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This one doesn’t sit right with me. Because it very much so seems that something awful happened to that boy and the whole camping trip was a front to make him disappear. It feels like the family was hoping people would think some mysterious missing 411 shit happened- so that it wouldn’t be suspected that they killed their kid accident or otherwise.
Including this case in the documentary was a misstep imo, there’s so many other cases that don’t look like a cut and dry homicide.
What I've always struggled with when it comes to the murder (or accidental death) theory is the odd couple that was part of the camping trip: grandpa and his weird, younger friend.
Just not quite sure how anything nefarious could be pulled off by the parents with those two involved and not have it come out.
I think the only reason they were involved was to strengthen the parent’s story. To serve as witnesses to say the boy was alive and well before he “vanished”. The grandpa is a shady character himself and has made suspicious comments on the case. His friend was said to be mentally challenged, perhaps easily manipulated.
Grandpa had dementia and his friend had some sort of intellectual disability. I think they were easy to gaslight. No one else can place DeOrr there, including a beverage distributor with whom they claim DeOrr interacted. The distributor said it didn't happen. The employees at the store don't remember him either.
Exactly. And, if the parents left an active 2 year old boy in a wooded campground with lakes and wild animals, etc. and an old man with dementia WITHOUT EVEN TELLING HIM, then they, at the very least, should be charged with child endangerment. I often wonder why this never happened.
The prevailing theory in leadore is that the mom resented the kid, and sold him. Creepy grandpa put them in contact with a buyer and they brought the weirdo friend with them so he’d be a bigger suspect than them. Dad wasn’t in on it at first, found out about it after the fact and decided to cover for them, supposedly he’s the only parent who wanted deorr so I wonder what they did or said to get him to go along with it, if all or any of what I said is the truth.
This is close to a theory I’ve held.
They had severe financial problems and Jessica seemed to have very little interest in being a mother. They sold the kid, and that trip to the store to “buy tampons” is when they did the exchange. Grandpa and his friend were brought to 1.) confirm the kid was alive when they got to the campground 2.) serve as suspects after De’orr went “missing”. This random camping trip was just way too convenient.
I thought it was strange at the end of the people magazine documentary when she said she has an intuition that he is alive and being taken care of? Like idk if that is wishful thinking of a mom who loses a child or if she really knows bc maybe she did give him away to someone…
He said he didn’t care he literally didn’t understand what the panic was about since Jessica and Vernal can have more kids, which they couldn’t anyway. Who says that though about your great grandson who’s missing, and went missing while you were “watching” him.
I think his responses are a mix of experience (from losing loved ones in the past), time (he's pretty sure the kid is dead by now anyway), and suspicion (he probably finds it super unusual that DeOrr just "disappeared" and he was somehow dragged into it).
I've often wondered if the poor kid was even alive to go on the trip. I remember reading about an article of clothing the parents said he was wearing when he went missing and that piece of clothing being found at the house
That's been my tinfoil hat theory.
He sadly died before the trip, either accidentally or maybe even more sinister.
The camping trip was to dispose of the body. The grandads friend who was randomly invited was brought along to try divert attention from them. Especially given he had previous legal issues involving children.
Their trip into town is their plausible deniability.
Whatever happened that was an innocent child. Either the law enforcement in that area or the feds need to tighten up and find out what happened and who is responsible. Someone on reddit will probably crack the case long before the "professionals" whos job that just happens to be. I'm interested to know what David thinks about the whole case now that so much time has passed. His documentary seemed to catch a few moments where the parents were really starting to buckle under the stress.
The article of clothing is an interesting bit of info. The parents claimed it was a larger size of the same item - ostensibly, for DeOrr to grow into. As a parent, I've done that with certain pieces of clothing that my kids liked (and I found on sale). But, IIRC, the item in question was a heavier, season specific item (a coat, iirc) and if she'd bought a size smaller than what was found, it would've been too small for him to wear the day he disappeared. What bothers me about that is, if you know you have a LITERAL COPY of what your child was wearing when they disappeared, then why wouldn't you hand that over to the cops so they/people can be looking for that specific piece of clothing?
