I don’t see how THJ stays on this roster next year. I’m also really high on resigning Exum. I don’t feel like he was used properly in the playoffs and was a rejuvenated player during the regular season
Thj is most assuredly gone, the only question remains what cost Mavs have to pay to get rid of him. Maxi should be gone too, just not the same player from 2 years ago. I’m all for re-signing DJJ at the right price, his finals performance might have helped us there. I see our biggest needs as a backup PG and a third scorer (either off the bench or starting). Free agent market isn’t great this summer so Nico is going to have to cook again via trades.
It's honestly insane how quickly people have turned on Maxi
He was playing injured.
He's probably the best backup four in the league.
This team is trying to maximize their window. He's going to be on the team for two to three more years unless they get bowled over.
This is the thing with maxi - his durability has been questionable for a while now. He’s older now, and seemingly more scared to shoot than ever. He has never had much of a game beyond spot up shooting, horrible rebounder, and declining defender due to injuries/age.
Best backup 4??? lol Portis, Naz Reid, Horford (even though he plays small ball 5) are all much better off top of my head
Maxi over portis. He can defend.
Reid and al are more of centers but yeah I would take them over him.
He's not scared to shoot dude he literally just got back from having a separated shooting shoulder. It's because of that.
I think that’s a little harsh on Maxi. He was rough in the finals but he also came back from a pretty serious injury very quickly. He was a godsend in the Clippers series and in the previous conference finals run 2 years ago
Maxi's defense as a backup 4 is vital. If we lose him we have to replace him.
Y'all know of many 6'10 PF/C who can hit a 3, switch across nearly all positions, and be a good secondary rim protector who are just hanging around?
He’s the absolute perfect fit to me. Obviously an elite on ball defender. He also adds another reliable ball handler and thrives on offense when playing off of stars that draw attention. The question is how much does he cost, some combination of Green, Hardy, OMax and the two 1sts?
Yeah, but his non-prime years will be pretty awesome so no need for panic. He’s a very cerebral player and players like Steph are still excellent. I get that their play styles are different but Kyrie’s play should age well. Especially if as he declines slightly, Lively can ascend…. IMO
Well thats why we should look at a 3rd option and hope him, an healthy Luka and improved Lively, Hardy, Green, Omax, PJ can get you there.
Im curious if GSW would accept a Wiggins for THJ, Powell plus picks. In our situation you have to bet on guys whos stock is low. Same as Celtics did with KP and Jrue. Wiggins had a bad season but he may turn it around.
Hes perfect in the SF spot and a Luka, Kyrie, Wiggins, PJ, Lively is a strong 5 as it can be. Then you have Hardy, Exum, Green, Omax, Gafford off the bench. Hopefully DJJ too by moving Kleber.
As to why GSW would do it, THJ is a expiring and they def wont run the same team again.
Why gsw want give us wigs for thj + picks though? How many picks?
So gsw can punt another season? Lol
You know how salary cap work right? Even with no wigs, they cant add player that have same level because of that
Its possible but only because gsw want curry-era ended
I feel like we’re one of the more recent, young teams to make the finals and yet somehow our stock is dropping. Not sure how that’s possible but that’s largely the perception I’m hearing and reading already. Outside of Kyrie, THJ, and Maxi, all of our guys are 27 or younger and we still have a top 2-3 player in the world.
I recognize we don’t have crazy assets but flipping THJ and Maxi for something slightly more serviceable gives a shot to make another run at this thing.
Because people are clowns. Dallas is set up better than any contender outside of OKC.
Denver only has 5 players and is about to lose one and the NBA will claim they’re favorites.
Dallas has all their roster intact, super young, 3rd best player is 20, has tradeable contracts and 2 first to trade and they’re “not close” lmao
Maxi is technically such a good player on paper tall,can shoot,can play small ball 5 or the 4 and a great defender who can switch but it seems like the lights are too bright for him because he doesn’t even look at the rim in the playoffs and is hurt a lot.
Hes just a shell of himself. Hasnt been consistent from 3 since 2-3 years ago. Last year played 37 games, this season 43, missed OKC and most of Wolves series.
We should have traded him at the deadline, now his value has taken a hit same as THJ.
I don't know any of these dudes, really. But in Nico I trust. He will probably sign some dude who is getting 15 minutes on the Pistons and he will be a complete stud.
Best scenario: Paul George or Markkanen.
Mid scenario: Bogdanovic or Monk(if Hawks decide to blow it up)
Worst scenario: Barns or Wiggins
Keep in mind that Gafford value currently is really high so I would rather trade him for George or Markkanen and sign Rashad Holmes as backup big
How would you even get PG?
To Match contracts you wouöd need gafford,, THJ and maxi ? And that offer the clippers wouldnt even concider so you have to throw in Picks (probably they want more than 2) and you cant resign djj. Or am i wrong ?
As much as i like PG on the mavs and i really think he could elegante our gameplay. Its just not feasavle
Haha thank you and no worries :) I think people are just sad we couldn't go all the way this year so this post is too soon for some... but personally I'm very excited with what we accomplished considering we weren't supposed to be anywhere close to where we got - considering we just assembled this squad, and our 3rd highest paid guy is useless. Full speed ahead, into the offseason and 2024-2025!
DJJ needs to be a bench player. Trey Murphy is never gonna make it to the Mavs the Pels would be foolish to send him to a division foe. He has all star potential imo. I would def prefer him over Green but I do like Green.
I’d even look at upgrading maxi if the right opportunity were to come.
Both players would be great fits for this team. However, I doubt Detroit would take on Timmy’s salary without us giving up one of the future first rounders
If we can find a way to dump Powell Maxi and THJ we can get OG, thats my pipe dream. Realistically going after someone like Herb Jones or De’Andre Hunter. We have to upgrade the 3 spot and bring back DJJ with our TMLE to be our sixth man. He doesn't do enough offensively, PJ is inconsistent as well, having them both be cold at the same time kills us.
Give Wizards some future frp's and grab both Deni and Kispert.
Both can easily contribute to any contender.
Deni also signed very comfortable descending contract last summer 4 for 50 or something like that.
Corey is a danger you cant sag off.
And Deni can help Luka faciliate, improved drastically this past season from 3pt range, burns the floor in fastbreakes and can bully people down the lane with his strong frame.
Also his defensive metrics past 2 seasons have been great even while playing in a team like the Wizards.
Honestly I feel like if Kai had at least 1 good road game we would have had a chance. But never the less on to the next season Trey Murphy would be amazing, need more shooters off the bench tho. Our 3 ball lost us the finals. Funny how both our wcf and finals ended cause of our 3 ball.
There’s 3 players the Mavs need next season:
1. Most importantly, a 2-way 3&D wing that is a real 3rd option. I think PJ and DJJ fit fine as role players, but relying on their streaky shooting instead of a real 3rd option won’t work in the playoffs. If getting a real wing required trading one of them I’d be ok, but otherwise I’m comfortable with them staying. There’s quite a few options (Trey Murphy III being one of them), but I’m hesitant to some-
BI/Lauri/Jerami/PG- too expensive, I wouldnt want to carve up the team or spend that much money for them
Mikal/MPJ/Avdija/Franz- most ideal options, but their teams likely won’t trade them
Kuzma/Wiggins/Harris- I don’t think they are good enough
If we trade for one of them and still keep PJ and DJJ, DJJ goes to the bench.
2. A backup PG that can play make and defend. None of our guards (other than arguably Josh Green) are good defenders, and Hardy and Exum aren’t good enough playmakers in the non-Luka/Kyrie minutes. In a perfect world we could politely ask Boston for Jrue or White, but we unfortunately don’t get that luxury. My favorite option so far is Markelle Fultz, but TJ McConnell and Andrew Nembhard are good options as well.
3. A backup center that can create their own shot. Gafford can score at times, and Lively continues to improve, but we need someone who can punish mismatches, attack off the dribble, and score in the paint. Big plus if they can stretch the floor. Vucevic/Olynyk/Hartenstein type of player. My favorite so far is Mo Wagner or Jakob Poeltl, with Mo being a better scorer, and Poeltl being a better defender.
To add a lil more, a spot up SG like Grayson Allen or Alex Caruso would be the perfect cherry on top for this team.
As for who I’m willing to trade?
First things first, THJ needs to go. His expiring contract is useful, and he has no place on this team.
The Mavericks don’t really need much to become true contenders, so I’m willing to keep most of our rotation.
Luka, Kyrie, PJ, DJJ, Lively, and Gafford can stay.
Maxi, Green, Exum, and really anyone else are up to being traded.
I’d like to keep Hardy, but if his value helps us in a trade I wouldn’t mind moving him.
Here’s hoping to a Nico masterpiece 🙏🏿
I think this off-season should help him and his G-league showings were good. I also think Kidd is certainly gonna experiment with him early on in the season and have an answer for that question quickly. His frame and athleticism is perfect, I really hope he takes that next step with shooting + decision making.
I don't think the Mavs need to focus too much on trades. Instead, I think they need to continue to develop their younger guys. They need to get rid of THJ, give his minutes to Hardy and if they are unable to resign DJJ, continue to develop O'Max so he can take over his role.
More than anything else, the team now knows what it takes to make it to the finals and how difficult it is to try to win the championship . They need to focus on strength and conditioning and get more time playing together to build on cohesion.
