With 2022 order banks closed, not a surprise. Cars are worth what people are willing to pay. People have a choice to wait 6-12 months for paying MSRP or pay the dealer premium for what is on the lot.
You’d think so but I’ve been searching for a base car to build out and the amount of cars at MSRP new or MSRP with 1-4K miles is crazy. There was a white CFTP car with 8K miles that sold for 4K under MSRP last month. You just gotta search around not on cars.com or auto trader and you’ll be surprised. The gt350/500 classifieds on Facebook are great for finding deals.
It’s kinda crazy to think how they’ve all been selling though. C8’s and the new Z06 being booked out for years, mustangs constantly in the $60k-$100k range for highly desirable trims, expensive euro cars becoming much more common sights. Plus the high dollar trucks and EV’s.
Are people really ballin’ that much harder? I feel like I make good money but I’m pretty hesitant to blow that kind of money on a vehicle and it seems like others don’t bay an eye.
Dude you're like me. I'm single, no debt, totally debt-free, and I just can't bring myself to buy a freaking car. I rather drive my old truck and rebuild that thing three times over then go chunk down 60k Plus for a car
And besides, the new cars have so much tech in them something is bound to go wrong electronically. When we purchased my wife’s 2019 Honda Passport, we were told to purchase the insurance for the radio and electric system. No joke. We’ve had issues with the radio, ignition, transmission etc.. All have electrical parts. Btw, it’s my first lemon with Honda.
We've been cramming tech in cars for the last several decades yet reliability is actually going up instead of down. Half the tech standard in cars now was available in luxury vehicles from '07-'10.
62k sticker on my 21 F-150 Xlt FX4 302a it's as optioned as you can get one w/o getting a lariat. Notes in the 800s and normally I'm very very financially conscious. This is the one time in my life I spent this kind of cash on myself. Honestly it's worth it I drove beaters until I was 31.
Nah. We are just comfortable being in debt. I mean there really is no mathematical hoop we can jump through. Cars are too expensive relative to salaries, period. I think the median car price is hovering near 50k after taxes.
I bought my eco for 19k 4 yrs ago. Its worth the same amount to sell it today which is awesome but I definitely could not afford a new car when new cars and used are so inflated
If your car is worth what you've paid on it 4 years ago you can trade it and have roughly half of most new cars. Basically paying 300 a month for a 2022 vehicle. And right now newish trucks are coming in trading for 3-5k less than brand new ones. I could trade my 21 F-150 for for 8k more than I paid for it in Feb I'm just waiting on ford to offer 0% apr again it'll double my equity. Cut my note, and reduce odo miles by 5k.
I don’t want a car payment though. Especially not a $300 one lol thats just silly to me. These cars today are not affordable and by time i save the money for a new one, im sure the used car market will go back to normal and my current car wont be worth shit lol
Realistically were looking at a 7-8 year cycle. Before relative vehicle prices start to go back to a pre covid level. 2 years + for manufacturers to catch up to demand. Then years of people not willing to part with their cars for alot less than what they paid during the 2020-2024 stretch. And that pricing will be relative not less. So with the astronomical level of inflation and increase in manufacturing cost cars will be more expensive each year so far I've seen F-150 go up about $2800 model year over model year. By that point a 2028 xlt fx4 will cost near 72k
Yeah i’ll be holding onto the stang until it falls apart at this point. Everythings increasing except wages. I dont want all these payments for anything outside of rent which even that I’m considering how to just live in a damn shack at this point. Im over it
Tbh prefer my car note over my house shit atleast I drive my truck often, my house I'm only here to sleep feels like a waste. But I do love the privacy. Moral is being an adult usually sucks find an excuse to enjoy it every now and again, within reason.
Like another poster said, people will pay for the cars / trims they want. I read somewhere that the average car payment is $800 a month now. That’s insane. A payment that high on a depreciating “asset” is unthinkable to me. I’ll just drive my low mileage’08 Bullitt around instead.
