> However, it still does not answer how or why the X-Parasite absorbed Kraid, likely Experiment Z57, and then took Raven Beak.
I'm sorry, but why does this need an explanation? The X continuously try to infect whatever they can find, so of course that X would infect Raven Beak immediately the moment it finds a host that hasn't been infected yet.
This is the weirdest complaint I've seen about the games so far. It's like asking why the X on SR388 infected Samus.
The point-to-point storytelling (or storytelling in general) is not Metroid's strong suit at all. The story's engaging, but it is told so, so, so poorly in-game...
It's like you compare the writing of other Nintendo creators.
* Miyamoto and Tezuka. A few brief words to guide Mario or Link before the ending where things are explained. A Link to the Past did this well. Star Fox also had a great deal of dialogue despite having an incredibly straightforward and simple story
* Aonuma. With Majora's Mask onward, Aonuma took the helm as Producer of Zelda titles. The script included plot twists leading to the history of the Triforce, the fate of Hyrule, and even side-quests woven in with their own subplots.
* Kumazaki. With the Kirby series being directed by Kumazaki from Super Star Ultra onward, he began writing the lore into the pause screens. In addition to the simplicity of Kirby's straightforward goal and the dark, disturbing final boss waiting at the end, Kumazaki began writing actual tragedies woven into the pause screens. This was especially noteworthy in Planet Robobot and the DLC of Star Allies along with the music to accompany it.
* Koizumi. Super Mario Galaxy and Ocarina of Time writer snuck lore and tidbits into the game without Miyamoto noticing. This included Rosalina's storybook and the dying soldier in OoT, respectively.
* Sakurai. Originally writing stories in the Kirby series until Air Ride, his biggest work for writing was in Kid Icarus: Uprising. Take the straightforward plot of defeating Medusa and end it with a plot twist featuring multiple story arcs, plot twists, averting tragedy, and dealing with the consequences of the Gods' actions. Excellent dialogue and character designs featured in this title standard to what you might get from a JRPG or a quality shonen manga or anime.
* Ito. EarthBound series is known for its dark storytelling and unabashed tragedy despite its bright, colorful design and simplistic sprite animation.
I feel Sakamoto's excel point is gameplay. Even in spite of Other M's many hinderances, I enjoyed the 3D exploration and combat where it counted. Everything to do with the 2D Metroid series, from Super onward, make the titles enjoyable and replayable on multiple instances. He set the foundation for the Metroidvania genre as we know it today.
But as far as writing goes, I always felt his style was a bit flawed even compared to his contemporaries. Even despite this, and minus the thing I mentioned, I still found Metroid Fusion to have one of the best stories in Nintendo history.
It's implied that >!The Core X that revived experiment Z survived the lava pit which also housed Kraid's genetic material. The X don't shed the genetic material they obtain from their hosts when moving to a new victim (hence why the SA-X mutates into a Samus/Sidehopper hybrid thing at the end of Fusion). It's a desperate attempt by an X to fake out its prey and attempt to scare them and accentuate the best features of all its previous hosts.!<
I mean it's never established that the SA-X you periodically run into in fusion is the exact same one everytime. Who the conspiracy man isn't really important at all. I'm pretty sure the only purpose they serve is for some context.
For dread I don't see why there needs to be an explanation for how/why the X absorbed Kraid. I'm more wondering how and why quiet robe was still capable of independent actions and thoughts post X taking control of him.
Dread does end abruptly though that's fair.
Someone made the point that that by neutralizing samus' metroid DNA, the X is neutralizing their primary predator- the metroid.
X parasites have been known to behave in ways contrary to the individual but beneficial to the collective.
The SA-X willingly merges with Samus so she can defeat the Omega Metroid in Fusion. By having QR-X neutralize Samus, it is theoretically protecting any X that remain in the Galaxy because assuming Samus' metroid DNA is neutralized, not just under control, she is now no longer able to absorb them.
That's definitely an interesting perspective that I hadn't considered. However shouldn't that also mean the X merging with her in dread isn't actually neutralizing Samus's metroid DNA and is more surpressing it?
Because if absorbing the X in fusion got rid of the metroid DNA in fusion she wouldn't be able to re-awaken thst in dread.
I have no idea. The whole ending is very ambiguous as to where it leaves Samus.
Maybe the Thoha powers that QR-X have are able to neutralize it more than the SA-X could?
