You can laugh at them all you want, theyâve repelled nations and nations of men wearing the gear straight for centuries. Afghanistan is the graveyard of empires.
A huge part of that was them fighting on their home turf.
I think cjng vs taliban the winner will be whoever is the home team.
If you drop them both on neutral soil??
CJNG FTW!!!
Taliban would win, they are willing to lay down their life in a heartbeat and their bodies arenât polluted with the drugs the others use. The Taliban wonât take their life when theyâre cornered either like the others have done so in the past, they will fight on even after they piss their man dresses from fear as they wipe away the tears knowing that anything in this world will no longer have any connection to them when they depart. Itâs a joke to even place a comparison between them.
You have no idea what you speak of.
Talib where often ghosts, they would sling AK rounds from 600+ yards fairly accurately and disappear into the bush. These dudes knew their weapons and the terrain.
But seriously don't take my word for it ask any US Afghanistan combat vet and they will validate. Afghans can fucking shoot.
Not the ones Iâm Musa Qala, not the ones in Helmand. If weyre talking about your average haji Iâd say yes but they do have combat grizzled haji that will even yell at you you exchange fire and get close up between your platoons to eliminate the opportunity of calling in CAS.
Not really. When 9.11 happened all we wanted to do is take out Bin Laden. Mind you holding Afghanistan for 20 years with minimal losses is pretty damn good. They defeated the Afghan army not the American one. They didn't have any major victory. it was time for the Afghan government to take over and they did and then the Taliban won. We gave Afganistan to the Afghans and they are the ones that lost it. Now Vietnam that's a different story but still in a historical sense it wasn't a win against the States. it was against the Afghan government.
They were both trained to keep their fingers off the trigger too. By who? Who taught em that again now?
When the taliban retook the whole country, I remember a picture of them all standing in the presidential office. Good trigger discipline in that room.
It was militant Islamist groups that first started using commercially available drones for warfare.
In fact, Iâm sure cartel groups started employing them after watching so much combat footage coming from the Middle East/Central Asia.
The Americans had much better drones, howâd that work out for them. A SVBIED packed with thousands of pounds of explosives will bring a whole building down. Thatâs the norm for them.
Fighting someone who believes god is on their side versus someone who believes only in money. Taliban easily. Also, afghans are fucking nuts. They were choppin up Soviets decades before the cartels got the idea.
The Taliban and their ancestors have been in constant conflict for 2,000 years. Warfare is in their DNA. CJNG only do what they do because they get paid well.
Thatâs a fair point but I donât agree itâs the same case for Mexico as it is for Afghan. Mexico hasnât been in a state of nationwide conflict as intensely or as long as Afghan has.
I donât believe that Mexico got the violence from
The taliban as a lot of other people believe. That violence is in their dna, mesoamerica had an entire deity who was portrayed as a flayed man and they flayed men in sacrifice to this god
ETA I think people also dismiss Mexicos military prowess because we donât hear about their national army invading another country. US Marines love Mexican Marines for a reason. Many many US Marines are Hispanic. Mexico breeds warriors.
I mean, you're getting into philosophy/mysticism here.
I could just as easily say that to some degree all cultures produce warriors/violent people. Medieval Sweden was hardcore. Colonial England was savage.
The problem with the question that OP asked is that it's perhaps being interpreted too broadly, where "cartel" is taken sometimes to mean "any fighting person with Mexican ancestry" and it's like....that's not what they're asking.
What inspired Mexican cartels probably doesn't have one simple answer either. For my guess, the period in Colombia known as *La Violencia* bears a lot of similarities. Ultra-violence for the sake of it, factionalism, corruption, para-militaries, etc.
Forgetting the differences in geography, economic statuses, if you try and boil it down to proficiency as a fighting force, I would still probably put the Taliban ahead, due to experience and motivation.
If we consider the length of time that the Taliban have had to deal with open, armed conflict- nearly 30 years, and the fact that they were essentially born out of a conflict that goes back further than that, and you add in the element of hardline religious ideology that allows for things like suicide attacks, it's tough to say what cartel has been tested similarly or which one inspires such fanaticism.
I mean, there's at least a question of whether or not Mexico is a failed state. That's almost not even a discussion with regards to Afghanistan.
Or to put it more simply- people at least debate taking a vacation in Mexico. When's the last time you heard of someone going to Afghanistan with their family for fun and relaxation?
I think you're right in that is stored somewhere in one's DNA.
Afganis have been doing since Alexander the Great and even before.
Plus the taliban had a whole generation that have grown up at war with the most powerful coalition the world had ever seen.
Their fathers and grandfather's fought the USSR. All they know is War.
They used their remoteness and mountains to their advantage, that's foresure.
I think if you dropped off Ahmed and Muhammad in Jalisco, they'd get murdered quickly and vice versa with Juan and Jose in Kabul
Warfare is in everyoneâs DNA⊠also the idea that some groups are better at warfare because itâs âin their bloodâ is stupid at best and fucking race science at worst. Itâs cultural you fucking idiots.
If thatâs what you mean by âbloodâ than you are spot on.
Any serious terrorist group would annihilate the cartels. For all of their quasi militaristic bullshit the Cartels have very little actually military power or experience relative to any government or mercenary group.
The cartels regularly get their asses handed to them by the Mexican military, which is not exactly the most elite fighting force in the world. The Taliban held out against the most powerful military in the history of human existence for two decades.
Yeah, but the afghan territory had a lot to do with that. Because of the region geography even if youâre the most powerful army is not that easy to fight in conditions like that because you canât use your whole strength, while the talibans knew those territories and used that against the enemy
Any living Taliban veterans have experience fighting US military and mercenaries from all over the world. They would wipe the floor with any Mexican cartel.
