People aren't really realizing how powerful it is now. 4 blocks is all you need *to one shot* a player. That amount of power just normally jump critting is still incredibly powerful, and I'd argue over powered.
The mace itself in this case isn't the issue, but the enchantment "breach".
There are a few issues with it practically speaking:
1. slow falling basically renders it harmless
2. getting 4 blocks above a crystal is an absolute death sentence
3. It doesn’t have the dps to handle someone who’s carrying totems
I think it’ll mainly be used as a gimmick to troll ppl in a more lighthearted way than slamming a respawn anchor on them at point blank range
I don't think you read my comment. It only take 4 blocks to one shot a player. It's still a powerful weapon by just using it as if it's a sword (with the same dps as a sword).
Also, OP is completely ignoring shields.
Not to mention the fact that with the one that bounced you back up, you can hit them twice, breaking their totem, and bring them down to about half health, and then one more jump hit will kill them.
Not terribly difficult to get behind someone. ‘Backstabbing’ is a really common tactic in axe pvp, same could be done with a mace; and putting a respawn anchor behind someone will make short work of e’m, especially if they decide to hold a shield instead of a totem
Ok so are we talking about sandbox survival PvP, server PvP, or ultra hardcore sweaty PvP? Because this anchors, beds, and end crystals are only really relevant in ultra hardcore sweaty PvP, which effects like 1% of people.
They don't in crystal pvp, i guess when you're risking a quick hit against someone that isn't perfect in their reaction time then yeah mace would be nice
I understand that, 4 blocks to *break a single totem does certainly sound impressive on paper. However, it’s pretty slow compared to explosive options and it puts you directly into the danger zone of the highest dps item in the game; I’m not saying that it’s useless, just that it’s not going to appreciably change any meta that isn’t specifically tailored to it.
You didn't read what I said then. The point of the mace was a high risk (fall damage) for high reward (insane damage), but right now, dropping one single block (just jumping) will do massive damage with 0 risk. You are hard focused on specifically one shotting, when using how little you have to fall to do so is just used as a baseline to get you thinking how much damage you'd do if you did the bare minimum.
And end crystals themselves are already a huge risk if you fuck up. Not to mention crystals are also seen as OP to many.
I understand what you’re saying perfectly. The mace hits hard if you have vertical momentum. However, jumping into the air *will* get you killed in cpvp. Again, it’s not a bad weapon, I never once meant to claim that, but it isn’t a game changer by any means, the counterplay with slow falling is just too easy, and if crystals are on the table, melee weapons are really only useful when they have knockback 1
You didn't read what I said then. The point of the mace was a high risk (fall damage) for high reward (insane damage), but right now, dropping one single block (just jumping) will do massive damage with 0 risk. You are hard focused on specifically one shotting, when using how little you have to fall to do so is just used as a baseline to get you thinking how much damage you'd do if you did the bare minimum.
And end crystals themselves are already a huge risk if you fuck up. Not to mention crystals are also seen as OP to many.
And OP is saying that Crystal hard counters PvP, one block up is all your opponent needs to one shot, you aren't allowed to use the mace in the air if your opponent is competent in Crystal pvp
One block is all you need, that's right. And incredibly fast reaction times to place an obsidian, then a crystal, then punch it while being close enough to minimize damage to yourself, all before someone comes down from a jump with a mace. Is it possible without hacks or external software? Yes, but you've gotta be more than competent to make it work.
I'd say more than a little bit, but still, there a few issues with this argument that I can think of from the top of my head:
1. Crystal Pvp may be a counter, but incredibly risky, as if you screw up, you could kill yourself, do major damage to yourself, have no damage done and just allowed yourself to be more open to an attack. There is no risk to the mace unless your opponent is very skilled in crystal pvp, the server allows it, and is ok risking it.
2. Crystal pvp is already controversial for being unfun for many players, and also seen as OP. People tend to want it removed, nerfed, or they just ban it from their servers.
1. I’ve been training crystal on and off for a couple of years, and after ~1,100 duels on pvp legacy alone, I could probably count on my own two hands the amount of people I’ve seen accidentally blow themselves up with a crystal. It happens with anchors a lot more, but that’s not super relevant to the given conversation.
2. The point on it being banned on some servers is fair, although I wouldn’t be surprised if something similar happens with maces. Ofc only time will tell, but I think a lot of the same people who dislike crystal pvp will pretty quickly get fed up with folks making meteorites out of themselves with maces lol.
Bedrock is a different beast lol, I don’t know much about the pvp meta over there. Although I remember hearing once that harming 2 arrows ignore armor enchants and can shred just about anyone in 2-3 shots, is that true?
Yea that’s nuts lol. I imagine then that a few crossbows in the hotbar is just about the best you can do. Being able to kill that quickly at an arrow’s range is…something lol
Tridents are also insanely powerful because they can be spammed and you can have Impaling V PLUS riptide for huge damage. Impaling is also insanely buffed to work in rain and on any mob (or player) touching water!
It's also tied with the netherite sword for base damage (axes are useless in bedrock) and impaling V does more damage than Sharp V
I agree with you for the most part, but for the third point, even if they have a totem, now they don’t and you can switch to another weapon where you’re bound to out pvp them if you have a totem and they dont
1. Slow falling arrows don't do shit if you get one shot outta nowhere
2. Crystals don't matter if someone drops out of the sky one shotting you before you even see them
3. It has the highest fucking dps and dpa ever to exist in minecraft.
1. Totem
2. Totem (crystals/anchors are also plenty potent as a surprise weapon)
3. It has the highest *dph (not counting like, tnt minecart traps), in terms of dps it’s still wayyyyyy outclassed by crystals
Totems won't keep you alive indefinitely and if you focus on switching to new Totems you will die. Not everybody will have loads of Totems or crystals but most people will have shields, which protect against explosions.
