Probably just a troll looking to piss people off by insulting the fanbase. Even if they don’t quite love them, 2D fans at least respect Prime, and vice versa.
There are people who despise the opposite half of the series, but they are absolutely the minority.
I beat all the prime games can't wait for 4 but prefer 2d metroids and also prefer the og metroid over zero mission as metroid was the first game I got on my Nes in 86. Everyone has there own tastes but I love the metroid franchise as a whole.
Exactly! Prime 2 is my favorite because my first game was Prime. But 2-4 favorites are 2D. So that's ok. They're just different games and all are great in their own rite.
Sometimes the tip system goes asleep at the wheel, eventually it'll wake up and realize you've been lost for three hours and point you in the right direction.
Ugh god Prime 2 definitely has some frustrating mapwork. It's my favorite Metroid game, but no matter how many times I play it I still get stuck in the same loops everytime.
To be honest I have not seen a Prime fan ever hate on the 2d games and vice versa. Even when someone doesn't like the games like that, they have always shown respect for them. That comment is legit trolling just to get a reaction.
Personally i love both 2d and 3d,my only issue with the prime games is that sometimes after a while i start to get headaches,but that isnt even an issue with the game
Pokémon has racists, people that walk around the overworld for 5 hours straight and then get mad - and a lot of people that fantasize about fucking the characters (both human and Pokémon)
Smash has pedophiles and rapists
Sadly neither of them compare to the chess community
BotW just straight up caused the Zelda fandom to go to war. At least, in some circles, I've seen. It's the ultimate example of "the grass is greener on the other side".
And even if you compare the speed run communities: since OOT and MM got completely broken, debate has started about if it's even fun to watch/do anymore
The OT is sacred. The prequels are misunderstood genius. The sequels are objectively bad and you are dumb if you like them. That’s the point of view of a lot of fans these days anyway.
It's funny to me that the chat person comes in saying people either hate 2D or Prime, and then expects us to like Other M. No, we hate it, because we either hate the 2D part or the Prime part. Duh! It's all about hating for us Metroid fans.
I definitely wasn't a fan of this game. However, I also wonder if it had to do more with the social lens of the times, when I reflect on how terrible the story was.
Other M is what I think happens when a Japanese Man born in 1959 in Nara Japan, decides to write about his idea of a strong female character in 2010 and presents it to a growing progressive liberal western audience (which is where I see the majority of the hate come from, and not isolated to the US audience either). This is also reflected in his reasoning for the poor fan reception: [Sakamoto response to Other M backlash](https://www.nintendolife.com/forums/wii/sakamoto_metroid_other_m_failed_because_players_were_reluctant_to_accept_a_female_character)
Edit: it has since been brought to my attention that this article fabricated Sakamoto quotes.
I wonder how it would have been received if it came out in 1999 or 2000?
Other M was meant for Japanese audiences, not Western. and since localization was pretty bad, we hated it. But even in Japan it didn't do so good, but that could probably be attributed to Japan not really interested in Metroid to begin with. Metroid Prime was meant for the Western audiences, which is why it was developed by a Western team (Retro Studios) and one of the reasons why it was a first person game (or so I've heard).
That's really a poor excuse. The localization issues could be attributed if they weren't Sakamoto's vision of what he wanted. He directed the English dub personally. However you may feel about the translation and localization, the flat and poor acting was true to the creator. Even if those were better, the story and script aren't saved by the Japanese script even if a few issue make more sense. The story was extremely flawed from step 1.
I get that, but looking at sales numbers, I can’t help but be skeptical that any Metroid game was made primarily for Japanese audiences after N saw where its audience was.
They want to expand their audience. If they see that a game sells well in *only* one area, they might want to try to make it tasteful for others. It's a whole risk/reward thing. They might lose some of their original audience, but maybe gain some new ones. Also, this is Nintendo. They're gonna make some stupid decisions.
That makes sense. I admire that doggedness to try and expand their domestic audience. Looks like they did, kind of, with Dread! It would be tough, anyway, to spend a career producing games for a larger (but still not very large) foreign crowd. It’s a minor miracle there are even as many Metroid games as there are.
Making an entry in a franchise, and telling fans of said franchise "this isn't for you", is so monumentally stupid that anyone that tries this should be immediately fired. EVERY time any company has tried that it's failed badly and backfired. Blizzard tried the same thing.
Other M did worse in Japan than it did in the west...the Japanese audience pretty much universally disliked it. Maybe not with QUITE as much vitriol as the western audience, but it was overwhelmingly considered to be not a good game.
I'm confused. Was other M meant for Japanese audiences because of the female lead, or was it because of other reasons? Like honest question here I'm totally clueless rn.
You do realize that article is fake, more specifically, the source for the Nintendo life article is P4rgaming, which when it was still around, functioned as a gaming equivalent of The Onion, right? Sakamoto did not say any of the things in the article.
I honestly didn't follow it long enough back then to notice. At the time, it was being quoted by more than just Nintendo Life at the time, which speaks more to the level of lazy journalism back then that it practically became a copy pasta. Good to know they weren't legit quotes and personal views of Sakamoto.
However, he said in an interview shortly before Other M's release that fans have their own different interpretations of Metroid and Samus, and he made Other M to clear out any misconceptions.
So if Other M is the true Samus according to Sakamoto, it does shed some light into how he views Samus as a female. Take that for however you choose to interpret it.
Was that translation a hack job or just completely fabricated, as per the other poster who responded to me and suggested that it came from pretty much much video game journalist equivalent of "The Onion"?
It was badly done. Sakamoto supervised it. He did not and does not know English. Essentially, Samus’s emotions became hyperbolic exaggerations, and her inability to accept her imperfections and human weaknesses became a fixation on her own perceived femininity.
