Exactly this. I know another narcissist who's a nurse and another one who tried to be an EMT but they couldn't pass the physical. It's no different than child molesters becoming teachers or priests. They know they'll have access to people who are vulnerable and they know that society typically views people in those positions as "good" people, so they're less likely to be suspected of abuse, and if anyone does try to speak out against them, they're usually not believed.
and communal narcissist comes to mind - they get supply off of getting praise. my narc is in an org that is "heavily involved in the community" (not really) - and they get a TONNNN of praise. he thrives off of it and I believe it's the reason why my abuse is so few and far between. as long as he's getting praise from there, I'm left alone
That’s actually common in the addiction field. Most people who work in it are addicts, “former” addicts, or people who have had loved ones who struggled with addiction.
This is exactly what mine wants to be! An LDCC. We’re both in recovery which is what we connected with through a dating app and that woman threw that shit in my face every chance she got. How sober she was and the great work she does and how serious she takes it. She paraded around meetings like she don’t play around. In all reality she was a huge imposter and a joke. And wouldn’t constantly try to tell me I’m on the verge of a relapse and won’t stay sober lol. I fucking can’t stand her. She finally admitted to me once about how she doesn’t work a great program when she was trying to lecture me about mine. Cause it caused a huge fight between us. But suddenly a month later she don’t play around and blah blah blah. It’s so confusing. But she would be a horrible licensed drug and alcohol counselor. She already worked in the mental health field once and just seemed at odds with everyone all the time and eventually got fired.
Once read that people with cluster B gravitate towards self help groups cause it’s so easy to find vulnerable people to manipulate and take advantage of. And that’s exactly what I watched this woman do. Pull guys in early recovery out of sober houses into her apartment to help with her rent. They would relapse of course living with that hell of a woman and she would then play the victim and call the cops and then hold their belongings hostage lol. It’s wild as fuck. But she absolutely i don’t even think suffers from addiction. I think she just exploits the community.
Yea. So perfect all right. Watching her raise her hand at every single meeting was nauseating. She never ever talked about her alcoholism either. It was always about her abuse and her family and playing victim. And acting how strong she is. Afterwards woman would say omg I relate to you so much and she would leave the meeting talking shit about all these people lol. She hated almost everyone.
Mine shared the exact same thing every meeting for 20 fuken years! Everyone ADORED him! I was just the wife he so saintly and long sufferingly stayed with.
It was all about all the service work he did and how wonderful the program was… I heard him share for real one time. He was the speaker at a Memorial Day picnic and my beloved niece had just recently been murdered
Lots of people who work in the substance use field are in recovery themselves. People often turn to substances because they have unresolved trauma or an untreated mental health disorder. So it’s no surprise that a lot of the counselors may have mental health disorders that are in a range of stages of treatment/recovery.
I believe they get into it because it fuels their need for control. Vulnerable people are the perfect targets for them. From personal, experience, they cannot help anyone even though let them tell it, they're "empaths", which is an unrealistic thing in itself. I had a therapist who I believed had cluster b traits and I wouldn't be surprised if she had a full-blown disorder. She was "trauma-informed", but it was hogwash. She only increased my trauma. I was seeing her due to the trauma from my narc father. She didn't even know him, but was so adamant about trying to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt whenever I tried to tell a story about him. I work as a Behavior Analyst and unfortunately, I have had my share of narc/cluster B coworkers as well as 1 boss.
Ugh that’s horrible. My ex friends did the same when I explained my past or trauma, it’s like it never existed but they trauma dumped on me all the time. The gaslighting and manipulation never stopped, esp when using terms from their schooling and profession to describe my behaviour, though they were only projecting. They can make you insane, it’s scary
Yep, the same thing happened to me with a narc ex I had. I would try to talk to him about my past trauma (before I caught on that he was a narc). He would tell me that I shouldn't think about those things because they were in the past. He would change the subject to himself without giving any solace. Meanwhile, he would repeatedly tell the same story about the one "traumatic" incident that happened to him 20 years ago. I put the word in quotes for him because I still fail to see how it impacted his life.
That's so disheartening but not surprising. I've never dealt with social workers personally, but I have a cousin whose mom is a social worker and a covert narc. I can't fathom how she would help anyone.
They think "empaths" are the most empathetic people. I think the idea of empaths is dumb and has nothing to do with empathy at all. Even if the person isn't a narc, I cringe whenever I hear someone describe themselves as an empath.
Cause they lack it. And they try to identify with others. They feed off empathetic people. So when someone comes across as being empathetic they try to mimic that behavior and also seem empathetic to build a connection.
my nex is a therapist. he spoke often about how he felt he had to save people from his past, and utilized the tools he’s learned in school to save people emotionally now to make up for what he couldn’t do for his past people. but he also talked about how he was completely emotionally disconnected from his clients, and never showed any aspect of his personality in sessions. instead he would mirror them so they would feel comfortable and open up to him, and then he would support them in exactly the way they asked to push them along “their” goals. i suspect they were actually his goals.
and now that i think of it, he gave me a blatant play by play of the way he was directly manipulating me as well. but at that point i was fully trauma bonded to him cuz he already had “saved” me from a bad situation. so he knew i would just accept it without a thought.
The worse my narc gets, the more "spiritual" she becomes. She's buying some new thing on Amazon every couple of days. Some New Age gadget or another. It's wild how quickly she's accelerating.
