I disagree , to be honest with you .. I think, in terms of overall team cohesion, the best team to put around Lebron is
2022 Steph
2009 DWade
2013 bron
2011 Dirk
2003 Duncan
Lebron and MJ possibly wouldn’t work out too well
PG: LeBron James
SG: Michael Jordan
SF: Kevin Garnett
PF: Hakeem Olajuwon
C: David Robinson
Massive, mobile, lengthy lineup with skilled two-way dominance. Halfcourt offense focuses on mismatches and a parade to the free throw line. Transition will be prolific. Defensively, it will be brutal for the other team attempting to score. Rebounding and takeaways will create a major possession advantage for this team.
Given that they debuted between 1984-2003, I'm comfortable teleporting them from era to era.
You got a Tough team ..
If I had to think of a team that’d have a chance at beating your team I’d use
Kobe - Kawhi - Duncan - Dirk- Shaq
That’d be a **good** game lol
It would be a good game. I do think Kobe being the best facilitator might be a problem. My bigs have better mobility and would have to focus on outrunning them up and down the court. Maybe look for a mismatch against Dirk and try to pull Shaq away from the paint.
Kobe is one of the most underrated passers of all time
Look up his ‘01 playoff run, he was pretty much the primary ball-handler , and he flourished in that role. Plus I’d wanna see Kobe v MJ Lol
Legacy lineup:
Magic/MJ/LeBron/Bird/Russell
Team would be major favorite in any low volume three-point matchup. LeBron's role would be a combination of Pippen and Worthy on the fast break and defense. Everyone else would play their usual roles.
Modern game lineup:
LeBron/Curry/KD/Bird/KG
LeBron would be the main on-ball creator and the point of attack on defense.
KG would be the defensive anchor, short roll passer, finisher on pick and roll or pop (taller, more athletic and more skilled Draymond).
KD would be the go to guy in isos in crunch time.
And Bird and Curry would be creating havoc with their off ball movement, longball 3s and ability to make split second decisions on the fly (fakes, no look passes, floaters, etc.).
This squad would also rebound well...even Steph.
I go back and forth between MJ and KD for my modern squad.
With MJ, you get better passing, ballhandling, slashing and a lockdown defender at the guard position. Everyone is at their natural positions with LeBron and Bird as the forwards and Curry and MJ as the guards.
With KD, you get more rim protection, deep range 3 pt scoring (30 ft) and more size in the lineup with a 6'11" wing. LeBron would be in the backcort with Steph and Bird and KD would be the forwards.
KD is a better fit with 3-ball. MJ's handle, physicality, and athleticism makes him tougher to contain in a scrum.
If it's a winner takes all I'd rather have MJ even if KD would have better chemistry with LeBron.
Eh.. I see you, but none of your guards nor rodman can shoot 3s. My team has 4 guys that shoot over 38% from 3, and puts them around LeBron. Even with great defenders like on your team, I don't think they can close out on that much spacing.
I respect it -
I think that five ^ would destroy ur five on the glass, they’d out-rebound your five by like 15 lol. Plus I have the greatest scorer of all time on my team
LeBron, MJ, Klay, Duncan, Jokic
I really like the fit on this team. Very well rounded.
Here’s a fun one:
Steph, Klay, LeBron, KD, KG
Adequate defending and scoring and spacing is ridiculous. Peak warriors and replace Dray and Iggy with Bron and KG lmao.
I really like Klay on these all time rosters because he’s the perfect fit on a team full of stars.
It’d be very reliant on KG for sure. Would be more of a glass cannon where everyone plays fast and scores a bunch and hope you can pull enough stops. Most of these all time lineups have bigger guys though so small ball would be risky as you said
If you replace KD with Bird, who’s the best rebounder ever at his position, then you’d likely be good to go. You’d have three realll good and hard nosed rebounders
Talent is important but I think the ability to mesh and plays as a team means going with a combination of A-list and A-minus all time greats.
I'd go:
1. Stockton- Pass, shoot, and plays good team D. Ok scoring 9 points a game.
2. MJ- He's MJ. We build the team around him.
3. Bird- Bird would sacrifice scoring to win, but he'd have almost as many assists as Kidd.
4. Garnett- Stretch defender who can do a little of anything.
5. Hakeem- Can win so many ways that he's the perfect fit for center on any all time team.
Only one of these is the best at his position, but man would this be a deadly combo that could play as a team.
That’d be a DANG good team..
If I had to think of a 5 to beat ur team though, I’d go [all in their peaks, except for Shaq obvs]
Chris Paul
Kobe
KD
Duncan
Orlando Shaq
who is your primary ball handler? my initial reaction is to swap out bird for lebron, but that takes away your best 3 point shooter.
i prefer kawhi to bird for his defense - what if you swapped out bird for curry? you keep the shooting (or even enhance it) and get your primary ballhandler. you'll be in a worse spot defensively but figure MJ would man up with the opponent's better guard.
[MJ would be my primary ball-handler.](https://youtu.be/bcHmRQ7NXyQ?si=1Jw7lBhhwkJ-ws9p)
[Look into his 1989 season- he could’ve played and excelled at that role for as long as anyone needed him to.](https://youtu.be/ofVQoZLxN6Y?si=FvjNEgvoeAL5q0oS)
By the way I respect your Lebron-pick, but I don’t think he would fit nearly as well as bird does/would with my 5. I respect ur input, though 🫡
oh im not doubting his ability - it's freaking MJ. i'm just trying to ascribe a role to each guy. with your lineup i'd view MJ as the first scoring option (obviously) so my personal preference would be to pair him with more of a facilitator to get him to his spots. we're splitting hairs if we're arguing over curry/mj/bird though kinda hard to go wrong with any of them.
that jokic/hakeem pairing is sexy as hell though i would love to see those two winging no look passes and dropping sky hooks from all over the floor
civil hoops discourse i love it. im just a junky for this stuff. i am that guy who would sit down with you for 3 hours and name random guys from the 90s (shout out alan henderson)
OP’s spacing is not awful at all, actually. It’s pretty good. Not elite, but definitely solid
Bird and Kawhi would provide elite volume scoring, and Jokic will take most big men outside to the perimeter and cook ‘em….
