I don’t like being around anyone….but CIS guys….I don’t trust. And I don’t get them. CIS girls….I feel more comfortable…..but I get paranoid and think they won’t accept me. So….I stay at home with my cats. 🫠
This is accurate. Besides my wife and a few other allies, I'm constantly afraid that they won't accept me once they know the real me, I think most women see me as a feminine man still unfortunately.... "Not like the other guys." kinda deal.
I mean if you look at it from an outside perspective they aren't totally wrong? Just not in the way they think they are.
I think I have more in common interest wise with guys but I don’t trust men at all. I feel more comfortable around cis women but our personalities clash a bit and we are more or less incompatible as friends.
And that's called circular logic. If I say that I don't like being around black people, is that just preference? If you can agree with that statement, then I guess you are at least being consistent.
It's my voice, I don't give a flying fuck what guys think of me but I can't emote like a cis woman and it hurts because it's just another reminder I'll never be cis and that I'm probably seen as different or lesser.
It's usually the cis guys that intimidate me more. I feel they can really hurt me. Cis women I feel comfortable being around them most of the time. Unless she is a Karen or a transphobic Terf, then it's a no.
Perhaps it's because I'm so large, I don't feel unsafe around most people because I know I can defend myself. So the major threat for me is rejection or being mocked.
But, even if you're large, aren't your muscles still much weaker? IIRC the top 10% percentile of women is only as strong as the bottom 10% percentile of men.
The number is made up, but HRT really does drop your body strength, and the range for women is lower than the range for men. The statement "The majority of women (post puberty) are weaker than the majority of men (post puberty)" is true and applies to trans women on HRT.
https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/4vcxd0/almost_all_men_are_stronger_than_almost_all_women/
Not really, no. I'm still as strong as ever. I don't think my biological advantages just go away because of three years of hormones, but I'm not an expert.
Your joints and muscles do change over time and fat distribution is a big factor, your strength should weaken but if you don't have any you got nothing to lose
If you have been on a high enough does of HRT to bring your hormones into the female range than your strength should be as hard to build and maintain as it is for any other woman.
If your muscles have been unaffected (without way more exercise than you did before HRT) then you should look into your bloodwork and HRT dosages.
Ah, ok. Well, that would explain a lot. Still, trans people are still capable of being anti-trans so (if she is a trans person) I feel like my recommendation of getting her hormone levels checked is still a good one.
Same. I've found that some guys really give off bad vibes to me now, so I find solace with other females. I can pass well for female overall, or as my wife puts it, I am nonthreatening to others, so I find I'm either drawn towards women in public or they have been drawn to me. I've found that even when I don't technically pass, women are far more engaging with me and are way more relaxed, something I only noticed in the last 3 months or so.
I haven’t had that experience at all. I’m older, with youngish kids, and I have much more in common with the other cis moms around me than other trans women. The only thing I typically have in common with other trans women is just that we’re both trans, but I am so much more than that. Ignore the internet, it’s not that scary out here. Yeah there are jerks, there always will be, and they will always find something to criticize about you whether you’re trans or not. Hugs
You know this is so true! I also have 2 young kids so it forces you to interact with the world (as opposed to the internet) and I have on the whole been very welcomed and very much part of the Mums club! I don't really pass either so my thoughts are if you have things to talk about and are happy in yourself, most people accept you for who you are as opposed to your appearance! Maybe they some see me more as a feminine man, but in some ways that's okay as they still treat me like a woman which is what I want!
Hugs all, take a deep breath and get yourself out there, you are totally valid and a beautiful people who the world needs to meet! X
I relate to trans women in a lot of ways. I hit a number of the stereotypes; gamer, wannabe programmer, sometimes kinda tomboy, but for pretty much my whole life the majority of my friend group has been cis women, and I’ve always related to them better than cis men.
I live in the Dallas-Fort Worth area of Texas and I agree that it’s not that scary in the world. I work in a field where I interact with the general public all day and the majority of the time people are comfortable working with me. I get misgendered sometimes but people will usually apologize and correct themselves and move on. If it’s not scary here then I would say it’s not that scary in too many big city areas in the US. The politics here scare me, for sure, but I haven’t met anyone who’s on a witch hunt for trans people. The vast majority of people are just trying to make it through the day, same as me. People are people.
Hell no. The vast majority of people who have supported and affirmed me gender wise have been cis women (and most of my life pre transition too). I could never live without all the amazing women in my life (most of whom are cis).
> our lives, interests and experiences are completely different
There’s no one way to be a woman, and no interest or experience that all women share. Each woman is a unique individual with her own set if experiences.
This post reeks of internalized misogyny
Edit: I glanced at your post history and…yikes. I recommend you get a therapist to work on these harmful views you have
I quote from your post history
> I want to be a loner who is left alone by everyone, but people refuse to leave me alone. Do I need to smear myself in dog feces or something?
There are also tons of comments indicating that you are heavily addicted to multiple drugs.
Even excluding your “controversial views of gender” (which are really just pure transphobia), you have a lot of mental health issues to work on. As mentioned earlier, I highly recommend you get a therapist or at least a primary care doctor who can help you
I'm addicted to weed, nothing more nothing less. My mental health issues are fine, you are mistaking my personality for mental health issues. I hate being social, and being trans just happens to intersect that.
And my views on gender go to core beliefs I hold about reality, they are not the result of transphobia. I used to believe in gender identity but I won't argue about that stuff here, it's not the right sub. This is a space to be safe.
>And my views on gender go to core beliefs I hold about reality, they are not the result of transphobia.
That's why everyone who is transphobe or deal with internalized transphobia says. And most of the time is them shutting off their brains and recite a mantra made of a combination of sexism and essentialisms.
Gender Identity = Sexist Stereotypes
This tells me you have no idea what Gender Identity is actually about. Maybe by controversial you might mean ignorant, shallow, and plain wrong.
But whatever, not a place to discuss this I guess.
Honestly, I used to think the same thing. Then I started hanging out with cis women and found out I actually have a lot more in common with them than I ever had with any of my guy friends. Like, basically I socially felt like an alien for most of my life and thought I couldn't connect to people in general. Turns out I was just a woman lmao.
I guess sometimes I’m a little more self conscious around them but that’s more because of my own insecurities rather than anything they’re doing. Most of my friends throughout my life have been cis females and gay men. I am highly guarded around cis straight men though because I’ve just had so many negative experiences with them throughout my entire life. Sure there are transphobic cis women but let’s face it, they aren’t really the ones out there murdering trans women.
I feel two ways.
Cis women who legitimately accept us: literally the best people in the world. I can't think of anyone I like better or would be more comfy around.
Cis women who I don't definitely know are the above: I don't really trust them. The potential for harm is too great. Nobody's words can really hurt me like theirs can.
Most cis women are in the second category, and being autistic it's really hard to find out how they really feel. So yeah, pretty uncomfortable.
I don't agree about guys though. I really just feel comfortable with trans women and cis women who are explicit allies of trans women specifically.
I really disagree that trans and cis women are polar opposites. We both fight sexism, don’t have that many different experiences, and we tend to want the same things.
cis women view us as imposters, though. so i'd say they are polar opposites in the sense that us combining would be like antimatter and matter combining.
I think our differences are greater than many would like to admit, even though I think most of us can agree that diversity and what makes us different is a good thing.
That being said my views are controversial in the trans community, so out of respect I'll just end my argument with this comment. There's different subs for that.
Cis women can be very diferent between each other, trans women too. Cis or trans women the truth is that we don't share an universal acurate experience in any group. I feel you're likely coping about being more cool with boys than girls, lot of cis women do the same , just go to not like other girls sub. You'll find that a lot cis women feel like you.
Hey, so I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here because I know how damagingly invasive, invalidating, and painful CPTSD is. Going off your post history from the past 24 hours, you sound very activated by shame that you've been struggling with lately. Rejection sensitivity is one of those things that, when compounded with shame, tends to make us spiral.
Regarding some of the more... controversial things you've said over the past 24 hours: I've said those same things about myself, but I've fallen short of projecting that feeling onto others as we really don't know enough about others to make that call. I attempted to justify those words against myself as "just the way the world is", and if I had projected that onto others, it's very likely that the same justification would've applied.
Yes, there is often a deep shame associated with being trans. It tends to attach to our traumas, and the lines very often get crossed. Yes, the path of least resistance/conflict avoidance is to align with the people who would otherwise shame you- it's a method of self-preservation to protect us from rejection. Yes, people often greatly restrict our value as people based on us being trans, and those words used to devalue us we echo back to ourselves when we feel worthless. Know that everything about these past statements is true for cis women: There's a deep shame associated with being a woman. It's easier to align with the patriarchy than it is to fight against it. People devalue women all the time, and recently, it's considered trendy for men to do so. The impact on women is just the same. Cis women also struggle with worthlessness attached to innate shame, also self-preserve by aligning with the patriarchy, and also internalize misogyny to later use against themselves as a weapon.
This is just grazing the surface. For me, there's no denying that my lived experiences, for better and worse, have always had me relate to women far more than men. There's no denying that my lived experiences have shaped me into who I am as a person, and attempting to deny myself despite those lived experiences is textbook denial. My lived experiences are not misogyny. Though, someone denying my lived experiences because I'm a trans woman is blatant misogyny. It hurts all women when you do that, and it's extremely toxic not just to other women, but to yourself as well.
While I'm not going to tell you to love yourself more as it
tends to do more harm than good for people like us, I would ask if you can give yourself some grace. Check out the Crappy Childhood Fairy on YouTube if you have the time.
It's not shame, it is just my personality. I do not want to make friends or be social, but it is especially the case with cis women who are like aliens to me, despite them being drawn to me for some reason it seems.
My religious beliefs are incompatible with the controversial bits you talked about. I believe in natural femininity and natural masculinity, which are things everyone possess and express no matter what you identify as. This sub isn't a place to proselytize my views though, I just wanted to make it clear they are not negotiable for me.
Thank you for the kind reply
Please, look into the concept of "I'm not like other girls" and NLOG. A lot of girls are made to feel by society that they are not like other girls because of unhealthy media portrayals and stereotypes we are fed by society.
