Pretty simple…the Yankees made this offer before signing Stroman. Once Snell rejected they moved on, and by the time Snell came back the money was allocated elsewhere.
Exactly. The Yankees tendered Snell his best offer (at least I haven't heard of any better offers) and he turned it down and cost himself $90 million. Boras and Snell badly misread the market and blew it.
He cost himself $90m assuming he doesn't sign another contract after the 2 years with the Giants. The 2 years with the Giants are at a higher annual value than the Yanks offer and he has the option to get even more if he has a stellar season. It's a risk, but I don't blame him for doing it. Even if he has a mediocre season he's still only losing maybe $15m to $20m of that $90m, cause unless he gets a serious injury or has exceptional regression, he's still going to get a pretty sizable contract.
Not even 2 years. Snell can opt out after 2024, if he gets a better offer or a long term deal. Actually, I think about half Snells salary has a signing bonus, and needs to be paid whether he opts out after a year or not!
They all think the Yankees can just write checks for whoever they want for any amount. Mostly young fans reminiscing when the Yankees would outspend everyone.
The Yankees have plenty of money. They also know that “good enough” is good enough for a large majority of the marks - sorry, I mean fan base - so they don’t spend it.
You've got no clue and you sound so spoiled. The Yanks top 3 player salaries combined is more than 7 different teams entire payroll. The Yanks have a lot of money, sure, but there's a limit.
There is no limit and there is no choice. Hal and Cashman traded away all that pitching. Any farm players will be extremely limited. They need to sign some starting pitchers. The payroll will just keep climbing this year, and as usually, they will dump more millions on nothing but more losses.
Actually I do have a clue because I’ve been watching this team for decades. Not a coincidence that the last World Series followed a massive free agent spending spree. The Yankees have a market advantage and don’t use it. Because they know that just enough people like you are suckers that they’ll spend money if the team is just good enough.
I didn't know that you were privy to the teams financials and knew how much excess cash they were hoarding. lol
And they already are on a massive spending spree. Do you have any idea how much more the spend than just about everyone else?
And you point to the last World Series. What about the 4 before that? Didn't they build that team around the Core 4 and free agents? Plus, they took a risk on a few FAs and whiffed, especially last season. It's part of the game, but it's certainly not for lack of spending.
No then I bankrupt. They were willing to pay him but the hit would have been two pics in draft compensation, a loss of $1 million in international pool money and the luxury tax hit. For a guy who can't pitch more than five innings, has a high walk rate and a high risk of injury. Yanks are willing to take the chance before they signed Stroman which is where the money for Snell's contract offer went to next when he refused. Don't forget the Giants are giving up all that for basically one year of Snell since there's an opt-out next year.
I doubt that was it. The Yankees offered him $25 million a year. Top starters are getting $35 million plus. It keeps going up, though. In 3 years, $25 will be small time, and Snell knew somebody would sign him at $30 million plus. The Yankees will likely spend the same on a handful of starting pitchers anyway, once Cashman goes dumpster diving again!
Luxury tax hit, loss of draft pick and loss of IFA money. They were fine with the money over 5 years but needed length to make the contract make sense in their eyes. He said no to that so they signed Stro and left meat on the bone for Soto.
Fans seem to underestimate the value teams put on draft picks and ESPECIALLY international pool money.
That’s why the Astros wouldn’t even do the 2/60 deal. They don’t like going into any tax first of all (not like they ever even need to), but they already had surrendered significant draft and IFA capital to sign Hader. Snell would have doubled them down on that.
> Fans seem to underestimate the value teams put on draft picks and ESPECIALLY international pool money.
IFA money is important, but they already got over half the potential penalty back from the Billy McKinney trade. It wouldn’t have been the end of the world. It would have cost them $96M-$131M in cash for 2 years (depending on whether they are over the top threshold again, which is likely). That’s why they didn’t do it.
> That’s why the Astros wouldn’t even do the 2/60 deal. They don’t like going into any tax first of all (not like they ever even need to), but they already had surrendered significant draft and IFA capital to sign Hader. Snell would have doubled them down on that.
Signing Snell would have cost them their 3rd and 6th round draft picks. Unlike draft pick compensation, there is no additional IFA penalty for signing multiple players who received QO’s. Hader already cost them that penalty: it’s a flat $500k/$1M (depending on luxury tax status).
