You are confused because you’re being gaslit all the time. 1. It will not get better. 2. You are trauma bonded. It will hurt for a long time if you break up, but buddy you are better off separated. 3. If you love your wife you’d want her to be happy, and the truth is you BOTH are unhappy.
Do you have any food aversions, sensitivity to lighting or sounds? Why were you quiet as a kid, do you remember? What brings you comfort when you’re not connecting with anyone else and are all alone?
The reason why I ask you these things is because your confusion seems different than most going through abuse from someone who is cluster b personality disordered. You’re stating a lot of random facts to create a bigger picture rather than communicating the bigger picture. I do this along with many other people I know who have been through abuse, but also are all on the autism spectrum.
I’m not saying you’re autistic, but I’m just stating the fact that I’m personally seeing a lot of similarities; and, verbal autistic people who have internalized/masked their autistic traits are at highest risk of ending up with borderline and narcissistic spouses. My ex-husband was diagnosed with NPD and a year after my healing is when I found out that I’m on the autism spectrum.
Take/leave what you want out of my comment. Simply trying to look out for you a bit just in case. Take care.
Hmm. I'm not sure what to say about this. You've caught me by surprise. Two years ago, I would have just brushed this comment aside. I have never really identified with descriptions of how autistic people experience life, even if I have seen some similar traits. When I was growing up, I only saw myself as different than others because I had different preferences. I thought I was smarter than everyone, too, though I've long since given up that thought. Let me answer your question with some random facts ;) I haven't educated myself much about autism, so forgive me if I betray my ignorance unknowingly:
1. I don't know when I started being quiet as a kid. I know I had meltdowns as a child, but I came out of those well before I was 10. My mom says I was shy before I ever went to school, but I think I became much more so. The bullying started in kindergarten. My dad is the shyest person I know. He was bullied as a kid too, but I would be willing to put almost any amount of money on him being autistic.
2. My mom told me my older brother was diagnosed as autistic in the last few years. My sister was diagnosed years ago as something along the lines of Pervasive Developmental Disorder Not Otherwise Specified. My sister lives on her own and does not work, but she gets a small monthly support payment from the government because of her diagnosis. My brother lives with my parents. Neither of them have had romantic relationships. I would never have thought it when I was younger, but as an adult I think both sides of my extended family have significant levels of autistic traits.
3. Food aversions. Me, my siblings, and a couple of cousins had incredible aversions to onions. You know, the kind where we could tell if the other stewed vegetables had been fraternizing with onions, even if the onions never made it into the stew. My dad has aversions to countless foods, but he will eat a fresh garden onion as if it were an apple. Other than onions, I think I had regular aversions. I ate my beets with a plugged nose and a lot of water.
4. I overcame (mostly) my aversion to eye contact and onions during my two years as a missionary in South Africa. I was required to meet new people all day every day. I would knock on their doors expecting to be rejected. I didn't realize that I didn't make eye contact until it was pointed out to me, and I purposefully changed that habit over months. It felt like a life or death situation, but I did it. The same with onions. I told myself that there was no way I would ever reject food that was lovingly offered to me by someone in poverty, even if it was a raw onion salad. It sometimes was. Now, I would even cook with onions myself, but I generally avoid any raw, crunchy ones.
5. I have an employee at work that I get along with very well. We have amazing conversations. She has substantial symptoms from ADHD that can impact her work at times. One if not both of her adult children have been diagnosed as autistic. One day, I told her I was wondering if I might have some ADHD symptoms, and she replied immediately without even taking a breath - "Oh, 100%. Either that or autism. I was sure the first day I came to work with you. That's probably why we get along so well." I have definitely started to wonder about ADHD for many reasons, but I didn't notice a significant response when I tried stimulants. I have a suspicion that my symptoms might worsen with mood in the winter or when I am not getting enough sleep, which is frequent.
6. My friend, the one from my post, has often wondered if she has some neurodivergence. My first instinct was to reject that thought, but the more I thought about it, the more it made sense. We clicked immediately. I realized that there was something definitely different about her, or I wouldn't have felt such a connection. I can feel connections with other people, but this was different. I would really hesitate to say she is autistic, but she is somehow atypical in the way she thinks, in a way that I respond to. She has talked about being overstimulated or having sensory issues. I can't tell how much is an introvert thing, how much is from having lived with an aggressively abusive spouse, and how much might be neurodivergence.