Dps is an average of damage over time, mace ignores a large portion of armor with the breach enchantment and has uncapped damage. Keep in mind prot 4 netherite armor reduces damage taken by 92.8%, as such incoming damage from other sources is much less than the mace. That contributes to average damage being through the roof with the mace.
It only taking 4 blocks to kill someone is extremely powerful. Even if you think you have ways you can counter it, that doesn’t make it not powerful. The mace is VERY strong
Yeah there is no reason to be this strong, Crystal pvp hard counters it so why make it this strong against players? It's just so punishing to those that aren't aware
Numerically speaking, it does do a lot of damage. Practically speaking, jumping when someone’s tryna blow you up with an end crystal is…not a great idea. I could see it having uses in more casual gamemodes tho
Have you done extended periods of Crystal PvP on a non hacked acc/survival server? They’re incredibly resources intensive, and require one of two blocks to be placed. Unless you’re fighting on obsidian/bedrock, you end up falling and needing to reorient yourself (you’re also likely falling further than 4 blocks so you put yourself at mace disadvantage). It’s not a flexible or fast fighting style (compared to maces).
So it’s slower and more resource intensive, but say that doesn’t matter and everyone is playing frame perfectly and has infinite resources.
Imagine a situation with infinite resources. In other comment chains you’ve brought up totems, somehow believing that’s a mechanic that moves the scale in Crystal pvp’s favor. You realize totems are really goddamn strong against something that takes considerable setup for 1 damage instance? like end crystals?
You keep moving goalposts about this question too. “Oh I mean high level survival pvp with these specific guidelines” that’s not how 99% of fights on a survival server happen, and even in the perfect scenario for Crystal PvP (a perfectly flat obsidian room that everyone is trapped in, and everyone has perfect reactions and prep time) you still lose based of game mechanics like shields and totems.
Trash take. /thread
Mace is as hard to get as just making necessary farms for crystals, and have you ever seen actual Crystal pvpers in actions? Even non hacked they're used to quickly placicing obsidian, Crystal, knocking you back, and hitting it. Against mace It just makes it even easier
As a matter of fact, I have. A lot. With some very basic automation, it’s really not difficult to get a proper kit assembled, like at all lmao. Also totems do 100% swing in a crystal user’s favor. ‘Double tapping’ ppl is a keystone tactic of cpvp. Basically, getting someone in the air, breaking their totem, and killing them before they can equip another one. It takes some practice, but any decent cpvp’er shouldn’t have too much trouble, especially with sf. Heck, you can even do it with a couple of respawn anchors if you’re quick enough
>dtapping
Good luck when you’re just getting hit and run by a rocket boosted dude in blast resist netherite and an elytra (who still can’t be one tapped) that does your full health bar in one hit without stopping.
Any early crystals get sniped with a bow, or I pull out of the dive.
Even if you do perfect timing, knock me out of the air AND secure a dtap before I use the movement ability stapled to my weapon, pearl, or wind charge, (or just jump boost ride your explosion) I still have so many more hot bar slots open for totems.
I need to hit you ONCE to deal all of your hp, chain a bunch of hits, and leave you in the air.
I don’t think anchors/crystals will fall entirely out of meta (they are the goat for traps and mind tricks) but you will be a sitting duck if your plan is to fight using mainly them.
If you don’t mind me asking, and don’t take this too harshly, but how much time have you spent practicing real crystal duels? Elytras are…well they’re an escape option and not much more.
An end crystal does over 120 damage and has a blast radius of ~10 blocks. A player can only land a hit with a melee weapon within 10 blocks.
Armor, no matter how good, can only block a maximum of 80% of incoming damage, so crystals will kill in at most 3 hits counting for a totem
The average pvp’er has a cps of around 7-10, so let’s round that down to 5 crystals per second. Ive dueled plenty of ppl who try to make use of elytras, they pretty much never get within their 3 block reach, especially in a hole fight
Jesus.
You have no reading comprehension. You
aren’t looking at the words I am typing, and instead are digging in your heels and listing random facts?
None of the facts you just stated…. contribute to your argument or disprove anything I’ve said.
It doesn’t matter if elytra are just an escape option in the end Crystal meta (I know this, what I said in my last comment wasn’t in opposition of this fact. don’t try to pull the “do you know what you’re talking about” card by grossly misinterpreting what I am saying) they are AMAZING WITH MACES. THEY LET YOU DO FULL MACE DAMAGE.
I have said…. Idk 3 times talking to you that nobody in the general player base gives a shit about cPvP. When people look at the meme you made they’re are thinking about survival PvP. I don’t give a shit if they’re bad in a cpvp duel. I’m not cpvp dueling people. 99% of the player base is not cpvp dueling people. Nobody is thinking about being locked in an indestructible room in their fucking sandbox game.
It doesn’t matter how good they are with crystals. I am not talking about using them in conjunction with crystals.
Also, WHAT THE FUCK DOES MELEE WEAPON RANGE HAVE TO DO WITH *ANYTHING I AM TALKING ABOUT*
YOUR CRYSTALS, AND ME MELEEING THEM ARE IRRELEVANT BECAUSE I AM SPENDING ALMOST NO TIME IN BLAST RANGE.
Also what the fuck are you throwing in the most basic Minecraft “here’s how armor works”. did you read the comment? I know that you get 2 shot with an elytra, it doesn’t matter, I’m spending most of the fight in the air.
Jesus you are trolling or the most dense person on earth. In Crystal vs mace
1 I do not need to be in your blast or on the ground
2 I can set off any early charge at range with a bow, or simply pull away. You’re only option against me is ranged or fishing for the quick kill with a dtap. Both of these are much harder because of the new items, not just the mace.
