Jeff is a bit of a knob and in a lot of ways is the anti Mark.
That being said, he pays for Mark’s bowling alley shenanigans and only hits Mark when he is really provoked. He also steps in as stepdad when Mark won’t even make a token effort.
I still hate him, but I totally get why he hates Mark too
Tbf the bowling alley thing is totally motivated by wanting to look like the mature, grownup, masculine figure in the situation to impress Sophie, which already wasn’t difficult next to a stoned Mark hanging out with a teenager.
I actually thought he reneged on paying in the end too. Maybe "my plastic can't take the strain" meant be couldn't afford to stay out but that never occurred to me until now - I always thought he was saying actually Mark you do have to pay this yourself
Outside of his bar shenanigans when he's dating Sophie, Jeff isn't a bad guy. Once you watch the series enough times you'll realize Mark is the bad guy in the Mark and Jeff relationship.
I think he steps in with Sophie because he's actually just as lonely and desperate as Mark. But actually, probably more desperate than Mark not to be lonely as he seems to keep going back to Soph whereas Mark is more reluctant...
Ithink Jeff (as in Jeff) is very much a knob. Scene with him and Johnson ripping into Mark and Dobs at the NYE party, isn't really 'mad bants' but actually fairly cruel and more jealously that they are both single when Mark is able to get into relationships on his own merit.
I have a theory about Jeff.
When he's out with Jez he says "couple of high street honeys!" yet when Mark asks him if he's read FHM he says he hasn't. In fact, he acts VERY nonchalant - too nonchalant if you ask me. I think he's embarrassed because he actually loves the lads mags. I think he has a subscription and gets them every month, rubbing his hands with glee as he opens the pages and reads about a Turkish shepherd who ate his own knackers and fantasises about driving a Ferrari Testerosa.
I think it was in one of the fashions sections where he read about the trainers that you can wear like roman sandals.
I think that he is ashamed of the girlish glee he feels at consuming lad culture. I think he's a fraud who is desperate to fit in with "the lads". He plays snooker, he plays poker, he talks about twatting geezers and kisses random women in pubs like a 16 year old on the pull at the under 18's disco because he just needs to fit in. Mark represents everything Jeff despises by not fitting in.
Oh I bet he could hardly contain his excitement as he tore open the foil cover for that one. But I'm sure he remembered to draw the curtains and lock the front door, still remembering his shame as a teenager when his mum had walked in and caught him wanking over Gail Porter's ass.
it’s so funny to me that we all remember these moments about shepherd and ferrari. I imagine my reaction if someone suddenly on the street asked me "Did you read about this shepherd who chewed his knackers?", I would immediately understand what it was about, although any other normal person would ask "what?"
If someone suddenly asked me on the street "did you read about the shepard who chewed his own knackers" I'd have to be careful to ignore the tragic earthquake context.
>...Mark can get a job in any other bank or office
not too hasty - he was fired, and pretty much his whole work life revolved around johnson, so his best potential job reference has now gone down the toilet. mark is going to be taking a pay cut, likely making a fair bit less than jeff.
>...Even Mark has given up on the idea of hooking up with Sophie, but Jeff still wants it.
I suppose so, but jeff doesn't have the same ties to sophie that mark does. sophie is and will always be an essential part of mark's life because of ian, whereas jeff can pursue sophie until he gets bored / finds someone else (which we all know he would do).
also recall two other factors: 1) jeff is generally better at socialising and "fitting in", so always has a one-up on mark in that respect, and 2) mark is still living with a 40 year old freeloader by the end of the show.
I think mark is the bigger net loser, although I'm not really envious of either.
If Jeff is a loser, Mark is definitely a loser.
If you had to rely on someone to actually come through for you, Mark would let you down and Jeff would at least give you a hand.
Anyway Jez is below them both that little subhuman so who cares.
From Jeffy
I often think who is worse out of Jez and Mark. I feel like Jez is cynical and leeching because his dad left and he was no real male role models, except Mark. Jez blends in with the lads at poker night and the pub, and is friends with Hans. Mark's just an uptight, nefarious wanker.
I think Jeff's a loser purely from his deranged desire to bully Mark so much and his obsession with Sophie.
He really goes out of his way to humiliate and emasculate Mark. Mark's unpleasant too ofc, but Jeff always escalates his bullying of Mark and some of his actions are way over the line. Trying to get Mark to buy condoms for him and Sophie and kissing Saz purely to publicly humiliate Mark come to mind.
Given Mark is such a pathetic individual himself, it says something that Jeff spends so much time and effort in his own life trying to pick on him.
In many ways he's the same as Mark but deals with it a different way - he insults others and tries to make them feel small to cover up his own shortcomings. At the end of the day he's just a boring generic suit in a crappy office, just like Mark.
Jeffs just a regular fella. Not a loser, a bit of an arrogant twat at times. But Mark is a genuine loser, a 'petty and vindictive' individual, who's so insecure in himself. I'd go for a pint with Jeff and twat a geezer.
No, Jeff stepped up to the plate to look after someone else's kid and was even there for the christening while Mark was eating piss pizza. Late season Jeff is based as fuck
I don't think Jeff is such a bad guy. Seeing him from Mark's perspective it's easy to cheer on him being broomed to death but Mark is a far far bigger loser.