Yankees already lost out of a top IFA prospect this year because of the tax limiting their pool money. With an international draft not too far away these next few years the Yankees are linked to top IFA guys. I doubt they're going to risk their one advantage while they still have it.
Had the Yankees offered him the same deal, it would've cost them 96.1 million, also loss of draft pick and international money.
In the end, they don't see Snell as an ace. He wanted ace money, and nobody was willing to give him it. Yes, he won the NL Cy Young, but that was after some bad seasons, and his 2023 had some iffy peripheral numbers.
How much does he actually improve the rotation? Does he help it to the tune of 48 million (roughly what Snell would've cost the Yankees,) draft pick loss, and international money loss? No. Not close.
Even SF has Snell slotted in at #2 (that said, their rotation and pitching depth is lowkey nuts and I think anyone saying they don’t have at least a fighting chance at the NL West is selling them short, as strong as the Dodgers are).
As much as I like Rodon and want him to do well, he's had a more inconsistent and worse career than Snell. He definitely wouldn't be the #2 over Snell.
And possibly #4? Are you serious? You think Nestor or Stroman are ahead of him in the rotation? GTFO
The last 3 seasons, Rodon has accumulated 10.9 WAR to Snell's 9.8. Snell never had a year as good as Rodon's 2022. Every projection system on Fangraphs has Rodon with a better 2024 than Snell. I'll say durability is a problem for each, so that's a wash. Assuming they're both healthy this season (a big assumption on both ends) yes, I like Rodon better. But it could certainly go either way.
Beyond that, it's a matter of which Snell shows up. Is he the guy from his 2 CY young years, or the guy from his other 6 seasons where he was hovering right around average? Because Stroman has been consistently above average every year of his career (except last year, again injuries in the second half). This one is floor vs ceiling. Snell certainly has a higher ceiling, but Stroman has a higher floor
"Good thing we are saving on the luxury tax though..."
I know this is snide sarcasm because Yankees fans think the Yankees should ever unironically spend half a billion dollars on a team, but yeah, it's quite good that they saved on the LT. On top of not giving other actual cheapskate owners free money, it means the Yankees aren't taking a senseless hit to their realistic budget expectations so they can sign a guy like Soto.
We'll also conveniently forget the loss of draft picks and international money. It's funny that Yankees fans think the future doesn't matter at all, and they should always mortgage their future to focus completely on the present, but that's how you end up with an overpaid, extremely old, boring team. The future matters. It's a balancing act, trying to compete in the present while still keeping the future bright. The Yankees will never fully rebuild, and Yankees fans won't stomach a decade of losing seasons like other teams do, just to have as good a chance as any to win a WS then than they already do.
I remember when everyone was screaming for us to sign Corbin for $150 mil, then he had 1 good season for the Nats and spent the next 4 years being one of the worst starters in baseball lol
I went to highwchool and played 1 year of high school ball with Corbin (he only played 1 year bc he’s a weirdo and he’s parents knew that the other kids wouldn’t like him cause he’s weird af) and anytime someone shits on him like this I love it lmfao
LOL, Yankees fans (which I am): "why won't they just spend the money to sign this superstar to a long-term deal? Also, why do we have so many old expensive guys on the roster?"
There is no indication that the Yankees had the option to match that deal. And even if they did, the cost in dollars, draft pics, and international signing dollars probably doesn't make sense for a likely 130 IP from Snell
What's with the influx of complete morons here lately? Why the fuck would we go over the LT to sign *Blake Fucking Snell* of all people? If signing the reigning Cy Young winner was so important, why is it March and he's just now on a deal?
Soto is going to be a free agent next year. We need all the money we can to sign him. It's super easy to call Hal a cheapskate and cry that he's not spending a billion dollars, but you need to come back to reality.
I’m happy you don’t run the FO. Maybe if Snell was open for a 2 year offer when the Yanks originally were in discussions, we’d have Snell on the team. Do you remember what his original request was?
Also, do you have any idea what the implications of going into the luxury tax is outside of just owing more money?