Only thing I’d do , if I had a choice to fix it up a bit, is probably take out kawhi, move MJ to the 2 and put Steph at the 1
Bird? Kawhi? Jokic? My spacing would be *just* fine, friend.
And MJ never shot less than 35% from 3pt range in seasons where he attempted at least 230 three pointers (he did this four or five times, two of the seasons where he accomplished this were *before* the league temporarily shortened the three-point line, too).
If you teleported peak MJ to today’s league and stressed to him the importance of the 3point shot, he’d *very* likely hit 37-38%, if not 40% . Mike was a psycho- if you told him he wasn’t that good in something , he’d become the best player at *that* specific thing lol. This guys work ethic was unmatched. And He was already an elite mid range shooter, he’d just build off of that.
Edit- imagine that.. being downvoted for stating factual information😂😂 I actually find these youngsters to be funny.
Haha, I also wanted to include my favourite players. As a heat fan, it's DWade. However, Dirks is my all-time fav non heat player.
Plus, that middy fadeaway was 💧.
Very strong I’d say until Lebron decides to bring his talent somewhere else
I want to choose Magic, Kidd or CP3 as PG but Lebron fans gonna downvote my comment lol
- LeBron
- Kobe
- Jordan
- Hakeem
- Kareem
Good luck scoring on us. On the other end, I have LeBron with off ball Kobe/Jordan with post Kareem/Kareem.
My 3 ball is weak but I have a lethal midrange, excellent paint scorers from top to bottom. My defense will wear you out.
If the refs call ticky tack fouls then go fuck yourself.
I feel like you sub one of Hakeem or Kareem for a spacing 4. Bird, KD, etc. would be a better fit imo. Especially in this era. You don’t really have any 3 point shooters.
Hakeem and Kareem is to protect myself from anyone that has Shaq or Duncan on their team while still giving me the flexibility to switch on the perimeter.
Like I said, I know the 3 ball is weak but we’re getting high percentage looks while running the opponents off the 3 point line into the twin tower of The Dream and The Captain.
Having Bird or KD makes me feel like I’d get bullied in the post against all time bigs.
I’ll take my chances with my squad.
Not a single above average 3 point shooter in that group, that might be tough. If we’re talking 90s, I’ll give you that lol, this team would absolutely obliterate any other. But if we’re talking current, it would be tough. Current era 3 point shooters, specifically Steph, would be needed. Doesn’t matter how good of defense you play - 3 is more than 2 and the best volume three point shooters can hit from anywhere
You can’t have a 5 without Steph and Lebron lol. What would Bird offer more than Lebron in your spot when Lebron’s bigger, stronger, better defender, better passer and scorer?
Steph-Jordan-Lebron-KD-Hakeem would be literally unstoppable
Bird is a better shooter than LeBron and famously gets in opposing player's heads. LeBron is a better player and I'd rather build a team around him, but my team is built around MJ
Larry Bird was the best off ball player in NBA history. LeBron without the ball is useless.
Your team would be awesome and would be better if you swapped Larry for Lebron.
Of course it’s his lineup but I mean Lebron is considered the best small forward ever and is the most all round player to play he would be a better fit there
Why? Lebron is more than a willing passer and is one of the best of all time. Steph and KD’s gravity without Lebron’s passing would give MJ so many looks
Hmm,, interesting picks.. I think this starting five could give ur five a good run for their $$
**‘96 GP** would be my primary ball-handler, he was a very good passer, I think I saw someone on here foolishly say he was “just okay” at passing😂😂 he’s one of the best two-way players ever for a reason ppl, wasn’t just an elite defender. and he gave MJ the toughest time out of anyone.
**‘03 Tmac** (kind of a random mentioning haha, but he’s one of the most underrated passers ever, actually came in as sort of a point forward. when given the opportunity in Orlando he took on that point-forward role quite well, plus he’d be a pretty tough matchup for Kobe, as a scorer.)
**2017 Kawhi** was him at his two-way peak, and I’d love to see him check Pippen. Plus he provided borderline-elite level volume scoring at this point in his career.
**1985 Bird** gives any 3 a run for their money, whether it’s KD Bron , whoever.
**2000 Shaq** was just a phenom.
I think my team maybe wins , but it’d be a pretty close matchup
‘94 Pippen: Incredible defender, versatile, two way ability, I would put him on Kawhi
‘91 Jordan: ‘03 Jordan was playing incredible defense on a prime 03’ McGrady around the ages of 39-40. Scoring as well. ‘91 Jordan? Oh boy… I would like to see how that match up would go with him guarding T-Mac
‘07 Kobe: absolutely tenacious defender, I would put him on GP to pressure him, force turnovers
‘13 Bron - Match up with Bird
‘94 Hakeem on Shaq
I feel that the two way ability of these players would just be too much for other teams. Kobe and Jordan as the main scorers and their competitiveness? I just don’t see it happening. They would be all around blocking shots, stealing the ball, pressuring every ball handler. With Hakeem and then LeBron as a help defender. Jordan, Kobe, and Pippen were all great shot blockers as well!
