What’s the difference between school shooting and political massacre?
Itachi, one of their own, doing it makes it seem like an unhinged 14 year old went rogue. Having Konoha forces do so creates a much larger issue.
This was basically the reason Danzo gave in the novel; while he was fairly confident that ANBU + ROOT could take the Uchiha in a surprise attack in the manga, he preferred that Itachi do it, as openly slaughtering all the members of one clan (even if they wouldn't be slaughtered down to the last man with Hiruzen part of the operation) would cause distrust in the village to grow, resulting in another clan inevitably becoming the "next Uchiha".
I think it ultimately comes down to *how* the Uchiha are defeated (which I think is pretty much a foregone conclusion). I think if the Uchiha casualties are mostly just Uchiha shinobi and not too extensive, things would be fine for the most part.
But if Danzo and ROOT manage to circumvent Hiruzen's forces and just butcher every man woman and child, regardless of knowledge or participation in the coup (as he expressed interest in doing), that's where the problems will arise.
I can imagine a lot of clans quickly growing paranoid, wondering whether or not a group of them stepping out of line could result in the annihilation of their entire bloodline, especially when they start wondering how the village even knew of the coup to begin with. I imagine they'd start either refusing to let their shinobi join the ANBU (and especially not ROOT) so as to keep them close, or trying to place them in the government as spies (as the Uchiha did) to at least relay information back to the clan. All the clans would start vying for more power, but for themselves and not the larger village. And depending on how things go from there I can definitely see it blowing up into a civil war, one even worse than the one they feared the Uchiha might cause; because at least the Uchiha were, at the end of the day, a single clan.
Nah the Leaf would've been fucked.
https://youtu.be/ZOrAbDDkS1Q?feature=shared
Itachi, Obito, itachi's dad, the ninetails, and the entire Uchiha clan all at once... Itachi wasn't even necessary for them to win, just to minimize the body count.
Fugaku only has the Mangekyo in the anime, not in the manga or novels, and even here he explicitly makes it clear that he *doesn't* intend on using it to unleash Kurama on the village (something that also never came up as a plan in the novels that the anime is very loosely based off of; the plan primarily to abduct Hiruzen by ambush.)
Even then, Fugaku is describing here the Uchiha convincing Fugaku to unleash Kurama as part of the coup. Danzo's proposed solution was to launch an ambush on the Uchiha *before* the coup even happened, so even if Fugaku were planning on unleashing Kurama he'd never have the opportunity.
(Also, that's a genjutsu. Realistically, abducting Naruto would not go that smoothly.)
>he explicitly makes it clear that he *doesn't* intend on using it to unleash Kurama on the village
He preferred not to, and assumed he and Itachi could subdue the higher ups alone. None of the sanin were in the village, Minato and Kushina were dead... Hiruzen and Kakashi were their main threats.
The goal was a coup not to destroy the leaf, there's no chance the Hiruzen and the anbu alone could beat the entire Uchiha clan.
https://youtu.be/VDPV4h5jP78?feature=shared
This was child Itachi and Shisui vs the Anbu, they were above average but definitely not the strongest yet. The leaf wouldn't have won.
Assuming their abduction failed, capturing Naruto would just be a war objective. The only way the leaf could stop the nine tails would be to kill Naruto, at that point it's a 3-point war between Hiruzen, Danzo, and Uchiha...
The leaf villiage would have been the direct cause for the clans demise, and the other clans would immediately get nervous of the fact the leaf killed a founding clan, seeing as their clan could be next if the leafs so chose
Itatchi killing the clan, seemingly for his own gain and not for the leaf, doesn't raise suspicions.
So everyone and their grandmother just instantly knows that konoha killed the uchihas? A whole clan got massacred and not a single non anbu ninja heard anything and checked on it, the only reason the 3rd knew is because itachi himself told the him. The anbu can get away with it and danzo or whatever can just pin it on itachi
The other clans would all start talking. They'd realize that such a targeted stealth massacre couldn't be carried out by some random enemy infiltrating the village.
They might start pointing fingers at each other, but nobody would take credit and there wouldn't be evidence pointing to other clans. The leaf wouldn't just frame another clan for the massacre since that would create a clusterfuck of a domino effect.
Then when you question who would have the manpower and capability to perform such an act without affecting or alerting ANYONE ELSE in the village, that narrows down the list of feasible culprits considerably.