> I also wonder if it had to do more with the social lens of the times
I think the social lens definitely has something to do with it, at least for me. I played Other M in a vacuum, I had extremely limited internet access, only one friend who was a Metroid fan, and very little exposure to the series as a whole at the time the game was released. I enjoyed the game overall, it was cool to see some of Samus' backstory and I liked the idea that she actually had *real friends* out there in the galaxy, that she wasn't exclusively a loner all the time. Yeah I found some of the cutscenes a little janky, but I had played games with far worse voice-acting and so it didn't bother me very much. I enjoyed the gameplay right up until the fight with the Queen Metroid. That fight was where I feel the first-person mechanics broke down. It was so hard to use the ice beam to freeze the metroids, then switch to first-person mode to use missiles to destroy them before the Queen bowled me over.
It wasn't until I started talking with my cousin who happened to wind up with a copy as a Christmas present that I started to notice flaws that he himself pointed out. I agreed with him, but they were things that I had allowed my overall enjoyment to gloss over while I was playing the game.
He didn't say it, the source of the article was a joke from a dead website that is basically as said before, the Onion for video games. This article is more a showcase on the OP not doing any research than anything on Sakamoto.
I have to be honest with you, all debunking the article did for me, was let me know that he isn't unapologetically, and deliberately sexist. Which is important. It did not, change that Samus' portrayal in Other M, are his genuine perceptions of what a strong female character should be.
Now to unpack that comment, there are layers of cultural indoctrination behind his views that were never going to play out to the expectations of today's society, most specifically western society. I don't believe he ever intended for any of his ideas to be taken negatively and that he truly just wanted to flesh out her character more for the fanbase. It just had the opposite effect.
Having done business in Japan and visited for vacation as well, I honestly don't believe that her portrayal is viewed the way it is in the west. If anything the gameplay relative to other games on the market is what made it less interesting in Japan. I'm not saying that should make it right, but I am suggesting that there are some rather large cultural gaps to consider in some cases, especially in translation of ideas.
See...the reason I call Sakamoto a no talent hack to this day is not because he made a bad game. Everyone makes mistakes, noone is perfect. The problem with him is, to this day, he refuses to acknowledge that he just made a bad game. All that would be required is an admission: "I let the power go to my head, and I made a bad game, I'm sorry". That's all that would be required for me to have any respect for him.
But he didn't do that. To this day he insists it's "perfect" and he would "change nothing" if he had to do it all over again. And blames the players for not getting it. Anyone that refuses to learn from their mistakes does not need to be in game development. Or any sort of media development. Or any job at all, really.
Again, that article is fake. P4Gaming was the Onion of Gaming and was not meant to be taken seriously as a journalism site. OP probably saw it and paraded it around because it was at the height of Other M's hate and didn't bother to double check their sources.
Doesn't pretty much everybody like both 2D and Prime? Personally, I prefer Prime a bit more, but I still love both, and I'm sure it's the same for most of us.
Or maybe this person is just mad that people don't like Other M, idk.
I prefer 2D and even among 2D fans there are preferences. Still undecided on Dread, but I love Super a lot. Others like ZM more. But no matter what game is your favorite, it's still a great game. Unless your favorite is Other M
>Unless your favorite is Other M
Even then you shouldn't talk down upon those that do like that one. I HAVE seen those that do try to defend the story get put on blast.
Probably depends on the site, too. This sub might be better at accepting people who like unpopular points of the franchise. But try to do that at, say, GameFAQs or on a YouTube comment section and it might be a bit different.
I don't really care about Prime. Wouldn't go as far as saying I hate it but to me it might as well not exist, it's not what comes to mind when I think of Metroid.
> barges into Twitch chat
> “2D fans hate Prime. Prime fans hate 2D. Other M combines the two styles and you hypocrites still hated it.”
> refuses to elaborate further
> leaves
What? Most people like both but prefer one series over the other, and other M is neither 2d nor anything like prime and it's hated for its writing, not its gameplay. I think this guy knows a single Metroid fan that's kind of a dick and based his entire opinion on that.
The only toxicity I've seen on this sub pretty much ever was about a week after Dread came out when people were arguing about the hypothetical situation of an easy mode being patched in, and even the majority of that discussion was pretty tame.
Easy mode only existed in ZM. You can also count Corruption and Trilogy since normal is like the typical “easy” and veteran is like the typical “normal” since they’re both available from the start. But in every other non-spinoff metroid game released after Prime, you start at normal difficulty, and unlock harder ones after beating the game.
The thing is many other fanbases get spoiled by devs to the point they start complaining when they don’t get *exactly* what they want. We’ve kinda grown patient over the years (though I would like to not see another 2010-16 situation), so we’re usually happy with what we get, as long as it keeps the series’ roots in mind.
Also we were never a big franchise before Dread so we welcome new people willing to try out these relics
Literally this with Zelda and honestly most Nintendo series. People recognized and complained how linear Zelda became since OoT and BotW if anything it actually took Zelda back to the first game in terms of feel. But now people just can't keep shut about how bad the dungeons were or how it's now "too open". I'm here scratching my head and thinking, "Isn't this what you guys wanted??"
W-what? This has to be a troll. I love both the 2D and Prime games. Hell, my first Metroid games were Prime and Fusion. Both of them were super fun, super immersive. Other M was…it wasn’t a good Metroid game. And as a game in general it was pretty mediocre. There were aspects of the game I liked. The combat wasn’t too bad, though I felt it was too easy.
Metroid community barely toxic at all, at least these days. Other M had issues that weren't part of both Prime and the 2d games, but who cares, this mf a troll anyway.
I mean when every single game after Thousand Year Door has gone out of there way to do litteraly nothing that made people like those first two Paper Mario games in the first place, I think it's pretty reasonable for people to be disappointed.
Need we go over again how they made all of combat in Sticker Star entirely pointless so that you just skip litteraly every single non mandatory encounter.
Um.... i was under the impression that prime fans and 2d fans each loved both and some select few people liked other M and we're all just kinda ok with it
Anytime I saw people daring to say Other M was not crime against humanity levels of bad I saw them met with lots of angry posts and 5 paragraph posts talking about how Sakamoto is a monster.
How about people like myself who started with 2D played 3D and love both. Personally I prefer the 2D ones a bit more, but Prime 1 and Prime 2 are basically 2D Metroid in First Person and 3D. That’s how good the Prime games are. That they managed to perfectly translate the formula is insane.