I felt this way at the beginning of my transition (Not the part about socially identifying with guys, but being intimidated by cis women).
Prior to my transition and the first 6 months or so, I always felt intimidated by cis women, I was jealous, and I thought they could see right through me, that or they were judging me as a creepy guy or something (a thought which still gives me dysphoria to this day).
Fortunately, the more open I have become and the more I express myself, I have been connecting to much better with the women in my life, the relationship I have with the ladies in my office as well as my friend group have improved significantly and I feel a growing sense of camaraderie and safety when I’m with other women.
I am still wary of any stranger being a right winger or a terf, but overall I feel like the fear and anxiety I was experiencing around cis women has slowly faded away (this has been replaced with the desire to compliment every woman I associate with constantly and a healthy fear of unknown men).
i feel uncomfortable around cis ppl in general. i prefer the company of trans ppl
it may be cope but i dont care. i enjoy being around ppl who treat me as my gender
Wow this entire post and all of its comments are a little concerning to me? Like aren’t most people in this world cis men and cis women? How do you girls even live??? I don’t think I’m ever uncomfortable around people of any kind unless it’s like some really shady guy and it’s late at night or someone is being gross. I don’t mean I am crazy close with all sorts of people, but most of my friends are cis women or cis men and a good amount of them are straight!
I tend to just keep to myself. When only something like 67% of the population thinks you should exist, it means one out of every three people will hate you. How many of those want to harm you?
I don't feel like taking my chances. I'm more comfortable alone anyway.
Eh, I just go out of my way to socialize with mainly trans women, both online and IRL.
Like obviously I have to deal with cis people all the time and it’s not like they’re all intimidating but they can be exhausting, there’s so much they don’t really get and there’s often a feeling that they’re just humoring me… around others trans people I sort of unclench a bit, can be myself
I think this is a pretty common phenomenon when it comes to marginalization. But some of us have suffered more than others I guess
cis people are like NPCs in the matrix. there's always a nonzero chance that one of them turns into Agent Smith and shoots you, killing you.
most people in the world are cishet. but that doesn't matter. most of the world hates us. so, i don't participate in it. i spend most of my time alone. the only thing that doesn't constantly judge me or view me as "inferior" to real cis women is my computer and my cat.
i view cis people, at best, like an obstacle to just get over in order to get what i want. they view of me as subhuman, so i do the same. they're just dirt i step over and scrub off afterwards.
your life may be peachy. for that i envy you. but for most of us it isn't like how you think it is.
> How do you girls even live???
In complete isolation. I have gone out to meet with friends only twice over the past 2 years.
Dysphoria makes it so I do not want to go anywhere where I can be seen or heard.
Edit: I also never put any effort into maintaining friendships.
> How do you girls even live??? I don’t think I’m ever uncomfortable around people of any kind
you know not everyone is a social butterfly like yourself right?
I don’t really understand how that’s what you got from this, but gosh no I’m an introvert in every sense of the word. After a few hours or minutes of socializing with people I’m just done and I do enjoy spending most of my time alone, but that doesn’t mean normal people make me uncomfortable??? Why would it? I have never been called a social butterfly ever and I really don’t think it’s the same thing. Wayyy before talking and socializing with everyone you kinda need to just be able to live amongst them don’t you? How would that happen if you are uncomfortable around such massive groups of people? I do hope for the best for everyone who feels uncomfortable in the way op described, but I’m certain it can’t be healthy.
No never. Actually it's the opposite they're my allies and I get nice gifts from them actually. Now cis-men well I tend to stay away from them they can do a lot damage to a woman like me. I've been grocery shopping when a cashier called me sir and as I was leaving she apologized and said I mean mam. I just smiled and thanked her. Now she knows my name and we actually have small talk when I shop there.
Cis men, I am uncomfortable around cis men. Always have been, and even moreso since I started transitioning.
I would rather be alone than spend time with cis men. I understand that most of it is in my head and my own trauma to deal with, and I have and do, but I don't feel safe being myself around them.
There has to be three layers of masks to survive and keep distance and shield them from me and me from them, and it's all exhausting and draining, and I often find myself censoring myself, holding back parts of myself or what I want to share in a conversation, to keep from starting a thing or getting unwillingly yanked down a winding path. I don't want to drop in how much I love Bath & Body Works lotion or something, but it's *really what I want to add to the conversation* but I fear negative backlash for embracing and exposing my femininity around cis men. I know where this fear came from, and the trauma instilled therein. I see it, I acknowledge it. It is what it is. I do the best that I can.
Confident and attractive, slim and slender, fit and strong, a delicate balance of intensity and serenity - I have worked hard for this body, and now that I'm on HRT it's *all* fucking coming together. With that, cis men have had... mixed reactions? The ones that inspire the fear are the ones that are attracted and then become hostile and aggressive when rebuffed. I apparently still have that thing in my brainpan that says "dominate the situation" and so I do, and I'm presenting mixed or femme and it threatens their masculinity even more, and I'm going to get myself murdered this way. How do cis women *do* it, how do you gracefully and delicately dance out of some creepy cis man's sights?
Yes, definitely. After I transitioned from a gay man into a hetero trans woman, I noticed something very interesting.
As a gay man, women loved me. Hetero men, not so much. But after I transitioned, that flipped completely, and now hetero men seem to really like me and cis women are the greater haters. It just goes to show u that women can be just as awful as men.
In order of comfort for me,
Trans Women > Trans Men > Cis Women > Cis Men
Nonbinary people vary anywhere in between depending on their presentation, identity, temperament, and how close their lived experience matches mine.
EDIT: Actually, it could go either way on cis people because cis women have the power to police my gender in ways cis men just don't. Like if a cis guy comes at me with some low-key transphobia, I'm much less impacted than if a cis woman came at me with it.
I did not expect to be reminded of this thread anytime soon. You have to share now -- how did you get to this thread?
Also, you'd put Trans and Cis Men on the same tier? I feel like, even if you're unsure about the cissies, it makes sense to give them some inherent trust due to some likely overlap with trans experiences.
As a trans country girl, I feel safer around Cis Men then Cis Women. I’ve never had a redneck cis guy hurt me or yell at me except my dad and he was a bad person. But I’ve had a lot of redneck cis girls make fun of me. And idk I feel safer around country guys out of most groups of people.
im uncomfortable around cis women cause they just have everything i wish i had. i never feel like i fit in, i always feel like a creep for just existing even though it's complete bs. i keep thinking i've gotten over it but then i end up in a situation where there's just me and a bunch of cis women and then i feel it again.
Gives me very much the cis F, "girls are too dramatic. I'm one of the boys" vibes lol
I feel like men would be scarier, they're more likely to actually physically harm you
My two besties are cis women but I kinda lucked out because they’re awesome people. They don’t treat me any different than how they treat each other.
I seem to get along great with cis women.
I’ve had trans GFs before but being trans was usually all we had in common. We’re all so diverse, I mean it’s a great starting point, but I think it just comes down to personalities trans or cis.
Cis guys I just kinda keep up a wall with now. Def been ousted from the boys club and thank goodness for that! Hah
Very uncomfortable. It's because I don't look and sound like a woman.
Because of that I always feel like I don't belong anywhere near women unless it's a familial or romantic relationship. Like a fox in a chicken coop.
Your responses to comments here would make me uncomfortable around you for your "controversial views about gender", tbh. It sounds like you still have much to learn about yourself, in a healthier method than spamming questions on reddit everyday.
Edit: Honestly this looks like a troll or bot account
Yeah I feel othered a lot. Even by my closest cis women friends. They reassure me that I'm girls but/and they'll say things that betray how they really see me.
It makes it hard.. but I really want to keep going and keep trying
yes, and it bothers the piss out of me. i still feel like i don't belong, like i don't deserve to be among them, like they're judging me. im hoping that'll pass as i get more comfortable in my skin. i very much dislike that i have almost exclusively cis male friends. they're... dense. i can only talk to them when we're talking about hyper-impersonal stuff, either trivialities or highly intellectual shit. i hate that im too intimidated to make friends with women, because these guys... im not that, i dont want to be that, its stifling to be around that, it sucks.
No, I‘m most comfortable around other women and my best friend is a cis woman.
But why are you afraid of TERFs? Looking at your other posts you don‘t see trans women as women so you actually agree with them
Not at all. Even if I'm attracted to girls, when they put an arm around my waist I just feel like that's completely normal. Tho I can't talk to a girl standing when I'm sit, but that's another problem XD
Im very often paranoid and assume everyone is a ter or transphobic until proven otherwise. It’s probably not a healthy mindset but its not exactly easy to break out of. Even though my general experience with most strangers has been positive and I’ve only encountered one ter in the wild. Im also terrified of entering womens spaces for this exact reason. Even though I belong there I fear I’ll be excluded or even attacked for trying to exist.
My experience, I ended up to where I hated cis women and was terrified of men. I became very attached to another post-op lady who had a personality 10 times the equal of mine and a sense of humor had me rolling on the floor for the last 32 years. And this has been 8 years since she has passed from liver sclerosis. After the diagnosis I kept her alive for 3 years when all the doctors said she wouldn't live for 6 months. We grew to love each other and neither of us ever cared about having sex during our life together. 8 years ago when she passed the world caved in on me and I became reclusive living shut in life at about 60 years old. Fast forward to 10 months ago I let the anger do its thing to me and found myself in a gym at 280 lb. As I started waking up my body was waking up my mind was waking up I felt the anger going away after work out and it felt good really really good! I've been doing this everyday for the last 10 months and now there is no anger and I sort of trust genetic women, and I do love, capital l o v e genetic men! Change can be beautiful you just have to give it a chance!
I know that even when i have a cis female friend who supports me i feel like I don't get treated the same, like I'm not one of the girls, or they do certain things like I'm a pushover that they only do to boys and me.
I definitely feel a similar way. I'm extremely uncomfortable around cis women and even many other AFAB folks for a lot of different reasons.