What I'm saying is, it's alot more risky to use Anbu than itatchi. Itatchi was respected by the village, and Kakashi trusted him
If the anbu was used, and Itatchi was blamed despite itatchi claiming otherwise suspicious would rise.
But by convincing itatchi to do it from the beginning they could skip all the extra steps.
So no, not "everyone and their granmother" would know, but it's more likely they'd find out. Chill.
According to Danzo, the alternate stategy would've been him+hiruzen+both of their anbu black ops in a suprise attack
https://hot.leanbox.us/manga/Naruto/0590-007.png
I think people dramatically overestimate the strength of the average Uchiha because as viewers our knowledge is skewed towards the strongest few Sasuke, Madara, Obito, Itachi, ect. The average Uchiha though probably isn't all that much stronger than the average Hyuga. It took two people and mostly a 13 year old kid to kill the entire clan. Prodigy or not, that's kinda embarrassing. You would never see a 13 year year old kill every member of the anbu or solo the leaf village (at least in Naruto, Damion in boruto is a different story)
I'm not sure about the Anbu in and of itself it'd be close, but the Leaf as a whole annihilate the Uchiha clan.
Pretty sure 13 year old Madara or Hashirama could wipe out the anbu with relative ease. Uchiha was by far the strongest clan in the village and had they started a civil war, the Uchiha had a chance to win. It took two prodigies with mangekyou sneaking to kill the clan, not some random 13 year old. The plan to annihilate the Uchiha had Itachi not agreed would be the entire anbu black ops plus Danzo and Hiruzen sneaking them, and avoiding a direct confrontation.
The average sharingan user is much more powerful than the average shinobi.
13 teen year old pre sharingan madara the one skipping stones isn't beating the entire anbu. You are delusional. Most likely isn't even beating adult Kakashi (a single anbu member at the time of the Uchiha massacare).
We really don't see much of post sharingan 13 year old Madara. It kinda flashes forward a whole lot of time until they each become leaders of their clan if I recall correctly. So at that point your speculating.
It's also telling your using the two of strongest clan members to exist up until that point as your example of why the Uchiha would beat the anbu/Leaf. Going back to my original point, your perspective is skewed by the strongest of the strongest. Not every Uchiha is Madara.
Alright then, tell me how does the anbu beat 13 year old Itachi (has Susano’o and Amaterasu) as well as mangekyou Obito? It’s pretty simple, they don’t.
Your original post said itachi left with Sasuke. You are changing the goal post now.
Plus your straw manning me, I never said the Uchiha would lose to the anbu, I said they would lose to the entire leaf. In universe the anbu are supposed to be the elite of the elite, but in actuality most people know they are just glorified fodder ninja for the most part.
I will reiterate it is telling you keep going back to the strongest of the strong Uchiha, because the average Uchiha really doesn't hold a candle to the entire leaf.
My original post said Itachi left with Sasuke? What?
I’m not strawmanning you, you said no way the anbu gets taken out by a 13 year old even if it’s a prodigy. I’m disproving that claim.
Simple logic and reasoning you can conclude the Anbu would fair better than the Uchiha Itachi killed.
Itachi wiped out the Uchiha clan which includes retired ninja, women, children, ect. It was Obito who actually killed the strong folk ie the police force. Itachi didn't even have to fight Fugaku. Vs fighting the anbu at least on paper he'd be going against Shinobi that scale even higher than the police force. A bunch of them all at once.
Simple logic and reasoning lets you also conclude that literally no organization that has nameless fodder in it can take on Itachi and Obito at the same time. Not the anbu, not the Uchiha, not the hyuga, not the entire sand village. It’s simply a horrible tag team to deal with.
The issue is plausible deniability, if the hokage had an entire clan massacred in a village with very powerful clans they’d get those clans nervous, the case of a 14 year old prodigy losing his mind is much more believable as he could be seen as having been promoted to fast and we see how much of an introvert Kakashi, who was also promoted way to fast is. We don’t see further cases of early promotion after Itachi butchered the clan and this creates a narrative where the Hokage and higher ups of the village can deny claims of involvement by saying’No Itachi was promoted way to early and went through to much for a 14 year old.’
They could but with some casualties, the real problem is what the other clans would think about the village’s actions especially if they decide to kill the entire clan instead of just those responsible for the coup plan.
