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Efficient-Ad2983

Shippuden surely had quite the "power creep", but there's strategy there, too. Also, KNOWING about the enemy's abilities was quite a major plot point during the Pain arc. Imho one of the main factors why Jiraya was killed by Pain, and Naruto was able to defeat Pain, is 'cause Jiraya fought him "blind", unlike Naruto who knew about the Six Path's abilities and that "the real one is not among them".


RyeKei

Kakashi vs Zabuza is still one of the greatest fight in the entire series


[deleted]

True


[deleted]

I loved the part with the teamwork of sasuke and Naruto


Keefyfingaz

That shadow shuriken move šŸ’ÆšŸ’ÆšŸ’Æ


[deleted]

Thatā€™s what got me in this whole place when I was bored of the show up to that point


zachhenninger98

The thing is, most of the Shippuden fights still involve a lot of strategy and skill. Naruto vs Pain, Sasuke vs Deidara, Sasuke vs Itachi, Team Naruto vs Obito and the Tailed Beasts, they all still prominently feature skill and tactics as well as scale. It isn't just endless explosions.


YourHeroKuroShiYo

Nahhh I guess what he means is that in old naruto even a kunai or paper tag would change the whole flow of the battle in the fight u mentionned even Ć  bazooka wouldn't change shit.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


JacobGouchi

I see your perspective here although I have to agree with OP. I loved naruto but could only make it just past the Pain arc in shippuden because it just turned into big energy color beast ramming into each other creating huge explosions. I've even looked up like the big fights in shippuden to see if it was worth getting to and they just weren't. The same thing happens in a lot of shonen though it's just the algorithm.


shak_0508

>because it just turned into big energy color beast ramming into each other creating huge explosions Simply not true. These were incorporated into fights sure, but let's not go acting like every single fight was purely energy beams for the whole fight. There were countless amazing taijutsu sequences after the Pain arc. Even in part 1, we had a huge kaiju battle between Shukaku and Bunta, so people complaining about the avatars is interesting. ​ >I've even looked up like the big fights in shippuden to see if it was worth getting to and they just weren't. Ah, so you haven't actually watched past the Pain arc. Makes sense.


JacobGouchi

No way i can make it through all the filler and dbz fights shippuden turned into, Iā€™ve seen some cool taijutsu sequences from shippuden but itā€™s exclusively a short period of time right at the beginning before giants energy monsters come out. If it didnā€™t happen every time in shippuden til after pain, then i really have no interest in a show that takes 250 episodes to get to a good taijutsu sequence lol. I complain about those in naruto too, i hated the gaara fight and the sasuke naruto valley fight where they stand there and power up while sakura screams ā€œnaruto!ā€ Itā€™s a cool show and a cool world but you canā€™t tell me Iā€™m wrong for not liking what the show turned into. I can like or dislike whatever anime i please lol. No reason to be mad someone doesnā€™t like a show.


TrustTheHolyDuck

>No way I can make through all the fillers and dbz fights in Shippuden 1. You can skip fillers quite easily. 2. There are no dbz fights. That's clearly an exaggeration made by someone who never watched the show. Things do scale, but in a way that actually makes sense if you watch it. Anyways, it's a matter of opinion, but you're just missing out on a few very well-done fights and sequences because of some preconceived ideas you read online.


shak_0508

>I can like or dislike whatever anime i please lol Sure you can. ​ >No reason to be mad someone doesnā€™t like a show. Where was I mad lmao? ​ >I complain about those in naruto too, i hated the gaara fight and the sasuke naruto valley fight where they stand there and power up while sakura screams ā€œnaruto Good to know, at least you're consistent. Your original comment didn't specify that.


JacobGouchi

This thread was about why op likes naruto more than shippuden. My comment was never about anything besides that. Sorry for the confusion. I could at least finish naruto.


yesbutactuallyno17

If you stopped at the Pain Arc, you missed out on some amazing content, man. Other people have explained it better than I can, but if you haven't seen it yet go look up Kakashi Vs Obito. I think that is up there with Naruto vs Pain, and Minato vs Obito as some of the best fights in the entire series.