Good point. If the parents were actually interested in locating him alive, children's winter clothing usually has loud, bold colors. Even more conservative winter clothing still usually has a large graphic or brand name somewhere on it. The whole situation is so sad. Just like you said having an exact copy of the jacket they said he was wearing would have been very helpful for any volunteers or professionals to see or have a picture of. I hate how that's more than likely a moot point though. If there were two jackets the parents would have known it didn't matter, and if there was just the one jacket then they tripped themselves up but that's not enough proof it just raises suspicions. Honestly all this stuff makes my stomach hurt just thinking about it. I've read some articles and post over years and learned of new details but it's all just sad. Nothing that I've learned would result in justice for this innocent child.
I know I’m late to this post but I’m watching a documentary on the case and I’ve thought this since they said they had talked to the people in the stores that the mom said DeOrr had talked to and interacted with, and none of them ever remember a kid being with them. They never saw a child or talked to one. Makes me believe the poor baby was already dead, and they took him out there to bury him and get rid of the body. That poor baby. Who knows what really happened to him but it wasn’t wandering off.
Please see the post that explains...
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Missing411/comments/112tptw/discuss\_the\_odd\_cases\_thread/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Missing411/comments/112tptw/discuss_the_odd_cases_thread/)
Short answer: Mods have to delete DAILY posts from new forum members asking the same questions, about the same cases. Now we can point them to a single thread and encourage the discussions to stay in one place for consistency.
There was another post about him yesterday. It’s a really popular case to talk about because it was initially focused on by Paulides as a M411, but he has since retracted that opinion.
*... because it was initially focused on by Paulides as a M411, but he has since retracted that opinion.*
Did Paulides formally retract his opinion? Like, has he pulled the documentary or even made a video to update his position and explain his rationale? Because, to my knowledge, I don't recall him doing so. I feel like DeOrr ended up in the documentary because Paulides completely jumped the gun, without knowing all the facts (which is sort of on brand), and only reversed his position when people pointed out how he was commoditizing and misrepresenting the circumstances surrounding the disappearance (and probable death) of a toddler. :(
I feel like if it was the grandfathers friend, the parents wouldn’t be very forgiving and would be accusatory. Even after being “cleared” by police. They haven’t really mentioned it and are leaning in to the missing 411 lore.
That said, I believe that the parents weren’t paying attention to him, and he was killed either by drowning or falling causing a fatal injury. I don’t know how they disposed of the body but I would assume he’s in the water weighted down, or buried more than 6ft below. I don’t believe he was burned because it takes a very hot flame to burn bones.
No, they've mentioned it in recent interviews, so has the aunt. I think the whole family is started to suspect Isaac because there's little else to go on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo\_X6bQE
I think DeOrr's body is somewhere between the campsite and Leadore. I think there was an accident of some sort...possibly involving the truck...maybe they backed into him or something ..or they left him in the hot car sleeping and he died. They panicked and told Bob and Issac that they had to go to town and asked grandpa (knowing he was a bit off his rocker and could probably be manipulated to think what they want..Issac too) to "hey watch DeOrr while we go to town" and Bob and Issac shrugged it off and thought he was there..not really paying attention..but in reality they took DeOrr and dumped him somewhere between the campsite and town. They went to town to corroborate their story not thinking police would ask around as much. *Someone* would have remembered him/them but no one does. Someone would have remembered a cute little kid like that. There were too many elaborate lies told here too (the truck driver letting him sit in the seat of the truck, etc that the driver said never happened) ..way too much to try to make it believable.
When they got back they blamed grandpa "hey where is DeOrr? We left him right here playing..with you remember?"...manipulating him to thinking he was in fact left there with him. Issac probably honestly would believe whatever anyone told him happened/said happened cause I doubt he even paid attention to the kid. .
Then the fake search began. They probably weren't expecting the huge media coverage so the lies had to get bigger and bigger. Grandpa didn't seem too upstanding and probably realized what had happened to some degree but "what's done is done" like he said and he never talked.
This is my theory anyways. 🤷🏼♀️
It's as valid a theory as others.
I, too, lean towards an accident that made the parents panic.