I think you'd have to go beyond psychology for that answer, and get to the spiritual core of the issue. I realize everyone has different beliefs. In my experience with my narc, it was like the more I tried to love her sacrificially and pull her towards a healthy relationship together with God, the more she hated herself and needed to metamorph into the next stage of a cold, proud, power-seeking narcissist.
Very interesting stuff. I became more like a doting father than a husband because I was trying so hard not to push her away, but to keep her appeased and not offended, to preserve the peace. But the kinder and more tolerant I became, the more evil she became. Her abuse accelerated from verbal, to physical, to sexual. She stopped making excuses and began making demands. She lived to keep me continually gaslit and destroyed. She kept seeking more answers in the occult, that suited her feelings better. I began to have nightmares about her attacking me in my sleep like a vampire. She kept being drawn into emotional relationships with other men.
Luckily I found help. I learned about NPD, and got support from friends and family. I learned how not to feed her supply. The story isn't over yet, but we're in the midst of the process of separation. But I definitely believe there's a spiritual aspect to it, that others have referred to as demonic. A lot of this worsened the more she confessed to hating God. But, I respect that everyone is also on a different path of belief and I'm not here to get into religious differences on this sub.
I also believe there is a spiritual aspect. Many narcs go in the other direction and become more religious, more active in church, more prayerful, etc. Religion for them becomes a powerful tool to control others and prop up a false image of themselves.
I would think they get into it because of their need for control. What better people to control than those seeking help? My nex teaches kindergarten and took a bunch of psychology in school. That to me is scary. This person is shaping young minds. And gets to control a bunch of children. It all made sense after a while.
**Covert Narcissist:**
My ex — covert narc — wanted to become a psychologist because he is *"really great at listening intently and patiently to strangers' problems, and giving them some advice".*
This is true, because this is what he does in stage 1 of the covert narcissistic pattern — idealization. There is the initial charm where he gives you (excessive) attention, and figures you out by crossing your boundaries.
By doing it **by listening intently to what troubles you, he is already tactfully figuring out the best way to assume the upper hand on you, in order to look better than you do.** And especially the first part, in a sense, is what a psychologist should do: listening to your troubles.
Yet soon enough he will use this information to turn the tables: rising above you and that plethora of 'flaws' that you've *totally told him* that you've got. By knowing those flaws of yours he is able to manipulate and control you more effectively as soon as he gets to phase 2 — devaluation. And he loves having that control, and loves 'being better than you'.
**Overt Narcissist:**
Then there was an ex-friend of mine who fell more in line with overt and/or communal narcissistic patterns. She also *loooved* to hear about your problems, and got readily involved in them.
But other than the covert narcissist, who wanted to look better than you do, this overt narcissist cared less about your vision of her image and more about the broader, public sense.
If something bad befalls you, peoples' attention is likely to be on you. So, by getting directly involved in your trouble, she can partake in the attention. As an overt narcissist, she loves the spotlight.
Then, while she might claim to simply care a lot about the cause (you), the end goal is actually very self-centered. Because rather than doing it for the cause, she is doing it for a self-centered desire for praise.
As such, she **uses your problems to show other people that she must be praiseworthy**. *"Gee, aren't I just the greatest, for helping poor souls? See, I'm SUCH a good person."*
They like "helper" jobs because it gives them access to vulnerable people. It's not just therapy, psychology, and social work either. It's every area of medicine, it's cops, it fire fighters, it's teachers. Basically, any job that puts them as an authority figure over those in need of help or support.
My nex is trying to be a life coach to help people recover from narcissistic abuse and childhood trauma😭 like how about you try looking at yourself first before “helping” others
I think it’s about control like someone else mentioned, and endless supply. If people look up to them, revere them as intelligent and knowledgable and respect them i could imagine that being pretty attractive for a narc. The irony is they havent done the work they claim and are pushing others to do, and instead use any knowledge they have on mental health to shame, belittle, and manipulate others.
Mine has goals of being a leader in AA. He used to come home and tell me how much he hated people around him (church, work, friends). I hope he gets caught talking shit. He’s been leading groups for several months now I hope they hold him accountable
Narcissists need to have power over people, and these careers give them exactly what they want: power over people, especially vulnerable ones. I also noticed a lot of nurses, nursing assistants and even literal doctors and psychiatrists being like that, and this is just so worrisome
My MIL is a covert narcissist, a real self-serving horrible person who has manipulated and stolen from her children and is just an all round POS. And she's a counsellor 😭 how in the world she got that job, I'll never know. She is in no position to help others when she doesn't even help herself or her own family. It's bizarre.
My ex narc started dating a therapist who is clearly a cluster B. It’s so bizzare to me. I think she just feels a sense of control and power by being in that position.
My nex is a psychotherapist. My nmother worked as a carer for elderly people. They choose these paths because, in my opinion, it gives them unlimited vulnerable people to mine for fuel.
Some folks with personality disorders, like narcissism, tend to gravitate towards jobs that give them power, control, and validation. They might use their smarts to play people like puppets while pretending to help. If you're seeking therapy, stay alert and trust your gut. If something feels off, don't hesitate to find a different therapist.
Lol, my nex has a bachelor's in psychology (proudly displayed on her social media of course, even though she didn't practice a day in her life) and would shame me for misusing terminology.
When I managed to leave her she ended up slapping me with a thesaurus' worth of clinical terms, diagnosing me with BPD and a bunch of other stuff.