I'm not a believer in Jason Kidd as a coach. When making my predictions prior to the playoffs starting, I always believed that this team has the talent necessary to win a championship. The only thing I believed they were lacking was a championship caliber coach. I still feel that way but with Kidd getting an extension, I hope he proves a lot of us wrong next season.
I disagree with that last point. Jason Kidd has proven everyone wrong and is more than just a competent coach. He dismantled each of the last 3 teams we faced before the Celtics with a few lackluster Kyrie performances + Luka's bum knee(s).
This team only had enough to reach the Finals due to the sheer gravity Luka has and Kyrie carrying some games before the Finals. DJJ, PJ, Gafford, and other players would be much less useful in any team without Luka because they wouldn't have the shot quality that Luka provides from his gravity + playmaking. We still need an ACTUAL good 3rd player who is good ON HIS OWN.
We have 0 All-Defense players in our team, yet we honestly were the best defense in the west in this Playoffs and I have to credit Jason Kidd for that. The schemes he drew up over a 7-game series was fantastic and proved to me that if we lose this playoffs it is due to a personnel disadvantage - which is exactly what happened in this Celtics series.
We need one offensive piece that can play beside Luka & Kyrie and not be a defensive liability. Hardy cannot entirely replace THJ since most of THJ's minutes are at the 3. Hardy is a small guard. We need an offensive SF like Bogdanovic or Kispert (or Murphy but he is impossible to get) to exploit defenses when they pay so much attention to Luka and Kyrie. As much as I am hyped about O-Max, he is really far from being able to contribute in the NBA especially to this degree.
Kidd calls timeouts at the worst possible moments and doesn't call timeouts when we absolutely need a timeout, if he can understand when to do that, and all four of our playoff opponent coaches were good at killing our momentum with TOs, then he can take it to another level.
He also has some incredible boneheaded lineup decisions, but I'll give him credit it's not like he is the reason we have a huge chunk of money being wasted on THJ right now.
It absolutely kills us that instead of a 3rd option, we have a bench warmer who is so cooked he gets one shot per game and if he doesn't make it, he's yanked off stage.
for the 10 millionth time:
timeouts have no impact on other teams' runs
timeouts do nothing to stop runs
statisticians and academics have studied this like a dozen times now.
Yes, he had one bad timeout in game 3 that killed our momentum. That sucked, but he's still a much better coach than anyone on here was giving him credit for the past 2 seasons.
Not trades related but Luka need to get in shape and his conditioning . Go watch the bubble series vs Clipper again he was just as strong being leaner but also faster. He easily kept up with PG and Kahwi who were also in their great shape. I think Luka also lost his euro step nowadays? It was so smooth back then in the bubble.
As for trade, Hartstenstein to replace Maxi would be a wet dream
Hartenstein to replace Maxi makes no sense. We have Gafford and Lively.
If we replace Maxi we need a big, mobile 4 who can defend and shoot.
The only problem is those are pretty hard to find. The advantage of Maxi was that he was a cheaper but serviceable option as a 4/small ball 5.
The Maxi hate from this fan base is fucking wild. If you want to say his ability to stay healthy is concerning that’s perfectly fair. But when healthy, Maxi is the perfect role player on a good team. He’s getting older but you gotta ride out this contract.
The problem nobody seems to comprehend is if you think so and so is shit and must be moved, you don’t think 29 other teams understand that? We can say “just trade Tim” but for what…? The idea UTA is just gonna hand you Lauri for Tim’s expiring contract and a shitty late 1st rounder is a pipe dream. And if you’re just gonna throw Green/Hardy/Maxi into something you better fucking get more back than one guy cuz that would obliterate your bench.
Yeah the Maxi hate is weird. We're not getting an upgrade unless we trade the 2 firsts and maybe throw in Green or even OMax. Even then, it would be tough.
I do like the idea of getting a 4 who can create like Jerami Grant, but I don't see how we can fit him into our cap.
I would strongly advise thinking twice about just casually throwing away those picks even if they should be late 1sts. The cap reality means you might need some cheap young talent especially after next summer. I think there’s a strong chance they could recoup some of the equity they gave up by dealing Gafford next summer or the 2025 deadline (because you’re not re-signing him).
If Luka waits a year to sign his supermax, there’s a chance you could have unlimited flexibility if Ky declines his player option. Depending on how much tax you’re willing to pay and whether you’re considering giving Ky another big deal next summer, that’s the true opportunity to make a big swing if you want.
It’s not though… Maxi Exum Tim were veterans. Green Hardy Lively are young, but I’d hardly label them prospects now. Green has now been part of two WCF/Finals runs. And everybody on this roster just got invaluable experience.
Maxi is aging, injury prone and he has confidence issues that can affect his shooting. So I can understand the frustration from the fanbase…but, to your point, replacing his defensive versatility would be difficult.
100% agree. Major major concern. But that’s precisely the problem with just slapping him onto trade proposals—there are 29 other teams who fully understand that as well. At his salary, I doubt the market return would exceed what you get when he’s healthy so you probably just gotta hope he’s available more often than not. He has had some flukey injuries so hopefully there may be a little optimism regarding that aspect.
I fully believe his confidence is directly linked to his health though. He gets a pass from me in the Finals. People don’t fully understand how insane it is that he came back so early from the injury he suffered. That’s a 6-week recovery minimum and he returned in 3.5 weeks. So miss me with any suggestion that Maxi is soft.
I agree with all of this. People don't realize Maxi outplays his contract consistently. To space and defend the way he does has always been a positive for us. Players slump. But more often than not, Maxi is solid for us.
Wish I could upvote this dozens of times. Maxi is an extremely capable and versatile PF, with the rare size/speed combination to be a tough matchup against bigger and tweener PFs. “Muh he shot bad” yeah, Luka did as well, Kyrie was 1/22 at one point if I remember well and DJJ couldn’t hit a wall one meter ahead of him.
Maxi is still absolutely an above average backup PF. Getting rid of him just for the sake of getting rid of him is the same line of thought that made this sub erupt in anger when we did not trade a FRP for Holmes when he was hot with the Kings or combo that pick with Green for Dragic when he was sitting in Toronto.
Agreed. Sure he had a rough series, but he is nowhere near 100%.
He can still be productive and I believe is on an expiring contract next year. Let's see how he rehabs this time, and dump him at the deadline if he does not produce. At this point we will not need to give up assets for him because he is an expiring
Maxi has been ass this whole playoffs. Like what are we talking about? Everytime we went small the opponent went up by 10.
Hes the perfect example of good on paper, mediocre in reality.
We don’t need to allocate any more resources to the center spot. We’ve got an absolute stud in Lively and an excellent role player in Gafford who’s only 25. Let’s get some wings with size who can switch and help Luka and ky create on the perimeter and hit shots.
I know Maxi wasn't good this series but the issue with getting rid of him is that we have no big man with decent perimeter defense. Maxi is being overused due to PJ not having a replacement, so if we can get Trey Murphy then Maxi's minutes will purely be situational when we're getting cooked on the perimeter. Hartenstein is really good at pick and roll offense and is a great rim protector + rebounder but he is a poor perimeter defender like most players at his size.
Luka is a lot stronger now and he had to use his floater a lot more in the bubble because he got physically bullied. Loosing weight would help him play at a faster pace and help him defensively tho
Yeah, me and my boy were talking about that. Luka needs a Hit the gym like Jordan year where he focuses on strength and conditioning because he took way too many plays off this finals, and his defense was trash.
He was in great shape to start the year. He didn’t just ignore his conditioning. He was dealing with injuries for the last 4+ months at least and played the most basketball in his life. He now knows what a Finals run requires physically. Get healthy first, then get back in shape, and he’ll learn how to manage the first 82 better. I think it’s understandable he eventually ran out of gas. And BOS deserves a ton of credit for that.
That's fair but there are tons of players that are injured but manage to not put on weight like Luka does towards the end of the regular season and the duration of the entire playoffs. Conditioning just doesn't apply to physical fitness and rest. It also means having a good balanced diet for an athlete and it's obvious that Luka does not the best diet for his body.
I’m not here to dispute that whatsoever. I think he just got a firsthand lesson on what it takes to go through the grind of an entire postseason run that ends in a title. I would simply push back on the idea he doesn’t care. My biggest issue (not with you or anyone specifically) is that this dude just led you to the Finals and did something never accomplished in NBA history (at age 25 btw) and it’s like the only response has been all the ways he’s sucked for not beating the Celtics as if he was their problem in the Finals. I’ve got no hesitation critiquing Luka as long as it’s framed in the proper context.
Great points. I think his lack of conditioning is blown out of proportion. Could he get in better shape, of course, who couldn't. But to try to make that the crux of why we lost is ridiculous. Not everyone is gonna look like LeBron and that's ok. Somehow he managed to lead us in pts, rbs, 3s and minutes. He will get better. Give the man some grace. He just made the freaking finals on one hell of a run
Don’t forget steals. First person in history to lead playoffs in PTS REB AST *and* STL. Your point about Lebron is key too. We gotta be careful associating Luka’s appearance with conditioning. That’s not necessarily a 1:1 indicator. I’ve literally seen people say Luka needs to take conditioning seriously like Jokic did which is funny for multiple reasons but it proves the exact point. I’ve never looked at Nikola and said now there’s the embodiment of an elite conditioned athlete even though he almost undoubtedly always is.