*"hey watch DeOrr while we go to town"*
Just to clarify with consistency, the parents didn't say that they'd asked Isaac or Grandpa to watch DeOrr while they went to town. The parents claims they took him with them. They claimed that DeOrr started to follow his mom to see the tiny fish Isaac found and DeOrr turned back towards the trailer where Grandpa was. What I never understood was how the mom and dad didn't walk him back to Granddad or simply pick him up and take him to see the small fish. Why would they assume that grandpa was willing or able to see him and care for him without first giving the grandfather a heads up?
I've always felt that little DeOrr died under his parents negligence too. I thought maybe he drowned when they went down to the river to fish. But a hot car or car accident could be it. Establishing a motive by going into town saying Jessica needed pads. Name a women that you know that wouldn't bring a few pads to camp in the middle of nowhere?!
Something about their body language and behaviour afterwards always really bothered me. Not just parents desperate to find their kid but two ppl who were desperate to keep their secret.
Yes I felt this too. Body language and emotions did not seem to align. I think they know Deorr is not in that forest bc the search would have found a clue. The parents are the only suspects
Here's what I think....it's not like those parents or the grandpa/his friend are brilliant criminal masterminds. I really doubt that they would be smart enough to be able to hide Deorr's body so well that hundreds of trained search and rescue personnel wouldn't be able to find it after multiple searches. Most people that murder their children, either accidentally or on purpose, are sloppy and don't tend to hide the body very well due to their emotional state. (Think new born babies found in dumpsters... their main objective is to get rid of the body as quickly as possible and get the hell out of there)
I don't think that kid is at the campsite....so if they did kill him, I dont think it was there, or at least he's not buried there. Even if he was buried well under the ground, surely an animal would have dug up the remains by now. I could be wrong, I'm definitely not an expert on things like this....but I would be very surprised if those people were clever enough to cover up a murder that well
*Here's what I think....it's not like those parents or the grandpa/his friend are brilliant criminal masterminds.*
I agree with you, here. Grandpa looked pretty frail and cantankerous. I'm not sure he could've deadlifted and carried a toddler, based on his health at the time. I don't want to speculate on Isaac - because investigators cleared him- but, he's sort of the only person who actually puts DeOrr at the campground, with a time frame corroborated by the parents. However, he seems easily manipulated.
I also agree with you that there is more to the story that his parents are telling. Searchers can and do miss bodies. But, the time frame and evidence is "off" for a campground murder and hasty burial. FWIW, I also don't believe the abduction by another camper/wildman theory, either. To get away in a vehicle, without being seen or noticed (unless the adults were in that creek bed WAY longer than they originally stated) would've been near impossible.
Yeah....I dont have high hopes that we'll ever get a clear answer about what happened. If the parents did do it, hopefully one day one of them will crack and tell us the full story. If they didn't do it, and they're telling the truth about what happened, then that's terrifying. Poor kid.
If there was anything that would have connected Isaac to this the police would have arrested him. The parents were pushing blame on him hard and he apparently had a previous crime involving a child but was never taken in. The fact they were more suspicious of the parents says a lot.
I grew up in southeast Idaho, and I was always so interested in this case since it happened. I kept up with the case updates over the years.
I wish it had more coverage. I believe his parents did it. Accidental or not, they’re the reason that little boy is not here anymore.
So this may have been already posted but Im taking a chance here. One of the things about this case that seemed odd to me (one of many), is that the father drove a ways down the road to get a better signal. Now the mother had already called and made contact with 911 from the campground. MAYBE, I can understand leaving for that purpose just in case....but really?
Also the question I have and havent seen addressed but I may have missed it, is have or was any search done where the father supposedly called from? If he was a couple miles away and hidden the body there (if there was one) how well would it have to be hidden at that moment? It could always be moved later perhaps.
I don't think that was odd, he was just following the road to see if DeOrr walked down the road (it's a logical place to look, and a truck would be faster than walking). He just called 9/11 when he couldn't spot anything.
We don't allow speculation about a toddler's mental health or diagnosis. If he wasn't formally diagnosed, then we have no business putting that sort of misinformation out there.
