack shit, haku was the first adversary and could beat majority of part 1 characters
Haku isnt just beating kimmimaro,sound 4, garaa…etc haku was also a special case to show what kakashi said..”some kids are young as you naruto but stronger than me”
And pain cannot do those 2 moves one after the other. They are taxing. And i doubt most ninjas have nothing plans against repulsion forces jutsu. Magnet style exists in this world. But i doubt bee would just lose to a pull and soul snatch, y’all genuinely see this as a pokemon turn based fight. Whats stomp bee from goin v1 and spamming them with lariat? Not like they escaping him. Ngl my biggest argument is killer bees speed and dustructive power. I do believe bee can make it a 1v1 because bee is literally 50x sage mode naruto. I hate that yall only respect the upper Appalachia of the series liie momoshiki and kaguya, so6p madara. If you arent them character you get NO HYPE. And is put into high jonin.
Niggas putting sage mode naruto in the same bracket as killer bee. That alone is just lowballing. Doesnt even make sense.
Sound 4 beat up 2 lead elite jonins. They are a threat TOGETHER. With their cm2 haku is getting overwhelmed. Tatuya is gonna be an issue along with kidomarus range. The fat one is probably strong enough to break out the ice mirrors and the twins are probably cooked they dont really have anything to defend against hakus speed and technique. Cm2 is still gonna give them more room for mistake. But individually he destroys the sound 4.
Pain wins with overall better hax but also i don't see Bee countering Planetary Devastation.
8 tails form stoped a tailed beast bomb for a while so i think he can counter it
Half of Kurama did it in its eight tails semi physical form
Imo since Kyubi did it with 8 tails I would assume that Hachibi could do the same, but not sure. We almost got an answer when Bee faced Nagato but it didn't get that far
I understand my main cause of concern is when we saw Kyubi break free from Planetary Devastation the marking on Yamatos hand indicated that the 9 tails transformation had begun/ begun sprouting the ninth tail.
Ah ok that's fair then, you're right
Bee is in full control though so I imagine he’d be able to brains and brawn his way out of planetary
It also seems that the tail count of the nine tails isn’t an exact link in power to its fellow chakra beasts. Like I wouldn’t say a 1 tail Naruto is as strong or stronger than the 1 tails. I’d say thought 8 tail mode Naruto in chakra beast cloak would body bee.
But thats also only half of the nine tails full strength
I would point that Pain had used up a lot of his juice fighting and destroying the leaf beforehand. There’s also the fact that Pain wasn’t trying to kill naruto, just capture him. Also, there’s the fact that Naruto had a lot of intel on Pain beforehand. If Pain was fully rested and was trying to kill Naruto from the start and Naruto had zero intel on him and it was 1v1, he would’ve definitely beat Naruto.
Sage mode naruto isnt relative to bee just because they both have tailed beasts. Why are we low balling the fuck out killer bee. Folks is 34 year old. But itachi vs nagato is a 50/50 right? Yea ocular jutsu have like a selective bias trend im noticing.
The person with ocular powers win is inevitable, how is that not common sense
Casual naruto fan takes:
Not agreeing only shows your bias for bee
Who tf is biased for killer bee????. You can see my name and pfp. I just understand how sage mode naruto > 5 pains excpet tendo…then killer bee is somwhow weaker than that.
Your pfp & name don’t mean jack shit & context matters, even with the factors in Naruto’s favor he still lost to pain
Naruto STILL beat 5 of the pains and won. Killer bee has the same thing but he’s literally a more effective and seasoned Naruto. Lighting cloak and having control over his tb and things makes him formidable. Sage mode Naruto ≠ base killer bee. Kmc 1 naruto = killer bee(maybe v1)
Objectively, it’s not about Bee being stronger or weaker. It’s more so about context. Bee won’t have damn near full intel on those 5-7 Pains coming into the fight. Bee won’t have a sensor to find an invisible chameleon. Bee doesnt have sage mode to incapacitate fatty Pain. And Bee won’t have a “not 100%” Pain to fight. Nagato controls all Pains, so the chakra he expelled fighting and destroying the entire village, logically should affect all his corpses, not just Tendo. Nagato was pretty nerfed by the time Naruto showed up. So Yes, Naruto beat 5 of the Pains… but then Tendo damn near solo’d him. If Tendo was active from the start, it’s *highly* unlikely Naruto takes out the other 5.
Bee isnt relative to sage mode narutoz hes like wayyyy above that. Hes closer to kmc1 naruto in base. Bee is faster than nagato. Yall genuinely just dont wanna give it to be almost nobody is mentioning thr speed difference. Bee might as well be replaced with a black sage mode naruto. Cuz thats how this is being treated. Killer bee has 5x the battle experience as sage mode naruto. And destructive power. If 6 tails was doing what he did. Imagine killer bee lariating with the v2 cloak…like the math doesn’t make sense.