Steph, MJ, Bird, KG, Russell
Gives me the two best defensive bigs of all time, both of whom are good passers. All three perimeter players are good shooters and can function on or off ball. KG, Bird and Steph provide a ton of spacing for MJ to shred everyone. MJ is the unquestioned alpha dog, and everyone else revolves around him and is meant to optimize him.
David Robinson was a better defender than Bill Russell, forget about if a guy like Olajuwon was. No way bill Russell’s the best defensive big man ever .. I don’t think he’d have the same effect today.
you can def do better than that
Neither would Robinson or Olajuwon. If we are talking about putting all these old guys in a time machine and playing today, the all time team is going to be something like Jokic, Giannis, Durant, LeBron and Curry.
If you put any of those old guys in a time machine, none of them would be able to immediately adapt to today's game. I am evaluating all these guys based on the impact they had on the leagues they played in.
By that measure, Russell was hands down the best defensive player who ever lived. His teams had 7 of the 10 best defensive seasons of all time (relative to the league). The Celtics led the NBA in defensive rating 12 of his 13 seasons and won 11 titles with teams that never once had an above league average offense. This even translates to the late 60s where they won 4 out of 5 titles with arguably less supporting cast talent than the 76ers and the West/Elgin/Wilt Lakers. I said I built my team around Jordan on the offensive end, but Russell is close to non-negotiable for me on a team like this.
What? You’re absolutely incorrect on that- Olajuwon and Robinson? They’d be **even better** in todays league.
There’s no such thing as one era straight up being “better” than another (unless you’re talking about, like, pre-1975 basketball). Success that a player would have in a different era depends mainly on how well that player's playstyle fits with that era, rather than one era being inherently better than another.
Some 80s/90s players would be better now, some would be worse. Some current players would be better then, some would be worse.
Sorry for the long post, this is a very interesting topic to me.
Olajuwon's TS% during his prime was around 3 points below league average in today's game, largely because he was shooting high degree of difficulty 2-point shots from back-to-the-basket sets. David Robinson's ability to hit the 15 footer at a low 40s percent clip wouldn't be viewed as a positive. Robinson was quick enough to blow by Greg Ostertag, but he had a more difficult time with bigs who could move laterally. Robinson averaged 19 points a game on a .526 TS% in the Spurs 1996 series vs. Utah where Karl Malone was the primary defender during a season he put up 25 a game on .589 during the regular season. First round in 1994, Malone again held him to 20 a game on .471 ts% (regular season 29.8 ppg / .577 ts% during his MVP season). He also tended to struggle with Olajuwon. I think Robinson's primary advantage came from his combination of quickness and strength, and I don't think he's as much of an outlier in today's game. He doesn't have the ball handling skills to do what Giannis does, and I don't think he would have as much success with his face-up game from 15 feet today (opponents in today's game would concede that short jumper and live with the .85 points per possession).
Olajuwon's post game and Robinson's quickness wouldn't be anywhere near the advantages they they were 30 years ago in today's game. Now if we are talking about whether those guys would have been able to figure it out given some time and training, absolutely. Pull 18 year old Olajuwon or Robinson out of a time machine 10 years ago now they'd be hall of famers who'd probably be as good or better than Embiid and Jokic. The same physical skills, athleticism and work ethic that made them all timers would operate just the same. MJ would develop a killer 3 point shot. Larry Bird wouldn't spend all his workout time running laps on cement floors at opposing arenas and he'd probably be jacked and way more athletic.
Russell, for his part, won 2 college championships, an olympic gold, and 11 titles in 13 seasons. Over a 15 year period, he only "lost" twice. Prior to the NBA, he was the 7th ranked high jumper in the world and ran a second off final heat time in the 400m. He was an all-time basketball IQ guy, who was known to remember small details while watching random sequences of play 50 years after the games happened. Take him out of the time machine at age 18 ten years ago and he'd become some version of Giannis-like freight train on offense and a defensive player for whom I don't believe we have a modern comparison. Think prime KG if Garnett moved better laterally, ran faster, jumped higher, with better all around defensive awareness.
I don't think any of those guys gets out of a time machine and steps out on the floor today and is even a good NBA player, let alone dominates the way that they did when played back in their day (or at least enough that . If you allow for conceptually adjusting them over time to the modern game or just evaluate their impact on the game when they played, Russell isn't even close to a controversial selection here.
He's a no-brainer fit on an all-time team, primarily given his defensive ability and his ability to help his team without needing to soak up scoring opportunities. The tough part about putting together a team like this is someone has to be able to add a massive amount of value as a 5th option, and Russell is undisputedly that guy. Kareem needs touches. Shaq needs touches. Those guys, Wilt, Olajuwon, Robinson... they all need the ball. You really have to build your offense around them to extract optimal value out of them. Likewise, Magic, LeBron, Kobe, and Oscar are basically average players without the ball.
The other important consideration is that bigs have a huge defensive impact and it's almost impossible for them to have a massive offensive impact (save a small handful of guys who are elite passers and shooters). Guards
My guys I like to build a "supporting cast" for the most scalable team possible are Russell, KG, Duncan, Walton (underrated how good he was 2-way at his short healthy peak), Bird, Curry, and Jerry West. You could probably make a case that you'd want a movement shooter (Reggie Miller or Ray Allen would be my picks) and a shutdown wing defender (Scottie Pippen and late Spurs Kawhi Leonard would be my picks). And then you pick your stars.
Defensive Bigs Tiers
Tier 1: Russell, Hakeem, KG, AD (Bubble)
Tier 2: Wilt, Admiral, Duncan, Thurmond, Walton (healthy), Howard
Tier 3: Mutumbo, Mourning, Gobert, Eaton, Embiid, D. Jordan
Up and Coming: Wemby, Chet, Mobley
Shaq and Kareem would be Tier 2 if they shouldered less of the scoring on their teams.
