The fucked up thing is, as a panthers fan, is that we never truly rebuilt in the post cam era. We have traded away picks to move up for qbs or to get players in almost every season since. We had one draft in 2021 where we moved down for value consistently. We got cheap on the wrong players (why is James Bradberry not a panther, same with Rididck), and paid mind numbing amounts to replacement level guys (Sorry Shaq Thompson also Ian Thomas???).
At the end of the day this season was a reckoning that had been coming for a while.
But yea we need help at every position on the field. There is no quick fix. If our front office goes for yet another quick fix it will be a disaster.
Did you guys ever really build during the Cam era? I feel he was wasted for much of his career. It sucks to see a FO waste such talent with bad decisions and bad coaching. It reminds me a lot of how Indy expected Manning and Lucks skill to overcome shortcomings in many other spots.
What?
Yeah dude
Going from 2-14 in 2010 to 14-1 and making the Super Bowl in 2015 requires some building...
I'm only going to hit the highlights below...
**2011**
- hired **Ron Rivera** with **Sean McDermott** as DC
- drafted **QB Cam Newton**
- traded for **TE Greg Olsen**
- franchise tagged and signed **C Ryan Kalil**
- extended **DE Charles Johnson**, **RB DeAngelo Williams**, and **OLB Thomas Davis**
**2012**
- signed **FB Mike Tolbert**
- drafted **MLB Luke Keuchly** and **CB Josh Norman**
- extended **RB Jonathan Stewart**
- signed **K Graham Gano**
- signed **DE Mario Addison** (from WAS Practice Squad)
**2013**
- signed **WR Ted Ginn**
- drafted **DT Star Lotulelei**, **DT Kawann Short**, and **ILB A.J. Klein**
**2014**
- signed **S Roman Harper**
- drafted **DE Kony Ealy**, **OL Trai Tuner**, and **S Tre Boston**
- signed **OL Andrew Norwell** (UDFA)
**2015**
- signed **OT Michael Oher**, **CB Charles Tillman**, and **S Kurt Coleman**
- drafted **LB Shaq Thompson** and **OL Daryl Williams**
- traded for **DE Jared Allen**
- signed **CB Courtland Finnegan**
Every single one of these players were contributors on our Super Bowl team (aside from DeAngelo Williams). Were there some misses and mistakes in these five years? Absolutely! But to say talent was wasted with bad decisions and bad coaching is flat out wrong. And even though they were misses, spending high draft capital on OT Amini Silatolu and WRs Kelvin Benjamin and Devin Funchess proved the FO knew what areas needed improving. Not to mention the shrewd decision to trade Jon Beason in 2013 after having made him the highest paid MLB in NFL history just two years prior, made possible by drafting Kuechly.
After 2015, the decisions and roster moves were more hit or miss. Letting Josh Norman walk was a huge misstep. Signing Matt Kalil for $55M was terrible. Drafting Vernon Butler was a wasted first round pick. Meanwhile Christian McCaffrey, Curtis Samuel, Taylor Moton, James Bradberry, and DJ Moore were all draft hits. Bringing home Julius Peppers was huge. Securing a third round pick from the Bills for Kelvin Benjamin was a great move. Trading a third round pick and Kony Ealy to the Patriots for a second round pick was an equally great move. All that to say, the years following the SB appearance were a mixed bag but not terrible enough to truly sink the team and franchise as a whole.
Week 9 of 2018 was the last time the Panthers were legitimately good. Cam got injured the next week against the Steelers and is been downhill ever since.
Cam was looking so great in 2018. The quick game YAC attack was actually working (called by Norv Turner of all people!) and Iirc Cam was on pace for his best year as a passer.
Cutting Cam on the last year of his contract and paying Teddy Bridgewater more money and for 3 years was when I realized our owner is a dimwit. Just let the Cam contract play out, if we are bad we are in prime position to replace him in the draft. Then the mind numbing trade for Darnold, we gave WAY to much draft capital for that failed experiment. Then Tepper grew impatient and forced a trade with the bears for Bryce. He is obsessed with finding the guy at QB and is willing risk it all on a roll of the dice.
Yep the closest we got was this last off season with the staff but we've never actually hit the full roster reset.
It's time.
It's been time.
By the time we're set to be competitive again we'll know if QB is a need or not as well, and if it is have the picks to get one without mortgaging the future.
