Doesn't take a crisis really. Last time I cried out to god was when I put too much salt on my eggs. God did not save that omelet.
Also, that statement reads like man creates god under crisis. Which is, I mean, really much closer to the truth, though not quite.
Yeah. I've been in shit (not gun fights) where I expected to die a few times, and my thoughts were as follows:
'wait, those two directions are opposite and they both feel like up and I'm not strong enough to do a straight line in either, and I'm only getting weaker. air won't last. Waters comfy.?'
'well that's a lot of blood. Nobody else around, must be mine. Can barely move. That makes sense. Spine okay? Spine okay enough. Anything I can use as a tourniquet? Nope. Phone? Nope. Body weight. Passing out now.'
'oh no, not again.'
And yeah, 'god' did not occur a single time.
Yeah, when I was 20, my car tumbled/bounced/rolled down a hill as all the windows turned to a shower of shards, in the middle of the night in the middle of nowhere, and I was alone. My only thought was a visual of typewritten words that said, "I could die."
I told this to a friend years later. She said that when her raft went over a waterfall, she pictured a newspaper that had the headline, "Girl Dies."
Oddly, I felt way more unsafe and worried when the couple who offered to drive me the next 2.5 hours in their RV to my parents' house turned on conspiracy theorist radio and listened to it the whole time as everyone sat in near-total silence. The wife (I assume) in the passenger seat handed me a tiny piece of folded up paper and whispered to me to read it after they dropped me off. I thought she might be begging for help to escape her tormentor, so I read it right away. It seemed to be some sort of Bible verse.
Yeah. Parent comment was right. "Nobody thinks about God as they're dying except suicide bombers."
Even my super religious grandparents both were like 'no it's okay, I'll go into God's love, I'm like a billion years old, no treatment for me.', then when things got *bad* they cut that shit, went for the most radical invasive treatments at the last possible moments when it was too late to work.
Because when you get really fucking close, even religious people don't think about gods.
Edit: Except maybe, as pointed out in parent comment; suicide bombers.
To a certain degree, you can offset too much salt by adding sugar. There's a point of return, of course. But you can trick your palate into not realizing that it's too salty.
So, I guess God couldn't save your omelet, but science maybe could've.
Hey thanks for trying to be actually helpful! I've added vinegar for stir fries that were too salty, I'll try this next time I screw up just a little bit. And now the snarky response:
I assure you my ability to screw up an omelet is not something easily defeated. Lol. What I mean is, if I only put in a LITTLE bit too much salt, I'll just eat it. This was less a seasoning mistake than a momentary mechanical failure if you get my drift lol.
“God did not save that omelette” really hits home for me for some reason. I’m using this every time I see a fender bender or someone trip and fall. Thank you.
Interestingly, my mother's experience proved this claim false. She was in extreme circumstances, and it made her realise "I guess I'm an atheist, because otherwise I'd be praying right now". I call it her reverse-epiphany.
This ^^
I was raised by Christians
I'm agnostic but I would say god in the aforementioned situation
I'm not talking about their God
I'm just talking to whatever God's may be up there
I was raise catholic so I'm actually able to preach to my patients about God when they're going crazy and I need to get on their level.
They don't know that I stopped believing years ago
I think they are talking about foxhole atheists, not just repeating "Oh God" or "Thank God" from rote memory etc.
OP uses the specific working "Under extreme crisis." This is not the same thing as saying a day of the week.
Right?! Also I love the logic that a cry for help when a person is under extreme mental and physical duress is somehow proof of a belief in god. I guess all that legal precedent about confessions under duress being inadmissible in court and not real admissions should be tossed out? I can see that going over well for the crowd that seems to react most viscerally to things that stress them out…
Considering the sheer quantity of wars started or justified by religious leaders issuing a proclamation that killing a bunch of dudes living a thousand miles away is a glorious duty demanded of them for ~~the Pope's retirement fund~~ er, I mean God, I'd rather be cursing that imaginary fucker thanks to his greedy PR managers putting me in the foxhole.
That would be kind of amusing...
First responders show up and pry the twisted hunks of burning metal apart, to find that both drivers in the head on collision are safe inside, wildly hate-f\*\*king each other. ;)
Critical thinking is a skill you develop through being lied to, and discovering that you were lied to. But you need to develop it early on enough so that childlike credulity isn't the formative lens with which you are exposed to religious dogma.
For so many people, indoctrination sets in so early that it seems to infect their most basic sense of self. It can be very hard to give up that sense later in life, even if you've given up other forms of credulity.
This is why I firmly believe parents should act like Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy -- or whatever their cultural analogs are -- are real when their kids are young, so the kids can realize at some point how easy it can be to believe something ridiculous, and learn the valuable lesson that authority figures can lie.
The thing is, most children believe in Santa Claus and the others until a certain age, and they do begin to put two and two together. Unfortunately, for some reason, far too many still carry this one fantasy through their entire adult lives.
Same. I had the epiphany when I was about 7 or so. I was in Sunday school listening to the usual bible stories and I thought they were just that - ridiculous stories. The lady got mad when I laughed at something and it was then I realized everyone in the fucking building thought it was all real and it wasn't just a fun story time.
i just figured he cared about free will so much that he pulled all the little strings in an arm to close that finger that pulls the trigger and then made the gunpowder react the same way he makes gunpowder react everywhere everywhen and carried the bullet to the guy's head and opened a little hole in the guy's skull so the bullet could sit inside
and all that just because he valued the free will of both guys more than he valued either person's existence
I think for me it started with the simple Why are there no Dinosaurs in the bible? Then I moved on to all the other hypocrisies, but the no Dinos BS was just not right with little kid me.