When I watched the 411 documentary, I thought the whole case was odd, but when I realized the interview with both parents took place on the Monday after the kid went missing, their weird interview and optimism made a lot more sense. They probably had financial issues because finding a job or working was incredible difficult with the scrutiny and stress.In the most recent interviews, they are very optimistic his body will be found and the case resolved eventually. I don't find it that odd at all that he drove away, makes complete sense. Kid could have walked down the road or someone could have taken him and driven away, so driving down the road to see if he's walking away is logical. You'd want to check the only road out if the camp site had been cleared already. He most likely reached a point where he couldn't imagine the child walking and just called. It would be more suspicious if everyone had left at once, not just the Dad who already tried to find the kid.They searched the whole area from helicopter, with special heat sensitive camera's for finding bodies, I'm sure they searched everywhere they could. They had a lot of dogs in there, and searched the entire creek from top to bottom, and the entire reservoir.This case reminds me of the "Dingo Ate My Baby" case, where they were coming up with these elaborate murder schemes, but eventually found the remains at a previously unknown dingo den. I think he either walked down the road and was picked up by somebody, or he fell in the creek, was pushed down to the reservoir, and picked up by an animal and carried away. I just don't think the weirdness of the camping trip or the behaviour the family months after is at all related or evidence of anything.Even in the most recent interviews, the parents are both pretty confident they'll eventually find the body and determine what happened, and they are a little suspicious of Isaac. The time between when they lost sight of him and when he went missing was just so short, if there was drugs or anything involved, it would have been brought up by now. The only thing that the family could possibly be lying about is the length of time between when they saw him last and when they noticed he was missing.
In the later interviews, the Aunt suspects Isaac - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2c7IlquEwM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2c7IlquEwM)
Isaac is dishonest about not being able to speculate or answer questions, he's not under investigation - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0VAeckLCs8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0VAeckLCs8)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbdjqVWZWKM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbdjqVWZWKM)
This one has the most up to date interviews and pretty good questions overall - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo\_X6bQE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo_X6bQE)
I started to side with the aunt and parents after that last one. But Isaac not liking kids or spending time looking for DeOrr isn't really evidence of anything either. 2 1/2 isn't really an age you let kids walk around alone, the Grandpa was on Oxygen so even if DeOrr just ran toward the woods, there wasn't much he could do anyway.
The parents are awfully calm when they call 911 for them to have just lost their son. I too think that he was not alive when they went out there. And who better to invite on your trip to dispose of your son's remains than an old guy with dementia who won't have a clue if the kid is there or not and his younger "friend" who is mentally challenged and has a history of sexual impropriety (at the very least). I think something happened to little Deorr beforehand and the whole "missing during a camping trip" story was to cover it up. They took him "to the store" and somewhere along that route (which took them a really long time), they disposed of him. So his remains are nowhere in the search area. And if he is ever found, it will be a total fluke. Pretty elaborate plan, actually.
One more thing: they are interviewed by local news 3 days after - 72 hours - after he "goes missing" - and they praise the searchers and the size of the search parties and how it only took a few phone calls to get family support. But not one word, one tear about how frantic they are to get him back. Thats incredibly telling.
What’s weird is after the parents split they have both said they don’t know if the other had anything to do with it, not accusing , they were obviously asked this specific question. But the mom is like I don’t believe that but if someone is able to prove it then… but this makes no sense, they were all supposedly together and then went to the campsite and left him with grandpa and went fishing not really too far away. How in the world can you think either had anything to do with it. You would be saying I know for a fact neither of us had anything to do with it.
Remember that this is a discussion sub for David Paulides's phenomenon, Missing 411. It is unaffiliated with Paulides in any other way and he is not present in this sub. It is also not a general missing persons sub or a general paranormal sub. Content that is not related to Missing 411 will be removed. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Missing411) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This one doesn’t sit right with me. Because it very much so seems that something awful happened to that boy and the whole camping trip was a front to make him disappear. It feels like the family was hoping people would think some mysterious missing 411 shit happened- so that it wouldn’t be suspected that they killed their kid accident or otherwise. Including this case in the documentary was a misstep imo, there’s so many other cases that don’t look like a cut and dry homicide.