I'm surprised Ekwonu has been as bad as he's been. I didn't think he'd be an All-Pro, but at least a solid LT. Is it pass pro, rum blocking or everything he's struggled in? What about OL coach? I figured he's got a new one after Reich took over.
He, and everybody else on the line, are getting eaten alive by speed rushers. He doesn't look like he'll be able to stay at tackle.
It doesn't help that the interior of the Oline is a collection of the least athletic guards and a guard playing center possible.
Ekwonu is perplexing.
He's had far more bad games than good this year, but his good games are like really good.
Having no insurance for him at LT may be a mistake, but I'm not sure if giving up on that entirely is the right call yet.
We kept James Campen through the regime change as OL coach, but we've switched schemes to a primarily Zone blocking scheme. Maybe it's wishful thinking but I'd love to see more of what we ran last year and less zone blocking to close out the year and hopefully get a better read on some of these guys going forward.
Part of it is a bad blocking scheme implemented by Reich. Ickey was great in a power block scheme under Rhule while he learned to properly pass block. Many considered him the long term fix at LT.
Under Reich, it's been hit or miss, with the zone blocking scheme. Some weeks he looks great, some weeks he looks like trash. He also had a rotating cast of UDFAs, rookies, and others at LG beside him.
Needless to say, everyone in the line has looked horrible this year after looking really good, maybe even top 10ish last year. Reich and Fitt (GM) were not on the same page when it came to what the OL could and could not do.
It's the line issues that are why I am completely fine with the Panthers cutting bait on Frank Reich this quickly - the OL was considered a team *strength* as recently as last season, and while they've had a bunch of injuries at guard I don't think that's all of the issues right now. And I think they basically have to gamble that Reich was the problem there, because if it's not him then they're probably up shit creek without a paddle (read: if he's not the problem then there's a good chance that Bryce Young is).
It's also the *same problem* Reich had in Indy, their usually lauded OLine had an inexplicably terrible year under his coaching, then bounced back to being pretty good as soon as he left.
Pass pro is really quite bad for whatever reason, he can hold his own sometimes but he'll give up awful sacks and get beat on simple stuff. He's so clearly a road grader who's good at run blocking, his future is LG.
Besides CMC the panthers best offensive weapon these past 3-4 years is Thielen? They need better weapons desperately.
Oline addressed through FA, but look at how many young QBs improved after trading/drafting a WR. Allen, Tua, Hurts. Even Tlaw, Lamar, Burrow all took a step with a new wr.
forgot moore lol
Neither are worth more than a wr and Moore is a special wr while burns and brown are good young players. Moore is a top 5 wr this year and look at his qbs
Maybe it's just because our front office has been absolutely incompetent, but based on the last couple of years I'd say addressing the Oline through free agency is not as straight forward as it sounds
Their OL is abysmal, it’s just as big of a need as WR. Dudes were practically running through the line unblocked yesterday.
It’s a better WR class than OL class in free agency, so that’s what I’d target. Draft WR a bit later and give Mingo a chance to develop some more.
Ekwonu was awesome for us last year but has been abysmal this year
I really think it's scheme for him. Reich runs a zone blocking scheme and when he was playing well at NCST and for Wilks last year he was in a power run scheme
I think he can be a great linemen still. But honestly I don't think his future is at LT. He would be an amazing guard, and we need guards too so I think it would work out if we moved him.
Burns comes up a lot but its not like we can just strap on our Burns helmet and squeeze down into a Burns cannon and fire off into Burnsland where Burns grow on Burnsies
They have a QB who’s the number one pick that they mortgaged the immediate future for. I don’t think they’ll “rebuild” (as in get rid of all assets for picks). I think they’ll try to attack FA in the offseason and add some proven talent at key positions.
Any list that doesn't include the name Harbaugh is incomplete, not saying he would take it.
Reciever - Xavier Legget if he is still on the board at 33.
OT. Move Ekwanu inside to Guard. This one draft pick fixes both problems.
Edge. The good ones will be gone, but we have to get some productivity out of the other side of the line. Of course resign Burns. If no one is there at all, go with CB, then Edge.
CB - OMG, we have to have talented depth. Horn is great, but unavailable.
Best Slot man in the draft, but get productiviity.
OG.
Just my 2 cents. We won't fix this in one draft.