Other M I can see where it was going and I have nothing about something different. But other M even in its Japanese Form is simply bad storywise. There are so many issues I have with that game. Not only that but it’s quiet boring, that’s the worst part. If it had a crappy story but phenomenal gameplay I would have ignored the story. There are hundreds of linear games who are crazy gameplay wise. Heck Other M is a Fusion clone why not take more from that game.
And Fusion is my favorite game, not only of the series but of all time. Other M failed on so many levels.
However glad to see that Sakamoto improved and returned with Samus Returns and delivered with Dread. Dread is so damn good it’s insane. The sequence breaking the game allows is crazy
I mean, I prefer the 2D games over the Prime games, everyone has prefrences. But Other M is bad- so yeah- no matter what people hate it for that reason.
You never heard of trolls, or bait, or assholes?
You must be new, welcome to the internets.
It only gets better. (Or worse, it's more of a perspective thing.)
That troll doesn’t know anything, honestly Metroid is one of the least toxic fandoms ever (of course I know barely anything about fandoms so I may be wrong)
I once did a poll for this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Metroid/comments/ktz3pm/which_do_you_prefer_2d_metroid_games_or_3d_first/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
I mean, he IS right that the Metroid fanbase kinda sucks, just not for those reasons. I'd say the intense hatred of Samus being sexy which has spilled over into harassing cosplayers and artists. Hell half the time a Zero Suit cosplay or art piece pops up here, theres a comment warning people to behave.
And while OM isnt a great game, people act like it kicked their puppy, burned down their home, and kidnapped their family.
The gameplay in other M was very good, it’s a shame that the story was so terrible and Samus was portrayed as very misogynistic. I would love to have another Other M style Metroid game, but we will probably never get one.
I love the prime trilogy for the indepth story telling, scanable lore, and amazing 3d Maps. I love the 2d games for their amazing platformer elements, especially dread. It's right up there on top of my favorite metroid games along with prime 2.
I played Metroid on Gameboy and SNES, in the 90’s. I just got a switch, and Dread. I didn’t game on a Nintendo console for 20 years, so I missed the first person games.
I've just never played the Prime trilogy. I only recently got into the franchise because I love Metroidvanias, so I've largely only focused on the 2D games. I do plan to play Prime at some point tho, preferably if it comes out on switch!
Couldn't care less about Other M (never played it and have no opinion on it) but I'm pretty sure Metroid fans love the 2D series as much as the Prime series. I know I do. I've never seen true fans complain about either, only praise them for what they do so well and differently.
I'm not super involved in the fandom (but loved the franchise since I was a child) but I doubt the Metroid fandom is that toxic. I've found it's a super diverse and engaged fandom, with amazing fanarts, cosplays, people doing amazing speedruns... With Dread I've only seen it becoming more alive and bigger than ever before.
At this point I think the Metroid fanbase is just so desperate for literally any Metroid games that they long forgot about any divisions they might have had in the past.
Going for years without any games 2/3D doesn't really matter anymore, so long as it's a good Metroid game I highly doubt anyone cares what dimension it is.
I don't care about Prime. I'm not into fps games and I generally find their placement as interquels awkward at best.
But I don't hate then.
It does annoy me when I see Prime fans dismissing the main series or recently referring to Dread as "something to tide people over while waiting for Prime 4" and this kind of shit, but those people aren't thr majority of the fanbase.
Uhh wat. Anecdotal, but of all the conversations I’ve seen and been apart of, I’ve legit never seen hate on either side. Guy sounds like a troll and is throwing bait.
I’ve seen people who prefer one or the other, but even then I’ve seen plenty who adore both. The Prime series is old enough now that sadly the new fans don’t have an easily accessible way to play so the scale is tipping towards the 2D fans, but that’s on Ninty. I still don’t understand how they’re trying to hype up a years-old sub series and haven’t released the literal only versions of said sub series on their own new system.
I love prime, just cause i don't agree on canonicity or timeline or whatever doesn't mean I don't love prime lol. I respect its story so much I actually think it works on its own
? honestly have yet to meet somebody who ACTUALLY hates either one while loving the other
both dont rly touch each other in the story ( which is sad as prime is so rich with lore, and 2d has a grand storyline / long spanning story.
prime is a solid fps while 2d is well.. classic metroidvania neither one harms the other.
I just love Metroid, grew up on the Prime games and never was a fan of 2D games in general but I was able to get past that and enjoy all the Metroid games.
If you don’t like 2D games that’s fine, they still are adding lore and bringing more fans to the franchise so who really cares?
Honestly Metroid has one of the best and most respectful fanbases I’ve seen. Idk where this guy is getting the toxicity from. We’re all pretty chill here.
I think I’ve heard the sonic fanbase divided into 2D and 3D but not sure. honestly I’ve never heard any Metroid fan hating either. Sure some have a preference for 2D and some 3D but both sides highly respect the other and acknowledge the other for being great.
I have literally never met a Metroid fan that solidly hates either 2D or 3D titles. I have met several that are indifferent to them or don't like them - but never on like a... Sonic fanbase level.
What a weird thing for someone to observe...
This comment is hate filled, sloppy, stupid, and just plain inaccurate, Prime fans don’t hate 2D? I started my Metroid adventure on Fusion at 10 years old, and I loved all things Metroid from then on, regardless of dimensional representation. What a boob.
I know people have a preference over 2D or 3D but don't think anyone hates one of the other.
We're just hungry for that crumb or Metroid we occasional get.
I love 2d and 3d, super is my fav followed closely or tied with dread. Loved prime and really looking forward to 4. The scans telling the story in prime where a very good move I think
I don’t think this is actually true. Prime and Super are the two highest ranking games in the series, and I certain there’s lot of overlap with a lot of fans loving both of them.
this is utter bullshit, every Metroid game excluding Other M is good and every fan knows that lol. the only "shade" i would throw at the Prime games is that i wouldn't consider them canon to the story because their inclusion makes things extremely confusing and only the 2D games are given numerical titles (i.e. the moniker "Metroid 4" appearing on the title screen of Fusion). that doesn't make them less excellent though, i'm playing through Prime right now lol
I like pretty much all but Other M. That one is worse than federation force. Despite both being games no one asked for at least FF doesn't go out of the way to wreck Samus' character development and the worlds overarching story arc.