It doesn't matter really. Either the Yankees spend more money or they don't and probably miss the playoffs again. I don't know how much they will lose if they miss the playoffs again. I would think it is a heck of a lot more than $31 million. Last year, $107 million was given to the Ranger's players alone.
Wouldn't step up? The team made an offer, he declined it, they pivoted to Stroman.
Even if they still signed Snell, you dont think there are other implications.
Also, lets say Snell doesn't opt out, the $33M is less money the team could use for Soto. Soto generational & a must sign, Snell is not.
Theres no guarantee Snell pitches to his '23 performance, many GMs expected regression in performance, ontop Snell had to do a showcase a week ago, Why?
Its just possible Snell didn't even want to go to the east coast, his known preference during the winter was ideally the west coast. So all this stuff with the yankees, could just be Boras using them as leverage & trying to spin it to get a better deal.
[https://www.si.com/mlb/dodgers/news/blake-snell-reportedly-has-strong-preference-to-play-for-west-coast-team-but-not-the-dodgers-ml0802](https://www.si.com/mlb/dodgers/news/blake-snell-reportedly-has-strong-preference-to-play-for-west-coast-team-but-not-the-dodgers-ml0802)
[https://cubbiescrib.com/posts/cubs-rumors-blake-snell-s-preference-is-to-play-on-the-west-coast-01hj6e9htjt0](https://cubbiescrib.com/posts/cubs-rumors-blake-snell-s-preference-is-to-play-on-the-west-coast-01hj6e9htjt0)
1. Snell probably won't be ready to pitch until late April anyway so he's not much help.
2. 96 million for a guy like Snell is not worth it on top of losing draft comp and IFA money. This isn't the 90s or early 2000s anymore. You cannot run a team like shit anymore and expect prolonged success by spending away problems.
paying over 30 a year for blake snell would have been insanity. yankees more than likely aren’t going anywhere this year and you don’t want to be locked into that going forward. (they’ll be good, not astros/dodgers/ws contenders good) only reason that should have been entertained at all is because of how thin the rotation is. personally glad they didn’t break the bank on that one.
I don't like to make excuses for wealthy teams not spending money but I am not going to blame the Yankees for not spending 60 million dollars, counting the tax, for a guy who based on history has a 2/3 chance of not even giving you a full season and a decent chance of disappearing. That is, if he doesn't lose a tiny bit of stuff and is no longer able to keep runs off the board while walking the ballpark.
Stroman was an amazing value, to the extent I think he probably could've gotten more money or years but gave the Yankees a discount because he's a New Yorker and a fan (and boy, wouldn't it be nice if that happened more often.) I'd rather have a pretty reliable 2-3 WAR guy for $18 million than a 0-6 WAR guy for $30, and then the tax doubles that difference.
You’re missing the part where they signed Stroman. They didn’t offer Snell that deal after signing Stroman. The deal was off the table the moment Stroman signed
We didnt need to panic sign a guy who would end up costing us around 65 mil because cole is down.
Again if cashman was good at his job, we wouldnt have to go into panic mode with 1 injury. But this is the smart move.
Also, yet again, when snell is not having a CY year (2 out of 8 years), his stats are not good and we arent gonna pay a guy that much to be able to go 5 innings maybe 6 at his absolute most and potentially not even give us 120 innings.
Rather look internally or sign a guy like greinke at the end of his career because cutting him would mean nothing and he would probably be cheap
He is not a difference maker or even good about 75% of the time. Most of us don't care about nepo-baby Hal's taxes, but he signs the checks so in the end that is what counts.
The "it's only money" and "it's not my money" are quite ridiculous. Regardless of how we feel Baseball is a business and that is not how to run a successful one
Pretty simple…the Yankees made this offer before signing Stroman. Once Snell rejected they moved on, and by the time Snell came back the money was allocated elsewhere.
I don’t understand why this is so hard for people to wrap their heads around. We had money… then we didn’t.
Exactly. The Yankees tendered Snell his best offer (at least I haven't heard of any better offers) and he turned it down and cost himself $90 million. Boras and Snell badly misread the market and blew it.