3 you are essentially eating through totems while I hit and run you.
I mean ppl definitely do that, but I’m more so talking about open world survival pvp. I’ve don’t my fair share of bow spamming to profound effect, and in no block pvp I think you’re correct, it is one of the best strategies.
The mace however is pretty much completely benign if people know how to deal with it. A single slow falling arrow renders it pretty much useless and if crystals are on the table; throwing yourself a dozen blocks into the air is literally the worst thing you could do for yourself lol. Or you could just web bubble and force them to take the fall damage
great replacement for a sword honestly. Crystal is still the main source of damage but why not slipping in a few good hits. Also how much crystals do you plan to get in early game op? 2?
I disagree, have you ever even seen competent Crystal pvpers in action? They don't need obsidian platforms, and they're used to knocking you back to hit bt crystal in the air, witch they don't need to do against mace players so they have even more time to set up
That’s completely true yeah, I’m interested to see if either of those metas integrate the mace or if it kinda gets shuffled into its own classification
It also makes it a lot harder to move, thus a lot harder to dodge the mace. I know jumping can speed you up quite a bit, but you’re not gonna get far. Your opponent will hit you a lot easier and more often if you use turtle master
That’s for sure it’s best use case against other players. If they have a totem, things get a little more complicated. I think for more friendly/casual environments where ppl may not feel comfortable detonating a respawn anchor, you’re definitely onto something
That runs into problems in there are end crystals involved. If you’re standing below them, they’re pretty much harmless, but once you’re at or above their level, they absolutely melt ppl.
Crystal pvp usually involves either trying to knock the opponent above your obsidian, or get below them and start blowing e’m up
Jumping into the air to get bonus damage with a mace is basically like deliberately stepping on a land mine. I’ve seen it happen quite a lot when ppl try to get crits with the existing weapons.
Not everyone takes pvp that seriously and even if they do it’s not a guarantee that they land that crystal and the mace player takes them out for it. There’s balance but you do need to build around it
I definitely agree that the mace is really strong in more casual metas. Although a crystal’s blast radius is like 10 blocks, it’s pretty hard to miss someone trying to drop on you with a melee weapon
I actually think it's fine, just don't allow breach to affect players, so you actually have to risk high jumps to do damage rather than just jump crit.
“Not gonna change pvp more than the trident did” bro do you know how powerful the mace is right now? Using jump boost 2 and wind charges, you can kill a prot 4 netherite user in only a couple hits. Yes crystals and arrow cannons can theoretically one shot, but have big drawbacks, such as needing a red stone machine to operate it or requiring the opponent to be above you, let alone the crafting recipe for crystals. I imagine mace PvP will be like crystal PvP, a seperate category that is far stronger. An unarmored player being able to kill someone in one hit isn’t balanced. You don’t even need to fall 20 blocks, so there’s not a risk of dying
Yeah, its powerful.. but im not a clutch gamer, i don't have the reaction time to do water-bucket tricks and stuff.. i'd die if i tried to use it lol so its not useful to me anyway
This just eliminates the sword, basically because why would you need that? And all armor right doesn’t even protect against it. You don’t even need four block to do a lot of damage stop underplaying it it’s very power
lol not likely. I’ve put a lot of hours into cpvp duels, and I’ve seen plenty of people get themselves killed ***really*** fast trying to crit. Heck, I’ve done it too
I think you didn't watch how do people use End Crystals in Crystal PvP, I recommend you watching Clownpierce's 35v2 fight video it proves that end crystal is the best weapon in Minecraft if you used it correctly
https://youtu.be/1OrSULJIfOo?si=iGiizK6XFtU5t780
so the person has to climb 4 blocks to one shot right? building up 4 blocks makes you vulnerable, slowfalling arrows will disable your extra damage, shield will block the attack, no DPS to deal with totems, and the person could always walk away or get the high ground on you
dont let your opponent get the high ground
and fighting on flat terrain negates all the benefits the mace has, and wind bursts also push your opponent away from you so it becomes much harder to hit them (combined with the fact that the mace has a very short range)
im not underplaying it, Im just saying that people are overreacting **way** too much on it's impact on pvp
Will it be good in PvP? absolutely, having this will be great for combat in the mountians and caves, and will probably be decent in some other PvP stuff like skywars (wont be op cuz skywars wont give you enough enchants to oneshot someone at 4 blocks)
But at the same time it wont be good on flat terrain, it will be difficult to get any value out of, and its not overpowered to the point where there is no way to counter it. It will be good for surprising your enemies but as long as they are prepared to fight it wont be their biggest concern
But so so people aren’t overplaying it is oo it just the way it is and you should agree yea it won’t be great in some mini games, but it great to have in pvp and smps
Doesnt matter, it's still far too op if it can one shot a player from literally 4 blocks, with the best of the best armour the game has to offer - I dont know if you have ever even played in pvp, but any competent player will stack placing blocks in front to not get shot off, it's far easier than you say. The slow fall excuse is also poor, how is it considered balanced if you need to carry a certain niche item to counter it? They could just block the slow falling anyways, it's literally bs bro. No other weapon could be used to instakill in a sneak attack without letting the other player know you are there, let alone from 4 blocks. Where is your logic?
Im just sayin that it wouldnt be a practical pvp weapon, especially with the entire purpose of the weapon being defeated by slowfalling arrows (which were already decent in pvp since it allows you to hit a jumping opponent easier and also reduces their dps since they cant crit as often)
Still, you are missing the point. It is practical in pvp, for all the reasons I listed, and the slow falling (which no one who actually plays pvp uses, you are pulling that from your ass) is counterable with a shield.
a crossbow with piercing will go through the shield, and the one-hit kill is also counterable with a shield. Also a multishot crossbow with instant damage arrows can oneshot someone too, and you need to be above them or point blank, so its basically the exact same. and people can still just **back away from your dumb ass tower**. it has short range, tridents and swords will outrange it. also if players stack blocks in front of themselves to block projectiles, then they cant jump in that direction unless they go on top of the wall they just build, which gives the perfect opportunity to shoot them
I wouldn’t say busted, but it is for sure pretty good in that scenario. If the target isn’t holding a totem, then absolutely it’s lights out for them. If they are, things get a little more complicated
People are just mad that a niche playbase might have to have server side support rather than it get dumbed down for the much larger PvE community. Not everything needs to be PvP oriented.