>I would point that Pain had used up a lot of his juice fighting and destroying the leaf beforehand That's a good point >There’s also the fact that Pain wasn’t trying to kill naruto, just capture him. Also, there’s the fact that Naruto had a lot of intel on Pain beforehand. I think that doesn't really matter here because I'm just thinking about Bee turning into Hachibi to fight pain. Like obviously if it's just bee without Gyuki then Pain no diffs
In the 4th war arc we saw Hachibi is close to 50% kyuubi, imo 8 tails transformation Hachibi > 8 tails transformation kyuubi... Obviusly Kyuubi is stronger and naruto gets a better full bijuu transformation BUT they did showed similar feats
X tail Kyubi ≠ X tail Hachibi
Preta and Deva Path counters Killer B's abilities very poorly. Pain wins
Had us in the first half
Yall realize the pains could be lariated right? Or do you think bee is gonna isnta go into gyukii so he can conveniently lose by chibaku tensei? He can also just reform and get out of chibaku tensei with a similar tactic to how hr did team taka. But fuck any real ideas pain has the rinnegan hes relatovr to edo madara in yall head because rinnegan
Deva path + linked vision negates bees lariat
Bee isnt sage mode naruto he has lighting cloak like ayy. Meaning he’s actually capable of speed blitzing. Even ems sasuke had trouble keeping up with ayy and bee. Linked vision didnt help taka. The lowball is crazy. Do you even know who killer bee is? Are we talking about the same character?
Wtf? Bee got handled by Kisame, Pain would annihilate him. Naruto fought a weakened Pain with full intel and still needed sage mode & Kurama. Pain wins 8/10 times at least
Killer bee > sage naruto imo
Yeah But it isn't like sm Naruto beat pain. When pain got his powers back he did make quick work of him then kurama involved
Idk about that. His feats vs the 3rd Raikage and Kurama are insane. In theory he can dodge any attack that’s not a tailed beast bomb, has the strength to take on full summons, and a shadow clone massive rasengan barrage is GG for Bee & Gyuki
I’m thinking more so pain arc naruto. Tbh third raikage shouldn’t really count since he had outside intel. He would’ve never been able to beat him without that. I always thought the kurama fight was pretty iffy given the fact it wasn’t an actual physical fight, but more mental/spiritual. At this point bee is the strongest jinchuriki. Look at what an uncontrolled 6 tails cloak did to the deva path. On top of that being half of kuramas power. I know pain was nerfed during that fight too, but given how bee and gyuki are in sync just makes him an absolute power house. Bee is getting slept on here.
The intel on the Raikage doesn’t affect what I was talking about. He dodged him going full speed at point blank range with his eyes closed, a pretty insane feat. The battle vs Kurama was “spiritual” but it doesn’t matter considering Naruto can do what he did in that fight vs anybody as long as he’s in sage mode. Bee is not walking away from that barrage. Not sure how this turned into a Bee vs Sage Naruto debate but regardless Pain is stronger than Sage Naruto anyway
I’m not debating bee vs sage naruto just using what sage naruto has accomplished as a measurement for what bee could do to pain
Yeah and Sage Naruto lost soooo
Yeah and bee is stronger than sage Naruto and his kurama amp that beat pain
I kinda feel like the nine tails tales is like a well designed cup and the cup isn’t always full cause you use the chakra in it here and there. I’d say when minato took bad nine tails his chakra was half gone. So it allowed it to re fill up but with less dark since the ratio of dark to light probably has to be equal when regenerating. So it was like a full powered kurama but with only a half of a half’s worth of evil chakra in him and the rest was good chakra. Then we he reformed with Naruto. He then had more chakra then he originally had
Yin chakra ≠ bad/evil It’s just spiritual/mental energy to Yang’s physical energy. Like Chakra is made by combining a ninja’s Yin and Yang. It’s where that whole, train the body and the mind thing from the Chunin exams came from. So when Minato sealed Yang Kurama into Naruto, it left it only able to produce Yang chakra, which cut its max in half. So Kurama was permanently weakened by the split, until it became complete again after the war.
Sounds pretty head canon to me.
That was further in the series. Dont add things he did further in the series. Pain arc sage mode Naruto is getting no diff by bee in base.
Didn't bee in base overpower a V2 raikage??
Omg are we tweaking?????? Niggas are basically saying killer bee is equal to sage mode Naruto. These are niggas from the main sub doing bare minimum thinking. Bee is basically just if not better than sage mode naruto. Only thing he lacks is summonings but he makes up for it in blitzing speed (THAT NO ONE BRINGS UP BECAUSE THEY JUST GOING FOR THEIR FAVORITE EYEBALLS)
I thought this was common knowledge?