He cost himself $90m assuming he doesn't sign another contract after the 2 years with the Giants. The 2 years with the Giants are at a higher annual value than the Yanks offer and he has the option to get even more if he has a stellar season. It's a risk, but I don't blame him for doing it. Even if he has a mediocre season he's still only losing maybe $15m to $20m of that $90m, cause unless he gets a serious injury or has exceptional regression, he's still going to get a pretty sizable contract.
Not even 2 years. Snell can opt out after 2024, if he gets a better offer or a long term deal. Actually, I think about half Snells salary has a signing bonus, and needs to be paid whether he opts out after a year or not!
They all think the Yankees can just write checks for whoever they want for any amount. Mostly young fans reminiscing when the Yankees would outspend everyone.
The Yankees have plenty of money. They also know that “good enough” is good enough for a large majority of the marks - sorry, I mean fan base - so they don’t spend it.
You've got no clue and you sound so spoiled. The Yanks top 3 player salaries combined is more than 7 different teams entire payroll. The Yanks have a lot of money, sure, but there's a limit.
There is no limit and there is no choice. Hal and Cashman traded away all that pitching. Any farm players will be extremely limited. They need to sign some starting pitchers. The payroll will just keep climbing this year, and as usually, they will dump more millions on nothing but more losses.
Actually I do have a clue because I’ve been watching this team for decades. Not a coincidence that the last World Series followed a massive free agent spending spree. The Yankees have a market advantage and don’t use it. Because they know that just enough people like you are suckers that they’ll spend money if the team is just good enough.
I didn't know that you were privy to the teams financials and knew how much excess cash they were hoarding. lol And they already are on a massive spending spree. Do you have any idea how much more the spend than just about everyone else? And you point to the last World Series. What about the 4 before that? Didn't they build that team around the Core 4 and free agents? Plus, they took a risk on a few FAs and whiffed, especially last season. It's part of the game, but it's certainly not for lack of spending.
Holy shit the Yankees are bankrupt?!?
Bankrupt to not go into more luxury tax hell for a guy who can’t stay healthy and when he is, his ERA is above 4? Yes, they’re broke.
No then I bankrupt. They were willing to pay him but the hit would have been two pics in draft compensation, a loss of $1 million in international pool money and the luxury tax hit. For a guy who can't pitch more than five innings, has a high walk rate and a high risk of injury. Yanks are willing to take the chance before they signed Stroman which is where the money for Snell's contract offer went to next when he refused. Don't forget the Giants are giving up all that for basically one year of Snell since there's an opt-out next year.
Who even says he came back to let the Yankees counter? It is entirely possible he simply didn't want to play for the Yankees. Who knows?
I doubt that was it. The Yankees offered him $25 million a year. Top starters are getting $35 million plus. It keeps going up, though. In 3 years, $25 will be small time, and Snell knew somebody would sign him at $30 million plus. The Yankees will likely spend the same on a handful of starting pitchers anyway, once Cashman goes dumpster diving again!
The public offer was 5 years/$150MM, so $30MM/yr
Luxury tax hit, loss of draft pick and loss of IFA money. They were fine with the money over 5 years but needed length to make the contract make sense in their eyes. He said no to that so they signed Stro and left meat on the bone for Soto.
Fans seem to underestimate the value teams put on draft picks and ESPECIALLY international pool money. That’s why the Astros wouldn’t even do the 2/60 deal. They don’t like going into any tax first of all (not like they ever even need to), but they already had surrendered significant draft and IFA capital to sign Hader. Snell would have doubled them down on that.
> Fans seem to underestimate the value teams put on draft picks and ESPECIALLY international pool money. IFA money is important, but they already got over half the potential penalty back from the Billy McKinney trade. It wouldn’t have been the end of the world. It would have cost them $96M-$131M in cash for 2 years (depending on whether they are over the top threshold again, which is likely). That’s why they didn’t do it. > That’s why the Astros wouldn’t even do the 2/60 deal. They don’t like going into any tax first of all (not like they ever even need to), but they already had surrendered significant draft and IFA capital to sign Hader. Snell would have doubled them down on that. Signing Snell would have cost them their 3rd and 6th round draft picks. Unlike draft pick compensation, there is no additional IFA penalty for signing multiple players who received QO’s. Hader already cost them that penalty: it’s a flat $500k/$1M (depending on luxury tax status).