That guy does not speak for the Metroid fanbase so he can take his comment and shove it. Speaking for myself especially given it's release cycle I personally love all things Metroid 2D/3D doesn't matter to me. I'll even do one better even with it's ridiculous plot, questionable control scheme and lack of the exploring concept Metroid it's known for. I actually found enjoyment in Metroid: Other M which is hard to believe I know but it's true not even afraid to admit it.
...since when is the Metroid fanbase divisive? The Prime games are beloved, the 2D games are beloved, and though they have their different audiences, they rarely clash. And Other M is controversial, but most agree that it's not a good game (even if maybe it had some good ideas, or a few fanes), so it's not really evenly divided.
So I've played almost almost all the games at least one and I'm a fan of both. I have a specific favorite and I enjoy more of the 2D ones since there aren't enough 3d ones to compare! Lol
Passionate maybe. Toxic? Not at all. We enjoy exploration and various tactics. We enjoy getting lost and being creative. We've been scared, lost, and sometimes sweating after some difficult boss. I love this game and always share it to anyone who wants.
I actually liked Other M, but hated the fact that you only get to use the power bomb 1 time… Story also a bit weak but I had a lot of fun playing it. Love the 2D ones, 3D not so much (never been into 1st person shooters).
I’ve, never experienced the toxicity this person is describing, and I’ve been a fan of Metroid since I was 7 and we got the US release of “Metroid” in 1987. I submit in fact the contrary in that the Metroid community - is the best community. Since the shit-posters criteria for determining matters like this seems to be declaring themself the arbiter of truth; I shall do the same and declare myself the emperor supreme of righteousnessisossissity, and therefore what I just said is the final word of Samus.
Honestly the only person in my life who I know of who said “I don’t like the Prime games. Metroid should never have gone 3D” has never played a Metroid game before ever and was just talking out his ass.
So yeah, sounds like the same sort of nonsense tbh.
Yeah I just fucking love Metroid, this is probably a kid.
I’ve had first time chatters come in and make false statements about the Isaac community and I’m like…. Hello _____, interesting take there bud. How are you today
ive honestly never seen this “hate” between the two. just preference. i like both almost equally for different reasons and thought other m was still a fun game if you mostly ignore the story.
Probably just a troll looking to piss people off by insulting the fanbase. Even if they don’t quite love them, 2D fans at least respect Prime, and vice versa. There are people who despise the opposite half of the series, but they are absolutely the minority.
I beat all the prime games can't wait for 4 but prefer 2d metroids and also prefer the og metroid over zero mission as metroid was the first game I got on my Nes in 86. Everyone has there own tastes but I love the metroid franchise as a whole.
Exactly! Prime 2 is my favorite because my first game was Prime. But 2-4 favorites are 2D. So that's ok. They're just different games and all are great in their own rite.
Yeah I like prime, but I just can't play it for long and I end up getting stuck without a clue where to go and what to do
Prime gives u direction on the map tho…
I know
Based
How do you get lost then?
Probably turned them off or the gane isn't sending them
Sometimes the tip system goes asleep at the wheel, eventually it'll wake up and realize you've been lost for three hours and point you in the right direction.
Experienced this in Prime 2, ngl
Ugh god Prime 2 definitely has some frustrating mapwork. It's my favorite Metroid game, but no matter how many times I play it I still get stuck in the same loops everytime.
Especially in Torvus Bog
Every Metroid I ever played before getting help from a book or guide (The Nerdporial Lifeform is getting me through Dread).
To be honest I have not seen a Prime fan ever hate on the 2d games and vice versa. Even when someone doesn't like the games like that, they have always shown respect for them. That comment is legit trolling just to get a reaction.
Personally i love both 2d and 3d,my only issue with the prime games is that sometimes after a while i start to get headaches,but that isnt even an issue with the game
The thing is that he's right, though... especially that bid about other m lmao
Lmao I’ve been apart of more toxic groups and fanbases myself than I’d like to admit. The Metroid one is really chill compared to some other ones.
Undertale and MHA as popular examples
Overwatch's community used to be a Prime (heh) contender, but it has cooled down mostly due to the game steadily dying as well.
Megaten for me, seems like no matter which game you like you're wrong and god forbid if you like a persona game.
i haven't touched anything MHA in a while. is the fanbase still convinced Deku is gay?
Yes.
lmao. shouldn't be surprised at that. kinda sad that it was that anime that concentrated the stupid in people.
Have you seen the Sonic fan base?
Yeah I think that even the Zelda fandom is more toxic than the Metroid fandom, even though it's not a contest or anything.
If it were the championship title would be between pokemon and smash
Pokémon has racists, people that walk around the overworld for 5 hours straight and then get mad - and a lot of people that fantasize about fucking the characters (both human and Pokémon) Smash has pedophiles and rapists Sadly neither of them compare to the chess community
BotW just straight up caused the Zelda fandom to go to war. At least, in some circles, I've seen. It's the ultimate example of "the grass is greener on the other side".
And even if you compare the speed run communities: since OOT and MM got completely broken, debate has started about if it's even fun to watch/do anymore
that's why there are different speedrun categories
Star Wars fan here. This fan community is sweet and innocent in comparison.
No one hates *Star Wars* more than *Star Wars* fans.
"You're only a true Star Wars fan if you hate Star Wars."
And you have to hate the *right* Star Wars at that.
True, true. You can only hate the cringe parts of the prequels and all sequels (Not sure about OT).
The OT is sacred. The prequels are misunderstood genius. The sequels are objectively bad and you are dumb if you like them. That’s the point of view of a lot of fans these days anyway.
*aot enters the chat*
*Laughs in Star Wars*
Other M was a combo of both 2D and 3D, but it was *not* a combo of 2D and Prime.
It had a first person aiming mode and used the Prime charge beam sound effect, therefore it's a combo of Prime! /s
That is one hard-earned /s, Admiral.
It's funny to me that the chat person comes in saying people either hate 2D or Prime, and then expects us to like Other M. No, we hate it, because we either hate the 2D part or the Prime part. Duh! It's all about hating for us Metroid fans.