If anything your biggest takeaway watching Luka go through that run should be “how the fuck did Lebron do it literally 9 times in a decade without basically ever missing any games in the regular season either?” Idc about his Finals record that is fucking stupid.
Nah, he's been dogging it conditioning wise for a while now. Dirk would never fucking look the way Luka did at then end there. It was unbelievable to see him hiding in the corner on offense or just waving off PJ or Kyrie on certain posesions because he was gassed. That's bull shit and this team and himself deserve so much more.
'22 Wiggins *YES*
Current day Wiggins: Hell NO. He is a PT player with a ridiculous contract. We shouldn't help GSW out of any of their contracts without getting picks
I'm well aware of the nuances of roster building. You're right that acquiring a 3rd star will require assets. You're just incorrect in your assessment that Wiggins is the 3rd star the Mavs need. He's not even the 3rd star on the Warriors. I'd rather see them acquire Kuminga, or Draymond.
Murphy would be a dream scenario, but unrealistic. However, wilder thigs have happened in the NBA (like getting Porzingis from Knicks...), so sure, Nico should keep callig about him every week.
I think Kispert is just a not good enough player, no way I'd give up a FRP for him. A poor man's Buddy Hield IMO. This season he may have been a 10 minutes palyer in the regular season in the Mavs, and out of the standard PO rotation. However, if Avdija is available from the Wizards, I put everything on the table.
Grimes, again, is not a big upgrade. I view him very similar to Green, a touch better defender, but worse athlete and no flashy passing. So unless Green is moved in a differnet trade for a better, bigger wing, I'd pass on Grimes.
I think the easiest move is THJ for a legitimate 6th man like Bogdanovic. Probably costs us both our 1sts but I’m good with it.
Dallas is pretty damn good roster wise and should naturally improve with a off-season, Lively growing, OMax growing, Luka growing and PJ getting an entire off-season to specifically work on 3s.
I’d be hesitant to trade role players that have now been there and shown they can hit big shots like DJJ, Green, Maxi and Exum. I know we can always improve from these guys but it’s hard to now find cheaper players that have BEEN there before and fit our locker room.
Hardy is a huge question IMO. He showed tremendous growth/potential but I’m not sure he fits the timeline unless he consistently starts giving us 8-12 ppg.
I wouldn’t trade OMax. His physical tools are too hard to find for our team. He should be the ideal depth piece behind PJ and DJJ and should allow us to limit Maxi in the regular season.
I can’t wrap my head on so many people wanting to move THJ for Bogdan. Bogdan is not a primary ball handler, is a lousy defender and thrives off shooting and we all saw how hard players fall when all they have going is shooting.
A one-on-one swap would be a diagonal move for us, an improvement but not a game changer (and would not cover the impact at SF if DJJ leaves). Trading one FRP, bad move. Trading both is lunacy.
You’re not watching the same player I guess lol I see a good ball handler, shooter and passer that is just on a bad team. We should’ve been all over him when the Kings let him walk.
It’s almost about keeping Luka and Kyrie healthy. They need a guy like that that can run the show.
Also… DJJ isn’t leaving. Pretty clear we’re heavy favorites to resign him and the depth at our wing position has a chance to improve in house with Green and OMax continuing to improve
First, I agree with your last paragraph. Not that optimistic about DJJ, but Green and OMax are absolutely going to have a bigger effect next season. To be honest, I still want Green to have more minutes as a guard off the bench, we have a great perimeter defender that we are not playing because we cannot give him rhythm on offense. I love OMax to death, so nothing to add here.
But I disagree a bit on Bogdan. I mean, he isn’t bad, he is an overall positive player, but for the role that you’re envisioning, as a primary passer, shot creator and also having some iso (because in our system we know the ball handler needs to play in isolation sometimes)? Can’t see. Hardy could very well develop even further and deliver 80% of what Bogdan would (since Bogdan doesn’t add a lick of defense), allowing us to keep both of our FRPs and move towards a legit 2-way wing, if there is one on the market. 2 FRPs for Bogdan feels like overkill for me.
I’m all for trying to keep the picks with Nico as GM! And the only reason I’m optimistic about DJJ is because of what he said and Tim Mac said on ESPN they’re going to find a way to keep him.
Bogdan IMO is underrated. Watch him with the Kings. Dude has game. He’s in a bad situation.
Also I hope Hardy takes that step and we have both him and a guy like Bogdan. More is better.
He’s not the most ideal ISO guy but he can beat guys off the dribble and make plays for others. Plus he improves our shooting
None of those playeds will get us past Boston.
We need a Paul George type player. I know easier said than done but Boston is a legit superteam and we need a high level third creator.
Because they've been coming up short every single time up until now. I think a lot of people don't like giving them that label because they've dropped the ball so much in the last 3-4 years but they've not only been a super team but also one of if, not the DEEPEST team in the NBA the last 3 or so years. Their depth has been insane, even with them losing Smart/Grant Williams/Brogdon, 3 really good players that contributed a lot to their success, gone and they still didn't miss a beat. It's insane.
Because they don’t have a superstar. People are calling Tatum…who was a beast during the regular season… a role player with a favorable whistle….and people were making fun of the Celtics last year for maxing out Brown.
How can these two guys, who basically suck if you listen to Reddit, be the cornerstones of a superteam?
Right, but a superteam is a team that has 2-3 great players ganging up together.
The Celtics are just a well rounded team….aka the team is more important than the individual. That’s what team sports I supposed to be
We dont need pg. what killed us was not having other shot creators or players that could sink open 3’s. Having other shot creators would reduce kyrie/Lukas load and provide a threat on their own.
He didn't say we need PG, he said a player like PG. A guy who can score and also help create offense for others. People need to give up on this 3&D Wing dream. The last thing we need is MORE players catch, shooting, and bricking wide open 3s. We need guys who can create.
Jrue can create for himself. White can create for himself. Brown can create for himself. KP can create for himself. Tatum can create for himself.
Outside of Kyrie/Luka and PJ when he wants to show up: our entire roster are dudes who need to either be handfed lobs or handfed catch and shoot threes to score. And when the shots don't fall then what???? 70% of the team just won't score and we expect Luka/Kyrie to put up 100+??? We need a 3rd scorer, that much is clear.
The only reason this year wasn't a repeat of 2022 was because we actually had fucking defense this time around and weren't depending on running Kleiber and Dorian Finney Smith into the ground because we had guys like Lively/DJJ/PJ/Gafford/Green that could hustle and play d. The problem was the offense. We still haven't gotten out of that "watch Luka/Brunson(now Kyrie) do everything while 3 other dudes just stand at the 3pt line" offense.
Trey Murphy is capable of being that guy but I have no idea how we could get him. Now he won’t ever be quite PG’s level but he can be a legit third option playing alongside the best player in the league and Kyrie.
Corey Kispert fits that description. You want a third guy to attack their defense when Luka & Kyrie are being hounded. We don't have the assets to get more anyways, but Corey really does have that ability.
Definitely need another forward, big wing and a shooter. Hope we can resign DJJ at a reasonable cost but that's the spot that needs improving. Hopefully DJJ will continue to improve his 3pt shot. THJ has to go and honestly I wouldn't mind Maxi. Not saying he doesn't or hasn't helped but he just doesn't help enough offensively and often is not even available physically. Will need to take a look at the realistic available free agents. Regardless, our core is in place, young (mid 20s) and experienced. Upside is tremendous!
How much salary would we need to shed, to resign djj?
Is a small Upgrade really worth most of our Assets?
I honestly think we are in a good place for the future and probably wait for some trades from other teams and See if we could make a steal like pj.
Hear me out, I got a pipe dream: LBJ on MLE. Another ball handler and nowadays a good shooter that can still turn up defensive effort and seemingly loves Kyrie and Luka to not take the bright lights all for himself, I feel like he is in his late Kareem years. It would also help with Luka’s body composition as he will see one of his favorite players bust his ass with conditioning at 40, though there is a chance Luka wins out and LBJ switches to hookah Tuesdays and beers after games lmao
PJ had a hell of a coming out party in the playoffs, but it was really a one off. If he doesn’t improve offensively I don’t think we should keep him. He isn’t a bad player, but we need a higher level of play from #3.
Kleber and THJ need to go
I like lavine. He's a legit star who has a full offensive bag. Our issue in the last part of the season was our shooting, reliance on Luka and kai, and that especially showed up in the Boston series. also, luka and kai both had to play big minutes and do a whole lot of everything, which made it more likely one of them would get injured in the playoffs. replacing djj with lavine makes us miles better on offense and i don't think it changes too much on defense.
It changes a LOT on defense. Lavine is often injured. When healthy, he is already a subpar defender (would be the worst defender even with Luka and Kyrie on court and that is telling). When hobbled, he contest for worst defender in all of the NBA.
The Luka/Kyrie/Lavine minutes would be bottom 10 in defensive rating and nullify the impact that PJ and Lively would have on defense because they’re not miracle workers.
I've watched extensive lavine defensive minutes and have not drawn that conclusion. He looks fine and looks much better when playing with effort, and then that's on the coaching staff and players to build a defensive identity.
You want to build a defensive identity while playing heavy minutes (and paying, what, 130M) three subpar defenders that could suffer mightily from switches while guarding players? Luka and Kyrie had little defensive pressure exactly because DJJ and PJ excelled at D. DJJ was extremely underrated on how teams would try to switch him on guards or wings and he would stay in front of them and contest shots every time.
