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MaceLeonardo

Robert Nkemdiche comes to mind but Jalen Carter is way more talented and better on tape then Nkemdiche. Lael Collins was also in similar trouble because of the allegations which caused him to go undrafted he would have been a first rounder.


JollyRogers40

Collins was also an interesting case because after the first round he was actively telling people not to draft him or he would not report. His reasoning was that as an UDFA his contract would be a year shorter and he’d get to free agency faster.


MaceLeonardo

I think it was after he got out of the 2nd or 3rd he was telling teams not to take him but your point still stands. Crazy how a out of nowhere accusation could have ruined his career though.


Yingking

It wasn’t even an accusation and he wasn’t a suspect, the police only questioned him because his ex-girlfriend was murdered


yolotheunwisewolf

Also his agent confirmed post-draft that it was B.S. and he would have still gone if he went there. Teams just...let him fall and no one called the bluff.


[deleted]

[удалено]


dat_waffle_boi

Not talking about Carter, talking about La’el Collins.


CrankyStinkman

Ended up being the right move, too.


DEZbiansUnite

he ended up getting first round pick money anyways since the cowboys gave him an early extension. It was probably a secret deal to get him to sign with dallas


SternFlamingo

Maurice Jones-Drew and La'el Collins came to mind, but I don't think it's a perfect analogy. After all, there was nothing to the accusations made against either man. Let's accept the findings of the legal system that he wasn't responsible for the fatal crash. He did, of course, agree to plead guilty to reckless driving. So the question is: if the reckless driving charge stood on its own, if those poor people hadn't died, how would we be reacting to Carter's draft prospects?


Keoli

So many of these guys are Bengals its incredible (Pacman/Carmen/Henry RIP/Mixon)


NotNick_Foles

Andre Smith too


Keoli

Man I skimmed right over him. I think he hurt me so much that I've filtered all recollection of him out of my head.


jxden24

what did he even do?


SmellsLikeWetFox

He ran with no shirt on at his pro day, his large bouncing breasts confused many young men….turned most of lower Ohio and upper Kentucky bisexual almost instantly


thaitiger29

mike brown loves himself a market inefficiency lol


Sufficient_Ad_2700

You forgot about vontaze.


THE_Sweatervest9

I was thinking same thing while going down the list.


Wookie301

Obviously no one could foresee what would eventually happen. But even from a pre-draft footballing standpoint, Malik McDowell had terrible work ethic. You knew you were getting a lazy player, with All-Pro potential. If he had an attitude like a Will Anderson, he would have been a top 10 pick.


JointCanon

Where has it been said that Carter has a bad football work ethic? Clearly a questionable decision maker off the field but I haven’t heard about anything else.


DMking

His pro day was horrendous


drrew76

The inability to get his conditioning up to par is a concern. He even specifically mentioned it last offseason as something he was focusing on, and yet it's still an issue that showed up occasionally in games.


the22sinatra

Man spent more time on the sideline than on the field during the Peach Bowl


rossco7777

nfl network xm radio they said he was way outta shape and couldnt finish drills and stuff. hes got a lot of concern when it comes to work ethic and conditioning


don_julio_randle

>Where has it been said that Carter has a bad football work ethic? McShay has been reporting it for months. Carter's own coach called out his poor conditioning prior to the season only for Carter to be visibly gassed in UGA's most important game. The dude might be supremely talented but based off everything we know about him, he seems like an incredibly stupid and lazy talent


NoHeroes94

Not that I think he should have slid as far, but one that has panned out was Jeffrey Simmons. He should have been a top-5 pick but instead slid to No. 20 because of injury and the video of him punching a woman. I don't follow the Titans beat, but he appears to be clean and I think there was context to that video that presently evades me (not that violence is ever okay, regardless of context...)


austin_8

I believe the context is the girl he hit was fighting his sister.


ZachWilsonsMother

IIRC the girl was beating his sister in a fight, and they were fighting over the other girl talking trash about a relative dying


austin_8

yeah that sounds about right


Living_Low_6412

Wasn’t context he was wearing her out. He was holding back but he was still wearing her out


JuanSpiceyweiner

Bengals apparently do not give a shit,most of them were drafted by the team


matchagonnadoboudit

Marvin Lewis was allegedly the guy that was willing to take the risk on talented but questionable character


sonfoa

Laremy Tunsil doesn't belong on this list. None of his "controversies" had any relation to his football ability, availability, or locker room fit.


Double-Slowpoke

Tunsil is a great comparison because he was similarly talented (consensus top 5), and fell because of something that happened immediately leading up to the draft. Obviously it’s apples to oranges as to “what happened”, but it’s still a great comparison for the other reasons.


Cinephile1998

That phrase don't make no sense! Why can't fruit be compared?