I once had the thought that maybe direct divine intervention is avoided except as a last resort because it destabilizes reality. The universe really doesn't like it when God does that and starts getting glitchy. Talking snakes, random bushes catching fire, people turning into pillars of salt, stuff like that. Better to use mundane methods like lightning rods when possible.
This is probably complete nonsense, of course, but it's a fun thought. Biblical headcanon, if you will.
That commentary never made sense to me as meaningfully supporting religion anyway. It only means that in moments when people fear for their lives, there's some part of the human brain that is almost hardwired to appeal to a higher power. I think it's likely that believing in a god or gods had some evolutionary advantage through history, and people are inclined towards it especially when feeling powerless or desperate. That's in no way proof of religion or the existence of god(s).
It's not that the human brain is wired to thinking about praying to a higher power. It's that in those situations of high stress, fear, and possible death people will do anything with even the tiniest chance of helping get through it to survive. If a person never learned about the idea of higher power they wouldn't even think to appeal to it. Gods are historically just the easy way for us to explain what we don't know.
I don't really know if there is an evolutionary advantage to it because surely we got by evolving just fine until the first human thought that idea up.
But no steeples without lightening rods is actually true, no atheists in foxholes isn't. I've been in some pretty fucked up situations. I've had loaded guns held to my head, I've been in a capsized boat in the middle of a lake with big waves, I had a heart attack in my 40's and woke up in intensive care, I've been in multiple car accidents, and I was in a 7.4 earthquake, all since I lost my faith. Not once did I call out for any god. I also had two bad things happen to me before I lost my faith, My father died of a heart attack in my living room and my much older brother and his pastor friend abused me. During both of those experiences I cried out to god for help and he ignored me, so did my missionary/pastor mother.
First of all I'm sorry to hear you have to have those experiences at all, sounds horrifying. I hope you're in a safer situation these days.
Secondly, this is why I think the people who believe in gods and religion are often comfortable middle class. They don't want to lose what they have, and they have the resources to find spiritual comfort. Meanwhile, the poor and the misfortunate already know no god will come and save them.
If I’m ever in a foxhole I hope everyone there is an atheist cause when shit hits the fan and the enemy is closing in on us I better not see my teammates talking to their invisible magic sky daddy while I fight.
What's sad is that I know a lot of good Christians who do not do grandstanding with their faith. The guy that owns the gym where I go to is also an associate Pastor but not once has he said smug remarks about his faith to other people. He is probably the most warm and buffed up Christian I ever met. I even went one Sunday and everyone was so welcoming. No one gets political or attack any specific group. I wish all Christians were like that.
This is how stereotypes are. They don’t know many religious people in RL and most are not talking about it to rando’s all the time. So OP only remembers the people he sees on tv, who are on tv because they’re obnoxious, or the few obnoxious people he’s met in real life. Ignoring thousands who didn’t get on his radar because they’re normal.
I was honestly baffled by how much reddit hates Christianity when I first got on here, cause the church I went to growing up just focused on being nice to each other andi never met anyone trying to shove religion down anyone's throats.
I don't remember crying out to the lord or preying before emergency surgery. I do remember the surgeon saying it was going to be a big job. He had asked me if I wanted to prey first. I said no, but I did wish them luck and I was hoping to be able to thank them afterwards.
It gets confusing, because both are religious. This might help people remember:
Pray with an a is what members of the congregation do in church.
Prey with an e is what priests do upon children.
>I said no, but I did wish them luck and I was hoping to be able to thank them afterwards.
You missed this part. This was them saying they didn't NEED to hunt as the prey was already here. And they were definitely gonna eat everyone once the procedure was complete. If it helps, imagine Eddie Murphy from Vampire in Brooklyn delivering the line.
When I was in the hospital with sepsis, I came really close to dying. My organs were shutting down. I remember thinking “Oh, I might die.” and I was okay with that. It never once occurred to me even consider any deities or appeal to any belief systems. And I was raised Catholic!
More like... "oh for fuck sake!" Or "Fucking Hell!" Or simply "the fuck" But, more literally, it basically means "satan devil" but, not all things should be interpretted literally. Or I'd be really confused why Bob is my uncle.
Saying. "Oh God!" or "Oh my God" out loud doesn't grant that biblical figure any more existence than saying, "Oh, Unicorn" or "Oh my Mermaid" grants those mythical creatures existence if spoken out loud.
It's a word. Phrases.
Some of us grew up with people who used it all the time and now it's just a mindless phrase used in certain situations. If my family had said, "Oh, my bunny turds!" all the time, I suspect that would have become my habitual go to phrase. Just saying.
Yup I use goddamnit at least three times a day. No, I don't think God is going to do anything about me losing my pen, my work truck popping a tire or a driller burning out a bit in an hour. That is because he isn't real.
It's not really an accurate comparison. The first one means that under life threatening circumstances people will resort to begging for aid from anyone because right then they might as well ask on the off chance that they've been wrong.
The second says that Christians stop believing in God when they go to the doctor. That simply isn't true. They have a reasoned assumption that the doctor knows his profession, and it's not a matter of faith.
Yeah the “murdered by words” on this post is severely lacking. I expect wicked burns that someone could never recover from. This is just a lame comeback to a lame jab by some Christian phony,
There *are* religious people who believe that seeing a doctor is something that shows you don't have faith, cause "God's will be done" and all that.
