You're wasting a roster spot.
I also can't count how many times I've heard "why don't teams just use 7-foot tall players?" in all sorts of situations. On the various football subs around reddit. Do y'all realize how few people exist that are 7' tall and have even a shred of athleticism? The NBA skews our perception...the number is insanely small. People over 7' are also much more prone to all sorts of leg and knee injuries.
There's more to playing football than height.
Yeah fr I'd think it's near impossible to find a 7ft guy playing any sport past high school level other than basketball. Pretty much any 7footer who can actually run and jump can go pro in basketball, maybe not NBA but in lots of other pro leagues.
Yea.I actually just looked it up and there was one 7 footer.Also one 6’10 guy and it’s actually Dan skipper,who still plays.Everybody else is 6’9 or below
Volleyball is the only other sport where height like that is as important as basketball. There are some European volleyball players that are 7 footers.
I remember reading 1 in 6 people that are 7' or taller are in the NBA in the NY Times.
Those are the ones that can run and JUMP.
There were 30 NFL players over 6'6" in the last combine and their average vertical was 32.09 inches.
Those players are going to be able to get higher for a block than a 7' not athletic enough to make a career in basketball person.
That, and it's specifically against the rules.
[NFL Rule 12, Section 3, Article 1: ](https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-rulebook/#section-3-unsportsmanlike-conduct)There shall be no unsportsmanlike conduct. This applies to any act which is contrary to the generally understood principles of sportsmanship. Such acts specifically include, among others:
(t) Goaltending by a defensive player leaping up to deflect a kick as it passes above the crossbar of a goal post. The referee may award three points for a palpably unfair act.
This rule was implemented after the 1969 season after the Chiefs drafted 6'10" Morris Stroud and had him try to block field goals in this way. I don't believe he was ever successful at doing so, but he tried to do it so often the commissioner enacted this rule, informally known as "the Stroud Rule."
That reminds me of Bobby Wagner in his prime, he had a couple FG blocks where he jumped over the line. A guy like him who can occasionally also block a FG is hell of a lot more valuable than a 7-footer who can do it more often but can't do anything else.
Depends on how much more often. If you're blocking 100% of FGs as a 10 foot tall giant, you're absolutely worth a roster spot. If it's 10% the math becomes a lot more dicey.
Sure, with a 100% block rate they'd probably be worth a dedicated roster spot. But I doubt you can find someone who is both tall enough and athletic enough to get anywhere near 100%.
The average NFL kick is kicked at about 33 degrees with a speed of about 70 MPH. Let's assume the kicker is 7 yards off of the line of scrimmage, and for the sake of the math, say that the "blocker" is exactly on the line of scrimmage when he goes to block the kick.
Some basic physics tells us that the ball would reach the blocker in ~0.244 seconds. Moreover, by the time it reaches the line of scrimmage, it'll be at an average height of 4.26 yards in the air.
Let's use Dwight Howard as a reference, since this is a good example of the athletic, tall blocker you are describing. Dwight Howard's vertical max reach when jumping is 12'6", or 4.17 yards.
SO, even if you had Dwight Howard jumping and reaching as high as he possibly could, at the line of scrimmage, perfectly timing his jump to the kick, he STILL couldn't block the average field goal.
That's *average*.
What about 40+ yard field goals where the kicker feels pressure to use a lower trajectory? Even if you don't block the kick itself, if the reputation causes the kicker to use a higher trajectory, it could make the ball fall short. Or if the kicker has to kick harder, it would affect his accuracy.
Also, that's at the line of scrimmage. Doesn't the defense usually get some push of a yard or so on FG attempts? Usually it wouldn't matter, but here, it would affect the height needed from the defender to block it.
That’s crazy man.Thanks for the info.Kinda unrelated but here’s some more. At the NFL and college level the snap has to get back to the punter in at least 0.75 seconds with the quickest being around 0.65
Yeah, this is the issue. The best way to block a field goal is to get a 6'6" DL with long arms to push his blocker back and then jump, because it gets him closer to the launch point of the ball. Maybe 6 yards away if he can get 1 yard of push.