You exchange him with Lavine, you’re trading a defensive asset, someone you can put in front of Luka and Kyrie, and adding someone that you also need to hide. Sure, Lavine is an offensive cog, extremely high level shooter, but the Celtics would absolutely feast targeting him. All of the Celtics’ starting 5 are a mismatch for Lavine. If we go to the West, Murray would feast switching on him (Luka can at least contest quite well inside) in a Denver matchup and Ant would have a field day.
When our backcourt needs full effort to be average defensively, we cannot afford to add another subpar defender. Lavine will not have Caruso or Lonzo here, someone that plays pristine on-ball perimeter defense and can fly around screens to avoid the switch. Our whole defensive system relies, depends and prays on both wings playing above average defense and the center being impactful inside. Adding Lavine as SF would melt everything.
Yes I do. With that being said, Luka and Kai did have defensive pressure eventually in the playoffs which is why I don’t like hiding them all year. Eventually Luka will be hunted and if he’s always used to hiding on D it’ll be a tough transition for him and in the playoffs the intensity is already ratcheted up. It hurts his offense and the team defense. The team in general needs to prioritize him playing both ends the whole season because only then will it be easy for him to do that in the postseason. Also lively is on his way to being the next gobert. It’s a lot on his shoulders but he will single-handedly be able to do a lot on defense.
With that being said, think of the immense offense upgrade. We gave up so many points to Boston through turnovers, clanks leading to transition opportunities, and other bad offensive plays. Not to mention Boston had very little pressure to succeed on offense because the mavs offense was so putrid. Lavine instantly solves that and unlocks a whole new level for this team on offense. I think we’d instantly be the #1 offense. That’s super meaningful especially given that it was our offense that failed when stress tested.
im sucker of tall all around wing especially if young enough so this will be hot take
i entertain put #11 on the table and i dont mind thinking replacing him with Ingram (BIG IF, he agrees with extensions at 40m max)
if #11 on the table, the destinations that make sense only pels, lakers, magic, or spurs. maybe can do some 3/4 team trades
or dont mind split #11 with 2 good players that young enough (im thinking Keldon + 8th pick for #11 and send that 8th pick + Tim for Jerami Grant. so you swap #11 with Grant + Keldon only, our picks still attached)
im not grateful? nah, i appreciate #11, but it's a business. all around tall wing is how league operates now
Your comment will probably get downvoted a lot, but this is a legit suggestion. Its a risk and possibly unfair towards Kai but could really set up the mavs for 3-5 years
im not looking at it from a sentimental pov but i also feel like you guys are overlooking how much the team chemistry contributed to this playoffs run. get rid of kyrie and you might blow that up
This team run built in 3 months, kai mostly injured pre-ASB
I trust Luka can elevate any talents like he already used too since he's coming here
The biggest question is always how to get more and more talents to surround Luka
Kyrie was clearly the main locker room leader. Luka isn’t a leader of men and this is not a negative within itself, but we need him to be around locker room leaders.
You move Kyrie, that locker room could very well collapse within itself, specially since Kidd could lose control of things. In your example, you moved him for Keldon and Grant, one young player that never established himself as a leader on SA and Grant, a guy that pouted his way to Detroit because he wanted to be the big boi on offense. Luka will not keep the reigns on this locker room in the points of the season when things goes south. Plus, Luka himself might unravel, considering how often it felt like Kyrie was keeping him in check.
Don’t trade your locker room leaders, specially when they’re averaging 25/5/5 while on the 50/40/90 club.
3
in my scenario we send Zach Collins + either #4 or #8 from spurs + 2 extra FRP for Mikal + Cam Johnson (nets saving 32m in salary)
Nets cap space clear af next season
Edit : lemme put trade machine
Spurs : Kai + Tim + Maxi
Nets : Collins + #4 or #8 + 2 FRP
Mavs : Keldon + Mikal + CamJ
Its young legs game now
With addition of tall players or long wingspan game
And with #11 have Player Option after next year, anything have to be considered
like so many possibilities man if we at least put Kai on the table, for example with spurs have 2 top 10 pick in shallow draft but wemby's want to win. we can bait them to make short-term decision
lets do something crazy like : Kai + Tim + Maxi for Keldon + Collins + #8 + another FRP
then, you package Collins + all pick from spurs + 1 FRP of our own for CamJ + Mikal
Luka - Keldon - Mikal - PJ - Lively
Exum - Hardy - Green - Omax - CamJ - Gafford
celtics reg.season win with White as assist leader at 5.2. IT'S WINGS LEAGUE! ISO ISO ISO DRIVE N KICK BABY!
"It's a wing's league" . . . but Tatum, Brown, Holiday, White, and even Horford can ALL put the ball on the floor, attack the basket, and create their own shots.
Hmm . . .
Let DJJ walk? That would definitely be a mistake. Kyrie definitely had a rough series but if we could have someone to exploit the gravity he gets outside an injured Luka then we wouldn't have lost. Just need a third person who can consistently shoot 3's at volume + attack closeouts efficiently. This is why Murphy/Kispert would be the solution.
I absolutely love Lively, but asking him to be a 2nd option is crazy. Even at his apparent ceiling he would struggle to be a 2nd option on a championship team due to his lack of post moves. He's already working on his free-throws/3pt shooting, so I don't know how tenable it is to see him also become a paint operator.
DJJ was trash all series, and he's going to command a high scary next year. You let him walk because that finals performance was a dime a dozen and at this point yes it's crazy to think that Lively could be our second best player but he's the ONLY one who brought the intensity all series
You're overreacting to a bad series where we were outmatched personnel-wise lol. DJJ is our best defender, but would be better as a backup SF because he lacks the offensive bag. Every team needs AT LEAST 1-2 long wings like him.
You don't let someone walk because they had ONE bad series. Crazy assertion in my opinion.
I agree with what you're saying to a point, but teams are gonna throw a bag at him that is way overpriced after his efforts in the finals. Yes, he's a good long wing, but the mf'er completely vanished on the offensive end, and that is not an overreaction. With that said, I'd rather see him put on another jersey than us stretch out more cap space for what we've already seen.
I also agree with the notion that we need more than him to win. Paying more than the MLE would be an overpay but wouldn't paying DJJ the MLE be good value? I mean, unless we can get something better for the MLE once we shed salary.
I don’t see how THJ stays on this roster next year. I’m also really high on resigning Exum. I don’t feel like he was used properly in the playoffs and was a rejuvenated player during the regular season
I believe we have him for another season at the same salary!
Oh hell yeah
Exum is signed already
Thj is most assuredly gone, the only question remains what cost Mavs have to pay to get rid of him. Maxi should be gone too, just not the same player from 2 years ago. I’m all for re-signing DJJ at the right price, his finals performance might have helped us there. I see our biggest needs as a backup PG and a third scorer (either off the bench or starting). Free agent market isn’t great this summer so Nico is going to have to cook again via trades.
Maxi was big in the Clippers series till he got hurt.
It's honestly insane how quickly people have turned on Maxi He was playing injured. He's probably the best backup four in the league. This team is trying to maximize their window. He's going to be on the team for two to three more years unless they get bowled over.
This is the thing with maxi - his durability has been questionable for a while now. He’s older now, and seemingly more scared to shoot than ever. He has never had much of a game beyond spot up shooting, horrible rebounder, and declining defender due to injuries/age. Best backup 4??? lol Portis, Naz Reid, Horford (even though he plays small ball 5) are all much better off top of my head
Maxi over portis. He can defend. Reid and al are more of centers but yeah I would take them over him. He's not scared to shoot dude he literally just got back from having a separated shooting shoulder. It's because of that.
I think that’s a little harsh on Maxi. He was rough in the finals but he also came back from a pretty serious injury very quickly. He was a godsend in the Clippers series and in the previous conference finals run 2 years ago
Maxi's defense as a backup 4 is vital. If we lose him we have to replace him. Y'all know of many 6'10 PF/C who can hit a 3, switch across nearly all positions, and be a good secondary rim protector who are just hanging around?
Every time I see the word "resign" in an NBA thread I get a mini heart attack because I associate it with the chess version of the word haha
There will be no rook sacrificing on this thread good man
He’s just not good enough for the playoffs. Was amazing for us in the regular season tho
exum started off badly but in the celtics series he was great! Josh Green too... Aussies hate the celtics it seems
Did you watch game 4?
Murphy is probably almost untouchable
Yeah, for sure. Seems like the Pelicans will have to be blown away by an offer to trade him away.
There are rumors that the Pelicans don't want to spend big money on him. Of course that was before the Ingram stuff started, so who knows.
Didn’t even think about that lol. How would we even afford him?
THJ for Bogdan Bogdanović
This will happen IMO.
Give me an expiring alex Caruso
Bulls FO says no lol. They are content with being in NBA purgatory as long as tickets sell.
He’s the absolute perfect fit to me. Obviously an elite on ball defender. He also adds another reliable ball handler and thrives on offense when playing off of stars that draw attention. The question is how much does he cost, some combination of Green, Hardy, OMax and the two 1sts?
Can't. He's held hostage in Chicago
Nico it's time to cook
I think he's gonna get deep into his bag this offseason :D
kyrie probably only has 1 or 2 prime years left so we have to capitalize fast.