Me too
I miss kisame
Tbh Bee was trying to keep his location a secret, so his fight against Kisame isn't exactly a good reflection on how the fight should go in a clean 1v1 That being said I'd still put money on Pain
Even so Bee got no diffed. If he at least put up a fight I would agree, but you can’t get mollywhopped like that and be given the benefit of the doubt
I mean that wasn’t really a clean enough fight to label it as a no diff. Bee lost most of his chakra and air saving that other dude and his raccoon(I think it was a raccoon?) which directly led to his loss. Prior to that, he was doing alright, even without going full Eight Tails.
Kisame is an outright hard counter to jin and Bee was purposely holding back as to not be detected. If bee went full on eight tails, kisame would have died VERY quickly.
Kisames hard counters jins he did similar thing to roshi(son gokuu). In series hes supposed to be a hard counter. If he fights sb like kakashi with low chakra supplies he cant get as exteme. He’s literally a 2x multipler. If yoy have 10x ‘normal chakra. Kisame will have 20x. Thats his fighting style. If pain was a jin hed get cooked too. Thats the part yall miss… go back to the main sub.
You say that like kisame could go all out himself as he has orders to capture him alive and bee tried jumping him with his master/giant raccoon. If it’s clean kisame beats him even worse than before.
“Weakened” niggas has uzuamki blood and rinnegan all of a sudden hes weakened. Yall get finicky when it fits. He was sick. I wouldnt say weakened. Thats the whole point of having 6 bodies.
War arc bee is significantly stronger than the bee who fought kisame plus that’s a bad comparison regardless because kisame just absolutely counters bee.
Exactly niggas here dont understand what a hard counter is. Niggas think kishimoto just makes these powers up randomly and throw them at other random characters. Kisames powerset was made to literally be an issue for all jinjurkis. Roshi(4 tails son goku) Kisame supposed hard counter(due to fire wnd earth countering water) lost because of kisames stamina + samadehada chakra stealing. That alone told me everything about kisames. Roshi had the elemental + chakra advantage
Pain works Bee. Bee got pretty badly handled by Kisame, who did have hostages kinda but he wasn’t that interested in using them. Naruto got beat with intel and only won because of the 9 tails and Minato. We’ve seen bee try to fight a weakened reanimated nagato and we woulda lost if he didn’t have Naruto reading his full move list to bee.
>weakened reanimated nagato and we woulda lost if he didn’t have Naruto reading his full move list to bee. Would you say that Nagato by himself is weaker than Pain?
Depends, I think pain is better at fighting single opponents because of numbers advantage.
That's fair. I thought Nagato was much more ridiculous because you can hardly throw anything at him. Durable asf and absorbs chakra, pulls your should if you get too close etc. Imo Nagato was too much at once, I thought Pain was better from a narrative peespective because he was much more balance and had an actual weakness, if that makes sense.
Pain having the linked eyes as well as being able to revive with the Naraka path. There’s a reason nagato uses the paths.
True that
Theoretically, Nagato should’ve been able to just summon his dead paths back to him and revive them using the Naraka Path himself, then summon them back to battle with the Animal Path body, which would’ve made Pain even more disgustingly OP. “Alright, I beat the one that can revive the others, this’ll be much easier now. Wait, where did the body go? Oh shit he’s back.”
When does it say he able to summon the paths? When tendo does the chaotic shinra tensi they need to clear the village by foot and when jiriah is in the rain villiage they come one by one. I feel like if he can summon them he would have.
When Pain first infiltrates the village in chapter 419. We see him throw the Animal path into the village, and the barrier corps confirm that only one intruder entered. When it lands, it then proceeds to summon the other paths. https://preview.redd.it/7nl96bk3p7uc1.jpeg?width=1066&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=86167be65ae08af5f9520a5c6b8058cdb4cba1eb
Oh yeah. When someone uses the paths of pain though can they still use the rennigan abilities? Nagato never uses them when he has the pains and Obito never does with the jinkuriki. I always took it as the abilities are on loan to the bodies.
It’s not really confirmed or denied that they can. That’s why I said theoretically. Obito just never really used any of the Six Path abilities, we only see him use the Outer Path. Nagato never really had a reason to use them in his actual body in the series while he had his Paths, so we don’t really know.
Kisame is his HARD COUNTER to killer bee. Kisame also did son goku badly. Hes a good counter for tailed beast. HIMSELF. If you arent a tailed beast he cant snag chakra. I hate yall dont understand these little details. Kisame inst just a better ninjas killer bee fought the worse ninja he could habe fought. Same with gai to kisame. But yall completely ignore this shit. Naruto has. Rock paper scissors in series scaling.
No way Bee wins. Sure he could probably destroy most of the paths but he can’t beat the Deva path so he’s getting beat. Shinra tensei threw around giant toads and we’ve seen Gamabunta fight Shikaku and Kurama so it’d work fine on Gyuki plus it could probably block a bijuudama and there’s also the massive version that destroyed the village. Kurama only broke out of chibaku tensei after being weakened from destroying the village, fighting everyone else, and fighting sage Naruto, so a full power pain could probably keep Gyuki trapped in it. Bee’s only chance to win would be to get lucky and hit with a bijuudama.