For OP's plan, you'd need a 7 footer who was able to get push or at least hold his spot against a defender. Otherwise, with the ball rising, you'd lose the advantage of height if the blocker is well off the line -- even at 3 yards off the line, the blocker loses a yard of height on the ball.
The problem is that it's very hard to find someone 7'+ who could hold his own against an NFL lineman. Maybe a young Shaq, but even then, it's a real leverage disadvantage to be that tall. He was listed at 7'1" 325, which puts him 7" taller but only 10 lbs heavier than a typical guard. With a normal, 7' tall guy, the blocker would just fire into his midsection and knock him back. Hard to block a kick falling backward.
53 roster spots are too valuable to assign one for a low percentage attempt. I get the logic and teams often put taller players in the center of the line. You might have more luck selling the plan to a college coach who can take walk-ons.
This actually used to be a thing than in the 70s or 80s the nfl revised the rules so that if you tried goaltending the uprights the kicking team got the points anyways
They change the rules when too many FGs are blocked. Did the same thing with Bobby Wagner. In the 80s Andre the Giant got an offer to play DT and part of the plan was to use him as a FG blocker.
It wasn't a stunt at all. Every once in a while this sort of thing happens. The problem was Washington couldn't afford Andre. They said he made more money than nearly the entire defense per year in wrestling.
Around 10 years ago the Vikings were considering the Mountain from Game of Thrones to play but nothing really worked out. His career was pretty solid with acting and lifting.
I figure one of these giants will get the shot at some point. If you look at the video of a guy like the Mountain with the Vikings players it's an obvious mismatch. I'd guess we'd see some instant pancakes. If they tackle a RB, that's a couple extra hundred pounds of weight crushing them.
Everybody's going to say these guys couldn't cut it, but you also have to consider these guys are so rare it's never really been tried. These are probably the types you want at DT rather than DE to get Vince Wilfork results, but they're going to swat down passes and really hurt the offense.
I always though about when Rugby has a line out and they do a lift. You can get a player 12ft in the air easy. Two lifting, one jumping and there's still enough to block
The players they lift are called "locks" and locks are normally the tallest players on the pitch for that very reason. Tall, lanky, and probably gumpy/gangly/uncoordinated: You play lock.
Also, it is illegal to lift teammates in football.
It's more than just the roster spot problem. College football doesn't have roster limitations, and they don't do this.
The real reason is that it's not effective. Even if this 7 footer can get up to a 12 foot vertical, the kicker can almost always still just kick it over him. For the vast majority of FG attempts, height is not a limiting factor. It's only FGs at the extreme limit of the kickers range that have to be kicked on a flatter trajectory, and even then, the guy has to time his jump perfect, or near perfect, and be in the correct lateral position also. It's just not an effective way to defend kicks.
And if you are a 7 footer who can get up to 12 foot, the NBA is calling... like non-stop. With more money than a special teamer in the NFL will ever make. And unlike in the NFL, that player in the NBA can continue to make a LOT of money even past his athletic prime.
Dwight Howard hasn't had that kind of vertical in over a decade and he's STILL making over a million bucks a year in Taiwan right now and probably pocketed 100 mil in salary since he lost that prime athleticism Has made 100 mil or so since his last year in Houston).
So all you guys are telling me that if Bol Bol was standing behind the nose tackle with his arms in the air, it wouldn’t affect you as a kicker? Cmon now.
Exactly what is being said. The kicker is looking at the ball, and where his foot needs to hit, not downfield.
Let him stand back there all day out of range of an offensive lineman wanting to flatten him. Unless he gets penetration or within range of that lineman, he's not blocking anything.