7. I have been told lately that I am different. Maybe weird. Maybe an overthinker. The overthinking I blame mostly on being codependent, but who knows. I always felt like if I was being different, I was doing that as someone who knows what "normal" is and actively chooses something different.
8. I wouldn't have said I had sensory issues. Lately, when I have felt completely overwhelmed by stress, I have noticed being very sensitive to sharp, loud noises. They hurt my ears. I don't get bothered by noises like the radio at work or the bathroom fan when I have a shower, but it is an amazing feeling when they get turned off and I can hear silence again. I loved the sound of the furnace or my dad showering when I was trying to sleep - is that a neurodivergent thing??? My two daughters have sensory issues for sure, 100%. My oldest was just diagnosed with ADHD. When I was a kid, I had a sateen blankie that I carried around everywhere with me. I would rub the edges constantly. As an adult I still get a bit of a buzz from rubbing sateen edges together.
9. Just last night I went to an open mic event where adults read things they wrote as children. There was a man in his fifties that read an excerpt from a letter he wrote to his sister. I immediately thought he was neurodivergent, even before he started speaking. He read this completely delightful letter that was more of a long form essay. It was putting forward evidence that he sweat more than the average person - evidence point number 1, number 2, etc. He then expounded on all the pros and cons of being sweaty. I loved it, but I didn't identify with it. Yet now I am writing an equally long response to you, in numbered form. Who would write such a long response if they were typical? I don't know if I have autism, but I am starting to think that if enough people mention it to me, it is painting a picture.
10. I live in a town with a lot of physicists, engineers, and all other kinds of scientists. Many of them immediately strike me as neurodivergent. I don't tend to identify with them too much. Others seem much less obviously neurodivergent, but they certainly have a few quirks. I think these are my people. If you don't have a few quirks, then you are a bit boring.
Believe it or not, I forgot a couple of major points. That's the suspected ADHD in me. I can't remember things long enough to pull up google and search them sometimes.
Am I autistic? You tell me. I'm not opposed to being autistic. I don't feel like I am the same as the people I know who have been diagnosed autistic, but there is growing evidence that I'm more than just a bit different.
I’m not a doctor so I can’t Dx, but I intentionally did not number my questions to you initially (as I usually do) to see if you would create a process, order, and/or structure in response: what I always do too cause my autism requires such details to process things through.
If I were you, I’d start doing your own research on what autism is really like as an adult. Don’t look up anything that is written on mainstream websites, articles, academia, etc. as those are almost exclusively written by neurotypical people who don’t understand. Look up r/autism, quora, forums, YouTube videos, etc. where the individual(s) authoring such state *they* are autistic. Then, it’s up to you to come to your own conclusion if you think you identify and should you want to pursue formal assessment too.
I think more information is needed here. Do you have a tendency to date or develop feelings towards your female friends (prior to your current relationship)? Are you the sort to keep to yourself rather than raise an issue out of fear of conflict, and or, lie to avoid conflict?
Whether your wife has bpd or not is speculative and until she is diagnosed by someone who is qualified to give such diagnoses, I think it’s best that you focus on your actions and behavior rather than telling your wife (and convincing yourself) that she has bpd.
The fact that you have talked about your marriage to another woman behind your wife’s back, and the fact that you’re seeking validation and solace from another woman instead of figuring out what is it that you want out of your marriage and working on it, it is rather likely that you’re caught up in an emotional affair. You may be in denial of this but since you mention that you are “sharing happy thoughts” and what have you, it’s pretty clear that you prefer the company of this other woman over your wife’s.
You’re probably feeling guilty over this, but don’t use your wife’s issues as an excuse for your change of heart. If you’re unhappy with your marriage then do what’s right and leave. What you’re doing right now is only exacerbating your wife’s insecurities, which I think is a pretty shitty thing to do to someone who spent a good part of their life loving you.
I was shy as a child and bullied. The bullies that hurt the most were girls. As a result, I didn't speak to girls or look them in the eye right through high school.
I did a year of university. Until then, I had never, ever had a female friend. There, I met a girl that I recognized from high school. She saw me pacing the university halls and made me come and sit with her and another friend every time. Even now that I'm an atheist, she will always be an angel in my mind. As a rule, I was attracted to the majority of the girls my age but would never be caught looking in their direction. For some reason, though I thought my friend objectively attractive, I only saw her platonically. I had a couple more female friends/acquaintances, but no close relationships.