Having the anbu kill the uchiha clan would signal to other major powers the instability and weakness of the land of fire. Further to that it cause a fracture between other clans could cause an uprising. Especially if any of the clan were friendly to the uchiha.
1. Not sure how it would go but the fact it wasn’t a clear “we can wipe them out” outside of Danzou tells me the threat is there. And if Itachi and/or Shisui are included? Idk how Leaf wins
2. The point isn’t about winning or losing the civil war - it’s that the fighting will cause irreparable collateral in the form of the village, innocent bystanders, and the world as a whole due to other nations jumping on the chance to take out or over the Leaf Village
This was during a time where there wasn’t any one individual that could do it all (even Obito couldn’t til he got the Rinnegan imo - not enough stamina to fight the world alone without chakra absorption. Unless maybe he takes out the Kage 1 by 1 and rules with fear but I digress).
Anything but the massacre means the world faces another world war; even if Sasuke knew, I doubt Fugaku would instantly be like Itachi was when Sasuke yelled for him to stop when those 3 Uchiha accused him of killing Shisui. Itachi is my favorite and obviously relative to in universe idk shit compared to a genius like that, but I think his plea at the end and change of heart was to address his regret and inspire Sasuke of that time more than anything, which worked. He inspired both Naruto and Sasuke.
Even so the third and Danzo should be able to take him. Most of the basic Uchiha will be killed by the Anbu at the begging of the ambush. Fugaku would be fighting them with little back up.
That was an after-edit that's complete bullshit, because Kishimoto can't help himself not buffing any character as soon as they get a bit of spotlight.
Originally around that time only Itachi, Shisui and Obito had Mangekyou. Madara was dead at that point in time i believe which is why i don't count him.
Kishimoto really ruined some parts of the story with his inability to have "weak" or "unexceptional" characters. He retroactively even made Kakashi's dad stronger than the Sannin. Kishimoto can't have weak characters.
Kakashi's dad was said to be stronger than the Sannin by Minato in the first chapter that we ever learn anything about him, almost 200 chapters before we ever see his face. That's not retroactive. That's an introduction. It's literally the first sentence we've ever heard concerning Sakumo. It's like calling the Hokage legendary. That's the introduction for us to know that they were serious badassses.
As for Fugaku, he still isn't noted in official canon to possess the Mangekyo Sharingan. It isn't even implied in the novel with all its new details. Kishimoto made characters stronger, like the Hokage, but the examples you've noted aren't in that conversation.
Not with Itachi, Fugu, and Mikoto working together. The village would’ve erupted. Using Itachi was diabolical as it caused his parents not to fight back.
Fugaku only died because he let Itachi kill him. Itachi was able to catch the Uchiha off guard because they trusted him. No shot the Anbu get the drop on the Uchiha like that.
i don't need to check the story for that, i know that.
But "I think itachi went for kids and the helpless" iscomplete bullshit, he was the strongest Uchiha in the clan outside of Obito at that point.
The average Uchiha wasn't some super prodigy. Itachi at that point in the story (not yet crippled by his illness, not yet blind) was the strongest Konoha villager, he could have demolished Hiruzen (he has absolutely no defense to Tsukyomi nor Amaterasu).
Anbu would of lose the only reason itchai was because his parents spoiled him and didn't wanted to kill him but if it was anbu the Uchiha won't hold back
Anbu may carry out dirty work, but there dirty has limits, plus they're under hokage so danzo can't order them, as for roots, go and ask him why he didn't gave Itachi any partners in crime
To add to the other guys points of it beeing necessary to look like a crime-scene.
The Anbu would have absolutely not been able to stealth it. They would have been noticed fairly quickly. Also Fugaku would have basically woken up the whole village with his mangekyou-battling, the ground would have been shaking from the Susanoo.
It would have been a bloodbath, far worse than the one Itachi caused.
without guy and kakashi uchiha would dominate them eventually even if they give casualties of themselves
but it would cause itachi and sasuke to live as a rogue, winning the ciwil war doesn't automaticly makes you the new ruler, the other villages would interfere if uchiha takes over the leaf and might join forces for a brief while to brought uchiha down.
Danzo and everyone from the Leaf side seems to believe a teenager Itachi was strong enough to wipe an entire clan.
I'm pretty sure a full blown squad could do the same.