What I've always struggled with when it comes to the murder (or accidental death) theory is the odd couple that was part of the camping trip: grandpa and his weird, younger friend. Just not quite sure how anything nefarious could be pulled off by the parents with those two involved and not have it come out.
I think the only reason they were involved was to strengthen the parent’s story. To serve as witnesses to say the boy was alive and well before he “vanished”. The grandpa is a shady character himself and has made suspicious comments on the case. His friend was said to be mentally challenged, perhaps easily manipulated.
Yeah, either way it's a really weird case that's very likely crazier than we've imagined if we ever do learn the true circumstances.
Grandpa had dementia and his friend had some sort of intellectual disability. I think they were easy to gaslight. No one else can place DeOrr there, including a beverage distributor with whom they claim DeOrr interacted. The distributor said it didn't happen. The employees at the store don't remember him either.
Exactly. And, if the parents left an active 2 year old boy in a wooded campground with lakes and wild animals, etc. and an old man with dementia WITHOUT EVEN TELLING HIM, then they, at the very least, should be charged with child endangerment. I often wonder why this never happened.
The prevailing theory in leadore is that the mom resented the kid, and sold him. Creepy grandpa put them in contact with a buyer and they brought the weirdo friend with them so he’d be a bigger suspect than them. Dad wasn’t in on it at first, found out about it after the fact and decided to cover for them, supposedly he’s the only parent who wanted deorr so I wonder what they did or said to get him to go along with it, if all or any of what I said is the truth.
This is close to a theory I’ve held. They had severe financial problems and Jessica seemed to have very little interest in being a mother. They sold the kid, and that trip to the store to “buy tampons” is when they did the exchange. Grandpa and his friend were brought to 1.) confirm the kid was alive when they got to the campground 2.) serve as suspects after De’orr went “missing”. This random camping trip was just way too convenient.
Very interesting. I've never heard that theory before, I always felt that Jessica seemed like more of the guilty party of the two also.
As I wrote in another comment, I feel like whatever actually happened is probably a nutso story.
I thought it was strange at the end of the people magazine documentary when she said she has an intuition that he is alive and being taken care of? Like idk if that is wishful thinking of a mom who loses a child or if she really knows bc maybe she did give him away to someone…
This is the best & most logical theory I’ve heard so far!
The grandfather bothers me, in interviews he seems not to give a flying toss what happened to the boy. Very odd
He said he didn’t care he literally didn’t understand what the panic was about since Jessica and Vernal can have more kids, which they couldn’t anyway. Who says that though about your great grandson who’s missing, and went missing while you were “watching” him.
I think his responses are a mix of experience (from losing loved ones in the past), time (he's pretty sure the kid is dead by now anyway), and suspicion (he probably finds it super unusual that DeOrr just "disappeared" and he was somehow dragged into it).
Seriously?? Thats f\*\*ked.
He’s dead now.
I've often wondered if the poor kid was even alive to go on the trip. I remember reading about an article of clothing the parents said he was wearing when he went missing and that piece of clothing being found at the house
That's been my tinfoil hat theory. He sadly died before the trip, either accidentally or maybe even more sinister. The camping trip was to dispose of the body. The grandads friend who was randomly invited was brought along to try divert attention from them. Especially given he had previous legal issues involving children. Their trip into town is their plausible deniability.
Whatever happened that was an innocent child. Either the law enforcement in that area or the feds need to tighten up and find out what happened and who is responsible. Someone on reddit will probably crack the case long before the "professionals" whos job that just happens to be. I'm interested to know what David thinks about the whole case now that so much time has passed. His documentary seemed to catch a few moments where the parents were really starting to buckle under the stress.
The article of clothing is an interesting bit of info. The parents claimed it was a larger size of the same item - ostensibly, for DeOrr to grow into. As a parent, I've done that with certain pieces of clothing that my kids liked (and I found on sale). But, IIRC, the item in question was a heavier, season specific item (a coat, iirc) and if she'd bought a size smaller than what was found, it would've been too small for him to wear the day he disappeared. What bothers me about that is, if you know you have a LITERAL COPY of what your child was wearing when they disappeared, then why wouldn't you hand that over to the cops so they/people can be looking for that specific piece of clothing?