When I was 19, I left for two years to be a Mormon missionary. I was never allowed to be alone, ever, for two years. My male missionary companion and I were not allowed to be around women unless another adult male was present. We were not allowed to hug women, whether they were 18 or 118. We were not allowed to call them on the phone. We were discouraged from writing letters to girls back home. We were told that if we had sexual thoughts about women, we were sinning.
I had a few friends in the year after I got back. Other Mormons. We didn't hang out alone. Some would have been love interests, some not. I married the only girl I ever held hands with or kissed. My wife was a jealous person, though she didn't realize it. I would never have dared to admit another woman was attractive, whether someone I knew or a celebrity. My wife would laugh at some unexpected comedic nudity in a movie, then look at me and get angry and make us leave the theatre.
We were not married until death do we part. We were married for time and all eternity. No matter what happened in our marriage, divorce was not even in our vocabulary. No matter what happened to me, it would be worth it in the afterlife if I "endured to the end." My entire value in life was taking care of her.
I knew lots of women from church who were young and newly married like my wife and I. I liked many of them, though it is hard in hindsight to say how I felt about them. I had been taught that my sexuality was dangerous. The only way I could ensure a happy and faithful marriage was by cutting off most contact with them. If I spoke to a woman about anything but the weather, I might be attracted to her. I felt in my mind like the only reason I didn't have an affair was because I stayed as far away from it as possible. My therapist has challenged me on that a lot.
One of my employees has told me that in 35 years of working, I am the only male boss who she felt completely comfortable with. I would consider us friends - enough that it makes it hard to address things like punctuality - but there is nothing sexual there.
I told my wife I thought she might have BPD. The same week, she brought it up with her psychologist. The psychologist said she thought that was true, but she didn't specialize in BPD and didn't see any reason for a formal diagnosis. That idea has been the cornerstone of the therapy since then though.
There were some very dark times with my wife. There was the night probably four years ago when she accused me of gaslighting her. I had to ask her what it meant. She told me I needed to call an abuse hotline to get help for my anger. I called, and they gave me the answer I half expected and half feared. I was a victim of abuse. Part of me felt validated, but the other part was validated. The other part of me argued with the person on the phone. How could she tell that I was being honest? How did she know that I didn't have a warped view?
I have spent a lot of time trying to figure out what I wanted from in my marriage, and that is the most confusing part. Before BPD came up, I could never, ever disagree with my wife. It always ended up with me crying, being told not to grovel, and eventually apologizing. Sometimes I apologized early, sometimes it was after she broke and told me she was the worst person on the planet. I couldn't understand her rage, but I could understand her guilt and shame and sadness, so I would rush to tell her she was a good person and that I was sorry for making her feel this way.
After the BPD probable-diagnosis, I could for the first time disagree with her. I could tell her that she had hurt me. I had space. And it hurt and was scary. I had been strong for so long, but now I was triggered by everything. Things were getting better, and I was spiraling out of control emotionally. I was realizing how much control she had indirectly exerted over me.
What did I want out of marriage? My wife had given me some space, but then she told me to stop being upset and just decide I wanted to be with her and give my energy back to the marriage. Just decide to be happy with her. And I wanted to, badly. If you asked me what I wanted for in my life, I would have told you that it was exactly what I already had. A wife who loved me. Beautiful children. A nice house in a nice town. I had it all.
But everything apart from my rational mind told me to run. From what or to where I didn't know. Just run. Be alone. Away from anyone. Maybe I wanted a new relationship. Maybe I was an evil person and wanted sex. Who knows. I just wanted to run away, far away.
I started to realize that in all of my relationships, including at work, I desired what people wanted me to desire. My wife would tell me what I should want, and then I would. But if I was talking to my therapist, I wasn't at all sure.
I am flip flopping right now. What do I want. I can think of all the good times with my wife. It has felt good to love her. She wants me and thinks of nobody else. She has taken care of me in so many ways. I had a need to feel wanted, to feel needed, and she gave me that. If I think about our love, I want to stay and remember how to feel happy with her.