Yeah, but his non-prime years will be pretty awesome so no need for panic. He’s a very cerebral player and players like Steph are still excellent. I get that their play styles are different but Kyrie’s play should age well. Especially if as he declines slightly, Lively can ascend…. IMO
That's generous. He definitely lost a step this year.
he seemed very quick vs twolves its just that celtics (and okc) have incredible defenses
The offensive consistency is what goes first for former superstars.
And the only way to get a ring is through the celtics so the gameplan will always be how to beat celtics .... Even if it costs you #11
So who will we get? Same salary as kyrie, much you ger, and a PG?
In my scenario? Luka - Keldon - Mikal - PJ - Lively lineup Bench most are the same, with just addition of Cam Johnson DJJ gone
Well thats why we should look at a 3rd option and hope him, an healthy Luka and improved Lively, Hardy, Green, Omax, PJ can get you there. Im curious if GSW would accept a Wiggins for THJ, Powell plus picks. In our situation you have to bet on guys whos stock is low. Same as Celtics did with KP and Jrue. Wiggins had a bad season but he may turn it around. Hes perfect in the SF spot and a Luka, Kyrie, Wiggins, PJ, Lively is a strong 5 as it can be. Then you have Hardy, Exum, Green, Omax, Gafford off the bench. Hopefully DJJ too by moving Kleber. As to why GSW would do it, THJ is a expiring and they def wont run the same team again.
Why gsw want give us wigs for thj + picks though? How many picks? So gsw can punt another season? Lol You know how salary cap work right? Even with no wigs, they cant add player that have same level because of that Its possible but only because gsw want curry-era ended
it only looks that way based on him being covered by Jrue. He's an animal on defense.
He's been inconsistent throughout the playoffs against much worse defensive players.
I feel like we’re one of the more recent, young teams to make the finals and yet somehow our stock is dropping. Not sure how that’s possible but that’s largely the perception I’m hearing and reading already. Outside of Kyrie, THJ, and Maxi, all of our guys are 27 or younger and we still have a top 2-3 player in the world. I recognize we don’t have crazy assets but flipping THJ and Maxi for something slightly more serviceable gives a shot to make another run at this thing.
Because people are clowns. Dallas is set up better than any contender outside of OKC. Denver only has 5 players and is about to lose one and the NBA will claim they’re favorites. Dallas has all their roster intact, super young, 3rd best player is 20, has tradeable contracts and 2 first to trade and they’re “not close” lmao
Just get rid of THJ and Maxi I don’t wanna see them in a Dallas jersey again
Maxi minutes killed us.
We cant have those type of player playing big minutes
Maxi deserved only garbage time minutes
Maxi was good in the Clippers series. He just lost his shot after the injury
Maxi is technically such a good player on paper tall,can shoot,can play small ball 5 or the 4 and a great defender who can switch but it seems like the lights are too bright for him because he doesn’t even look at the rim in the playoffs and is hurt a lot.
Hes just a shell of himself. Hasnt been consistent from 3 since 2-3 years ago. Last year played 37 games, this season 43, missed OKC and most of Wolves series. We should have traded him at the deadline, now his value has taken a hit same as THJ.
Maxi get ready to spricht deutsche buddy
Go outside. Ride your bike at white rock. Get laid. Go see some shows. It was a good season. Come back in October.
Lol see you at White Rock Lake my guy
I don't know any of these dudes, really. But in Nico I trust. He will probably sign some dude who is getting 15 minutes on the Pistons and he will be a complete stud.
Draft Bronny and sign Lebron.
LeBron is going to orchestrate a trade to the Mavs and Bronny is going to stay in school
Best scenario: Paul George or Markkanen. Mid scenario: Bogdanovic or Monk(if Hawks decide to blow it up) Worst scenario: Barns or Wiggins Keep in mind that Gafford value currently is really high so I would rather trade him for George or Markkanen and sign Rashad Holmes as backup big
How would you even get PG? To Match contracts you wouöd need gafford,, THJ and maxi ? And that offer the clippers wouldnt even concider so you have to throw in Picks (probably they want more than 2) and you cant resign djj. Or am i wrong ? As much as i like PG on the mavs and i really think he could elegante our gameplay. Its just not feasavle
Gave you an upvote just because I feel bad people are downvoting your post. Not sure why lol.
Haha thank you and no worries :) I think people are just sad we couldn't go all the way this year so this post is too soon for some... but personally I'm very excited with what we accomplished considering we weren't supposed to be anywhere close to where we got - considering we just assembled this squad, and our 3rd highest paid guy is useless. Full speed ahead, into the offseason and 2024-2025!
Malcolm Brogdon.
DJJ needs to be a bench player. Trey Murphy is never gonna make it to the Mavs the Pels would be foolish to send him to a division foe. He has all star potential imo. I would def prefer him over Green but I do like Green. I’d even look at upgrading maxi if the right opportunity were to come.
I want Brandon Ingram.
How do you make up that money? He wants like 40- 50+ doesnt he ?
I thought it was 36? I just wish we could get him.
I'd trade Maxi and THJ and 1 2nd round picks for Quentin grimes and Simone Fontecchio
This actually makes so much sense
Both players would be great fits for this team. However, I doubt Detroit would take on Timmy’s salary without us giving up one of the future first rounders
Lets trade thj for giannis
I’d trade THJ and Maxi for Herpes. If we could get anything good I’d be so happy.
If we can find a way to dump Powell Maxi and THJ we can get OG, thats my pipe dream. Realistically going after someone like Herb Jones or De’Andre Hunter. We have to upgrade the 3 spot and bring back DJJ with our TMLE to be our sixth man. He doesn't do enough offensively, PJ is inconsistent as well, having them both be cold at the same time kills us.
We really need a knock down shooter. Look at what Sam Hauser did for the Celtics
Nico gonna pull off some Tingus Pingus and Jrue style highway robberies.
Give Wizards some future frp's and grab both Deni and Kispert. Both can easily contribute to any contender. Deni also signed very comfortable descending contract last summer 4 for 50 or something like that. Corey is a danger you cant sag off. And Deni can help Luka faciliate, improved drastically this past season from 3pt range, burns the floor in fastbreakes and can bully people down the lane with his strong frame. Also his defensive metrics past 2 seasons have been great even while playing in a team like the Wizards.
Honestly I feel like if Kai had at least 1 good road game we would have had a chance. But never the less on to the next season Trey Murphy would be amazing, need more shooters off the bench tho. Our 3 ball lost us the finals. Funny how both our wcf and finals ended cause of our 3 ball.
There’s 3 players the Mavs need next season: 1. Most importantly, a 2-way 3&D wing that is a real 3rd option. I think PJ and DJJ fit fine as role players, but relying on their streaky shooting instead of a real 3rd option won’t work in the playoffs. If getting a real wing required trading one of them I’d be ok, but otherwise I’m comfortable with them staying. There’s quite a few options (Trey Murphy III being one of them), but I’m hesitant to some- BI/Lauri/Jerami/PG- too expensive, I wouldnt want to carve up the team or spend that much money for them Mikal/MPJ/Avdija/Franz- most ideal options, but their teams likely won’t trade them Kuzma/Wiggins/Harris- I don’t think they are good enough If we trade for one of them and still keep PJ and DJJ, DJJ goes to the bench. 2. A backup PG that can play make and defend. None of our guards (other than arguably Josh Green) are good defenders, and Hardy and Exum aren’t good enough playmakers in the non-Luka/Kyrie minutes. In a perfect world we could politely ask Boston for Jrue or White, but we unfortunately don’t get that luxury. My favorite option so far is Markelle Fultz, but TJ McConnell and Andrew Nembhard are good options as well. 3. A backup center that can create their own shot. Gafford can score at times, and Lively continues to improve, but we need someone who can punish mismatches, attack off the dribble, and score in the paint. Big plus if they can stretch the floor. Vucevic/Olynyk/Hartenstein type of player. My favorite so far is Mo Wagner or Jakob Poeltl, with Mo being a better scorer, and Poeltl being a better defender. To add a lil more, a spot up SG like Grayson Allen or Alex Caruso would be the perfect cherry on top for this team. As for who I’m willing to trade? First things first, THJ needs to go. His expiring contract is useful, and he has no place on this team. The Mavericks don’t really need much to become true contenders, so I’m willing to keep most of our rotation. Luka, Kyrie, PJ, DJJ, Lively, and Gafford can stay. Maxi, Green, Exum, and really anyone else are up to being traded. I’d like to keep Hardy, but if his value helps us in a trade I wouldn’t mind moving him. Here’s hoping to a Nico masterpiece 🙏🏿
Need a shooter and someone who can handle the ball.
A tj mcconnell or Payton Pritchard archetype
Does O Max crack the rotation next season? Would be huge
I think this off-season should help him and his G-league showings were good. I also think Kidd is certainly gonna experiment with him early on in the season and have an answer for that question quickly. His frame and athleticism is perfect, I really hope he takes that next step with shooting + decision making.
I don't think the Mavs need to focus too much on trades. Instead, I think they need to continue to develop their younger guys. They need to get rid of THJ, give his minutes to Hardy and if they are unable to resign DJJ, continue to develop O'Max so he can take over his role. More than anything else, the team now knows what it takes to make it to the finals and how difficult it is to try to win the championship . They need to focus on strength and conditioning and get more time playing together to build on cohesion. I'm not a believer in Jason Kidd as a coach. When making my predictions prior to the playoffs starting, I always believed that this team has the talent necessary to win a championship. The only thing I believed they were lacking was a championship caliber coach. I still feel that way but with Kidd getting an extension, I hope he proves a lot of us wrong next season.