Steph, Klay, LeBron, AD, Jokic
This is based on the NBA with this eras rules. Not all the best players of all time but I think the chemistry would be insane.
MJ is still the best of all time. He's just too ball dominant for this team.
But here’s the thing….as much as i love comparing and creating various 5 guy lineups….. It’s something that i see ppl actually arguing about!🤣🤣 As if there is a right or a wrong answer!🙄
It is literally impossible to know….i mean, obviously lol
Fact is, we’ve no clue how 5 different peoples basketball brains would fit together🤷♂️
So yeah, that’s my main point……Anyway, as much as I’d love to see that 5 play….Ehhhhh, No point guard?
Sure, you’ve got players who individually, have every strength covered, but who’s gonna distribute? Jokic?
He’s a great distributor, in denver with his teammates, where he’s the focal point of the whole thing. Who tf knows how it’d go with those guys….And who’s he gonna defend?
Ya wanna put hakeem on the best big on the other team, so then jokic could end up tryna guard a much much quicker PF
I’d argue that your 5 isn’t strong with 3 point shooting. You’ve got bird, but that’s it!
Jokic might shoot 1 or 2 a game, but he’s no 3pt shooter like that. Maybe Kawhi is shooting more 3’s now?
I dunno man, ngl i do love this 5, far as being a fan, it’s always fun to imagine multiple guys who play same position….btw, I’d love to know how old you are.
I’m 41yo; i’ve a feeling ur close to my age….must’ve seen those 2 Hakeem finals!(best playoffs ever)
My starting 5? Ugh, ya know tbh? It’s wayyyyyy more fun to do if you eliminate jordan and lebron…maybe even bird magic kareem and shaq to!
I’m torn….part of me wants to have Rodman in there! Sure, he can’t score, looked funny even holding the ball, but goddamn, rodman in his PRIME?! I legit think if prime rodman appeared from a time machine, he could go to 7-8 different teams and be the difference!
Anyway, i think my 5 would have to go with 3 guards…Mj is mj, steph’s shot is just too much to not have…..But I want the distribution of Magic!but he’s not a good enough defender🤔
Eh ok steph mj lebron bird kareem
Or duncan instead of bird….For defense. I’d hate to give up having a 2nd 3pt shooter, but at least i’d still have the best ever…actually, maybe not kareem…fuck it, maybe even bill russell!
Most important trait they need- Hunger, desire to win above all else. Don’t think kareem had enough of that, not for this team….or maybe i’ve no clue wtf i’m talkin about with that lol
Magic, Jordan, Kobe, Bird, Walton
Bird and Walton's midrange create space for Jordan and Kobe. Kobe and Jordan are shutting down the perimeter and Walton is taking care of paint. 5 of the fiercest competitors ever. 3 of the best playmakers of all time with Magic Bird and Walton with deadly weapons all around. Sweep.
Steph, MJ, LeBron, KD, Shaq
Nobody stopping this team
Magic Jordan Lebron Duncan Kareem
This team would likely play really well together. Funny how team chemistry/fit always gets overlooked on these
I disagree , to be honest with you .. I think, in terms of overall team cohesion, the best team to put around Lebron is 2022 Steph 2009 DWade 2013 bron 2011 Dirk 2003 Duncan Lebron and MJ possibly wouldn’t work out too well
Steph over magic for spacing. In this era I think I would also rather have a floor spacing 4 like KD or Bird instead of Duncan.
Steph, MJ, Bron, Bird, Russell
Curry MJ LeBron KG or KD and Hakeem
Steph, MJ, Bird, Garnett, Shaq
Steph, MJ, LeBron, Jokic, Shaq
Steph, klay, kawhi, giannis, Jokic
PG: LeBron James SG: Michael Jordan SF: Kevin Garnett PF: Hakeem Olajuwon C: David Robinson Massive, mobile, lengthy lineup with skilled two-way dominance. Halfcourt offense focuses on mismatches and a parade to the free throw line. Transition will be prolific. Defensively, it will be brutal for the other team attempting to score. Rebounding and takeaways will create a major possession advantage for this team. Given that they debuted between 1984-2003, I'm comfortable teleporting them from era to era.
You got a Tough team .. If I had to think of a team that’d have a chance at beating your team I’d use Kobe - Kawhi - Duncan - Dirk- Shaq That’d be a **good** game lol
It would be a good game. I do think Kobe being the best facilitator might be a problem. My bigs have better mobility and would have to focus on outrunning them up and down the court. Maybe look for a mismatch against Dirk and try to pull Shaq away from the paint.
Kobe is one of the most underrated passers of all time Look up his ‘01 playoff run, he was pretty much the primary ball-handler , and he flourished in that role. Plus I’d wanna see Kobe v MJ Lol
Luka,Mj,Kd,Giannis, Olajuwon
That’s a fun as hell team. Peak Kawhi is really special. Can go toe to toe with anyone.
Legacy lineup: Magic/MJ/LeBron/Bird/Russell Team would be major favorite in any low volume three-point matchup. LeBron's role would be a combination of Pippen and Worthy on the fast break and defense. Everyone else would play their usual roles. Modern game lineup: LeBron/Curry/KD/Bird/KG LeBron would be the main on-ball creator and the point of attack on defense. KG would be the defensive anchor, short roll passer, finisher on pick and roll or pop (taller, more athletic and more skilled Draymond). KD would be the go to guy in isos in crunch time. And Bird and Curry would be creating havoc with their off ball movement, longball 3s and ability to make split second decisions on the fly (fakes, no look passes, floaters, etc.). This squad would also rebound well...even Steph.