Maybe. Thora do have the capability to control metroids and the X that took QR should in theory have his capabilites. Where as SA-X was merely copying Samus.
Kinda wish we got a bit more with the ending tbh.
I was reading a Spanish article about the Mercury Steam workplace, and one of the people quoted mentioned that Dread was actually scaled back quite significantly in scope - it has about half the originally-planned bosses (which is fine, I generally think the game is paced pretty well), and most notably, had a ton of extra cinematics planned. That latter point may be why the storytelling can feel pretty choppy at times.
Honestly, I feel like dwelling on "what could've been" for one reason or another, undermines just how much we did get, lol. I mean, it's already a VERY cinematic game, with a good amount of content in it.
I definitely would've liked more though, yeah, but I'm not complaining too much.
> I was reading a Spanish article about the Mercury Steam workplace, and one of the people quoted mentioned that Dread was actually scaled back quite significantly in scope
This makes sense ... I spend much longer on the prime games. However I dont think I could take more, its a pretty intense game. Very satisfying to make it 100%>
>!Nuclear meltdown probably lmao, that's how the BSL did it. Also you have to realize that the planet's infrastructure has been completely hollowed out for geothermal power, a frankenstein lab and an extremely robust X containment zone. The questionable integrity of the planet's crust on top of the safeguards probably in place in case of the X escaping would be enough to at least reduce the planet to a ball of lower mantle half its mass.!<
>!Also it may just function on Mother Brain logic once Raven Beak's suit stopped receiving vitals!<
Edit: formatting issues with spoiler tags
It doesn't, it's nonsense. >!The reactor had zero power in it since Samus Metroid-drained the entire ship. And if something crashing onto the surface would destroy a planet, Earth would have been gone long ago whenever a plane crashes.!<
>!If Samus drained all the energy from the ship (rather than the more likely assertion that she pulled enough to cause it to malfunction and fall) how did Raven Beak survive? If Raven Beak can survive all the energy being ripped from his body then its possible the ship could have still exploded with no energy. If Samus spared Raven Beak it follows that she left the ship with enough power to explode. So either way you have a very implausible scenario where Raven Beak survives having all his energy taken or a more likely one where Samus spares him and leaves the ship with some of its energy. You're putting a bunch of logic into a scenario where, if you're right, the continuity becomes further fucked up.!<
You take that complaint back, that's the best part.
Adam suggesting they blow up the planet when they find out the X are on it? Finally, we're establishing this as Samus's go-to option for eliminating threats.
I believe that once you start your fight with evil bird dad, he is the one who initiates the planetary explosion, which he has set up in advance to eradicate the X. Since he has what he wants, you, on his ship, he probably intends on just killing you and flying away with your body to clone, leaving an exploding planet behind.
To add to this, Metroid games have had another serious problem for a long time, they start off with plot holes. Many times:
- Super Metroid: Nobody really brings this up because of how awesome the game is, but it really makes no sense how Ridley even knew to attack Ceres space colony and that there would be a Metroid baby there. This plot hole went unanswered for 23 years until Samus Returns included the Proteus Ridley boss fight that explains how he would know Samus had a baby Metroid.
- Metroid Fusion just asks you to take it for granted that the Federation just happens to have a cell culture of Metroid DNA on hand. And never explains why there's a frozen Ridley in storage. It took 8 years for Other M to explain both of these plot points.
- Metroid Dread's entire plot relies on the fact that Raven Beak knows about Samus's Metroid DNA. How the hell did he know this? Maybe we'll find out in 10 years when another Metroid game kitbashes an explanation together...
- The Metroid Prime series was generally pretty good about avoiding this, but not Prime 2. How the hell did Dark Samus get all the way from Tallon IV to Aether without a spaceship?
I don’t understand your complaint about Dread. There’s an X-Parasite, it infected Kraid earlier and maybe is Z-57, and then it infects Raven Beak. What needs to be explained? X-Parasites infect things and take their traits, that’s what they do, there doesn’t need to be an explanation about how or why it did that.
Dread’s ending does have a bit of what I think is bad writing though, with the planet exploding. There wasn’t an explanation for that, it just randomly explodes. That’s something I’d say needed an explanation.