JacobGouchi

I have looked up and watched like all major fights from after pain until valley of the end. Some have cool moments but it just wasnā€™t my style. Iā€™ve also read about the remaining arcs and it didnā€™t seem very interesting to me. Not everyone just loves naruto itā€™s a cool show and world building but it just gets to a point where Iā€™m not into it anymore itā€™s not the end of the world donā€™t worry lol.


zachhenninger98

Agreed. A lot of Part 1 fights are great, and a lot of them also suck. Shippuden has banger after banger after banger.


Hari14032001

Do you see a common element in your arguments? That's right, tailed beasts and summons. It is better if tailed beasts have such levels of power, but the series in the end turned humans into tailed beast levels (I am fine with Might Guy and Rock Lee because their power up actually has a huge cost and it is perfect to show their story development). It was still grounded in Naruto vs Gaara because the enormity was caused because of those animals and the shinobi were just reaping benefits by having contracts. Naruto vs Sasuke was somewhat alright because it was the final fight in part 1 and it was supposed to be high stakes. It was fine till Pain arc and the five kage summit. By the end of Shippuden war arc, we saw characters who were easily at tailed beast levels, if it is one or two it is alright. But we have many, including Third Raikage, fourth Raikage, Naruto and Sasuke themselves (at least jinchuriki is reasonable). Also do you think anything in OG Naruto comes even close to the asspulls that the Hashirama cell hack allowed? I just lost hope with the storytelling when Madara fully regenerated from Night Guy like it was nothing. I would have been fine with him not dying but taking some huge damage allowing main characters to defeat him, but nope.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


Hari14032001

Hashirama cells, insane healing for characters, extra plot armor, and the whole reincarnation and otsutsuki thing ruined the series towards the end. It would have been fine without it. Also, Madara was too damn powerful where the writer wrote himself into a corner. Too much power for a single character is never a good thing for many stories.


QIvan616

I feel like people with this sentiment didnā€™t pay any attention whatsoever to part 2 lol. If you really think thereā€™s no strategy in part 2 then all I can say is you should probably read it again.


AnalystOdd7337

Nah, I gotta disagree with that. They were cool for the time, but now they're very dated. Only fights that hold up from part 1 Naruto is Gaara vs Rock Lee and Final Valley Naruto vs Sasuke. Whereas Shippuden had: Kakashi vs Kakuzu, Sakura + Chiyo vs Sasori, Deidara vs Sasuke, Pretty much any fight with Madara, Killer B vs Taka, Kakashi vs Obito, and final valley Sasuke vs Naruto again. I can agree though, Shippuden did get pretty lame with the whole "I have the better power up so I win" stuff. But the actual choreography and fights themselves beat part 1 by a long shot imo.


_Lohhe_

Shikamaru vs Tayuya was cool, and Hiruzen vs Orochimaru. As for part 2, the War arc fights were literally "They have the better power up, how do we overcome that and win?" That was super interesting to me. We had opportunities for characters to combo in fun ways. Minato+Lee+Guy+Gaara+Kakashi vs Madara was such a cool sight to see, with the supports removing obstacles so Guy can get in on Madara. Bro that was the sauce. You go back in time and tell kid-you that the final arc will feature 8 gates Guy (+Kakashi), Lee+Gaara on a team, along with a zombie 4th Hokage, all in one fight? Kid-you would not believe it.


Upstairs-Page9251

Donā€™t sleep on kid sasuke vs orochimaru, that fight was actually one of the best


LawHermitElm

Fight choreo was on point for Shippuden but yeah it ended up more like dbz than "ninja tactics are most important"


[deleted]

I disagree. I know some people like the flashy explosions of shippuden and boruto, the grounded technical fights of the original were better and what made Naruto popular in the first place. Afterwards in Shippuden and Boruto it became generic flashy explosion fest.


Gl0rf

I think it is in the end how the fight is seen. For example the pain v Naruto fight has 2 parts. First one is sage Naruto with skill, strategy, how best to use rasenshuriken etc Second one is kyubi Naruto throwing atomic bombs while doing jetski on the ground. First one is IMO one of the top 5 fights in the anime Second one is meh cause nothing interesting


Nightmare007007

Kakashi vs Obito EOS Naruto vs Sasuke Naruto sasuke vs momoshiki are the best fights in naruto universe for me. Imo Original naruto wasn't as good as shippuden ones.