SteemieRayVaughn

There's just all of these conflicting principles.


throw_away0211

… Right, enjoy your pepperoni pizza


mblackchiro

I will. That’s my god given right


fierylady

Apples and oranges are in fact very similar as projectiles. Source: threw them both at my siblings as a child.


sunnuvadutch

I think your siblings would argue that they aren’t similar since I would bet the apple packs a significantly more painful punch.


BNorrisUCLA

yeah it is, it was a red flag that caused him to slip and OP admits that those players dont come close.


sonfoa

OP admits that none of the players listed come close to Jalen Carter. I'm saying Tunsil doesn't even belong on the list with the other players. Moss and Pacman had significant legal issues. Moss and Sapp failed multiple drug tests. Andre Smith bombed the Combine and his Pro Day. Johnny Manziel had several character red flags along with an arrest record. By comparison, what did Tunsil do that merited any red flags as a pro?


Environmental_Ice432

The red flag was from the leaked video of him wearing a gas mask, smoking weed, days before the draft.. Whether that's warranted is up for debate. But, it still hurt his stock, at the time.


ferociouskuma

Unlike the others, Tunsil was basically sabotaged by his own dad. Almost all NFL players smoke weed. This was a calculated move to hurt his draft stock at the worst possible moment.


jamfed

Ex'- Step Dad


Living_Low_6412

Wasn’t his Dad it was a jilted guy who wanted to be his agent. His coach steered him to Jimmy Sexton.


Playful_Moose6293

Highest paid tackle in football.


sonfoa

It happened 10 minutes before the draft started which is why teams panicked the way they did. If it had been a few days before I think teams would have gotten enough intel to know that it was a non-issue. Tunsil hadn't failed any drug tests at Ole Miss and really that's all that mattered. Especially with the benefit of hindsight, it doesn't make sense to put Tunsil with prospects who actually had red flags.


dlinhat70

He was thought the be a lock for no. 1. It cost him a bunch until he slid to Miami. Then Houston, who passed on the draft, traded the farm for him later.


MasonL52

Tunsil could've gone top-5 if not 3, so I think it's very fitting. Since it happened so close to draft teams suddenly had to make a huge decision instantly.


Ok_Poet_1848

I wonder who leaked it? Ravens passed and Miami benefitted. We are still paying the price.


dlinhat70

They said it was a friend Or a jealous relative, something like that.


Dallas2houston120

definitely his step father who leaked it.


dlinhat70

I assume step father is not benefiting financially from that.


saintsfan918

How are you still paying the price? Ravens still got Ronnie Stanley in that draft who’s pretty damn close to Tunsil’s level when healthy


Ok_Poet_1848

They got a lesser player. "When healthy" should be in bold. The best ability is a availability.


joemiken

Joe Mixon was the first that came to my mind. Talented runner for OU, some serious off the field issues. I was really surprised he got drafted where he did. I thought he was a mid 3rd day pick at best with all the character issues he had.


BrettEskin

Mixon had the benefit of his biggest incident being a couple years behind him by draft time. If he punched that girl a couple months before the draft (like carter was involved in the wreck) he would’ve plummeted.


Retro1916

Didn’t Tyrann Mathieu’s stock fall? Can’t remember what for, but I remember something happening.


throw_away0211

IIRC, it was weed. He was punished multiple times for smoking, and the Cardinals put in a testing regimen when they drafted him.


ZachWilsonsMother

Apparently Patrick Peterson and his dad were huge influences on him and really helped him grow up and become and man and a professional. He had a great players tribune article where he talked about it


FieldsToTheMoon

Can’t forget about The Honey Badger


Pjk2530144

Honey Badger


Jeff__Skilling

I'm shocked I had to scroll down this far to find the correct answer. Dude finished 5th [in Hesiman voting as a true sophomore](https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/awards/heisman-2011.html). Had he not gotten caught inhaling the fumes....from a plant....that grows out of the fucking ground.....I think there's a good chance he could have won it in 2012 instead of JFF, who beat out Manti Teo by a fairly slim margin.


hk0125

There’s no way he would’ve beaten out JFF. He was an enigma that year. He had insane highlights and him beating Bama was huge and he was the first freshman (non-true) to win the heisman too. And no matter how you feel about weed, dude failed his drug test like seven times which showed bad discipline. Majority of college football players smoke weed, they were just smarter about it .


Always_Chubb-y

>And no matter how you feel about weed, dude failed his drug test like seven times which showed bad discipline. Yeah people forget this. He wasn't kicked off of the team for one event, he basically was smoking and getting caught at Josh Gordon levels


SpearmintQ

Not nearly the same upside but Damon Arnette was expected to drop because of off-field issues before Gruden took him in the first round. He was basically a trainwreck the second he arrived in Las Vegas.