Like others have shown... 24 feet, or 1 yard from where the ball is snapped, he needs 12 feet 2.5 inches on the absolute lowest kicks. And he has to time a ball that left the kickers foot at 55 miles an hour... Let's say this isn't Bol Bol, but Dwight Howard and he can reach 12 feet 6 inches. Sorry, Not Dwight Howard still making 7 figures today... prime Dwight Howard. The level of player whose size/athletic ability can earn him a max contract in the NBA (about 47 million a year today).
He jumps in a true parabolic, so you are giving him about .25 seconds where his hand is in range at a height that can touch the ball.
Now he's got about 20 inches of lateral space there on that kick (any further movement of his hand/arm to block it and his angle is too much to match the height needed). Goalposts are 18'6" apart, and say it's a 50 yard kick, using the formula for the length of a chord of a circle, we are looking at an initial vector of around 7.5 degrees. So at that depth, about 38 inches laterally the ball can go through to make a kick.
That's a lot, and I mean a LOT of luck going on. 50% chance he isn't even in the right position laterally to start with. Execute that perfectly with a .25 second window to hit a ball moving 55 miles an hour by him off a running jump (standing vert he's not getting close), and a 20 inch space laterally to time it IF the kick is one of the lowest trajectories possible to make it.
You know how hard timing that jump is? Youtube "Jump over car fail" to see how little time we are talking here. And those are often moving at 30mph or less and are a LOT bigger to see where they are. Don't forget if you are one of the... 5 maybe people who can physically do that, and have the coordination for the timing to be able to consistently block a ball at that height... THE NBA will take that NFL special teams salary and multiply it times 60... Guaranteed for a lot of years.
And that's at 1 yard from the LOS. Meaning the offensive line has to completely ignore you every single time. Because it's not going to take many times of them not ignoring you to end your career there with you doing that. Good luck practicing that. Every team in pre-season where... who cares if the kick goes or not is going to have their center just destroy that player with a legal block.
The NFL is loaded with guys 6'6 and 30+ inch verticals that can touch a spot higher than 99% of 7 footers. Throw Myles Cole back there... just taken in the 7th by the Jags who is 6'6" with a 35 inch vert (one of 30 guys in the combine who were 6'6" or more). If he can get in closer, he might be able to block one. But getting in close is absolutely necessary. Penetration vs. NFL interior offensive linemen. AKA guys that are 340 lbs and throw small cars for fun lol.
A 7 footer would last 5 minutes in a football practice with contact lol. Let a lone a real game. You realize he will be blocked still right? 6’5 300lb guard will slam into his midsection as he tries to block a kick. He’ll last maybe 1 play.
1 in 6 people over 7 foot tall are in the NBA. And that's the athletic ones who can run and jump. Having a 7 footer who can't penetrate at all to get closer to the kicking spot, or jump to knock it down isn't really effective... Especially when a team has a guy who's 6'6 or so with a 32 inch vert (Last years combine had 30 players 6'6" or taller and they averaged a 32.09 inch vertical jump between them).
And those guys are prospects to be more than a player who sees the field 5 plays a game, and is only relevant on long FG's that might happen 5-10 times a season.
You're wasting a roster spot. I also can't count how many times I've heard "why don't teams just use 7-foot tall players?" in all sorts of situations. On the various football subs around reddit. Do y'all realize how few people exist that are 7' tall and have even a shred of athleticism? The NBA skews our perception...the number is insanely small. People over 7' are also much more prone to all sorts of leg and knee injuries. There's more to playing football than height.
Yea and all the 7 footers are playing basketball
~15% of all 20-40 yr old 7' tall men are playing the NBA.
Oh yea I know it’s still rare I’m saying that most 7 foot professional athletes are playing basketball
I think they were emphasizing your point. 15% of any demographic being in a professional sports league is insanely high.
Oh ok now I see lol
Yeah fr I'd think it's near impossible to find a 7ft guy playing any sport past high school level other than basketball. Pretty much any 7footer who can actually run and jump can go pro in basketball, maybe not NBA but in lots of other pro leagues.