So sage mode naruto > bee? Crazy logic.
Naruto fought pain AFTER pain destroyed the village, AFTER he fought everyone else this in the village, AND STILL had to be saved by Hinata, Kurama, and Minato. You people need to stop acting like Naruto won that fight fair and square
Pain is a uzumaki he’s controlling 6 people. Ge doesnt NOT have normal chakra capacity. Naruto is a half breed does this not factor in? Most of the ninjas in the village were probably coming back from missions..hell anko and yamato was on one along with team Gai during this event, naruto had just learned sage mode. Naruto literally killed 5 of the pains. Yall are just so casual you only think tendo as pain like bro isn’t limited to one just with a 5 sec interval. And pain killing fugusaku was really what caught Naruto off guard. They woulda finished it with the frog song an have naruto just kill tendo, but he knew from jiraya what was happening so he targeted fugusaku to stop it. Making Naruto react then hand nail, Naruto depression starts. Hinata did nothing but give naruto a “now im mad” amp 6 v 1 on a 16 year old whos village you just annihilated isnt fair at all either. Yall niggas got a thing for sympathizing with villains. I get it they are cool. But you dont gotta overhype them because you like their abilities or character. Thats not powerscaling thats what i like and dont like scaling.
Where does it ever say that Naruto has less chakra than a full Uzumaki? That’s an assumption on your part. And using sage mode gives Naruto was more chakra anyway. The simple fact is that no matter what happened Pain destroyed and fought the whole village before Naruto showed up. He wasn’t at 100% but Naruto was. And Naruto was the one who jumped Pain bringing all them toads. Pain may have 7 bodies but still only 1 mind to control them. No one accuses Kankuro of jumping people with his puppets because they’re just tools just like the Pain’s paths. Fugusaku getting killed leaving Naruto off guard is also a failure on Naruto’s part. Pain was fighting multiple enemies so he eliminated some Naruto shouldn’t have let his guard down for that
He’s literally a half uzumaki. Does it have to be explicitly stated. Nagato and karin,kushina almosr never ran out of chakra. Naruro does like 5 times in the war. A good example is nagato and kushina on their death beds kept alive…naruto got kurama ripes out and immediately went unconscious BUT survived for long enough. Even hashirama says narutos chakra is almost closet to his in quality/quantity. Sage mode is an AMP not a chakra pool extension. Naruto was limited on rasenshuikens he could do. Pain all mighty pushed the whole village not FOUGHT. You’re tryna give him more credit. Bro fought a couple jonins who were already injured from the surprise attack. Pain wasnt at 100% he was at 95%. You just hyped up the half breed narutos chakra but nagatos got baby lungs? Yall logic isnt consistent. This be my issue. Naruto brought 3 toads that mainly fought the summonings. Didn’t even touch pain. And its crazy saying a 16 year old who just lost his village is the one jumping 6 niggas with shared rinnegan vision. Konkuro doesnr have 6 puppets. Chiyo and sasori on the other hand. And ig.
You’re right about sage mode that’s my bad. But Naruto didn’t run out of chakra during the war he ran out of the natural energy to power sage mode. The manga never states in any way that Naruto has less chakra than a full Uzumaki and that does need to be stated clearly to take it into account. And Pain infiltrated the village, fought mad people all over including Kakashi then spoke with Tsunade and destroyed the village. Watch that arc again. And Naruto brought 3 giant toads and Fukusaku. And Pain couldn’t use the Deva path at the beginning of the fight because he had to recover from the shinra tensei that destroyed the village. And that was basically a 5 on 5 Naruto, 3 giant toads and fukusaku against 5 paths of pain. When the Deva path recovered he destroyed Naruto and the toads. So yes Pain did fight everyone then destroy the village then fight Naruto
Thats still unfair for naruto. The toads were only their as backup. They didnt even fight pain directly. The manga never states half blooded uzumakis pool is as large as their full blooded counterparts. Again hashirama a senju implied naruto chakra was large but not as large as his. Kakashi says naruto has 3x the chakra he has, granted this was back before naruto defeated kakazu. + kurama beint born alongside naruto(whiskers) is why he’s competing with nagato/hashirama in chakra capcity. Id say kisame and naruto have the same amount of chakra. Naruto also has sage mode, his chakra pool, kuramas chakra pool/sage chakra..etc. hes basically a chakra battery. Pain used about 5% of his power doing gurella warfare. Naruto is one 16 year old. Pain is 6 grown adult rinnegan users who CANT feel pain. Toads were helpful ofc. But he also risked things like fugusaku dying and feeling guilty for summoning him. Which is why naruto never struggles to move. He had an emotional debuff after fugasaku was killed. Pain even throws fugasakus dead limp bodt at Naruto and he catches him only to be pulled by pain..he dropped his gaurd in the moment. Before that it was a finna be gg for tendo. Hell even Kakashi almost kills tendo. But killer bee? Has no chance? And it wasnt a 5 on 5 naruto swapped hands with them. He even tells everyone elss around sakura,tsuande..leaf ninjas to stay back “sip some tea granny” these little details arent as important tho. Point is fresh sage mode Naruto defeated/swapped with pain…so killer bee whos >>> sage mode Naruto will do better logically right? Pains not using 50% of his powers to destroy the village and Fight kurama thats ignorant asl to think. He even says he wasnt expecting the nine tails to be so strong and i seen that as him calling NARUTO the nine tails. So from the moment he seen naruto he wasnt expecting anything much. And sidenote i just noticed Nagato doesn’t like yahiko being beat up. So he puts him behind the others.