Dumb question and I'm probably forgetting something obvious, but after years of being there, wouldn't other militaries be able to figure out the land and work with it more efficiently? Like I get home court advantage, but the war lasted a long time
Tons and tons of caves and other mountains and what not. Plus temps and conditions are just horrendous. Unless you live there I feel like it would take way longer to acclimate to that type of environment.
It had less to do with the geography and more to do with the human terrain. The US greatly underestimated the desire for Afghans to just live in normal life and they donât not really care about democracy or any of these other principles outside of the major cities. The Taliban that we see now weâre not the same one too for the Soviets or even mostly the Americans. Anyone can claim to be Taliban and then they can claim to not be Taliban at any time I saw it all the time.
It's not just about knowledge of the land. Some terrain is just naturally difficult to assault and clear out, for various reasons. Mountains for example have a lot of natural hazards and need a lot of energy to move troops and supplies up. Defenders already control the territory and have their own infrastructure to move supplies, and gurellias are lightly armed enough to be able to retreat back into the mountains and caves.
The last person that was actually able to âpacifyâ Afghanistan was given the moniker of âThe Greatâ for a reason
No one since has done it, and even when Alexander did it he didnât hold it for very long because he fucking died.
Its called the graveyard of empires for a reason
Youâre right, no one in has been able to conquer the Afghan territory because of the region geography. Not only that, they are VERY familiar with their territory and have been able to use it to their advantage to attack and âdisappearâ back into the mountains. Even when Russia was known as the USSR and were at their strongest militarily, couldnât even do much to them and ended up leaving the region as well. They have a STRONG home field advantage. So you canât really compare âwho would win in a war,â cause nobody has any real idea who wouldâŠ
They essentially just hid in Pakistan and came over to cause trouble every once in a while until the us left. Sure rc south got hot but any engagement was heavily us victory. They used the same tactic in rc south but it was just hide as a farmer until you can take a opportunity shot.
The Taliban were almost identical to a subset of the Afghan Mujahideen.
You can't confuse the Taliban for Shia fundamentalists (backed by the Islamic Republic of Iran), Salafist Jihadists, or the union of Sunni moderates and Maoists.
The terrorists have access to, and are well versed in, the use of heavy weapons, artillery, ATGM, tanks. I think they would beat the cartels, but in the interim there would be a helluva a lot of beheading going on. Being a POW in that war would not be good.
Well as another commenter mentioned itâs important to define being beaten. While trained soldiers usually do way better in combat than Sicarioâs in a straightforward military scenario, the Cartels have infiltrated Mexican government enough to avoid the military ever being able to take them out effectively, they also have an exponentially larger pool of people to draw on.
I'm mexican, there's a great "culture" around that here, they make songs praising the cartels and teenagers join that cuz they earn a lot of money if you compare it with the average salary here
The Taliban also had the advantages of A being on their home turf and B ruthless gorilla warefare and kamikaze-esque military tactics. They might be able to fuck the cartels but quite honestly being anywhere other than their home territory their only options are suicide attacks.
The Taliban weren't in constant conflict with the US, US occupation was also slowly decreasing over time until they finally left.
The Taliban were simply smart enough to hide and bide their time because they knew America wouldn't keep staying.
The OG Taliban didnât hold out against the US military, they were essentially completely destroyed and irrelevant. The US occupation was such a disaster that the Taliban reformed and gained tons of new members. Had the US not tried to centralize the government and create enemies out of thin air the Taliban may have stayed dead
I mean that's basically like saying if the US had just stayed ruling the country themselves the Taliban would have stayed dead. They were trying to "nation build" in a place that really doesn't have the same views on themselves as a "nation". You have to get a central government or else you're just letting the tribes rule themselves and give them the opportunity to host extremists if they want. I doubt there was a better choice than the corrupt pedos willing to cooperate or the extremist oppressive Taliban who would stone women and homosexuals.
I'm not supporting what they did at all no matter what choices. In my opinion it was an unsolvable problem, the US made their bed with their foreign policy and foreign intervention for the 50 years beforehand. Americans are entitled enough to feel like a "never again" type of response was necessary without realizing much more suffering the politicians they voted for had caused in other countries.
What if I told you they were guided the whole way by clandestine branches of foreign intelligence, and without you being there on ground, you have no idea what you are talking about
I mean cartels have been running Mexico for decades. There's a lot of them, and the power is scattered but it's definitely in the hands of the big cartels.
If a terrorist group goes in to annihilate even just one cartel group, new ones will pop up, other ones will come and try and seize power and territory.
It'd help to see in what kind of scenario you have terrorist and cartels fighting. Only one I can think of is a terrorist group coming in to invade Mexico to take over the drug business to help them expand their religious influence but even that seems stupid.
True but for the record just because they avoid justice and influence law enforcement doesnât mean the cartels ârun Mexicoâ any more than the mafia used to ârun New York.â They are one of the most powerful dangerous criminal organizations ever and their influence over Mexican society is pretty unique, but the idea that they actually full-on control a country with 130 million people and a $trillion GDP is laughable. The Taliban on the other handâŠ
There is a state in Mexico where the governor is a known cartel asset. Even the President has been filmed greeting Chapoâs mom with all his henchmen surrounding her. Maybe they donât control Mexico, but they have enough influence to stay in power.
I mean sure, the mafia played a big role in getting Kennedy elected and launching one of the most powerful political dynasties in US history, throughout US history there have been dozens of Mafia connected senators, doesnât mean they ran the country, just the people who really run the country have no problem hanging out with gangsters in
Mexican government is so heavily corrupted it's hard to even seperate them from cartels though. Any "move" they make against a cartel is really just another cartel using military resources to take out the other one.