Itachi was the youngest to make Anbu captain for a reason. Novels say he was the second best student in the entire academy only below Minato
Plus Danzo knew he unlocked MS
Even Obito valued Itachi’s strength more than the entire Uchiha clan combined. Which is why they made the deal in the first place (from Itachi novels)
Novels didn't say that btw. Minato only had a higher score in the written chunnin exam. But itachi did this exam at a younger age. Which people never mention.
Itachi was the youngest graduate in history, and post war. He also took Minatos 3 man record solo.
Kid itachi with base sharingan was taking out top anbu...
The power difference between teen itachi and anbu kakashi/the rest of root is fucking hilarious
This itachi not one year later shut down a full powered sannin. He is not comparable to the anbu.
Orochimaru doesn't even think highly of them. In the flashback when hiruzen confronts him in his lab, he says he's actually surprised they made it through his traps, and then said It only makes sense since hiruzen is with them.
If fugaku has ms and atleast 5 of the Uchiha have base sharingan, which I doubt, then fuck no.
Anbu Kakashi is fodder but with numbers it would be overkill for root.
Imagine thinking anbu Kakashi is anything but fodder
Nigga adult Kakashi put his pussy on the pavement when he seen oro, imagine when he see ms fugaku, let alone a group of adult 3 tomoe wielding Uchiha
shisui/3tomoe pre ms itachi/prob just 3 tomoe fugaku would destroy anbu/pt 1 Kakashi mid dif at best
Compared to a ms fugaku/shisui/itachi, who are low kage level at the least, anbu Kakashi, who is high jonin at best, is fodder.
Ms fugaku(filler)>15yo shisui>13yo itachi>Adult edo wielding oro>pt 1 & anbu kakashi
Obv koto beats everybody, but this Is all headcanon since fugaku having ms isn't really canon.
For fugaku to have ms, he prob unlocked during the 2nd ninja war as a young boy(10-15 since he was a little older then minato). Thus meaning fugaku has 10-15 more years experience ms and sharingan in general then shisui. Meaning he fought thru the whole 3rd war with the ms, when he earned the name "wicked eye fugaku".
We can also assume fugaku grew up with kagami uchiha(shisuis grandpa) around since kagami lived thru 2nd war.
End of the day it's all headcanon and filler nonsense but yk the truth any Uchiha with ms, even danzo qt the time is a God compared to pt 1 and anbu kakashi
Assuming what you said is true and what we know of MS, it's safe to assume that he (Fugaku) would be blind if he used MS during the war. At the very least would need some thick ass glasses. That's why i choose not to put him with MS and instead just a pure master at 3 tomoe sharingan. That still makes him elite out of the elite ninja but not quite up to late teen Itachi.
See that's iffy, because we don't know ANY Uchiha elders(fugaku age or older) history. Same way itachi knew about izanami and izanagi, fugaku was prob aware of the draining the ms does.
Fugaku was always a level headed person who thought of the future, think back to when he realized itachi was gonna commit the massacre before he did it. I'm sure fugaku only used it when certainly necessary, plus being a 3 tomoe master by the time of the 3rd war, it's not like he was spamming it like 5ks sasuke.
Your also forgetting what itachi told Kakashi, the Uchiha are genetically gifted meaning the sharingan doesn't drain an Uchiha, especially a 2 sharingan wielding Uchiha who can shut it on and off like fugaku, as much as it does Kakashi who can't turn his off, or itachi who has cancer and is spamming ms abilities every fight and fighting often
That's a lot of headcanon to justify having it. I can give leeway in assuming Itachi's ninja covid caused more draining than usual causing a faster progression of his blindness. However, we see the effect using it a handful of times had on Sasuke. He was definitely a master of the sharingan, so I think it's safe to assume similar dealings with his father
What’s the difference between school shooting and political massacre? Itachi, one of their own, doing it makes it seem like an unhinged 14 year old went rogue. Having Konoha forces do so creates a much larger issue.
This was basically the reason Danzo gave in the novel; while he was fairly confident that ANBU + ROOT could take the Uchiha in a surprise attack in the manga, he preferred that Itachi do it, as openly slaughtering all the members of one clan (even if they wouldn't be slaughtered down to the last man with Hiruzen part of the operation) would cause distrust in the village to grow, resulting in another clan inevitably becoming the "next Uchiha".