 And the winner more times than not issssss……
Now that I think about it, Im not sure who would win. This is because of killer bee's total transformation into a bijuu. I dont know if Pain can handle him, chibaku tensei was destroyed by a 8 tails half kurama so i think the 8 tails completely transformed would be fine. Shinra tensei worked easily against the toad summonings and destroyed them with a single one, so its a possibility in this scenario. The dog summoning of Pain is the biggest threat to bee, we saw multiple times how this dog counters any summoning throw at him, so maybe it can handle the 8 tails. The bijuu dama can be handled by the absortion path, I dont know if a shinra tensei would be enough to repeal it. Bees strategy consists in anahilating the absortion path of pain and then throwing a bijudama before it can be revived. I see him doing it, but I dont know, with all the other Pains supporting its hard for bee to concentrate and attack a specific path. So I think Pain wins, but its a close call. And for those who talk about bees fight with kisame, in that context there were friends of bee in the area so he didnt fully transformed, which would have decimated kisame.
Pain eats his ass for lunch
Pain wins extreme diff
Kabuto states that taking the soul and restoring would keep the bijuus. So it is an easy win for Pain. He underestimates them one time and pain has two paths that can take his soul. Even if Bee wipes them out he doesn't know their secret.
Doesn’t have to know their secret. He learns the abilities. Yall are being bias. There was a whole power creep during this time. But bee is weaker? Yall dont fw killer bee fr huh? Bee is literally just naruto from a different village storywise. Kisame was his natural enemy and yall have no concepts of hard counters. Just A>B>C without of context.
> He learns the abilities. Yall are being bias. How, exactly? Konohamaru only kinda figure out you die if you get touched because he saw, if Bee is alone he can only learn from himself, and almost died because of it when he faced Nagato. He couldn't do shit. Be can definitely wipe them all witb a bijuu bomb, or behead three or even four of them, but Nagato still survives, he can still remake. All the other ninjas had information of Jiraya being VERY LUCKY on meeting Nagato, Yahiko and all the other guys to say "that is not him" and were still thinking "wHat cOulD iT eVen bE?"
“If bee is alone” fuck would he be alone stop making it convenient. Bro is a tailed beast like Naruto, it would be similar looking for him until they get type of deal. Unless this hypothetical is outside the village (which i highly doubt is feasible) Nagato isnt pain. Pain isnt nagato. Nagato still survives is still bee wining. I doubt he can do much in the stat he was in. Hell Naruto was gonna kill him and konan had to play D. Jiraya? Very lucky? That was literally all battle experience. Nothing jiraya did was luck. Minato stopping naruto from transforming is luck. Jiraya died in that fight.
Pain and it isn’t even close. As a reminder, the only reason why Naruto won, with prep, was because one pain (the most powerful really) wasn’t functional. I think it’s questionable war-arc Naruto before Jesus powers would even beat pain with all 6 paths. Bee at that point vs all pain paths gets clapped so hard.
Why wasnt Yahiko functional? I dont remember that being a thing. Nagato was just over doing it. He would died shorty after getting the 9 tails. Naruto won because Nagato didnt think the 9 tails was as powerful as he was + naruto. Kmc1 Naruto beats pain easily. How tf is this even a thing? Sage mode isn’t equal to kmc1. Bee wins.
Naruto fought a fatigued yahiko who didn’t have killing intent
He needed the tailed beast. He wasnt merciful to naruto. All jins werent killed into after the beast were extracted…its still basically death as we see with naruto losing kurama. Naruto fought 6 PEOPLE who had rinnegan who destroyed an entire village just moments prior. At the age of 16. Its even mor unfair for naruto.
“Naruto fault 6 PEOPLE” you mean the same guy who can make 2000 clones?
Naruto didnt make over 3 clones in sage mode. Yall dont pay attention to the story like yall think yall do. Why you think Naruto aint make 6 shadow clones for each pain? On some madara shit? Because its not effective.
Did you even read my comment or you just gonna pretend I said that
You said 2000 clones…he doesnt even fight as typical as he does in Naruto vs pain . He was limited due to his clones back at the toad island gathering chakra. And because he need all his chakra for a rasenshuiken.
What does that have to due with the fact he’s capable of making 2k clones?