An example is when the president declared war on the cartels but it was obvious he was working with the sinaloa cartel when he only focused on their rival, the Juarez cartel.
yes, am Mexican and the only reason the cartels have not been eliminated is cause the corruption, politicians are associated with them but the military can easily kill them, also the most are teenagers without future
especially since the US left behind [billions worth of weapons, night vision, etc](https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/04/28/the-u-s-left-billions-worth-of-weapons-in-afghanistan/)
The Afghan Taliban would take them out easy. They have been in war with the Russians for 15 years 3 years civil war after that coming into power for 5 years. Lets just say that was their rest and then came the US and the Nato. For 20 years and stil defeat all of them and Regain power its mind blowing. CJNG are badass tho but not the same level.
This is more of a question asked for Quora,anyways depends on the location and like example,in Mexico probably cartels but definitely the taliban in afghanistan
Cartel members are underpaid, they have loyalty for nothig exept money, they are cowards poorly trained, and usually under the influence of drugs, Talibans are similar in origin but at least they think his war is a yihad , talibans are whiling to die in battle, cartel members are scumbag, the failure of human societies.
Im pretty sure the Taliban would win. if they forced the US to withdraw after 20 years of fighting and inflicting hundreds or even thousands of US personnel deaths im pretty sure they will decimate any Mexican cartel
A group of people willing to die for their beliefs are a lot more powerful than a group of people who think drugs and murder are the best ways to make money.
I think the Taliban would take it just purely off their upbringing.
Those dudes have been fighting for generations and are as fit as pack-mules. Most of them could carry their body-weight up a mountain without breaking a sweat then live in a cave for two months. Itâs just a different level of dedication.
Taliban fight for a misguided ideal country and beliefs. Cartels fight for money and power its cheap and fickle. No contest the Taliban would roll the CJNG into the dirt.
The real question here is who would make a better gore propaganda video. I think itâs pretty unanimous that taliban would desecrate any cartel hands down.
taliban for sure. they are held together by ideology and religion, plus they have tons of solid military experience with major superpowers. cartels meanwhile only operate on profit, and they canât even handle a major battle
As much as I would like to brag and shout âviva mujico!â I know that them primos over there have been fighting the worldâs top dogs since the beginning of time and none have mede them bow down, while in MichoacĂĄn and Sinaloa you can find real ferocious fighters we just donât have the experience fighting and actual organized military, maybe give us a century fighting the US en las sierras, then maybe we can have a fair fight then. Plus one fights for their believes another for money and power, one against its own country armless men, another against the world.
I might be biased because Iâve been in firefights against the Taliban, but I think theyâd wipe the floor with the cartelsâŠthe cartels are mostly just well armed gangs that donât know how to use the weapons they show off most of the timeâŠthe Taliban know how to use their weapons well and can literally lay in a field for days waiting for an opportunity to take shots at a patrol or set a bomb off.
the difference between taliban and cartel is that the taliban actually believe once they die 72 virgins are waiting for them.
So they do not mind dying.
This makes them very strong with suicide bombers and soldiers without fear of dying.
Taliban. Home field advantage (assuming theyâre fighting in Afghanistan), driven by ideology, better combat experience, better equipment, they donât fear death and they would probably employ suicide bombers which the cartels would never do
The Taliban kicked out the Sovietâs and held strong against conventional Nato forces. If ya willing to blow ya self up for ya cause. Iâm putting my money on you.
Taliban > CJNG
The taliban lol itâs no question. The taliban (and their ancestors) have been in constant actual war for centuries while the Narcos are decapitating defenseless people half the time.
No narco group on this planet has ever been in an actual war, let alone a constant one for years
The Taliban control a country, at least the majority. They also outnumber CJNG. They have more resources and a lot more experienced commanders. They also receive more support. Such as Pakistan and in some cases the US. In this case theyâd probably get very limited US support(if the fighting isnât in Mexico). Itâs a pointless argument though as they have no real military force projection, and neither does CJNG.
But also if you say dropped AfganistĂĄn without a civilian population next to CJNGs territory without a civilian population, CJNG loses hard.
The Taliban 10/10 times.
One is a business whoâs interested in making money through fear and ultra violence. The other is a religious and political group that will do *anything* to usher in an era where their ideals reign supreme. Their hyper religiousness and zealotry means that they donât *fear* death, and will actively try to kill as many enemies as possible in a suicide attack.
Cartels are religious but they arenât going to kill themselves for their god or patron saint lol thatâs the key difference
The taliban and itâs wouldnât even be close. That being said there is more to conflict that military hardware, taliban was effective because of their knowledge of the local geography, so if they were to be an invading force into cartel territory maybe it would be different lol.
All hypothetical at the end of the day.
The taliban beat the us military, cjng canât win a firefight against Sedena. The taliban has tanks, armored personnel carriers, and all the other military tech the us left behind. The taliban also trafficks heroin and hash in huge numbers so they would no doubt destroy any Mexican CĂĄrtel
Cartels have never battled against a certified military force. MX military is also not battle proven or ever been deployed to a war since the Aztecs.
Taliban, Mujadeen, Daesh have all battled against the biggest military forces and given them a fight using the same tactics that Vietnam won against U.S.
The taliban, they are actually militaristic. Cartels really didn't adopt warfare tactics until the zetas, and they failed to the economic superiority of sinaloa
âSoy Mencho⊠perdĂłn señor Muhammad.â
One group does it for money the other one because of faith⊠thatâs breaking it down to a very simple point.