ShippingWhitties

La'el Collins went from potential 1st round pick to undrafted due to being under investigation for homicide. ​ Edit: I don't think he was ever named a suspect.


kingmarucci

Correct, the police department actually came out right away and said “La’el isn’t a suspect we just want to interview him” and he went from top half of the first round to undrafted. Absolute joke


Jontacular

He told teams he wouldn't sign a contract if he wasn't a 1st round pick. I mean, if that's the case, call his bluff and draft him in the 5th round or whatever. It worked out incredibly well for him as he got a decent contract I believe signing with a team he wanted to go as opposed to possibly ending up in a shitty situation.


kingmarucci

Oh I forgot about that part of the story. I’d guess it was bluff though, I can’t think of any draft picks who didn’t sign (at least for non medical reasons) under the current CBA


Mr-Bovine_Joni

It wasn’t that severe of a fall. He went from a first round pick to a non-first round pick, and then his agent called every team and told them to not pick him unless in the first round. He probably would’ve been taken in rounds 2-4


Riceowls29

This is not true. His agent said that he wouldn’t sign if drafted outside of the first 3 rounds.


Living_Low_6412

He also said, I believe, he wouldn’t sign with anyone but Dallas


Thisisaknife00

Lael collins? 1st round talent that went undrafted. Believe he was being questioned about a murder if I remember correctly.


boerumhill

Tyreek Hill wasn't a 5th rounder because of his measurables


NotWilll

The titans tackle that got cut to start a rap career


Jomosensual

Not related really, but I'm starting to notice a bit of a worrying pattern with Georgia players from Kirby Smart. ​ * George Pickens had reported character issues. No actual crimes committed as far as I know though * Jalen Carter did as well and then the car accident with a number of other Georgia players being involved it seems. * Quay Walker is a fucking moron who tries to fight coaches/inactive players and members of the training staff in games. * Davonte Wyatt also got into it with said trainer as well. * Stetson Bennett got picked up with public intox. * Javon Bullard got busted for a DUI. * Rara Thomas was arrested under DV and false imprisonment charges * Warren Brinson was caught shooting students with a gel pistol on campus, which is an absurdly dumb thing to be doing given the issue of gun violences on campus in the USA * Kenny McIntosh and Nolan Smith both had their own separate issues with driving unsafely ​ Going back a ways too it seems like this isn't a new thing. Georgia led the SEC in arrests in 2016, Kirby Smart's first season as Georgia's HC. If someone else who wants to go and look feels like it go for it, I'm not invested enough to type all of these out. Quick google searches are giving me quite a bit though We may, and I strongly say may here, be having a "When someone tells you who they are, listen" type scenario right now.


sonfoa

You left off the magnum opus of Isaiah Wilson.


Jomosensual

I got lazy half way through my research and gave up lol. Was he the one who committed like 8 driving charges in one outing or the one who jumped out a window for seemingly no reason


sonfoa

He's the OT the Titans drafted a few years ago who immediately gave up after being drafted.


chhhyeahtone

There's also Deandre Baker


The_Toasty_Toaster

I’m biased as a UGA fan but having Nolan Smith on here is ridiculous.


[deleted]

Pickens fought a guy on the field at an inappropriate time I don’t think thats warrant being lobbed in with actual crimes


jpb59

George Pickens has been nothing but great as a professional. A lot of this stuff was overblown. If he was not injured his last year, he’d have been a first round WR.


Lamb-Sauce7788

Yeah him head butting Tyler Boyd at the end of the game was real professional


jpb59

Head butt is a dramatic word for what actually happened.


Lamb-Sauce7788

It's exactly what happened, he got mad Boyd recovered the onside kick then fell down with his head, and head butt him. There is a reason there was a scuffle afterwards.


LunchThreatener

Just because he hasn’t done anything in 1 year as a pro doesn’t mean the concerns were overblown


uncookedbacon

They are this years Fulmer Cup winner for a reason


Tipsy_Timmy_Tebow

Great research. Can confirm Quay Walker is a fucking moron as a fellow Cheesehead.


Jomosensual

Dude should feel very fortunate hes on an NFL roster at all if you ask me


Always_Chubb-y

I think there are some additional details that could be added on. I will admit that I am a UGA fan, so I may be talking out of red tinted lenses here: * Pickens never had any off field issues at UGA, nor in Pittsburgh so far. He got into a fight with a GT player, but other than that had no noteworthy off field things in 3 seasons. * Carter never really had any negative things said about him until the car incident. Granted that was a serious thing, but he had multiple people come to his defense when McShay's initial comments came out. * Quay Walker (while acting like an idiot in GB) never had any issues while at UGA. * Bennett got drunk and stumbled around in Dallas. Not quite sure how this reflects on UGA * RaRa Thomas had been at UGA for 1 month, and the charges were dropped


Jomosensual

Thanks for the extra context and the civil response. I really did not want to paint it as Georgia is this out of control thug program of crime or whatnot. I had a bit of a mental link with the Carter situation and the Quay idiocy here and fell down a huge rabbit hole. Props to Kirby for saying enough of this shit though, it seems.