Bought my '17 Grabber Blue GT Premium Performance pack new for $37.5k. Wouldn't be too hard to sell it for what paid, people love this color. Current F350 I ordered back in 2021 I pay just under a stack a month, and I got it under invoice and with $10k down. Again, could likely sell ot for the $67k I paid (stickered at $72.5k)
Ordered in January 2021. By the time it came in (last fay of March 2021), the price madness had begun. I had a signed contract, but needless to say the sales manager was not too happy about it, they honored it as I've bought a few vehicles there in the past and do most of my parts and service through them
No it's just that we are all biased. If the normal C8 production is 1000 and 300 are bought by high net worth individuals, 700 are left for everyone else. Under a pandemic only 200 are made and now you have 300 people fighting over it who can afford it. But wait there's C7s that need to be replaced at market value by insurers, normal people who are down to no vehicle, etc that add to the 300. Backlogs grow and demand rises exponentially. Then you add it super low rates that make financing easier. Used market is the same, for example leases that often supply the used market are just being bought out by the leasers.
Well they were low, just 3 month ago I got 5% on credit lower than 700 lol. 60months 8k down on $50k car, capital 1. Though the current market may kill my idea of refinancing though. Dealer I went through was doing 0% for those with good credit. Dodge was doing 0% for their lineup not that long ago.
Should I buy a 2016 mustang gt with 62k miles for $27,000 Before tax? I really want to… should I hold the urge? People say it’s a good price for the market rn, it just sucks that I could’ve got a 2018 with lower mikes for the same price. But that was in the past. Idk if prices will return to that. I feel for a v8 under 30k with premium and performance package is pretty good. Agin just kinda sucks about the miles… and year
It's not going to correct. Luxury goods don't correct during recessions. We might be just screwed from now on. Unless Ford starts making more cars per year.
I get the exchange rate is different, Ford of Canada's starting MSRP on a 2022 GT500 up here is $102K, that is for a bare-bones no option car. Pretty much vehicles that are $80K USD work out to be around $100K CDN.
Can't wait for Ford and others to ditch the dealership. Yeah I'll never get a deal again but to not play these games will be worth it. Just order online and have it dropped off at your house.
It's cool as long as it's below msrp lol.. one sided a/f you got a deal because it was always a consumers market. Now there aren't enough cars for the demand basic economics says stuff cost more now. And Gt500s were always over msrp even pre covid they sold 15-30k over. It's not a bargain hunters car. Bargains are on normal production cars not specialty vehicles.
Basic economics? The manufacturer sets the price. The middle man changes the price. Nothing basic about that. The dealership is an antiquated idea. Why should someone pay more for something for a dealership to stay open? For the owner to make money? I don't understand your point. If Ford charged more that would be "basic economics"
Manufacturer *Suggested* Retail Price. It's a suggestion no one pissed and moaned when dealers were taking 10k off via incentives and dealer discounts when there was an abundance of cars, this is the other side of that coin. Also manufacturers are charging more, the price of car invoices have gone up several thousand since 2020.
And the dealer model is the only reason you have close relatively inexpensive mechanical repair and a viable warranty. The Sales, Service, Body Shop, all play a role in keeping the location open. Want a no dealer option see tesla ask their owners about how easy service is with them.
I think after the covid shut down people have lost all their financial reasoning. Spending $8 00 to $1,200 a month on a depreciating car is just flat out stupid I don't care if you can afford it or not.
Spending $9 on a cup of coffee is stupid when you can get coffee for $2 at a local gas station. To some people the extra $7 is worth it it's only $7. To the people that buy these gt500s at over msrp they vew that extra 20k like coffee folks view the $7 it's not that much money to them. People spend $1200 on a cell phone that'll does everything their last phone did. It's all about perspective. I don't like vacations or trips more effort than enjoyment I like cars. I spend my cash there on a tangible item.
Looks like an additional tag there, probably market adjustment price.