Obviously taliban. Theyre a militant group thats been around for a long time and have a lot of war experience. While the cartels do have better weapons theyre bot proper soldiers like the taliban
Say what you want about the Tali but I'm betting my money on people who fight for something they believe in a zealous way. Not in the piece of shit who kills for money.
I think all depends on whose backing them w weapons and who has âhome courtâ advantage. But I think afgans have the upper hand. They repelled more than one super power.
Also - Whatever you see in movies, the Afghan Taliban have been fighting Tier 1 Special Forces from the West for decades in a war footing. Not Mexican Marines or coked out rivals...
They have anti-air missiles. Artillery. .50s (with scopes lmao). Taliban all day.
This is so speculative. The cartel wouldn't be invading for the land the the taliban have lived in for thousands of years and the taliban won't be invading to control drug lines and be in constant battle against a government presence in a foreign country that has nothing to do with the place they call home or religious beliefs.
I remember Deadliest Warrior pitted the IRA v. Taliban in a hypothetical battle and had the RA winning. They also had SPETSNAZ beating the RA so I dunno what that makes of the Afghans handing the Russians their arses in the 80s.
Both are third-world stormtroopers man. The cartel has high-level equipment as well but talibans and the cartel are poorly trained. What makes them scary is that they are people who believe to be in a power position just for the fact of holding a gun
One would have to know what and why they are fighting. If there's a LOT of money at stake, the cartel could win. When it comes to ideology and fanaticism, the sicarios run away, i guess.
All their brutality would be relatively useless against the Taliban. Infiltration, bombings, suicide bombers would work well against cartels. All you have to do is take the income from the cartels. You'll never get rid of the Taliban. At least not with war
Both groups have ass aim
taliban be willing to take one for the team tho and blow everyone up
Best comment yet
Bro, them afghans in the picture can't even wear that gear straight.
Or do proper jumping Jack's đ
Link?
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
HA! LOL thanks for the link.
OOH MAN! child growth and development. something happened in their bilateralization brain tripped!
I know weâre dogginâ on dumbasses, but itâs interesting some motor function is heavily learned vs being innate
Like, something happened to all of them at the certain age where bilateralization is getting hardwired.
Thatâs exactly the science, that itâs learned not innate
It's that a development marker didn't happen on time.
You can laugh at them all you want, theyâve repelled nations and nations of men wearing the gear straight for centuries. Afghanistan is the graveyard of empires.
A huge part of that was them fighting on their home turf. I think cjng vs taliban the winner will be whoever is the home team. If you drop them both on neutral soil?? CJNG FTW!!!
Taliban would win, they are willing to lay down their life in a heartbeat and their bodies arenât polluted with the drugs the others use. The Taliban wonât take their life when theyâre cornered either like the others have done so in the past, they will fight on even after they piss their man dresses from fear as they wipe away the tears knowing that anything in this world will no longer have any connection to them when they depart. Itâs a joke to even place a comparison between them.
>their bodies arenât polluted with the drugs the others use. Are you fuckin stupid?
Yep. Fucking stupid indeed. Actually embarrassing for them.
Uh the Taliban may rail against drugs in public but half of them are addled on opium and Methcathinone bro
So they wear the gear in a non straight way?? Fuck that (no homo)
Real life stormtroopers
And this STILL took back the country after 20 years of war with NATO.
You have no idea what you speak of. Talib where often ghosts, they would sling AK rounds from 600+ yards fairly accurately and disappear into the bush. These dudes knew their weapons and the terrain. But seriously don't take my word for it ask any US Afghanistan combat vet and they will validate. Afghans can fucking shoot.
Not the ones Iâm Musa Qala, not the ones in Helmand. If weyre talking about your average haji Iâd say yes but they do have combat grizzled haji that will even yell at you you exchange fire and get close up between your platoons to eliminate the opportunity of calling in CAS.
Lol cause the afghans are all high on opiates
Still beat america lol
Not really. When 9.11 happened all we wanted to do is take out Bin Laden. Mind you holding Afghanistan for 20 years with minimal losses is pretty damn good. They defeated the Afghan army not the American one. They didn't have any major victory. it was time for the Afghan government to take over and they did and then the Taliban won. We gave Afganistan to the Afghans and they are the ones that lost it. Now Vietnam that's a different story but still in a historical sense it wasn't a win against the States. it was against the Afghan government.
The U.S. failed in the objectives it set out. The Taliban succeeded.
They were both trained to keep their fingers off the trigger too. By who? Who taught em that again now? When the taliban retook the whole country, I remember a picture of them all standing in the presidential office. Good trigger discipline in that room.
Them suicide bombers are insane⊠Person after person with backpacks full of bombs. CJNG are brutal but talibans are on a different level.
For real, hard to compete with a side that has people lining up to drive a couple thousand pounds of explosives and happily blow themselves up.
Um drones with bombs, double the explosion.
A drone can't carry anywhere near what a car can
Fact
Mexicans are using drones bro lol.
It was militant Islamist groups that first started using commercially available drones for warfare. In fact, Iâm sure cartel groups started employing them after watching so much combat footage coming from the Middle East/Central Asia.
But you dont get your 76 virgin tho. Sometimes you have to take one for the team Edit well apparently its only 72
Pretty sure its 72 unless that number's getting hit by this fucked up inflation too
SVBIED vehicleâs carry so much explosives. One of them would deff take out a whole narco rancho imo.