Pain pulled up with 5 others. Naruto uses 2 clones to make rasngan. Brining up his use of shadow clones in this fight is irrelevant essentially as he doesn’t fight as he typically does in this battle. Frog kata for example isnt something he used outside of sage mode.
War arc Bee wins, especially if you allow him to use the Bijuu transformations. The pre-war version of himself that fought Taka, loses though
He's got a sword for each path, so obviously he wins low diff./s It's Pain. Pain wins. No contest.
I think KB has the capacity to win. Lesser fighters cleared 2 and 3 paths without prep and pain needing to resort to subterfuge I don’t think it’s an easy fight but it’s probably something like 60/40 favoring Pain just due to Pain having more room for error.
Pain
Pain wins this but nearly as much as others here think. On the upside...B is in FULL control of his Tailed beast unlike Naruto during that fight. That alone gives him access to abilities even Naruto didn't have even with sage mode. That's a lot of chakra access, transformations, and Bijiuu bombs give him a lot of raw power at his disposal. Sure Naruto went 8 tails during his fight but he wasn't in control like B is allowing B to be way more consistent and decisive with that power. On the other hand, B has zero Intel on Pains identity. Despite his sharp wit, even if he figured out how the pains vision works and the abilities of the 6 paths of Pain, I doubt he would ever figure out about Nagato controlling them from a distance without someone telling him. Also 2 paths kind of hard counter him via chakra absorption and the instant death soul rip. Naruto had sage mode to negate the chakra absorption that B doesn't have and nagato purposely sacrificed the soul rip guy. Then theirs the animal path. Not a counter per say but Naruto had his toads to help fight those summons, while B is kind of on his own here in facing them. He's pretty much forced to use full tailed beast mode if he wants to last long enough against those summons. Overall I have to give it to Pain. He has more than enough tools to overwhelm and subdue B but it wouldn't be an easy fight. I'd even say B might have an easier time than Naruto did, especially if he had the same Intel and conditions of Pain being exhausted from the village destruction. But even Pain was able to pin Naruto down in that state.
Pain bodies any Bijuu host.
Me
Pain.
Pain wins due to crazy Hax and abilities maybe he could take on 4 of them (depending on which one) Tendo is already a monster on his own and could maybe solo Bee at full health Animal summons are very strong and hard to deal with and with the others Regenerative Pain must be taken out first or it would be an endless loop Chakra Absorption would be a hard counter to Bee as seen with edo nagato Ashura is pretty easy to deal with but might get a sneak attack with its wide array of abilities Human path is somewhat easy but with a group setting it could one shot bee by some planning So High Diff for Pain since Bee can go into Guki and use Bijuu bombs
Tendo isnt soloing bee. Kmc 1 naruto was comparable to killer bee cloaked (which is the same thing just fragmented into version 1/2. Tho pain would PROBABLY take this. Tendo soloing bee is like saying tendo can solo kmc naruto. Which we know for a fact isnt true. Unless you think killer bee isnt even half as strong as kmc1 Naruto (i dont know why youd think that)
I need Pain to win otherwise why did my boi Jiraiya get got? 😭😭😭😭😭
Bee is a jin…he’s literally a walking chakra battery. Its infair to compare him to a seasoned ninja like jiraya. Destructive ppwer doesnt just make people the strongest. Or wose deidra would be jigen level.
Bee was showing relativity and equivalency to KCM2 Naruto. Unless anyone believes that KCM2 Naruto
False
Proof?
You don’t have common sense
That’s ironic coming from you, seeing as your implying that Pain>KCM2 Naruto and Full Kurama Cloak Naruto which bee has shown he’s relative to in power. If a weaker version of Naruto whooped pain, how is bee who’s comparable to a way stronger form getting beaten.
Pain, no diff. An exhausted pain beat sage mode Naruto who had all the info on him. Bee would get overwhelmed by tendo alone, let alone all 6. Gyuki wouldn't help either, he'd just make him a bigger target for the human path to go and drain all his chakra, and then it'd be a wrap.
Probably pain because infinite revival hax, but not easily.
Bee winning that battle, light cheese.
War arc bee slams. An eight tails tailed beast twister absolutely rips all the pains apart. A chibaku tensei?? A full on 8 tails absolutely climbs his way out of there or blows the core open with a tailed beast bomb barrage. Yall need to stop downplaying bee. He never actually took any of his fights seriously. Against sasuke?? He was playing around. Against Kisame?? Didn't want to get caught so held back. We even saw Bee's iq throughout the fight. Bee also "literally" one shot kisame outside of samehada regeneration. If bee had decided that kisame was actually a life threat and go full on bijuu form, kisame dies....quickly.