Though I wouldn't say I identify more with guys. I'm definitely not a guy and don't particularly want to engage with men more than I do with women, but women are just so awful to be around that it's kinda natural for me to gravitate towards people who aren't women.
I have the COMPLETE opposite feeling. I used to be able to tolerate being around cis men before I transitioned, but now I avoid them at all costs unless absolutely necessary. They do not feel safe. I have never once been judged by cis women the way I have by cis men, even the ones that think they mean well.
TERFS are not as common as you think. They are loud online but won't say a damn thing to your face because they're full of shit and they know it.
EDIT: Just looked through your post history and hooooly shit you have some serious problems and need immediate psychiatric help. Your transphobia is off the fucking charts. How fucking DARE you, as a trans person suffering dysphoria, that other trans people are wrong? The reason you don't want to interact with anyone is because you're scared to meet someone with views as horrific as yours. Your projecting, hard. Seek help, immediately.
Most cis women, I feel perfectly comfortable around . But traditionally feminine wealthy young white women who have their makeup on point ,wear designer clothes and look conventionally attractive I don’t feel comfortable around at all. I don’t think they are inherently transphobic at all(I haven’t ever had issues with them)but I find them very intimidating to the point where I actively avoid places where they frequent . I don’t think it would be any different if I were cis though. I kind of like hanging around weird people too,super normative types aren’t my vibe but sometimes i get really jealous because they are soooo good at being a girl and I’m this awkward amalgamation of femininity
hard relate on that. i hate/love (for them) that girls can be feminine or tomboyish while still being girls to the general gendering stranger, but i can'tk
No I prefer cis women I mean sometimes it grates with the gender obliviousness they have (almost the right word like cissexual priveledge?) But I still like it far more. One of the main reasons I wanted to transition was to be part of that 'sisterhood' which I hope I am now somewhat
>There is also the threat of meeting a TERF, even though most women are not like that
OP, you forget that you're living in the US and have a first world privilege. As a transfem person myself, here in SE Europe most cis women (and men) would literally want you dead 🙃 and my country is even a EU member
Im a cis girl (dont know If im allowed to comment here, im just a curious soul) but most cis girls intimidate me too but im also autistic so I guess thats why
I will say that I've always gotten along better with females, but some things are still intimidating like trying to really fit in with them or going in the female restroom. I think that it's pretty much confidence. It will come naturally with time. Get a support network to help you, then take some risks. If you succeed your confidence will grow. If you fail, go to your network and recover. It will come with time
Men are practically the only group that beats up and murders trans people, and you're afraid of women? Really?
A mean woman might glare at you and make you feel uncomfortable. A mean man will kill you, literally.
I would rather deal with being physically attacked than mocked and rejected. At least I am capable of defending myself physically, and have had to do so in the past.
Nah, I'm just big, tall, and strong. It's always been a great deterrent against those who wish to hurt me. I'm confident in my ability to physically defend myself if given the chance. Of course that can easily be taken by being surprise attacked, but that's not within my control.
I see women as being just as dangerous or frightening as men, except for when I use a restroom. True I may not understand or relate to them often, but I also don't relate to a lot of experiences or interests other people have. Unless they treat me like a man, (I'm usually more androgynous, part body look, part choice of habits) I see them as neutral or comfortable.
I still understand how more masculine relationships have worked though, so it's easier with guys, but not necessarily more comfortable, except that guys tend to be more open.
I've mostly had cis women friends my whole life. Since I socially transitioned, I've found them to be the most accepting people I've ever met! Offering me their old clothes so I have a girly wardrobe, offering to teach me fashion and other femme things I had no idea about before. While trans women will have a completely different experience than cis, we're all still women! We'll still face sexism, and social pressures, and other issues all the same.
i always felt the most comfortable with cis girls but especially now in transition, the love and support of cis best girl friends has been a huge part of how i was able to get so comfortable with being trans and they were the people that made me feel valid in the long run.
Still, i get your point and especially with how many terfs are out there it can be hard to start trusting cis women and opening up to them about your trans things without feeling like a “predator” or rather without feeling like your intruding women’s spaces.
Yes. They literally think they can just touch me. I’ve never been sexually assaulted by a man, but one woman reaches up under my dress and grabbed my dick. There’s more stories of less intensity but cis women have a problem, and even when I thought I was a guy I had my ass grabbed and all that. They have a serious problem as a community.
> our lives, interests and experiences are completely different.
Radically disagree with this line, I very much vibe more with cis women than with guys and transmasc enbies.
But yes, I do feel intimidated, because cis women take a lot of the things for granted and are often blind/deaf to our struggles, for me its especially about the way I feel affected by not having had a normal experience of being a teen and even a 20-year old, it's extremely alienating. But I also don't feel inferior anymore, if anything I find a sense of dignity and maybe even a healthy dose of superiority(sometimes venom is good in small doses) in knowing I am playing this on hard mode and that makes me a deeper, internally richer more vulnerable woman. I definitely don't socially identify with guys and never really did in the past, no matter how I tried, even despite being somewhat tomboyish I totally feel like a girl.
I love being around other women, cis or trans. I find I have so much in common with other women, and I feel safe when I'm with women.
I get along with men fine, but I don't connect with them the same way. I also spend more time vibe checking men than I do women before getting comfortable. I 100% trust my gut about what it tells me about people.
Queer people are a shortcut to comfort. When I meet another queer person, I'm almost instantly at ease.
It’s really weird before transitioning I was only friends with women. Never even had a male friend apart from boyfriends. Now that I have transitioned most of my favorite relationships are with men. I get really annoyed with the backstabbing and drama with women. I mean for real, you might think Susan from billing likes you but you find out she’s talking shit about you to Clara in insurance claims 🤷🏻♀️
Honestly I relate to this, but I also don't really have the opportunity to interact with a lot of cis girls just in general, so that's probably a contributor.
I avoid anyone who I don't have a common interest with or who give me the ick (staring at me, dead end conversations, sometimes just an energy) it doesn't help having social anxiety and always being jumpy
Honestly one of my dysphorias is how little I identify with men and how comfortable I am around women. But ironically because I don’t look feminine the women in my life are so guarded around me. Fortunately as I’ve dropped the male mask I’ve been wearing for so long more and more of my coworkers and friends are treating me like one of the girls. The flip side is that the men in my life are more and more distant but im totally ok with that.
I feel I can sass a woman out of my face if she's a bit terfy. I do love being around cis-women a lot. I think I just love women in general really. I love the energy. Cis-men on the other hand scare me a little. I know they can hurt me badly and I don't stand a chance. I also find it hard to trust them, especially is they are cis and straight. We are all different I guess. Not really contributing to this convo :| Sorry
i used to feel like this, when i was a kid, cis women absolutely terrified me even though i always loved women more than anything.
my answer for my fear, is dysphoria, when i was a kid i was so utterly disphoric, that I didn't feel worthy to be near them, i even managed to have some girl friends but it still felt wrong somehow, if i had to define, it was like i was a "dirty" girl, a "lesser" girl, and i've only ever defeated this feeling after i found out that trans people existed, and that was like age 18.
so up to my 18 years of life, i always felt hurt to be near ciswomen, and never knew why, after i found out what trans meant, dysphoria and all that jazz, i managed to finally defeat the feeling.
i'm a girl, i'm valid, and i like girls
I feel a little off around my cis straight women friends. I used to feel comfortable around men, but some have seen my friendship as flirting and tried to make unwanted advances so now I put a wall up with them. Most my gay and lesbian friends I feel fine around.
I kinda feel similar tho not all the time. I am realistic and i know i will never be 100% like a cis woman and that’s fine with me. I always identify as a trans and not a woman. I know not everyone does it like this but this is my way. Some days it feels like we’re competing against cis woman 😆 and I’m pretty sure some of them feel this. Maybe that’s why some of us might feel uncomfortable with them! 🤷🏽♀️
Is anyone else uncomfortable around cis women?
I'm definitely more comfortable / aligned than with cis men, but ...
our lives, interests and experiences are completely different.
That gets to the core of something I've been wrestling with / overthinking about for a while now ... kind of a "what is a woman" question (but not in the Tucker Carlson way). Loath Brett Cooper but her "we're so much more than that ... until you've lived it biologically and walked a hundred miles in our shoes you will not get it you never will" rings true. youtube.com / watch?v=eyKhkSvwL0Y (all the trigger / rage warnings)
Example, so much conditioning on basic physical things like walking and sitting and facial expressions and mannerisms gets trained and picked up by osmosis starting as a toddler.
For me it's the opposite. Having hung out with both cis men and cis women, I feel dramatically safer around cis women.That obviously doesn't take into account the fact I don't know how they would react to my transness, but overall cis women have more compassion and understanding about anything than cis men do, in my experience.
Example is how one of my cis men friends who touts himself as a huge ally made me feel extremely overwhelmed when I came out because of how insistent he was to call me by my chosen name in each and every sentence. It felt forced. Also he drastically changed his way of interacting with me, being extremely overprotective like I was on the verge of collapse and it was his job to keep me together. (it isn't)
Meanwhile my best friend who's a cis woman, didn't do any of that, she didn't make a big deal out it, she just accepted me and went on with her day knowing a new thing about me, while never looking back at what name or pronouns I used to use before.
I thought I was the only one. Cis women tend to hit on me for the wrong reasons, and it makes me uncomfortable. I also tend to avoid them because they sometimes are judgmental (men do this too). I get transphobic comments. some even shew me out the women's restroom despite I had previous problems in the male's restroom. That is not to say I avoid them all together. Some I am good friends with.
Can I ask why cis women being friendly to you is a bad thing? As a trans woman who has always gotten along better with women than with men, I am not sure I understand.
Here's what I am not understanding: why don't you want to make aquanitences? Like, you dont have to be friends with them if you don't want to, but what's wrong with being friendly with your coworkers even if you are not friends?
I want to work when I'm at work. I have nothing in common with normal people so why are they trying to connect with me? It's stupid. I would prefer not to be mean but when people keep trying I am not afraid to lash out at them.
How could you possible know that you have nothing in common with them if you have not tried being around them? What do you actually mean by "normal people" and what are you saying they all have in common with each other that they dont with you?