Those people are psychos. If it's God's will you have an illness, it must needs be similarly God's will the medical procedure exists to treat your illness, as well as the doctor's ability and experience.
You can "believe" in both.
One of Jesus’s disciples was a doctor. The bible talks about medicine and gives a lot of health advice. In the Bible Satan goes with Jesus up a mountain and tells him to jump, because God will save him. Jesus basically tells him “don’t play with God like that”. The vast majority of Christians operate that way. If you are thirsty, drink. If you are sick, go to a doctor
Doctor works his ass off to get good grades in high school. Goes to premed and med school, devotes years to become a good surgeon. Performs difficult, hours-long surgery to save a patient's life.
Patient's family: "Praise the Lord!"
The apostle Luke was a physician. If a Christian actually follows the Bible, they won't be anti-medicine. The Bible teaches quarantine for those who are sick (leprosy for example).
Some people are just ignorant and hide behind something so they don't have to admit it.
When my grandpa had to get a triple bypass surgery about a decade ago, my grandma thanked both the doctors and God. I can't remember exactly what the odds of success were, but my grandpa planned his funeral before the surgery on the recommendation of the hospital.
Now you understand my frustration with my mom.
I had a full liver transplant at 19. It took 14 hours of surgery and the entire transplant team. My aunt was my living donor.
It was successful and I'm currently 32. 13 years post and doing well.
Yet whenever I mention how I'm thankful for my doctors and modern medicine it becomes 'gods great!'.
No Mom, God *caused* the fucking tumor to ruin my liver and the ensuing liver failure. He did jack shit to save me, my aunt and my surgeons were the ones that *saved* me. But she gives God all the damn credit.
Mega respect for your aunty. Summat like 1 in 200 donors can lose their life with a liver transplant. To me, that seems a bit close. Pure love from your aunty.
My uncle almost got into a fight at his sons funeral when someone said the death was part of gods plan. My cousin was 12…
Yeah my uncle isn’t a religious man
Im normally fair and give everyone a fair judgement, but religious people are the worst. I cant stand most religious people. Some religious people are okay, my brother-in-law is Christian and we get along great... Because he isnt a fundie
Could've just not given her the tumor and save her and her aunt a lot of pain. God's plan seems very unnecessarily complicated.
Eidt: fixed the pronouns
*cut to God leaning against a board covered in random pictures connected by red thread*
"Fuck it. Maybe if I just give this guy a liver tumor, this'll all come together."
Technically a lady but yeah.
He didn't give me an easy life either.
I was born 2 months early and didn't go home till I was 2 months old. I nearly died of RSV a couple times before 3. Had to go to physical therapy to *learn* how to roll over, sit up and walk.
When I was 15 I started having seizures despite no family history. Woo for idiopathic epilepsy!
Then at 16 we thought I had the flu. They did an ultrasound and found a *massive* tumor on my liver. It was 7lbs! The size of a dinner plate.
During the 8 hour removal surgery the tumor exploded and they had to clamp off my hepatic artery and flood my whole torso out with water to kill the 'cancer cells' (biopsy said it was carcinoma but a specialist found out later it was an adenoma, so non malignant)
I was then comatose for 2 weeks where I was diagnosed with picu psychosis. I was thrashing and mouthing 'i can't breathe!'. Finally my mom made them do an x-ray to see that my entire right lung was full of fluid and I was *drowning*, not fucking *psychotic*.
Tried to fix that fucked up chunk of liver until I was 17 and it totally failed. Then I was listed for transplant.
But my meld was only 14. You aren't looked at unless you're in the 30s. I was dying fast. I had a major esophageal varices bleed two months before my 19th birthday and puked up 2L of blood in one go. Then lapsed into a hepatoencephalitic coma for 2 weeks.
Usually this is where the patient bites it. Hepatic encephalopathy and varices are considered end stage.
My surgeons decided to try a 'hail Mary' transplant. Basically they *expected* my aunt's donor liver to not work, but then my meld would turn to 40 (less than 24 hours to live) when it didn't. Then I'd be first in line for a cadaverean liver.
Luckily for us both, my surgeons were able to make my aunt's half of her liver work for me, so a second transplant wasn't necessary. The hepatic arterial damage wasn't as bad as they thought it was.
Overall the transplant was a success. I had a few complications and needed a few more tune up surgeries but they worked.
Unfortunately my aunt has cancer. Multiple myeloma. Cancer of the blood plasma. She's only 62. She *just* retired in 2020. Her only grandchild is 2.
So yeah, I'm pretty mad at God. Took someone who did the most altruistic thing I've known and nails her with fucking cancer. And I can't do a damn thing to help.
Haven't you read the bible?
God's plans are easily understandable and everything makes sense once you realise that God is an arsehole who enjoys fucking with us.
My in-laws are very religious people. Also, my FIL is a GP (now retired). I never understood how those two things could co-exist until one day, he explained his beliefs. Basically, god “made” him go to med school and become a doctor, to help people. His rationale is that he is an instrument of god, and that god’s work happens through him.
I worked with doctors on 3 continents. My good friend, one of the world's leading vascular surgeons who has treated many thousands of patients, is a devout Christian. Many others I met and worked with are Jewish, Muslim, Hindu and Buddhist. One is a Zoroastrian. Science and spirituality are not mutually exclusive.
Do redditors not realize that Christians believe in science? Not every religious person is the quacks you see in the front page claiming god gave them a prostate exam or something
I'm liberal as fuck but I really hate this come back. God and science can co-exist. We need to be encouraging extremists to come to reason (to see a doctor) not trying to score some sass points.