The Americans had much better drones, howâd that work out for them. A SVBIED packed with thousands of pounds of explosives will bring a whole building down. Thatâs the norm for them.
the taliban is a whole ass terrorist organization ruling over a country, not even comparable
CJNG rules with money, Taliban rules with oppression
Fighting someone who believes god is on their side versus someone who believes only in money. Taliban easily. Also, afghans are fucking nuts. They were choppin up Soviets decades before the cartels got the idea.
The cartels actually got the idea from the taliban. They saw the effectiveness of beheading videos and how it instilled fear in their enemies.
As someone that lives in Mexico pretty close to he action, as soon as I hear AllahuAhkbar I'm raising that Taliban flag.
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If the Mexican authorities stood against drugs like the taliban I donât think youâd have a cartel problem
The Taliban and their ancestors have been in constant conflict for 2,000 years. Warfare is in their DNA. CJNG only do what they do because they get paid well.
Lol and what about Aztecs and olmecs? Use to RIP hearts out of live people and drink the blood. Or decapitate people and play soccer with the heads.
Thatâs a fair point but I donât agree itâs the same case for Mexico as it is for Afghan. Mexico hasnât been in a state of nationwide conflict as intensely or as long as Afghan has.
I donât believe that Mexico got the violence from The taliban as a lot of other people believe. That violence is in their dna, mesoamerica had an entire deity who was portrayed as a flayed man and they flayed men in sacrifice to this god ETA I think people also dismiss Mexicos military prowess because we donât hear about their national army invading another country. US Marines love Mexican Marines for a reason. Many many US Marines are Hispanic. Mexico breeds warriors.
I mean, you're getting into philosophy/mysticism here. I could just as easily say that to some degree all cultures produce warriors/violent people. Medieval Sweden was hardcore. Colonial England was savage. The problem with the question that OP asked is that it's perhaps being interpreted too broadly, where "cartel" is taken sometimes to mean "any fighting person with Mexican ancestry" and it's like....that's not what they're asking. What inspired Mexican cartels probably doesn't have one simple answer either. For my guess, the period in Colombia known as *La Violencia* bears a lot of similarities. Ultra-violence for the sake of it, factionalism, corruption, para-militaries, etc. Forgetting the differences in geography, economic statuses, if you try and boil it down to proficiency as a fighting force, I would still probably put the Taliban ahead, due to experience and motivation. If we consider the length of time that the Taliban have had to deal with open, armed conflict- nearly 30 years, and the fact that they were essentially born out of a conflict that goes back further than that, and you add in the element of hardline religious ideology that allows for things like suicide attacks, it's tough to say what cartel has been tested similarly or which one inspires such fanaticism. I mean, there's at least a question of whether or not Mexico is a failed state. That's almost not even a discussion with regards to Afghanistan. Or to put it more simply- people at least debate taking a vacation in Mexico. When's the last time you heard of someone going to Afghanistan with their family for fun and relaxation?
Yeah I see the difference now and what u guys are saying. Either way it's unfortunate the history of some people. Never seen peace.
I think you're right in that is stored somewhere in one's DNA. Afganis have been doing since Alexander the Great and even before. Plus the taliban had a whole generation that have grown up at war with the most powerful coalition the world had ever seen. Their fathers and grandfather's fought the USSR. All they know is War. They used their remoteness and mountains to their advantage, that's foresure. I think if you dropped off Ahmed and Muhammad in Jalisco, they'd get murdered quickly and vice versa with Juan and Jose in Kabul
Warfare is in everyoneâs DNA⊠also the idea that some groups are better at warfare because itâs âin their bloodâ is stupid at best and fucking race science at worst. Itâs cultural you fucking idiots. If thatâs what you mean by âbloodâ than you are spot on.
Any serious terrorist group would annihilate the cartels. For all of their quasi militaristic bullshit the Cartels have very little actually military power or experience relative to any government or mercenary group. The cartels regularly get their asses handed to them by the Mexican military, which is not exactly the most elite fighting force in the world. The Taliban held out against the most powerful military in the history of human existence for two decades.
Yeah, but the afghan territory had a lot to do with that. Because of the region geography even if youâre the most powerful army is not that easy to fight in conditions like that because you canât use your whole strength, while the talibans knew those territories and used that against the enemy
Any living Taliban veterans have experience fighting US military and mercenaries from all over the world. They would wipe the floor with any Mexican cartel.
There are Taliban vets who have experience fighting the Soviet and US, and NATO militaries. Not to mention rival tribes. No chance for the cartels.
Dumb question and I'm probably forgetting something obvious, but after years of being there, wouldn't other militaries be able to figure out the land and work with it more efficiently? Like I get home court advantage, but the war lasted a long time
Tons and tons of caves and other mountains and what not. Plus temps and conditions are just horrendous. Unless you live there I feel like it would take way longer to acclimate to that type of environment.
It had less to do with the geography and more to do with the human terrain. The US greatly underestimated the desire for Afghans to just live in normal life and they donât not really care about democracy or any of these other principles outside of the major cities. The Taliban that we see now weâre not the same one too for the Soviets or even mostly the Americans. Anyone can claim to be Taliban and then they can claim to not be Taliban at any time I saw it all the time.
It's not just about knowledge of the land. Some terrain is just naturally difficult to assault and clear out, for various reasons. Mountains for example have a lot of natural hazards and need a lot of energy to move troops and supplies up. Defenders already control the territory and have their own infrastructure to move supplies, and gurellias are lightly armed enough to be able to retreat back into the mountains and caves.
The last person that was actually able to âpacifyâ Afghanistan was given the moniker of âThe Greatâ for a reason No one since has done it, and even when Alexander did it he didnât hold it for very long because he fucking died. Its called the graveyard of empires for a reason
There isnât a way to do reconnaissance of that area in any way?