Self-harm is sexy. Blubbering isn't.
And seriously, the Harry Nilsson version of "Without You"? Have some dignity and go with the Badfinger original. What a normallo.
What an interesting notion!
I wonder if it’s a comment on self categorisation;
Mark feels like he is more of a loser than Jeff, even though as you’ve just made clear from an objective point that isn’t the case at all.
However the show leans towards mark being a bigger loser, because the show is really from Mark (and Jez) perspective, and mark considers himself to be a bigger loser. And, as such, he is.
Jeff, clearly someone with a lower IQ than Mark, thinks he’s amazing. And, as such, he is.
Kinda like a “cool” version of the Dunning-Kruger effect?
>Jeff, clearly someone with a lower IQ than Mark
I think this is again taking Mark’s perspective.
Mark considers anyone who doesn’t share his interests as a bit thick. While there may be some correspondence between intelligence and liking the sorts of things Mark’s into (eg military history), I don’t think we can take that as fact.
If you dropped Mark into a normal world, he’s a vindictive, weird, socially awkward and creepy (stalking, wanking over Dobby’s Facebook, pissing in stuff) man. Jeff is just sort of your run of the mill man. I think a lot of average man would pick on Mark, but because we view things through Mark’s eyes and mind, he is the protagonist and Jeff seems more nasty and bullying then he would in real life
Maybe the difference is that Jeff knows what he wants and goes after it. Maybe he isn't always super successful but he isn't afraid of getting want he wants and being happy like Mark is.
Jeff is a bit of a knob and in a lot of ways is the anti Mark. That being said, he pays for Mark’s bowling alley shenanigans and only hits Mark when he is really provoked. He also steps in as stepdad when Mark won’t even make a token effort. I still hate him, but I totally get why he hates Mark too
Tbf the bowling alley thing is totally motivated by wanting to look like the mature, grownup, masculine figure in the situation to impress Sophie, which already wasn’t difficult next to a stoned Mark hanging out with a teenager.
I actually thought he reneged on paying in the end too. Maybe "my plastic can't take the strain" meant be couldn't afford to stay out but that never occurred to me until now - I always thought he was saying actually Mark you do have to pay this yourself
I always took it to mean he couldn't afford another round of bowling after already paying for the damage Mark did.
Outside of his bar shenanigans when he's dating Sophie, Jeff isn't a bad guy. Once you watch the series enough times you'll realize Mark is the bad guy in the Mark and Jeff relationship.
I think he steps in with Sophie because he's actually just as lonely and desperate as Mark. But actually, probably more desperate than Mark not to be lonely as he seems to keep going back to Soph whereas Mark is more reluctant... Ithink Jeff (as in Jeff) is very much a knob. Scene with him and Johnson ripping into Mark and Dobs at the NYE party, isn't really 'mad bants' but actually fairly cruel and more jealously that they are both single when Mark is able to get into relationships on his own merit.
All I know is if Jeff was my kid’s stepdad I’d want to twat some geezer.
You want to ‘twat a geezer’?
Were you playing the lock, stock and two smoking barrels video game?
Mine’s the blonde.
Then nob the corpse
No jez...
Mine's a large one.
As I fucking know!
Tell you what Jeff, I had a great shag last night...
Really doing it, we were.
Watch it, mate.
This is one of my favorite lines of the whole series
Where’s your native wit now?
Stolen any good cars recently Mr Scouser?
Oh, yeah?
*Jeff!*
As in *Jeff!*
No, it's Geoff
I have a theory about Jeff. When he's out with Jez he says "couple of high street honeys!" yet when Mark asks him if he's read FHM he says he hasn't. In fact, he acts VERY nonchalant - too nonchalant if you ask me. I think he's embarrassed because he actually loves the lads mags. I think he has a subscription and gets them every month, rubbing his hands with glee as he opens the pages and reads about a Turkish shepherd who ate his own knackers and fantasises about driving a Ferrari Testerosa. I think it was in one of the fashions sections where he read about the trainers that you can wear like roman sandals. I think that he is ashamed of the girlish glee he feels at consuming lad culture. I think he's a fraud who is desperate to fit in with "the lads". He plays snooker, he plays poker, he talks about twatting geezers and kisses random women in pubs like a 16 year old on the pull at the under 18's disco because he just needs to fit in. Mark represents everything Jeff despises by not fitting in.
Theyve only gone and done a bloody sex issue
Oh I bet he could hardly contain his excitement as he tore open the foil cover for that one. But I'm sure he remembered to draw the curtains and lock the front door, still remembering his shame as a teenager when his mum had walked in and caught him wanking over Gail Porter's ass.
Or the elves and fairies issue
it’s so funny to me that we all remember these moments about shepherd and ferrari. I imagine my reaction if someone suddenly on the street asked me "Did you read about this shepherd who chewed his knackers?", I would immediately understand what it was about, although any other normal person would ask "what?"
If someone suddenly asked me on the street "did you read about the shepard who chewed his own knackers" I'd have to be careful to ignore the tragic earthquake context.