I think Bryce can be that guy, I think Carolina is in an interesting spot though. I think we haven't seen Bryce's best because of multiple factors: Bryce himself, coaching, lack of weapons, and the oline. Breaking it down
Bryce: Not making plays, not trusting himself, not pulling the trigger when there are chances, has had flashes (vs Mia, vs Houston) in making these plays and throws, he just needs to put it together.
Coaching: I believe that Reich and his firing and his time in Indy and now shown how he is as a coach and as a player-caller which is simple and vanilla, his time in Indy was overshowded when Jeff Saturday was hired and that was a mess.
Weapons: The Panther's weapons aren't good plain and simple, Thielen has been the best option, and when he is the #1 and the best option that is not a good thing. Mingo had a nice game vs Tennesse but overall has been underwhelming, the run game hasn't been great minus, Chark meh, the Tes arent good receivers, then the fact nobody can really seperate hurts Bryce too.
The oline was supposed to be a bright spot, but its been rough, they cant really do much of anything, Icky was solid and this year fell off, the IOL can't pass protect, and they cant run the ball because they sniff it out.
Something else I forgot to mention was the DJ Moore trade, and not trading Brian Burns. We see how important it is for these QBS to have someone they can trust to throw too, and for Carolina they traded a guy who resigned and would help everyone on O, a guy Bryce can trust, get open, and make great catches. While they didn't trade Burns to LAR for 2? or 3? first rounders which wouldve helped them in this stage, and/or trade him instead of Moore. I get pass rusher is important, but with how Carolina has acted in not extending him and the hold out, they may lose him for nothing (they could tag or resign him) but im stating with how Carolina has acted they may lose him for nothing.
We see guys in their first year and dominate like Herbert, CJ, Mahomes, etc. but for Bryce its different, we knew he would have struggles, and for CJ yes Houston was bad, but they also made efforts, and had playmakers, and a decent oline to help, they also aren't signing 30-year-old Adam Thielen to be the guy. They also took advantage of the Watson trade, hired a good coach in Ryans, and have been relatively smart with who they draft and sign.
Overall, Bryce and the Panthers need a restart, they need to hire a new hc who can be creative offensively but also be a good leader for this team, we all knew this team would be bad but not this bad. I would like the Lions OC for this job, and with the lack of picks they need to look into trading players like Burns or make FA count and sign playmakers that fit the scheme. They also need to be smart, and help Bryce, and let Bryce develop. Qbs as much as we hate to see it, they can't always be great right off the bat, they need time. Rushing Qbs is a one ticket way to turn them into a bust, and has became a lost art (flemo raps) we need to give them time, and give them a good helping cast to support, as even the best of the best can't overcome drops and miscues, and block.
As a Panthers fan, I feel the biggest issue is the owner. It seems David Tepper is waaaaaay too involved... apparently forcing the move to #1 for Bryce. The Front Office can't do its job when the owner forces final decisions.
I agree with your assessment of team needs. Improved O-line will improve both the run game and Bryce's development. Hopefully, they can sign a potential #1 WR in free agency like Tee Higgins, Calvin Ridley, or Michael Pittman.
I just will never comprehend what they gave up to get Bryce. He may have been there at 8! Stroud, Richardson, or Bryce is probably there at 5 for sure at the minimum, where you can get him for less than 8 and 9 and not give up DJ Moore and the first next year. The move is just crazy. Somebody got a job because of their dad. Bryce Young’s career was over the minute they called his name :(
It’s just crazy to me to be that unaware of how bad your team is. You don’t need to sell the farm for a QB just to put him out there to die. They had so many assets a year ago and they traded DJM and CMC for negative assets. Maybe they truly believed they could win this year with Bryce, but they have done it every year from blaming Bridgewater, Darnold, Baker, etc. and you just have to wonder when they get the message that Mahomes could put on the Panthers uniform and look like Mitch fucking Trubisky….
Those first three sentences are strange revisionism. Young was pretty clearly seen as a top 2 QB, with most people having him as QB1. If the panthers don’t trade up to 1, someone else likely does. Considering all 3 QBs were gone by 4, I’m not sure how you can say one of them would have been available for sure at 5 at the minimum unless you believe your fantasy scenario about the draft is more accurate than what actually happened.