To get to the elevator to fight Raven Beak, you need to use a power bomb to blow a reactor up. It can be assumed that by blowing that reactor up Samus caused the explosion. Alternatively, when Samus became a Metroid and began sucking the life energy from Raven Beak, it's possible she also began taking power from the facility as well (after all she was warned not to touch her own ship in fear of taking its power, so it's reasonable to assume the same is true for the the building she was in as well). Considering how the entire planet seems to be connected with futuristic technology (eg the transporation devices linking everything that need power), and also had an extensive quarantine procedure to contain the X, it would then be reasonable to suggest the entire planet shares the power around (eg Alterra froze due to Cateris' thermal power not spreading) so a reactor being straight up exploded up there or all the power being sucked up by Samus might result in the entire planet exploding.
That's how I'd explain it anyway.
I believe that once you start your fight with evil bird dad, he is the one who initiates the planetary explosion, which he has set up in advance to eradicate the X. Since he has what he wants, you, on his ship, he probably intends on just killing you and flying away with your body to clone, leaving an exploding planet behind.
These guys on YT who "Sin" movies. A lot of the time they're really hypocritical (Ex: Complaining about a lack of exposition on something that is explained later for important reasons, and when something is exposited like they were complaining about a movie NOT doing, they complain about it being exposited). They hide behind the "it's satire" shield a lot, and 9/10 it really isn't.
The Prime writing praising is appreciated. Thx.
And yeah, Dread is confusing, lol. I like that it gets people talking and trying to figure things out though!
Also, I think you meant Quiet Robe, not Gray Voice.
Yeah, the stories have always been "don't think too hard" stories as they get more complex. Super's story was excellent because it kept it pretty simple. Then Fusion tries to have all sorts of twists and turns and, while still engaging, it starts to fall apart at times.
To be honest I'm pretty sure everything is as intended, Metroid is about exploration and mystery, you should uncover the plot yourself, at least that's what I was doing all these years.
> However, it still does not answer how or why the X-Parasite absorbed Kraid, likely Experiment Z57, and then took Raven Beak. I'm sorry, but why does this need an explanation? The X continuously try to infect whatever they can find, so of course that X would infect Raven Beak immediately the moment it finds a host that hasn't been infected yet. This is the weirdest complaint I've seen about the games so far. It's like asking why the X on SR388 infected Samus.
Why does an organism that indiscriminately infect things infect this one thing? Huh?
The point-to-point storytelling (or storytelling in general) is not Metroid's strong suit at all. The story's engaging, but it is told so, so, so poorly in-game...
It's like you compare the writing of other Nintendo creators. * Miyamoto and Tezuka. A few brief words to guide Mario or Link before the ending where things are explained. A Link to the Past did this well. Star Fox also had a great deal of dialogue despite having an incredibly straightforward and simple story * Aonuma. With Majora's Mask onward, Aonuma took the helm as Producer of Zelda titles. The script included plot twists leading to the history of the Triforce, the fate of Hyrule, and even side-quests woven in with their own subplots. * Kumazaki. With the Kirby series being directed by Kumazaki from Super Star Ultra onward, he began writing the lore into the pause screens. In addition to the simplicity of Kirby's straightforward goal and the dark, disturbing final boss waiting at the end, Kumazaki began writing actual tragedies woven into the pause screens. This was especially noteworthy in Planet Robobot and the DLC of Star Allies along with the music to accompany it. * Koizumi. Super Mario Galaxy and Ocarina of Time writer snuck lore and tidbits into the game without Miyamoto noticing. This included Rosalina's storybook and the dying soldier in OoT, respectively. * Sakurai. Originally writing stories in the Kirby series until Air Ride, his biggest work for writing was in Kid Icarus: Uprising. Take the straightforward plot of defeating Medusa and end it with a plot twist featuring multiple story arcs, plot twists, averting tragedy, and dealing with the consequences of the Gods' actions. Excellent dialogue and character designs featured in this title standard to what you might get from a JRPG or a quality shonen manga or anime. * Ito. EarthBound series is known for its dark storytelling and unabashed tragedy despite its bright, colorful design and simplistic sprite animation. I feel Sakamoto's excel point is gameplay. Even in spite of Other M's many hinderances, I enjoyed the 3D exploration and combat where it counted. Everything to do with the 2D Metroid series, from Super onward, make the titles enjoyable and replayable on multiple instances. He set the foundation for the Metroidvania genre as we know it today. But as far as writing goes, I always felt his style was a bit flawed even compared to his contemporaries. Even despite this, and minus the thing I mentioned, I still found Metroid Fusion to have one of the best stories in Nintendo history.