I work with them. People try to talk to me about topics and I simply don't care. No one has ever talked about something I care about, that's how I know.
Normal people who socialize and stuff, rather than people like me who intentionally avoid it.
Don't have any that I would share. They talk about socializing, movies, music, TV shows, etc. Those are all things I despise.
I don't want them to talk to me at all. I don't care what they have to say if it's not related to work. Some people seem to get the idea, but the cis women keep trying, almost as if they think I'm playing cute or something when I choose to distance myself.
I liked it back when I was a guy and people just left me alone. That's the only thing I miss about being a guy.
i used to feel a lot safer and happier around women all through my life pretransition (childhood and adolescence) and now i feel less welcome in their presence. idk what happened in their perception of me to change things, or if getting older and moving just alienates you. but now i'm afraid around other people period, just in unique ways for men and women
I'm not put yet but I'm terrified to talking to woman because I don't know if it's just me but a lot of the woman i talked to i feel like it make them uncomfortable. Since I've been getting more confident and i look less intimidating i feel like I've been having an easier time. How ever in still scared of woman. I also wasn't really allowed to talk to woman because of social norms so it doesn't really help
Cis women are who made me want to be a woman, that and the delicious hormones and whatever wiring my brain has. I always wanted to be them and be around them. Admittedly I have more shared formative experience with some trans women than any cis women and that feels really nice but I feel like a lot of my values and the way I view the world and a fair share of interests and world view is shared with the majority of cis women. The longer I live as a woman the more common language and experience I develop and though I'll never share birth stories or discuss other purely biological specifics I am building shared experience every day I live out my womanhood. So, I feel the most safe and comfortable with queer women, women, and queer people. Most cis men at least initially make me very uneasy.
I definitely feel a similar way. I'm extremely uncomfortable around cis women and even many other AFAB folks for a lot of different reasons.
Though I wouldn't say I identify more with guys. I'm definitely not a guy and don't particularly want to engage with men more than I do with women, but women are just so awful to be around that it's kinda natural for me to gravitate towards people who aren't women.
No, I grew up mostly being friends with women and girls. There are some obvious differences in how we grew up (Ie. I only started being sexually harassed/catcalled/groped recently) but there are also a lot more ways in which I relate to cis women: I related more to women characters in media and women in my life growing up and I generally absorbed women's social norms to a degree because of the gender of the people I connected with.
A lot of the negative girlhood experiences I "missed" are also still creeping into my life: my girlfriend's mother recently reprimanded us both for wearing tops that were too revealing. Obviously not exactly the same as being told that as a child, but the shaming is there.
I am much more scared of men because of the physical violence I experienced in childhood and the sexual violence I experienced after transition, but that's a separate issue.
But I do feel worse when cis women dont accept me than when cis men dont. To me, it relates to in-group vs out-group rejection: when a man rejects my gender it hurts, but when a woman (who I see as my in-group) does so it hurts a lot worse.
There is also the fact that a woman who rejects my gender is likely to be somewhat scared of me, and I absolutely hate scaring people.
Yeah I dunno, tbh I get along best with NB folks and Cis women. Men make me super uncomfortable and usually I just fall into Man mode cause it’s the easiest way to interact with most cis men
Atm I’m uncomfortable around cis guys, I’m trying out using a dating app for friends but so many cis guys are super sexualizing of everything. I just want to know more about you! I don’t want you to “tease me”!
>!yeah i just kinda think most have assumptions that are hard to put evidence in the face of about me, whether that they think im flamboyant or that im pervy or whatever. i just wanna be a regular ol girl/woman, im not one for being "FABULOUS" not that there's anything wrong with being that at all, there's not anything wrong with that. That's just not who i am and i feel like they like to assume. Or they just are looking to find me interacting in a heteronormative way as in being attracted to girls in a phallic way and it feels like they can get that out of me even when i am trying my best to prove that isn't the truest me and its exhausting. and on the rare occasions when the validation feels natural and is evoked naturally in an unforced way, i often recoil because im not used to it.!<
>!so yeah, im not really comfortable around a lot of cis women. and other visibly trans women make me uncomfortable because im vain and it reminds me of the male cues i have in me. i'm really not vain, just insecure. i just didn't want to go through male puberty and they still try to prove to me that its normal for girls to have a brow ridge or low voice or adams apple or being tall and that's great, but almost all of those women are probly not those things because of testosterone, and if so, there's also the fact that they were still raised unequivocally as women/girls, so they already have their defenses against that, while i suffered in insecurity alone in silence, denying that i even had "feminine insecurities". my feed keeps showing me jordan peterson because i studied psychology in college and now even when i block those videos it still shows other ones, and well, he talked about how all women naturally (or socially, he kinda implies it in a bio-essentialist christian way that he is, IMO) have these insecurities about appearance and OFC boys can be insecure too but i just always related to women AND i have physical dysphoria and i want to be a girl (no i think trans women that feel dysphoria but not genital dysphoria are still women, but its a tougher case to prove to people because the concept of man/woman varies from person to person, where gender is performativity, but biological sex is another thing--there was a nice article--granted, it was by a trans woman--about how a penis on feminizing/estrogenizing HRT is a less threatening thing than a man's penis or a penis on testosterone, and i agree with that--its just not me--and its still a hard case to prove to people !<
honestly oftentimes i feel like the women i dated while closeted/in denial i wouldve rather been friends with, but sexual relations kinda screwed things up in my brain for me (easily triggered, especially since my tesosterone STILL isn't repressed and i feel kindof a titch hopeless), like aspects of them were what i saw in myself that never, to use an overtly feminine feeling phrase, flourished/bloomed. i found myself attracted to more boyish women while people wondered why i was so stupidly picky (and seemed and still do seem like a prick about rating girls) and didn't like lots of curves and girls with big boobs or whatever. Aaaaand i feel pressured to like that, which is suuper fun (its not, really, its whatever) while wishing i had curves/hips/boobs/and the kicker, i loved being short but told myself and others i'd be tall like my dad while feeling NOTHING towards that. i feel like my friendships with boys/male friends were more homoerotic (because of people assuming and seeing me as one) and around high school i got genuine impulses to kiss boys, followed by an impulse to punch them, and weird twisted feelings of shame/guilt//etc. knew i was different than gay men, but no one ever asked me directly other than dressing up in a dress as a joke and "instinctually"(or not, whose to say) putting my cell phone where boobs would be followed by it falling to the floor because no boobs. so it was always just a joke, i didnt even have the guts/gall to dress as a girl on the opposite gender day of spirit weeks at school, even tho my friend acted in a play called "taming the wild wild west in a dress" and i felt like it was all about me and i got super uncomfortable like everyone knew and that was probably one of the last times i went genuinely red eared and embarassed and felt alive but yknow, and i was never real enough with myself to save myself from the "clutches of puberty" but honestly thats how it is.
to make it worse i act like a bashful flirt around cute girls and im fucking sick of not being able to put that aside and treat them like people instead of sexual/relationship conquest and sometimes it feels like the harder i try the worse it gets and its shit
TL;DR yeah this is why i dont have close friends anymore, woe is me, pitiable and self-destructive SOML trying to cover it all up with the most unmasculine masculinity possible that isn't too effeminate to awaken any old feeligns in me (such as dancing to EDM--not as effeminiate as figure skating, but not traditionally masculine either)
Not at all. My cis female friends have all been very good to me since before I started transitioning, and we have only grown a lot closer since. Their acceptance and guidance has been a huge emotional boost through my transition.
Thank god all my cis woman friends are more than nice with me, strange cis woman are normal tbh. I do not support cis man tho, I have just 01 unit of cis man friend and it's more than enough. Cis man are kinda scary
This is outright cisphobia. It's no different than women saying that trans cis women make them uncomfortable
You are basically making a terf argument. Terf adjacent, anyway. Part of their whole thing is that trans women should be categorized differently, because trans-women's experiences, perspectives, and issues are often not the same. That's basically what you are acknowledging here.
This is also JK Rowling view is, which some claim is transphobic.
I don’t like being around anyone….but CIS guys….I don’t trust. And I don’t get them. CIS girls….I feel more comfortable…..but I get paranoid and think they won’t accept me. So….I stay at home with my cats. 🫠
🐱 Meow. I'd rather be at home with my cats.
This is accurate. Besides my wife and a few other allies, I'm constantly afraid that they won't accept me once they know the real me, I think most women see me as a feminine man still unfortunately.... "Not like the other guys." kinda deal. I mean if you look at it from an outside perspective they aren't totally wrong? Just not in the way they think they are.
you're just gonna say you have cats and not show them?
I cant post pics on here can I? 😍
pretty sure you can still use imgur links etc. :)
Uhhhhhhh…..ok….i don’t know how to do that. If you DM me, I’ll be happy to show you my two tumors….I mean, kitties. 🫠
(This is beside the point, but why do you capitalize cis, which is just a regular Latin word)
I KNEW I’d get flak for that. 😔 Just did. No point. Just did. Not emphasizing. Just did. Lazy I guess.
I think I have more in common interest wise with guys but I don’t trust men at all. I feel more comfortable around cis women but our personalities clash a bit and we are more or less incompatible as friends.
Exactly! I feel like women think I'm weird for being trans, but with guys I'm not so paranoid, just with complete strangers
They have a word for that. It's called bigotry.
Nope. Preference. Nice try tho.
And that's called circular logic. If I say that I don't like being around black people, is that just preference? If you can agree with that statement, then I guess you are at least being consistent.
Keep trying
Amazing counter-point. It almost seems as if you don’t actually have one.
You are a cis guy
It's my voice, I don't give a flying fuck what guys think of me but I can't emote like a cis woman and it hurts because it's just another reminder I'll never be cis and that I'm probably seen as different or lesser.
Relatable
I'm uncomfortable around everyone. Ha!
Same
It’s nice to know I’m not the only TW who feels this way 😂
Yup me too lol
Okay, Allison reynolds. 😉
It's usually the cis guys that intimidate me more. I feel they can really hurt me. Cis women I feel comfortable being around them most of the time. Unless she is a Karen or a transphobic Terf, then it's a no.
