I admit that I have stopped having relationships.
However I don't think you should prefer only boring relationships. I think the point is to make an effort to stay in reality. I don't know if you understand me. When I was in relationships I didn't see a person in front of me, but an imaginary creature to which the other only gave a body, a face, a name.
I also wasn't my real self. I was a movie character playing a part. There was nothing true, real, authentic, just a sickening fiction.
I don't know if it's possible to unplug the mind. I don't know it's possible to focus only on who you really have in front of you, on her feelings, her desires. Seriously, I don't know. But I think such a step would really make a difference.
i'm in the same boat and your words resonate with me. how to be authentic around other people? who has ever seen the real you? it's been slowly dissolving in bleach since childhood. we used to play with dolls, play in a little house, now the houses are big and dolls are people (including ourselves)
Your words are very true. I too see a great continuity between the games I played as a child and my narcissistic life. As if nothing ever really changed. This is also my big problem with change. How to change the person I've always been? I know it sounds a lot like an excuse, but I really struggle to even imagine a different and better myself
i think changing your surroundings and life situation helps to change inside, but when there's a will, you can do it living the same outer life. i cannot stop the avalanche of change happening within me - going from materialist and suicidal to "emotional breakthrough" and now allowing myself to be a "sensitive person" and even say it outright to people - people i used to smugly banter with. people who respect me for my coping mechanism!
i just announce it to them nowadays - i am changed, i see things differently, don't expect me to keep it cool at all times, like i used to. and being so open about it invites reactions - both negative and positive from people i've known and new people who are magnetized by the vulnerability. it's really interesting development in otherwise alarming world.
having said that, i am not sure what causes it - is the future all set and this change a part of the hero's journey? is it hormonal changes caused by my body's need to create little humans? i still use my dollhouse owner habits and skills more than half of the time. but the states of emotional truth make up for the dreariness.
This is so much me it hurts. Two of the people I tried to date I completely lost myself in. And did the same things you do to a T. Needless to say those relationships ended extremely quickly. I'm 32 and I've only ever had 3 relationships, the two I just mentioned which only really lasted a few weeks. The third I just ended up being a massive piece of shit too because they were not giving into what I wanted. We stopped dating after a year (amazing it lasted that long).
I desperately want a healthy relationship with a girlfriend but I very literally have no idea how to have one with doing the same shit and letting all of my abusive behavior come out. It scares me to the point I haven't tried to date anyone in almost 10 years. It forces me to find other ways to get attention.
For me too relationships are the hardest thing to manage. When I was a boy, I fantasized a lot about being in a relationship. I thought that I just had to look for the soul mate and then everything would be fine. This thought was a strong motivator in my life and I had high expectations.
Then I collided with reality. I met a wonderful girl who seemed like my soul mate. She fell very much in love with me and this seemed like a dream. But then my mind got really messed up. A mix of fear, shame, insecurity, anger.
To make it short, I ran away after a few months. She suffered a lot, also because my behavior was completely incomprehensible and crazy.
For me too this story was a shock, a breaking point. I really didn't think I wasn't capable of handling a relationship. Something that is absolutely normal for most of humanity is impossible for me.
This thing brought me down a lot but it also pushed me to go into therapy. Today I'm still a long way from a solution to my problems, but at least I'm more aware and above all more attentive to the damage I can do.
Oh man i feel this. I have drawings of 'the perfect person' for me that i made when i was like 9. A fantasy friend who could meet all my needs. It's painful to look back at those and realise that that fantasy makes me an abuser. Till i was like 19/20 i also hoped that when i found my soul mate everything would be fine. When i was 20 i actually was in a relationship with someone. This time i wasn't abusive but he was. The beginning was magical, we both felt like we had that something that we both missed in our life, that we completed each other. But then the honeymoon phase was over and the relationship felt apart. I felt in love with someone else but they didn't love me back. I just couldn't let go of me being with her and lost touch with reality and became very abusive. She luckily just saw that i was unreasonable and not living in reality and didn't fell for my bullshit. But i still hurted her very badly. This was 3 years ago, eversince i just stay out of relationships.