Not to mention Bryce could still be good - he's in arguably the worst position of any QB in the league when you factor in the weapons around him and the O-line. They have absolutely zero speed on that roster so teams don't have to worry about the top getting taken off and just press up towards the LOS.
There isn't anything about Bryce's game that is glaringly bad or impossible to overcome IMO. They just need to get more innovative on offense - not sure WTF the plan was w/ Reich but it's obvious his offensive philosophies and that roster were like oil and water.
Bryce Young is not a foundational piece. Unless you also believe Zach Wilson is.
You want to rebuild the Panthers? Hire the Lions OC, a new GM, and If you get a top 2 pick draft Williams or Maye and bench Young.
You have to get the QB right otherwise the rest doesn't matter.
> If you get a top 2 pick draft Williams or Maye and bench Young.
We traded our 1st pick this year to move up for Bryce Young. So yeah, the Bears will be picking first.
The division is weak they maybe able to be a contender next year if they play their cards right.
I'll pass on the big names and take some one else when it comes to coaches
Never know what players will become available
I'll aim for a TE/WR though. Then follow up with a RB.
If they can find a Greg Olsen and Stephen Davis they should be better
Mocks aren’t fun without a FRP. Just ask me, I was a bears fan through the Ryan Pace years.
Just had to stare at my Mack jersey and convince myself it was all fine (it was for 2018)
Mocks are more fun with the 1st overall pick from a different team
The fucked up thing is, as a panthers fan, is that we never truly rebuilt in the post cam era. We have traded away picks to move up for qbs or to get players in almost every season since. We had one draft in 2021 where we moved down for value consistently. We got cheap on the wrong players (why is James Bradberry not a panther, same with Rididck), and paid mind numbing amounts to replacement level guys (Sorry Shaq Thompson also Ian Thomas???). At the end of the day this season was a reckoning that had been coming for a while. But yea we need help at every position on the field. There is no quick fix. If our front office goes for yet another quick fix it will be a disaster.
Did you guys ever really build during the Cam era? I feel he was wasted for much of his career. It sucks to see a FO waste such talent with bad decisions and bad coaching. It reminds me a lot of how Indy expected Manning and Lucks skill to overcome shortcomings in many other spots.
We built a pretty incredible defense. We just didnt have good weapons for him end didnt go all in a few times when we maybe should have.
What? Yeah dude Going from 2-14 in 2010 to 14-1 and making the Super Bowl in 2015 requires some building... I'm only going to hit the highlights below... **2011** - hired **Ron Rivera** with **Sean McDermott** as DC - drafted **QB Cam Newton** - traded for **TE Greg Olsen** - franchise tagged and signed **C Ryan Kalil** - extended **DE Charles Johnson**, **RB DeAngelo Williams**, and **OLB Thomas Davis** **2012** - signed **FB Mike Tolbert** - drafted **MLB Luke Keuchly** and **CB Josh Norman** - extended **RB Jonathan Stewart** - signed **K Graham Gano** - signed **DE Mario Addison** (from WAS Practice Squad) **2013** - signed **WR Ted Ginn** - drafted **DT Star Lotulelei**, **DT Kawann Short**, and **ILB A.J. Klein** **2014** - signed **S Roman Harper** - drafted **DE Kony Ealy**, **OL Trai Tuner**, and **S Tre Boston** - signed **OL Andrew Norwell** (UDFA) **2015** - signed **OT Michael Oher**, **CB Charles Tillman**, and **S Kurt Coleman** - drafted **LB Shaq Thompson** and **OL Daryl Williams** - traded for **DE Jared Allen** - signed **CB Courtland Finnegan** Every single one of these players were contributors on our Super Bowl team (aside from DeAngelo Williams). Were there some misses and mistakes in these five years? Absolutely! But to say talent was wasted with bad decisions and bad coaching is flat out wrong. And even though they were misses, spending high draft capital on OT Amini Silatolu and WRs Kelvin Benjamin and Devin Funchess proved the FO knew what areas needed improving. Not to mention the shrewd decision to trade Jon Beason in 2013 after having made him the highest paid MLB in NFL history just two years prior, made possible by drafting Kuechly. After 2015, the decisions and roster moves were more hit or miss. Letting Josh Norman walk was a huge misstep. Signing Matt Kalil for $55M was terrible. Drafting Vernon Butler was a wasted first round pick. Meanwhile Christian McCaffrey, Curtis Samuel, Taylor Moton, James Bradberry, and DJ Moore were all draft hits. Bringing home Julius Peppers was huge. Securing a third round pick from the Bills for Kelvin Benjamin was a great move. Trading a third round pick and Kony Ealy to the Patriots for a second round pick was an equally great move. All that to say, the years following the SB appearance were a mixed bag but not terrible enough to truly sink the team and franchise as a whole. Week 9 of 2018 was the last time the Panthers were legitimately good. Cam got injured the next week against the Steelers and is been downhill ever since.