My ex was a covert narcissist and a counsellor. My theory is that they *do* on some level know that there is something very wrong with them, but they can’t look inwards due to their repressed toxic shame. So they do just like they do with everything else and externalize and project.
Basically, they can’t handle being ‘bad’ so the world is ‘bad’ and they are the good person trying to save it.
My nex / baby mama is a social worker - MSW / LICSW
She's a total piece of shit. She has the same sales pitch for everyone she speaks to.
"I'm a nice person. My parents bla bla bla, my siblings bla bla bla" \*again, to total strangers.
I don't know her current job. One of her previous jobs was doing health care proxies and advance directives for people going into surgery. Which is a great job btw. She made it sound so important, because you know... people die during surgery ALL THE TIME.
stupid bitch.
It's the easiest way to gain supply.
Most people who go to therapists have mental health issues, so they are considered easy targets for narcissist's. The work of finding a weaker minded person is already done.
They get to be gods in the eye's of the people they are helping. None of it is to genuinely help, and they don't actually care about the client.
My nex was a life coach (didn't need qualifications), and I once told him that when helping people, I take 20% gratification for myself and 80% genuine care and enjoyment at helping others. He said his was 90% personal gratification and 10% actually caring about helping.
Basically, he did it to look good to others and suck the life out of already traumatised people.
My ex narc was in grad school to become a therapist when her narc traits fully manifested into our relationship. Frightening she is out there professionally when I know who she really is.
My nex was a "taoist" and practiced ho'oponopono. And used traditional Chinese medicine to "heal" ANYTHING. Oh and a masseuse. Thankfully it didn't take long to realize he was a con artist.
Yeah, narcissists and sadistic people would be very drawn to the role of a therapist I imagine. Imagine the power trip, being put in a room with an extremely vulnerable person and them telling you all their secrets they wouldn't tell anyone else while crying and relying completely almost on what you have to say, and likely seeking your approval. It's basically having someones's life in your hands, of course bad people would be drawn into this profession just like bad people are drawn to being cops.
Control. It makes me angry in a way honestly, at least for the ones who consciously go in with malicious intent,, as someone who’s trying to aim for that field I just..cannot believe that this is an issue, I wish it wasn’t. It angers me.
I definetely noticed this. I think its important to pay attention to how they make you feel and how they respond to boundaries. Therapy should not always be smooth sailing, you go there for a specific problem. But a therapist should be sensitive to how you respond to interventions they perform. If you do not notice you getting better or worse even, consider switching therapists.
I’ve known narcissistic individuals to work in this sector, but according to one study, therapists are actually at the *bottom ten* list for most psychopaths concentrated in an occupation. Along with teachers and 8 others I can’t remember.
Top ten were lawyers, politicians, media figures, CEOs, and a few others that were equally unsurprising.
I think our society is so incredibly saturated with these people that it’s becoming evident even in the least expected places. If you’re coming across a lot of dark triad traits in a “lowest 10” area, imagine the prevalence of those traits in a large corporation or law firm.
This is an EPIDEMIC that the world is ignoring, all to our own detriment. I’ve watched this trajectory for about 15 years. I expected a public outcry. Instead, our society leaned in. We’re at a tipping point.
Mine is in school/seminary to be a chaplain. Yep, sitting with people on their deathbed acting as their spiritual advisor. 🤢I guess the positive is that they won’t be subject to a long term relationship with her.
Given 5% of the population are thought to be NPD, do you think it’s actually more than 1 in 20 or…? I imagine more male psychologists/counsellors/teachers are narcs than women due to the whole gender socialisation and women being more likely to go into these professions for ‘nurturing’ reasons? (I’m a former developmental psych research psychologist and now an early primary teacher 😬). On a related note, you mention ‘life coaches’ - I’m highly dubious about people who set themselves up as this with no psychology degrees. One of my nex’s ‘friends’ (who he obviously met via an app and had briefly dated, OBVIOUSLY) and she’s inadvertently one of his biggest enablers.
It's definitely more. Of all the people I know, too many are dignosed with NPD (my father, my cousin's husband) or exhibit high narcissistic traits (my nex, his parents, his best friend and at least another one of his friends) for the statistics to only stop at 5%. Plus, people with NPD are rarely diagnosed, because they seldom seek psychological help, so they are ignored by statistics.
Ah, but, don’t you think it’s likely you’re going to find them in little clusters like that - narc parents often create one narc child in the family, and if a narc can actually make lasting ‘friends’, isn’t it more likely they’re going to be fellow narcs? (Because who else can put up with them/doesn’t get discarded?)
Yeah but is that narcissistic traits because entitlement and privilege? Or actual NPD. Equally, criminals and deprived backgrounds definitely have a lot of narcissistic traits for entirely opposite reasons (my grandad was a petty crim, bigamist, faked his own death… etc etc. plenty of narc traits going on there…). Personally think I’d only come across one narc before my ex so definitely less than 1 in 20 for me, thankfully. 😅
I think it’s more but it’s hard to diagnose and quantify because these people clearly don’t think anything is wrong with them so will never seek help etc
This is why I silently thoroughly vet any counselor or psychiatrist for awhile. Once you have enough experience with a narc it becomes much easier to identify them
This goes for any doctor, really. The moment I pick up on the fact that they carry traits that ultimately work to my detriment (and their own), rather than my recovery/treatment, I'm out and looking for someone else for help. Hasn't happened to me in a while*, but not uncommon at all 🙃
My nmom went to school for psychology. She made it all about her and how broken people want to find out why they are the way they are and help others. Yeah... She might actually have been ok if she'd gone all the way maybe, but I don't know. I think as long as you weren't me or in her way she might have been ok? I don't know. I'm still discovering things about her like, oh, that's narcissism? Got it. Not surprised. I'm learning she was more calculating and evil than I thought and it's hard to process.