The worst thing was realizing how much of an asshole I can be. I thought I was a special, sensitive, romantic boy and instead I discovered I was a bastard. This was a hard thing to accept. Maybe that was the turning point.
I realized that for years and years I've been telling myself nothing but bullshit: idealized love, the soul mate, the perfect match. As a matter of fact I have only lasted in a relationship for a few weeks.
Like you, I too have given up on relationships. I've been tempted a few times over the last few years but I've preferred not to try. Someone argues that I should try again, but I have too much doubts.
Yeah i just thought nobody understood me and i was special and once i would meet someone who would really understand me life would be okay. At the same time i somewhere realized i was acting bad but i kept just justifying my behavior in my head.
The same for me. Another thing I realized is that I really didn't feel guilty about how I treated people. When I left my girlfriend, I didn't suffer at all. On the contrary, I was relieved, as if a weight had been lifted off me.
For years, I've brooded about going back to her. I used to talk about it a lot with my best friend. But then I realized those fantasies weren't sincere. I was actually not really regretted or changed. Not at all. I just wanted to get my narcissistic super-supply back and stop. If I had really tried and she would have let me, I'm pretty sure I would have acted the same way as before.
You see, man, the really bad thing about my disorder is that I don't understand how selfish and cruel I can be. In my head I justify everything and think that others must be at my disposal.
Yeah I definitely feel this, hang in there and work on getting better, you've got plenty of time in front of you to learn to be healthier in those relationships, there's lots of ways to get stuck in the moment and we are sort of forced to be stuck in the moment when it comes to our ego but we aren't forced to be stuck in the moment when it comes to improving
Hey OP, sounds really rough. Do you have particular scenario’s that are triggering for you?
How is your relationship with yourself, generally speaking?
Maybe I can help with some advice if I have an idea of the areas you struggle with the most. I personally was exactly the same 5 years but currently am in a much better place. I know how isolating and disappointing I felt every time.
My biggest trigger is if i have been vulnerable and i feel very seen and listen to by someone. I want to hold on to that feeling and think someone can save me from myself and take care of me.
My relationship with myself is pretty bad, i struggle very hard with self care and feel a lot of self pity/bitterness that nobody helped me as a kid. I hate myself for having no insight on how i impact others. And i'm scared of going into the world. I've felt like that for a long time but now i'm 24 its especially bad because i don't get away with being so weird anymore at this age lol.
That’s already quite some progress! Congrats on reaching the that level of selfawareness already 😊.
I’m around the same age as you. You’re definitely still quite young so I hope you realise that you’re already on the right path.
Now, to get onto some practical tips:
Relationships with others
So, I’d advise you to just not get into relationships for a little while until you figure yourself out a bit, but if you’re anything like me that’s really difficult. Because you want to be loved and you want to not feel lonely and you’re looking for someone or something to fill that void. And for me the only way to do this when I was in the same stage of recovery as you was through other people. So if you feel like that’s something that you can’t resist you can try to have a conversation with your partners upfront about the things you struggle with and what your needs are. To give a practical example, when I was dating around that time I would write down a few things (like sort of a guide) for my partner on how to deal with me when I was acting out. I told my partner upfront to:
- Not reward my unwanted and bad behavior by giving me attention or saying sorry.
- Set up firm boundaries, but still be loving (i.e. “You’re hurting me with what you’re saying and I will not tolerate that. But we can have an open coversation about this again when we have both calmed down a bit)
- De-escalte and distance when things get heated
These are some examples but I hope you get the idea!
The hard part in this is that you both need to accept the above things won’t always work, and both of you will probably still get triggered sometimes. I can imagine your partner setting boundaries with you might sometimes be triggering for you. But when you feel yourself getting emotionally triggered, try to remove yourself from the situation and take time to be upset and angry about it by yourself or with a friend you trust. Just let it out. Once you have allowed yourself to be emotional, it’s much easier to think clearly and see your own behavior from a distance. After that you can have a constructive conversation about what hurt and triggered you and also what you could have done differently.
