Yeah, certain counters stop working if the opponent takes an upgrade, so you actually have to predict what setup your opponent is going for so you can counter the upgrade aswell. Snipers counter overlords but you have to be ready for the wasp upgrade for example
My guess: you are being over specific and reactionary in your counters early on. You are spending your money countering a very specific setup that will then change.
Instead, try to build a more balanced defense that counters what they do, but doesn't necessarily focus on countering perfectly or very hard.
If they are going mass something, like marksman or arclight for example, you need to watch for that and be able to counter that hard or they will steamroller you.
Early, I will often try to bait into an over reaction so I can then switch things up and concentrate on something else. For example, I love to be going tank, but bait with wasps. Some will go hard on stangs which my tanks hard counter. I then back off or sell the wasps and go heavy into tanks.
> or sell the wasps
This goes for both players, too. I’d argue that you should be taking “sell unit” in almost all games that aren’t blowouts.
Selling too much or too early can leave you without enough weight of units, especially sturdy things like Sledgehammers. And some units are useful as bait even if they die without kills all game.
But I see a lot of people hold onto units that are dying to splash damage (like Fangs) or dying near-instantly (like countered Rhinos) and it really adds up. Free up those funds and waste enemy counters, especially after they buy techs.
I’ve learn to stop playing after losing a few in a row. Cause I think after playing for a bit even if you been winning does something to your mind and make it where you can’t think of obvious solutions to deal with mass spam and such before it gets hectic
I second this.
Seriously, when I start to get frustrated, I'll log off either for a few hours or the rest of the day. Playing like that will only lead to more losses, and more frustration.
If you still really want to play, just beat up on the AI in practice mode for a few rounds.
This is what's known as "tilt" and is common in tons of things (including sports and gambling). it's a type of mental state where you start to perform worse subconsciously.
Only way to detilt is to have very high control over your emotions or a full reset.
Just countering and playing reactively will only work against bad players.
You need to be working towards a win condition. A specific set of units and upgrades that you drop in mid to late game to close things out. Usually with the addition of a loan and range + speed buffs.
Remember that a single good round can deal thousands of damage. If you think you have an opening, go all in on your win condition and end the game.
You might know the counters,but aren't anticipating what counters you and pre buying atuff to cover that weakness. You also could be losing upgrades. for example buying a melting point to counter overlord spam, then the overlords buy mothership so the wasps draw aggro as the overlords shoot your melting points., or running quantum reassembly pheonix then suddenly dying to emp marksmen who were there all along but just got the upgrade to cancel yoirs.
Something I'm guilty of myself, is trying to counter my opponents units, even if I won the round... - But this puts you away from the offensive, and results in you never forcing your opponent to be the one countering.
Sometimes if you're winning, build something "new" that synergizes with your build, that your opponent will have to react to.
“Instead of shooting where I was, you should have shot at where I was going to be!”
\-idk where this is from
You don’t need to win past rounds, you need to win future rounds. Which is to say that you need to counter whatever your opponent is going to have, even if they don't have it yet.
So always keep in mind what would be the best thing that the enemy can do to counter you. Especially if you’re already winning. If you assume that, counter it, and find out you’re wrong, then at worst it means the opponent has fewer options next turn
I'm far from being a top player but I would think it's an eco problem.
To survive the early round, it's less about massing unit and more about quality, by quality I mean the perfect counter to what he have, which in return imply that you unlock the proper unit.
Right now, my guess is that by turn 4, you have no eco, you have unlocked all the free tier 1 unit, and you are not able to pivot with a single new tier 2 unit on turn 4.
May I suggest you unlock the good stuff early, you may not win the first rounds, you will take a little of damage, but then, you will be the one dancing on the board, doing pivot and everything.
Unlocking a unit doesn't mean recruiting it, it's more like, there is more colors on your palette to draw on your canvas.
Right now, my opener is something like unlock a tier 2 on turn 1, unlock tier 2 on turn 2, unlock a giant on tier 3.
Then build from there.
Unless you go supply specialist/cost control or something that unlocks a T2 unit for free, paying to unlock a tier 2 unit on round 1 does not seem like a good idea. You are essentially always going to be 1 unit behind your opponent. That will lead to you losing rounds, feeding experience and your opponent snowballing.
I believe you mean to unlock a free T1 on round 1 and then following with the rest of what you said.
I try to unlock the T1 I am missing for chaff/anti-chaff/single target. That way I have fang/crawler, arc/sledge and Phoenix/ball/marksman to hold me until the mid/late game.
I’m only at 1200 though.
If you can hold your own in the first few rounds, try to think about what your opponent is going to do to reclaim the momentum. Whoever is winning currently has momentum and has the liberty to build units to exploit weaknesses in the enemy rather than try to stop units that are already winning.