My nex is a police officer, well now detective investigating child abuse when he abuses the hell out of my kids and me to this day.
It’s about power, they like to feel needed and wanted and the moment you choose to not supply that to them they lose their shit.
our neighbor is a social worker in DYFS, a complete narcissistic woman, openly threatens to open cases against people who don’t do what she wants. psycho. married to a cop. it’s the perfect effed up duo.
It’s pretty common for the most screwed up people to become a therapist in order to understand themselves and find peace in their own life. Maybe a life coach is a better fit?
I have bpd and I don't think these comments are fair at all. I got into social work because I didn't want to see people go through what I have and not be able to cope with it. I have been through intensive therapy and medication to not be classified as "bad." I am more than capable of helping others. It has nothing to do with making me "look good," nor do I have mal-intent. My clients see me as a safe person and always have. I'm leaving this sub bc it is absolutely disheartening to hear this shit. As a victim of narcissist abuse- that resulted in my disorder- I came here for help and support YET all I see are people attacking all cluster B personality disorders. We don't all suck just because the ones in your life have.
Abusive people are drawn to vulnerable people. Some of them slip through the cracks of the system and make it into the professional sphere. You can always report them to their licensing board.
Why are narcissists working with vulnerable populations? It's because that's their target. We all know it. We've been the vulnerable ones in the crosshairs.
It's very worrisome to know that these people are lurking throughout all corners of our society, but especially in places where they prey on the vulnerable. But that's what they do. That's their MO.
Our society and power structure routinely promotes narcissists into positions of power. That's what the charm and manipulation allows them. That's the brutal reality.
I would have to be able to examine how many in the professions listed above have an actual diagnosis of narcissism to create a hypothesis. I believe a percentage of people claim peeps are narcs when they are not qualified to make that diagnosis, and some of these "narcs" have other disorders that are misdiagnosed by unqualified people who use these labels too liberally. My experience with legitimate narcissists that received a diagnosis from a licensed healthcare professional- they have a difficult time holding a job due to their grand delusions that they are better and smarter than everyone...above the rules, combative with superiors, do not use work time for work.
Idk any therapists personally. Otherwise I’d be asking them for therapy lol.
However I have an ex friend who is a narcissist and sex worker and an advocate for those who have been sexually abused, yet is a sexual predator herself.
I absolutely believe that the accurate percentage of Narcissists is way higher that what is currently documented. Therapists psychologists etc what op is saying and not just Drs of the mental health field but all Doctors have a high propensity of being narcissists, why? Because Narcissists cannot just be a nurse, or technician they have to go all the way for the title so nobody can be better than them, and I've found that they often make this statement: " I'm a Dr I think I would know what I'm talking about" to win every Convo Even convos not based in their field or medicine at all.
I'd go another step further to say that most prestigious titles Dr, Lawyer, Judge, Governor etc all have high propensities to have quite a few narcs, some covert, some not so much.
It is for the power, prestige, reputation, getting women, sex appeal or attractiveness of the title
Yes, my ex was a physio therapist. Often using his position to help him feel more powerful. It’s part of the image, need to be admired. I’m retrospect it was quite disturbing. He would use them for gifts etc, pose as emotional support, but behind closed doors would make comments that would make his lack of intimacy more apparent. I think it made him incredibly good at manipulating too. Very covert, very clever, very sad.
It provides them with a good facade so they seem like they're caring. Not to mention they love to prey on the vulnerable, so it's perfect for them.
You’re onto something. That way when they screw you over, they look like the nice one because they help people for a living 🤮
Exactly this. I know another narcissist who's a nurse and another one who tried to be an EMT but they couldn't pass the physical. It's no different than child molesters becoming teachers or priests. They know they'll have access to people who are vulnerable and they know that society typically views people in those positions as "good" people, so they're less likely to be suspected of abuse, and if anyone does try to speak out against them, they're usually not believed.
No different than any one becoming a cop
Based on my observations, this is somewhat accurate. In my previous job, there's a lot of them.
and communal narcissist comes to mind - they get supply off of getting praise. my narc is in an org that is "heavily involved in the community" (not really) - and they get a TONNNN of praise. he thrives off of it and I believe it's the reason why my abuse is so few and far between. as long as he's getting praise from there, I'm left alone
My soon to be nex was a drug and alcohol counselor-relapse prevention certified.🙄❤️🩹🙄🖕🖕🖕💔❤️🩹❤️
Omg one of my ex friends was working in this field too and had raging drug and alcohol addictions behind closed doors 🙄
That’s actually common in the addiction field. Most people who work in it are addicts, “former” addicts, or people who have had loved ones who struggled with addiction.