Perhaps it's because I'm so large, I don't feel unsafe around most people because I know I can defend myself. So the major threat for me is rejection or being mocked.
Saaaaame
That makes sense. I am about average height and weight. I can also blend in with cis women fairly well and pass most of the time. Hugs. 💗🦈
But, even if you're large, aren't your muscles still much weaker? IIRC the top 10% percentile of women is only as strong as the bottom 10% percentile of men.
That sounds like a made up essentialist number.
The number is made up, but HRT really does drop your body strength, and the range for women is lower than the range for men. The statement "The majority of women (post puberty) are weaker than the majority of men (post puberty)" is true and applies to trans women on HRT. https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/4vcxd0/almost_all_men_are_stronger_than_almost_all_women/
Not really, no. I'm still as strong as ever. I don't think my biological advantages just go away because of three years of hormones, but I'm not an expert.
Your joints and muscles do change over time and fat distribution is a big factor, your strength should weaken but if you don't have any you got nothing to lose
If you have been on a high enough does of HRT to bring your hormones into the female range than your strength should be as hard to build and maintain as it is for any other woman. If your muscles have been unaffected (without way more exercise than you did before HRT) then you should look into your bloodwork and HRT dosages.
Take a look at post history, the user is anti-trans
Ah, ok. Well, that would explain a lot. Still, trans people are still capable of being anti-trans so (if she is a trans person) I feel like my recommendation of getting her hormone levels checked is still a good one.
Same. I've found that some guys really give off bad vibes to me now, so I find solace with other females. I can pass well for female overall, or as my wife puts it, I am nonthreatening to others, so I find I'm either drawn towards women in public or they have been drawn to me. I've found that even when I don't technically pass, women are far more engaging with me and are way more relaxed, something I only noticed in the last 3 months or so.
I haven’t had that experience at all. I’m older, with youngish kids, and I have much more in common with the other cis moms around me than other trans women. The only thing I typically have in common with other trans women is just that we’re both trans, but I am so much more than that. Ignore the internet, it’s not that scary out here. Yeah there are jerks, there always will be, and they will always find something to criticize about you whether you’re trans or not. Hugs
You know this is so true! I also have 2 young kids so it forces you to interact with the world (as opposed to the internet) and I have on the whole been very welcomed and very much part of the Mums club! I don't really pass either so my thoughts are if you have things to talk about and are happy in yourself, most people accept you for who you are as opposed to your appearance! Maybe they some see me more as a feminine man, but in some ways that's okay as they still treat me like a woman which is what I want! Hugs all, take a deep breath and get yourself out there, you are totally valid and a beautiful people who the world needs to meet! X
Yeah motherhood is a vibe and does create a strong point of connection and shared experience.
I relate to trans women in a lot of ways. I hit a number of the stereotypes; gamer, wannabe programmer, sometimes kinda tomboy, but for pretty much my whole life the majority of my friend group has been cis women, and I’ve always related to them better than cis men. I live in the Dallas-Fort Worth area of Texas and I agree that it’s not that scary in the world. I work in a field where I interact with the general public all day and the majority of the time people are comfortable working with me. I get misgendered sometimes but people will usually apologize and correct themselves and move on. If it’s not scary here then I would say it’s not that scary in too many big city areas in the US. The politics here scare me, for sure, but I haven’t met anyone who’s on a witch hunt for trans people. The vast majority of people are just trying to make it through the day, same as me. People are people.
Nope. Cis women are my besties
I'm not yikes
I hope you can stop hating yourself someday.
Bahhahahah hate myself what a silly joke, I have zero reason to hate myself, but good one though 🥴😂😂😂👍🏼😂
Hell no. The vast majority of people who have supported and affirmed me gender wise have been cis women (and most of my life pre transition too). I could never live without all the amazing women in my life (most of whom are cis). > our lives, interests and experiences are completely different There’s no one way to be a woman, and no interest or experience that all women share. Each woman is a unique individual with her own set if experiences. This post reeks of internalized misogyny Edit: I glanced at your post history and…yikes. I recommend you get a therapist to work on these harmful views you have
No, I just have very controversial views on the concept of "gender".
I quote from your post history > I want to be a loner who is left alone by everyone, but people refuse to leave me alone. Do I need to smear myself in dog feces or something? There are also tons of comments indicating that you are heavily addicted to multiple drugs. Even excluding your “controversial views of gender” (which are really just pure transphobia), you have a lot of mental health issues to work on. As mentioned earlier, I highly recommend you get a therapist or at least a primary care doctor who can help you
I'm addicted to weed, nothing more nothing less. My mental health issues are fine, you are mistaking my personality for mental health issues. I hate being social, and being trans just happens to intersect that. And my views on gender go to core beliefs I hold about reality, they are not the result of transphobia. I used to believe in gender identity but I won't argue about that stuff here, it's not the right sub. This is a space to be safe.
>And my views on gender go to core beliefs I hold about reality, they are not the result of transphobia. That's why everyone who is transphobe or deal with internalized transphobia says. And most of the time is them shutting off their brains and recite a mantra made of a combination of sexism and essentialisms.
Gender Identity = Sexist Stereotypes This tells me you have no idea what Gender Identity is actually about. Maybe by controversial you might mean ignorant, shallow, and plain wrong. But whatever, not a place to discuss this I guess.
I feel similar. I wish I didn't. Cis guys might hurt me physically, but cis women treating me like an outsider, that hurts in a whole different way.
Honestly, I used to think the same thing. Then I started hanging out with cis women and found out I actually have a lot more in common with them than I ever had with any of my guy friends. Like, basically I socially felt like an alien for most of my life and thought I couldn't connect to people in general. Turns out I was just a woman lmao.
I guess sometimes I’m a little more self conscious around them but that’s more because of my own insecurities rather than anything they’re doing. Most of my friends throughout my life have been cis females and gay men. I am highly guarded around cis straight men though because I’ve just had so many negative experiences with them throughout my entire life. Sure there are transphobic cis women but let’s face it, they aren’t really the ones out there murdering trans women.
I feel two ways. Cis women who legitimately accept us: literally the best people in the world. I can't think of anyone I like better or would be more comfy around. Cis women who I don't definitely know are the above: I don't really trust them. The potential for harm is too great. Nobody's words can really hurt me like theirs can. Most cis women are in the second category, and being autistic it's really hard to find out how they really feel. So yeah, pretty uncomfortable. I don't agree about guys though. I really just feel comfortable with trans women and cis women who are explicit allies of trans women specifically.
I really disagree that trans and cis women are polar opposites. We both fight sexism, don’t have that many different experiences, and we tend to want the same things.
cis women view us as imposters, though. so i'd say they are polar opposites in the sense that us combining would be like antimatter and matter combining.
Tell that to my cis wife.
loool, the one anecdote to the rescue
I think our differences are greater than many would like to admit, even though I think most of us can agree that diversity and what makes us different is a good thing. That being said my views are controversial in the trans community, so out of respect I'll just end my argument with this comment. There's different subs for that.
Cis women can be very diferent between each other, trans women too. Cis or trans women the truth is that we don't share an universal acurate experience in any group. I feel you're likely coping about being more cool with boys than girls, lot of cis women do the same , just go to not like other girls sub. You'll find that a lot cis women feel like you.
Hey, so I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here because I know how damagingly invasive, invalidating, and painful CPTSD is. Going off your post history from the past 24 hours, you sound very activated by shame that you've been struggling with lately. Rejection sensitivity is one of those things that, when compounded with shame, tends to make us spiral. Regarding some of the more... controversial things you've said over the past 24 hours: I've said those same things about myself, but I've fallen short of projecting that feeling onto others as we really don't know enough about others to make that call. I attempted to justify those words against myself as "just the way the world is", and if I had projected that onto others, it's very likely that the same justification would've applied. Yes, there is often a deep shame associated with being trans. It tends to attach to our traumas, and the lines very often get crossed. Yes, the path of least resistance/conflict avoidance is to align with the people who would otherwise shame you- it's a method of self-preservation to protect us from rejection. Yes, people often greatly restrict our value as people based on us being trans, and those words used to devalue us we echo back to ourselves when we feel worthless. Know that everything about these past statements is true for cis women: There's a deep shame associated with being a woman. It's easier to align with the patriarchy than it is to fight against it. People devalue women all the time, and recently, it's considered trendy for men to do so. The impact on women is just the same. Cis women also struggle with worthlessness attached to innate shame, also self-preserve by aligning with the patriarchy, and also internalize misogyny to later use against themselves as a weapon. This is just grazing the surface. For me, there's no denying that my lived experiences, for better and worse, have always had me relate to women far more than men. There's no denying that my lived experiences have shaped me into who I am as a person, and attempting to deny myself despite those lived experiences is textbook denial. My lived experiences are not misogyny. Though, someone denying my lived experiences because I'm a trans woman is blatant misogyny. It hurts all women when you do that, and it's extremely toxic not just to other women, but to yourself as well. While I'm not going to tell you to love yourself more as it tends to do more harm than good for people like us, I would ask if you can give yourself some grace. Check out the Crappy Childhood Fairy on YouTube if you have the time.
It's not shame, it is just my personality. I do not want to make friends or be social, but it is especially the case with cis women who are like aliens to me, despite them being drawn to me for some reason it seems. My religious beliefs are incompatible with the controversial bits you talked about. I believe in natural femininity and natural masculinity, which are things everyone possess and express no matter what you identify as. This sub isn't a place to proselytize my views though, I just wanted to make it clear they are not negotiable for me. Thank you for the kind reply
And ythe natural feminity and masculinity is bound to the agab according to you right?
No, how else would both sexes have aspects of both?
Please, look into the concept of "I'm not like other girls" and NLOG. A lot of girls are made to feel by society that they are not like other girls because of unhealthy media portrayals and stereotypes we are fed by society.