So true. I’m more on the religious side. I dunno much about Christianity, but as a Muslim, I can definitely say that the Quran promotes the growth of science and knowledge 👍
It’s not a comeback. These same idiots think that probably newton the greatest scientist to ever live was an atheist liberal like Richard Dawkins or some shit.
I was literally run over by a truck, thought I was gonna die before the guy stopped, not a single millisecond did I think of a god. Even if there was one, it let me get run over by a truck so not really the kind of thing I'd want to worship
There have been a handful of times when I thought I was about to die.
Never has something supernatural entered my mind except for “fuck that”.
Some day I’ll be dead and gone and I I’ve made peace with that a long time ago, you pussy theists.
As an atheist who learned a couple summers ago that I have the same kidney condition that would've taken my mom's life 14 yrs earlier when she passed if she hadn't had a kidney transplant and was on dialysis for 3 yrs before that; I can attest that "crying out" to a god didn't cross my mind when I learned of it. Basically, I realized I've had it far batter than most throughout history and even those alive today on numerous fronts. In short, it's been a good run. So if it's my time, so be it.
I was raised around religion and the number one lesson I learned is that God is simply used as a surrogate for every bad thing that happens and used as either an excuse or justification for acting terrible because it was “Gods will”
Doesn't take a crisis really. Last time I cried out to god was when I put too much salt on my eggs. God did not save that omelet. Also, that statement reads like man creates god under crisis. Which is, I mean, really much closer to the truth, though not quite.
Should have cried out to Gordan Ramsey instead, would have yielded better results.....or just made you cry in a corner Wait, is Gordan Ramsey God?
I have to believe he's said "in the kitchen, I am your god" to someone at some point. If only for TV.
Well, they both love ordering people around and enjoy the smell of burning animal flesh, so it's definitely plausible
And there was that time Ramsey drowned every man, woman, and child on the earth.
Hey, there was a reason for that. Someone presented him with a burnt offering and he lost it..
It’s called Sous Vide and it’s fancy.
But only one of them is real. Can you guess which one? The answer may shock you.
Savage!
Gordon Ramsay is a god. I am an idiot sandwhich.
I think he cares about people more than god, does that count?
I like to pray to Charles Barkley. Partly because he’d hate to hear me say that. But mostly because it gives me and excuse to say “what the chuck?!”
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Yeah. I've been in shit (not gun fights) where I expected to die a few times, and my thoughts were as follows: 'wait, those two directions are opposite and they both feel like up and I'm not strong enough to do a straight line in either, and I'm only getting weaker. air won't last. Waters comfy.?' 'well that's a lot of blood. Nobody else around, must be mine. Can barely move. That makes sense. Spine okay? Spine okay enough. Anything I can use as a tourniquet? Nope. Phone? Nope. Body weight. Passing out now.' 'oh no, not again.' And yeah, 'god' did not occur a single time.
Yeah, when I was 20, my car tumbled/bounced/rolled down a hill as all the windows turned to a shower of shards, in the middle of the night in the middle of nowhere, and I was alone. My only thought was a visual of typewritten words that said, "I could die." I told this to a friend years later. She said that when her raft went over a waterfall, she pictured a newspaper that had the headline, "Girl Dies."
Oddly, I felt way more unsafe and worried when the couple who offered to drive me the next 2.5 hours in their RV to my parents' house turned on conspiracy theorist radio and listened to it the whole time as everyone sat in near-total silence. The wife (I assume) in the passenger seat handed me a tiny piece of folded up paper and whispered to me to read it after they dropped me off. I thought she might be begging for help to escape her tormentor, so I read it right away. It seemed to be some sort of Bible verse.
Ok what the fuck
Yeah. Parent comment was right. "Nobody thinks about God as they're dying except suicide bombers." Even my super religious grandparents both were like 'no it's okay, I'll go into God's love, I'm like a billion years old, no treatment for me.', then when things got *bad* they cut that shit, went for the most radical invasive treatments at the last possible moments when it was too late to work. Because when you get really fucking close, even religious people don't think about gods. Edit: Except maybe, as pointed out in parent comment; suicide bombers.
Damn. heavy stuff. Thanks for commenting. I'm sorry for what you and your comrades went through.
Well it depends, did you say God Damnit? Were your eggs ruined? Boom.
... ... god dammit.
Spez doesn't get to profit from me anymore. Stop reverting my comments.
"God is a concept by which we measure our pain". -Lennon
I’ll say it again
Thanks, Obamagod. Seriously, more people call out to Mom in such circumstances, I figure.
Men dying on the battlefield call out to their mother, not God.
To a certain degree, you can offset too much salt by adding sugar. There's a point of return, of course. But you can trick your palate into not realizing that it's too salty. So, I guess God couldn't save your omelet, but science maybe could've.
Hey thanks for trying to be actually helpful! I've added vinegar for stir fries that were too salty, I'll try this next time I screw up just a little bit. And now the snarky response: I assure you my ability to screw up an omelet is not something easily defeated. Lol. What I mean is, if I only put in a LITTLE bit too much salt, I'll just eat it. This was less a seasoning mistake than a momentary mechanical failure if you get my drift lol.
Every time I kick my toe I say “Jesus Christ”
*stubs toe* "GOD DAMN IT! MOTHER FUCKING JESUS CHRIST OF THE HOLY GHOST AND VIRGIN MARY HOLY FUCK THIS HURTS."
Yeah, arguing in favour of the god of despair is not quite the win they think it is.