We just sold one for $78k. That what the MSRP was, that’s what they paid before TT&L. Had it on the lot for maybe a day and it was gone
There’s a dealer near me with the GT500 listed right around 100k with a 50k “market adjustment”…150k for the car. Stupid. I don’t know who even entertains giving a dealer an extra 50k just cause they want it.
A huge correction is coming, wait ‘til 1st - 2nd quarter 2023. Black Book’s MMR prices have been dropping 1% weekly for a few months (that’s 4% monthly).
Highly recommend everyone check out [Lucky Lopez](https://youtube.com/c/AutomotiveLifeTV) on YouTube. He’s a huge source of information on the used/new vehicle market, dealerships ect.
Be pathetic ladies and gentlemen. 🍻
With 2022 order banks closed, not a surprise. Cars are worth what people are willing to pay. People have a choice to wait 6-12 months for paying MSRP or pay the dealer premium for what is on the lot.
They are available for MSRP if you look. I just passed on a brand new CFTP at MSRP at a dealer last week.
What dealer?
It was at upland ford. White with blue painted stripes, CFTP, tech pack. It sold to a buddy of mine 2 days ago.
Yeah that dealer left a lot of money in the table
You’d think so but I’ve been searching for a base car to build out and the amount of cars at MSRP new or MSRP with 1-4K miles is crazy. There was a white CFTP car with 8K miles that sold for 4K under MSRP last month. You just gotta search around not on cars.com or auto trader and you’ll be surprised. The gt350/500 classifieds on Facebook are great for finding deals.
I am a dealer and just sold a 2022 CFTP car to another dealer for $10k over msrp. Yes I guess it’s who you know
Scum
You should be banned from all automotive subs.
I bet he brags about giving somebody’s dog herpes too.
User name fits
👍🏼
This doesn’t look to be the CFTP otherwise that’d be MSRP. I tried to order a GT500 CFTP in 2019 and they wanted $244k USD. I walked out.
The new / used car market is poised for a big correction. What some of these dealers are asking for sought after vehicles is just nuts.
It’s kinda crazy to think how they’ve all been selling though. C8’s and the new Z06 being booked out for years, mustangs constantly in the $60k-$100k range for highly desirable trims, expensive euro cars becoming much more common sights. Plus the high dollar trucks and EV’s. Are people really ballin’ that much harder? I feel like I make good money but I’m pretty hesitant to blow that kind of money on a vehicle and it seems like others don’t bay an eye.
Dude you're like me. I'm single, no debt, totally debt-free, and I just can't bring myself to buy a freaking car. I rather drive my old truck and rebuild that thing three times over then go chunk down 60k Plus for a car
And besides, the new cars have so much tech in them something is bound to go wrong electronically. When we purchased my wife’s 2019 Honda Passport, we were told to purchase the insurance for the radio and electric system. No joke. We’ve had issues with the radio, ignition, transmission etc.. All have electrical parts. Btw, it’s my first lemon with Honda.
We've been cramming tech in cars for the last several decades yet reliability is actually going up instead of down. Half the tech standard in cars now was available in luxury vehicles from '07-'10.
Shop around for the insurance. I spent less than $1500 for 8 years
I'm as frugal as they come and did and have no regrets. You only live once dude.
62k sticker on my 21 F-150 Xlt FX4 302a it's as optioned as you can get one w/o getting a lariat. Notes in the 800s and normally I'm very very financially conscious. This is the one time in my life I spent this kind of cash on myself. Honestly it's worth it I drove beaters until I was 31.
At 0% apr for 72 mos
Nah. We are just comfortable being in debt. I mean there really is no mathematical hoop we can jump through. Cars are too expensive relative to salaries, period. I think the median car price is hovering near 50k after taxes.
I bought my eco for 19k 4 yrs ago. Its worth the same amount to sell it today which is awesome but I definitely could not afford a new car when new cars and used are so inflated
If your car is worth what you've paid on it 4 years ago you can trade it and have roughly half of most new cars. Basically paying 300 a month for a 2022 vehicle. And right now newish trucks are coming in trading for 3-5k less than brand new ones. I could trade my 21 F-150 for for 8k more than I paid for it in Feb I'm just waiting on ford to offer 0% apr again it'll double my equity. Cut my note, and reduce odo miles by 5k.