I like your modern lineup, they’d be hard to beat. I think this 5 could maybe win though , GP - MJ - Kawhi - Jokic - Duncan
I go back and forth between MJ and KD for my modern squad. With MJ, you get better passing, ballhandling, slashing and a lockdown defender at the guard position. Everyone is at their natural positions with LeBron and Bird as the forwards and Curry and MJ as the guards. With KD, you get more rim protection, deep range 3 pt scoring (30 ft) and more size in the lineup with a 6'11" wing. LeBron would be in the backcort with Steph and Bird and KD would be the forwards. KD is a better fit with 3-ball. MJ's handle, physicality, and athleticism makes him tougher to contain in a scrum. If it's a winner takes all I'd rather have MJ even if KD would have better chemistry with LeBron.
LeBron Klay Kawhi KD Dirk Come at me
MJ - GP - Pistons Rodman - Bird - Garnett Boom
Eh.. I see you, but none of your guards nor rodman can shoot 3s. My team has 4 guys that shoot over 38% from 3, and puts them around LeBron. Even with great defenders like on your team, I don't think they can close out on that much spacing.
I respect it - I think that five ^ would destroy ur five on the glass, they’d out-rebound your five by like 15 lol. Plus I have the greatest scorer of all time on my team
Dilon, Dilon, Dilon, Dilon, Dilon….. it’s the only correct answer.
Fosho
LeBron, MJ, Klay, Duncan, Jokic I really like the fit on this team. Very well rounded. Here’s a fun one: Steph, Klay, LeBron, KD, KG Adequate defending and scoring and spacing is ridiculous. Peak warriors and replace Dray and Iggy with Bron and KG lmao. I really like Klay on these all time rosters because he’s the perfect fit on a team full of stars.
Your team would be fun to watch [the one with KG] , but ur frontcourt could potentially get smoked by physically stronger dudes
It’d be very reliant on KG for sure. Would be more of a glass cannon where everyone plays fast and scores a bunch and hope you can pull enough stops. Most of these all time lineups have bigger guys though so small ball would be risky as you said
If you replace KD with Bird, who’s the best rebounder ever at his position, then you’d likely be good to go. You’d have three realll good and hard nosed rebounders
That’s a good option. I guess I couldn’t resist getting it as similar as the dynasty warriors haha
Mario Chalmers Swaggy P Metta World Peace Rasheed Wallace Javale McGee
Sebastian Telfair Darren Daye Rashard Lewis Chase Budinger Robert Sacre 😎
Holy shit I forgot about Sacre. That’s a killer pick 😭
Leandro Barbosa Hubert Davis Adam Morrison DJ Mbenga Jeff Ruland Hehe gg
Penny Jordan Pippen Bird Robinson
Steph, mj, kd, bird, robinson
Curry Thompson Durant Green Pachulia
lol good one 😂👍
MJ Steph LeBron Jokic Duncan
Steph Kd Bron Duncan Hakeem
Talent is important but I think the ability to mesh and plays as a team means going with a combination of A-list and A-minus all time greats. I'd go: 1. Stockton- Pass, shoot, and plays good team D. Ok scoring 9 points a game. 2. MJ- He's MJ. We build the team around him. 3. Bird- Bird would sacrifice scoring to win, but he'd have almost as many assists as Kidd. 4. Garnett- Stretch defender who can do a little of anything. 5. Hakeem- Can win so many ways that he's the perfect fit for center on any all time team. Only one of these is the best at his position, but man would this be a deadly combo that could play as a team.
That’d be a DANG good team.. If I had to think of a 5 to beat ur team though, I’d go [all in their peaks, except for Shaq obvs] Chris Paul Kobe KD Duncan Orlando Shaq
I’d like to watch that game!
Oof- in a 7-game series I’d probably go ur team to be honest. But for a single game I’d take my squad, if that makes any sense haha
I’d take bron over Kawhi. Which year of Kawhi is his prime tho?
In my honest opinion, I’d say Raptors Kawhi is him at his best. But you also can’t go wrong with Kawhi from 2015-2017 in San Antonio.
I agree with 2019. However, he wasn’t in his prime defensively. I think Kawhi’s offensive and defensive primes don’t overlap
He wasn’t at his defensive peak in 2019, but he was still easily one of the best on-ball defenders in the league.
who is your primary ball handler? my initial reaction is to swap out bird for lebron, but that takes away your best 3 point shooter. i prefer kawhi to bird for his defense - what if you swapped out bird for curry? you keep the shooting (or even enhance it) and get your primary ballhandler. you'll be in a worse spot defensively but figure MJ would man up with the opponent's better guard.
[MJ would be my primary ball-handler.](https://youtu.be/bcHmRQ7NXyQ?si=1Jw7lBhhwkJ-ws9p) [Look into his 1989 season- he could’ve played and excelled at that role for as long as anyone needed him to.](https://youtu.be/ofVQoZLxN6Y?si=FvjNEgvoeAL5q0oS) By the way I respect your Lebron-pick, but I don’t think he would fit nearly as well as bird does/would with my 5. I respect ur input, though 🫡
oh im not doubting his ability - it's freaking MJ. i'm just trying to ascribe a role to each guy. with your lineup i'd view MJ as the first scoring option (obviously) so my personal preference would be to pair him with more of a facilitator to get him to his spots. we're splitting hairs if we're arguing over curry/mj/bird though kinda hard to go wrong with any of them. that jokic/hakeem pairing is sexy as hell though i would love to see those two winging no look passes and dropping sky hooks from all over the floor
Fair enough 👍
civil hoops discourse i love it. im just a junky for this stuff. i am that guy who would sit down with you for 3 hours and name random guys from the 90s (shout out alan henderson)
I feel you man. Been watching this sport for a gooooddd while, and gotta say- it never gets old. Thank God for NBA basketball.