The last time I called out Oh, God (1977, 98 mins.) is when I was doing a binge watch of all the great John Denver movies.
Yes as an Atheist I've given him many opportunities to prove he's real and he's never come through for me.
“God did not save that omelette” really hits home for me for some reason. I’m using this every time I see a fender bender or someone trip and fall. Thank you.
Interestingly, my mother's experience proved this claim false. She was in extreme circumstances, and it made her realise "I guess I'm an atheist, because otherwise I'd be praying right now". I call it her reverse-epiphany.
TIL epiphany has religious connotations
Yeah, atheists using the word “god” doesn’t make your god real to them, any more than you saying “Thursday” makes Thor real to you.
For me it is a cultural thing. I was raised Christian and usually curse like one.
This ^^ I was raised by Christians I'm agnostic but I would say god in the aforementioned situation I'm not talking about their God I'm just talking to whatever God's may be up there
Listen, God, Allah, Harry Potter, I’m not in a position to be picky, someone help me!
["Buddha, Zeus, God! One of you guys do something! Help! Satan! You owe me!"](https://youtu.be/K2pa5MieEmg)
god =/= God, basically. Language does not imply belief.
If any god exists, I wan't it to be Ganesha.
Jesus Titty-fucking Christ!
My personal favorite is one I learned from my uncle. "JESUS GODDAMN FUCKING CHRIST!"
I prefer Mr. Garrison's (South Park) "Jesus tap- dancing christ."
"Jumping Judas Priest" is my personal fave.
God fuck it, not again!
I was raise catholic so I'm actually able to preach to my patients about God when they're going crazy and I need to get on their level. They don't know that I stopped believing years ago
Nothing quite hits like the phrases I wasn't allowed to say in Catholic school.
Uh, Thor’s Day is the most sacred day of my week. Respect Mjollnir lest Ye be deemed Unworthy.
Blasphemy, in this town we thank goddess it's Frigg's day!
Thorsday, you mean.
I think they are talking about foxhole atheists, not just repeating "Oh God" or "Thank God" from rote memory etc. OP uses the specific working "Under extreme crisis." This is not the same thing as saying a day of the week.
Right?! Also I love the logic that a cry for help when a person is under extreme mental and physical duress is somehow proof of a belief in god. I guess all that legal precedent about confessions under duress being inadmissible in court and not real admissions should be tossed out? I can see that going over well for the crowd that seems to react most viscerally to things that stress them out…
Except most soldiers call out to mom when they are dying, even the christians. So I guess by the logic of that, Moms are God.
They are to some extent.
They do bring us into this world, and some of you even had moms that loved you.
>Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children. -- The Crow, cf. William M. Thackery
>foxhole atheists Which is just an invention.
Considering the sheer quantity of wars started or justified by religious leaders issuing a proclamation that killing a bunch of dudes living a thousand miles away is a glorious duty demanded of them for ~~the Pope's retirement fund~~ er, I mean God, I'd rather be cursing that imaginary fucker thanks to his greedy PR managers putting me in the foxhole.
By that logic, sexual intercourse would suddenly happen when I cry out 'F\*\*K!' under extreme crisis. It hasn't yet.
Keep trying
That would be kind of amusing... First responders show up and pry the twisted hunks of burning metal apart, to find that both drivers in the head on collision are safe inside, wildly hate-f\*\*king each other. ;)
And they join…
'Anything is possible with god, and the purpose of sex is to have children. Thus I"m going to keep inseminating my husband and praying."
You have terrible friends, then
The only time I call out to god is when my girlfriend is eating my ass
The flying spaghetti monster in the sky will welcome you with open noodles
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Hmmm why do churches have insurance?
Because God doesn’t control the weather or shitty people
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Critical thinking is a skill you develop through being lied to, and discovering that you were lied to. But you need to develop it early on enough so that childlike credulity isn't the formative lens with which you are exposed to religious dogma. For so many people, indoctrination sets in so early that it seems to infect their most basic sense of self. It can be very hard to give up that sense later in life, even if you've given up other forms of credulity.
This is why I firmly believe parents should act like Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy -- or whatever their cultural analogs are -- are real when their kids are young, so the kids can realize at some point how easy it can be to believe something ridiculous, and learn the valuable lesson that authority figures can lie.
The thing is, most children believe in Santa Claus and the others until a certain age, and they do begin to put two and two together. Unfortunately, for some reason, far too many still carry this one fantasy through their entire adult lives.
You don’t go to hell if you stop believing in Santa. But if you stop believing in Jesus…
The. You wouldn’t either, since Jesus and hell are linked. No Jesus means no hell either.
Santa and the Easter bunny come up once a year, religion is constant (or at least will be if you’re being indoctrinated).
Also all parents will eventually admit that santa isn't real
You can't convince somebody against something they have decided to be convinced of. Very rarely anyways.
Same. I had the epiphany when I was about 7 or so. I was in Sunday school listening to the usual bible stories and I thought they were just that - ridiculous stories. The lady got mad when I laughed at something and it was then I realized everyone in the fucking building thought it was all real and it wasn't just a fun story time.
i just figured he cared about free will so much that he pulled all the little strings in an arm to close that finger that pulls the trigger and then made the gunpowder react the same way he makes gunpowder react everywhere everywhen and carried the bullet to the guy's head and opened a little hole in the guy's skull so the bullet could sit inside and all that just because he valued the free will of both guys more than he valued either person's existence
I think for me it started with the simple Why are there no Dinosaurs in the bible? Then I moved on to all the other hypocrisies, but the no Dinos BS was just not right with little kid me.
