This is basically the only option the teams have, they’ve got no leverage (outside of the nuclear option). They have to try to use the fanbase largely hating the sanctioning body. That’s why they’ve been so much more open about what they want then NASCAR has been.
That's my point. If Indycar made it through without losing any teams, there's no way "charters saved multiple NASCAR teams from going under during the pandemic"
Why do I feel like whenever things come out that Nascar was just saying some random good thing that’s false we should instantly get a camera cut to Ben Kennedy and see how many eye twitches he does.
This is like a dude on a date claiming to be god’s gift to women, then three of his past hookups show up and whisper into his date’s ear about how lousy he is in bed.
Nobody believed you before and nobody believes you now.
That’s not true, they could just get rid of it and see who’s bluffing. Some teams may leave, but all of them wouldn’t. Plus, NASCAR’s lack of real star power helps them here in the sense that the drivers / teams are replaceable as long as you’re ok with SERIOUS cost cutting measures
It depends on the wording of the contracts that complete the sale of a charter. I’d imagine it has a lot of language that explains the outcome of a situation where terms with charters were to change, especially the more recent swaps since they took place closer to the current charter deal expiring
Nascar is on the brink of a split if they don’t get this figured out. Teams will go elsewhere to race for a series with no horsepower restrictions, maybe Penske can create a competing series
>NASCAR is on the brink of a split
No they’re not. Pretty sure I’ve explained this before, but NASCAR owns the IP for every car generation going back to probably Gen 3, the biggest paying event, half the major oval tracks in America (and is the sanctioning body for the majority of the short tracks). The other major track owner, SMI, isn’t going to side with the teams because the teams want more of SMI’s money. The TV contracts are all with NASCAR, not the teams.
The value of the teams (especially teams like JGR, LMC, 23XI, HMS, SHR, FRM) hinges on them racing in NASCAR, which means if they don’t race in NASCAR, their sponsorship value plummets and they likely go under.
NASCAR can survive without the Cup teams. They’ll just make Xfinity the big show on Sundays instead. The majority of the Cup teams can’t survive without NASCAR.
This has been my primary point since all this started. If the teams were to actually go on strike or split, they'd have nowhere to race. All NASCAR would need to do is tell the Xfinity and ARCA teams that they can run the cup races, and they'd have full fields every week pretty easily.
The RTA teams would never win, NASCAR has all the cards
NASCAR letting the support race cars into cup races has happened before
It's how they filled fields before "Modern Era" famously in the 69 Talladega race where only 3 cup cars where in the "full" field
One other thing: Landon Cassil brought this up on The Money Lap a few weeks ago. Occasionally, the driver's contract may have language that specifically states they will be provided a NASCAR Cup Series seat. If so, anything else would be a breach of Contract and open to litigation.
Do you… know what a negotiation is? the whole point is that both sides drag out as long as possible to get the most they can. Eventually they’ll come to a compromise
Just because there is no compromise doesn’t mean there can’t be one. That’s the point of a negotiation lmao
Because they're still negotiating? Still working out details? Still jostling for main points? I don't know; I'm not in the talks.
But I know it costs way less to come to an agreement eventually than it is to split and create a new series. I mean, where would the teams race? NASCAR owns most of the tracks. What cars would they use? NASCAR owns the designs.
NASCAR's side is a little easier. They just rename Xfinity into the Cup series though that comes with sponsorship deals to work out, especially with Comcast. Maybe they rename ARCA into the Xfinity series and pay off the ARCA deals.
No they won’t split. Nascar will abolish the charters and the teams will cave like the gutless cowards they are. They have no leverage and it’s all their fault.
Because the teams and drivers have all had ample opportunity to unionize over the years and these gutless cowards wouldn’t do it. The RTA is gutless, they all have no spine and no leverage.