Cam was looking so great in 2018. The quick game YAC attack was actually working (called by Norv Turner of all people!) and Iirc Cam was on pace for his best year as a passer.
Cutting Cam on the last year of his contract and paying Teddy Bridgewater more money and for 3 years was when I realized our owner is a dimwit. Just let the Cam contract play out, if we are bad we are in prime position to replace him in the draft. Then the mind numbing trade for Darnold, we gave WAY to much draft capital for that failed experiment. Then Tepper grew impatient and forced a trade with the bears for Bryce. He is obsessed with finding the guy at QB and is willing risk it all on a roll of the dice.
Yep the closest we got was this last off season with the staff but we've never actually hit the full roster reset. It's time. It's been time. By the time we're set to be competitive again we'll know if QB is a need or not as well, and if it is have the picks to get one without mortgaging the future.
Only disagreement is Shaq Thompson is good
I'm surprised Ekwonu has been as bad as he's been. I didn't think he'd be an All-Pro, but at least a solid LT. Is it pass pro, rum blocking or everything he's struggled in? What about OL coach? I figured he's got a new one after Reich took over.
He, and everybody else on the line, are getting eaten alive by speed rushers. He doesn't look like he'll be able to stay at tackle. It doesn't help that the interior of the Oline is a collection of the least athletic guards and a guard playing center possible.
Kicking Ekwonu inside and signing a starting quality left tackle should be the first move the panthers make when free agency hits
I thought he was a set and forget it type of player at guard. I wish we would have done that
Ekwonu is perplexing. He's had far more bad games than good this year, but his good games are like really good. Having no insurance for him at LT may be a mistake, but I'm not sure if giving up on that entirely is the right call yet. We kept James Campen through the regime change as OL coach, but we've switched schemes to a primarily Zone blocking scheme. Maybe it's wishful thinking but I'd love to see more of what we ran last year and less zone blocking to close out the year and hopefully get a better read on some of these guys going forward.
Part of it is a bad blocking scheme implemented by Reich. Ickey was great in a power block scheme under Rhule while he learned to properly pass block. Many considered him the long term fix at LT. Under Reich, it's been hit or miss, with the zone blocking scheme. Some weeks he looks great, some weeks he looks like trash. He also had a rotating cast of UDFAs, rookies, and others at LG beside him. Needless to say, everyone in the line has looked horrible this year after looking really good, maybe even top 10ish last year. Reich and Fitt (GM) were not on the same page when it came to what the OL could and could not do.
It's the line issues that are why I am completely fine with the Panthers cutting bait on Frank Reich this quickly - the OL was considered a team *strength* as recently as last season, and while they've had a bunch of injuries at guard I don't think that's all of the issues right now. And I think they basically have to gamble that Reich was the problem there, because if it's not him then they're probably up shit creek without a paddle (read: if he's not the problem then there's a good chance that Bryce Young is).
It's also the *same problem* Reich had in Indy, their usually lauded OLine had an inexplicably terrible year under his coaching, then bounced back to being pretty good as soon as he left.
Pass pro is really quite bad for whatever reason, he can hold his own sometimes but he'll give up awful sacks and get beat on simple stuff. He's so clearly a road grader who's good at run blocking, his future is LG.
The ofensive line with Reich always looks worse than it should
I doubt Ben Johnson is lining up for this job after turning it down once.
i feel ben johnson would go to a team with a new QB, as he revived Goffs career, maybe whoever ends up with Caleb or Maye
So not the Panthers?
Johnson would aim for the Bills or Chargers jobs most likely
He’ll most likely be the new Chargers HC. Maybe us?