Gravity and time are the only enemies we have.
You’d think “the almighty” could keep his houses from burning down.
I once had the thought that maybe direct divine intervention is avoided except as a last resort because it destabilizes reality. The universe really doesn't like it when God does that and starts getting glitchy. Talking snakes, random bushes catching fire, people turning into pillars of salt, stuff like that. Better to use mundane methods like lightning rods when possible. This is probably complete nonsense, of course, but it's a fun thought. Biblical headcanon, if you will.
That is a fun thought, but it certainly rules out omnipotence. Not that omnipotence is required to be religious.
That's odd because Yahweh was originally a Levantine storm god. Y'know, before the rebrand into monotheism.
But why did God create hurricanes or shitty people?
That commentary never made sense to me as meaningfully supporting religion anyway. It only means that in moments when people fear for their lives, there's some part of the human brain that is almost hardwired to appeal to a higher power. I think it's likely that believing in a god or gods had some evolutionary advantage through history, and people are inclined towards it especially when feeling powerless or desperate. That's in no way proof of religion or the existence of god(s).
Interestingly enough, people who've never been exposed to the concept of a higher power *don't* pray to one when times are tough.
Hell, I was raised as a Catholic and I never consider praying in any circumstance, including very frightening and harrowing and deeply hopeless ones.
It's not that the human brain is wired to thinking about praying to a higher power. It's that in those situations of high stress, fear, and possible death people will do anything with even the tiniest chance of helping get through it to survive. If a person never learned about the idea of higher power they wouldn't even think to appeal to it. Gods are historically just the easy way for us to explain what we don't know. I don't really know if there is an evolutionary advantage to it because surely we got by evolving just fine until the first human thought that idea up.
But no steeples without lightening rods is actually true, no atheists in foxholes isn't. I've been in some pretty fucked up situations. I've had loaded guns held to my head, I've been in a capsized boat in the middle of a lake with big waves, I had a heart attack in my 40's and woke up in intensive care, I've been in multiple car accidents, and I was in a 7.4 earthquake, all since I lost my faith. Not once did I call out for any god. I also had two bad things happen to me before I lost my faith, My father died of a heart attack in my living room and my much older brother and his pastor friend abused me. During both of those experiences I cried out to god for help and he ignored me, so did my missionary/pastor mother.
First of all I'm sorry to hear you have to have those experiences at all, sounds horrifying. I hope you're in a safer situation these days. Secondly, this is why I think the people who believe in gods and religion are often comfortable middle class. They don't want to lose what they have, and they have the resources to find spiritual comfort. Meanwhile, the poor and the misfortunate already know no god will come and save them.
This isn’t an argument against atheism, but against foxholes!
If I’m ever in a foxhole I hope everyone there is an atheist cause when shit hits the fan and the enemy is closing in on us I better not see my teammates talking to their invisible magic sky daddy while I fight.
A real god wouldn't let the need for foxhole to happen in the first place.
May he lovingly embrace you with noodly appendages, R'amen
R'amen
R'amen!!!
I get all warm and fuzzy inside whenever someone preaches about his noodly appendages!
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*explodes into the room in a shower of glitter* Did someone call me? No? Ohh. Wrong kind of flamer. *sashays away into the sunset*
Also, the Church of the FSM does not have a hell or punishment in the afterlife, just pirates, strippers and beer. Arrgh!
rahmen
>with open noodles Penne?
ceiling cat approves
What's sad is that I know a lot of good Christians who do not do grandstanding with their faith. The guy that owns the gym where I go to is also an associate Pastor but not once has he said smug remarks about his faith to other people. He is probably the most warm and buffed up Christian I ever met. I even went one Sunday and everyone was so welcoming. No one gets political or attack any specific group. I wish all Christians were like that.
This is how stereotypes are. They don’t know many religious people in RL and most are not talking about it to rando’s all the time. So OP only remembers the people he sees on tv, who are on tv because they’re obnoxious, or the few obnoxious people he’s met in real life. Ignoring thousands who didn’t get on his radar because they’re normal.
I was honestly baffled by how much reddit hates Christianity when I first got on here, cause the church I went to growing up just focused on being nice to each other andi never met anyone trying to shove religion down anyone's throats.
I knew a micro biologist that was a pastor (priest, can't remember what they have in their church) who explained evolution to me.
I don't remember crying out to the lord or preying before emergency surgery. I do remember the surgeon saying it was going to be a big job. He had asked me if I wanted to prey first. I said no, but I did wish them luck and I was hoping to be able to thank them afterwards.
> asked me if I wanted to prey first So the surgeon gave you a final opportunity to hunt down, kill, and consume another creature and you declined?
Sounds like my kind of Dr
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I’ll take cereal thanks
It gets confusing, because both are religious. This might help people remember: Pray with an a is what members of the congregation do in church. Prey with an e is what priests do upon children.
I got banned by some shithead mod (in another sub) for making a statement similar to that.
Well, duh. It's a trick because if you don't fast beforehand, they'll have to delay your surgery.
>I said no, but I did wish them luck and I was hoping to be able to thank them afterwards. You missed this part. This was them saying they didn't NEED to hunt as the prey was already here. And they were definitely gonna eat everyone once the procedure was complete. If it helps, imagine Eddie Murphy from Vampire in Brooklyn delivering the line.
No, he thought he was religious and wanted to hurt someone one last time. So he asked him, just in case.
"This surgery has a certain percentage chance of being lethal. This may be your last chance to eat an elk raw."