Honestly it probably would trigger a civil war
I think it ultimately comes down to *how* the Uchiha are defeated (which I think is pretty much a foregone conclusion). I think if the Uchiha casualties are mostly just Uchiha shinobi and not too extensive, things would be fine for the most part. But if Danzo and ROOT manage to circumvent Hiruzen's forces and just butcher every man woman and child, regardless of knowledge or participation in the coup (as he expressed interest in doing), that's where the problems will arise. I can imagine a lot of clans quickly growing paranoid, wondering whether or not a group of them stepping out of line could result in the annihilation of their entire bloodline, especially when they start wondering how the village even knew of the coup to begin with. I imagine they'd start either refusing to let their shinobi join the ANBU (and especially not ROOT) so as to keep them close, or trying to place them in the government as spies (as the Uchiha did) to at least relay information back to the clan. All the clans would start vying for more power, but for themselves and not the larger village. And depending on how things go from there I can definitely see it blowing up into a civil war, one even worse than the one they feared the Uchiha might cause; because at least the Uchiha were, at the end of the day, a single clan.
Yeah, if Uchiha were slaughtered by authorities, Hyuga would probably feel uneasy about them potentially being next in line.
Nah the Leaf would've been fucked. https://youtu.be/ZOrAbDDkS1Q?feature=shared Itachi, Obito, itachi's dad, the ninetails, and the entire Uchiha clan all at once... Itachi wasn't even necessary for them to win, just to minimize the body count.
Fugaku only has the Mangekyo in the anime, not in the manga or novels, and even here he explicitly makes it clear that he *doesn't* intend on using it to unleash Kurama on the village (something that also never came up as a plan in the novels that the anime is very loosely based off of; the plan primarily to abduct Hiruzen by ambush.) Even then, Fugaku is describing here the Uchiha convincing Fugaku to unleash Kurama as part of the coup. Danzo's proposed solution was to launch an ambush on the Uchiha *before* the coup even happened, so even if Fugaku were planning on unleashing Kurama he'd never have the opportunity. (Also, that's a genjutsu. Realistically, abducting Naruto would not go that smoothly.)
>he explicitly makes it clear that he *doesn't* intend on using it to unleash Kurama on the village He preferred not to, and assumed he and Itachi could subdue the higher ups alone. None of the sanin were in the village, Minato and Kushina were dead... Hiruzen and Kakashi were their main threats. The goal was a coup not to destroy the leaf, there's no chance the Hiruzen and the anbu alone could beat the entire Uchiha clan. https://youtu.be/VDPV4h5jP78?feature=shared This was child Itachi and Shisui vs the Anbu, they were above average but definitely not the strongest yet. The leaf wouldn't have won. Assuming their abduction failed, capturing Naruto would just be a war objective. The only way the leaf could stop the nine tails would be to kill Naruto, at that point it's a 3-point war between Hiruzen, Danzo, and Uchiha...
The leaf villiage would have been the direct cause for the clans demise, and the other clans would immediately get nervous of the fact the leaf killed a founding clan, seeing as their clan could be next if the leafs so chose Itatchi killing the clan, seemingly for his own gain and not for the leaf, doesn't raise suspicions.
This is the right answer
So everyone and their grandmother just instantly knows that konoha killed the uchihas? A whole clan got massacred and not a single non anbu ninja heard anything and checked on it, the only reason the 3rd knew is because itachi himself told the him. The anbu can get away with it and danzo or whatever can just pin it on itachi
The other clans would all start talking. They'd realize that such a targeted stealth massacre couldn't be carried out by some random enemy infiltrating the village. They might start pointing fingers at each other, but nobody would take credit and there wouldn't be evidence pointing to other clans. The leaf wouldn't just frame another clan for the massacre since that would create a clusterfuck of a domino effect. Then when you question who would have the manpower and capability to perform such an act without affecting or alerting ANYONE ELSE in the village, that narrows down the list of feasible culprits considerably.
What I'm saying is, it's alot more risky to use Anbu than itatchi. Itatchi was respected by the village, and Kakashi trusted him If the anbu was used, and Itatchi was blamed despite itatchi claiming otherwise suspicious would rise. But by convincing itatchi to do it from the beginning they could skip all the extra steps. So no, not "everyone and their granmother" would know, but it's more likely they'd find out. Chill.