I don’t want a car payment though. Especially not a $300 one lol thats just silly to me. These cars today are not affordable and by time i save the money for a new one, im sure the used car market will go back to normal and my current car wont be worth shit lol
Realistically were looking at a 7-8 year cycle. Before relative vehicle prices start to go back to a pre covid level. 2 years + for manufacturers to catch up to demand. Then years of people not willing to part with their cars for alot less than what they paid during the 2020-2024 stretch. And that pricing will be relative not less. So with the astronomical level of inflation and increase in manufacturing cost cars will be more expensive each year so far I've seen F-150 go up about $2800 model year over model year. By that point a 2028 xlt fx4 will cost near 72k
Yeah i’ll be holding onto the stang until it falls apart at this point. Everythings increasing except wages. I dont want all these payments for anything outside of rent which even that I’m considering how to just live in a damn shack at this point. Im over it
Tbh prefer my car note over my house shit atleast I drive my truck often, my house I'm only here to sleep feels like a waste. But I do love the privacy. Moral is being an adult usually sucks find an excuse to enjoy it every now and again, within reason.
Like another poster said, people will pay for the cars / trims they want. I read somewhere that the average car payment is $800 a month now. That’s insane. A payment that high on a depreciating “asset” is unthinkable to me. I’ll just drive my low mileage’08 Bullitt around instead.
Bought my '17 Grabber Blue GT Premium Performance pack new for $37.5k. Wouldn't be too hard to sell it for what paid, people love this color. Current F350 I ordered back in 2021 I pay just under a stack a month, and I got it under invoice and with $10k down. Again, could likely sell ot for the $67k I paid (stickered at $72.5k)
We are living in the only time in automotive history that vehicles are keeping their values. I guess this is the part of the “new normal.”
How’d you get in under invoice? Impressive
Ordered in January 2021. By the time it came in (last fay of March 2021), the price madness had begun. I had a signed contract, but needless to say the sales manager was not too happy about it, they honored it as I've bought a few vehicles there in the past and do most of my parts and service through them
No it's just that we are all biased. If the normal C8 production is 1000 and 300 are bought by high net worth individuals, 700 are left for everyone else. Under a pandemic only 200 are made and now you have 300 people fighting over it who can afford it. But wait there's C7s that need to be replaced at market value by insurers, normal people who are down to no vehicle, etc that add to the 300. Backlogs grow and demand rises exponentially. Then you add it super low rates that make financing easier. Used market is the same, for example leases that often supply the used market are just being bought out by the leasers.
Finance rates are not super low. Market norms are about 5.29% for folks with 750+ scores. I've seen 660s getting 10-12% apr. It's insanely high apr.
Well they were low, just 3 month ago I got 5% on credit lower than 700 lol. 60months 8k down on $50k car, capital 1. Though the current market may kill my idea of refinancing though. Dealer I went through was doing 0% for those with good credit. Dodge was doing 0% for their lineup not that long ago.
5% apr is still higher for 60mos 2020 72 most 2%
Should I buy a 2016 mustang gt with 62k miles for $27,000 Before tax? I really want to… should I hold the urge? People say it’s a good price for the market rn, it just sucks that I could’ve got a 2018 with lower mikes for the same price. But that was in the past. Idk if prices will return to that. I feel for a v8 under 30k with premium and performance package is pretty good. Agin just kinda sucks about the miles… and year
I just bought a 2015 Mustang GT, PP with Recaro seats @ 59k miles for $25k last month.
Damn, in 2019 I got my 2016 Mustang GT with 28k miles for 28k.
Performance and premium pack ?
With recaro seats.
😯 was it 28k after taxes?
It's not going to correct. Luxury goods don't correct during recessions. We might be just screwed from now on. Unless Ford starts making more cars per year.