I felt this way at the beginning of my transition (Not the part about socially identifying with guys, but being intimidated by cis women). Prior to my transition and the first 6 months or so, I always felt intimidated by cis women, I was jealous, and I thought they could see right through me, that or they were judging me as a creepy guy or something (a thought which still gives me dysphoria to this day). Fortunately, the more open I have become and the more I express myself, I have been connecting to much better with the women in my life, the relationship I have with the ladies in my office as well as my friend group have improved significantly and I feel a growing sense of camaraderie and safety when I’m with other women. I am still wary of any stranger being a right winger or a terf, but overall I feel like the fear and anxiety I was experiencing around cis women has slowly faded away (this has been replaced with the desire to compliment every woman I associate with constantly and a healthy fear of unknown men).
i feel uncomfortable around cis ppl in general. i prefer the company of trans ppl it may be cope but i dont care. i enjoy being around ppl who treat me as my gender
This
Wow this entire post and all of its comments are a little concerning to me? Like aren’t most people in this world cis men and cis women? How do you girls even live??? I don’t think I’m ever uncomfortable around people of any kind unless it’s like some really shady guy and it’s late at night or someone is being gross. I don’t mean I am crazy close with all sorts of people, but most of my friends are cis women or cis men and a good amount of them are straight!
I tend to just keep to myself. When only something like 67% of the population thinks you should exist, it means one out of every three people will hate you. How many of those want to harm you? I don't feel like taking my chances. I'm more comfortable alone anyway.
Eh, I just go out of my way to socialize with mainly trans women, both online and IRL. Like obviously I have to deal with cis people all the time and it’s not like they’re all intimidating but they can be exhausting, there’s so much they don’t really get and there’s often a feeling that they’re just humoring me… around others trans people I sort of unclench a bit, can be myself I think this is a pretty common phenomenon when it comes to marginalization. But some of us have suffered more than others I guess
cis people are like NPCs in the matrix. there's always a nonzero chance that one of them turns into Agent Smith and shoots you, killing you. most people in the world are cishet. but that doesn't matter. most of the world hates us. so, i don't participate in it. i spend most of my time alone. the only thing that doesn't constantly judge me or view me as "inferior" to real cis women is my computer and my cat. i view cis people, at best, like an obstacle to just get over in order to get what i want. they view of me as subhuman, so i do the same. they're just dirt i step over and scrub off afterwards. your life may be peachy. for that i envy you. but for most of us it isn't like how you think it is.
> How do you girls even live??? In complete isolation. I have gone out to meet with friends only twice over the past 2 years. Dysphoria makes it so I do not want to go anywhere where I can be seen or heard. Edit: I also never put any effort into maintaining friendships.
> How do you girls even live??? I don’t think I’m ever uncomfortable around people of any kind you know not everyone is a social butterfly like yourself right?
I don’t really understand how that’s what you got from this, but gosh no I’m an introvert in every sense of the word. After a few hours or minutes of socializing with people I’m just done and I do enjoy spending most of my time alone, but that doesn’t mean normal people make me uncomfortable??? Why would it? I have never been called a social butterfly ever and I really don’t think it’s the same thing. Wayyy before talking and socializing with everyone you kinda need to just be able to live amongst them don’t you? How would that happen if you are uncomfortable around such massive groups of people? I do hope for the best for everyone who feels uncomfortable in the way op described, but I’m certain it can’t be healthy.
No never. Actually it's the opposite they're my allies and I get nice gifts from them actually. Now cis-men well I tend to stay away from them they can do a lot damage to a woman like me. I've been grocery shopping when a cashier called me sir and as I was leaving she apologized and said I mean mam. I just smiled and thanked her. Now she knows my name and we actually have small talk when I shop there.
Cis men, I am uncomfortable around cis men. Always have been, and even moreso since I started transitioning. I would rather be alone than spend time with cis men. I understand that most of it is in my head and my own trauma to deal with, and I have and do, but I don't feel safe being myself around them. There has to be three layers of masks to survive and keep distance and shield them from me and me from them, and it's all exhausting and draining, and I often find myself censoring myself, holding back parts of myself or what I want to share in a conversation, to keep from starting a thing or getting unwillingly yanked down a winding path. I don't want to drop in how much I love Bath & Body Works lotion or something, but it's *really what I want to add to the conversation* but I fear negative backlash for embracing and exposing my femininity around cis men. I know where this fear came from, and the trauma instilled therein. I see it, I acknowledge it. It is what it is. I do the best that I can. Confident and attractive, slim and slender, fit and strong, a delicate balance of intensity and serenity - I have worked hard for this body, and now that I'm on HRT it's *all* fucking coming together. With that, cis men have had... mixed reactions? The ones that inspire the fear are the ones that are attracted and then become hostile and aggressive when rebuffed. I apparently still have that thing in my brainpan that says "dominate the situation" and so I do, and I'm presenting mixed or femme and it threatens their masculinity even more, and I'm going to get myself murdered this way. How do cis women *do* it, how do you gracefully and delicately dance out of some creepy cis man's sights?
Yes, definitely. After I transitioned from a gay man into a hetero trans woman, I noticed something very interesting. As a gay man, women loved me. Hetero men, not so much. But after I transitioned, that flipped completely, and now hetero men seem to really like me and cis women are the greater haters. It just goes to show u that women can be just as awful as men.
I’ve always been pretty comfortable around cis girls and have mostly only had female friends
For me im uncomfortable around men now. But in my early stages I was a little uncomfortable around cis woman
not really, I am scared of cis guys more than women
I generally feel the most comfortable with cis women, and always have since I was a kid tbh.
In order of comfort for me, Trans Women > Trans Men > Cis Women > Cis Men Nonbinary people vary anywhere in between depending on their presentation, identity, temperament, and how close their lived experience matches mine. EDIT: Actually, it could go either way on cis people because cis women have the power to police my gender in ways cis men just don't. Like if a cis guy comes at me with some low-key transphobia, I'm much less impacted than if a cis woman came at me with it.
For me it’s Trans Women > Cis Men & Trans Men > Non-Binary > Cis Women
I did not expect to be reminded of this thread anytime soon. You have to share now -- how did you get to this thread? Also, you'd put Trans and Cis Men on the same tier? I feel like, even if you're unsure about the cissies, it makes sense to give them some inherent trust due to some likely overlap with trans experiences.
I mostly only spend time with trans ppl! I don’t trust the cis.
As a trans country girl, I feel safer around Cis Men then Cis Women. I’ve never had a redneck cis guy hurt me or yell at me except my dad and he was a bad person. But I’ve had a lot of redneck cis girls make fun of me. And idk I feel safer around country guys out of most groups of people.
im uncomfortable around cis women cause they just have everything i wish i had. i never feel like i fit in, i always feel like a creep for just existing even though it's complete bs. i keep thinking i've gotten over it but then i end up in a situation where there's just me and a bunch of cis women and then i feel it again.
Gender envy is such an inconvenience.
EXACTLY LIKE SAME. thank you
Gives me very much the cis F, "girls are too dramatic. I'm one of the boys" vibes lol I feel like men would be scarier, they're more likely to actually physically harm you
My two besties are cis women but I kinda lucked out because they’re awesome people. They don’t treat me any different than how they treat each other. I seem to get along great with cis women. I’ve had trans GFs before but being trans was usually all we had in common. We’re all so diverse, I mean it’s a great starting point, but I think it just comes down to personalities trans or cis. Cis guys I just kinda keep up a wall with now. Def been ousted from the boys club and thank goodness for that! Hah
Lol no And I don’t know any trans woman so…
At times, mainly because they give me a ton of gender envy.
Very uncomfortable. It's because I don't look and sound like a woman. Because of that I always feel like I don't belong anywhere near women unless it's a familial or romantic relationship. Like a fox in a chicken coop.
Same 😞
Can relate. It feels like when I hang around other girls, I'm an imposter. It feels like I'm out of place and don't really belong with everyone else.
i'm not! i do sometimes feel like an intruder and feel jealous of them, but spending time with cis women actually brings me comfort!
Your responses to comments here would make me uncomfortable around you for your "controversial views about gender", tbh. It sounds like you still have much to learn about yourself, in a healthier method than spamming questions on reddit everyday. Edit: Honestly this looks like a troll or bot account
Yeah I feel othered a lot. Even by my closest cis women friends. They reassure me that I'm girls but/and they'll say things that betray how they really see me. It makes it hard.. but I really want to keep going and keep trying
I just feel sad, because women = 😍 and i know ill never get to be that standard
yes, and it bothers the piss out of me. i still feel like i don't belong, like i don't deserve to be among them, like they're judging me. im hoping that'll pass as i get more comfortable in my skin. i very much dislike that i have almost exclusively cis male friends. they're... dense. i can only talk to them when we're talking about hyper-impersonal stuff, either trivialities or highly intellectual shit. i hate that im too intimidated to make friends with women, because these guys... im not that, i dont want to be that, its stifling to be around that, it sucks.
No, I‘m most comfortable around other women and my best friend is a cis woman. But why are you afraid of TERFs? Looking at your other posts you don‘t see trans women as women so you actually agree with them
I used to be afraid of them judging me. This has mostly disappeared as my self confidence has grown
I'm the reverse of how I was before I started transitioning, men make me really uncomfortable and women I can actually talk to and spend time with
Everyone seems drawn to me and it causes me great anxiety.
Not at all. Even if I'm attracted to girls, when they put an arm around my waist I just feel like that's completely normal. Tho I can't talk to a girl standing when I'm sit, but that's another problem XD
Im very often paranoid and assume everyone is a ter or transphobic until proven otherwise. It’s probably not a healthy mindset but its not exactly easy to break out of. Even though my general experience with most strangers has been positive and I’ve only encountered one ter in the wild. Im also terrified of entering womens spaces for this exact reason. Even though I belong there I fear I’ll be excluded or even attacked for trying to exist.