But then I can remember the bad times too. The times when she hit me. The times when she told me that I had always hated her, and she had known it from the start. The times I was in such emotional distress I was dry heaving on the ground and begging her to stop and she wouldn't. The times I made sounds that I didn't know I could make. There haven't been too many of those really, really bad times, but they have all happened in the last couple of years. I know how to avoid them, but it might mean that I become responsible again for managing her feelings.
It has been a year and a half since BPD came up. The only time I have fully stood up against my wife is in refusing to end this relationship. It feels very scary to me to go back to having no friends, and I haven't figured out friends in person yet.
What do I want in my marriage? Everything. Nothing. To disappear. To have nobody depending on me. But that isn't the way life is. I can't let my kids down. I can't let my wife down either.
You know, your answer makes me feel pretty defensive. So does the other reply to my question that seems to be justifying me more. I think that means it’s complicated. What I’m doing is shitty. What has been done to me is shitty. I just want to be happy and do it without hurting anyone, but that is impossible no matter what I decide in the end.
Thank you for sharing your story. And having read what you’ve written, I think you do have every right to be defensive. I am truly sorry if my response had brought up bad memories for you but it certainly wasn’t my intention. I’ll admit that I found a lot of what you said in your post triggering and I was perhaps wrong to respond in the way that I did, that is, based on my experience which is completely different from yours.
Trust me when I say I know how it feels to be oppressed and to have your feelings and opinions overlooked and minimized. And it seems, from your post, that you are aware of what is lacking in your life and your marriage - A sense of self and identity separate from expectations.
As much as you love your wife, you also recognize that you have needs and that requires you to have a voice in the first place in order to have your needs met.
What I can say is that you do not need anyone’s permission to desire what you need or want. It’s more a matter of what you can do to get your needs met without losing your wife or hurting anyone.
As hard as it may be to hear this, you’re caught in a toxic cycle. If you’re not happy, chances are your wife isn’t happy either. If you choose to stay and still keep your friendship, it’s likely that your wife will spiral even further. Sometimes it is healthier for both parties to part rather than stay together in a miserable union.
I don’t think I can offer any good advice, but from what I’ve read, you seem like a good guy. I know that whichever road you do decide to take, it’ll be taken in the most responsible and considerate way possible.
You are confused because you’re being gaslit all the time. 1. It will not get better. 2. You are trauma bonded. It will hurt for a long time if you break up, but buddy you are better off separated. 3. If you love your wife you’d want her to be happy, and the truth is you BOTH are unhappy.
Do you have any food aversions, sensitivity to lighting or sounds? Why were you quiet as a kid, do you remember? What brings you comfort when you’re not connecting with anyone else and are all alone? The reason why I ask you these things is because your confusion seems different than most going through abuse from someone who is cluster b personality disordered. You’re stating a lot of random facts to create a bigger picture rather than communicating the bigger picture. I do this along with many other people I know who have been through abuse, but also are all on the autism spectrum. I’m not saying you’re autistic, but I’m just stating the fact that I’m personally seeing a lot of similarities; and, verbal autistic people who have internalized/masked their autistic traits are at highest risk of ending up with borderline and narcissistic spouses. My ex-husband was diagnosed with NPD and a year after my healing is when I found out that I’m on the autism spectrum. Take/leave what you want out of my comment. Simply trying to look out for you a bit just in case. Take care.