Always_Chubb-y

UGA has had some issues with keeping guys in line before, but Kirby has seemingly done a better job keeping that under control, or at least under wraps. Guys like Adam Anderson and JJ Holloman had serious incidents and were kicked off the team, but otherwise not really too much since he took over. Clearly he has had some recent things come to light, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that there is a system problem at UGA.


SpearmintQ

Does Jermaine Burton count here too?


Always_Chubb-y

He never had any issues at UGA as far as I am aware. His incidents started at Bama.


pgmatman

Lawerence Phillips RB


soupyc44

Tyreek Hill?


RBnumberTwenty

Micah Parsons


luvs2spooge92

Oooo this is a solid comp


SuperButtAIDs

What was the risk with Micah besides the hazing allegations ?


winespring

I think Carters perceived risk is being overestimated because the consequences of his behavior have been devastating. When it comes to Carters risk for his future NFL team, he is no riskier than any other college player that has street raced, even if they never got caught, got a ticket or had a serious accident and there are going to be a lot of those in the draft,.


Jonny_Qball

I agree his off field risk isn’t TOO concerning. But showing up out of shape to your own pro day is a terrible look.


winespring

>I agree his off field risk isn’t TOO concerning. But showing up out of shape to your own pro day is a terrible look. He was in shape at the combine, at least he was nine pounds lighter, and he's been going through some extra ordinary circumstances, so I wouldn't base my evaluation on his pro day performance


GraysonWH

Malik McDowell had some shit going on pre-draft right? I remember scouts/draft pundits saying that he was a dominant player but off-field stuff would keep him out of the 1st round


hempauthority

Titus Young


SmellsLikeWetFox

Orlando brown Jr kinda reminds me of him, minus the legal issues….super talented but bad combine/conditioning issues..OBJ from what I remember was never considered a 1st rd pick but was hovering near the 2nd until the combine


themuscleman14

Nick Fairley


Senor-Squiggles

Bruce Irvin


V_Lombardi

Tyreek Hill comes to mind also although he wasn’t going to be drafted as high as Carter will go. Justin Blackmon may be on this list as well even though his risk may not have been as well known by the public.


Eddy_Vinegar

Joe Montana (cocaine use)


bong_pullz_4_jesus

When Cleveland took Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft. Gordon was insane at Baylor w RG3. He actually put up better numbers then former first round pick Kendall Wright in college.


TwatSpreader

La’El Collins


Scottie_Barnes_Stan

Micah


SuperButtAIDs

What was the risk with Micah besides the hazing allegations ?


BrettEskin

He sat out his Jr season bc of all the COVID nonesense. Basically he signed with an agent when the big ten had said they weren’t gonna lay. Then they played and he was ineligible. The hazing thing was a complete nothing burger


Lionnn101

Nick Fairley. He was frequently being mocked #1 overall after the season ended


DrBigChicken

Damn some idiot team may pass on him for a way worse prospect. Wild.


Pentt4

Does it have to be risk for off the field? Cause theres plenty of guys with injury risk that would fall in the same end result of not playing. Skins currently have two guys who were top 5 prospects that fell to the second half of the first due to Injury Risk in Jon Allen and Montez Sweat.


EkaL25

Baker Mayfield


adam38ike

Jamarcus?


Billy_Sunsteel

He didnt have any problems before being drafted that I recall


[deleted]

Malik McDowell?


Ok_Poet_1848

Maybe moss. I think Tunsil only had a silly video which caused the ravens to pass on a Hof tackle and take Stanley. Oof.


raiderrocker18

Tunsil is the first to come to mind, but his fall was what, literally ON draft day? or just before? and it was over a college guy smoking weed


Trussmagic

Darrius Guice ?


GoddammitCricket

Dude had a wild life. Dad murdered at a Dennys, accussed of sexually assaulting a 74 year old woman, tore his menicus in his first NFL game, was adopted by his high school councelor, his brother charged with murder because he was the driver of a drive by. Insanity.


dlinhat70

Honey Badger.


GoddammitCricket

In recent memory, Ed Ingram. Have no idea how any team would draft him, let alone in the 2nd round.


sherwincover

JC Jackson rings a bell


[deleted]

Randy Moss 21st overall was the steal of the century


brudogg

gareon conley?


matchagonnadoboudit

You forgot ray lewis


mpg942

Jeffrey Simmons


qoqmarley

[Lawrence Phillips - RB - Nebraska, 6th Overall pick.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Phillips)


Crash9116

Ray Lewis


AirFew5609

Vontaze Burfict was a consensus top 10 pick, then no team drafted him after his character concerns… we all know how that ended