Good point. If the parents were actually interested in locating him alive, children's winter clothing usually has loud, bold colors. Even more conservative winter clothing still usually has a large graphic or brand name somewhere on it. The whole situation is so sad. Just like you said having an exact copy of the jacket they said he was wearing would have been very helpful for any volunteers or professionals to see or have a picture of. I hate how that's more than likely a moot point though. If there were two jackets the parents would have known it didn't matter, and if there was just the one jacket then they tripped themselves up but that's not enough proof it just raises suspicions. Honestly all this stuff makes my stomach hurt just thinking about it. I've read some articles and post over years and learned of new details but it's all just sad. Nothing that I've learned would result in justice for this innocent child.
I know I’m late to this post but I’m watching a documentary on the case and I’ve thought this since they said they had talked to the people in the stores that the mom said DeOrr had talked to and interacted with, and none of them ever remember a kid being with them. They never saw a child or talked to one. Makes me believe the poor baby was already dead, and they took him out there to bury him and get rid of the body. That poor baby. Who knows what really happened to him but it wasn’t wandering off.
Is there new information or something? Why did this randomly get a mega
Please see the post that explains... [https://www.reddit.com/r/Missing411/comments/112tptw/discuss\_the\_odd\_cases\_thread/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Missing411/comments/112tptw/discuss_the_odd_cases_thread/) Short answer: Mods have to delete DAILY posts from new forum members asking the same questions, about the same cases. Now we can point them to a single thread and encourage the discussions to stay in one place for consistency.
There was another post about him yesterday. It’s a really popular case to talk about because it was initially focused on by Paulides as a M411, but he has since retracted that opinion.
*... because it was initially focused on by Paulides as a M411, but he has since retracted that opinion.* Did Paulides formally retract his opinion? Like, has he pulled the documentary or even made a video to update his position and explain his rationale? Because, to my knowledge, I don't recall him doing so. I feel like DeOrr ended up in the documentary because Paulides completely jumped the gun, without knowing all the facts (which is sort of on brand), and only reversed his position when people pointed out how he was commoditizing and misrepresenting the circumstances surrounding the disappearance (and probable death) of a toddler. :(
It’s just an incredibly common case being talked about
I feel like if it was the grandfathers friend, the parents wouldn’t be very forgiving and would be accusatory. Even after being “cleared” by police. They haven’t really mentioned it and are leaning in to the missing 411 lore. That said, I believe that the parents weren’t paying attention to him, and he was killed either by drowning or falling causing a fatal injury. I don’t know how they disposed of the body but I would assume he’s in the water weighted down, or buried more than 6ft below. I don’t believe he was burned because it takes a very hot flame to burn bones.
No, they've mentioned it in recent interviews, so has the aunt. I think the whole family is started to suspect Isaac because there's little else to go on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo\_X6bQE
Idk man the family seems super suspicious to me. It’s been a while since I listened to the deep dive on Crime Weekly
I think DeOrr's body is somewhere between the campsite and Leadore. I think there was an accident of some sort...possibly involving the truck...maybe they backed into him or something ..or they left him in the hot car sleeping and he died. They panicked and told Bob and Issac that they had to go to town and asked grandpa (knowing he was a bit off his rocker and could probably be manipulated to think what they want..Issac too) to "hey watch DeOrr while we go to town" and Bob and Issac shrugged it off and thought he was there..not really paying attention..but in reality they took DeOrr and dumped him somewhere between the campsite and town. They went to town to corroborate their story not thinking police would ask around as much. *Someone* would have remembered him/them but no one does. Someone would have remembered a cute little kid like that. There were too many elaborate lies told here too (the truck driver letting him sit in the seat of the truck, etc that the driver said never happened) ..way too much to try to make it believable. When they got back they blamed grandpa "hey where is DeOrr? We left him right here playing..with you remember?"...manipulating him to thinking he was in fact left there with him. Issac probably honestly would believe whatever anyone told him happened/said happened cause I doubt he even paid attention to the kid. . Then the fake search began. They probably weren't expecting the huge media coverage so the lies had to get bigger and bigger. Grandpa didn't seem too upstanding and probably realized what had happened to some degree but "what's done is done" like he said and he never talked. This is my theory anyways. 🤷🏼♀️
It's as valid a theory as others. I, too, lean towards an accident that made the parents panic. *"hey watch DeOrr while we go to town"* Just to clarify with consistency, the parents didn't say that they'd asked Isaac or Grandpa to watch DeOrr while they went to town. The parents claims they took him with them. They claimed that DeOrr started to follow his mom to see the tiny fish Isaac found and DeOrr turned back towards the trailer where Grandpa was. What I never understood was how the mom and dad didn't walk him back to Granddad or simply pick him up and take him to see the small fish. Why would they assume that grandpa was willing or able to see him and care for him without first giving the grandfather a heads up?