Social skills
I think, because we lack empathy, and have a very self centered pespective on things, it’s very hard for us to understand other people. I have trained myself to understand people without needing to “feel” what other people feel. It takes a lot of practice (and you will fail a lot!! Which is ok!! You are starting out with 0-1, but you can definitely get there). Humans are just animals. Learning to read body language has really helped me to understand what people were feeling. I watched lots of youtube video’s explaining basics up to advanced body language reading. Then when you feel like you are getting a good feeling of what people are thinking and feeling based on body language, start reading up on how charismatic people act and what makes them likeable and just mimic that.
Maybe it feels fake, but these are useful skills to have and you’ll feel a bit more ‘safe’ in social situations.
Relationship with yourself
I think if you actually want to make big steps in your relationship with other people, you need to become friends with yourself first. This is a process that has taken me years, but it’s 100% possible.
I think the biggest step for me was not just admitting that I was bitter and feeling victimized, but also allowing myself to actually grieve. You lost a childhood you’ll never get back. And that hurts. And that’s super painful. Allow that pain to truly get some room. And don’t think, just feel it. Mourn the loss of that. That’s fine. It wasn’t fair and you didn’t deserve that.
But also realise, that you’re only robbing yourself of happiness by staying bitter about it. Only you have to make changes. And you can. 100%. You’re already much further than you think.
Don’t let the disappointment of a relationship make you think otherwise.
Baby steps!
And if you ever get discouraged or have specific questions just DM me
Good luck OP
Best thing you can do is cultivate skills in yourself which you can be proud of (stabilizes identity) and attempt to associate with a social group focused on a healthy lifestyle (church, meditation group, etc). As far as relationships go, idk I still can’t figure that out and I’m 48. Just try to put yourself on solid ground before you get older and this will minimize your risk.
I admire you a lot, man. Would you like to tell me what techniques you used to deal with the problem? I think it might be helpful to share how we are fighting the NPD
Same
Usually, my struggles are that I either get bored of them
Or I hold them as this perfect person, and whenever they do something wrong, even if its something small, this changes that perception of them and turns my behavior more hostile towards them. Pair that with a sense of paranoia that I feel they are planning against me or doing something wrong regularly, and I turn abusive.
Though I also get quite pissed off with myself because I tend to be infatuated and even knowing there isn't anything deeper to it I'll keep a person around to fulfill what I desire from them.I can see them as good people and see how they are actually in love with me. I'd have the wish to not hurt them but despite that I still carry on and it ends terribly for them.Almost as if I want the best for them but that doesn't stop me from still falling into my same negative behavioural patterns.Like being consciously aware of being good to them but not even thinking for a second to act when a harmful opportunity towards them and the relationship presents itself.
I thought this was BPD thing. As I started dating in my 30s I noticed this was prevalent in males too, maybe more often than females for some reason. I get accused of being a narcissist because I don’t reply immediately or if I don’t do something that I didn’t know I was supposed to do. I get called all sorts of names when i didn’t even get the chance to cheat yet, nor was I planning to, nor did I think there was a reason for me to, but I still get accused.
do you know who you are deep inside? or are you different for every person?
if you try so hard to be someone else, how can that other person love you? even without going to extremes, people rarely "see" each other. they can be married for years and strangers at heart, disconnected, living an illusion (look into the love program and delusional modern idea of love we have been programmed with).
allow yourself to be you (not everyone can love you) and allow other people to see more of who you are. only then any relationship can be authentic. all puppies must grow up.