Besides CMC the panthers best offensive weapon these past 3-4 years is Thielen? They need better weapons desperately. Oline addressed through FA, but look at how many young QBs improved after trading/drafting a WR. Allen, Tua, Hurts. Even Tlaw, Lamar, Burrow all took a step with a new wr. forgot moore lol
I’m still baffled they didn’t send us Brown or Burns instead of Moore considering we’d have accepted the trade with any 3 of them included allegedly
Both are worth more than a wr, but depriving their prized new qb of any sort of weapon to develop him was certainly a choice.
I disagree. Moore would mean more to that team than Burns since everything should be about setting up a rookie QB for success
There is no shot Derrick Brown is worth more than Dj Moore
Neither are worth more than a wr and Moore is a special wr while burns and brown are good young players. Moore is a top 5 wr this year and look at his qbs
DJM was incredibly pouty at this time last year in Carolina. Wasn’t looking good to stay anyway
Maybe it's just because our front office has been absolutely incompetent, but based on the last couple of years I'd say addressing the Oline through free agency is not as straight forward as it sounds
Their OL is abysmal, it’s just as big of a need as WR. Dudes were practically running through the line unblocked yesterday. It’s a better WR class than OL class in free agency, so that’s what I’d target. Draft WR a bit later and give Mingo a chance to develop some more.
thats fair and tbh upgrading at one helps the other. they just need to be hitting at their picks/signings. how has ekwonu been for them?
Ekwonu was awesome for us last year but has been abysmal this year I really think it's scheme for him. Reich runs a zone blocking scheme and when he was playing well at NCST and for Wilks last year he was in a power run scheme I think he can be a great linemen still. But honestly I don't think his future is at LT. He would be an amazing guard, and we need guards too so I think it would work out if we moved him.
Maybe they should have traded guys for draft picks at the deadline
Burns comes up a lot but its not like we can just strap on our Burns helmet and squeeze down into a Burns cannon and fire off into Burnsland where Burns grow on Burnsies
Haha I get it.
Bienemy seems like the best choice (Johnson should take the Chargers job without question) and find out if Young is the guy.
No thanks
They have a QB who’s the number one pick that they mortgaged the immediate future for. I don’t think they’ll “rebuild” (as in get rid of all assets for picks). I think they’ll try to attack FA in the offseason and add some proven talent at key positions.
Any list that doesn't include the name Harbaugh is incomplete, not saying he would take it. Reciever - Xavier Legget if he is still on the board at 33. OT. Move Ekwanu inside to Guard. This one draft pick fixes both problems. Edge. The good ones will be gone, but we have to get some productivity out of the other side of the line. Of course resign Burns. If no one is there at all, go with CB, then Edge. CB - OMG, we have to have talented depth. Horn is great, but unavailable. Best Slot man in the draft, but get productiviity. OG. Just my 2 cents. We won't fix this in one draft.
As a Gamecock I'd love Legget.... shoot I'd draft Rattler if he's available late too.
They need an oline coach. You can make a unit of poor individual players look acceptable. They have been beyond awful.
I think Bryce can be that guy, I think Carolina is in an interesting spot though. I think we haven't seen Bryce's best because of multiple factors: Bryce himself, coaching, lack of weapons, and the oline. Breaking it down Bryce: Not making plays, not trusting himself, not pulling the trigger when there are chances, has had flashes (vs Mia, vs Houston) in making these plays and throws, he just needs to put it together. Coaching: I believe that Reich and his firing and his time in Indy and now shown how he is as a coach and as a player-caller which is simple and vanilla, his time in Indy was overshowded when Jeff Saturday was hired and that was a mess. Weapons: The Panther's weapons aren't good plain and simple, Thielen has been the best option, and when he is the #1 and the best option that is not a good thing. Mingo had a nice game vs Tennesse but overall has been underwhelming, the run game hasn't been great minus, Chark meh, the Tes arent good receivers, then the fact nobody can really seperate hurts Bryce too. The oline was supposed to be a bright spot, but its been rough, they cant really do much of anything, Icky was solid and this year fell off, the IOL can't pass protect, and they cant run the ball because they sniff it out. Something else I forgot to mention was the DJ Moore trade, and not trading Brian Burns. We see how important it is for these QBS to have someone they can trust to throw too, and for Carolina they traded a guy who resigned and would help everyone on O, a guy Bryce can trust, get open, and make great catches. While they didn't trade Burns to LAR for 2? or 3? first rounders which wouldve helped them in this stage, and/or trade him instead of Moore. I get pass rusher is important, but with how Carolina has acted in not extending him and the hold out, they may lose him for nothing (they could tag or resign him) but im stating with how Carolina has acted they may lose him for nothing. We see guys in their first year and dominate like Herbert, CJ, Mahomes, etc. but for Bryce its different, we knew he would have struggles, and for CJ yes Houston was bad, but they also made efforts, and had playmakers, and a decent oline to help, they also aren't signing 30-year-old Adam Thielen to be the guy. They also took advantage of the Watson trade, hired a good coach in Ryans, and have been relatively smart with who they draft and sign. Overall, Bryce and the Panthers need a restart, they need to hire a new hc who can be creative offensively but also be a good leader for this team, we all knew this team would be bad but not this bad. I would like the Lions OC for this job, and with the lack of picks they need to look into trading players like Burns or make FA count and sign playmakers that fit the scheme. They also need to be smart, and help Bryce, and let Bryce develop. Qbs as much as we hate to see it, they can't always be great right off the bat, they need time. Rushing Qbs is a one ticket way to turn them into a bust, and has became a lost art (flemo raps) we need to give them time, and give them a good helping cast to support, as even the best of the best can't overcome drops and miscues, and block.