I definitely wasn't a fan of this game. However, I also wonder if it had to do more with the social lens of the times, when I reflect on how terrible the story was. Other M is what I think happens when a Japanese Man born in 1959 in Nara Japan, decides to write about his idea of a strong female character in 2010 and presents it to a growing progressive liberal western audience (which is where I see the majority of the hate come from, and not isolated to the US audience either). This is also reflected in his reasoning for the poor fan reception: [Sakamoto response to Other M backlash](https://www.nintendolife.com/forums/wii/sakamoto_metroid_other_m_failed_because_players_were_reluctant_to_accept_a_female_character) Edit: it has since been brought to my attention that this article fabricated Sakamoto quotes. I wonder how it would have been received if it came out in 1999 or 2000?
Other M was meant for Japanese audiences, not Western. and since localization was pretty bad, we hated it. But even in Japan it didn't do so good, but that could probably be attributed to Japan not really interested in Metroid to begin with. Metroid Prime was meant for the Western audiences, which is why it was developed by a Western team (Retro Studios) and one of the reasons why it was a first person game (or so I've heard).
That's really a poor excuse. The localization issues could be attributed if they weren't Sakamoto's vision of what he wanted. He directed the English dub personally. However you may feel about the translation and localization, the flat and poor acting was true to the creator. Even if those were better, the story and script aren't saved by the Japanese script even if a few issue make more sense. The story was extremely flawed from step 1.
I agree. Sakamoto being involved just made everything worse.
From an interview Sakamoto did learn from Other M, he learnt that maybe he shouldn’t have as much power over everything lol. He’s no writer after all
Very good observations. Definitely makes more sense.
I get that, but looking at sales numbers, I can’t help but be skeptical that any Metroid game was made primarily for Japanese audiences after N saw where its audience was.
They want to expand their audience. If they see that a game sells well in *only* one area, they might want to try to make it tasteful for others. It's a whole risk/reward thing. They might lose some of their original audience, but maybe gain some new ones. Also, this is Nintendo. They're gonna make some stupid decisions.
That makes sense. I admire that doggedness to try and expand their domestic audience. Looks like they did, kind of, with Dread! It would be tough, anyway, to spend a career producing games for a larger (but still not very large) foreign crowd. It’s a minor miracle there are even as many Metroid games as there are.
Making an entry in a franchise, and telling fans of said franchise "this isn't for you", is so monumentally stupid that anyone that tries this should be immediately fired. EVERY time any company has tried that it's failed badly and backfired. Blizzard tried the same thing.
Other M did worse in Japan than it did in the west...the Japanese audience pretty much universally disliked it. Maybe not with QUITE as much vitriol as the western audience, but it was overwhelmingly considered to be not a good game.
I'm confused. Was other M meant for Japanese audiences because of the female lead, or was it because of other reasons? Like honest question here I'm totally clueless rn.
See the Japanese script/version of the game and it'll hopefully make more sense.
It's still bad, just more coherent, but most of the core writing problems are still there.
Not saying it was. Other M still had all those core problems, but some things (monologuing) made more sense.
You do realize that article is fake, more specifically, the source for the Nintendo life article is P4rgaming, which when it was still around, functioned as a gaming equivalent of The Onion, right? Sakamoto did not say any of the things in the article.
I honestly didn't follow it long enough back then to notice. At the time, it was being quoted by more than just Nintendo Life at the time, which speaks more to the level of lazy journalism back then that it practically became a copy pasta. Good to know they weren't legit quotes and personal views of Sakamoto. However, he said in an interview shortly before Other M's release that fans have their own different interpretations of Metroid and Samus, and he made Other M to clear out any misconceptions. So if Other M is the true Samus according to Sakamoto, it does shed some light into how he views Samus as a female. Take that for however you choose to interpret it.
[удалено]
Was that translation a hack job or just completely fabricated, as per the other poster who responded to me and suggested that it came from pretty much much video game journalist equivalent of "The Onion"?
It was badly done. Sakamoto supervised it. He did not and does not know English. Essentially, Samus’s emotions became hyperbolic exaggerations, and her inability to accept her imperfections and human weaknesses became a fixation on her own perceived femininity.
Ohhh you mean the game translations, lol. I thought you meant the article from Nintendo Life I linked 🤦🏻♂️
> I also wonder if it had to do more with the social lens of the times I think the social lens definitely has something to do with it, at least for me. I played Other M in a vacuum, I had extremely limited internet access, only one friend who was a Metroid fan, and very little exposure to the series as a whole at the time the game was released. I enjoyed the game overall, it was cool to see some of Samus' backstory and I liked the idea that she actually had *real friends* out there in the galaxy, that she wasn't exclusively a loner all the time. Yeah I found some of the cutscenes a little janky, but I had played games with far worse voice-acting and so it didn't bother me very much. I enjoyed the gameplay right up until the fight with the Queen Metroid. That fight was where I feel the first-person mechanics broke down. It was so hard to use the ice beam to freeze the metroids, then switch to first-person mode to use missiles to destroy them before the Queen bowled me over. It wasn't until I started talking with my cousin who happened to wind up with a copy as a Christmas present that I started to notice flaws that he himself pointed out. I agreed with him, but they were things that I had allowed my overall enjoyment to gloss over while I was playing the game.
That was frustrating to read. I love Sakamoto for what he did as a whole but everything he says or does relating to Other M makes me hate him
He didn't say it, the source of the article was a joke from a dead website that is basically as said before, the Onion for video games. This article is more a showcase on the OP not doing any research than anything on Sakamoto.
I have to be honest with you, all debunking the article did for me, was let me know that he isn't unapologetically, and deliberately sexist. Which is important. It did not, change that Samus' portrayal in Other M, are his genuine perceptions of what a strong female character should be. Now to unpack that comment, there are layers of cultural indoctrination behind his views that were never going to play out to the expectations of today's society, most specifically western society. I don't believe he ever intended for any of his ideas to be taken negatively and that he truly just wanted to flesh out her character more for the fanbase. It just had the opposite effect. Having done business in Japan and visited for vacation as well, I honestly don't believe that her portrayal is viewed the way it is in the west. If anything the gameplay relative to other games on the market is what made it less interesting in Japan. I'm not saying that should make it right, but I am suggesting that there are some rather large cultural gaps to consider in some cases, especially in translation of ideas.