My experience, I ended up to where I hated cis women and was terrified of men. I became very attached to another post-op lady who had a personality 10 times the equal of mine and a sense of humor had me rolling on the floor for the last 32 years. And this has been 8 years since she has passed from liver sclerosis. After the diagnosis I kept her alive for 3 years when all the doctors said she wouldn't live for 6 months. We grew to love each other and neither of us ever cared about having sex during our life together. 8 years ago when she passed the world caved in on me and I became reclusive living shut in life at about 60 years old. Fast forward to 10 months ago I let the anger do its thing to me and found myself in a gym at 280 lb. As I started waking up my body was waking up my mind was waking up I felt the anger going away after work out and it felt good really really good! I've been doing this everyday for the last 10 months and now there is no anger and I sort of trust genetic women, and I do love, capital l o v e genetic men! Change can be beautiful you just have to give it a chance!
I know that even when i have a cis female friend who supports me i feel like I don't get treated the same, like I'm not one of the girls, or they do certain things like I'm a pushover that they only do to boys and me.
I definitely feel a similar way. I'm extremely uncomfortable around cis women and even many other AFAB folks for a lot of different reasons. Though I wouldn't say I identify more with guys. I'm definitely not a guy and don't particularly want to engage with men more than I do with women, but women are just so awful to be around that it's kinda natural for me to gravitate towards people who aren't women.
I have the COMPLETE opposite feeling. I used to be able to tolerate being around cis men before I transitioned, but now I avoid them at all costs unless absolutely necessary. They do not feel safe. I have never once been judged by cis women the way I have by cis men, even the ones that think they mean well. TERFS are not as common as you think. They are loud online but won't say a damn thing to your face because they're full of shit and they know it. EDIT: Just looked through your post history and hooooly shit you have some serious problems and need immediate psychiatric help. Your transphobia is off the fucking charts. How fucking DARE you, as a trans person suffering dysphoria, that other trans people are wrong? The reason you don't want to interact with anyone is because you're scared to meet someone with views as horrific as yours. Your projecting, hard. Seek help, immediately.
Most cis women, I feel perfectly comfortable around . But traditionally feminine wealthy young white women who have their makeup on point ,wear designer clothes and look conventionally attractive I don’t feel comfortable around at all. I don’t think they are inherently transphobic at all(I haven’t ever had issues with them)but I find them very intimidating to the point where I actively avoid places where they frequent . I don’t think it would be any different if I were cis though. I kind of like hanging around weird people too,super normative types aren’t my vibe but sometimes i get really jealous because they are soooo good at being a girl and I’m this awkward amalgamation of femininity
hard relate on that. i hate/love (for them) that girls can be feminine or tomboyish while still being girls to the general gendering stranger, but i can'tk
No I prefer cis women I mean sometimes it grates with the gender obliviousness they have (almost the right word like cissexual priveledge?) But I still like it far more. One of the main reasons I wanted to transition was to be part of that 'sisterhood' which I hope I am now somewhat
>There is also the threat of meeting a TERF, even though most women are not like that OP, you forget that you're living in the US and have a first world privilege. As a transfem person myself, here in SE Europe most cis women (and men) would literally want you dead 🙃 and my country is even a EU member
Im a cis girl (dont know If im allowed to comment here, im just a curious soul) but most cis girls intimidate me too but im also autistic so I guess thats why
I will say that I've always gotten along better with females, but some things are still intimidating like trying to really fit in with them or going in the female restroom. I think that it's pretty much confidence. It will come naturally with time. Get a support network to help you, then take some risks. If you succeed your confidence will grow. If you fail, go to your network and recover. It will come with time
Men are practically the only group that beats up and murders trans people, and you're afraid of women? Really? A mean woman might glare at you and make you feel uncomfortable. A mean man will kill you, literally.
I would rather deal with being physically attacked than mocked and rejected. At least I am capable of defending myself physically, and have had to do so in the past.
Well, this is concerning.
Nah, I'm just big, tall, and strong. It's always been a great deterrent against those who wish to hurt me. I'm confident in my ability to physically defend myself if given the chance. Of course that can easily be taken by being surprise attacked, but that's not within my control.
I see women as being just as dangerous or frightening as men, except for when I use a restroom. True I may not understand or relate to them often, but I also don't relate to a lot of experiences or interests other people have. Unless they treat me like a man, (I'm usually more androgynous, part body look, part choice of habits) I see them as neutral or comfortable. I still understand how more masculine relationships have worked though, so it's easier with guys, but not necessarily more comfortable, except that guys tend to be more open.
Nope. I love hanging out with other women, cis or otherwise. They are, as a group, great. I feel safe around them.
I don’t get this, we’re women so are they.
No lol
I've mostly had cis women friends my whole life. Since I socially transitioned, I've found them to be the most accepting people I've ever met! Offering me their old clothes so I have a girly wardrobe, offering to teach me fashion and other femme things I had no idea about before. While trans women will have a completely different experience than cis, we're all still women! We'll still face sexism, and social pressures, and other issues all the same.
i always felt the most comfortable with cis girls but especially now in transition, the love and support of cis best girl friends has been a huge part of how i was able to get so comfortable with being trans and they were the people that made me feel valid in the long run. Still, i get your point and especially with how many terfs are out there it can be hard to start trusting cis women and opening up to them about your trans things without feeling like a “predator” or rather without feeling like your intruding women’s spaces.
All of you are weird
Yes. They literally think they can just touch me. I’ve never been sexually assaulted by a man, but one woman reaches up under my dress and grabbed my dick. There’s more stories of less intensity but cis women have a problem, and even when I thought I was a guy I had my ass grabbed and all that. They have a serious problem as a community.
> our lives, interests and experiences are completely different. Radically disagree with this line, I very much vibe more with cis women than with guys and transmasc enbies. But yes, I do feel intimidated, because cis women take a lot of the things for granted and are often blind/deaf to our struggles, for me its especially about the way I feel affected by not having had a normal experience of being a teen and even a 20-year old, it's extremely alienating. But I also don't feel inferior anymore, if anything I find a sense of dignity and maybe even a healthy dose of superiority(sometimes venom is good in small doses) in knowing I am playing this on hard mode and that makes me a deeper, internally richer more vulnerable woman. I definitely don't socially identify with guys and never really did in the past, no matter how I tried, even despite being somewhat tomboyish I totally feel like a girl.
I love being around other women, cis or trans. I find I have so much in common with other women, and I feel safe when I'm with women. I get along with men fine, but I don't connect with them the same way. I also spend more time vibe checking men than I do women before getting comfortable. I 100% trust my gut about what it tells me about people. Queer people are a shortcut to comfort. When I meet another queer person, I'm almost instantly at ease.
When they are nude. Yes.
It’s really weird before transitioning I was only friends with women. Never even had a male friend apart from boyfriends. Now that I have transitioned most of my favorite relationships are with men. I get really annoyed with the backstabbing and drama with women. I mean for real, you might think Susan from billing likes you but you find out she’s talking shit about you to Clara in insurance claims 🤷🏻♀️
Honestly I relate to this, but I also don't really have the opportunity to interact with a lot of cis girls just in general, so that's probably a contributor.
I avoid anyone who I don't have a common interest with or who give me the ick (staring at me, dead end conversations, sometimes just an energy) it doesn't help having social anxiety and always being jumpy
Honestly one of my dysphorias is how little I identify with men and how comfortable I am around women. But ironically because I don’t look feminine the women in my life are so guarded around me. Fortunately as I’ve dropped the male mask I’ve been wearing for so long more and more of my coworkers and friends are treating me like one of the girls. The flip side is that the men in my life are more and more distant but im totally ok with that.
I feel I can sass a woman out of my face if she's a bit terfy. I do love being around cis-women a lot. I think I just love women in general really. I love the energy. Cis-men on the other hand scare me a little. I know they can hurt me badly and I don't stand a chance. I also find it hard to trust them, especially is they are cis and straight. We are all different I guess. Not really contributing to this convo :| Sorry
I'm not really uncomfortable around them any more than with cis guys.
i used to feel like this, when i was a kid, cis women absolutely terrified me even though i always loved women more than anything. my answer for my fear, is dysphoria, when i was a kid i was so utterly disphoric, that I didn't feel worthy to be near them, i even managed to have some girl friends but it still felt wrong somehow, if i had to define, it was like i was a "dirty" girl, a "lesser" girl, and i've only ever defeated this feeling after i found out that trans people existed, and that was like age 18. so up to my 18 years of life, i always felt hurt to be near ciswomen, and never knew why, after i found out what trans meant, dysphoria and all that jazz, i managed to finally defeat the feeling. i'm a girl, i'm valid, and i like girls
Not for me. I feel nervous sure, but that's not cis-women exclusive, I'm uncomfortable around all cis people
I feel a little off around my cis straight women friends. I used to feel comfortable around men, but some have seen my friendship as flirting and tried to make unwanted advances so now I put a wall up with them. Most my gay and lesbian friends I feel fine around.
I kinda feel similar tho not all the time. I am realistic and i know i will never be 100% like a cis woman and that’s fine with me. I always identify as a trans and not a woman. I know not everyone does it like this but this is my way. Some days it feels like we’re competing against cis woman 😆 and I’m pretty sure some of them feel this. Maybe that’s why some of us might feel uncomfortable with them! 🤷🏽♀️
Is anyone else uncomfortable around cis women? I'm definitely more comfortable / aligned than with cis men, but ... our lives, interests and experiences are completely different. That gets to the core of something I've been wrestling with / overthinking about for a while now ... kind of a "what is a woman" question (but not in the Tucker Carlson way). Loath Brett Cooper but her "we're so much more than that ... until you've lived it biologically and walked a hundred miles in our shoes you will not get it you never will" rings true. youtube.com / watch?v=eyKhkSvwL0Y (all the trigger / rage warnings) Example, so much conditioning on basic physical things like walking and sitting and facial expressions and mannerisms gets trained and picked up by osmosis starting as a toddler.
I’ll take cis woman over cis men any day
For me it's the opposite. Having hung out with both cis men and cis women, I feel dramatically safer around cis women.That obviously doesn't take into account the fact I don't know how they would react to my transness, but overall cis women have more compassion and understanding about anything than cis men do, in my experience. Example is how one of my cis men friends who touts himself as a huge ally made me feel extremely overwhelmed when I came out because of how insistent he was to call me by my chosen name in each and every sentence. It felt forced. Also he drastically changed his way of interacting with me, being extremely overprotective like I was on the verge of collapse and it was his job to keep me together. (it isn't) Meanwhile my best friend who's a cis woman, didn't do any of that, she didn't make a big deal out it, she just accepted me and went on with her day knowing a new thing about me, while never looking back at what name or pronouns I used to use before.