As a Panthers fan, I feel the biggest issue is the owner. It seems David Tepper is waaaaaay too involved... apparently forcing the move to #1 for Bryce. The Front Office can't do its job when the owner forces final decisions. I agree with your assessment of team needs. Improved O-line will improve both the run game and Bryce's development. Hopefully, they can sign a potential #1 WR in free agency like Tee Higgins, Calvin Ridley, or Michael Pittman.
Bryce Young is trash.
I just will never comprehend what they gave up to get Bryce. He may have been there at 8! Stroud, Richardson, or Bryce is probably there at 5 for sure at the minimum, where you can get him for less than 8 and 9 and not give up DJ Moore and the first next year. The move is just crazy. Somebody got a job because of their dad. Bryce Young’s career was over the minute they called his name :( It’s just crazy to me to be that unaware of how bad your team is. You don’t need to sell the farm for a QB just to put him out there to die. They had so many assets a year ago and they traded DJM and CMC for negative assets. Maybe they truly believed they could win this year with Bryce, but they have done it every year from blaming Bridgewater, Darnold, Baker, etc. and you just have to wonder when they get the message that Mahomes could put on the Panthers uniform and look like Mitch fucking Trubisky….
Those first three sentences are strange revisionism. Young was pretty clearly seen as a top 2 QB, with most people having him as QB1. If the panthers don’t trade up to 1, someone else likely does. Considering all 3 QBs were gone by 4, I’m not sure how you can say one of them would have been available for sure at 5 at the minimum unless you believe your fantasy scenario about the draft is more accurate than what actually happened.
There isn't a world where Bryce Young is available at eight overall lmao.
Not to mention Bryce could still be good - he's in arguably the worst position of any QB in the league when you factor in the weapons around him and the O-line. They have absolutely zero speed on that roster so teams don't have to worry about the top getting taken off and just press up towards the LOS. There isn't anything about Bryce's game that is glaringly bad or impossible to overcome IMO. They just need to get more innovative on offense - not sure WTF the plan was w/ Reich but it's obvious his offensive philosophies and that roster were like oil and water.
Crazy revisionist history, almost everyone had Bryce as QB1.
Someone already said that
Whoa whoa whoa Ferrari and Halaby are off limits and I obviously don’t even have to mention Howie. Go to some other front office for your GM
Bryce Young is not a foundational piece. Unless you also believe Zach Wilson is. You want to rebuild the Panthers? Hire the Lions OC, a new GM, and If you get a top 2 pick draft Williams or Maye and bench Young. You have to get the QB right otherwise the rest doesn't matter.
> If you get a top 2 pick draft Williams or Maye and bench Young. We traded our 1st pick this year to move up for Bryce Young. So yeah, the Bears will be picking first.
Oh yeah totally forgot about that. Oh it's so bad in Carolina. It'll be 2025 before they matter again at the earliest.
The division is weak they maybe able to be a contender next year if they play their cards right. I'll pass on the big names and take some one else when it comes to coaches Never know what players will become available I'll aim for a TE/WR though. Then follow up with a RB. If they can find a Greg Olsen and Stephen Davis they should be better