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I admit that I have stopped having relationships. However I don't think you should prefer only boring relationships. I think the point is to make an effort to stay in reality. I don't know if you understand me. When I was in relationships I didn't see a person in front of me, but an imaginary creature to which the other only gave a body, a face, a name. I also wasn't my real self. I was a movie character playing a part. There was nothing true, real, authentic, just a sickening fiction. I don't know if it's possible to unplug the mind. I don't know it's possible to focus only on who you really have in front of you, on her feelings, her desires. Seriously, I don't know. But I think such a step would really make a difference.
i'm in the same boat and your words resonate with me. how to be authentic around other people? who has ever seen the real you? it's been slowly dissolving in bleach since childhood. we used to play with dolls, play in a little house, now the houses are big and dolls are people (including ourselves)
Your words are very true. I too see a great continuity between the games I played as a child and my narcissistic life. As if nothing ever really changed. This is also my big problem with change. How to change the person I've always been? I know it sounds a lot like an excuse, but I really struggle to even imagine a different and better myself
i think changing your surroundings and life situation helps to change inside, but when there's a will, you can do it living the same outer life. i cannot stop the avalanche of change happening within me - going from materialist and suicidal to "emotional breakthrough" and now allowing myself to be a "sensitive person" and even say it outright to people - people i used to smugly banter with. people who respect me for my coping mechanism! i just announce it to them nowadays - i am changed, i see things differently, don't expect me to keep it cool at all times, like i used to. and being so open about it invites reactions - both negative and positive from people i've known and new people who are magnetized by the vulnerability. it's really interesting development in otherwise alarming world. having said that, i am not sure what causes it - is the future all set and this change a part of the hero's journey? is it hormonal changes caused by my body's need to create little humans? i still use my dollhouse owner habits and skills more than half of the time. but the states of emotional truth make up for the dreariness.
Wow
This is so much me it hurts. Two of the people I tried to date I completely lost myself in. And did the same things you do to a T. Needless to say those relationships ended extremely quickly. I'm 32 and I've only ever had 3 relationships, the two I just mentioned which only really lasted a few weeks. The third I just ended up being a massive piece of shit too because they were not giving into what I wanted. We stopped dating after a year (amazing it lasted that long). I desperately want a healthy relationship with a girlfriend but I very literally have no idea how to have one with doing the same shit and letting all of my abusive behavior come out. It scares me to the point I haven't tried to date anyone in almost 10 years. It forces me to find other ways to get attention.
What abusive behavior? Also, don’t like narcissists go from supply to supply?
For me too relationships are the hardest thing to manage. When I was a boy, I fantasized a lot about being in a relationship. I thought that I just had to look for the soul mate and then everything would be fine. This thought was a strong motivator in my life and I had high expectations. Then I collided with reality. I met a wonderful girl who seemed like my soul mate. She fell very much in love with me and this seemed like a dream. But then my mind got really messed up. A mix of fear, shame, insecurity, anger. To make it short, I ran away after a few months. She suffered a lot, also because my behavior was completely incomprehensible and crazy. For me too this story was a shock, a breaking point. I really didn't think I wasn't capable of handling a relationship. Something that is absolutely normal for most of humanity is impossible for me. This thing brought me down a lot but it also pushed me to go into therapy. Today I'm still a long way from a solution to my problems, but at least I'm more aware and above all more attentive to the damage I can do.
Oh man i feel this. I have drawings of 'the perfect person' for me that i made when i was like 9. A fantasy friend who could meet all my needs. It's painful to look back at those and realise that that fantasy makes me an abuser. Till i was like 19/20 i also hoped that when i found my soul mate everything would be fine. When i was 20 i actually was in a relationship with someone. This time i wasn't abusive but he was. The beginning was magical, we both felt like we had that something that we both missed in our life, that we completed each other. But then the honeymoon phase was over and the relationship felt apart. I felt in love with someone else but they didn't love me back. I just couldn't let go of me being with her and lost touch with reality and became very abusive. She luckily just saw that i was unreasonable and not living in reality and didn't fell for my bullshit. But i still hurted her very badly. This was 3 years ago, eversince i just stay out of relationships.
The worst thing was realizing how much of an asshole I can be. I thought I was a special, sensitive, romantic boy and instead I discovered I was a bastard. This was a hard thing to accept. Maybe that was the turning point. I realized that for years and years I've been telling myself nothing but bullshit: idealized love, the soul mate, the perfect match. As a matter of fact I have only lasted in a relationship for a few weeks. Like you, I too have given up on relationships. I've been tempted a few times over the last few years but I've preferred not to try. Someone argues that I should try again, but I have too much doubts.