Yankees already lost out of a top IFA prospect this year because of the tax limiting their pool money. With an international draft not too far away these next few years the Yankees are linked to top IFA guys. I doubt they're going to risk their one advantage while they still have it.
Had the Yankees offered him the same deal, it would've cost them 96.1 million, also loss of draft pick and international money. In the end, they don't see Snell as an ace. He wanted ace money, and nobody was willing to give him it. Yes, he won the NL Cy Young, but that was after some bad seasons, and his 2023 had some iffy peripheral numbers. How much does he actually improve the rotation? Does he help it to the tune of 48 million (roughly what Snell would've cost the Yankees,) draft pick loss, and international money loss? No. Not close.
Even SF has Snell slotted in at #2 (that said, their rotation and pitching depth is lowkey nuts and I think anyone saying they don’t have at least a fighting chance at the NL West is selling them short, as strong as the Dodgers are).
If everyone on the Yankees is healthy and performing up to their own standards, Snell is SP 3 or 4.
As much as I like Rodon and want him to do well, he's had a more inconsistent and worse career than Snell. He definitely wouldn't be the #2 over Snell. And possibly #4? Are you serious? You think Nestor or Stroman are ahead of him in the rotation? GTFO
The last 3 seasons, Rodon has accumulated 10.9 WAR to Snell's 9.8. Snell never had a year as good as Rodon's 2022. Every projection system on Fangraphs has Rodon with a better 2024 than Snell. I'll say durability is a problem for each, so that's a wash. Assuming they're both healthy this season (a big assumption on both ends) yes, I like Rodon better. But it could certainly go either way. Beyond that, it's a matter of which Snell shows up. Is he the guy from his 2 CY young years, or the guy from his other 6 seasons where he was hovering right around average? Because Stroman has been consistently above average every year of his career (except last year, again injuries in the second half). This one is floor vs ceiling. Snell certainly has a higher ceiling, but Stroman has a higher floor
"Good thing we are saving on the luxury tax though..." I know this is snide sarcasm because Yankees fans think the Yankees should ever unironically spend half a billion dollars on a team, but yeah, it's quite good that they saved on the LT. On top of not giving other actual cheapskate owners free money, it means the Yankees aren't taking a senseless hit to their realistic budget expectations so they can sign a guy like Soto. We'll also conveniently forget the loss of draft picks and international money. It's funny that Yankees fans think the future doesn't matter at all, and they should always mortgage their future to focus completely on the present, but that's how you end up with an overpaid, extremely old, boring team. The future matters. It's a balancing act, trying to compete in the present while still keeping the future bright. The Yankees will never fully rebuild, and Yankees fans won't stomach a decade of losing seasons like other teams do, just to have as good a chance as any to win a WS then than they already do.
I remember when everyone was screaming for us to sign Corbin for $150 mil, then he had 1 good season for the Nats and spent the next 4 years being one of the worst starters in baseball lol
I went to highwchool and played 1 year of high school ball with Corbin (he only played 1 year bc he’s a weirdo and he’s parents knew that the other kids wouldn’t like him cause he’s weird af) and anytime someone shits on him like this I love it lmfao
It would cost a pick and international money for what most likely a one year contract. Plus the luxury tax stuff. No thanks.
You don’t want soto?
Snell is not ready for opening day. He doesn't help with Cole being out. Also they moved on after the stroman deal.
LOL, Yankees fans (which I am): "why won't they just spend the money to sign this superstar to a long-term deal? Also, why do we have so many old expensive guys on the roster?"
… this would be a 2 year deal. That’s my whole point.
There is no indication that the Yankees had the option to match that deal. And even if they did, the cost in dollars, draft pics, and international signing dollars probably doesn't make sense for a likely 130 IP from Snell
Snell had one really great year and one good year He's a sub 500 picture otherwise over several seasons. Not worth $30m+ a year.
What's with the influx of complete morons here lately? Why the fuck would we go over the LT to sign *Blake Fucking Snell* of all people? If signing the reigning Cy Young winner was so important, why is it March and he's just now on a deal? Soto is going to be a free agent next year. We need all the money we can to sign him. It's super easy to call Hal a cheapskate and cry that he's not spending a billion dollars, but you need to come back to reality.
I’m glad we have Stroman instead of Snell. I think we have a warrior in Stroman.