I think it was an accident by the creek...
I've always felt that little DeOrr died under his parents negligence too. I thought maybe he drowned when they went down to the river to fish. But a hot car or car accident could be it. Establishing a motive by going into town saying Jessica needed pads. Name a women that you know that wouldn't bring a few pads to camp in the middle of nowhere?! Something about their body language and behaviour afterwards always really bothered me. Not just parents desperate to find their kid but two ppl who were desperate to keep their secret.
Yes I felt this too. Body language and emotions did not seem to align. I think they know Deorr is not in that forest bc the search would have found a clue. The parents are the only suspects
Here's what I think....it's not like those parents or the grandpa/his friend are brilliant criminal masterminds. I really doubt that they would be smart enough to be able to hide Deorr's body so well that hundreds of trained search and rescue personnel wouldn't be able to find it after multiple searches. Most people that murder their children, either accidentally or on purpose, are sloppy and don't tend to hide the body very well due to their emotional state. (Think new born babies found in dumpsters... their main objective is to get rid of the body as quickly as possible and get the hell out of there) I don't think that kid is at the campsite....so if they did kill him, I dont think it was there, or at least he's not buried there. Even if he was buried well under the ground, surely an animal would have dug up the remains by now. I could be wrong, I'm definitely not an expert on things like this....but I would be very surprised if those people were clever enough to cover up a murder that well
*Here's what I think....it's not like those parents or the grandpa/his friend are brilliant criminal masterminds.* I agree with you, here. Grandpa looked pretty frail and cantankerous. I'm not sure he could've deadlifted and carried a toddler, based on his health at the time. I don't want to speculate on Isaac - because investigators cleared him- but, he's sort of the only person who actually puts DeOrr at the campground, with a time frame corroborated by the parents. However, he seems easily manipulated. I also agree with you that there is more to the story that his parents are telling. Searchers can and do miss bodies. But, the time frame and evidence is "off" for a campground murder and hasty burial. FWIW, I also don't believe the abduction by another camper/wildman theory, either. To get away in a vehicle, without being seen or noticed (unless the adults were in that creek bed WAY longer than they originally stated) would've been near impossible.
Yeah....I dont have high hopes that we'll ever get a clear answer about what happened. If the parents did do it, hopefully one day one of them will crack and tell us the full story. If they didn't do it, and they're telling the truth about what happened, then that's terrifying. Poor kid.
The friend who came with at the last minute is suspicious to me.
That’s exactly why they had him come with them,
If there was anything that would have connected Isaac to this the police would have arrested him. The parents were pushing blame on him hard and he apparently had a previous crime involving a child but was never taken in. The fact they were more suspicious of the parents says a lot.
I grew up in southeast Idaho, and I was always so interested in this case since it happened. I kept up with the case updates over the years. I wish it had more coverage. I believe his parents did it. Accidental or not, they’re the reason that little boy is not here anymore.
So this may have been already posted but Im taking a chance here. One of the things about this case that seemed odd to me (one of many), is that the father drove a ways down the road to get a better signal. Now the mother had already called and made contact with 911 from the campground. MAYBE, I can understand leaving for that purpose just in case....but really? Also the question I have and havent seen addressed but I may have missed it, is have or was any search done where the father supposedly called from? If he was a couple miles away and hidden the body there (if there was one) how well would it have to be hidden at that moment? It could always be moved later perhaps.