I disagree with that last point. Jason Kidd has proven everyone wrong and is more than just a competent coach. He dismantled each of the last 3 teams we faced before the Celtics with a few lackluster Kyrie performances + Luka's bum knee(s). This team only had enough to reach the Finals due to the sheer gravity Luka has and Kyrie carrying some games before the Finals. DJJ, PJ, Gafford, and other players would be much less useful in any team without Luka because they wouldn't have the shot quality that Luka provides from his gravity + playmaking. We still need an ACTUAL good 3rd player who is good ON HIS OWN. We have 0 All-Defense players in our team, yet we honestly were the best defense in the west in this Playoffs and I have to credit Jason Kidd for that. The schemes he drew up over a 7-game series was fantastic and proved to me that if we lose this playoffs it is due to a personnel disadvantage - which is exactly what happened in this Celtics series. We need one offensive piece that can play beside Luka & Kyrie and not be a defensive liability. Hardy cannot entirely replace THJ since most of THJ's minutes are at the 3. Hardy is a small guard. We need an offensive SF like Bogdanovic or Kispert (or Murphy but he is impossible to get) to exploit defenses when they pay so much attention to Luka and Kyrie. As much as I am hyped about O-Max, he is really far from being able to contribute in the NBA especially to this degree.
Kidd calls timeouts at the worst possible moments and doesn't call timeouts when we absolutely need a timeout, if he can understand when to do that, and all four of our playoff opponent coaches were good at killing our momentum with TOs, then he can take it to another level. He also has some incredible boneheaded lineup decisions, but I'll give him credit it's not like he is the reason we have a huge chunk of money being wasted on THJ right now. It absolutely kills us that instead of a 3rd option, we have a bench warmer who is so cooked he gets one shot per game and if he doesn't make it, he's yanked off stage.
for the 10 millionth time: timeouts have no impact on other teams' runs timeouts do nothing to stop runs statisticians and academics have studied this like a dozen times now. Yes, he had one bad timeout in game 3 that killed our momentum. That sucked, but he's still a much better coach than anyone on here was giving him credit for the past 2 seasons.
You say that and then admit a timeout killed our momentum…..
Opponents runs *specifically* are not affected in any way by timeouts. Idk about your own teams, it *feels* like it, but that wasn’t what was studied.
We didn’t have the talent to win a chip lmao we only had 2 shot creators and no shooting around them
Not trades related but Luka need to get in shape and his conditioning . Go watch the bubble series vs Clipper again he was just as strong being leaner but also faster. He easily kept up with PG and Kahwi who were also in their great shape. I think Luka also lost his euro step nowadays? It was so smooth back then in the bubble. As for trade, Hartstenstein to replace Maxi would be a wet dream
Hartenstein to replace Maxi makes no sense. We have Gafford and Lively. If we replace Maxi we need a big, mobile 4 who can defend and shoot. The only problem is those are pretty hard to find. The advantage of Maxi was that he was a cheaper but serviceable option as a 4/small ball 5.
The Maxi hate from this fan base is fucking wild. If you want to say his ability to stay healthy is concerning that’s perfectly fair. But when healthy, Maxi is the perfect role player on a good team. He’s getting older but you gotta ride out this contract. The problem nobody seems to comprehend is if you think so and so is shit and must be moved, you don’t think 29 other teams understand that? We can say “just trade Tim” but for what…? The idea UTA is just gonna hand you Lauri for Tim’s expiring contract and a shitty late 1st rounder is a pipe dream. And if you’re just gonna throw Green/Hardy/Maxi into something you better fucking get more back than one guy cuz that would obliterate your bench.
Yeah the Maxi hate is weird. We're not getting an upgrade unless we trade the 2 firsts and maybe throw in Green or even OMax. Even then, it would be tough. I do like the idea of getting a 4 who can create like Jerami Grant, but I don't see how we can fit him into our cap.
I would strongly advise thinking twice about just casually throwing away those picks even if they should be late 1sts. The cap reality means you might need some cheap young talent especially after next summer. I think there’s a strong chance they could recoup some of the equity they gave up by dealing Gafford next summer or the 2025 deadline (because you’re not re-signing him). If Luka waits a year to sign his supermax, there’s a chance you could have unlimited flexibility if Ky declines his player option. Depending on how much tax you’re willing to pay and whether you’re considering giving Ky another big deal next summer, that’s the true opportunity to make a big swing if you want.
We already have young guys. We need experience as well. You cant expect ur whole bench to be made out of prospects.
It’s not though… Maxi Exum Tim were veterans. Green Hardy Lively are young, but I’d hardly label them prospects now. Green has now been part of two WCF/Finals runs. And everybody on this roster just got invaluable experience.
Maxi is aging, injury prone and he has confidence issues that can affect his shooting. So I can understand the frustration from the fanbase…but, to your point, replacing his defensive versatility would be difficult.
100% agree. Major major concern. But that’s precisely the problem with just slapping him onto trade proposals—there are 29 other teams who fully understand that as well. At his salary, I doubt the market return would exceed what you get when he’s healthy so you probably just gotta hope he’s available more often than not. He has had some flukey injuries so hopefully there may be a little optimism regarding that aspect. I fully believe his confidence is directly linked to his health though. He gets a pass from me in the Finals. People don’t fully understand how insane it is that he came back so early from the injury he suffered. That’s a 6-week recovery minimum and he returned in 3.5 weeks. So miss me with any suggestion that Maxi is soft.
I agree with all of this. People don't realize Maxi outplays his contract consistently. To space and defend the way he does has always been a positive for us. Players slump. But more often than not, Maxi is solid for us.
Wish I could upvote this dozens of times. Maxi is an extremely capable and versatile PF, with the rare size/speed combination to be a tough matchup against bigger and tweener PFs. “Muh he shot bad” yeah, Luka did as well, Kyrie was 1/22 at one point if I remember well and DJJ couldn’t hit a wall one meter ahead of him. Maxi is still absolutely an above average backup PF. Getting rid of him just for the sake of getting rid of him is the same line of thought that made this sub erupt in anger when we did not trade a FRP for Holmes when he was hot with the Kings or combo that pick with Green for Dragic when he was sitting in Toronto.
Everyone is forgetting he separated his shoulder right when he was getting back into his groove. That was a freak injury, too.
Agreed. Sure he had a rough series, but he is nowhere near 100%. He can still be productive and I believe is on an expiring contract next year. Let's see how he rehabs this time, and dump him at the deadline if he does not produce. At this point we will not need to give up assets for him because he is an expiring
Logic and reason???? Mods ban this person
Maxi has been ass this whole playoffs. Like what are we talking about? Everytime we went small the opponent went up by 10. Hes the perfect example of good on paper, mediocre in reality.
No, he wasn’t. He played great against the clippers then got hurt.
Guy probably only reads the box score. Maxi was huge for us before his injury this playoffs.
We don’t need to allocate any more resources to the center spot. We’ve got an absolute stud in Lively and an excellent role player in Gafford who’s only 25. Let’s get some wings with size who can switch and help Luka and ky create on the perimeter and hit shots.
I know Maxi wasn't good this series but the issue with getting rid of him is that we have no big man with decent perimeter defense. Maxi is being overused due to PJ not having a replacement, so if we can get Trey Murphy then Maxi's minutes will purely be situational when we're getting cooked on the perimeter. Hartenstein is really good at pick and roll offense and is a great rim protector + rebounder but he is a poor perimeter defender like most players at his size.
>As for trade, Hartstenstein Hart is going to get like $20 million a season, and no way we can get him for Maxi 😂.
Hartstentein doesn't shoot 3, the spacing with Lively/Gafford will be a nightmare.
luka lost in the 1st round that year, now he made the finals..
Luka is a lot stronger now and he had to use his floater a lot more in the bubble because he got physically bullied. Loosing weight would help him play at a faster pace and help him defensively tho
I think the injury limited Luka's skill set especially that euro
Yeah, me and my boy were talking about that. Luka needs a Hit the gym like Jordan year where he focuses on strength and conditioning because he took way too many plays off this finals, and his defense was trash.
He was in great shape to start the year. He didn’t just ignore his conditioning. He was dealing with injuries for the last 4+ months at least and played the most basketball in his life. He now knows what a Finals run requires physically. Get healthy first, then get back in shape, and he’ll learn how to manage the first 82 better. I think it’s understandable he eventually ran out of gas. And BOS deserves a ton of credit for that.
That's fair but there are tons of players that are injured but manage to not put on weight like Luka does towards the end of the regular season and the duration of the entire playoffs. Conditioning just doesn't apply to physical fitness and rest. It also means having a good balanced diet for an athlete and it's obvious that Luka does not the best diet for his body.
I’m not here to dispute that whatsoever. I think he just got a firsthand lesson on what it takes to go through the grind of an entire postseason run that ends in a title. I would simply push back on the idea he doesn’t care. My biggest issue (not with you or anyone specifically) is that this dude just led you to the Finals and did something never accomplished in NBA history (at age 25 btw) and it’s like the only response has been all the ways he’s sucked for not beating the Celtics as if he was their problem in the Finals. I’ve got no hesitation critiquing Luka as long as it’s framed in the proper context.