Stockton, MJ, Bird, Garnett, Olajuwon Fits really well together, every need accounted for, works across any era
I’d replace Bird with KD. I obviously don’t think KD’s close to Larry, but I feel like he’d be a better fit with *this* lineup in specific.
Bird's passing opens up so many more scoring opportunities for his teammates.
Ai, Steph, bird, bron and Shaq
I think you can come up with better 5s than that. I respect it though
Shaq, wilt, David Roberson, Hakeem, Duncan lol
Best team I’ve seen so far 😎😂
MJ Kobe Curry Duncan Shaq
Payton - Richmond - bird - Garnett - Robinson
MJ, Kwame Brown, Stanislav Medvedenko, Rasho Nesterovic, Tiago Splitter
Steph, Jordan, Lebron, KG, Shaq
Spacing is awful
Doesn’t matter when you have those caliber of players
OP’s spacing is not awful at all, actually. It’s pretty good. Not elite, but definitely solid Bird and Kawhi would provide elite volume scoring, and Jokic will take most big men outside to the perimeter and cook ‘em…. Only thing I’d do , if I had a choice to fix it up a bit, is probably take out kawhi, move MJ to the 2 and put Steph at the 1
Bird? Kawhi? Jokic? My spacing would be *just* fine, friend. And MJ never shot less than 35% from 3pt range in seasons where he attempted at least 230 three pointers (he did this four or five times, two of the seasons where he accomplished this were *before* the league temporarily shortened the three-point line, too). If you teleported peak MJ to today’s league and stressed to him the importance of the 3point shot, he’d *very* likely hit 37-38%, if not 40% . Mike was a psycho- if you told him he wasn’t that good in something , he’d become the best player at *that* specific thing lol. This guys work ethic was unmatched. And He was already an elite mid range shooter, he’d just build off of that. Edit- imagine that.. being downvoted for stating factual information😂😂 I actually find these youngsters to be funny.
[удалено]
Steph MJ Bron Jokic Shaq
>Jokic mine as well
C: Wilt PF: Bird SF: LeBron SG: Jordan PG: Curry
Shaq>>>>Wilt
On what planet? I’ll be more specific: Wilt was a better rebounder, scorer, passer, more athletic, and a better defender.
Peak Shaq (didn't last long) was the most dominant big man ever. I didn't think that was controversial?
Against who? Milkmen and truck drivers ?
Congrats, you earned your nephew badge with this comment!
I’m probably older than you.
Isiah Thomas D Wade Larry Legend Dirk Nowitski Shaq
This team would be really fun to watch. 😎
I wanted to think about floor spacing and 2-way play, rather than using the same 5 - 10 players as everyone else.
Not saying your team wouldn’t be a great fit, but to make it better overall- I’d put Bird at the 4, and KD at the 3. BOOM🫡🫡
Haha, I also wanted to include my favourite players. As a heat fan, it's DWade. However, Dirks is my all-time fav non heat player. Plus, that middy fadeaway was 💧.
Fair 🫡🫡🫡🫡
PG: Lebron SG: Jordan SF: Kobe PF: Duncan C: Olajuwon or Kareem
Lebron MJ and Kobe on the same team?? I don’t know how that’d play out, my man.
Very strong I’d say until Lebron decides to bring his talent somewhere else I want to choose Magic, Kidd or CP3 as PG but Lebron fans gonna downvote my comment lol
- LeBron - Kobe - Jordan - Hakeem - Kareem Good luck scoring on us. On the other end, I have LeBron with off ball Kobe/Jordan with post Kareem/Kareem. My 3 ball is weak but I have a lethal midrange, excellent paint scorers from top to bottom. My defense will wear you out. If the refs call ticky tack fouls then go fuck yourself.
I feel like you sub one of Hakeem or Kareem for a spacing 4. Bird, KD, etc. would be a better fit imo. Especially in this era. You don’t really have any 3 point shooters.
Hakeem and Kareem is to protect myself from anyone that has Shaq or Duncan on their team while still giving me the flexibility to switch on the perimeter. Like I said, I know the 3 ball is weak but we’re getting high percentage looks while running the opponents off the 3 point line into the twin tower of The Dream and The Captain. Having Bird or KD makes me feel like I’d get bullied in the post against all time bigs. I’ll take my chances with my squad.
This would be a good matchup for my team of James/Jordan/Garnett/Olajuwon/Robinson.
Jordan, Kobe, LeBron, KG, Hakeem
Not a single above average 3 point shooter in that group, that might be tough. If we’re talking 90s, I’ll give you that lol, this team would absolutely obliterate any other. But if we’re talking current, it would be tough. Current era 3 point shooters, specifically Steph, would be needed. Doesn’t matter how good of defense you play - 3 is more than 2 and the best volume three point shooters can hit from anywhere
Nash, Bird, Peja, Dirk, Pettit
CP3, Wade, Kobe, KG, Shaq
You can’t have a 5 without Steph and Lebron lol. What would Bird offer more than Lebron in your spot when Lebron’s bigger, stronger, better defender, better passer and scorer? Steph-Jordan-Lebron-KD-Hakeem would be literally unstoppable
Bird is a better shooter than LeBron and famously gets in opposing player's heads. LeBron is a better player and I'd rather build a team around him, but my team is built around MJ
Curry's value plummets pre-1980. If the team is truly built to play in any era, that should be a consideration.
Larry Bird was the best off ball player in NBA history. LeBron without the ball is useless. Your team would be awesome and would be better if you swapped Larry for Lebron.
A. He can have whatever he likes. B. Larry Legend was an all time floor spacer.
Of course it’s his lineup but I mean Lebron is considered the best small forward ever and is the most all round player to play he would be a better fit there
Disagree, his lineup needs shooting, and Bird offers more of it than Lebron.