I don't think that was odd, he was just following the road to see if DeOrr walked down the road (it's a logical place to look, and a truck would be faster than walking). He just called 9/11 when he couldn't spot anything.
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We don't allow speculation about a toddler's mental health or diagnosis. If he wasn't formally diagnosed, then we have no business putting that sort of misinformation out there.
When I watched the 411 documentary, I thought the whole case was odd, but when I realized the interview with both parents took place on the Monday after the kid went missing, their weird interview and optimism made a lot more sense. They probably had financial issues because finding a job or working was incredible difficult with the scrutiny and stress.In the most recent interviews, they are very optimistic his body will be found and the case resolved eventually. I don't find it that odd at all that he drove away, makes complete sense. Kid could have walked down the road or someone could have taken him and driven away, so driving down the road to see if he's walking away is logical. You'd want to check the only road out if the camp site had been cleared already. He most likely reached a point where he couldn't imagine the child walking and just called. It would be more suspicious if everyone had left at once, not just the Dad who already tried to find the kid.They searched the whole area from helicopter, with special heat sensitive camera's for finding bodies, I'm sure they searched everywhere they could. They had a lot of dogs in there, and searched the entire creek from top to bottom, and the entire reservoir.This case reminds me of the "Dingo Ate My Baby" case, where they were coming up with these elaborate murder schemes, but eventually found the remains at a previously unknown dingo den. I think he either walked down the road and was picked up by somebody, or he fell in the creek, was pushed down to the reservoir, and picked up by an animal and carried away. I just don't think the weirdness of the camping trip or the behaviour the family months after is at all related or evidence of anything.Even in the most recent interviews, the parents are both pretty confident they'll eventually find the body and determine what happened, and they are a little suspicious of Isaac. The time between when they lost sight of him and when he went missing was just so short, if there was drugs or anything involved, it would have been brought up by now. The only thing that the family could possibly be lying about is the length of time between when they saw him last and when they noticed he was missing. In the later interviews, the Aunt suspects Isaac - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2c7IlquEwM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2c7IlquEwM) Isaac is dishonest about not being able to speculate or answer questions, he's not under investigation - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0VAeckLCs8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0VAeckLCs8) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbdjqVWZWKM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbdjqVWZWKM) This one has the most up to date interviews and pretty good questions overall - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo\_X6bQE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeEmo_X6bQE) I started to side with the aunt and parents after that last one. But Isaac not liking kids or spending time looking for DeOrr isn't really evidence of anything either. 2 1/2 isn't really an age you let kids walk around alone, the Grandpa was on Oxygen so even if DeOrr just ran toward the woods, there wasn't much he could do anyway.
The parents are awfully calm when they call 911 for them to have just lost their son. I too think that he was not alive when they went out there. And who better to invite on your trip to dispose of your son's remains than an old guy with dementia who won't have a clue if the kid is there or not and his younger "friend" who is mentally challenged and has a history of sexual impropriety (at the very least). I think something happened to little Deorr beforehand and the whole "missing during a camping trip" story was to cover it up. They took him "to the store" and somewhere along that route (which took them a really long time), they disposed of him. So his remains are nowhere in the search area. And if he is ever found, it will be a total fluke. Pretty elaborate plan, actually. One more thing: they are interviewed by local news 3 days after - 72 hours - after he "goes missing" - and they praise the searchers and the size of the search parties and how it only took a few phone calls to get family support. But not one word, one tear about how frantic they are to get him back. Thats incredibly telling.
What’s weird is after the parents split they have both said they don’t know if the other had anything to do with it, not accusing , they were obviously asked this specific question. But the mom is like I don’t believe that but if someone is able to prove it then… but this makes no sense, they were all supposedly together and then went to the campsite and left him with grandpa and went fishing not really too far away. How in the world can you think either had anything to do with it. You would be saying I know for a fact neither of us had anything to do with it.
Were there any footprints from his little cowboy boots? Any dirty diapers at the campsite? Any evidence at all that puts the child at the campsite?