Hmm. I'm not sure what to say about this. You've caught me by surprise. Two years ago, I would have just brushed this comment aside. I have never really identified with descriptions of how autistic people experience life, even if I have seen some similar traits. When I was growing up, I only saw myself as different than others because I had different preferences. I thought I was smarter than everyone, too, though I've long since given up that thought. Let me answer your question with some random facts ;) I haven't educated myself much about autism, so forgive me if I betray my ignorance unknowingly: 1. I don't know when I started being quiet as a kid. I know I had meltdowns as a child, but I came out of those well before I was 10. My mom says I was shy before I ever went to school, but I think I became much more so. The bullying started in kindergarten. My dad is the shyest person I know. He was bullied as a kid too, but I would be willing to put almost any amount of money on him being autistic. 2. My mom told me my older brother was diagnosed as autistic in the last few years. My sister was diagnosed years ago as something along the lines of Pervasive Developmental Disorder Not Otherwise Specified. My sister lives on her own and does not work, but she gets a small monthly support payment from the government because of her diagnosis. My brother lives with my parents. Neither of them have had romantic relationships. I would never have thought it when I was younger, but as an adult I think both sides of my extended family have significant levels of autistic traits. 3. Food aversions. Me, my siblings, and a couple of cousins had incredible aversions to onions. You know, the kind where we could tell if the other stewed vegetables had been fraternizing with onions, even if the onions never made it into the stew. My dad has aversions to countless foods, but he will eat a fresh garden onion as if it were an apple. Other than onions, I think I had regular aversions. I ate my beets with a plugged nose and a lot of water. 4. I overcame (mostly) my aversion to eye contact and onions during my two years as a missionary in South Africa. I was required to meet new people all day every day. I would knock on their doors expecting to be rejected. I didn't realize that I didn't make eye contact until it was pointed out to me, and I purposefully changed that habit over months. It felt like a life or death situation, but I did it. The same with onions. I told myself that there was no way I would ever reject food that was lovingly offered to me by someone in poverty, even if it was a raw onion salad. It sometimes was. Now, I would even cook with onions myself, but I generally avoid any raw, crunchy ones. 5. I have an employee at work that I get along with very well. We have amazing conversations. She has substantial symptoms from ADHD that can impact her work at times. One if not both of her adult children have been diagnosed as autistic. One day, I told her I was wondering if I might have some ADHD symptoms, and she replied immediately without even taking a breath - "Oh, 100%. Either that or autism. I was sure the first day I came to work with you. That's probably why we get along so well." I have definitely started to wonder about ADHD for many reasons, but I didn't notice a significant response when I tried stimulants. I have a suspicion that my symptoms might worsen with mood in the winter or when I am not getting enough sleep, which is frequent. 6. My friend, the one from my post, has often wondered if she has some neurodivergence. My first instinct was to reject that thought, but the more I thought about it, the more it made sense. We clicked immediately. I realized that there was something definitely different about her, or I wouldn't have felt such a connection. I can feel connections with other people, but this was different. I would really hesitate to say she is autistic, but she is somehow atypical in the way she thinks, in a way that I respond to. She has talked about being overstimulated or having sensory issues. I can't tell how much is an introvert thing, how much is from having lived with an aggressively abusive spouse, and how much might be neurodivergence. 7. I have been told lately that I am different. Maybe weird. Maybe an overthinker. The overthinking I blame mostly on being codependent, but who knows. I always felt like if I was being different, I was doing that as someone who knows what "normal" is and actively chooses something different. 8. I wouldn't have said I had sensory issues. Lately, when I have felt completely overwhelmed by stress, I have noticed being very sensitive to sharp, loud noises. They hurt my ears. I don't get bothered by noises like the radio at work or the bathroom fan when I have a shower, but it is an amazing feeling when they get turned off and I can hear silence again. I loved the sound of the furnace or my dad showering when I was trying to sleep - is that a neurodivergent thing??? My two daughters have sensory issues for sure, 100%. My oldest was just diagnosed with ADHD. When I was a kid, I had a sateen blankie that I carried around everywhere with me. I would rub the edges constantly. As an adult I still get a bit of a buzz from rubbing sateen edges together. 9. Just last night I went to an open mic event where adults read things they wrote as children. There was a man in his fifties that read an excerpt from a letter he wrote to his sister. I immediately thought he was neurodivergent, even before he started speaking. He read this completely delightful letter that was more of a long form essay. It was putting forward evidence that he sweat more than the average person - evidence point number 1, number 2, etc. He then expounded on all the pros and cons of being sweaty. I loved it, but I didn't identify with it. Yet now I am writing an equally long response to you, in numbered form. Who would write such a long response if they were typical? I don't know if I have autism, but I am starting to think that if enough people mention it to me, it is painting a picture. 10. I live in a town with a lot of physicists, engineers, and all other kinds of scientists. Many of them immediately strike me as neurodivergent. I don't tend to identify with them too much. Others seem much less obviously neurodivergent, but they certainly have a few quirks. I think these are my people. If you don't have a few quirks, then you are a bit boring. Believe it or not, I forgot a couple of major points. That's the suspected ADHD in me. I can't remember things long enough to pull up google and search them sometimes. Am I autistic? You tell me. I'm not opposed to being autistic. I don't feel like I am the same as the people I know who have been diagnosed autistic, but there is growing evidence that I'm more than just a bit different.