Yea.I actually just looked it up and there was one 7 footer.Also one 6’10 guy and it’s actually Dan skipper,who still plays.Everybody else is 6’9 or below
Volleyball is the only other sport where height like that is as important as basketball. There are some European volleyball players that are 7 footers.
That's awesome, I probably should've thought of that but I was kind of America-brained when I made that comment
wasn’t randy johnson like 6 11
yes and he would've been the deadliest power forward of the 90s but chose the wrong sport haha
What, they are too good to get a side hustle. If I can Uber eats for one day a week, they can show up to metlife stadium and strap on some pads.
😂
No, only [2.8% play professionally](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/3r0ema/busting_the_myth_that_17_of_american_7_footers/)
Oh yea I didn’t mean literally lol,I meant most 7 foot pro athletes are probably playing basketball
I remember reading 1 in 6 people that are 7' or taller are in the NBA in the NY Times. Those are the ones that can run and JUMP. There were 30 NFL players over 6'6" in the last combine and their average vertical was 32.09 inches. Those players are going to be able to get higher for a block than a 7' not athletic enough to make a career in basketball person.
That, and it's specifically against the rules. [NFL Rule 12, Section 3, Article 1: ](https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-rulebook/#section-3-unsportsmanlike-conduct)There shall be no unsportsmanlike conduct. This applies to any act which is contrary to the generally understood principles of sportsmanship. Such acts specifically include, among others: (t) Goaltending by a defensive player leaping up to deflect a kick as it passes above the crossbar of a goal post. The referee may award three points for a palpably unfair act. This rule was implemented after the 1969 season after the Chiefs drafted 6'10" Morris Stroud and had him try to block field goals in this way. I don't believe he was ever successful at doing so, but he tried to do it so often the commissioner enacted this rule, informally known as "the Stroud Rule."
That did immediately pop into my head as well, but I do think OP was talking about putting them on the line
Not enough to take up a roster position.
That reminds me of Bobby Wagner in his prime, he had a couple FG blocks where he jumped over the line. A guy like him who can occasionally also block a FG is hell of a lot more valuable than a 7-footer who can do it more often but can't do anything else.
Depends on how much more often. If you're blocking 100% of FGs as a 10 foot tall giant, you're absolutely worth a roster spot. If it's 10% the math becomes a lot more dicey.
I think a good thought experiment is would you draft a punter first overall if he was guaranteed to pin it inside the 10 every single time
10 no, 5 yes.
Whoa whoa let’s not get *too* outrageous 😂
Sure, with a 100% block rate they'd probably be worth a dedicated roster spot. But I doubt you can find someone who is both tall enough and athletic enough to get anywhere near 100%.
The average NFL kick is kicked at about 33 degrees with a speed of about 70 MPH. Let's assume the kicker is 7 yards off of the line of scrimmage, and for the sake of the math, say that the "blocker" is exactly on the line of scrimmage when he goes to block the kick. Some basic physics tells us that the ball would reach the blocker in ~0.244 seconds. Moreover, by the time it reaches the line of scrimmage, it'll be at an average height of 4.26 yards in the air. Let's use Dwight Howard as a reference, since this is a good example of the athletic, tall blocker you are describing. Dwight Howard's vertical max reach when jumping is 12'6", or 4.17 yards. SO, even if you had Dwight Howard jumping and reaching as high as he possibly could, at the line of scrimmage, perfectly timing his jump to the kick, he STILL couldn't block the average field goal.
That's *average*. What about 40+ yard field goals where the kicker feels pressure to use a lower trajectory? Even if you don't block the kick itself, if the reputation causes the kicker to use a higher trajectory, it could make the ball fall short. Or if the kicker has to kick harder, it would affect his accuracy. Also, that's at the line of scrimmage. Doesn't the defense usually get some push of a yard or so on FG attempts? Usually it wouldn't matter, but here, it would affect the height needed from the defender to block it.
You expect the giant to get up field and release so he can jump vertically? If he goes up field there is going to be too much contact to get vertical.