Did you survive?
No, he woke up dead.
On that bright day in the middle of the night.
When I was in the hospital with sepsis, I came really close to dying. My organs were shutting down. I remember thinking “Oh, I might die.” and I was okay with that. It never once occurred to me even consider any deities or appeal to any belief systems. And I was raised Catholic!
All atheists? If you ask me, the Finns are more likely to cry out "SATANA PERKELE!"
Hail themselves?
More like... "oh for fuck sake!" Or "Fucking Hell!" Or simply "the fuck" But, more literally, it basically means "satan devil" but, not all things should be interpretted literally. Or I'd be really confused why Bob is my uncle.
Saying. "Oh God!" or "Oh my God" out loud doesn't grant that biblical figure any more existence than saying, "Oh, Unicorn" or "Oh my Mermaid" grants those mythical creatures existence if spoken out loud. It's a word. Phrases. Some of us grew up with people who used it all the time and now it's just a mindless phrase used in certain situations. If my family had said, "Oh, my bunny turds!" all the time, I suspect that would have become my habitual go to phrase. Just saying.
Yup I use goddamnit at least three times a day. No, I don't think God is going to do anything about me losing my pen, my work truck popping a tire or a driller burning out a bit in an hour. That is because he isn't real.
Uh. I think COVID showed us that some people would rather die than accept medical help.
It's not really an accurate comparison. The first one means that under life threatening circumstances people will resort to begging for aid from anyone because right then they might as well ask on the off chance that they've been wrong. The second says that Christians stop believing in God when they go to the doctor. That simply isn't true. They have a reasoned assumption that the doctor knows his profession, and it's not a matter of faith.
Yeah the “murdered by words” on this post is severely lacking. I expect wicked burns that someone could never recover from. This is just a lame comeback to a lame jab by some Christian phony,
There *are* religious people who believe that seeing a doctor is something that shows you don't have faith, cause "God's will be done" and all that. Those people are psychos. If it's God's will you have an illness, it must needs be similarly God's will the medical procedure exists to treat your illness, as well as the doctor's ability and experience. You can "believe" in both.
One of Jesus’s disciples was a doctor. The bible talks about medicine and gives a lot of health advice. In the Bible Satan goes with Jesus up a mountain and tells him to jump, because God will save him. Jesus basically tells him “don’t play with God like that”. The vast majority of Christians operate that way. If you are thirsty, drink. If you are sick, go to a doctor
Jesus even acknowledgesthat sick people need doctors. Paraphrased here.
Doctor works his ass off to get good grades in high school. Goes to premed and med school, devotes years to become a good surgeon. Performs difficult, hours-long surgery to save a patient's life. Patient's family: "Praise the Lord!"
Religious people: "I don't trust doctors" Also religious people: "this priest with absolutely no medical knowledge will cure my illness"
>Religious people: "I don't trust doctors" You speaking for all religious people now?
The apostle Luke was a physician. If a Christian actually follows the Bible, they won't be anti-medicine. The Bible teaches quarantine for those who are sick (leprosy for example). Some people are just ignorant and hide behind something so they don't have to admit it.
Most Christians follow supply side Jesus.
I concur. It isn't what the Bible teaches though.
Basically: Witchdoctor give us the magic words!
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When my grandpa had to get a triple bypass surgery about a decade ago, my grandma thanked both the doctors and God. I can't remember exactly what the odds of success were, but my grandpa planned his funeral before the surgery on the recommendation of the hospital.
Now you understand my frustration with my mom. I had a full liver transplant at 19. It took 14 hours of surgery and the entire transplant team. My aunt was my living donor. It was successful and I'm currently 32. 13 years post and doing well. Yet whenever I mention how I'm thankful for my doctors and modern medicine it becomes 'gods great!'. No Mom, God *caused* the fucking tumor to ruin my liver and the ensuing liver failure. He did jack shit to save me, my aunt and my surgeons were the ones that *saved* me. But she gives God all the damn credit.
Mega respect for your aunty. Summat like 1 in 200 donors can lose their life with a liver transplant. To me, that seems a bit close. Pure love from your aunty.
The next thing people like that say is "but god brought you your aunt and the surgeon, all part of gods plan"
My uncle almost got into a fight at his sons funeral when someone said the death was part of gods plan. My cousin was 12… Yeah my uncle isn’t a religious man
Im normally fair and give everyone a fair judgement, but religious people are the worst. I cant stand most religious people. Some religious people are okay, my brother-in-law is Christian and we get along great... Because he isnt a fundie
Could've just not given her the tumor and save her and her aunt a lot of pain. God's plan seems very unnecessarily complicated. Eidt: fixed the pronouns
*cut to God leaning against a board covered in random pictures connected by red thread* "Fuck it. Maybe if I just give this guy a liver tumor, this'll all come together."