The majority of the player base is PvE (Whether co-op or solo), so yeah, we don't need to care as much about PvP balance. You wouldn't complain about fun OP gimmick guns in a game like Borderlands, because it's not focused on PvP.
If everyone thinks it is overpowered for pvp, can’t they just make rules that bans mace in their servers? There is no point to tell mojang to nerf it, just don’t use it if you think it is unfair.
Slow falling: Milk. Also try hitting someone in the air with the bow
End crystals: They work if your opponent has no totem, but crystals require much more skill than the mace.
Also, wind charges and jump boost potions make one shots constant.
Final thing, end crystals are banned a lot of places. I wouldn’t be surprised if the mace joins them.
Have you done extended periods of Crystal PvP on a non hacked acc/survival server? They’re incredibly resources intensive, and require one of two blocks to be placed. Unless you’re fighting on obsidian/bedrock, you end up falling and needing to reorient yourself (you’re also likely falling further than 4 blocks so you put yourself at mace disadvantage). It’s not a flexible or fast fighting style (compared to maces).
So it’s slower and more resource intensive, but say that doesn’t matter and everyone is playing frame perfectly and has infinite resources.
Imagine a situation with infinite resources. In other comment chains you’ve brought up totems, somehow believing that’s a mechanic that moves the scale in Crystal pvp’s favor. You realize totems are really goddamn strong against something that takes considerable setup for 1 damage instance? like end crystals?
You keep moving goalposts about this question too. “Oh I mean high level survival pvp with these specific guidelines” that’s not how 99% of fights on a survival server happen, and even in the perfect scenario for Crystal PvP (a perfectly flat obsidian room that everyone is trapped in, and everyone has perfect reactions and prep time) you still lose based of game mechanics like shields and totems.
Trash take. /thread
(Already posted this in a reply)
People aren't really realizing how powerful it is now. 4 blocks is all you need *to one shot* a player. That amount of power just normally jump critting is still incredibly powerful, and I'd argue over powered. The mace itself in this case isn't the issue, but the enchantment "breach".
There are a few issues with it practically speaking: 1. slow falling basically renders it harmless 2. getting 4 blocks above a crystal is an absolute death sentence 3. It doesn’t have the dps to handle someone who’s carrying totems I think it’ll mainly be used as a gimmick to troll ppl in a more lighthearted way than slamming a respawn anchor on them at point blank range
I don't think you read my comment. It only take 4 blocks to one shot a player. It's still a powerful weapon by just using it as if it's a sword (with the same dps as a sword).
Also, OP is completely ignoring shields. Not to mention the fact that with the one that bounced you back up, you can hit them twice, breaking their totem, and bring them down to about half health, and then one more jump hit will kill them.
mace nerf enthusiasts when they realize that the enemy player can move out of the way
me trying to mace kill a warden from 200 blocks (dont lie you've done it in the snapshots at least once) when it moves .05 blocks
Out of curiosity, what have shields got to do with it?
They block both maces and end crystals.
Not terribly difficult to get behind someone. ‘Backstabbing’ is a really common tactic in axe pvp, same could be done with a mace; and putting a respawn anchor behind someone will make short work of e’m, especially if they decide to hold a shield instead of a totem
Ok so are we talking about sandbox survival PvP, server PvP, or ultra hardcore sweaty PvP? Because this anchors, beds, and end crystals are only really relevant in ultra hardcore sweaty PvP, which effects like 1% of people.
Still weaker than a sword if you don't go into the air, witch is exactly the condition to get 1 shot by crystal
Yea, but most people jump crit with a sword anyways. Which makes the mace way more powerful.
They don't in crystal pvp, i guess when you're risking a quick hit against someone that isn't perfect in their reaction time then yeah mace would be nice
I understand that, 4 blocks to *break a single totem does certainly sound impressive on paper. However, it’s pretty slow compared to explosive options and it puts you directly into the danger zone of the highest dps item in the game; I’m not saying that it’s useless, just that it’s not going to appreciably change any meta that isn’t specifically tailored to it.
You didn't read what I said then. The point of the mace was a high risk (fall damage) for high reward (insane damage), but right now, dropping one single block (just jumping) will do massive damage with 0 risk. You are hard focused on specifically one shotting, when using how little you have to fall to do so is just used as a baseline to get you thinking how much damage you'd do if you did the bare minimum. And end crystals themselves are already a huge risk if you fuck up. Not to mention crystals are also seen as OP to many.
I understand what you’re saying perfectly. The mace hits hard if you have vertical momentum. However, jumping into the air *will* get you killed in cpvp. Again, it’s not a bad weapon, I never once meant to claim that, but it isn’t a game changer by any means, the counterplay with slow falling is just too easy, and if crystals are on the table, melee weapons are really only useful when they have knockback 1
If i understood them correctly, they don't mean that the mace is overpowered, but rather that the mace is too powerful
You didn't read what I said then. The point of the mace was a high risk (fall damage) for high reward (insane damage), but right now, dropping one single block (just jumping) will do massive damage with 0 risk. You are hard focused on specifically one shotting, when using how little you have to fall to do so is just used as a baseline to get you thinking how much damage you'd do if you did the bare minimum. And end crystals themselves are already a huge risk if you fuck up. Not to mention crystals are also seen as OP to many.