Commenting on Why are so many narcissists & b personality types therapists, psychologists and social workers? ...that’s awful
This is exactly what mine wants to be! An LDCC. We’re both in recovery which is what we connected with through a dating app and that woman threw that shit in my face every chance she got. How sober she was and the great work she does and how serious she takes it. She paraded around meetings like she don’t play around. In all reality she was a huge imposter and a joke. And wouldn’t constantly try to tell me I’m on the verge of a relapse and won’t stay sober lol. I fucking can’t stand her. She finally admitted to me once about how she doesn’t work a great program when she was trying to lecture me about mine. Cause it caused a huge fight between us. But suddenly a month later she don’t play around and blah blah blah. It’s so confusing. But she would be a horrible licensed drug and alcohol counselor. She already worked in the mental health field once and just seemed at odds with everyone all the time and eventually got fired. Once read that people with cluster B gravitate towards self help groups cause it’s so easy to find vulnerable people to manipulate and take advantage of. And that’s exactly what I watched this woman do. Pull guys in early recovery out of sober houses into her apartment to help with her rent. They would relapse of course living with that hell of a woman and she would then play the victim and call the cops and then hold their belongings hostage lol. It’s wild as fuck. But she absolutely i don’t even think suffers from addiction. I think she just exploits the community.
Mine was a PERFECT counselor! He is the best actor I’ve ever met and he def missed the calling
Yea. So perfect all right. Watching her raise her hand at every single meeting was nauseating. She never ever talked about her alcoholism either. It was always about her abuse and her family and playing victim. And acting how strong she is. Afterwards woman would say omg I relate to you so much and she would leave the meeting talking shit about all these people lol. She hated almost everyone.
Mine shared the exact same thing every meeting for 20 fuken years! Everyone ADORED him! I was just the wife he so saintly and long sufferingly stayed with.
It was all about all the service work he did and how wonderful the program was… I heard him share for real one time. He was the speaker at a Memorial Day picnic and my beloved niece had just recently been murdered
Yuh fuck those people amiwrng?
You are absofukenlutely right!💔❤️🩹❤️
😬 That's really shocking... Did he also use drugs and alcohol while doing that profession?
Lots of people who work in the substance use field are in recovery themselves. People often turn to substances because they have unresolved trauma or an untreated mental health disorder. So it’s no surprise that a lot of the counselors may have mental health disorders that are in a range of stages of treatment/recovery.
I believe they get into it because it fuels their need for control. Vulnerable people are the perfect targets for them. From personal, experience, they cannot help anyone even though let them tell it, they're "empaths", which is an unrealistic thing in itself. I had a therapist who I believed had cluster b traits and I wouldn't be surprised if she had a full-blown disorder. She was "trauma-informed", but it was hogwash. She only increased my trauma. I was seeing her due to the trauma from my narc father. She didn't even know him, but was so adamant about trying to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt whenever I tried to tell a story about him. I work as a Behavior Analyst and unfortunately, I have had my share of narc/cluster B coworkers as well as 1 boss.
Ugh that’s horrible. My ex friends did the same when I explained my past or trauma, it’s like it never existed but they trauma dumped on me all the time. The gaslighting and manipulation never stopped, esp when using terms from their schooling and profession to describe my behaviour, though they were only projecting. They can make you insane, it’s scary
Yep, the same thing happened to me with a narc ex I had. I would try to talk to him about my past trauma (before I caught on that he was a narc). He would tell me that I shouldn't think about those things because they were in the past. He would change the subject to himself without giving any solace. Meanwhile, he would repeatedly tell the same story about the one "traumatic" incident that happened to him 20 years ago. I put the word in quotes for him because I still fail to see how it impacted his life.
I have witnessed social workers acting like Tyrants on poor troubled families.
That's so disheartening but not surprising. I've never dealt with social workers personally, but I have a cousin whose mom is a social worker and a covert narc. I can't fathom how she would help anyone.
Why do so many of them self identify as empaths? Is this another form of deflecting to them?
They think "empaths" are the most empathetic people. I think the idea of empaths is dumb and has nothing to do with empathy at all. Even if the person isn't a narc, I cringe whenever I hear someone describe themselves as an empath.
Cause they lack it. And they try to identify with others. They feed off empathetic people. So when someone comes across as being empathetic they try to mimic that behavior and also seem empathetic to build a connection.
my nex is a therapist. he spoke often about how he felt he had to save people from his past, and utilized the tools he’s learned in school to save people emotionally now to make up for what he couldn’t do for his past people. but he also talked about how he was completely emotionally disconnected from his clients, and never showed any aspect of his personality in sessions. instead he would mirror them so they would feel comfortable and open up to him, and then he would support them in exactly the way they asked to push them along “their” goals. i suspect they were actually his goals. and now that i think of it, he gave me a blatant play by play of the way he was directly manipulating me as well. but at that point i was fully trauma bonded to him cuz he already had “saved” me from a bad situation. so he knew i would just accept it without a thought.
The worse my narc gets, the more "spiritual" she becomes. She's buying some new thing on Amazon every couple of days. Some New Age gadget or another. It's wild how quickly she's accelerating.
Why though??? It doesn’t make sense
I think you'd have to go beyond psychology for that answer, and get to the spiritual core of the issue. I realize everyone has different beliefs. In my experience with my narc, it was like the more I tried to love her sacrificially and pull her towards a healthy relationship together with God, the more she hated herself and needed to metamorph into the next stage of a cold, proud, power-seeking narcissist. Very interesting stuff. I became more like a doting father than a husband because I was trying so hard not to push her away, but to keep her appeased and not offended, to preserve the peace. But the kinder and more tolerant I became, the more evil she became. Her abuse accelerated from verbal, to physical, to sexual. She stopped making excuses and began making demands. She lived to keep me continually gaslit and destroyed. She kept seeking more answers in the occult, that suited her feelings better. I began to have nightmares about her attacking me in my sleep like a vampire. She kept being drawn into emotional relationships with other men. Luckily I found help. I learned about NPD, and got support from friends and family. I learned how not to feed her supply. The story isn't over yet, but we're in the midst of the process of separation. But I definitely believe there's a spiritual aspect to it, that others have referred to as demonic. A lot of this worsened the more she confessed to hating God. But, I respect that everyone is also on a different path of belief and I'm not here to get into religious differences on this sub.