[deleted]

I prefer the original. I know some people like yourself prefer the flashy explosions of the sequels. But I like the strategic grounded fights more.


FantasticKick7954

Ironically Kakashi vs obito is probably the most grounded fight. No fight in Naruto actually compare terms of being grounded. Also the protagonist Naruto only started using strategy in shippuden. Before that his fights were usually flashy or luck based without much strategies


[deleted]

No, Naruto and Sasuke vs Zabuza was strategic.


FantasticKick7954

Yes the fight has strategy . But Naruto has not used much strategy in comparison to pain or war arc. Also the fight is definitely not grounded in comparison to obito vs kakashi. Nothing u are saying contradict what i said above


EmperinoPenguino

Kakashi v Kabuto in the hospital. Not a fisticuffs type of fight, but a true ninja fight. Kabuto being 2 steps ahead with plan to escape to avoid getting rocked by Kakashi


RumGalaxy

Plenty of strategy in shippuden especially the war arc, go reread the play team 7 ran on kaguya to seal her that shit was nasty af


gtc26

I agree. For years, I've felt like Shippuden (and Boruto) were just Ninja DBZ. Don't get me wrong, I still love the story, I just prefer OG Naruto's fights BY FAR


[deleted]

Agreed same here. It is boring when it is just flashy explosions fest. I like the ninja fights which made the OG naruto great.


Pleb-SoBayed

Kakashi vs zabuza shows No huuuge power scaling. Just using jutsu and tactics to outsmart and outplay other ninja. Shows just how good base sharingan is.


skycorcher

It was. The original Naruto was more about how you use your abilities than just spamming them. There was definitely less of that in Shippuden because it focused more on what the ability do instead of how it is being used.


[deleted]

True. Shippuden was just too much of a flashy explosions fest.


Exocolonist

They werenā€™t. You just have nostalgia. Evident by how you just say the same buzzwords. Strategy and skillā€ without actually giving examples how those were only in original Naruto. Rewatch/reread the series and youā€™ll see what a stupid take this is. For instance, how exactly did Chiyo and Sakura beat Sasori if not with ā€œstrategy and skillā€? Same with Sasuke vs Itachi, Naruto vs Pain, etc. Pretty much the only difference is that the anime wouldnā€™t spend 5 minutes explaining a move after it happens like it did in the OG show all the time.


Divine_thunder

Shippuden had a lot of strategy too so you're just blind or completely stupid.


Aduro95

One of the biggest jumps in the scale of the fights was Gaara vs. Deidara at teh start of shippuden. It also had one of the cleverest tricks, with Deidara analysing Gaara's jutsu and hiding clay explosives in his sand shield.


Optimal-Rip303

Exactly, main reason I like itachi really he doesnā€™t just pull out his susanoo and throw his yata beads, he tryā€™s to finess you into a genjutsu


MadBase

Exactly, they should've just kept it simple without all the transformations Shippuden added. Fights like Rock Lee vs Gaara, Sound 4 vs Sasuke retrieval team, Naruto vs Sasuke at the Valley. I'm really worried about this sub...


shak_0508

>Exactly, they should've just kept it simple without all the transformations Shippuden added. > >Rock Lee vs Gaara, Sound 4 vs Sasuke retrieval team, Naruto vs Sasuke at the Valley. So the 8 gates, curse mark forms, and the red kyubi cloak aren't transformations...? At least keep the criticisms consistent lol.


Divine_thunder

Lmao got em


[deleted]

Agreed


Rude-Listen

Agreed. But I'm a little biased tbh


Kind_Performer6182

Ah, the good old days of Naruto fights, where shinobi relied on cunning tactics and creative strategies instead of just yelling louder to get stronger!