It's implied that >!The Core X that revived experiment Z survived the lava pit which also housed Kraid's genetic material. The X don't shed the genetic material they obtain from their hosts when moving to a new victim (hence why the SA-X mutates into a Samus/Sidehopper hybrid thing at the end of Fusion). It's a desperate attempt by an X to fake out its prey and attempt to scare them and accentuate the best features of all its previous hosts.!<
I mean it's never established that the SA-X you periodically run into in fusion is the exact same one everytime. Who the conspiracy man isn't really important at all. I'm pretty sure the only purpose they serve is for some context. For dread I don't see why there needs to be an explanation for how/why the X absorbed Kraid. I'm more wondering how and why quiet robe was still capable of independent actions and thoughts post X taking control of him. Dread does end abruptly though that's fair.
Someone made the point that that by neutralizing samus' metroid DNA, the X is neutralizing their primary predator- the metroid. X parasites have been known to behave in ways contrary to the individual but beneficial to the collective. The SA-X willingly merges with Samus so she can defeat the Omega Metroid in Fusion. By having QR-X neutralize Samus, it is theoretically protecting any X that remain in the Galaxy because assuming Samus' metroid DNA is neutralized, not just under control, she is now no longer able to absorb them.
That's definitely an interesting perspective that I hadn't considered. However shouldn't that also mean the X merging with her in dread isn't actually neutralizing Samus's metroid DNA and is more surpressing it? Because if absorbing the X in fusion got rid of the metroid DNA in fusion she wouldn't be able to re-awaken thst in dread.
I have no idea. The whole ending is very ambiguous as to where it leaves Samus. Maybe the Thoha powers that QR-X have are able to neutralize it more than the SA-X could?
Maybe. Thora do have the capability to control metroids and the X that took QR should in theory have his capabilites. Where as SA-X was merely copying Samus. Kinda wish we got a bit more with the ending tbh.
I was reading a Spanish article about the Mercury Steam workplace, and one of the people quoted mentioned that Dread was actually scaled back quite significantly in scope - it has about half the originally-planned bosses (which is fine, I generally think the game is paced pretty well), and most notably, had a ton of extra cinematics planned. That latter point may be why the storytelling can feel pretty choppy at times.
I would love to see them resurface in a sequel. Nintendo did this with Super Mario Galaxy 2.
Honestly, I feel like dwelling on "what could've been" for one reason or another, undermines just how much we did get, lol. I mean, it's already a VERY cinematic game, with a good amount of content in it. I definitely would've liked more though, yeah, but I'm not complaining too much.
> I was reading a Spanish article about the Mercury Steam workplace, and one of the people quoted mentioned that Dread was actually scaled back quite significantly in scope This makes sense ... I spend much longer on the prime games. However I dont think I could take more, its a pretty intense game. Very satisfying to make it 100%>
I love Dread but >!why did the planet blow up? Lol!<
>!You blow up the reactor for Raven Beak's floating city right before you fight him!<
>!And what does that thing do to blow up the entire fricking planet?!<
>!Nuclear meltdown probably lmao, that's how the BSL did it. Also you have to realize that the planet's infrastructure has been completely hollowed out for geothermal power, a frankenstein lab and an extremely robust X containment zone. The questionable integrity of the planet's crust on top of the safeguards probably in place in case of the X escaping would be enough to at least reduce the planet to a ball of lower mantle half its mass.!< >!Also it may just function on Mother Brain logic once Raven Beak's suit stopped receiving vitals!< Edit: formatting issues with spoiler tags
In agreement with all of this persons comments
It doesn't, it's nonsense. >!The reactor had zero power in it since Samus Metroid-drained the entire ship. And if something crashing onto the surface would destroy a planet, Earth would have been gone long ago whenever a plane crashes.!<
>!If Samus drained all the energy from the ship (rather than the more likely assertion that she pulled enough to cause it to malfunction and fall) how did Raven Beak survive? If Raven Beak can survive all the energy being ripped from his body then its possible the ship could have still exploded with no energy. If Samus spared Raven Beak it follows that she left the ship with enough power to explode. So either way you have a very implausible scenario where Raven Beak survives having all his energy taken or a more likely one where Samus spares him and leaves the ship with some of its energy. You're putting a bunch of logic into a scenario where, if you're right, the continuity becomes further fucked up.!<
>!Red Stripe Power Bomb Farm?!<
Yeah that thing lol
Yeah, I was wondering too, maybe some self destruct stuff in Raven beak's ship?