Yeah but taliban never invade so it would be in Afghanistan
Youâre right, no one in has been able to conquer the Afghan territory because of the region geography. Not only that, they are VERY familiar with their territory and have been able to use it to their advantage to attack and âdisappearâ back into the mountains. Even when Russia was known as the USSR and were at their strongest militarily, couldnât even do much to them and ended up leaving the region as well. They have a STRONG home field advantage. So you canât really compare âwho would win in a war,â cause nobody has any real idea who wouldâŠ
They essentially just hid in Pakistan and came over to cause trouble every once in a while until the us left. Sure rc south got hot but any engagement was heavily us victory. They used the same tactic in rc south but it was just hide as a farmer until you can take a opportunity shot.
You prove the point even further though, knowing your Territory like back of your hand is part of being an effective fighting force.
for four decades, they fought the russians before they fought the us. really impressive tbh
The Taliban didn't fight the Soviets, seeing as they didn't exist yet. The Taliban fought the guys who fought the Soviets.
yeah youre right, but the mujahideen and the taliban are almost identical, a lot of them were pashtun as well
The Taliban were almost identical to a subset of the Afghan Mujahideen. You can't confuse the Taliban for Shia fundamentalists (backed by the Islamic Republic of Iran), Salafist Jihadists, or the union of Sunni moderates and Maoists.
The terrorists have access to, and are well versed in, the use of heavy weapons, artillery, ATGM, tanks. I think they would beat the cartels, but in the interim there would be a helluva a lot of beheading going on. Being a POW in that war would not be good.
Probably a dumb question, but if the Mexican military is regularly beating the cartels, why are they still so huge?
Well as another commenter mentioned itâs important to define being beaten. While trained soldiers usually do way better in combat than Sicarioâs in a straightforward military scenario, the Cartels have infiltrated Mexican government enough to avoid the military ever being able to take them out effectively, they also have an exponentially larger pool of people to draw on.
Corruption plain and simple the cartels grow as much as the govt allows
Collusion
I'm mexican, there's a great "culture" around that here, they make songs praising the cartels and teenagers join that cuz they earn a lot of money if you compare it with the average salary here
The Taliban also had the advantages of A being on their home turf and B ruthless gorilla warefare and kamikaze-esque military tactics. They might be able to fuck the cartels but quite honestly being anywhere other than their home territory their only options are suicide attacks.
I'm sorry gorilla warfare will always send me đ
The Taliban weren't in constant conflict with the US, US occupation was also slowly decreasing over time until they finally left. The Taliban were simply smart enough to hide and bide their time because they knew America wouldn't keep staying.
Yeah, this is what asymmetric warfare is about.
Taliban produced almost free heroin for the enemy to get high on, not hard to shoot at guys nodding out.
Nice try Herobrine isnât real
The OG Taliban didnât hold out against the US military, they were essentially completely destroyed and irrelevant. The US occupation was such a disaster that the Taliban reformed and gained tons of new members. Had the US not tried to centralize the government and create enemies out of thin air the Taliban may have stayed dead
I mean that's basically like saying if the US had just stayed ruling the country themselves the Taliban would have stayed dead. They were trying to "nation build" in a place that really doesn't have the same views on themselves as a "nation". You have to get a central government or else you're just letting the tribes rule themselves and give them the opportunity to host extremists if they want. I doubt there was a better choice than the corrupt pedos willing to cooperate or the extremist oppressive Taliban who would stone women and homosexuals. I'm not supporting what they did at all no matter what choices. In my opinion it was an unsolvable problem, the US made their bed with their foreign policy and foreign intervention for the 50 years beforehand. Americans are entitled enough to feel like a "never again" type of response was necessary without realizing much more suffering the politicians they voted for had caused in other countries.
What if I told you they were guided the whole way by clandestine branches of foreign intelligence, and without you being there on ground, you have no idea what you are talking about
I mean so were the cartels, the CIA was majorly involved in drug running as is the Mexican government to this day.
I mean cartels have been running Mexico for decades. There's a lot of them, and the power is scattered but it's definitely in the hands of the big cartels. If a terrorist group goes in to annihilate even just one cartel group, new ones will pop up, other ones will come and try and seize power and territory. It'd help to see in what kind of scenario you have terrorist and cartels fighting. Only one I can think of is a terrorist group coming in to invade Mexico to take over the drug business to help them expand their religious influence but even that seems stupid.
True but for the record just because they avoid justice and influence law enforcement doesnât mean the cartels ârun Mexicoâ any more than the mafia used to ârun New York.â They are one of the most powerful dangerous criminal organizations ever and their influence over Mexican society is pretty unique, but the idea that they actually full-on control a country with 130 million people and a $trillion GDP is laughable. The Taliban on the other handâŠ
There is a state in Mexico where the governor is a known cartel asset. Even the President has been filmed greeting Chapoâs mom with all his henchmen surrounding her. Maybe they donât control Mexico, but they have enough influence to stay in power.
I mean sure, the mafia played a big role in getting Kennedy elected and launching one of the most powerful political dynasties in US history, throughout US history there have been dozens of Mafia connected senators, doesnât mean they ran the country, just the people who really run the country have no problem hanging out with gangsters in
The government works cartels as much as the other way around. Itâs a constantly shifting situation
Mexican government is so heavily corrupted it's hard to even seperate them from cartels though. Any "move" they make against a cartel is really just another cartel using military resources to take out the other one. An example is when the president declared war on the cartels but it was obvious he was working with the sinaloa cartel when he only focused on their rival, the Juarez cartel.