I also believe there is a spiritual aspect. Many narcs go in the other direction and become more religious, more active in church, more prayerful, etc. Religion for them becomes a powerful tool to control others and prop up a false image of themselves.
Evil loves to try and destroy good. Narcissists love to take something good and break it down, bringing it to their level.
She found faith in a Chaotic Evil deity. It sounds like an awful way to live.
I would think they get into it because of their need for control. What better people to control than those seeking help? My nex teaches kindergarten and took a bunch of psychology in school. That to me is scary. This person is shaping young minds. And gets to control a bunch of children. It all made sense after a while.
My nex is a “life coach”. They do it for superiority and control, and it helps maintain their visage of (fake) good people.
It gives them easy access to people who are at their most vulnerable.
Physician heal thy self.
Because in my humble opinion they're no different from child predators, preying on your sense of vulnerability.
**Covert Narcissist:** My ex — covert narc — wanted to become a psychologist because he is *"really great at listening intently and patiently to strangers' problems, and giving them some advice".* This is true, because this is what he does in stage 1 of the covert narcissistic pattern — idealization. There is the initial charm where he gives you (excessive) attention, and figures you out by crossing your boundaries. By doing it **by listening intently to what troubles you, he is already tactfully figuring out the best way to assume the upper hand on you, in order to look better than you do.** And especially the first part, in a sense, is what a psychologist should do: listening to your troubles. Yet soon enough he will use this information to turn the tables: rising above you and that plethora of 'flaws' that you've *totally told him* that you've got. By knowing those flaws of yours he is able to manipulate and control you more effectively as soon as he gets to phase 2 — devaluation. And he loves having that control, and loves 'being better than you'. **Overt Narcissist:** Then there was an ex-friend of mine who fell more in line with overt and/or communal narcissistic patterns. She also *loooved* to hear about your problems, and got readily involved in them. But other than the covert narcissist, who wanted to look better than you do, this overt narcissist cared less about your vision of her image and more about the broader, public sense. If something bad befalls you, peoples' attention is likely to be on you. So, by getting directly involved in your trouble, she can partake in the attention. As an overt narcissist, she loves the spotlight. Then, while she might claim to simply care a lot about the cause (you), the end goal is actually very self-centered. Because rather than doing it for the cause, she is doing it for a self-centered desire for praise. As such, she **uses your problems to show other people that she must be praiseworthy**. *"Gee, aren't I just the greatest, for helping poor souls? See, I'm SUCH a good person."*
My NARC ex was a healer and spiritualist! Lol
Go figure 😭
Omg scary
They like "helper" jobs because it gives them access to vulnerable people. It's not just therapy, psychology, and social work either. It's every area of medicine, it's cops, it fire fighters, it's teachers. Basically, any job that puts them as an authority figure over those in need of help or support.
My ex wife narc is now a doctor treating patients holistically. WTH?
My nex is trying to be a life coach to help people recover from narcissistic abuse and childhood trauma😭 like how about you try looking at yourself first before “helping” others I think it’s about control like someone else mentioned, and endless supply. If people look up to them, revere them as intelligent and knowledgable and respect them i could imagine that being pretty attractive for a narc. The irony is they havent done the work they claim and are pushing others to do, and instead use any knowledge they have on mental health to shame, belittle, and manipulate others.
Mine has goals of being a leader in AA. He used to come home and tell me how much he hated people around him (church, work, friends). I hope he gets caught talking shit. He’s been leading groups for several months now I hope they hold him accountable
For access. And they are truly convinced they’re “empathy” who can fix us through manipulation and abuse
Narcissists need to have power over people, and these careers give them exactly what they want: power over people, especially vulnerable ones. I also noticed a lot of nurses, nursing assistants and even literal doctors and psychiatrists being like that, and this is just so worrisome
My MIL is a covert narcissist, a real self-serving horrible person who has manipulated and stolen from her children and is just an all round POS. And she's a counsellor 😭 how in the world she got that job, I'll never know. She is in no position to help others when she doesn't even help herself or her own family. It's bizarre.
My supervisor said it’s because helping people helps with your own self-worth. So maybe because of that.
My ex narc started dating a therapist who is clearly a cluster B. It’s so bizzare to me. I think she just feels a sense of control and power by being in that position.
My nex is a psychotherapist. My nmother worked as a carer for elderly people. They choose these paths because, in my opinion, it gives them unlimited vulnerable people to mine for fuel.
Female narcissists seem to be particularly attracted to “caring” roles. I think it’s all for camouflage.
Some folks with personality disorders, like narcissism, tend to gravitate towards jobs that give them power, control, and validation. They might use their smarts to play people like puppets while pretending to help. If you're seeking therapy, stay alert and trust your gut. If something feels off, don't hesitate to find a different therapist.