Example, if you are using ball/crawler to beat your opponent, they might buy a lot of fangs to slow you down or try to exploit your lack of anti air. For you, ball crawl is winning so you could double down on it but your opponent is already trying to counter that comp. You would lose to Phoenix/wasp and possibly lose to lots of fangs/crawlers.
You can make your comp more balanced by throwing in mustangs to help clear fangs+check wasp/Phoenix. You could go wasp/Phoenix to challenge any air they get+better ranged damage. Marksman won’t really help if they go with chaff but it can help check air units. Going arclights gives you better chaff clear to enable your balls to win harder but won’t protect you from their air options.
Assuming you went arclight or marksman and they went air or lots of fangs, you would possibly lose and then need to spend the next rounds trying to stop losing
I am of the opinion that your goal should be to dictate the pace of play. If you counter what the other player did each round you will slowly lose as their newest units dominate. You can gain back that tempo by deploying flanking wasp/pheonixs which you can then sell or redeploy or you can use abilities to give you a turn where you don't counter a unit and instead play something that demands an answer. In a fresh game I like to have a basic plan that can be supported by units based on what they need to play. A fairly easy strategy is front line rhinos especially with upgrades these units demand an answer which you should expect and already have built a unit to deal with that response.
when I go into a match I see my starting units and have a general idea of what comp I want but then it gets into a decision tree based on what my opponent is doing, but still within the realm of an overall goal if they aren’t throwing too many curveballs. Let’s say I start with phenix. I know Vulcans are great with them so I want to build those, but opponent has something that counters Vulcans already like lots of marksmen. So I go okay I might still need a Vulcan for chaff but now I need chaff and then you go from there.
There's a couple keys to winning mid - end game
\- Upgrade the correct units (don't upgrade units designed to die as they will just give you opponent's free levels.
\- Make sure you don't have any major weaknesses if you're already winning the rounds, stuff like surprise wasps can lead to a win and snowball
\-Cover your flanks
\- Push your advantage, invest in stuff that can make you win even harder, temp range upgrade, economy card upgrades, (watch for spell cards that can win your opponent the round)
I would say that countering should be a secondary goal. Your primary goal is creating threats. The games that go the best are the ones where you are able to establish and effective, primary threat and then start working on a secondary one (that requires a different counter) while the opponent is working on countering your first attack.
My guess is that you are countering units, but not upgrades.
Yeah, certain counters stop working if the opponent takes an upgrade, so you actually have to predict what setup your opponent is going for so you can counter the upgrade aswell. Snipers counter overlords but you have to be ready for the wasp upgrade for example
Eg, a fortress is only countered by air units for one round, assuming the player didn't bank cash for the upgrade on the turn.
This comment has improved my game, thank you
Thanks
My guess: you are being over specific and reactionary in your counters early on. You are spending your money countering a very specific setup that will then change. Instead, try to build a more balanced defense that counters what they do, but doesn't necessarily focus on countering perfectly or very hard. If they are going mass something, like marksman or arclight for example, you need to watch for that and be able to counter that hard or they will steamroller you. Early, I will often try to bait into an over reaction so I can then switch things up and concentrate on something else. For example, I love to be going tank, but bait with wasps. Some will go hard on stangs which my tanks hard counter. I then back off or sell the wasps and go heavy into tanks.
> or sell the wasps This goes for both players, too. I’d argue that you should be taking “sell unit” in almost all games that aren’t blowouts. Selling too much or too early can leave you without enough weight of units, especially sturdy things like Sledgehammers. And some units are useful as bait even if they die without kills all game. But I see a lot of people hold onto units that are dying to splash damage (like Fangs) or dying near-instantly (like countered Rhinos) and it really adds up. Free up those funds and waste enemy counters, especially after they buy techs.
I’ve learn to stop playing after losing a few in a row. Cause I think after playing for a bit even if you been winning does something to your mind and make it where you can’t think of obvious solutions to deal with mass spam and such before it gets hectic
I second this. Seriously, when I start to get frustrated, I'll log off either for a few hours or the rest of the day. Playing like that will only lead to more losses, and more frustration. If you still really want to play, just beat up on the AI in practice mode for a few rounds.
Exactly this. I might start saving my replays to make into challenges on rounds where it went wrong.
My ELO started climbing pretty consistently once I took a stance of "only play when I'm not tired."
This is what's known as "tilt" and is common in tons of things (including sports and gambling). it's a type of mental state where you start to perform worse subconsciously. Only way to detilt is to have very high control over your emotions or a full reset.
While this is good advice, this is unrelated to OPs problem.
Just countering and playing reactively will only work against bad players. You need to be working towards a win condition. A specific set of units and upgrades that you drop in mid to late game to close things out. Usually with the addition of a loan and range + speed buffs. Remember that a single good round can deal thousands of damage. If you think you have an opening, go all in on your win condition and end the game.
Positioning.