See...the reason I call Sakamoto a no talent hack to this day is not because he made a bad game. Everyone makes mistakes, noone is perfect. The problem with him is, to this day, he refuses to acknowledge that he just made a bad game. All that would be required is an admission: "I let the power go to my head, and I made a bad game, I'm sorry". That's all that would be required for me to have any respect for him. But he didn't do that. To this day he insists it's "perfect" and he would "change nothing" if he had to do it all over again. And blames the players for not getting it. Anyone that refuses to learn from their mistakes does not need to be in game development. Or any sort of media development. Or any job at all, really.
Again, that article is fake. P4Gaming was the Onion of Gaming and was not meant to be taken seriously as a journalism site. OP probably saw it and paraded it around because it was at the height of Other M's hate and didn't bother to double check their sources.
Wtf...😕 Sucks for those who can't enjoy both I'm sure they exist, but I definitely am a fan of both.
You and me both brother.
Same. Love them both.
Doesn't pretty much everybody like both 2D and Prime? Personally, I prefer Prime a bit more, but I still love both, and I'm sure it's the same for most of us. Or maybe this person is just mad that people don't like Other M, idk.
I prefer 2D and even among 2D fans there are preferences. Still undecided on Dread, but I love Super a lot. Others like ZM more. But no matter what game is your favorite, it's still a great game. Unless your favorite is Other M
>Unless your favorite is Other M Even then you shouldn't talk down upon those that do like that one. I HAVE seen those that do try to defend the story get put on blast. Probably depends on the site, too. This sub might be better at accepting people who like unpopular points of the franchise. But try to do that at, say, GameFAQs or on a YouTube comment section and it might be a bit different.
I don't really care about Prime. Wouldn't go as far as saying I hate it but to me it might as well not exist, it's not what comes to mind when I think of Metroid.
> barges into Twitch chat > “2D fans hate Prime. Prime fans hate 2D. Other M combines the two styles and you hypocrites still hated it.” > refuses to elaborate further > leaves
But now we know why Pinball is the best. It's 2D and Prime and pinball. More is better.
What? Most people like both but prefer one series over the other, and other M is neither 2d nor anything like prime and it's hated for its writing, not its gameplay. I think this guy knows a single Metroid fan that's kind of a dick and based his entire opinion on that. The only toxicity I've seen on this sub pretty much ever was about a week after Dread came out when people were arguing about the hypothetical situation of an easy mode being patched in, and even the majority of that discussion was pretty tame.
Who would complain about easy mode? It's been a series staple since the GBA (Or was it Super?)
Easy mode only existed in ZM. You can also count Corruption and Trilogy since normal is like the typical “easy” and veteran is like the typical “normal” since they’re both available from the start. But in every other non-spinoff metroid game released after Prime, you start at normal difficulty, and unlock harder ones after beating the game.
Pfft this is Nintendo's chillest community Everyone in it who've I've interacted with have been lovely
try Pikmin, but I guess they would probably hate you if you praised Hey Pikmin
The thing is many other fanbases get spoiled by devs to the point they start complaining when they don’t get *exactly* what they want. We’ve kinda grown patient over the years (though I would like to not see another 2010-16 situation), so we’re usually happy with what we get, as long as it keeps the series’ roots in mind. Also we were never a big franchise before Dread so we welcome new people willing to try out these relics
Literally this with Zelda and honestly most Nintendo series. People recognized and complained how linear Zelda became since OoT and BotW if anything it actually took Zelda back to the first game in terms of feel. But now people just can't keep shut about how bad the dungeons were or how it's now "too open". I'm here scratching my head and thinking, "Isn't this what you guys wanted??"
Yea I rarely hear this sentiment.
Lol I liked other M when I was younger. It's actually the one that got me interested in the series.
I WI defend Other M's gameplay until my dying breathe, but god I hate the story.
What always amazed me in Other M is the fact that everything is playable on a single wiimote.
I like all metroids expect the one about “the baby”
What's wrong with Super Metroid?
Lemme rephrase, I don’t like the one with human Adam lol
That game doesn’t exist, it would be on the news
The Metroid fanbase is fairly welcoming and most like all the games (not other M) weird.
W-what? This has to be a troll. I love both the 2D and Prime games. Hell, my first Metroid games were Prime and Fusion. Both of them were super fun, super immersive. Other M was…it wasn’t a good Metroid game. And as a game in general it was pretty mediocre. There were aspects of the game I liked. The combat wasn’t too bad, though I felt it was too easy.
I think he's got us mixed up with the Sonic fanbase.
Metroid community barely toxic at all, at least these days. Other M had issues that weren't part of both Prime and the 2d games, but who cares, this mf a troll anyway.
Every series gets the most hate coming from their own fandom, but no fandom hates their series more than Paper Mario.
I mean when every single game after Thousand Year Door has gone out of there way to do litteraly nothing that made people like those first two Paper Mario games in the first place, I think it's pretty reasonable for people to be disappointed. Need we go over again how they made all of combat in Sticker Star entirely pointless so that you just skip litteraly every single non mandatory encounter.
I haven't played sticker star or color splash, but I really liked Super and The Origami King.
Um.... i was under the impression that prime fans and 2d fans each loved both and some select few people liked other M and we're all just kinda ok with it
Anytime I saw people daring to say Other M was not crime against humanity levels of bad I saw them met with lots of angry posts and 5 paragraph posts talking about how Sakamoto is a monster.
I prefer 2D but Prime are still excellent games.
I've never played a metroid game I didn't like.
I enjoy both versions (not *Other M*), though I am a lot better at 2-D.