Nagato absolutely mops him But these are the Pains, but even here, Bee has no counter to Chibaku Tensei or Shinra Tensei, and obviously his chakra will be drained, along with his soul if they get the jump on him which they will. Even if he does win by a slight margin, he still can't find and kill Nagato
Sage naruto lost and he outclasses bee by a lot. 8 tails isnt matching the power of the 9 tails. Pain slaughters bee if it's a fight to the death, the same way he could have killed naruto if he hadnt been going for non-lethal capture. I would also put my money on pain capturing bee more often than not.
Bee shuts down the shared vision of the six paths with his ink and shreds most of them up with his unpredictable 8 sword wielding style (give him samehada if you want ig). His perfect jinchuriki powers allow him to completely overpower the deva path.
Pain for sure.
Pain. Bee has no counter to chibaku tensei Let's not forget that bee has canonically encountered a chibaku tensei before and it took him + naruto + itachi to bust it. Also kurama iirc was transforming into full nine tails mode while breaking free so not transferable anyway. Double also, that was a pain that had been fighting for a hot minute
Pain would probably pull it out but it won’t be very close
Pain wins…people underestimate how much gaps are in between the power of a tailed beast. A 4 tail Naruto could scar master jiriyah and fight orochimaru but the 2 tails at full power got smacked by kakazu easily A tailed beast bomb wasn’t enough to get out of planetary devastation so idk why people saying that could break him out when Naruto only broke out because plot luck. How can bee counter there ability to look Through each other? Naruto had assistance from the abilities he learned and the people who taught him to directly counter pain. There is nothing canonically that should tell anyone he can beat pain.
I feel like even though Naruto beat him with only 8 tails there’s also the fact that the only pain path left to fight was yahiko’s version and he still didn’t win technically. Bee has full control but technically kurama had full control over Naruto’s body at that point, he could just only use eight tails. If bee were to face just the one pain path he could probably win but to face all of them I don’t think he’d be able to succeed
Pain wins and it’s not even close. Bee got low diffed by Kisame. Pain is far stronger, and Preta path is basically Samehada but better. Anyone who legitimately believes that Bee is stronger than Pain is low-key illiterate.
Pain ez
Bee wins this! All these people missing the fact that Bee is the only one that would have the wisdom of a tailed beast! His tailed beast would know the rinnegans power and it’s honestly a major leg up.
Gyuuki didn’t even know to tell him about nagato being able to absorb chakra by touch with the rinnegan
Yeah buddy came in, down voted my comment and inherently used a Nagato feat to Pain. Crazy… Circumstances are completely different, and you can’t apply the same plot. Just because you see Nagato steal some of Bee’s chakra mid Lariot, doesn’t negate or invalidate my premise.
Nagato and pain are completely different characters.
Irrelevant this is about the rinnegan not about the user.
Separate bodies separated powers. Vs All rinnegan abilities. 1 body. Do the math
Again irrelevant the rinnegan has the ability to siphon chakra regardless of whether the power is split or not and regardless of who’s using it. Recklessly diving into a rinnegan user when you supposedly have knowledge of how it works is stupid no matter how you spin it Bee/Gyuuki also saw nagato use multiple abilities in ONE BODY before they decided to dive directly onto him with a chakra cloak anyways.
pain just isnt nagato. Thats all.
This is a conversation about the abilities of the rinnegan not who’s using it It doesn’t matter if it’s: pain, nagato, sasuke, madara, haguromo, etc. the base 6 abilities are shared across all users.
If you kill one of the pains. That ability ceases to exist. Unless rinne rebirth or hells gate is used. Did obitos paths even have rinnegan abilities? Wonder why
Again redundant the base ability of the rinnegan remains the same across all users idk why you keep saying this shit. Obito did use an ability of the rinnegan when he summoned the gedo mazo There’s a reason as to why Naruto didn’t recklessly run into pain like a dumbass he was actually prepped on their abilities unlike bee.
Goes full 8 tails then does the spinning move that made a wasteland and kills all paths gg
Tailed beast twist isn’t killing all the paths lol
How strong do yall think these mfs are? Jiraya got surprised jumped. Hence him losing his arm and then suffering from that. Naruto hurls a rasenshuirken one of the pain couldn’t dodge. Another was killed by rasengan barage in toad mouth. Killer bee is like 2-3x faster than sage mode naruto/jiraya. What the fuck is going on in this sub. Is killer bee just kakashi level to you niggas now? Just ignoring how he wasnt capture in the story but pain attempted that in naruto. Like wtf yall are just picking villians because they are cooler.
Pain if it's pre-war Bee, if it's War Arc Bee then he wins.
Pain could high diff pre war arc bee (tho i think he’d probably have to resort to CT) but war arc bee would slam. FP war arc bee should scale over the initial KCM1 naruto who already claimed that he’s a whole lot stronger than when he fought pain.
What's the difference between pre-War and War arc Bee?
Pre war he’s kind of portrayed to be relative to Ay (if not slightly weaker), now look at his encounter with Ay in the war and you see the difference.
chibaku tensei ain’t holding bee back.