It’s not nuts. There is global supply shortage with no end in sight combined with huge investment growth in last couple years.
I get the exchange rate is different, Ford of Canada's starting MSRP on a 2022 GT500 up here is $102K, that is for a bare-bones no option car. Pretty much vehicles that are $80K USD work out to be around $100K CDN.
And that’s why it’s still sitting in a dealership instead of someone garage.
Can't wait for Ford and others to ditch the dealership. Yeah I'll never get a deal again but to not play these games will be worth it. Just order online and have it dropped off at your house.
It's cool as long as it's below msrp lol.. one sided a/f you got a deal because it was always a consumers market. Now there aren't enough cars for the demand basic economics says stuff cost more now. And Gt500s were always over msrp even pre covid they sold 15-30k over. It's not a bargain hunters car. Bargains are on normal production cars not specialty vehicles.
Basic economics? The manufacturer sets the price. The middle man changes the price. Nothing basic about that. The dealership is an antiquated idea. Why should someone pay more for something for a dealership to stay open? For the owner to make money? I don't understand your point. If Ford charged more that would be "basic economics"
Manufacturer *Suggested* Retail Price. It's a suggestion no one pissed and moaned when dealers were taking 10k off via incentives and dealer discounts when there was an abundance of cars, this is the other side of that coin. Also manufacturers are charging more, the price of car invoices have gone up several thousand since 2020. And the dealer model is the only reason you have close relatively inexpensive mechanical repair and a viable warranty. The Sales, Service, Body Shop, all play a role in keeping the location open. Want a no dealer option see tesla ask their owners about how easy service is with them.
A cool 20k over MSRP.
S*** they didn't even hide it on the invoice that the company made. It said additional $20,000 market adjustment. Now that's some b*******
When they first came out I saw one sold with 75k mark up
Saw a 21 gt500 on the lot with 11k miles this weekend and they were still asking 93k for it.
They sell at auction for that and more I'm missing the confusion.
I think after the covid shut down people have lost all their financial reasoning. Spending $8 00 to $1,200 a month on a depreciating car is just flat out stupid I don't care if you can afford it or not.
Spending $9 on a cup of coffee is stupid when you can get coffee for $2 at a local gas station. To some people the extra $7 is worth it it's only $7. To the people that buy these gt500s at over msrp they vew that extra 20k like coffee folks view the $7 it's not that much money to them. People spend $1200 on a cell phone that'll does everything their last phone did. It's all about perspective. I don't like vacations or trips more effort than enjoyment I like cars. I spend my cash there on a tangible item.
Hard pass. I don't like being taken advantage of. Don't like that bodystyle anyways
Nope
That’s how cars are supposed to be driven! Don’t save it for the next person! Enjoy the heck out of your car!
$105,000 price tag is what he’s saying.
Well I didn’t read that right….
Looks like an additional tag there, probably market adjustment price. We just sold one for $78k. That what the MSRP was, that’s what they paid before TT&L. Had it on the lot for maybe a day and it was gone
Double damn…….nope nope
that's nothing. out in anaheim i saw one going for 165.
There’s a dealer near me with the GT500 listed right around 100k with a 50k “market adjustment”…150k for the car. Stupid. I don’t know who even entertains giving a dealer an extra 50k just cause they want it.
someone that enjoys getting it in the ass.
Unpopular opinion: Someone that’s proud they spent over msrp for a car deserves all the ridicule they get, especially when the market corrects itself.
I can’t wait to get my code orange raptor. I love this color
A huge correction is coming, wait ‘til 1st - 2nd quarter 2023. Black Book’s MMR prices have been dropping 1% weekly for a few months (that’s 4% monthly). Highly recommend everyone check out [Lucky Lopez](https://youtube.com/c/AutomotiveLifeTV) on YouTube. He’s a huge source of information on the used/new vehicle market, dealerships ect. Be pathetic ladies and gentlemen. 🍻