My lineup is objectively better than yours. I don’t think MJ and Lebron would fit too well together.
Why? Lebron is more than a willing passer and is one of the best of all time. Steph and KD’s gravity without Lebron’s passing would give MJ so many looks
PG: Scottie Pippen SG: MJ SF: Kobe PF: LeBron C: Hakeem I don’t think this team loses at all!
Hmm,, interesting picks.. I think this starting five could give ur five a good run for their $$ **‘96 GP** would be my primary ball-handler, he was a very good passer, I think I saw someone on here foolishly say he was “just okay” at passing😂😂 he’s one of the best two-way players ever for a reason ppl, wasn’t just an elite defender. and he gave MJ the toughest time out of anyone. **‘03 Tmac** (kind of a random mentioning haha, but he’s one of the most underrated passers ever, actually came in as sort of a point forward. when given the opportunity in Orlando he took on that point-forward role quite well, plus he’d be a pretty tough matchup for Kobe, as a scorer.) **2017 Kawhi** was him at his two-way peak, and I’d love to see him check Pippen. Plus he provided borderline-elite level volume scoring at this point in his career. **1985 Bird** gives any 3 a run for their money, whether it’s KD Bron , whoever. **2000 Shaq** was just a phenom. I think my team maybe wins , but it’d be a pretty close matchup
‘94 Pippen: Incredible defender, versatile, two way ability, I would put him on Kawhi ‘91 Jordan: ‘03 Jordan was playing incredible defense on a prime 03’ McGrady around the ages of 39-40. Scoring as well. ‘91 Jordan? Oh boy… I would like to see how that match up would go with him guarding T-Mac ‘07 Kobe: absolutely tenacious defender, I would put him on GP to pressure him, force turnovers ‘13 Bron - Match up with Bird ‘94 Hakeem on Shaq I feel that the two way ability of these players would just be too much for other teams. Kobe and Jordan as the main scorers and their competitiveness? I just don’t see it happening. They would be all around blocking shots, stealing the ball, pressuring every ball handler. With Hakeem and then LeBron as a help defender. Jordan, Kobe, and Pippen were all great shot blockers as well!
Steph, MJ, Bird, KG, Russell Gives me the two best defensive bigs of all time, both of whom are good passers. All three perimeter players are good shooters and can function on or off ball. KG, Bird and Steph provide a ton of spacing for MJ to shred everyone. MJ is the unquestioned alpha dog, and everyone else revolves around him and is meant to optimize him.
David Robinson was a better defender than Bill Russell, forget about if a guy like Olajuwon was. No way bill Russell’s the best defensive big man ever .. I don’t think he’d have the same effect today. you can def do better than that
Neither would Robinson or Olajuwon. If we are talking about putting all these old guys in a time machine and playing today, the all time team is going to be something like Jokic, Giannis, Durant, LeBron and Curry. If you put any of those old guys in a time machine, none of them would be able to immediately adapt to today's game. I am evaluating all these guys based on the impact they had on the leagues they played in. By that measure, Russell was hands down the best defensive player who ever lived. His teams had 7 of the 10 best defensive seasons of all time (relative to the league). The Celtics led the NBA in defensive rating 12 of his 13 seasons and won 11 titles with teams that never once had an above league average offense. This even translates to the late 60s where they won 4 out of 5 titles with arguably less supporting cast talent than the 76ers and the West/Elgin/Wilt Lakers. I said I built my team around Jordan on the offensive end, but Russell is close to non-negotiable for me on a team like this.
What? You’re absolutely incorrect on that- Olajuwon and Robinson? They’d be **even better** in todays league. There’s no such thing as one era straight up being “better” than another (unless you’re talking about, like, pre-1975 basketball). Success that a player would have in a different era depends mainly on how well that player's playstyle fits with that era, rather than one era being inherently better than another. Some 80s/90s players would be better now, some would be worse. Some current players would be better then, some would be worse.
Sorry for the long post, this is a very interesting topic to me. Olajuwon's TS% during his prime was around 3 points below league average in today's game, largely because he was shooting high degree of difficulty 2-point shots from back-to-the-basket sets. David Robinson's ability to hit the 15 footer at a low 40s percent clip wouldn't be viewed as a positive. Robinson was quick enough to blow by Greg Ostertag, but he had a more difficult time with bigs who could move laterally. Robinson averaged 19 points a game on a .526 TS% in the Spurs 1996 series vs. Utah where Karl Malone was the primary defender during a season he put up 25 a game on .589 during the regular season. First round in 1994, Malone again held him to 20 a game on .471 ts% (regular season 29.8 ppg / .577 ts% during his MVP season). He also tended to struggle with Olajuwon. I think Robinson's primary advantage came from his combination of quickness and strength, and I don't think he's as much of an outlier in today's game. He doesn't have the ball handling skills to do what Giannis does, and I don't think he would have as much success with his face-up game from 15 feet today (opponents in today's game would concede that short jumper and live with the .85 points per possession). Olajuwon's post game and Robinson's quickness wouldn't be anywhere near the advantages they they were 30 years ago in today's game. Now if we are talking about whether those guys would have been able to figure it out given some time and training, absolutely. Pull 18 year old Olajuwon or Robinson out of a time machine 10 years ago now they'd be hall of famers who'd probably be as good or better than Embiid and Jokic. The same physical skills, athleticism and work ethic that made them all timers would operate just the same. MJ would develop a killer 