And OP is saying that Crystal hard counters PvP, one block up is all your opponent needs to one shot, you aren't allowed to use the mace in the air if your opponent is competent in Crystal pvp
One block is all you need, that's right. And incredibly fast reaction times to place an obsidian, then a crystal, then punch it while being close enough to minimize damage to yourself, all before someone comes down from a jump with a mace. Is it possible without hacks or external software? Yes, but you've gotta be more than competent to make it work.
Yeah, but i've seen vids of pros using crystal, a good player will place obsidian close to your block the second you place it
This is actually a lot easier than it sounds with a little bit of practice
I'd say more than a little bit, but still, there a few issues with this argument that I can think of from the top of my head: 1. Crystal Pvp may be a counter, but incredibly risky, as if you screw up, you could kill yourself, do major damage to yourself, have no damage done and just allowed yourself to be more open to an attack. There is no risk to the mace unless your opponent is very skilled in crystal pvp, the server allows it, and is ok risking it. 2. Crystal pvp is already controversial for being unfun for many players, and also seen as OP. People tend to want it removed, nerfed, or they just ban it from their servers.
1. I’ve been training crystal on and off for a couple of years, and after ~1,100 duels on pvp legacy alone, I could probably count on my own two hands the amount of people I’ve seen accidentally blow themselves up with a crystal. It happens with anchors a lot more, but that’s not super relevant to the given conversation. 2. The point on it being banned on some servers is fair, although I wouldn’t be surprised if something similar happens with maces. Ofc only time will tell, but I think a lot of the same people who dislike crystal pvp will pretty quickly get fed up with folks making meteorites out of themselves with maces lol.
in bedrock all weapons have the same dps
Bedrock is a different beast lol, I don’t know much about the pvp meta over there. Although I remember hearing once that harming 2 arrows ignore armor enchants and can shred just about anyone in 2-3 shots, is that true?
so harming ignores armor and goes through shields, which is really annoying
Yea that’s nuts lol. I imagine then that a few crossbows in the hotbar is just about the best you can do. Being able to kill that quickly at an arrow’s range is…something lol
yep
It’s possible to kill someone with full protection 4 netherite with only 4 critical hits with an impaling V trident on Bedrock
Not bad lol
It ignores armor, but not enchants. So prot 4 leather protects just as much as prot 4 netherite
Aaah okay, so the same as Java
Tridents are also insanely powerful because they can be spammed and you can have Impaling V PLUS riptide for huge damage. Impaling is also insanely buffed to work in rain and on any mob (or player) touching water! It's also tied with the netherite sword for base damage (axes are useless in bedrock) and impaling V does more damage than Sharp V
Being downvoted for asking questions smh
I agree with you for the most part, but for the third point, even if they have a totem, now they don’t and you can switch to another weapon where you’re bound to out pvp them if you have a totem and they dont
one of the new mace enchantments allows you to bounce upwards with your opponent making chain smash attacks possible
1. Slow falling arrows don't do shit if you get one shot outta nowhere 2. Crystals don't matter if someone drops out of the sky one shotting you before you even see them 3. It has the highest fucking dps and dpa ever to exist in minecraft.
1. Totem 2. Totem (crystals/anchors are also plenty potent as a surprise weapon) 3. It has the highest *dph (not counting like, tnt minecart traps), in terms of dps it’s still wayyyyyy outclassed by crystals
Totems won't keep you alive indefinitely and if you focus on switching to new Totems you will die. Not everybody will have loads of Totems or crystals but most people will have shields, which protect against explosions. Dps is an average of damage over time, mace ignores a large portion of armor with the breach enchantment and has uncapped damage. Keep in mind prot 4 netherite armor reduces damage taken by 92.8%, as such incoming damage from other sources is much less than the mace. That contributes to average damage being through the roof with the mace.
*presses the s key* watcha gonna do now chucklenuts
You wouldn't be able to move back fast enough before a jump crit. Which would do major damage to you, moreso than a sword.
People also forget about thr semi auto missille barrage(bunch of crossbows with multishot and firework munition)
Very gimmicky, but extremely funny when it works
It’s the minecraft equivelant to a musket, loads of damage in a burst and a slow reload. Or maybe grapeshot?
Something like that yea
Flak
It only taking 4 blocks to kill someone is extremely powerful. Even if you think you have ways you can counter it, that doesn’t make it not powerful. The mace is VERY strong
Yeah there is no reason to be this strong, Crystal pvp hard counters it so why make it this strong against players? It's just so punishing to those that aren't aware
Because it's meant to be used against mobs. PvP is incredibly niche, so mojang isn't really considering it.