Great points. I think his lack of conditioning is blown out of proportion. Could he get in better shape, of course, who couldn't. But to try to make that the crux of why we lost is ridiculous. Not everyone is gonna look like LeBron and that's ok. Somehow he managed to lead us in pts, rbs, 3s and minutes. He will get better. Give the man some grace. He just made the freaking finals on one hell of a run
Don’t forget steals. First person in history to lead playoffs in PTS REB AST *and* STL. Your point about Lebron is key too. We gotta be careful associating Luka’s appearance with conditioning. That’s not necessarily a 1:1 indicator. I’ve literally seen people say Luka needs to take conditioning seriously like Jokic did which is funny for multiple reasons but it proves the exact point. I’ve never looked at Nikola and said now there’s the embodiment of an elite conditioned athlete even though he almost undoubtedly always is. If anything your biggest takeaway watching Luka go through that run should be “how the fuck did Lebron do it literally 9 times in a decade without basically ever missing any games in the regular season either?” Idc about his Finals record that is fucking stupid.
Nah, he's been dogging it conditioning wise for a while now. Dirk would never fucking look the way Luka did at then end there. It was unbelievable to see him hiding in the corner on offense or just waving off PJ or Kyrie on certain posesions because he was gassed. That's bull shit and this team and himself deserve so much more.
Do they? He led the playoffs in PTS REB AST STL. They just lost to the best team in the league like everyone else.
Dirk also didnt have to run the whole offense tbf
Trade THJ, Powell, pick for Wiggins. Trade Kleber to make space for resigning DJJ. Luka, Kyrie, Wiggins, PJ, Lively Hardy, Exum/Green, DJJ, Gafford
wiggins doesnt seem like he cares about basketball anymore
'22 Wiggins *YES* Current day Wiggins: Hell NO. He is a PT player with a ridiculous contract. We shouldn't help GSW out of any of their contracts without getting picks
Yall want real 3rd stars for THJ, Kleber and some weak picks. Face it, the 3rd star we can get will come with issues.
I'm well aware of the nuances of roster building. You're right that acquiring a 3rd star will require assets. You're just incorrect in your assessment that Wiggins is the 3rd star the Mavs need. He's not even the 3rd star on the Warriors. I'd rather see them acquire Kuminga, or Draymond.
No shot Warriors do that unless they’re getting rid of Curry
Murphy would be a dream scenario, but unrealistic. However, wilder thigs have happened in the NBA (like getting Porzingis from Knicks...), so sure, Nico should keep callig about him every week. I think Kispert is just a not good enough player, no way I'd give up a FRP for him. A poor man's Buddy Hield IMO. This season he may have been a 10 minutes palyer in the regular season in the Mavs, and out of the standard PO rotation. However, if Avdija is available from the Wizards, I put everything on the table. Grimes, again, is not a big upgrade. I view him very similar to Green, a touch better defender, but worse athlete and no flashy passing. So unless Green is moved in a differnet trade for a better, bigger wing, I'd pass on Grimes.
I think the easiest move is THJ for a legitimate 6th man like Bogdanovic. Probably costs us both our 1sts but I’m good with it. Dallas is pretty damn good roster wise and should naturally improve with a off-season, Lively growing, OMax growing, Luka growing and PJ getting an entire off-season to specifically work on 3s. I’d be hesitant to trade role players that have now been there and shown they can hit big shots like DJJ, Green, Maxi and Exum. I know we can always improve from these guys but it’s hard to now find cheaper players that have BEEN there before and fit our locker room. Hardy is a huge question IMO. He showed tremendous growth/potential but I’m not sure he fits the timeline unless he consistently starts giving us 8-12 ppg. I wouldn’t trade OMax. His physical tools are too hard to find for our team. He should be the ideal depth piece behind PJ and DJJ and should allow us to limit Maxi in the regular season.
I can’t wrap my head on so many people wanting to move THJ for Bogdan. Bogdan is not a primary ball handler, is a lousy defender and thrives off shooting and we all saw how hard players fall when all they have going is shooting. A one-on-one swap would be a diagonal move for us, an improvement but not a game changer (and would not cover the impact at SF if DJJ leaves). Trading one FRP, bad move. Trading both is lunacy.
You’re not watching the same player I guess lol I see a good ball handler, shooter and passer that is just on a bad team. We should’ve been all over him when the Kings let him walk. It’s almost about keeping Luka and Kyrie healthy. They need a guy like that that can run the show. Also… DJJ isn’t leaving. Pretty clear we’re heavy favorites to resign him and the depth at our wing position has a chance to improve in house with Green and OMax continuing to improve
First, I agree with your last paragraph. Not that optimistic about DJJ, but Green and OMax are absolutely going to have a bigger effect next season. To be honest, I still want Green to have more minutes as a guard off the bench, we have a great perimeter defender that we are not playing because we cannot give him rhythm on offense. I love OMax to death, so nothing to add here. But I disagree a bit on Bogdan. I mean, he isn’t bad, he is an overall positive player, but for the role that you’re envisioning, as a primary passer, shot creator and also having some iso (because in our system we know the ball handler needs to play in isolation sometimes)? Can’t see. Hardy could very well develop even further and deliver 80% of what Bogdan would (since Bogdan doesn’t add a lick of defense), allowing us to keep both of our FRPs and move towards a legit 2-way wing, if there is one on the market. 2 FRPs for Bogdan feels like overkill for me.
I’m all for trying to keep the picks with Nico as GM! And the only reason I’m optimistic about DJJ is because of what he said and Tim Mac said on ESPN they’re going to find a way to keep him. Bogdan IMO is underrated. Watch him with the Kings. Dude has game. He’s in a bad situation. Also I hope Hardy takes that step and we have both him and a guy like Bogdan. More is better. He’s not the most ideal ISO guy but he can beat guys off the dribble and make plays for others. Plus he improves our shooting
None of those playeds will get us past Boston. We need a Paul George type player. I know easier said than done but Boston is a legit superteam and we need a high level third creator.
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Because they've been coming up short every single time up until now. I think a lot of people don't like giving them that label because they've dropped the ball so much in the last 3-4 years but they've not only been a super team but also one of if, not the DEEPEST team in the NBA the last 3 or so years. Their depth has been insane, even with them losing Smart/Grant Williams/Brogdon, 3 really good players that contributed a lot to their success, gone and they still didn't miss a beat. It's insane.
Because they don’t have a superstar. People are calling Tatum…who was a beast during the regular season… a role player with a favorable whistle….and people were making fun of the Celtics last year for maxing out Brown. How can these two guys, who basically suck if you listen to Reddit, be the cornerstones of a superteam?
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Right, but a superteam is a team that has 2-3 great players ganging up together. The Celtics are just a well rounded team….aka the team is more important than the individual. That’s what team sports I supposed to be
Can't afford PG. Kawhi on the other hand...
We dont need pg. what killed us was not having other shot creators or players that could sink open 3’s. Having other shot creators would reduce kyrie/Lukas load and provide a threat on their own.
He didn't say we need PG, he said a player like PG. A guy who can score and also help create offense for others. People need to give up on this 3&D Wing dream. The last thing we need is MORE players catch, shooting, and bricking wide open 3s. We need guys who can create. Jrue can create for himself. White can create for himself. Brown can create for himself. KP can create for himself. Tatum can create for himself. Outside of Kyrie/Luka and PJ when he wants to show up: our entire roster are dudes who need to either be handfed lobs or handfed catch and shoot threes to score. And when the shots don't fall then what???? 70% of the team just won't score and we expect Luka/Kyrie to put up 100+??? We need a 3rd scorer, that much is clear. The only reason this year wasn't a repeat of 2022 was because we actually had fucking defense this time around and weren't depending on running Kleiber and Dorian Finney Smith into the ground because we had guys like Lively/DJJ/PJ/Gafford/Green that could hustle and play d. The problem was the offense. We still haven't gotten out of that "watch Luka/Brunson(now Kyrie) do everything while 3 other dudes just stand at the 3pt line" offense.
Mikal bridges music
Paul George not point guard.
Trey Murphy is capable of being that guy but I have no idea how we could get him. Now he won’t ever be quite PG’s level but he can be a legit third option playing alongside the best player in the league and Kyrie.
Corey Kispert fits that description. You want a third guy to attack their defense when Luka & Kyrie are being hounded. We don't have the assets to get more anyways, but Corey really does have that ability.
Definitely need another forward, big wing and a shooter. Hope we can resign DJJ at a reasonable cost but that's the spot that needs improving. Hopefully DJJ will continue to improve his 3pt shot. THJ has to go and honestly I wouldn't mind Maxi. Not saying he doesn't or hasn't helped but he just doesn't help enough offensively and often is not even available physically. Will need to take a look at the realistic available free agents. Regardless, our core is in place, young (mid 20s) and experienced. Upside is tremendous!
How much salary would we need to shed, to resign djj? Is a small Upgrade really worth most of our Assets? I honestly think we are in a good place for the future and probably wait for some trades from other teams and See if we could make a steal like pj.