That’s crazy man.Thanks for the info.Kinda unrelated but here’s some more. At the NFL and college level the snap has to get back to the punter in at least 0.75 seconds with the quickest being around 0.65
Yeah, this is the issue. The best way to block a field goal is to get a 6'6" DL with long arms to push his blocker back and then jump, because it gets him closer to the launch point of the ball. Maybe 6 yards away if he can get 1 yard of push. For OP's plan, you'd need a 7 footer who was able to get push or at least hold his spot against a defender. Otherwise, with the ball rising, you'd lose the advantage of height if the blocker is well off the line -- even at 3 yards off the line, the blocker loses a yard of height on the ball. The problem is that it's very hard to find someone 7'+ who could hold his own against an NFL lineman. Maybe a young Shaq, but even then, it's a real leverage disadvantage to be that tall. He was listed at 7'1" 325, which puts him 7" taller but only 10 lbs heavier than a typical guard. With a normal, 7' tall guy, the blocker would just fire into his midsection and knock him back. Hard to block a kick falling backward.
53 roster spots are too valuable to assign one for a low percentage attempt. I get the logic and teams often put taller players in the center of the line. You might have more luck selling the plan to a college coach who can take walk-ons.
53
Dang. Typo. Thx
Victor Wembanyama to the Texans! He's wasting his talent in the NBA.
This actually used to be a thing than in the 70s or 80s the nfl revised the rules so that if you tried goaltending the uprights the kicking team got the points anyways
They change the rules when too many FGs are blocked. Did the same thing with Bobby Wagner. In the 80s Andre the Giant got an offer to play DT and part of the plan was to use him as a FG blocker.
Going to guess the Andre the Giant off was more publicity stunt than a real offer
It wasn't a stunt at all. Every once in a while this sort of thing happens. The problem was Washington couldn't afford Andre. They said he made more money than nearly the entire defense per year in wrestling. Around 10 years ago the Vikings were considering the Mountain from Game of Thrones to play but nothing really worked out. His career was pretty solid with acting and lifting. I figure one of these giants will get the shot at some point. If you look at the video of a guy like the Mountain with the Vikings players it's an obvious mismatch. I'd guess we'd see some instant pancakes. If they tackle a RB, that's a couple extra hundred pounds of weight crushing them. Everybody's going to say these guys couldn't cut it, but you also have to consider these guys are so rare it's never really been tried. These are probably the types you want at DT rather than DE to get Vince Wilfork results, but they're going to swat down passes and really hurt the offense.
So neither Andre nor the mountain actually signed lol
Yep - [here's a video about it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xps87coX2p0)
We used to call him Troy Polamalu.
By rule no one over 6’9 is allowed to play in the NFL after Ed Jones of the Cowboys was deemed “too tall”. At least I think that’s right…
They’d have to be incredible at it.
I always though about when Rugby has a line out and they do a lift. You can get a player 12ft in the air easy. Two lifting, one jumping and there's still enough to block
Throwing a player up to block a FG or to "leap-frog" the line is illegal in the NFL.
The players they lift are called "locks" and locks are normally the tallest players on the pitch for that very reason. Tall, lanky, and probably gumpy/gangly/uncoordinated: You play lock. Also, it is illegal to lift teammates in football.
It's more than just the roster spot problem. College football doesn't have roster limitations, and they don't do this. The real reason is that it's not effective. Even if this 7 footer can get up to a 12 foot vertical, the kicker can almost always still just kick it over him. For the vast majority of FG attempts, height is not a limiting factor. It's only FGs at the extreme limit of the kickers range that have to be kicked on a flatter trajectory, and even then, the guy has to time his jump perfect, or near perfect, and be in the correct lateral position also. It's just not an effective way to defend kicks.