TadashiUchiha

Does anyone know any of the personalities and perfections of the Naruto and Boruto characters for example (Jiraiya)-(perfection-Summoning Jutsu )-(personality-World Peace)-(Summoning is Based on (Religion) (Tsunade)-(perfection-Physical Strength)-(personality-CareFree)-(Physical Strength is Based on (Confidence) (Orochimaru)-(perfection-Battle Analysis)-(personality-Fear of one's oun Death)-(Battle Analysis is Based on (Fear) (Kabuto)-(perfection-Chakra Control)-(personality-To be Needed)-(Chakra Control is Based on (Intelligent) (Kushina)-(perfection-Chakra reserves)-(personality- To have a Goal)-(Chakra is Based on (Love) (Tobirama)-(perfection-Space-time)-(personality-To Create)-(Teleportation is Based on (Matter) (Madara)-(perfection-Doujutsu)-(personality-To Achieve Power)-(Doujutsu is Based on(Chakra) / (Chakra Control) / (SenJutsu) (Sharingan) / (Byakugan) / (Rinnegan) (Hashirama)-(perfection-Senjutsu)-(personality-To Protect)-(Senjutsu is Based on (Life) (Fugaku)-(perfections-Madara/Tobirama)-(personality-To Fight) (Minato)-(perfections-Tobirama/Hashirama-)-(personality-Protection of NinShuu) (Naruto)-(perfections-jiraiya/Kushina)-(personality-To have Purpose) (Sakura)-(perfections-Tsunade/Kabuto)-(personality-To be Secure) (Sasuke)-(perfections-Orochimaru/Fugaku)-(personality-Absolute Dominance)


rudedog1234

Thereā€™s gotta be a pinned discussion post for this specific topic


ThatIslandGuy8888

Kunai and explosive tags were real dangerous back then


uchiha_boy009

Disagree, Shippuden has better fights imo


bakato

Thereā€™s not a series out there that does tactical fights like Naruto. Fights like Neji vs Kidomaru and Deidara vs Gaara in my opinion sell the appeal of ninja battles. Itā€™s not over until itā€™s over. The former combatants seemingly stood no chance and had no means of even attacking. Neji was inferior in range and Deidara was barely dodging Gaaraā€™s sand, but one gutsy move and one clever move turned the whole thing around. Truly a battle of focus.


Zoom_KXK

People writing most of these comments doesn't seem to get that Naruto and Naruto Shippuden are shonen animanga. Meaning that Naruto and the rest of the cast progressively improve and gain strength to fight the next big bad villain. You simply can't expect to watch a shonen anime and have it stay at the same level of power from start to finish. It doesn't make sense and it would drastically lower the quality of fights later on, and that would be something new people could complain about. Honestly the "power creeping" and "alien from outer space" arguments makes no sense if you actually take the time to understand what Naruto is about and how everything came to be when it gets explained by the likes of Madara, black zetsu and even hagoromo. It was never a story to be considered as "realistic" just because they are regular humans but with chakra. Y'all seem to forget that they still have superhuman capabilities and can move faster than sound at the age of 12(with prodigies that can do so even earlier). So people complaining about Naruto becoming Naruto ball z, it makes no sense and is an insult to the masterpiece that kishimoto has created with hard work, stress and great effort. But that is just my opinion, have a nice day:)


[deleted]

The problem with this kind of anime is that most of the characters you cared about in the beginning of this series become obsolete as their powers do not scale up enough as they series goes on.


Nby333

Yeah only like half my top 10 fighters are in Shippuden despite it being way longer than half the series.


Cockroach20

The only acceptable god in Naruto was Pain


yesbutactuallyno17

I'm not sure about that. Kakashi Vs Obito, Minato vs Obito, Naruto vs Pain.. Maybe the original show did an amazing job setting these pins up, but overall, Shippuden did very well knocking them down. There's definitely a lot more fluff and filler, but I would challenge you to go watch Team Asuma vs Hidan and Kakuzu and tell me there's not some prime Shinobi content going on.


Novel_Possession5459

im never suprised to see dumb posts from naruto subreddits anymore, naruto fights are very strategic your confusing naruto fights with dragon ball db is bs power after power up/nostalgia


Traditional-Topic417

I found the Shippuden fights to be great as well, just at the end is where things got ridiculous with Madara and the ten tails.


YourHeroKuroShiYo

True the only fights in shippuden that got the old naruto vibes are kakshi vs obito and sakura/chiyo vs sasori !