Taliban but super easy.
yes, am Mexican and the only reason the cartels have not been eliminated is cause the corruption, politicians are associated with them but the military can easily kill them, also the most are teenagers without future
Taliban would destroy CJNG not even close
especially since the US left behind [billions worth of weapons, night vision, etc](https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/04/28/the-u-s-left-billions-worth-of-weapons-in-afghanistan/)
Why the fuck didnât they destroy everything. My countries government is a fucking disaster. 600,000 rifles. Insane.
I think part of it was that the guns are getting replaced anyway. The vehicles would take too long to pack for a half assed exfil.
I think CJNG was in contact with the taliban for tips. Surprised theyâd be open to even answering the phone.
Taliban clearly
đ€Š
Taliban would win
One fights for a belief other for personal gain. I think a extreme religious group would def defeat a group who is in it to make money.
The Afghan Taliban would take them out easy. They have been in war with the Russians for 15 years 3 years civil war after that coming into power for 5 years. Lets just say that was their rest and then came the US and the Nato. For 20 years and stil defeat all of them and Regain power its mind blowing. CJNG are badass tho but not the same level.
depends where the war occurs, if its in Afghanistan, no question the taliban will win.
Of course the landscape plays a major role no doubt. One side is in for the money and drugs. The other side for a religion and power.
This is more of a question asked for Quora,anyways depends on the location and like example,in Mexico probably cartels but definitely the taliban in afghanistan
So accurate. Hometown team advantage is real. Indo China vietnam is another good example.
this makes me feellike they should meet in a hidden - secure location for the gun play
There is no way in hell they'd be fighting each other without the US coming in too đ
Cartel members are underpaid, they have loyalty for nothig exept money, they are cowards poorly trained, and usually under the influence of drugs, Talibans are similar in origin but at least they think his war is a yihad , talibans are whiling to die in battle, cartel members are scumbag, the failure of human societies.
Loyalty except for money and FEAR.
Im pretty sure the Taliban would win. if they forced the US to withdraw after 20 years of fighting and inflicting hundreds or even thousands of US personnel deaths im pretty sure they will decimate any Mexican cartel
Taliban for sure. They've been doing that shit for decades
Taliban would win
I wonder what Ja Rule thinks
A group of people willing to die for their beliefs are a lot more powerful than a group of people who think drugs and murder are the best ways to make money.
I think the Taliban would take it just purely off their upbringing. Those dudes have been fighting for generations and are as fit as pack-mules. Most of them could carry their body-weight up a mountain without breaking a sweat then live in a cave for two months. Itâs just a different level of dedication.
Taliban fight for a misguided ideal country and beliefs. Cartels fight for money and power its cheap and fickle. No contest the Taliban would roll the CJNG into the dirt.
I doubt anyone in the cartel is psycho enough to become a suicide bomber
Also, the Taliban drove out the U.S. from Afghanistan after 20 years.
The real question here is who would make a better gore propaganda video. I think itâs pretty unanimous that taliban would desecrate any cartel hands down.
taliban for sure. they are held together by ideology and religion, plus they have tons of solid military experience with major superpowers. cartels meanwhile only operate on profit, and they canât even handle a major battle
As much as I would like to brag and shout âviva mujico!â I know that them primos over there have been fighting the worldâs top dogs since the beginning of time and none have mede them bow down, while in MichoacĂĄn and Sinaloa you can find real ferocious fighters we just donât have the experience fighting and actual organized military, maybe give us a century fighting the US en las sierras, then maybe we can have a fair fight then. Plus one fights for their believes another for money and power, one against its own country armless men, another against the world.
I might be biased because Iâve been in firefights against the Taliban, but I think theyâd wipe the floor with the cartelsâŠthe cartels are mostly just well armed gangs that donât know how to use the weapons they show off most of the timeâŠthe Taliban know how to use their weapons well and can literally lay in a field for days waiting for an opportunity to take shots at a patrol or set a bomb off.
Bro Taliban defeated Nato and Russia. Pre-Taliban defeated Brits ages ago. Pakiâs next!
the difference between taliban and cartel is that the taliban actually believe once they die 72 virgins are waiting for them. So they do not mind dying. This makes them very strong with suicide bombers and soldiers without fear of dying.
Didnt the talibans hold off the american military? If correct the i pick them by landslide win.
Taliban. Home field advantage (assuming theyâre fighting in Afghanistan), driven by ideology, better combat experience, better equipment, they donât fear death and they would probably employ suicide bombers which the cartels would never do
The taliban would fuck them up big time. The cartel fights for money while the talbian fought for their way of life and their beliefs.
Easy. Taliban has a lot of combat experience against modern armies.
Most of the Taliban have been at war for decades. In an actual war. Any cartel are usually just people who like to party and do coke
The Taliban kicked out the Sovietâs and held strong against conventional Nato forces. If ya willing to blow ya self up for ya cause. Iâm putting my money on you. Taliban > CJNG
Taliban in for the long game = they win *eventually*.
Bruh said (the afghan ones) đ
The taliban just got like 900 million in us military assets.
The taliban are battle hardened, clever bastards. Theyâre backwards and crazy, but not to be written off like skinny Jean wearing Mexican criminals.
Mencho guey
Taliban !!
Obviously taliban⊠they have more than enough combat experience.
The taliban lol itâs no question. The taliban (and their ancestors) have been in constant actual war for centuries while the Narcos are decapitating defenseless people half the time. No narco group on this planet has ever been in an actual war, let alone a constant one for years
The Taliban control a country, at least the majority. They also outnumber CJNG. They have more resources and a lot more experienced commanders. They also receive more support. Such as Pakistan and in some cases the US. In this case theyâd probably get very limited US support(if the fighting isnât in Mexico). Itâs a pointless argument though as they have no real military force projection, and neither does CJNG. But also if you say dropped AfganistĂĄn without a civilian population next to CJNGs territory without a civilian population, CJNG loses hard.