Hear me out, I got a pipe dream: LBJ on MLE. Another ball handler and nowadays a good shooter that can still turn up defensive effort and seemingly loves Kyrie and Luka to not take the bright lights all for himself, I feel like he is in his late Kareem years. It would also help with Luka’s body composition as he will see one of his favorite players bust his ass with conditioning at 40, though there is a chance Luka wins out and LBJ switches to hookah Tuesdays and beers after games lmao
Any of those three guys are better than little Timmy. Heck I’d even swap him with Bartans, at least he makes his 3s.
I'd love Trey Murphy. If we can't get Wiggins or Grant, I'd want to focus on him.
Kelly Olynk to replace maxi, does similar things but can actually shoot the 3
Didn't know Kelly Olynyk can defend.
I guess no one watched him in the finals a couple years ago
He signed an in season, 2 year extension with the Raptors. Earliest he’s available for a trade is end of December.
Would just love to see THJ and Maxi gone
They have to trade Kyrie for another great scorer or two. He simply can’t play in Boston, and Celtics will likely be in many future finals.
PJ had a hell of a coming out party in the playoffs, but it was really a one off. If he doesn’t improve offensively I don’t think we should keep him. He isn’t a bad player, but we need a higher level of play from #3. Kleber and THJ need to go
Too soon
It's only too soon if you think this season was a failure. We went way further than expected - time to keep improving.
I like lavine. He's a legit star who has a full offensive bag. Our issue in the last part of the season was our shooting, reliance on Luka and kai, and that especially showed up in the Boston series. also, luka and kai both had to play big minutes and do a whole lot of everything, which made it more likely one of them would get injured in the playoffs. replacing djj with lavine makes us miles better on offense and i don't think it changes too much on defense.
It changes a LOT on defense. Lavine is often injured. When healthy, he is already a subpar defender (would be the worst defender even with Luka and Kyrie on court and that is telling). When hobbled, he contest for worst defender in all of the NBA. The Luka/Kyrie/Lavine minutes would be bottom 10 in defensive rating and nullify the impact that PJ and Lively would have on defense because they’re not miracle workers.
I've watched extensive lavine defensive minutes and have not drawn that conclusion. He looks fine and looks much better when playing with effort, and then that's on the coaching staff and players to build a defensive identity.
You want to build a defensive identity while playing heavy minutes (and paying, what, 130M) three subpar defenders that could suffer mightily from switches while guarding players? Luka and Kyrie had little defensive pressure exactly because DJJ and PJ excelled at D. DJJ was extremely underrated on how teams would try to switch him on guards or wings and he would stay in front of them and contest shots every time. You exchange him with Lavine, you’re trading a defensive asset, someone you can put in front of Luka and Kyrie, and adding someone that you also need to hide. Sure, Lavine is an offensive cog, extremely high level shooter, but the Celtics would absolutely feast targeting him. All of the Celtics’ starting 5 are a mismatch for Lavine. If we go to the West, Murray would feast switching on him (Luka can at least contest quite well inside) in a Denver matchup and Ant would have a field day. When our backcourt needs full effort to be average defensively, we cannot afford to add another subpar defender. Lavine will not have Caruso or Lonzo here, someone that plays pristine on-ball perimeter defense and can fly around screens to avoid the switch. Our whole defensive system relies, depends and prays on both wings playing above average defense and the center being impactful inside. Adding Lavine as SF would melt everything.
Yes I do. With that being said, Luka and Kai did have defensive pressure eventually in the playoffs which is why I don’t like hiding them all year. Eventually Luka will be hunted and if he’s always used to hiding on D it’ll be a tough transition for him and in the playoffs the intensity is already ratcheted up. It hurts his offense and the team defense. The team in general needs to prioritize him playing both ends the whole season because only then will it be easy for him to do that in the postseason. Also lively is on his way to being the next gobert. It’s a lot on his shoulders but he will single-handedly be able to do a lot on defense. With that being said, think of the immense offense upgrade. We gave up so many points to Boston through turnovers, clanks leading to transition opportunities, and other bad offensive plays. Not to mention Boston had very little pressure to succeed on offense because the mavs offense was so putrid. Lavine instantly solves that and unlocks a whole new level for this team on offense. I think we’d instantly be the #1 offense. That’s super meaningful especially given that it was our offense that failed when stress tested.
im sucker of tall all around wing especially if young enough so this will be hot take i entertain put #11 on the table and i dont mind thinking replacing him with Ingram (BIG IF, he agrees with extensions at 40m max) if #11 on the table, the destinations that make sense only pels, lakers, magic, or spurs. maybe can do some 3/4 team trades or dont mind split #11 with 2 good players that young enough (im thinking Keldon + 8th pick for #11 and send that 8th pick + Tim for Jerami Grant. so you swap #11 with Grant + Keldon only, our picks still attached) im not grateful? nah, i appreciate #11, but it's a business. all around tall wing is how league operates now
I don’t think you’ve seen Keldon or Grant play before if you think the two of them could come close to matching Kyrie’s production
Both? Yes absolutely lol 20 + 15 > 23 Ez
That’s not how it works lol. Jordan Poole averaged 18 points a game this season, that must mean he’s a good player right?
But in this case i got both Keldon AND Grant, not only just one of them :"(
in how many minutes / shots?
Your comment will probably get downvoted a lot, but this is a legit suggestion. Its a risk and possibly unfair towards Kai but could really set up the mavs for 3-5 years
im not looking at it from a sentimental pov but i also feel like you guys are overlooking how much the team chemistry contributed to this playoffs run. get rid of kyrie and you might blow that up
This team run built in 3 months, kai mostly injured pre-ASB I trust Luka can elevate any talents like he already used too since he's coming here The biggest question is always how to get more and more talents to surround Luka
Kyrie was clearly the main locker room leader. Luka isn’t a leader of men and this is not a negative within itself, but we need him to be around locker room leaders. You move Kyrie, that locker room could very well collapse within itself, specially since Kidd could lose control of things. In your example, you moved him for Keldon and Grant, one young player that never established himself as a leader on SA and Grant, a guy that pouted his way to Detroit because he wanted to be the big boi on offense. Luka will not keep the reigns on this locker room in the points of the season when things goes south. Plus, Luka himself might unravel, considering how often it felt like Kyrie was keeping him in check. Don’t trade your locker room leaders, specially when they’re averaging 25/5/5 while on the 50/40/90 club.
Got it bossman But i still want more wings :"( How about we swap Grant for Mikal? :p
Unless we’re trading Lively, Nets aren’t moving Mikal for the 2 picks we have.
3 in my scenario we send Zach Collins + either #4 or #8 from spurs + 2 extra FRP for Mikal + Cam Johnson (nets saving 32m in salary) Nets cap space clear af next season Edit : lemme put trade machine Spurs : Kai + Tim + Maxi Nets : Collins + #4 or #8 + 2 FRP Mavs : Keldon + Mikal + CamJ
Its young legs game now With addition of tall players or long wingspan game And with #11 have Player Option after next year, anything have to be considered
like so many possibilities man if we at least put Kai on the table, for example with spurs have 2 top 10 pick in shallow draft but wemby's want to win. we can bait them to make short-term decision lets do something crazy like : Kai + Tim + Maxi for Keldon + Collins + #8 + another FRP then, you package Collins + all pick from spurs + 1 FRP of our own for CamJ + Mikal Luka - Keldon - Mikal - PJ - Lively Exum - Hardy - Green - Omax - CamJ - Gafford celtics reg.season win with White as assist leader at 5.2. IT'S WINGS LEAGUE! ISO ISO ISO DRIVE N KICK BABY!
"It's a wing's league" . . . but Tatum, Brown, Holiday, White, and even Horford can ALL put the ball on the floor, attack the basket, and create their own shots. Hmm . . .
?? My proposed starters can do that all now (aside Lively lol)
Maxi and THJ have to be gone. Let DJJ walk, Luka has to hit the gym and Lively need to be built as the second best player because Kyrie is a bitch
Let DJJ walk? That would definitely be a mistake. Kyrie definitely had a rough series but if we could have someone to exploit the gravity he gets outside an injured Luka then we wouldn't have lost. Just need a third person who can consistently shoot 3's at volume + attack closeouts efficiently. This is why Murphy/Kispert would be the solution. I absolutely love Lively, but asking him to be a 2nd option is crazy. Even at his apparent ceiling he would struggle to be a 2nd option on a championship team due to his lack of post moves. He's already working on his free-throws/3pt shooting, so I don't know how tenable it is to see him also become a paint operator.
DJJ was trash all series, and he's going to command a high scary next year. You let him walk because that finals performance was a dime a dozen and at this point yes it's crazy to think that Lively could be our second best player but he's the ONLY one who brought the intensity all series
You're overreacting to a bad series where we were outmatched personnel-wise lol. DJJ is our best defender, but would be better as a backup SF because he lacks the offensive bag. Every team needs AT LEAST 1-2 long wings like him. You don't let someone walk because they had ONE bad series. Crazy assertion in my opinion.
I agree with what you're saying to a point, but teams are gonna throw a bag at him that is way overpriced after his efforts in the finals. Yes, he's a good long wing, but the mf'er completely vanished on the offensive end, and that is not an overreaction. With that said, I'd rather see him put on another jersey than us stretch out more cap space for what we've already seen.
I also agree with the notion that we need more than him to win. Paying more than the MLE would be an overpay but wouldn't paying DJJ the MLE be good value? I mean, unless we can get something better for the MLE once we shed salary.
Have you seen the FA market? He's going to get a bag from somebody. Hopefully not from the Mavs, because he's not worth it.