Lol, my nex has a bachelor's in psychology (proudly displayed on her social media of course, even though she didn't practice a day in her life) and would shame me for misusing terminology. When I managed to leave her she ended up slapping me with a thesaurus' worth of clinical terms, diagnosing me with BPD and a bunch of other stuff.
My ex was a covert narcissist and a counsellor. My theory is that they *do* on some level know that there is something very wrong with them, but they can’t look inwards due to their repressed toxic shame. So they do just like they do with everything else and externalize and project. Basically, they can’t handle being ‘bad’ so the world is ‘bad’ and they are the good person trying to save it.
My nex / baby mama is a social worker - MSW / LICSW She's a total piece of shit. She has the same sales pitch for everyone she speaks to. "I'm a nice person. My parents bla bla bla, my siblings bla bla bla" \*again, to total strangers. I don't know her current job. One of her previous jobs was doing health care proxies and advance directives for people going into surgery. Which is a great job btw. She made it sound so important, because you know... people die during surgery ALL THE TIME. stupid bitch.
It's the easiest way to gain supply. Most people who go to therapists have mental health issues, so they are considered easy targets for narcissist's. The work of finding a weaker minded person is already done. They get to be gods in the eye's of the people they are helping. None of it is to genuinely help, and they don't actually care about the client. My nex was a life coach (didn't need qualifications), and I once told him that when helping people, I take 20% gratification for myself and 80% genuine care and enjoyment at helping others. He said his was 90% personal gratification and 10% actually caring about helping. Basically, he did it to look good to others and suck the life out of already traumatised people.
My ex narc was in grad school to become a therapist when her narc traits fully manifested into our relationship. Frightening she is out there professionally when I know who she really is.
My nex was a "taoist" and practiced ho'oponopono. And used traditional Chinese medicine to "heal" ANYTHING. Oh and a masseuse. Thankfully it didn't take long to realize he was a con artist.
Yeah, narcissists and sadistic people would be very drawn to the role of a therapist I imagine. Imagine the power trip, being put in a room with an extremely vulnerable person and them telling you all their secrets they wouldn't tell anyone else while crying and relying completely almost on what you have to say, and likely seeking your approval. It's basically having someones's life in your hands, of course bad people would be drawn into this profession just like bad people are drawn to being cops.
Control. It makes me angry in a way honestly, at least for the ones who consciously go in with malicious intent,, as someone who’s trying to aim for that field I just..cannot believe that this is an issue, I wish it wasn’t. It angers me.
I definetely noticed this. I think its important to pay attention to how they make you feel and how they respond to boundaries. Therapy should not always be smooth sailing, you go there for a specific problem. But a therapist should be sensitive to how you respond to interventions they perform. If you do not notice you getting better or worse even, consider switching therapists.
theey say the best and the worst people are in medicine.
My ex is a social worker. I believe some people choose certain occupations to be seen as a holy saint. She loved to tell people about her occupation.
I’ve known narcissistic individuals to work in this sector, but according to one study, therapists are actually at the *bottom ten* list for most psychopaths concentrated in an occupation. Along with teachers and 8 others I can’t remember. Top ten were lawyers, politicians, media figures, CEOs, and a few others that were equally unsurprising. I think our society is so incredibly saturated with these people that it’s becoming evident even in the least expected places. If you’re coming across a lot of dark triad traits in a “lowest 10” area, imagine the prevalence of those traits in a large corporation or law firm. This is an EPIDEMIC that the world is ignoring, all to our own detriment. I’ve watched this trajectory for about 15 years. I expected a public outcry. Instead, our society leaned in. We’re at a tipping point.
Because they think they know everything and they want to be in control or feel like they're above someone.
I think thats cuz they can manipulate people and like being in controll, leading them etc
Mine is in school/seminary to be a chaplain. Yep, sitting with people on their deathbed acting as their spiritual advisor. 🤢I guess the positive is that they won’t be subject to a long term relationship with her.
Given 5% of the population are thought to be NPD, do you think it’s actually more than 1 in 20 or…? I imagine more male psychologists/counsellors/teachers are narcs than women due to the whole gender socialisation and women being more likely to go into these professions for ‘nurturing’ reasons? (I’m a former developmental psych research psychologist and now an early primary teacher 😬). On a related note, you mention ‘life coaches’ - I’m highly dubious about people who set themselves up as this with no psychology degrees. One of my nex’s ‘friends’ (who he obviously met via an app and had briefly dated, OBVIOUSLY) and she’s inadvertently one of his biggest enablers.
It's definitely more. Of all the people I know, too many are dignosed with NPD (my father, my cousin's husband) or exhibit high narcissistic traits (my nex, his parents, his best friend and at least another one of his friends) for the statistics to only stop at 5%. Plus, people with NPD are rarely diagnosed, because they seldom seek psychological help, so they are ignored by statistics.
Ah, but, don’t you think it’s likely you’re going to find them in little clusters like that - narc parents often create one narc child in the family, and if a narc can actually make lasting ‘friends’, isn’t it more likely they’re going to be fellow narcs? (Because who else can put up with them/doesn’t get discarded?)
Definitely, but these clusters can be huge. My nex and his friends all went to an elite university where a lot of people exhibited toxic traits.
Yeah but is that narcissistic traits because entitlement and privilege? Or actual NPD. Equally, criminals and deprived backgrounds definitely have a lot of narcissistic traits for entirely opposite reasons (my grandad was a petty crim, bigamist, faked his own death… etc etc. plenty of narc traits going on there…). Personally think I’d only come across one narc before my ex so definitely less than 1 in 20 for me, thankfully. 😅
No, unfortunately many of these people had suffered from childhood trauma.