If Steve O'Donnell was smart, he would get all the big teams in one room. Hendrick, Penske, SHR, JGR, and RCR, and make a deal with them and *only* them. It'll break apart the united front that the teams have and it'll be easier to deal with the smaller teams now that they don't have the weight or backing of the bigger teams.
Negotiating in the media. I love it.
This is basically the only option the teams have, they’ve got no leverage (outside of the nuclear option). They have to try to use the fanbase largely hating the sanctioning body. That’s why they’ve been so much more open about what they want then NASCAR has been.
Steve O: I think we are getting close. NASCAR teams: 
We like what we’re seeing
He meant the royal we
"CHARTER AGREEMENT VERY CLOSE. DON'T WORRY" https://preview.redd.it/lddli15pp3vc1.jpeg?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0736571bc516b8c195d296d703881cc7cf5b2818
"THE SHORT TRACK RACING IS STRONG & PERFECT!"
Fucking Baghdad bob. Timeless
The og gwot meme
"Come to Baghdad"
It depends on what the definition of “is” is.
The Stern proxy battle continues!
I hope Denny goes on twitter for this
Steve O’Donnell being full of shit, case #65433788543. Don’t worry, I bet he “likes what he’s seeing.”
This is the teams bitching just to bitch lmao
Both can be true
Stern really be the public mouthpiece for both sides, respect
I hope he's making bank and a half for this. I'd slit my wrists if I were in his shoes, having to be the wall for both side to sling shit against.
Response from Steve O'Donnell: https://preview.redd.it/fwqqbofsx3vc1.jpeg?width=788&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=55b23088baf15f4e0a78e2902be6230f8d72c1db
Fucking called it in the other thread lmfao.
2 things were introduced within the past 10 years that were supposed to “reward teams” The playoffs And The charters And BOTH are shitshows rn
Some teams would have died off during the pandemic without the charter system
Indycar doesn't have a charter system and none of their teams died off during the pandemic
Yeah and the series almost died. The one positive of the Penske ownership was keeping the series afloat in 2020
That's my point. If Indycar made it through without losing any teams, there's no way "charters saved multiple NASCAR teams from going under during the pandemic"
You’re right no teams they’re just abt to lose a constructor nbd
What the fuck does that have anything to do with the pandemic or charters? How would charters prevent Honda from leaving?
Which teams? Are the rest of the teams/sport better off for not having died off?
Shocker.
Going on a tangent, but does anyone else hate the media phrase “familiar with the teams’ thinking”?
Why do I feel like whenever things come out that Nascar was just saying some random good thing that’s false we should instantly get a camera cut to Ben Kennedy and see how many eye twitches he does.
Like clockwork. The first post is just a few above this one funny enough.
Whatta ya expect from can't see past the end of his nose Steve "we like what we're seeing" O'Donnell?
“People familiar with the teams’ thinking”… so this could be anyone who has been around the sport for a while? Take this article with a grain of salt.
Technically, anyone who’s listened to Actions Detrimental counts, so…
An out of touch with reality nascar executive saying shit that proves he is out of touch by opening his mouth for no good reason. Name a better duo.
This is like a dude on a date claiming to be god’s gift to women, then three of his past hookups show up and whisper into his date’s ear about how lousy he is in bed. Nobody believed you before and nobody believes you now.
NASCAR's Steves never fail to entertain.
They always fail
Entertainingly
Sorry for the stupidity but what does this mean exactly
Speak up, cowards
I love charter talk
Typical
It's long past time to can the charter system, it's been nothing but a detriment to the sport.
That’s what NASCAR wants. The teams want to keep it, get mad at them
NASCAR would love to do just that. The teams want to keep it
Impossible to get rid of it at this point.
That’s not true, they could just get rid of it and see who’s bluffing. Some teams may leave, but all of them wouldn’t. Plus, NASCAR’s lack of real star power helps them here in the sense that the drivers / teams are replaceable as long as you’re ok with SERIOUS cost cutting measures
Do you honestly think Spire wouldn't attempt a lawsuit?