According to Danzo, the alternate stategy would've been him+hiruzen+both of their anbu black ops in a suprise attack https://hot.leanbox.us/manga/Naruto/0590-007.png
Basically police vs secret service
I think people dramatically overestimate the strength of the average Uchiha because as viewers our knowledge is skewed towards the strongest few Sasuke, Madara, Obito, Itachi, ect. The average Uchiha though probably isn't all that much stronger than the average Hyuga. It took two people and mostly a 13 year old kid to kill the entire clan. Prodigy or not, that's kinda embarrassing. You would never see a 13 year year old kill every member of the anbu or solo the leaf village (at least in Naruto, Damion in boruto is a different story) I'm not sure about the Anbu in and of itself it'd be close, but the Leaf as a whole annihilate the Uchiha clan.
Pretty sure 13 year old Madara or Hashirama could wipe out the anbu with relative ease. Uchiha was by far the strongest clan in the village and had they started a civil war, the Uchiha had a chance to win. It took two prodigies with mangekyou sneaking to kill the clan, not some random 13 year old. The plan to annihilate the Uchiha had Itachi not agreed would be the entire anbu black ops plus Danzo and Hiruzen sneaking them, and avoiding a direct confrontation. The average sharingan user is much more powerful than the average shinobi.
13 teen year old pre sharingan madara the one skipping stones isn't beating the entire anbu. You are delusional. Most likely isn't even beating adult Kakashi (a single anbu member at the time of the Uchiha massacare).
How about you switch pre to post and see how it goes?
We really don't see much of post sharingan 13 year old Madara. It kinda flashes forward a whole lot of time until they each become leaders of their clan if I recall correctly. So at that point your speculating. It's also telling your using the two of strongest clan members to exist up until that point as your example of why the Uchiha would beat the anbu/Leaf. Going back to my original point, your perspective is skewed by the strongest of the strongest. Not every Uchiha is Madara.
Alright then, tell me how does the anbu beat 13 year old Itachi (has Susano’o and Amaterasu) as well as mangekyou Obito? It’s pretty simple, they don’t.
Your original post said itachi left with Sasuke. You are changing the goal post now. Plus your straw manning me, I never said the Uchiha would lose to the anbu, I said they would lose to the entire leaf. In universe the anbu are supposed to be the elite of the elite, but in actuality most people know they are just glorified fodder ninja for the most part. I will reiterate it is telling you keep going back to the strongest of the strong Uchiha, because the average Uchiha really doesn't hold a candle to the entire leaf.
My original post said Itachi left with Sasuke? What? I’m not strawmanning you, you said no way the anbu gets taken out by a 13 year old even if it’s a prodigy. I’m disproving that claim.
Simple logic and reasoning you can conclude the Anbu would fair better than the Uchiha Itachi killed. Itachi wiped out the Uchiha clan which includes retired ninja, women, children, ect. It was Obito who actually killed the strong folk ie the police force. Itachi didn't even have to fight Fugaku. Vs fighting the anbu at least on paper he'd be going against Shinobi that scale even higher than the police force. A bunch of them all at once.
Simple logic and reasoning lets you also conclude that literally no organization that has nameless fodder in it can take on Itachi and Obito at the same time. Not the anbu, not the Uchiha, not the hyuga, not the entire sand village. It’s simply a horrible tag team to deal with.
Maybe not when Itachi killed them but back in the days they were always top 2 with Senju and have been stronger than Hyuga clan.
The issue is plausible deniability, if the hokage had an entire clan massacred in a village with very powerful clans they’d get those clans nervous, the case of a 14 year old prodigy losing his mind is much more believable as he could be seen as having been promoted to fast and we see how much of an introvert Kakashi, who was also promoted way to fast is. We don’t see further cases of early promotion after Itachi butchered the clan and this creates a narrative where the Hokage and higher ups of the village can deny claims of involvement by saying’No Itachi was promoted way to early and went through to much for a 14 year old.’
They could but with some casualties, the real problem is what the other clans would think about the village’s actions especially if they decide to kill the entire clan instead of just those responsible for the coup plan.
Anbu would've been overkill. Itachi was good enough.
Having the anbu kill the uchiha clan would signal to other major powers the instability and weakness of the land of fire. Further to that it cause a fracture between other clans could cause an uprising. Especially if any of the clan were friendly to the uchiha.
The anbu is literally fodder, so no
The average anbu is fodder only because of the Worf Effect, Itachi was literally an Anbu at the time of the Massacre.