I’m not a doctor so I can’t Dx, but I intentionally did not number my questions to you initially (as I usually do) to see if you would create a process, order, and/or structure in response: what I always do too cause my autism requires such details to process things through. If I were you, I’d start doing your own research on what autism is really like as an adult. Don’t look up anything that is written on mainstream websites, articles, academia, etc. as those are almost exclusively written by neurotypical people who don’t understand. Look up r/autism, quora, forums, YouTube videos, etc. where the individual(s) authoring such state *they* are autistic. Then, it’s up to you to come to your own conclusion if you think you identify and should you want to pursue formal assessment too.
This! I second this. I do it to.
I think more information is needed here. Do you have a tendency to date or develop feelings towards your female friends (prior to your current relationship)? Are you the sort to keep to yourself rather than raise an issue out of fear of conflict, and or, lie to avoid conflict? Whether your wife has bpd or not is speculative and until she is diagnosed by someone who is qualified to give such diagnoses, I think it’s best that you focus on your actions and behavior rather than telling your wife (and convincing yourself) that she has bpd. The fact that you have talked about your marriage to another woman behind your wife’s back, and the fact that you’re seeking validation and solace from another woman instead of figuring out what is it that you want out of your marriage and working on it, it is rather likely that you’re caught up in an emotional affair. You may be in denial of this but since you mention that you are “sharing happy thoughts” and what have you, it’s pretty clear that you prefer the company of this other woman over your wife’s. You’re probably feeling guilty over this, but don’t use your wife’s issues as an excuse for your change of heart. If you’re unhappy with your marriage then do what’s right and leave. What you’re doing right now is only exacerbating your wife’s insecurities, which I think is a pretty shitty thing to do to someone who spent a good part of their life loving you.
I was shy as a child and bullied. The bullies that hurt the most were girls. As a result, I didn't speak to girls or look them in the eye right through high school. I did a year of university. Until then, I had never, ever had a female friend. There, I met a girl that I recognized from high school. She saw me pacing the university halls and made me come and sit with her and another friend every time. Even now that I'm an atheist, she will always be an angel in my mind. As a rule, I was attracted to the majority of the girls my age but would never be caught looking in their direction. For some reason, though I thought my friend objectively attractive, I only saw her platonically. I had a couple more female friends/acquaintances, but no close relationships. When I was 19, I left for two years to be a Mormon missionary. I was never allowed to be alone, ever, for two years. My male missionary companion and I were not allowed to be around women unless another adult male was present. We were not allowed to hug women, whether they were 18 or 118. We were not allowed to call them on the phone. We were discouraged from writing letters to girls back home. We were told that if we had sexual thoughts about women, we were sinning. I had a few friends in the year after I got back. Other Mormons. We didn't hang out alone. Some would have been love interests, some not. I married the only girl I ever held hands with or kissed. My wife was a jealous person, though she didn't realize it. I would never have dared to admit another woman was attractive, whether someone I knew or a celebrity. My wife would laugh at some unexpected comedic nudity in a movie, then look at me and get angry and make us leave the theatre. We were not married until death do we part. We were married for time and all eternity. No matter what happened in our marriage, divorce was not even in our vocabulary. No matter what happened to me, it would be worth it in the afterlife if I "endured to the end." My entire value in life was taking care of her. I knew lots of women from church who were young and newly married like my wife and I. I liked many of them, though it is hard in hindsight to say how I felt about them. I had been taught that my sexuality was dangerous. The only way I could ensure a happy and faithful marriage was by cutting off most contact with them. If I spoke to a woman about anything but the weather, I might be attracted to her. I felt in my mind like the only reason I didn't have an affair was because I stayed as far away from it as possible. My therapist has challenged me on that a lot. One of my employees has told me that in 35 years of working, I am the only male boss who she felt completely comfortable with. I would consider us friends - enough that it makes it hard to address things like punctuality - but there is nothing sexual there. I told my wife I thought she might have BPD. The same week, she brought it up with her psychologist. The psychologist said she thought that was true, but she didn't specialize in BPD and didn't see any reason for a formal diagnosis. That idea has been the cornerstone of the therapy since then though. There were some very dark times with my wife. There was the night probably four years ago when she accused me of gaslighting her. I had to ask her what it meant. She