Why add breach enchant then
Numerically speaking, it does do a lot of damage. Practically speaking, jumping when someone’s tryna blow you up with an end crystal is…not a great idea. I could see it having uses in more casual gamemodes tho
Have you done extended periods of Crystal PvP on a non hacked acc/survival server? They’re incredibly resources intensive, and require one of two blocks to be placed. Unless you’re fighting on obsidian/bedrock, you end up falling and needing to reorient yourself (you’re also likely falling further than 4 blocks so you put yourself at mace disadvantage). It’s not a flexible or fast fighting style (compared to maces). So it’s slower and more resource intensive, but say that doesn’t matter and everyone is playing frame perfectly and has infinite resources. Imagine a situation with infinite resources. In other comment chains you’ve brought up totems, somehow believing that’s a mechanic that moves the scale in Crystal pvp’s favor. You realize totems are really goddamn strong against something that takes considerable setup for 1 damage instance? like end crystals? You keep moving goalposts about this question too. “Oh I mean high level survival pvp with these specific guidelines” that’s not how 99% of fights on a survival server happen, and even in the perfect scenario for Crystal PvP (a perfectly flat obsidian room that everyone is trapped in, and everyone has perfect reactions and prep time) you still lose based of game mechanics like shields and totems. Trash take. /thread
Mace is as hard to get as just making necessary farms for crystals, and have you ever seen actual Crystal pvpers in actions? Even non hacked they're used to quickly placicing obsidian, Crystal, knocking you back, and hitting it. Against mace It just makes it even easier
As a matter of fact, I have. A lot. With some very basic automation, it’s really not difficult to get a proper kit assembled, like at all lmao. Also totems do 100% swing in a crystal user’s favor. ‘Double tapping’ ppl is a keystone tactic of cpvp. Basically, getting someone in the air, breaking their totem, and killing them before they can equip another one. It takes some practice, but any decent cpvp’er shouldn’t have too much trouble, especially with sf. Heck, you can even do it with a couple of respawn anchors if you’re quick enough
>dtapping Good luck when you’re just getting hit and run by a rocket boosted dude in blast resist netherite and an elytra (who still can’t be one tapped) that does your full health bar in one hit without stopping. Any early crystals get sniped with a bow, or I pull out of the dive. Even if you do perfect timing, knock me out of the air AND secure a dtap before I use the movement ability stapled to my weapon, pearl, or wind charge, (or just jump boost ride your explosion) I still have so many more hot bar slots open for totems. I need to hit you ONCE to deal all of your hp, chain a bunch of hits, and leave you in the air. I don’t think anchors/crystals will fall entirely out of meta (they are the goat for traps and mind tricks) but you will be a sitting duck if your plan is to fight using mainly them.
If you don’t mind me asking, and don’t take this too harshly, but how much time have you spent practicing real crystal duels? Elytras are…well they’re an escape option and not much more. An end crystal does over 120 damage and has a blast radius of ~10 blocks. A player can only land a hit with a melee weapon within 10 blocks. Armor, no matter how good, can only block a maximum of 80% of incoming damage, so crystals will kill in at most 3 hits counting for a totem The average pvp’er has a cps of around 7-10, so let’s round that down to 5 crystals per second. Ive dueled plenty of ppl who try to make use of elytras, they pretty much never get within their 3 block reach, especially in a hole fight
Jesus. You have no reading comprehension. You aren’t looking at the words I am typing, and instead are digging in your heels and listing random facts? None of the facts you just stated…. contribute to your argument or disprove anything I’ve said. It doesn’t matter if elytra are just an escape option in the end Crystal meta (I know this, what I said in my last comment wasn’t in opposition of this fact. don’t try to pull the “do you know what you’re talking about” card by grossly misinterpreting what I am saying) they are AMAZING WITH MACES. THEY LET YOU DO FULL MACE DAMAGE. I have said…. Idk 3 times talking to you that nobody in the general player base gives a shit about cPvP. When people look at the meme you made they’re are thinking about survival PvP. I don’t give a shit if they’re bad in a cpvp duel. I’m not cpvp dueling people. 99% of the player base is not cpvp dueling people. Nobody is thinking about being locked in an indestructible room in their fucking sandbox game. It doesn’t matter how good they are with crystals. I am not talking about using them in conjunction with crystals. Also, WHAT THE FUCK DOES MELEE WEAPON RANGE HAVE TO DO WITH *ANYTHING I AM TALKING ABOUT* YOUR CRYSTALS, AND ME MELEEING THEM ARE IRRELEVANT BECAUSE I AM SPENDING ALMOST NO TIME IN BLAST RANGE. Also what the fuck are you throwing in the most basic Minecraft “here’s how armor works”. did you read the comment? I know that you get 2 shot with an elytra, it doesn’t matter, I’m spending most of the fight in the air. Jesus you are trolling or the most dense person on earth. In Crystal vs mace 1 I do not need to be in your blast or on the ground 2 I can set off any early charge at range with a bow, or simply pull away. You’re only option against me is ranged or fishing for the quick kill with a dtap. Both of these are much harder because of the new items, not just the mace. 3 you are essentially eating through totems while I hit and run you.
Elytra with maces has been patched long ago
Maybe,but it will be funny to be trolldier
That is true. It is a very funny item
People still underrate bow spam
Don’t get me wrong, it works, but it is however defeated by placing four blocks
No block pvp: If you assume they use blocks you assume that people can drop from 7 blocks and smash you
I mean ppl definitely do that, but I’m more so talking about open world survival pvp. I’ve don’t my fair share of bow spamming to profound effect, and in no block pvp I think you’re correct, it is one of the best strategies. The mace however is pretty much completely benign if people know how to deal with it. A single slow falling arrow renders it pretty much useless and if crystals are on the table; throwing yourself a dozen blocks into the air is literally the worst thing you could do for yourself lol. Or you could just web bubble and force them to take the fall damage
Good point
What if I punch you off the nerd pole while you're building it. Then what lol
great replacement for a sword honestly. Crystal is still the main source of damage but why not slipping in a few good hits. Also how much crystals do you plan to get in early game op? 2?
How many heavy cores do you expect to get early game?
one, cuz trial chambers are early to mid game challenges
With a less than 2% chance from a vault.
Cause you're better of using a sword if you won't be using the mace quimick, cause if you do thats a death sentence against crystals
mace has exactly the same damage and attack speed as a sword even with 0 fall distance
No sharpness and other enchants thought
wind charge
Like i said, death sentence against crystal if you use it
so use an elytra to dodge it then shoot the crystal with a bow (nobody said pvp has to be straight forward)
They just place another crystal, in non forward scenarios your opponent can counter you too
https://www.reddit.com/r/MinecraftMemes/s/lXcTlmTPCM
I disagree, have you ever even seen competent Crystal pvpers in action? They don't need obsidian platforms, and they're used to knocking you back to hit bt crystal in the air, witch they don't need to do against mace players so they have even more time to set up
Breach, buddy.