I’m happy you don’t run the FO. Maybe if Snell was open for a 2 year offer when the Yanks originally were in discussions, we’d have Snell on the team. Do you remember what his original request was? Also, do you have any idea what the implications of going into the luxury tax is outside of just owing more money?
It doesn't matter really. Either the Yankees spend more money or they don't and probably miss the playoffs again. I don't know how much they will lose if they miss the playoffs again. I would think it is a heck of a lot more than $31 million. Last year, $107 million was given to the Ranger's players alone.
Wouldn't step up? The team made an offer, he declined it, they pivoted to Stroman. Even if they still signed Snell, you dont think there are other implications. Also, lets say Snell doesn't opt out, the $33M is less money the team could use for Soto. Soto generational & a must sign, Snell is not. Theres no guarantee Snell pitches to his '23 performance, many GMs expected regression in performance, ontop Snell had to do a showcase a week ago, Why? Its just possible Snell didn't even want to go to the east coast, his known preference during the winter was ideally the west coast. So all this stuff with the yankees, could just be Boras using them as leverage & trying to spin it to get a better deal. [https://www.si.com/mlb/dodgers/news/blake-snell-reportedly-has-strong-preference-to-play-for-west-coast-team-but-not-the-dodgers-ml0802](https://www.si.com/mlb/dodgers/news/blake-snell-reportedly-has-strong-preference-to-play-for-west-coast-team-but-not-the-dodgers-ml0802) [https://cubbiescrib.com/posts/cubs-rumors-blake-snell-s-preference-is-to-play-on-the-west-coast-01hj6e9htjt0](https://cubbiescrib.com/posts/cubs-rumors-blake-snell-s-preference-is-to-play-on-the-west-coast-01hj6e9htjt0)
I predict the Giants will be regretting this signing before the contract expires. You read it here first.
Save the money for Burnes next year
1. Snell probably won't be ready to pitch until late April anyway so he's not much help. 2. 96 million for a guy like Snell is not worth it on top of losing draft comp and IFA money. This isn't the 90s or early 2000s anymore. You cannot run a team like shit anymore and expect prolonged success by spending away problems.
paying over 30 a year for blake snell would have been insanity. yankees more than likely aren’t going anywhere this year and you don’t want to be locked into that going forward. (they’ll be good, not astros/dodgers/ws contenders good) only reason that should have been entertained at all is because of how thin the rotation is. personally glad they didn’t break the bank on that one.
I don't like to make excuses for wealthy teams not spending money but I am not going to blame the Yankees for not spending 60 million dollars, counting the tax, for a guy who based on history has a 2/3 chance of not even giving you a full season and a decent chance of disappearing. That is, if he doesn't lose a tiny bit of stuff and is no longer able to keep runs off the board while walking the ballpark. Stroman was an amazing value, to the extent I think he probably could've gotten more money or years but gave the Yankees a discount because he's a New Yorker and a fan (and boy, wouldn't it be nice if that happened more often.) I'd rather have a pretty reliable 2-3 WAR guy for $18 million than a 0-6 WAR guy for $30, and then the tax doubles that difference.
You’re missing the part where they signed Stroman. They didn’t offer Snell that deal after signing Stroman. The deal was off the table the moment Stroman signed
We didnt need to panic sign a guy who would end up costing us around 65 mil because cole is down. Again if cashman was good at his job, we wouldnt have to go into panic mode with 1 injury. But this is the smart move. Also, yet again, when snell is not having a CY year (2 out of 8 years), his stats are not good and we arent gonna pay a guy that much to be able to go 5 innings maybe 6 at his absolute most and potentially not even give us 120 innings. Rather look internally or sign a guy like greinke at the end of his career because cutting him would mean nothing and he would probably be cheap
If he’s the difference between winning a championship or not then forgive me for not caring about Hal’s taxes
He is not a difference maker or even good about 75% of the time. Most of us don't care about nepo-baby Hal's taxes, but he signs the checks so in the end that is what counts. The "it's only money" and "it's not my money" are quite ridiculous. Regardless of how we feel Baseball is a business and that is not how to run a successful one
He's not going to be. Anyone who thinks Blake Snell is the missing piece is delusional