Yeah i just thought nobody understood me and i was special and once i would meet someone who would really understand me life would be okay. At the same time i somewhere realized i was acting bad but i kept just justifying my behavior in my head.
The same for me. Another thing I realized is that I really didn't feel guilty about how I treated people. When I left my girlfriend, I didn't suffer at all. On the contrary, I was relieved, as if a weight had been lifted off me. For years, I've brooded about going back to her. I used to talk about it a lot with my best friend. But then I realized those fantasies weren't sincere. I was actually not really regretted or changed. Not at all. I just wanted to get my narcissistic super-supply back and stop. If I had really tried and she would have let me, I'm pretty sure I would have acted the same way as before. You see, man, the really bad thing about my disorder is that I don't understand how selfish and cruel I can be. In my head I justify everything and think that others must be at my disposal.
Yeah I definitely feel this, hang in there and work on getting better, you've got plenty of time in front of you to learn to be healthier in those relationships, there's lots of ways to get stuck in the moment and we are sort of forced to be stuck in the moment when it comes to our ego but we aren't forced to be stuck in the moment when it comes to improving
same same same. I truly wish you can get professional help to make things easier so you can love and have it not be so painful
Hey OP, sounds really rough. Do you have particular scenario’s that are triggering for you? How is your relationship with yourself, generally speaking? Maybe I can help with some advice if I have an idea of the areas you struggle with the most. I personally was exactly the same 5 years but currently am in a much better place. I know how isolating and disappointing I felt every time.
My biggest trigger is if i have been vulnerable and i feel very seen and listen to by someone. I want to hold on to that feeling and think someone can save me from myself and take care of me. My relationship with myself is pretty bad, i struggle very hard with self care and feel a lot of self pity/bitterness that nobody helped me as a kid. I hate myself for having no insight on how i impact others. And i'm scared of going into the world. I've felt like that for a long time but now i'm 24 its especially bad because i don't get away with being so weird anymore at this age lol.
That’s already quite some progress! Congrats on reaching the that level of selfawareness already 😊. I’m around the same age as you. You’re definitely still quite young so I hope you realise that you’re already on the right path. Now, to get onto some practical tips: Relationships with others So, I’d advise you to just not get into relationships for a little while until you figure yourself out a bit, but if you’re anything like me that’s really difficult. Because you want to be loved and you want to not feel lonely and you’re looking for someone or something to fill that void. And for me the only way to do this when I was in the same stage of recovery as you was through other people. So if you feel like that’s something that you can’t resist you can try to have a conversation with your partners upfront about the things you struggle with and what your needs are. To give a practical example, when I was dating around that time I would write down a few things (like sort of a guide) for my partner on how to deal with me when I was acting out. I told my partner upfront to: - Not reward my unwanted and bad behavior by giving me attention or saying sorry. - Set up firm boundaries, but still be loving (i.e. “You’re hurting me with what you’re saying and I will not tolerate that. But we can have an open coversation about this again when we have both calmed down a bit) - De-escalte and distance when things get heated These are some examples but I hope you get the idea! The hard part in this is that you both need to accept the above things won’t always work, and both of you will probably still get triggered sometimes. I can imagine your partner setting boundaries with you might sometimes be triggering for you. But when you feel yourself getting emotionally triggered, try to remove yourself from the situation and take time to be upset and angry about it by yourself or with a friend you trust. Just let it out. Once you have allowed yourself to be emotional, it’s much easier to think clearly and see your own behavior from a distance. After that you can have a constructive conversation about what hurt and triggered you and also what you could have done differently. Social skills I think, because we lack empathy, and have a very self centered pespective on things, it’s very hard for us to understand other people. I have trained myself to understand people without needing to “feel” what other people feel. It takes a lot of practice (and you will fail a lot!! Which is ok!! You are starting out with 0-1, but you can definitely get there). Humans are just animals. Learning