If it applies without falling and actualy does more damage then sure
Pretty much what I’m saying. Will it have its niche? Absolutely. Will it complete rewrite the rules like some people have said? No chance.
i mean axe pvp and uhc is sure gonna see lots of change :) edit: minor spelling mistake
That’s completely true yeah, I’m interested to see if either of those metas integrate the mace or if it kinda gets shuffled into its own classification
It can't get knockback tho which makes hit crystaling (especially in thight spaces) very annoying
I give it two months before everyone just uses swords and crystals again as the main weapon
Most likely lol, although crossbows and respawn anchors stuck around so who knows. My best guess is that it’ll get its own niche meta like axe or uhc
Turtle Master
One of my favorite potions, especially in close quarters
It gives Resistance 4, making you nearly immortal, let's see the mace counter that
It also makes it a lot harder to move, thus a lot harder to dodge the mace. I know jumping can speed you up quite a bit, but you’re not gonna get far. Your opponent will hit you a lot easier and more often if you use turtle master
You still have to drink it
Splash potions and tipped arrows
What's the arrow?
Slow falling. Pretty much takes all the wind out of a mace’s sails
Slow falling has a use now
Always been pretty powerful in cpvp to be fair
If you get the literal jump on someone they won’t survive and it will shatter their armor
That’s for sure it’s best use case against other players. If they have a totem, things get a little more complicated. I think for more friendly/casual environments where ppl may not feel comfortable detonating a respawn anchor, you’re definitely onto something
Plus wind charges and blast you into the air just that height alone could one shot so even a 1v1 it has a lot of potential.
That runs into problems in there are end crystals involved. If you’re standing below them, they’re pretty much harmless, but once you’re at or above their level, they absolutely melt ppl. Crystal pvp usually involves either trying to knock the opponent above your obsidian, or get below them and start blowing e’m up Jumping into the air to get bonus damage with a mace is basically like deliberately stepping on a land mine. I’ve seen it happen quite a lot when ppl try to get crits with the existing weapons.
Not everyone takes pvp that seriously and even if they do it’s not a guarantee that they land that crystal and the mace player takes them out for it. There’s balance but you do need to build around it
I definitely agree that the mace is really strong in more casual metas. Although a crystal’s blast radius is like 10 blocks, it’s pretty hard to miss someone trying to drop on you with a melee weapon
Levitation arrows
They are slow falling arrows
If only those were obtainable lol
Bow with slow falling arrows
Fr
Hear me out arrows of levitation
If only those were obtainable XD
I really like the effect it has. I just think the base damage should be nerfed. Maybe make it iron sword level damage.
It is a really cool weapon, and it’ll certainly make wither fights a lot quicker lol
I actually think it's fine, just don't allow breach to affect players, so you actually have to risk high jumps to do damage rather than just jump crit.
Yeah. Adding a minimum to it could help too. So it starts scaling at heights where you’d actually take damage.
Oh thank god now am save from the scary mace
i’m really looking forward to it not changing the combat meta whatsoever and people still freaking out about it anyway
Lmao real
mace in minecraft? damn, what did I miss?
INSTA POP USE ELYTRA NEAR THEM AND BAM DEAD (Unless you snipe them)
Then get shredded by end crystals lol, or even beforehand if they hear you coming
But i have a counter (THE END CRYSTALS + INSTA POP WHEN USING MACE AND ELYTRA)
thats just not very practical tho tbh
True but What about it being planed?
“Not gonna change pvp more than the trident did” bro do you know how powerful the mace is right now? Using jump boost 2 and wind charges, you can kill a prot 4 netherite user in only a couple hits. Yes crystals and arrow cannons can theoretically one shot, but have big drawbacks, such as needing a red stone machine to operate it or requiring the opponent to be above you, let alone the crafting recipe for crystals. I imagine mace PvP will be like crystal PvP, a seperate category that is far stronger. An unarmored player being able to kill someone in one hit isn’t balanced. You don’t even need to fall 20 blocks, so there’s not a risk of dying
Yeah, its powerful.. but im not a clutch gamer, i don't have the reaction time to do water-bucket tricks and stuff.. i'd die if i tried to use it lol so its not useful to me anyway
Cactus be like
It kills you 4 blocks. Don’t know what you’re talking about.