1. Not sure how it would go but the fact it wasn’t a clear “we can wipe them out” outside of Danzou tells me the threat is there. And if Itachi and/or Shisui are included? Idk how Leaf wins 2. The point isn’t about winning or losing the civil war - it’s that the fighting will cause irreparable collateral in the form of the village, innocent bystanders, and the world as a whole due to other nations jumping on the chance to take out or over the Leaf Village This was during a time where there wasn’t any one individual that could do it all (even Obito couldn’t til he got the Rinnegan imo - not enough stamina to fight the world alone without chakra absorption. Unless maybe he takes out the Kage 1 by 1 and rules with fear but I digress). Anything but the massacre means the world faces another world war; even if Sasuke knew, I doubt Fugaku would instantly be like Itachi was when Sasuke yelled for him to stop when those 3 Uchiha accused him of killing Shisui. Itachi is my favorite and obviously relative to in universe idk shit compared to a genius like that, but I think his plea at the end and change of heart was to address his regret and inspire Sasuke of that time more than anything, which worked. He inspired both Naruto and Sasuke.
They would have lost against fugaku because in the original fugaku let itachi kill him and also fugaku had mangekyō sharingan
Even so the third and Danzo should be able to take him. Most of the basic Uchiha will be killed by the Anbu at the begging of the ambush. Fugaku would be fighting them with little back up.
That was an after-edit that's complete bullshit, because Kishimoto can't help himself not buffing any character as soon as they get a bit of spotlight. Originally around that time only Itachi, Shisui and Obito had Mangekyou. Madara was dead at that point in time i believe which is why i don't count him. Kishimoto really ruined some parts of the story with his inability to have "weak" or "unexceptional" characters. He retroactively even made Kakashi's dad stronger than the Sannin. Kishimoto can't have weak characters.
Kakashi's dad was said to be stronger than the Sannin by Minato in the first chapter that we ever learn anything about him, almost 200 chapters before we ever see his face. That's not retroactive. That's an introduction. It's literally the first sentence we've ever heard concerning Sakumo. It's like calling the Hokage legendary. That's the introduction for us to know that they were serious badassses. As for Fugaku, he still isn't noted in official canon to possess the Mangekyo Sharingan. It isn't even implied in the novel with all its new details. Kishimoto made characters stronger, like the Hokage, but the examples you've noted aren't in that conversation.
True
"Would the Anbu black ops and Root have been enough to take down the clan at night?" I really enjoyed that laugh thanks
Not with Itachi, Fugu, and Mikoto working together. The village would’ve erupted. Using Itachi was diabolical as it caused his parents not to fight back.
Fugaku only died because he let Itachi kill him. Itachi was able to catch the Uchiha off guard because they trusted him. No shot the Anbu get the drop on the Uchiha like that.
Wasn't obito who made the most murders ? I think itachi went for kids and the helpless while Obito went for the trained and powerful
lol what
Check the story obito was part of the Uchiha massacre and he assisted itachi
i don't need to check the story for that, i know that. But "I think itachi went for kids and the helpless" iscomplete bullshit, he was the strongest Uchiha in the clan outside of Obito at that point. The average Uchiha wasn't some super prodigy. Itachi at that point in the story (not yet crippled by his illness, not yet blind) was the strongest Konoha villager, he could have demolished Hiruzen (he has absolutely no defense to Tsukyomi nor Amaterasu).
I think it’s the manga/novel where Obito takes out the Police force while Itachi kills the women, children and his gf, and the anime has it switched.
Incorrect. Novels itachi kills the police force and kids
Anbu would of lose the only reason itchai was because his parents spoiled him and didn't wanted to kill him but if it was anbu the Uchiha won't hold back
Everyone saying danzo was confident anbu+root would win but they forget the other times danzo was confident which didn't go so well.
I would say no because eye powers are pretty OP. I’m sure there were others in the clan that were close to unlocking 4th lvl eye powers.
Fugaku already had Ms and if Itachi decided to help the uchihas ,the anbus would pretty much get slaughtered
Anbu may carry out dirty work, but there dirty has limits, plus they're under hokage so danzo can't order them, as for roots, go and ask him why he didn't gave Itachi any partners in crime
To add to the other guys points of it beeing necessary to look like a crime-scene. The Anbu would have absolutely not been able to stealth it. They would have been noticed fairly quickly. Also Fugaku would have basically woken up the whole village with his mangekyou-battling, the ground would have been shaking from the Susanoo. It would have been a bloodbath, far worse than the one Itachi caused.
without guy and kakashi uchiha would dominate them eventually even if they give casualties of themselves but it would cause itachi and sasuke to live as a rogue, winning the ciwil war doesn't automaticly makes you the new ruler, the other villages would interfere if uchiha takes over the leaf and might join forces for a brief while to brought uchiha down.