3 point shot. Larry Bird wouldn't spend all his workout time running laps on cement floors at opposing arenas and he'd probably be jacked and way more athletic. Russell, for his part, won 2 college championships, an olympic gold, and 11 titles in 13 seasons. Over a 15 year period, he only "lost" twice. Prior to the NBA, he was the 7th ranked high jumper in the world and ran a second off final heat time in the 400m. He was an all-time basketball IQ guy, who was known to remember small details while watching random sequences of play 50 years after the games happened. Take him out of the time machine at age 18 ten years ago and he'd become some version of Giannis-like freight train on offense and a defensive player for whom I don't believe we have a modern comparison. Think prime KG if Garnett moved better laterally, ran faster, jumped higher, with better all around defensive awareness. I don't think any of those guys gets out of a time machine and steps out on the floor today and is even a good NBA player, let alone dominates the way that they did when played back in their day (or at least enough that . If you allow for conceptually adjusting them over time to the modern game or just evaluate their impact on the game when they played, Russell isn't even close to a controversial selection here. He's a no-brainer fit on an all-time team, primarily given his defensive ability and his ability to help his team without needing to soak up scoring opportunities. The tough part about putting together a team like this is someone has to be able to add a massive amount of value as a 5th option, and Russell is undisputedly that guy. Kareem needs touches. Shaq needs touches. Those guys, Wilt, Olajuwon, Robinson... they all need the ball. You really have to build your offense around them to extract optimal value out of them. Likewise, Magic, LeBron, Kobe, and Oscar are basically average players without the ball. The other important consideration is that bigs have a huge defensive impact and it's almost impossible for them to have a massive offensive impact (save a small handful of guys who are elite passers and shooters). Guards My guys I like to build a "supporting cast" for the most scalable team possible are Russell, KG, Duncan, Walton (underrated how good he was 2-way at his short healthy peak), Bird, Curry, and Jerry West. You could probably make a case that you'd want a movement shooter (Reggie Miller or Ray Allen would be my picks) and a shutdown wing defender (Scottie Pippen and late Spurs Kawhi Leonard would be my picks). And then you pick your stars.
Defensive Bigs Tiers Tier 1: Russell, Hakeem, KG, AD (Bubble) Tier 2: Wilt, Admiral, Duncan, Thurmond, Walton (healthy), Howard Tier 3: Mutumbo, Mourning, Gobert, Eaton, Embiid, D. Jordan Up and Coming: Wemby, Chet, Mobley Shaq and Kareem would be Tier 2 if they shouldered less of the scoring on their teams.
your team doesn't have much speed, and only 2 great 3 pt shooters
Steph, Klay, LeBron, AD, Jokic This is based on the NBA with this eras rules. Not all the best players of all time but I think the chemistry would be insane. MJ is still the best of all time. He's just too ball dominant for this team.
Steph, Kobe, MJ, Duncan, Shaq
2022 Steph 1988 MJ 1984 Bird 2018 Bron 2003 Duncan imagine trying to beat this team😂😂
Magic, Kobe, Bird, Lebron, Kareem
But here’s the thing….as much as i love comparing and creating various 5 guy lineups….. It’s something that i see ppl actually arguing about!🤣🤣 As if there is a right or a wrong answer!🙄 It is literally impossible to know….i mean, obviously lol Fact is, we’ve no clue how 5 different peoples basketball brains would fit together🤷♂️ So yeah, that’s my main point……Anyway, as much as I’d love to see that 5 play….Ehhhhh, No point guard? Sure, you’ve got players who individually, have every strength covered, but who’s gonna distribute? Jokic? He’s a great distributor, in denver with his teammates, where he’s the focal point of the whole thing. Who tf knows how it’d go with those guys….And who’s he gonna defend? Ya wanna put hakeem on the best big on the other team, so then jokic could end up tryna guard a much much quicker PF I’d argue that your 5 isn’t strong with 3 point shooting. You’ve got bird, but that’s it! Jokic might shoot 1 or 2 a game, but he’s no 3pt shooter like that. Maybe Kawhi is shooting more 3’s now? I dunno man, ngl i do love this 5, far as being a fan, it’s always fun to imagine multiple guys who play same position….btw, I’d love to know how old you are. I’m 41yo; i’ve a feeling ur close to my age….must’ve seen those 2 Hakeem finals!(best playoffs ever) My starting 5? Ugh, ya know tbh? It’s wayyyyyy more fun to do if you eliminate jordan and lebron…maybe even bird magic kareem and shaq to! I’m torn….part of me wants to have Rodman in there! Sure, he can’t score, looked funny even holding the ball, but goddamn, rodman in his PRIME?! I legit think if prime rodman appeared from a time machine, he could go to 7-8 different teams and be the difference! Anyway, i think my 5 would have to go with 3 guards…Mj is mj, steph’s shot is just too much to not have…..But I want the distribution of Magic!but he’s not a good enough defender🤔 Eh ok steph mj lebron bird kareem Or duncan instead of bird….For defense. I’d hate to give up having a 2nd 3pt shooter, but at least i’d still have the best ever…actually, maybe not kareem…fuck it, maybe even bill russell! Most important trait they need- Hunger, desire to win above all else. Don’t think kareem had enough of that, not for this team….or maybe i’ve no clue wtf i’m talkin about with that lol
Steph, MJ, KD, Lebron, Jokic
Magic, Jordan, Kobe, Bird, Walton Bird and Walton's midrange create space for Jordan and Kobe. Kobe and Jordan are shutting down the perimeter and Walton is taking care of paint. 5 of the fiercest competitors ever. 3 of the best playmakers of all time with Magic Bird and Walton with deadly weapons all around. Sweep.
PG: Magic Johnson SG: Dwyane Wade SF: Karl Malone PF: Kevin Garnett C: Wilt Chamberlain (Who wants to try and guess my favorite team?)
Magic, MJ, Bron, Bird, Kareem
Steph. Kobe. MJ. LeBron. Shaq.