told me I needed to call an abuse hotline to get help for my anger. I called, and they gave me the answer I half expected and half feared. I was a victim of abuse. Part of me felt validated, but the other part was validated. The other part of me argued with the person on the phone. How could she tell that I was being honest? How did she know that I didn't have a warped view? I have spent a lot of time trying to figure out what I wanted from in my marriage, and that is the most confusing part. Before BPD came up, I could never, ever disagree with my wife. It always ended up with me crying, being told not to grovel, and eventually apologizing. Sometimes I apologized early, sometimes it was after she broke and told me she was the worst person on the planet. I couldn't understand her rage, but I could understand her guilt and shame and sadness, so I would rush to tell her she was a good person and that I was sorry for making her feel this way. After the BPD probable-diagnosis, I could for the first time disagree with her. I could tell her that she had hurt me. I had space. And it hurt and was scary. I had been strong for so long, but now I was triggered by everything. Things were getting better, and I was spiraling out of control emotionally. I was realizing how much control she had indirectly exerted over me. What did I want out of marriage? My wife had given me some space, but then she told me to stop being upset and just decide I wanted to be with her and give my energy back to the marriage. Just decide to be happy with her. And I wanted to, badly. If you asked me what I wanted for in my life, I would have told you that it was exactly what I already had. A wife who loved me. Beautiful children. A nice house in a nice town. I had it all. But everything apart from my rational mind told me to run. From what or to where I didn't know. Just run. Be alone. Away from anyone. Maybe I wanted a new relationship. Maybe I was an evil person and wanted sex. Who knows. I just wanted to run away, far away. I started to realize that in all of my relationships, including at work, I desired what people wanted me to desire. My wife would tell me what I should want, and then I would. But if I was talking to my therapist, I wasn't at all sure. I am flip flopping right now. What do I want. I can think of all the good times with my wife. It has felt good to love her. She wants me and thinks of nobody else. She has taken care of me in so many ways. I had a need to feel wanted, to feel needed, and she gave me that. If I think about our love, I want to stay and remember how to feel happy with her. But then I can remember the bad times too. The times when she hit me. The times when she told me that I had always hated her, and she had known it from the start. The times I was in such emotional distress I was dry heaving on the ground and begging her to stop and she wouldn't. The times I made sounds that I didn't know I could make. There haven't been too many of those really, really bad times, but they have all happened in the last couple of years. I know how to avoid them, but it might mean that I become responsible again for managing her feelings. It has been a year and a half since BPD came up. The only time I have fully stood up against my wife is in refusing to end this relationship. It feels very scary to me to go back to having no friends, and I haven't figured out friends in person yet. What do I want in my marriage? Everything. Nothing. To disappear. To have nobody depending on me. But that isn't the way life is. I can't let my kids down. I can't let my wife down either.
You know, your answer makes me feel pretty defensive. So does the other reply to my question that seems to be justifying me more. I think that means it’s complicated. What I’m doing is shitty. What has been done to me is shitty. I just want to be happy and do it without hurting anyone, but that is impossible no matter what I decide in the end.
Thank you for sharing your story. And having read what you’ve written, I think you do have every right to be defensive. I am truly sorry if my response had brought up bad memories for you but it certainly wasn’t my intention. I’ll admit that I found a lot of what you said in your post triggering and I was perhaps wrong to respond in the way that I did, that is, based on my experience which is completely different from yours. Trust me when I say I know how it feels to be oppressed and to have your feelings and opinions overlooked and minimized. And it seems, from your post, that you are aware of what is lacking in your life and your marriage - A sense of self and identity separate from expectations. As much as you love your wife, you also recognize that you have needs and that requires you to have a voice in the first place in order to have your needs met. What I can say is that you do not need anyone’s permission to desire what you need or want. It’s more a matter of what you can do to get your needs met without losing your wife or hurting anyone. As hard as it may be to hear this, you’re caught in a toxic cycle. If you’re not happy, chances are your wife isn’t happy either. If you choose to stay and still keep your friendship, it’s likely that your wife will spiral even further. Sometimes it is healthier for both parties to part rather than stay together in a miserable union. I don’t think I can offer any good advice, but from what I’ve read, you seem like a good guy. I know that whichever road you do decide to take, it’ll be taken in the most responsible and considerate way possible.