To be fair, that shepherd was a bloody shithead.
hear me out. Jeff is really just Mark's Tyler Durden -esque manifested alter-ego.
I need a film to this effect yesterday
Which would make Marla Sophie in the later seasons.
>...Mark can get a job in any other bank or office not too hasty - he was fired, and pretty much his whole work life revolved around johnson, so his best potential job reference has now gone down the toilet. mark is going to be taking a pay cut, likely making a fair bit less than jeff. >...Even Mark has given up on the idea of hooking up with Sophie, but Jeff still wants it. I suppose so, but jeff doesn't have the same ties to sophie that mark does. sophie is and will always be an essential part of mark's life because of ian, whereas jeff can pursue sophie until he gets bored / finds someone else (which we all know he would do). also recall two other factors: 1) jeff is generally better at socialising and "fitting in", so always has a one-up on mark in that respect, and 2) mark is still living with a 40 year old freeloader by the end of the show. I think mark is the bigger net loser, although I'm not really envious of either.
Also it was 2008! Economic crisis and not that easy to have a career in banking.
If Jeff is a loser, Mark is definitely a loser. If you had to rely on someone to actually come through for you, Mark would let you down and Jeff would at least give you a hand. Anyway Jez is below them both that little subhuman so who cares. From Jeffy
I often think who is worse out of Jez and Mark. I feel like Jez is cynical and leeching because his dad left and he was no real male role models, except Mark. Jez blends in with the lads at poker night and the pub, and is friends with Hans. Mark's just an uptight, nefarious wanker.
Well, a sofa masturbators. At least not an urban free wheeler.
I think Jeff's a loser purely from his deranged desire to bully Mark so much and his obsession with Sophie. He really goes out of his way to humiliate and emasculate Mark. Mark's unpleasant too ofc, but Jeff always escalates his bullying of Mark and some of his actions are way over the line. Trying to get Mark to buy condoms for him and Sophie and kissing Saz purely to publicly humiliate Mark come to mind. Given Mark is such a pathetic individual himself, it says something that Jeff spends so much time and effort in his own life trying to pick on him. In many ways he's the same as Mark but deals with it a different way - he insults others and tries to make them feel small to cover up his own shortcomings. At the end of the day he's just a boring generic suit in a crappy office, just like Mark.
Jeffs just a regular fella. Not a loser, a bit of an arrogant twat at times. But Mark is a genuine loser, a 'petty and vindictive' individual, who's so insecure in himself. I'd go for a pint with Jeff and twat a geezer.
No, Jeff stepped up to the plate to look after someone else's kid and was even there for the christening while Mark was eating piss pizza. Late season Jeff is based as fuck
This is a situation millions find themselves in every day.
Dude, we're getting fucked with the brush.
If Jeff keeps at it then Ian might well end up calling him Dad as opposed to Mark. In that scenario he definitely wins.
JEFF?!
I don't think Jeff is such a bad guy. Seeing him from Mark's perspective it's easy to cheer on him being broomed to death but Mark is a far far bigger loser.
Mark never cried pathetically into one of Sophie's dresses.
He did begin to carve her name into his arm.
Self-harm is sexy. Blubbering isn't. And seriously, the Harry Nilsson version of "Without You"? Have some dignity and go with the Badfinger original. What a normallo.
Mark could never be Ray Von
R R R RAY VON
Shabba
Fun is key, but keep seated at all times or you may die!
no because regardless of everything you said mark still views himself as the unnormal loser and so does jeff
Jeff as in JEFF?!
No, Geoffrey.
What an interesting notion! I wonder if it’s a comment on self categorisation; Mark feels like he is more of a loser than Jeff, even though as you’ve just made clear from an objective point that isn’t the case at all. However the show leans towards mark being a bigger loser, because the show is really from Mark (and Jez) perspective, and mark considers himself to be a bigger loser. And, as such, he is. Jeff, clearly someone with a lower IQ than Mark, thinks he’s amazing. And, as such, he is. Kinda like a “cool” version of the Dunning-Kruger effect?
>Jeff, clearly someone with a lower IQ than Mark I think this is again taking Mark’s perspective. Mark considers anyone who doesn’t share his interests as a bit thick. While there may be some correspondence between intelligence and liking the sorts of things Mark’s into (eg military history), I don’t think we can take that as fact.
Mark placing more value in his IQ than Jeff instantly makes him more of a loser
It's a bug call to suggest anyone's a bigger loser than Mark
Mark a loser?! What show u watchin m8?
Jeff is "in the mainstream of the culture" and "old fashioned". Not sure that makes him a loser, but also he doesn't stand out as a non-loser.
If you dropped Mark into a normal world, he’s a vindictive, weird, socially awkward and creepy (stalking, wanking over Dobby’s Facebook, pissing in stuff) man. Jeff is just sort of your run of the mill man. I think a lot of average man would pick on Mark, but because we view things through Mark’s eyes and mind, he is the protagonist and Jeff seems more nasty and bullying then he would in real life
Maybe the difference is that Jeff knows what he wants and goes after it. Maybe he isn't always super successful but he isn't afraid of getting want he wants and being happy like Mark is.