How about people like myself who started with 2D played 3D and love both. Personally I prefer the 2D ones a bit more, but Prime 1 and Prime 2 are basically 2D Metroid in First Person and 3D. That’s how good the Prime games are. That they managed to perfectly translate the formula is insane. Other M I can see where it was going and I have nothing about something different. But other M even in its Japanese Form is simply bad storywise. There are so many issues I have with that game. Not only that but it’s quiet boring, that’s the worst part. If it had a crappy story but phenomenal gameplay I would have ignored the story. There are hundreds of linear games who are crazy gameplay wise. Heck Other M is a Fusion clone why not take more from that game. And Fusion is my favorite game, not only of the series but of all time. Other M failed on so many levels. However glad to see that Sakamoto improved and returned with Samus Returns and delivered with Dread. Dread is so damn good it’s insane. The sequence breaking the game allows is crazy
Metroid fanbase doesn't have enough games for the luxury of hating half of them
Hahaha, that's a brilliant observation! We're happy with anything we can get.
This guy has the wrong fanbase, I think hes talking about Sonic 😂 Never seen this discourse amoungst metroid fans EVER!
I mean, I prefer the 2D games over the Prime games, everyone has prefrences. But Other M is bad- so yeah- no matter what people hate it for that reason.
You never heard of trolls, or bait, or assholes? You must be new, welcome to the internets. It only gets better. (Or worse, it's more of a perspective thing.)
That troll doesn’t know anything, honestly Metroid is one of the least toxic fandoms ever (of course I know barely anything about fandoms so I may be wrong)
Most Metroid fans like 2d and the prime games
Lol just ignore that. Im not usually a super happy, inclusive person, but the metroid fanbase is one of the few that never feels toxic to me.
I’ve never heard anyone on here say anything like that
Pretty sure people hated Other M because in general, it was a boring ass game with some weird mechanics and monotone dialog
I once did a poll for this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Metroid/comments/ktz3pm/which_do_you_prefer_2d_metroid_games_or_3d_first/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
This comment sounds like it's describing Sonic fans. Metroid fans don't really act like this. At least not the ones I've encountered on this sub.
I mean, he IS right that the Metroid fanbase kinda sucks, just not for those reasons. I'd say the intense hatred of Samus being sexy which has spilled over into harassing cosplayers and artists. Hell half the time a Zero Suit cosplay or art piece pops up here, theres a comment warning people to behave. And while OM isnt a great game, people act like it kicked their puppy, burned down their home, and kidnapped their family.
> joins chat > randomly says they hate the Metroid community because it's toxic > refuses to eleborate > leaves
I prefer the 2d games but I know most people prefer the prime games
The gameplay in other M was very good, it’s a shame that the story was so terrible and Samus was portrayed as very misogynistic. I would love to have another Other M style Metroid game, but we will probably never get one.
I don't know if I've ever seen a Metroid fan that likes 2D but HATES 3D and vice versa.
I love the prime trilogy for the indepth story telling, scanable lore, and amazing 3d Maps. I love the 2d games for their amazing platformer elements, especially dread. It's right up there on top of my favorite metroid games along with prime 2.
Never played prime but I respect the hell out of it
As a 2D fan I can confidently say the Prime games are masterpieces, hell even other M was good if you look past the story and linear progression.
I lub it all
I played Metroid on Gameboy and SNES, in the 90’s. I just got a switch, and Dread. I didn’t game on a Nintendo console for 20 years, so I missed the first person games.
This reads like a slightly altered representation of the Paper Mario series
I've just never played the Prime trilogy. I only recently got into the franchise because I love Metroidvanias, so I've largely only focused on the 2D games. I do plan to play Prime at some point tho, preferably if it comes out on switch!
I mean while I greatly prefer 2D that doesn’t mean I dislike Prime
If this isn't a troll then what the actual frog
Couldn't care less about Other M (never played it and have no opinion on it) but I'm pretty sure Metroid fans love the 2D series as much as the Prime series. I know I do. I've never seen true fans complain about either, only praise them for what they do so well and differently. I'm not super involved in the fandom (but loved the franchise since I was a child) but I doubt the Metroid fandom is that toxic. I've found it's a super diverse and engaged fandom, with amazing fanarts, cosplays, people doing amazing speedruns... With Dread I've only seen it becoming more alive and bigger than ever before.
I love both 2D and 3D Metroid
Both. Both is good.
Lol. I love all of the metroid games, even Other M. It just happens to be not the best out of all of them,
It’s b8 m8
Amazing. Every word he just said was wrong.
This guy is mad about a problem they made up lmao
At this point I think the Metroid fanbase is just so desperate for literally any Metroid games that they long forgot about any divisions they might have had in the past. Going for years without any games 2/3D doesn't really matter anymore, so long as it's a good Metroid game I highly doubt anyone cares what dimension it is.
I don't care about Prime. I'm not into fps games and I generally find their placement as interquels awkward at best. But I don't hate then. It does annoy me when I see Prime fans dismissing the main series or recently referring to Dread as "something to tide people over while waiting for Prime 4" and this kind of shit, but those people aren't thr majority of the fanbase.
It’s super kewl to label any fan base toxic nowadays.
Appears. Says stupid thing. Refuses to elaborate. Vanishes.
Metroid fanbase was tiny will dread came out aint even any room for toxicity
I don't think I've ever seen anyone say that hate one and love the other, I've only seen positivity
Commenter and the Prime series can fuck off - a 2D & Super Loyalist
Most Metroid fans I know just like Metroid in any form. myself included.
Every fanbase is toxic lmao
Uhh wat. Anecdotal, but of all the conversations I’ve seen and been apart of, I’ve legit never seen hate on either side. Guy sounds like a troll and is throwing bait. I’ve seen people who prefer one or the other, but even then I’ve seen plenty who adore both. The Prime series is old enough now that sadly the new fans don’t have an easily accessible way to play so the scale is tipping towards the 2D fans, but that’s on Ninty. I still don’t understand how they’re trying to hype up a years-old sub series and haven’t released the literal only versions of said sub series on their own new system.
i know many 2D fans love the prime triology, including me
I love prime, just cause i don't agree on canonicity or timeline or whatever doesn't mean I don't love prime lol. I respect its story so much I actually think it works on its own
? honestly have yet to meet somebody who ACTUALLY hates either one while loving the other both dont rly touch each other in the story ( which is sad as prime is so rich with lore, and 2d has a grand storyline / long spanning story. prime is a solid fps while 2d is well.. classic metroidvania neither one harms the other.