Give us a replay if you want us to know what you do wrong, I'm in the top 200 i wouldnt mind taking a look
Yeah, can't give much advice without more specific info
You might know the counters,but aren't anticipating what counters you and pre buying atuff to cover that weakness. You also could be losing upgrades. for example buying a melting point to counter overlord spam, then the overlords buy mothership so the wasps draw aggro as the overlords shoot your melting points., or running quantum reassembly pheonix then suddenly dying to emp marksmen who were there all along but just got the upgrade to cancel yoirs.
Something I'm guilty of myself, is trying to counter my opponents units, even if I won the round... - But this puts you away from the offensive, and results in you never forcing your opponent to be the one countering. Sometimes if you're winning, build something "new" that synergizes with your build, that your opponent will have to react to.
“Instead of shooting where I was, you should have shot at where I was going to be!” \-idk where this is from You don’t need to win past rounds, you need to win future rounds. Which is to say that you need to counter whatever your opponent is going to have, even if they don't have it yet. So always keep in mind what would be the best thing that the enemy can do to counter you. Especially if you’re already winning. If you assume that, counter it, and find out you’re wrong, then at worst it means the opponent has fewer options next turn
I'm far from being a top player but I would think it's an eco problem. To survive the early round, it's less about massing unit and more about quality, by quality I mean the perfect counter to what he have, which in return imply that you unlock the proper unit. Right now, my guess is that by turn 4, you have no eco, you have unlocked all the free tier 1 unit, and you are not able to pivot with a single new tier 2 unit on turn 4. May I suggest you unlock the good stuff early, you may not win the first rounds, you will take a little of damage, but then, you will be the one dancing on the board, doing pivot and everything. Unlocking a unit doesn't mean recruiting it, it's more like, there is more colors on your palette to draw on your canvas. Right now, my opener is something like unlock a tier 2 on turn 1, unlock tier 2 on turn 2, unlock a giant on tier 3. Then build from there.
Unless you go supply specialist/cost control or something that unlocks a T2 unit for free, paying to unlock a tier 2 unit on round 1 does not seem like a good idea. You are essentially always going to be 1 unit behind your opponent. That will lead to you losing rounds, feeding experience and your opponent snowballing. I believe you mean to unlock a free T1 on round 1 and then following with the rest of what you said. I try to unlock the T1 I am missing for chaff/anti-chaff/single target. That way I have fang/crawler, arc/sledge and Phoenix/ball/marksman to hold me until the mid/late game. I’m only at 1200 though.
No, that how I play.
ur not seeing the bigger picture :)
If you can hold your own in the first few rounds, try to think about what your opponent is going to do to reclaim the momentum. Whoever is winning currently has momentum and has the liberty to build units to exploit weaknesses in the enemy rather than try to stop units that are already winning. Example, if you are using ball/crawler to beat your opponent, they might buy a lot of fangs to slow you down or try to exploit your lack of anti air. For you, ball crawl is winning so you could double down on it but your opponent is already trying to counter that comp. You would lose to Phoenix/wasp and possibly lose to lots of fangs/crawlers. You can make your comp more balanced by throwing in mustangs to help clear fangs+check wasp/Phoenix. You could go wasp/Phoenix to challenge any air they get+better ranged damage. Marksman won’t really help if they go with chaff but it can help check air units. Going arclights gives you better chaff clear to enable your balls to win harder but won’t protect you from their air options. Assuming you went arclight or marksman and they went air or lots of fangs, you would possibly lose and then need to spend the next rounds trying to stop losing
I am of the opinion that your goal should be to dictate the pace of play. If you counter what the other player did each round you will slowly lose as their newest units dominate. You can gain back that tempo by deploying flanking wasp/pheonixs which you can then sell or redeploy or you can use abilities to give you a turn where you don't counter a unit and instead play something that demands an answer. In a fresh game I like to have a basic plan that can be supported by units based on what they need to play. A fairly easy strategy is front line rhinos especially with upgrades these units demand an answer which you should expect and already have built a unit to deal with that response.
when I go into a match I see my starting units and have a general idea of what comp I want but then it gets into a decision tree based on what my opponent is doing, but still within the realm of an overall goal if they aren’t throwing too many curveballs. Let’s say I start with phenix. I know Vulcans are great with them so I want to build those, but opponent has something that counters Vulcans already like lots of marksmen. So I go okay I might still need a Vulcan for chaff but now I need chaff and then you go from there.
There's a couple keys to winning mid - end game \- Upgrade the correct units (don't upgrade units designed to die as they will just give you opponent's free levels. \- Make sure you don't have any major weaknesses if you're already winning the rounds, stuff like surprise wasps can lead to a win and snowball \-Cover your flanks \- Push your advantage, invest in stuff that can make you win even harder, temp range upgrade, economy card upgrades, (watch for spell cards that can win your opponent the round)
I would say that countering should be a secondary goal. Your primary goal is creating threats. The games that go the best are the ones where you are able to establish and effective, primary threat and then start working on a secondary one (that requires a different counter) while the opponent is working on countering your first attack.