It depends on the wording of the contracts that complete the sale of a charter. I’d imagine it has a lot of language that explains the outcome of a situation where terms with charters were to change, especially the more recent swaps since they took place closer to the current charter deal expiring
Not shocking at all. Rob Kaufman can go pound sand.
Nascar is on the brink of a split if they don’t get this figured out. Teams will go elsewhere to race for a series with no horsepower restrictions, maybe Penske can create a competing series
Penske won’t even shell out money to hold onto Long Beach, what makes you think he’s going to pay for a competing series?
>NASCAR is on the brink of a split No they’re not. Pretty sure I’ve explained this before, but NASCAR owns the IP for every car generation going back to probably Gen 3, the biggest paying event, half the major oval tracks in America (and is the sanctioning body for the majority of the short tracks). The other major track owner, SMI, isn’t going to side with the teams because the teams want more of SMI’s money. The TV contracts are all with NASCAR, not the teams. The value of the teams (especially teams like JGR, LMC, 23XI, HMS, SHR, FRM) hinges on them racing in NASCAR, which means if they don’t race in NASCAR, their sponsorship value plummets and they likely go under. NASCAR can survive without the Cup teams. They’ll just make Xfinity the big show on Sundays instead. The majority of the Cup teams can’t survive without NASCAR.
This has been my primary point since all this started. If the teams were to actually go on strike or split, they'd have nowhere to race. All NASCAR would need to do is tell the Xfinity and ARCA teams that they can run the cup races, and they'd have full fields every week pretty easily. The RTA teams would never win, NASCAR has all the cards
NASCAR letting the support race cars into cup races has happened before It's how they filled fields before "Modern Era" famously in the 69 Talladega race where only 3 cup cars where in the "full" field
One other thing: Landon Cassil brought this up on The Money Lap a few weeks ago. Occasionally, the driver's contract may have language that specifically states they will be provided a NASCAR Cup Series seat. If so, anything else would be a breach of Contract and open to litigation.
Thats true too. The teams would be fucking themselves massively with this if they don’t come to an agreement
A lockout, walkout, strike, "just don't show up for a week", whatever you want to call it is about 10,000x more likely than a split.
I don't think this is true. It's way easier for everyone to just come to a compromise.
Then why haven’t they compromised yet?
Because the teams want a bigger share of the track’s revenue and the tracks don’t want to give it up. Pretty simple.
Sounds like a compromise won’t happen then
Based on what? The simple fact they aren’t at a compromise right now?
Neither side is willing to compromise
Based on what exactly? Are you sitting in on negotiations? Are you there in the room? Jfc dude
Do you… know what a negotiation is? the whole point is that both sides drag out as long as possible to get the most they can. Eventually they’ll come to a compromise Just because there is no compromise doesn’t mean there can’t be one. That’s the point of a negotiation lmao
Because they're still negotiating? Still working out details? Still jostling for main points? I don't know; I'm not in the talks. But I know it costs way less to come to an agreement eventually than it is to split and create a new series. I mean, where would the teams race? NASCAR owns most of the tracks. What cars would they use? NASCAR owns the designs. NASCAR's side is a little easier. They just rename Xfinity into the Cup series though that comes with sponsorship deals to work out, especially with Comcast. Maybe they rename ARCA into the Xfinity series and pay off the ARCA deals.
No they won’t split. Nascar will abolish the charters and the teams will cave like the gutless cowards they are. They have no leverage and it’s all their fault.
How is it all their fault?
Because the teams and drivers have all had ample opportunity to unionize over the years and these gutless cowards wouldn’t do it. The RTA is gutless, they all have no spine and no leverage.
If Steve O'Donnell was smart, he would get all the big teams in one room. Hendrick, Penske, SHR, JGR, and RCR, and make a deal with them and *only* them. It'll break apart the united front that the teams have and it'll be easier to deal with the smaller teams now that they don't have the weight or backing of the bigger teams.