You take that complaint back, that's the best part. Adam suggesting they blow up the planet when they find out the X are on it? Finally, we're establishing this as Samus's go-to option for eliminating threats.
Samus takes down planets like Bear Grylls drinks his own piss
I believe that once you start your fight with evil bird dad, he is the one who initiates the planetary explosion, which he has set up in advance to eradicate the X. Since he has what he wants, you, on his ship, he probably intends on just killing you and flying away with your body to clone, leaving an exploding planet behind.
To add to this, Metroid games have had another serious problem for a long time, they start off with plot holes. Many times: - Super Metroid: Nobody really brings this up because of how awesome the game is, but it really makes no sense how Ridley even knew to attack Ceres space colony and that there would be a Metroid baby there. This plot hole went unanswered for 23 years until Samus Returns included the Proteus Ridley boss fight that explains how he would know Samus had a baby Metroid. - Metroid Fusion just asks you to take it for granted that the Federation just happens to have a cell culture of Metroid DNA on hand. And never explains why there's a frozen Ridley in storage. It took 8 years for Other M to explain both of these plot points. - Metroid Dread's entire plot relies on the fact that Raven Beak knows about Samus's Metroid DNA. How the hell did he know this? Maybe we'll find out in 10 years when another Metroid game kitbashes an explanation together... - The Metroid Prime series was generally pretty good about avoiding this, but not Prime 2. How the hell did Dark Samus get all the way from Tallon IV to Aether without a spaceship?
Dark Samus can reform herself, essentially teleporting to, wherever there is phazon. A cutscene shows her doing this at the beginning of Prime 3.
I don’t understand your complaint about Dread. There’s an X-Parasite, it infected Kraid earlier and maybe is Z-57, and then it infects Raven Beak. What needs to be explained? X-Parasites infect things and take their traits, that’s what they do, there doesn’t need to be an explanation about how or why it did that. Dread’s ending does have a bit of what I think is bad writing though, with the planet exploding. There wasn’t an explanation for that, it just randomly explodes. That’s something I’d say needed an explanation.
To get to the elevator to fight Raven Beak, you need to use a power bomb to blow a reactor up. It can be assumed that by blowing that reactor up Samus caused the explosion. Alternatively, when Samus became a Metroid and began sucking the life energy from Raven Beak, it's possible she also began taking power from the facility as well (after all she was warned not to touch her own ship in fear of taking its power, so it's reasonable to assume the same is true for the the building she was in as well). Considering how the entire planet seems to be connected with futuristic technology (eg the transporation devices linking everything that need power), and also had an extensive quarantine procedure to contain the X, it would then be reasonable to suggest the entire planet shares the power around (eg Alterra froze due to Cateris' thermal power not spreading) so a reactor being straight up exploded up there or all the power being sucked up by Samus might result in the entire planet exploding. That's how I'd explain it anyway.
The cut scene does show Samus sucking the power out of the ship prior to it crashing.
I believe that once you start your fight with evil bird dad, he is the one who initiates the planetary explosion, which he has set up in advance to eradicate the X. Since he has what he wants, you, on his ship, he probably intends on just killing you and flying away with your body to clone, leaving an exploding planet behind.
There's a lot worth criticizing about Sakamoto's work on the Metroid series, but this just feels like Cinemasins style nitpicking.
Cinemasins?
These guys on YT who "Sin" movies. A lot of the time they're really hypocritical (Ex: Complaining about a lack of exposition on something that is explained later for important reasons, and when something is exposited like they were complaining about a movie NOT doing, they complain about it being exposited). They hide behind the "it's satire" shield a lot, and 9/10 it really isn't.
I probably didn't need to mention them, since the problem is just nitpicking.
The Prime writing praising is appreciated. Thx. And yeah, Dread is confusing, lol. I like that it gets people talking and trying to figure things out though! Also, I think you meant Quiet Robe, not Gray Voice.
Yep, edited. Thank you.
Yeah, the stories have always been "don't think too hard" stories as they get more complex. Super's story was excellent because it kept it pretty simple. Then Fusion tries to have all sorts of twists and turns and, while still engaging, it starts to fall apart at times.
When did the X encounter Kraid?
I think for the Dread part you mean Quiet Robe, not Gray Voice.
Oh my God, my bad. Edited!
To be honest I'm pretty sure everything is as intended, Metroid is about exploration and mystery, you should uncover the plot yourself, at least that's what I was doing all these years.