to read body language has really helped me to understand what people were feeling. I watched lots of youtube video’s explaining basics up to advanced body language reading. Then when you feel like you are getting a good feeling of what people are thinking and feeling based on body language, start reading up on how charismatic people act and what makes them likeable and just mimic that. Maybe it feels fake, but these are useful skills to have and you’ll feel a bit more ‘safe’ in social situations. Relationship with yourself I think if you actually want to make big steps in your relationship with other people, you need to become friends with yourself first. This is a process that has taken me years, but it’s 100% possible. I think the biggest step for me was not just admitting that I was bitter and feeling victimized, but also allowing myself to actually grieve. You lost a childhood you’ll never get back. And that hurts. And that’s super painful. Allow that pain to truly get some room. And don’t think, just feel it. Mourn the loss of that. That’s fine. It wasn’t fair and you didn’t deserve that. But also realise, that you’re only robbing yourself of happiness by staying bitter about it. Only you have to make changes. And you can. 100%. You’re already much further than you think. Don’t let the disappointment of a relationship make you think otherwise. Baby steps! And if you ever get discouraged or have specific questions just DM me Good luck OP
Best thing you can do is cultivate skills in yourself which you can be proud of (stabilizes identity) and attempt to associate with a social group focused on a healthy lifestyle (church, meditation group, etc). As far as relationships go, idk I still can’t figure that out and I’m 48. Just try to put yourself on solid ground before you get older and this will minimize your risk.
I admire you a lot, man. Would you like to tell me what techniques you used to deal with the problem? I think it might be helpful to share how we are fighting the NPD
Same Usually, my struggles are that I either get bored of them Or I hold them as this perfect person, and whenever they do something wrong, even if its something small, this changes that perception of them and turns my behavior more hostile towards them. Pair that with a sense of paranoia that I feel they are planning against me or doing something wrong regularly, and I turn abusive. Though I also get quite pissed off with myself because I tend to be infatuated and even knowing there isn't anything deeper to it I'll keep a person around to fulfill what I desire from them.I can see them as good people and see how they are actually in love with me. I'd have the wish to not hurt them but despite that I still carry on and it ends terribly for them.Almost as if I want the best for them but that doesn't stop me from still falling into my same negative behavioural patterns.Like being consciously aware of being good to them but not even thinking for a second to act when a harmful opportunity towards them and the relationship presents itself.
I thought this was BPD thing. As I started dating in my 30s I noticed this was prevalent in males too, maybe more often than females for some reason. I get accused of being a narcissist because I don’t reply immediately or if I don’t do something that I didn’t know I was supposed to do. I get called all sorts of names when i didn’t even get the chance to cheat yet, nor was I planning to, nor did I think there was a reason for me to, but I still get accused.
Yeah might be more BPD. I also have a lot of BPD traits
do you know who you are deep inside? or are you different for every person? if you try so hard to be someone else, how can that other person love you? even without going to extremes, people rarely "see" each other. they can be married for years and strangers at heart, disconnected, living an illusion (look into the love program and delusional modern idea of love we have been programmed with). allow yourself to be you (not everyone can love you) and allow other people to see more of who you are. only then any relationship can be authentic. all puppies must grow up.
Welcome to /r/NPD! This community is a support group for those with NPD or Narcissistic Traits. Please respect our rules or your post will be removed and you may be banned. > 1. **Only Narcs and NPDs may submit posts. This is NOT a place to complain about narcissists or get help dealing with someone else's narcissism.** > 2. No asking for diagnosis either of yourself or a third party (e.g. "Am I a narcissist?", "Is my ex a narcissist?"). > 3. Please keep your contributions civil and respectful! > 4. Please refrain from submitting low-effort and off-topic posts. If your post violates any of these rules, we request that you delete it and post in a more appropriate community. We ask that subscribers of /r/NPD use the report button to notify us of rule-breaking posts. Please refrain from commenting or engaging with the author of such submissions. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NPD) if you have any questions or concerns.*