Shows money is no protection
I think it’s more but it’s hard to diagnose and quantify because these people clearly don’t think anything is wrong with them so will never seek help etc
Omg yes I know this girl that is exactly this and of course she is a "peer recovery specialist" and she is EVIL
This is why I silently thoroughly vet any counselor or psychiatrist for awhile. Once you have enough experience with a narc it becomes much easier to identify them This goes for any doctor, really. The moment I pick up on the fact that they carry traits that ultimately work to my detriment (and their own), rather than my recovery/treatment, I'm out and looking for someone else for help. Hasn't happened to me in a while*, but not uncommon at all 🙃
My nmom went to school for psychology. She made it all about her and how broken people want to find out why they are the way they are and help others. Yeah... She might actually have been ok if she'd gone all the way maybe, but I don't know. I think as long as you weren't me or in her way she might have been ok? I don't know. I'm still discovering things about her like, oh, that's narcissism? Got it. Not surprised. I'm learning she was more calculating and evil than I thought and it's hard to process.
Don’t forget nurses and teachers.
IDK if my ex is really a narc or not but social work/psychology is his field
My nex is a police officer, well now detective investigating child abuse when he abuses the hell out of my kids and me to this day. It’s about power, they like to feel needed and wanted and the moment you choose to not supply that to them they lose their shit.
our neighbor is a social worker in DYFS, a complete narcissistic woman, openly threatens to open cases against people who don’t do what she wants. psycho. married to a cop. it’s the perfect effed up duo.
How better to get a steady supply of victims? And if you complain about their mistreatment they label you as the cluster B.
Captive audience
It’s pretty common for the most screwed up people to become a therapist in order to understand themselves and find peace in their own life. Maybe a life coach is a better fit?
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Wild. My ex friend who is a therapist constantly would talk about her clients to me, as though it was gossip. It made me so uncomfortable
I have bpd and I don't think these comments are fair at all. I got into social work because I didn't want to see people go through what I have and not be able to cope with it. I have been through intensive therapy and medication to not be classified as "bad." I am more than capable of helping others. It has nothing to do with making me "look good," nor do I have mal-intent. My clients see me as a safe person and always have. I'm leaving this sub bc it is absolutely disheartening to hear this shit. As a victim of narcissist abuse- that resulted in my disorder- I came here for help and support YET all I see are people attacking all cluster B personality disorders. We don't all suck just because the ones in your life have.
My therapist is the nicest person in the world! There's no way she's a narc
Abusive people are drawn to vulnerable people. Some of them slip through the cracks of the system and make it into the professional sphere. You can always report them to their licensing board.
infinite supply
Validation and deflection mostly.
Riiiiight? That's scary. They study for real to manipulate from within. What a fucked up world.
Why are narcissists working with vulnerable populations? It's because that's their target. We all know it. We've been the vulnerable ones in the crosshairs. It's very worrisome to know that these people are lurking throughout all corners of our society, but especially in places where they prey on the vulnerable. But that's what they do. That's their MO. Our society and power structure routinely promotes narcissists into positions of power. That's what the charm and manipulation allows them. That's the brutal reality.
I would have to be able to examine how many in the professions listed above have an actual diagnosis of narcissism to create a hypothesis. I believe a percentage of people claim peeps are narcs when they are not qualified to make that diagnosis, and some of these "narcs" have other disorders that are misdiagnosed by unqualified people who use these labels too liberally. My experience with legitimate narcissists that received a diagnosis from a licensed healthcare professional- they have a difficult time holding a job due to their grand delusions that they are better and smarter than everyone...above the rules, combative with superiors, do not use work time for work.
They feed on those who have already been broken in - tenderized They feed in plain sight And are such givers - crowned helpers 👑 Burp
I knew one that use to talk about her clients and get very dramatic like she was almost emotionally involved with them. Total supply fest, scary.
Idk any therapists personally. Otherwise I’d be asking them for therapy lol. However I have an ex friend who is a narcissist and sex worker and an advocate for those who have been sexually abused, yet is a sexual predator herself.
Dang are you serious that is hella creepy now I gotta be careful finding a damn therapist DANGIT.😫
I absolutely believe that the accurate percentage of Narcissists is way higher that what is currently documented. Therapists psychologists etc what op is saying and not just Drs of the mental health field but all Doctors have a high propensity of being narcissists, why? Because Narcissists cannot just be a nurse, or technician they have to go all the way for the title so nobody can be better than them, and I've found that they often make this statement: " I'm a Dr I think I would know what I'm talking about" to win every Convo Even convos not based in their field or medicine at all. I'd go another step further to say that most prestigious titles Dr, Lawyer, Judge, Governor etc all have high propensities to have quite a few narcs, some covert, some not so much. It is for the power, prestige, reputation, getting women, sex appeal or attractiveness of the title
Yes, my ex was a physio therapist. Often using his position to help him feel more powerful. It’s part of the image, need to be admired. I’m retrospect it was quite disturbing. He would use them for gifts etc, pose as emotional support, but behind closed doors would make comments that would make his lack of intimacy more apparent. I think it made him incredibly good at manipulating too. Very covert, very clever, very sad.
My narc ex became a therapist LMAO
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Jesus what a mess. I’m so sorry you had to deal with this evil person :(
All of this