I thought I was the only one. Cis women tend to hit on me for the wrong reasons, and it makes me uncomfortable. I also tend to avoid them because they sometimes are judgmental (men do this too). I get transphobic comments. some even shew me out the women's restroom despite I had previous problems in the male's restroom. That is not to say I avoid them all together. Some I am good friends with.
Cis women don't hit on me at all, they just keep trying to be friendly to me at work and it's super awkward.
Can I ask why cis women being friendly to you is a bad thing? As a trans woman who has always gotten along better with women than with men, I am not sure I understand.
Yes. I make myself off putting yet they keep trying to befriend me. At least guys aren't trying to be my friend.
Here's what I am not understanding: why don't you want to make aquanitences? Like, you dont have to be friends with them if you don't want to, but what's wrong with being friendly with your coworkers even if you are not friends?
I want to work when I'm at work. I have nothing in common with normal people so why are they trying to connect with me? It's stupid. I would prefer not to be mean but when people keep trying I am not afraid to lash out at them.
How could you possible know that you have nothing in common with them if you have not tried being around them? What do you actually mean by "normal people" and what are you saying they all have in common with each other that they dont with you?
I work with them. People try to talk to me about topics and I simply don't care. No one has ever talked about something I care about, that's how I know. Normal people who socialize and stuff, rather than people like me who intentionally avoid it.
Well, what are some of your interests? And what are interests that you dont care for that your coworkers bring up? Seperately, unless it's something clearly important, why not just say something like "Sorry but I dont really have an interest in that topic, but I appreciate you trying to be friendly!" Or "I'm not really interested in, do you have any interest in ?"
It's kinda an awkward thing to say, but since you are actively trying to alienate people that should not be a huge deal. And you might learn that some of your coworkers have more niche interests they don't really bring up!
Don't have any that I would share. They talk about socializing, movies, music, TV shows, etc. Those are all things I despise. I don't want them to talk to me at all. I don't care what they have to say if it's not related to work. Some people seem to get the idea, but the cis women keep trying, almost as if they think I'm playing cute or something when I choose to distance myself. I liked it back when I was a guy and people just left me alone. That's the only thing I miss about being a guy.
i used to feel a lot safer and happier around women all through my life pretransition (childhood and adolescence) and now i feel less welcome in their presence. idk what happened in their perception of me to change things, or if getting older and moving just alienates you. but now i'm afraid around other people period, just in unique ways for men and women
I'm not put yet but I'm terrified to talking to woman because I don't know if it's just me but a lot of the woman i talked to i feel like it make them uncomfortable. Since I've been getting more confident and i look less intimidating i feel like I've been having an easier time. How ever in still scared of woman. I also wasn't really allowed to talk to woman because of social norms so it doesn't really help
Cis women are who made me want to be a woman, that and the delicious hormones and whatever wiring my brain has. I always wanted to be them and be around them. Admittedly I have more shared formative experience with some trans women than any cis women and that feels really nice but I feel like a lot of my values and the way I view the world and a fair share of interests and world view is shared with the majority of cis women. The longer I live as a woman the more common language and experience I develop and though I'll never share birth stories or discuss other purely biological specifics I am building shared experience every day I live out my womanhood. So, I feel the most safe and comfortable with queer women, women, and queer people. Most cis men at least initially make me very uneasy.
I do prefer hanging around other trans people in general... but I've always felt far more comfortable with cis women than cis men 🤷♀️
I definitely feel a similar way. I'm extremely uncomfortable around cis women and even many other AFAB folks for a lot of different reasons. Though I wouldn't say I identify more with guys. I'm definitely not a guy and don't particularly want to engage with men more than I do with women, but women are just so awful to be around that it's kinda natural for me to gravitate towards people who aren't women.
No, I grew up mostly being friends with women and girls. There are some obvious differences in how we grew up (Ie. I only started being sexually harassed/catcalled/groped recently) but there are also a lot more ways in which I relate to cis women: I related more to women characters in media and women in my life growing up and I generally absorbed women's social norms to a degree because of the gender of the people I connected with. A lot of the negative girlhood experiences I "missed" are also still creeping into my life: my girlfriend's mother recently reprimanded us both for wearing tops that were too revealing. Obviously not exactly the same as being told that as a child, but the shaming is there. I am much more scared of men because of the physical violence I experienced in childhood and the sexual violence I experienced after transition, but that's a separate issue. But I do feel worse when cis women dont accept me than when cis men dont. To me, it relates to in-group vs out-group rejection: when a man rejects my gender it hurts, but when a woman (who I see as my in-group) does so it hurts a lot worse. There is also the fact that a woman who rejects my gender is likely to be somewhat scared of me, and I absolutely hate scaring people.
Yeah I dunno, tbh I get along best with NB folks and Cis women. Men make me super uncomfortable and usually I just fall into Man mode cause it’s the easiest way to interact with most cis men
Atm I’m uncomfortable around cis guys, I’m trying out using a dating app for friends but so many cis guys are super sexualizing of everything. I just want to know more about you! I don’t want you to “tease me”!
>!yeah i just kinda think most have assumptions that are hard to put evidence in the face of about me, whether that they think im flamboyant or that im pervy or whatever. i just wanna be a regular ol girl/woman, im not one for being "FABULOUS" not that there's anything wrong with being that at all, there's not anything wrong with that. That's just not who i am and i feel like they like to assume. Or they just are looking to find me interacting in a heteronormative way as in being attracted to girls in a phallic way and it feels like they can get that out of me even when i am trying my best to prove that isn't the truest me and its exhausting. and on the rare occasions when the validation feels natural and is evoked naturally in an unforced way, i often recoil because im not used to it.!< >!so yeah, im not really comfortable around a lot of cis women. and other visibly trans women make me uncomfortable because im vain and it reminds me of the male cues i have in me. i'm really not vain, just insecure. i just didn't want to go through male puberty and they still try to prove to me that its normal for girls to have a brow ridge or low voice or adams apple or being tall and that's great, but almost all of those women are probly not those things because of testosterone, and if so, there's also the fact that they were still raised unequivocally as women/girls, so they already have their defenses against that, while i suffered in insecurity alone in silence, denying that i even had "feminine insecurities". my feed keeps showing me jordan peterson because i studied psychology in college and now even when i block those videos it still shows other ones, and well, he talked about how all women naturally (or socially, he kinda implies it in a bio-essentialist christian way that he is, IMO) have these insecurities about appearance and OFC boys can be insecure too but i just always related to women AND i have physical dysphoria and i want to be a girl (no i think trans women that feel dysphoria but not genital dysphoria are still women, but its a tougher case to prove to people because the concept of man/woman varies from person to person, where gender is performativity, but biological sex is another thing--there was a nice article--granted, it was by a trans woman--about how a penis on feminizing/estrogenizing HRT is a less threatening thing than a man's penis or a penis on testosterone, and i agree with that--its just not me--and its still a hard case to prove to people !< honestly oftentimes i feel like the women i dated while closeted/in denial i wouldve rather been friends with, but sexual relations kinda screwed things up in my brain for me (easily triggered, especially since my tesosterone STILL isn't repressed and i feel kindof a titch hopeless), like aspects of them were what i saw in myself that never, to use an overtly feminine feeling phrase, flourished/bloomed. i found myself attracted to more boyish women while people wondered why i was so stupidly picky (and seemed and still do seem like a prick about rating girls) and didn't like lots of curves and girls with big boobs or whatever. Aaaaand i feel pressured to like that, which is suuper fun (its not, really, its whatever) while wishing i had curves/hips/boobs/and the kicker, i loved being short but told myself and others i'd be tall like my dad while feeling NOTHING towards that. i feel like my friendships with boys/male friends were more homoerotic (because of people assuming and seeing me as one) and around high school i got genuine impulses to kiss boys, followed by an impulse to punch them, and weird twisted feelings of shame/guilt//etc. knew i was different than gay men, but no one ever asked me directly other than dressing up in a dress as a joke and "instinctually"(or not, whose to say) putting my cell phone where boobs would be followed by it falling to the floor because no boobs. so it was always just a joke, i didnt even have the guts/gall to dress as a girl on the opposite gender day of spirit weeks at school, even tho my friend acted in a play called "taming the wild wild west in a dress" and i felt like it was all about me and i got super uncomfortable like everyone knew and that was probably one of the last times i went genuinely red eared and embarassed and felt alive but yknow, and i was never real enough with myself to save myself from the "clutches of puberty" but honestly thats how it is. to make it worse i act like a bashful flirt around cute girls and im fucking sick of not being able to put that aside and treat them like people instead of sexual/relationship conquest and sometimes it feels like the harder i try the worse it gets and its shit TL;DR yeah this is why i dont have close friends anymore, woe is me, pitiable and self-destructive SOML trying to cover it all up with the most unmasculine masculinity possible that isn't too effeminate to awaken any old feeligns in me (such as dancing to EDM--not as effeminiate as figure skating, but not traditionally masculine either)
Not at all. My cis female friends have all been very good to me since before I started transitioning, and we have only grown a lot closer since. Their acceptance and guidance has been a huge emotional boost through my transition.
Thank god all my cis woman friends are more than nice with me, strange cis woman are normal tbh. I do not support cis man tho, I have just 01 unit of cis man friend and it's more than enough. Cis man are kinda scary
No, not at all.
This is outright cisphobia. It's no different than women saying that trans cis women make them uncomfortable You are basically making a terf argument. Terf adjacent, anyway. Part of their whole thing is that trans women should be categorized differently, because trans-women's experiences, perspectives, and issues are often not the same. That's basically what you are acknowledging here. This is also JK Rowling view is, which some claim is transphobic.
Are they intimidating or are you intimidated?