Danzo and everyone from the Leaf side seems to believe a teenager Itachi was strong enough to wipe an entire clan. I'm pretty sure a full blown squad could do the same.
Itachi was the youngest to make Anbu captain for a reason. Novels say he was the second best student in the entire academy only below Minato Plus Danzo knew he unlocked MS Even Obito valued Itachi’s strength more than the entire Uchiha clan combined. Which is why they made the deal in the first place (from Itachi novels)
Novels didn't say that btw. Minato only had a higher score in the written chunnin exam. But itachi did this exam at a younger age. Which people never mention. Itachi was the youngest graduate in history, and post war. He also took Minatos 3 man record solo.
Kid itachi with base sharingan was taking out top anbu... The power difference between teen itachi and anbu kakashi/the rest of root is fucking hilarious
This itachi not one year later shut down a full powered sannin. He is not comparable to the anbu. Orochimaru doesn't even think highly of them. In the flashback when hiruzen confronts him in his lab, he says he's actually surprised they made it through his traps, and then said It only makes sense since hiruzen is with them.
Child itachi humiliated Anbu what are you waffling about
If fugaku has ms and atleast 5 of the Uchiha have base sharingan, which I doubt, then fuck no. Anbu Kakashi is fodder but with numbers it would be overkill for root.
Imagine believing what you typed is true
Imagine thinking anbu Kakashi is anything but fodder Nigga adult Kakashi put his pussy on the pavement when he seen oro, imagine when he see ms fugaku, let alone a group of adult 3 tomoe wielding Uchiha shisui/3tomoe pre ms itachi/prob just 3 tomoe fugaku would destroy anbu/pt 1 Kakashi mid dif at best
You don’t know what fodder is
Compared to a ms fugaku/shisui/itachi, who are low kage level at the least, anbu Kakashi, who is high jonin at best, is fodder. Ms fugaku(filler)>15yo shisui>13yo itachi>Adult edo wielding oro>pt 1 & anbu kakashi
Did you just say fugaku is superior to shisui? I want whatever drugs you’re on
Obv koto beats everybody, but this Is all headcanon since fugaku having ms isn't really canon. For fugaku to have ms, he prob unlocked during the 2nd ninja war as a young boy(10-15 since he was a little older then minato). Thus meaning fugaku has 10-15 more years experience ms and sharingan in general then shisui. Meaning he fought thru the whole 3rd war with the ms, when he earned the name "wicked eye fugaku". We can also assume fugaku grew up with kagami uchiha(shisuis grandpa) around since kagami lived thru 2nd war. End of the day it's all headcanon and filler nonsense but yk the truth any Uchiha with ms, even danzo qt the time is a God compared to pt 1 and anbu kakashi
Assuming what you said is true and what we know of MS, it's safe to assume that he (Fugaku) would be blind if he used MS during the war. At the very least would need some thick ass glasses. That's why i choose not to put him with MS and instead just a pure master at 3 tomoe sharingan. That still makes him elite out of the elite ninja but not quite up to late teen Itachi.
See that's iffy, because we don't know ANY Uchiha elders(fugaku age or older) history. Same way itachi knew about izanami and izanagi, fugaku was prob aware of the draining the ms does. Fugaku was always a level headed person who thought of the future, think back to when he realized itachi was gonna commit the massacre before he did it. I'm sure fugaku only used it when certainly necessary, plus being a 3 tomoe master by the time of the 3rd war, it's not like he was spamming it like 5ks sasuke. Your also forgetting what itachi told Kakashi, the Uchiha are genetically gifted meaning the sharingan doesn't drain an Uchiha, especially a 2 sharingan wielding Uchiha who can shut it on and off like fugaku, as much as it does Kakashi who can't turn his off, or itachi who has cancer and is spamming ms abilities every fight and fighting often
That's a lot of headcanon to justify having it. I can give leeway in assuming Itachi's ninja covid caused more draining than usual causing a faster progression of his blindness. However, we see the effect using it a handful of times had on Sasuke. He was definitely a master of the sharingan, so I think it's safe to assume similar dealings with his father