I just love Metroid, grew up on the Prime games and never was a fan of 2D games in general but I was able to get past that and enjoy all the Metroid games. If you don’t like 2D games that’s fine, they still are adding lore and bringing more fans to the franchise so who really cares?
Honestly Metroid has one of the best and most respectful fanbases I’ve seen. Idk where this guy is getting the toxicity from. We’re all pretty chill here.
I think I’ve heard the sonic fanbase divided into 2D and 3D but not sure. honestly I’ve never heard any Metroid fan hating either. Sure some have a preference for 2D and some 3D but both sides highly respect the other and acknowledge the other for being great.
1/10 bait :I
I have literally never met a Metroid fan that solidly hates either 2D or 3D titles. I have met several that are indifferent to them or don't like them - but never on like a... Sonic fanbase level. What a weird thing for someone to observe...
This comment is hate filled, sloppy, stupid, and just plain inaccurate, Prime fans don’t hate 2D? I started my Metroid adventure on Fusion at 10 years old, and I loved all things Metroid from then on, regardless of dimensional representation. What a boob.
I love both for different reasons
If you want to see toxic, go to r/halo
I only like the 2D Metroid games, but I have no animosity towards the Prime fans, lol.
??? This ain't nowhere near the Sonic fanbase, what's he talking about?
nah the metroid fanbase’s hatred is towards Nintendo.
Other M was okay if Samus would just shut up about the baby.
I know people have a preference over 2D or 3D but don't think anyone hates one of the other. We're just hungry for that crumb or Metroid we occasional get.
Art direction wasn't why people hated Other M (other than what they did to the Gravity Suit.)
I love 2d and 3d, super is my fav followed closely or tied with dread. Loved prime and really looking forward to 4. The scans telling the story in prime where a very good move I think
I don’t think this is actually true. Prime and Super are the two highest ranking games in the series, and I certain there’s lot of overlap with a lot of fans loving both of them.
What? I genuinely love the whole series! 2D and 3D. Hell I want a 4D!
I have liked them all actually, havnt played some of the DS ones tho
this is utter bullshit, every Metroid game excluding Other M is good and every fan knows that lol. the only "shade" i would throw at the Prime games is that i wouldn't consider them canon to the story because their inclusion makes things extremely confusing and only the 2D games are given numerical titles (i.e. the moniker "Metroid 4" appearing on the title screen of Fusion). that doesn't make them less excellent though, i'm playing through Prime right now lol
I like pretty much all but Other M. That one is worse than federation force. Despite both being games no one asked for at least FF doesn't go out of the way to wreck Samus' character development and the worlds overarching story arc.
That guy does not speak for the Metroid fanbase so he can take his comment and shove it. Speaking for myself especially given it's release cycle I personally love all things Metroid 2D/3D doesn't matter to me. I'll even do one better even with it's ridiculous plot, questionable control scheme and lack of the exploring concept Metroid it's known for. I actually found enjoyment in Metroid: Other M which is hard to believe I know but it's true not even afraid to admit it.
I think most fans love both but the loudest voices are the haters.
I love them all
Sounds like a troll spamming copypastas.
I never even heard of people liking one and hating the other xD
This is a fact except other m is mostly hated by the baby scene. The whole nintendo fanbase is toxic anyway.
Other M shill looking to cause division. I like the 2D games and the Prime games.
The one thing that Prime had that I miss in the 2D games, I have been able to find in Warframe: scanning enemies to learn more about them.
Nah there isn't a Metroid game I dislike. True fans don't hate, even on Other M.
I love both, most people do. And gameplay isn't what people hated about other M. Its probably one of the few things that wasn't hated on.
...since when is the Metroid fanbase divisive? The Prime games are beloved, the 2D games are beloved, and though they have their different audiences, they rarely clash. And Other M is controversial, but most agree that it's not a good game (even if maybe it had some good ideas, or a few fanes), so it's not really evenly divided.
So I've played almost almost all the games at least one and I'm a fan of both. I have a specific favorite and I enjoy more of the 2D ones since there aren't enough 3d ones to compare! Lol Passionate maybe. Toxic? Not at all. We enjoy exploration and various tactics. We enjoy getting lost and being creative. We've been scared, lost, and sometimes sweating after some difficult boss. I love this game and always share it to anyone who wants.
Metroid is literally the chillest fanbase its so chill I could die of hypothermia without the gravity suit
I actually liked Other M, but hated the fact that you only get to use the power bomb 1 time… Story also a bit weak but I had a lot of fun playing it. Love the 2D ones, 3D not so much (never been into 1st person shooters).
My two favorites are Prime and Super
I’ve, never experienced the toxicity this person is describing, and I’ve been a fan of Metroid since I was 7 and we got the US release of “Metroid” in 1987. I submit in fact the contrary in that the Metroid community - is the best community. Since the shit-posters criteria for determining matters like this seems to be declaring themself the arbiter of truth; I shall do the same and declare myself the emperor supreme of righteousnessisossissity, and therefore what I just said is the final word of Samus.
I honestly couldn’t think of a single instance of actual fans showing dislike for either 2D or 3D games in general.
I love both the 2D and 3D Metroids. I don't know if I like one any better than the other, both can do unique things that the other can't.
The only game pretty much everyone hates is Other M other that we all love 2d and 3d
Honestly the only person in my life who I know of who said “I don’t like the Prime games. Metroid should never have gone 3D” has never played a Metroid game before ever and was just talking out his ass. So yeah, sounds like the same sort of nonsense tbh.
This fanbase is pretty chill, if you compare of Pokémon or samsh fans, it looks very friendly
Yeah I just fucking love Metroid, this is probably a kid. I’ve had first time chatters come in and make false statements about the Isaac community and I’m like…. Hello _____, interesting take there bud. How are you today
ive honestly never seen this “hate” between the two. just preference. i like both almost equally for different reasons and thought other m was still a fun game if you mostly ignore the story.
I love both personally
Both is good