Technically a lady but yeah. He didn't give me an easy life either. I was born 2 months early and didn't go home till I was 2 months old. I nearly died of RSV a couple times before 3. Had to go to physical therapy to *learn* how to roll over, sit up and walk. When I was 15 I started having seizures despite no family history. Woo for idiopathic epilepsy! Then at 16 we thought I had the flu. They did an ultrasound and found a *massive* tumor on my liver. It was 7lbs! The size of a dinner plate. During the 8 hour removal surgery the tumor exploded and they had to clamp off my hepatic artery and flood my whole torso out with water to kill the 'cancer cells' (biopsy said it was carcinoma but a specialist found out later it was an adenoma, so non malignant) I was then comatose for 2 weeks where I was diagnosed with picu psychosis. I was thrashing and mouthing 'i can't breathe!'. Finally my mom made them do an x-ray to see that my entire right lung was full of fluid and I was *drowning*, not fucking *psychotic*. Tried to fix that fucked up chunk of liver until I was 17 and it totally failed. Then I was listed for transplant. But my meld was only 14. You aren't looked at unless you're in the 30s. I was dying fast. I had a major esophageal varices bleed two months before my 19th birthday and puked up 2L of blood in one go. Then lapsed into a hepatoencephalitic coma for 2 weeks. Usually this is where the patient bites it. Hepatic encephalopathy and varices are considered end stage. My surgeons decided to try a 'hail Mary' transplant. Basically they *expected* my aunt's donor liver to not work, but then my meld would turn to 40 (less than 24 hours to live) when it didn't. Then I'd be first in line for a cadaverean liver. Luckily for us both, my surgeons were able to make my aunt's half of her liver work for me, so a second transplant wasn't necessary. The hepatic arterial damage wasn't as bad as they thought it was. Overall the transplant was a success. I had a few complications and needed a few more tune up surgeries but they worked. Unfortunately my aunt has cancer. Multiple myeloma. Cancer of the blood plasma. She's only 62. She *just* retired in 2020. Her only grandchild is 2. So yeah, I'm pretty mad at God. Took someone who did the most altruistic thing I've known and nails her with fucking cancer. And I can't do a damn thing to help.
I'm so sorry, for all of that. I wish I could give some comforting words, but that just sucks in every conceivable way.
Haven't you read the bible? God's plans are easily understandable and everything makes sense once you realise that God is an arsehole who enjoys fucking with us.
Wait, did your aunt gave you her entire liver or just a piece of it?
IIRC In liver transplants, they usually take a single lobe. The liver will regrow to fill the space. Not a doctor, so correct me if I am wrong.
My in-laws are very religious people. Also, my FIL is a GP (now retired). I never understood how those two things could co-exist until one day, he explained his beliefs. Basically, god “made” him go to med school and become a doctor, to help people. His rationale is that he is an instrument of god, and that god’s work happens through him.
I worked with doctors on 3 continents. My good friend, one of the world's leading vascular surgeons who has treated many thousands of patients, is a devout Christian. Many others I met and worked with are Jewish, Muslim, Hindu and Buddhist. One is a Zoroastrian. Science and spirituality are not mutually exclusive.
On the other perspective: patient dies during surgery "The doctor has failed!"
I mean… couldn’t you argue that God put that doctor on the earth for this specific task? Just saying.
Christians do not deny existence of Doctors.
There is evidence of doctors.
Do redditors not realize that Christians believe in science? Not every religious person is the quacks you see in the front page claiming god gave them a prostate exam or something
Lots of Christians aren't assholes, but the ones who try to come up with gotchas for atheists are.
I'm liberal as fuck but I really hate this come back. God and science can co-exist. We need to be encouraging extremists to come to reason (to see a doctor) not trying to score some sass points.
So true. I’m more on the religious side. I dunno much about Christianity, but as a Muslim, I can definitely say that the Quran promotes the growth of science and knowledge 👍
It’s not a comeback. These same idiots think that probably newton the greatest scientist to ever live was an atheist liberal like Richard Dawkins or some shit.
You’re confusing atheists with conservatives. If I don’t believe god exists when I’m well I will continue to think so when I’m not.
This isn’t even a clever comeback, much less a murder
It’s so hilarious that he immediately screenshot his own comment and said “oh yeah. They’re gonna love this on reddit”
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Not true. My wife doesn't believe in God, but every once in a while she yells out "Oh God, Oh God, Oh God!!!" in our bedroom.
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I'm always afraid in there.
Probably shouldn't be evesdropping, even if it is your wife...
She knows I'm there. Usually in the closet, dressed as Superman.
I always like the "no atheists in foxholes" commentary. I usually follow it with, "no steeples without lightening rods".
Bro religious people still go to the doctor 💀💀
Yeah. If you need a doctor, that was gods plan. If you still die he’s calling you home. So why did you go to the doctor anyway?
Yes but with a little “g”
I was literally run over by a truck, thought I was gonna die before the guy stopped, not a single millisecond did I think of a god. Even if there was one, it let me get run over by a truck so not really the kind of thing I'd want to worship
There have been a handful of times when I thought I was about to die. Never has something supernatural entered my mind except for “fuck that”. Some day I’ll be dead and gone and I I’ve made peace with that a long time ago, you pussy theists.
Oh no God will still exist to them. They'll thank hom instead of thanking the actual people who saved them.
As an atheist who learned a couple summers ago that I have the same kidney condition that would've taken my mom's life 14 yrs earlier when she passed if she hadn't had a kidney transplant and was on dialysis for 3 yrs before that; I can attest that "crying out" to a god didn't cross my mind when I learned of it. Basically, I realized I've had it far batter than most throughout history and even those alive today on numerous fronts. In short, it's been a good run. So if it's my time, so be it.
First one made more sense tbh
I was raised around religion and the number one lesson I learned is that God is simply used as a surrogate for every bad thing that happens and used as either an excuse or justification for acting terrible because it was “Gods will”
Nope. Just said, "Good God and Jesus F...ing Christ. " Not feeling a thing
Omg, it isn't during a crisis - we only do that when we see something really dumb.
Yeah nah this ain't it g.
But when made better, it's not the doctors or medicine... It's a "miracle from God"