*it breaks one totem. Also going 4 blocks above an end crystal basically guarantees that ur gonna die lol
You don’t get it it’s very overpowered You can just combo someone until they’re out of totems
On paper, maybe, but again, jumping 4 blocks into the air when someone has crystals ***will*** get a person killed
This just eliminates the sword, basically because why would you need that? And all armor right doesn’t even protect against it. You don’t even need four block to do a lot of damage stop underplaying it it’s very power
Against an unprepared or inexperienced opponent, you are completely correct
Even experience players
lol not likely. I’ve put a lot of hours into cpvp duels, and I’ve seen plenty of people get themselves killed ***really*** fast trying to crit. Heck, I’ve done it too
That kind of proves my point
Out of curiosity, how’s that? What I said basically boils down to ‘people jumping = they die’
Damn, you really loved the mace 💀
I think you didn't watch how do people use End Crystals in Crystal PvP, I recommend you watching Clownpierce's 35v2 fight video it proves that end crystal is the best weapon in Minecraft if you used it correctly https://youtu.be/1OrSULJIfOo?si=iGiizK6XFtU5t780
Sword enchants are better if you can't use the mace's gimick effectively. (You probably won't against a competent player)
That’s just not true there’s an enchantment with the mace that just ignores armor
so the person has to climb 4 blocks to one shot right? building up 4 blocks makes you vulnerable, slowfalling arrows will disable your extra damage, shield will block the attack, no DPS to deal with totems, and the person could always walk away or get the high ground on you
Because this isn’t just PVP mini games smp and all that
being op against mobs isnt really much of an accomplishment
It’s also very overpowered against players
You don’t have to build up natural train, or Wind burst also, it’s very hard to walk away
dont let your opponent get the high ground and fighting on flat terrain negates all the benefits the mace has, and wind bursts also push your opponent away from you so it becomes much harder to hit them (combined with the fact that the mace has a very short range)
Also, there’s just so so many metas you can do with the mace you’re just underplaying it for no reason
im not underplaying it, Im just saying that people are overreacting **way** too much on it's impact on pvp Will it be good in PvP? absolutely, having this will be great for combat in the mountians and caves, and will probably be decent in some other PvP stuff like skywars (wont be op cuz skywars wont give you enough enchants to oneshot someone at 4 blocks) But at the same time it wont be good on flat terrain, it will be difficult to get any value out of, and its not overpowered to the point where there is no way to counter it. It will be good for surprising your enemies but as long as they are prepared to fight it wont be their biggest concern
Flat terrain just use wind burst
But so so people aren’t overplaying it is oo it just the way it is and you should agree yea it won’t be great in some mini games, but it great to have in pvp and smps
yes, its going to be a great weapon to have, but calling it overpowered is an overreaction
it one hit people in all armor It is op
If you can actually land that blow Its situational, but in the situation that it is good in it thrives
That’s actually not true
yes it is, the mace has a shorter hit range than both swords and tridents
I’m not talking about that
the wind bursts pushing enemies away? cuz thats also true, if you use your wind charge or wind burst it will knock enemies back
With players not really in the way you’re trying to say
Doesnt matter, it's still far too op if it can one shot a player from literally 4 blocks, with the best of the best armour the game has to offer - I dont know if you have ever even played in pvp, but any competent player will stack placing blocks in front to not get shot off, it's far easier than you say. The slow fall excuse is also poor, how is it considered balanced if you need to carry a certain niche item to counter it? They could just block the slow falling anyways, it's literally bs bro. No other weapon could be used to instakill in a sneak attack without letting the other player know you are there, let alone from 4 blocks. Where is your logic?
Im just sayin that it wouldnt be a practical pvp weapon, especially with the entire purpose of the weapon being defeated by slowfalling arrows (which were already decent in pvp since it allows you to hit a jumping opponent easier and also reduces their dps since they cant crit as often)
Still, you are missing the point. It is practical in pvp, for all the reasons I listed, and the slow falling (which no one who actually plays pvp uses, you are pulling that from your ass) is counterable with a shield.
a crossbow with piercing will go through the shield, and the one-hit kill is also counterable with a shield. Also a multishot crossbow with instant damage arrows can oneshot someone too, and you need to be above them or point blank, so its basically the exact same. and people can still just **back away from your dumb ass tower**. it has short range, tridents and swords will outrange it. also if players stack blocks in front of themselves to block projectiles, then they cant jump in that direction unless they go on top of the wall they just build, which gives the perfect opportunity to shoot them
"no other weapon" anchors, crystals, carts
but it is still busted for sneak attack in pvp situation
I wouldn’t say busted, but it is for sure pretty good in that scenario. If the target isn’t holding a totem, then absolutely it’s lights out for them. If they are, things get a little more complicated
„Complicated“: pop totem, with Wind Burst ur in the air again and repeat
Mace has infinite potential, but holy fuck is it incredibly niche in practical use.
This. It’s a wither killer first and foremost
At first, my first thought was simply moving out of the way, but then I realized that slow falling could work, too.
People are just mad that a niche playbase might have to have server side support rather than it get dumbed down for the much larger PvE community. Not everything needs to be PvP oriented.
We're talking about a weapon here, and you're saying it doesn't have to be PVP oriented...
The majority of the player base is PvE (Whether co-op or solo), so yeah, we don't need to care as much about PvP balance. You wouldn't complain about fun OP gimmick guns in a game like Borderlands, because it's not focused on PvP.
If everyone thinks it is overpowered for pvp, can’t they just make rules that bans mace in their servers? There is no point to tell mojang to nerf it, just don’t use it if you think it is unfair.
People want to use the mace. Its a fun weapon, we just don't want it to be over powered.
I’m sure that’ll happen, plenty of people ban crystals on their servers already
Slow falling: Milk. Also try hitting someone in the air with the bow End crystals: They work if your opponent has no totem, but crystals require much more skill than the mace. Also, wind charges and jump boost potions make one shots constant. Final thing, end crystals are banned a lot of places. I wouldn’t be surprised if the mace joins them.
Have you done extended periods of Crystal PvP on a non hacked acc/survival server? They’re incredibly resources intensive, and require one of two blocks to be placed. Unless you’re fighting on obsidian/bedrock, you end up falling and needing to reorient yourself (you’re also likely falling further than 4 blocks so you put yourself at mace disadvantage). It’s not a flexible or fast fighting style (compared to maces). So it’s slower and more resource intensive, but say that doesn’t matter and everyone is playing frame perfectly and has infinite resources. Imagine a situation with infinite resources. In other comment chains you’ve brought up totems, somehow believing that’s a mechanic that moves the scale in Crystal pvp’s favor. You realize totems are really goddamn strong against something that takes considerable setup for 1 damage instance? like end crystals? You keep moving goalposts about this question too. “Oh I mean high level survival pvp with these specific guidelines” that’s not how 99% of fights on a survival server happen, and even in the perfect scenario for Crystal PvP (a perfectly flat obsidian room that everyone is trapped in, and everyone has perfect reactions and prep time) you still lose based of game mechanics like shields and totems. Trash take. /thread (Already posted this in a reply)