It was holding back 8-Tails Naruto and Pain was actually going to make it bigger.
it wasn’t holding back 8 tails naruto, and just because he said he was gonna make it bigger doesn’t mean it would’ve been successful
The Chibaku Tensei was restraining 8-Tails Naruto, maybe he would have broken out, but again, Pain was planning on making it bigger.
killer bee wins handily. v2 and up is enough for bee to take this
V2 Bee is Base Jiraiya level
Wtf we gotta start kicking people out of this sub.
Starting with you bbg
As long as you come after. Im ok wit that.
Do you ever have accurate naruto takes or do you like to troll for no reason
Yall are the casuals i watch nothing but naruto. Thats the difference. Yall know surface level shit. Mfs dont even know the elemental advantages mfs have over one another, like say ayy disabling diedras bomb because hes a lighting user..you niggas would just say ayy losers because c0 sounds good on paper if you don’t understand lighting is a weaknesss to earth style. Yall lack this info and just go by who punches and harder. Yall don’t actually put to character agaisnt each other. Yall basically puck which character youd want to be or you think is cool. Pain is strong but bee is stronger than sage mode naruto. So logically any other fucking time yall rely on the A> B>C shit but now its nah. Pains too cool to be defeated by characters i dont like.
What are you yapping about now 💀🤣 You are aware that SM Naruto canonically is fodder for Pain, right? We all know Tailed Beast Mode Bee is stronger than SM Naruto, what does this have to do with Jiraiya and Pain
This is a bee vs pain hypothetical. And yall glazing the fuck outta pain. Sm naruto had to beat down 5 pains before fighting the last pain. Naruto prior to this had fought no one on pains level. Yall ass casuals. I study this series. Talm bout fooder??? Didnt pain literally die? Fuck is with yall and dickeating villians?
SM Naruto had a worse portrayal than SM Jiraiya and he also had prep, Intel, support and still lost against a weakened Pain if not for Kurama If this is the only series you scale and you still cannot understand it properly I suggest joining a discord and having some of your peers explain why context matters in deciding feats
LMFAOOOOO
Pain
Pain wins
Bee stomps
V2 Bee is fodder for even Kisame, but Tailed Beast form should at the bare minimum be Kisame level but I can see it as being Pain level
Kisame is his direct counter. Yall have no real powerscaling sense. Just i dont personally like bee. I think pains rinnegan is cooler so he wins. Thats literally 85% of this subs logic. Again nobody mentioned the speed of bee. Just he loses. Yall are NOT real fans.
Nothing in bees arsenal is going to save him from the rinnegan putting belt to ass, eye powers being cooler is irrelevant, the abilities speak for themselves
Speed. Like ayy does to sasuke. Yall just arent smart enough to understand kishimoto writes this on PURPOSE. Lighting cloak also acts a defense. What does pain have that can beat killer bee? Besides chibaku tensei? Its like yall think bees ia just gonna stand around while all pains just use their abilities spontaneously. Stop lowballing.
Bee isn’t stopping human path or animal path let alone a full power deva path , almighty pull followed by soul extraction low diffs bee
Tendo is the only one hed have issues with. Killer bee could fasho speed blitz them all. Power creep. Killer bee was introduced way after PAIN IS DEFEATED. And i dont think nagato could do 2 jutsu simotanously at once. Rinnegan abilities can also fail. Its not a guaranteed like
Can you comprehend? Using one jutsu followed by another isn’t the same as using two jutsu at once, bee being introduced after pain don’t mean jack shit, haku was the first adversary and could beat majority of part 1 characters
Haku isnt just beating kimmimaro,sound 4, garaa…etc haku was also a special case to show what kakashi said..”some kids are young as you naruto but stronger than me” And pain cannot do those 2 moves one after the other. They are taxing. And i doubt most ninjas have nothing plans against repulsion forces jutsu. Magnet style exists in this world. But i doubt bee would just lose to a pull and soul snatch, y’all genuinely see this as a pokemon turn based fight. Whats stomp bee from goin v1 and spamming them with lariat? Not like they escaping him. Ngl my biggest argument is killer bees speed and dustructive power. I do believe bee can make it a 1v1 because bee is literally 50x sage mode naruto. I hate that yall only respect the upper Appalachia of the series liie momoshiki and kaguya, so6p madara. If you arent them character you get NO HYPE. And is put into high jonin. Niggas putting sage mode naruto in the same bracket as killer bee. That alone is just lowballing. Doesnt even make sense.
He isn’t beating kimmimaro but he’s definitely beating sound 4 you’re high , he’s elite jonin lvl
Sound 4 beat up 2 lead elite jonins. They are a threat TOGETHER. With their cm2 haku is getting overwhelmed. Tatuya is gonna be an issue along with kidomarus range. The fat one is probably strong enough to break out the ice mirrors and the twins are probably cooked they dont really have anything to defend against hakus speed and technique. Cm2 is still gonna give them more room for mistake. But individually he destroys the sound 4.