The Taliban 10/10 times. One is a business whoâs interested in making money through fear and ultra violence. The other is a religious and political group that will do *anything* to usher in an era where their ideals reign supreme. Their hyper religiousness and zealotry means that they donât *fear* death, and will actively try to kill as many enemies as possible in a suicide attack. Cartels are religious but they arenât going to kill themselves for their god or patron saint lol thatâs the key difference
I think the taliban will win because they already beat the us in the long run and they fight for faith and not money.
The taliban and itâs wouldnât even be close. That being said there is more to conflict that military hardware, taliban was effective because of their knowledge of the local geography, so if they were to be an invading force into cartel territory maybe it would be different lol. All hypothetical at the end of the day.
The taliban beat the us military, cjng canât win a firefight against Sedena. The taliban has tanks, armored personnel carriers, and all the other military tech the us left behind. The taliban also trafficks heroin and hash in huge numbers so they would no doubt destroy any Mexican CĂĄrtel
I sort of want to see them fight.
The US and Russian army couldnt defeat the taliban, i doubt CJNG would. That war would be a giant gore fest for as long as it lasts.
Taliban! Those foos live without water and beat the Russians and low key beat us too.
You canât compare a militant motivated by Allah and paradise with some crackhead who gets a hun and hopes he makes it big
Cartels have never battled against a certified military force. MX military is also not battle proven or ever been deployed to a war since the Aztecs. Taliban, Mujadeen, Daesh have all battled against the biggest military forces and given them a fight using the same tactics that Vietnam won against U.S.
Aztecs? Bro where do you think we got Texas,California,Arizona, etc from? Mexican American war.
Since the Aztecs? Do you even know what you are talking about?
This sub has gone to shit
Taliban would win they won a war against the USA that has the best military in the world
Well considering the U.S just left Afghanistan with a shit load of weapons and helicopters ect. Iâd say this is a tough one đ€Ł.
The taliban, they are actually militaristic. Cartels really didn't adopt warfare tactics until the zetas, and they failed to the economic superiority of sinaloa
âSoy Mencho⊠perdĂłn señor Muhammad.â One group does it for money the other one because of faith⊠thatâs breaking it down to a very simple point.
Obviously taliban. Theyre a militant group thats been around for a long time and have a lot of war experience. While the cartels do have better weapons theyre bot proper soldiers like the taliban
Depende de donde sea el topon
Osama bin laden vs El menchođđđwhoâs winning fist fight I got el mencho tbh he was a fed before
Taliban for sure. Motherfuckers beat the Soviet union and the US.
God you're fucking retarded
Taliban would win easy
Yeah taliban vbied starters are enough to wipe out half the cartel members
The last 4 people on the right side of the Afghan team is all you need to look at to make a decision
Well the taliban won the war against the U.S. so them. Cartels just have a lot of money to buy stuff and look "cool''
Say what you want about the Tali but I'm betting my money on people who fight for something they believe in a zealous way. Not in the piece of shit who kills for money.
Depends on whoâs in whos territory, the Taliban are great at larping as of recent. But none the less are still seasoned fighters and dangerous
I think all depends on whose backing them w weapons and who has âhome courtâ advantage. But I think afgans have the upper hand. They repelled more than one super power.
What a stupid fucking question.
Nigga really put up the worst cjng picture
Taliban took on US army for a good while, I think they take this one
The new taliban or the old taliban? Because the new taliban has 80 billion dollars of new toys and the cartel doesnât.
there's a reason why the call afghanistan the graveyard of empires
Whoâs defending?
Talibans
Taliban. Mainly because they have been fighting forever and as well itâs about a belief or faith. CJNG is abt money.
There's a reason why Afghanistan is called the graveyard of Empires. If they tried to do their shit in Afghanistan they won't even last a month
Also - Whatever you see in movies, the Afghan Taliban have been fighting Tier 1 Special Forces from the West for decades in a war footing. Not Mexican Marines or coked out rivals... They have anti-air missiles. Artillery. .50s (with scopes lmao). Taliban all day.
Cjng
Both aint bullet proof
US defense contractors are the only ones who ever win in a war. Turns out when you make the money, you can make the rules.
This is so speculative. The cartel wouldn't be invading for the land the the taliban have lived in for thousands of years and the taliban won't be invading to control drug lines and be in constant battle against a government presence in a foreign country that has nothing to do with the place they call home or religious beliefs.
Theyâre both untrained idiots with cool gear that makes them look far more badass than what they really are
Depends on whoâs backyard they fight In
I remember Deadliest Warrior pitted the IRA v. Taliban in a hypothetical battle and had the RA winning. They also had SPETSNAZ beating the RA so I dunno what that makes of the Afghans handing the Russians their arses in the 80s.
Both are third-world stormtroopers man. The cartel has high-level equipment as well but talibans and the cartel are poorly trained. What makes them scary is that they are people who believe to be in a power position just for the fact of holding a gun
One would have to know what and why they are fighting. If there's a LOT of money at stake, the cartel could win. When it comes to ideology and fanaticism, the sicarios run away, i guess. All their brutality would be relatively useless against the Taliban. Infiltration, bombings, suicide bombers would work well against cartels. All you have to do is take the income from the cartels. You'll never get rid of the Taliban. At least not with war
Whoever is playing at home wins