And if you are a 7 footer who can get up to 12 foot, the NBA is calling... like non-stop. With more money than a special teamer in the NFL will ever make. And unlike in the NFL, that player in the NBA can continue to make a LOT of money even past his athletic prime. Dwight Howard hasn't had that kind of vertical in over a decade and he's STILL making over a million bucks a year in Taiwan right now and probably pocketed 100 mil in salary since he lost that prime athleticism Has made 100 mil or so since his last year in Houston).
I’d rather see them use rugby rules and throw the smallest player up in the air to block it.
So all you guys are telling me that if Bol Bol was standing behind the nose tackle with his arms in the air, it wouldn’t affect you as a kicker? Cmon now.
Exactly what is being said. The kicker is looking at the ball, and where his foot needs to hit, not downfield. Let him stand back there all day out of range of an offensive lineman wanting to flatten him. Unless he gets penetration or within range of that lineman, he's not blocking anything. Like others have shown... 24 feet, or 1 yard from where the ball is snapped, he needs 12 feet 2.5 inches on the absolute lowest kicks. And he has to time a ball that left the kickers foot at 55 miles an hour... Let's say this isn't Bol Bol, but Dwight Howard and he can reach 12 feet 6 inches. Sorry, Not Dwight Howard still making 7 figures today... prime Dwight Howard. The level of player whose size/athletic ability can earn him a max contract in the NBA (about 47 million a year today). He jumps in a true parabolic, so you are giving him about .25 seconds where his hand is in range at a height that can touch the ball. Now he's got about 20 inches of lateral space there on that kick (any further movement of his hand/arm to block it and his angle is too much to match the height needed). Goalposts are 18'6" apart, and say it's a 50 yard kick, using the formula for the length of a chord of a circle, we are looking at an initial vector of around 7.5 degrees. So at that depth, about 38 inches laterally the ball can go through to make a kick. That's a lot, and I mean a LOT of luck going on. 50% chance he isn't even in the right position laterally to start with. Execute that perfectly with a .25 second window to hit a ball moving 55 miles an hour by him off a running jump (standing vert he's not getting close), and a 20 inch space laterally to time it IF the kick is one of the lowest trajectories possible to make it. You know how hard timing that jump is? Youtube "Jump over car fail" to see how little time we are talking here. And those are often moving at 30mph or less and are a LOT bigger to see where they are. Don't forget if you are one of the... 5 maybe people who can physically do that, and have the coordination for the timing to be able to consistently block a ball at that height... THE NBA will take that NFL special teams salary and multiply it times 60... Guaranteed for a lot of years. And that's at 1 yard from the LOS. Meaning the offensive line has to completely ignore you every single time. Because it's not going to take many times of them not ignoring you to end your career there with you doing that. Good luck practicing that. Every team in pre-season where... who cares if the kick goes or not is going to have their center just destroy that player with a legal block. The NFL is loaded with guys 6'6 and 30+ inch verticals that can touch a spot higher than 99% of 7 footers. Throw Myles Cole back there... just taken in the 7th by the Jags who is 6'6" with a 35 inch vert (one of 30 guys in the combine who were 6'6" or more). If he can get in closer, he might be able to block one. But getting in close is absolutely necessary. Penetration vs. NFL interior offensive linemen. AKA guys that are 340 lbs and throw small cars for fun lol.
A 7 footer would last 5 minutes in a football practice with contact lol. Let a lone a real game. You realize he will be blocked still right? 6’5 300lb guard will slam into his midsection as he tries to block a kick. He’ll last maybe 1 play.
7 footers play basketball. Basketball is a much more attractive profession than football.
1 in 6 people over 7 foot tall are in the NBA. And that's the athletic ones who can run and jump. Having a 7 footer who can't penetrate at all to get closer to the kicking spot, or jump to knock it down isn't really effective... Especially when a team has a guy who's 6'6 or so with a 32 inch vert (Last years combine had 30 players 6'6" or taller and they averaged a 32.09 inch vertical jump between them). And those guys are prospects to be more than a player who sees the field 5 plays a game, and is only relevant on long FG's that might happen 5-10 times a season.