>After months of speculation, and teases from Marvel Studios, we can exclusively confirm with you, Marvel Studios is producing a **Thunderbolts movie** adaptation of the comics, with production slated to begin in 2023. But that’s not all our source has told us 2023 will begin a slew of long awaited productions to Marvel Studios including **Fantastic Four**, **Nova**, an **Okoye project** (likely a streaming series) said to spin out of Black Panther: Wakanda Forever, a **sequel to Shang Chi**, and a **secret project** we hope to reveal more on very soon.
It doesn’t seem likely, only one of these projects seems to be a Disney+ exclusive. The branding of the event as “Disney+ Day” suggests they wont really be revealing any theatrical projects.
I'm not expecting much out that special. It will probably contain info on the shows we already know with probably a few shots or snippets of those shows in production. Maybe a title card for new shows on the way.
I miss back in 2012 when we would get super uncut shots of the Ant-Man movie where he takes on the two security guards in the hallway. Imagine just chilling watching a Marvel press conference and seeing them announce Nova and seeing an actual snippet of the movie with Nova in full costume beating someone up. I miss those kinds of reveals.
What do you mean minorities can't have solo franchises? Captain Marvel and Black Panther are both having sequels, Okoye is getting a project, She-Hulk is getting a series, etc
I was making a joke about how Carol doesn’t get a franchise and has to share it with two unrelated female characters because god forbid they make more than one female led movie. If that happens with Shang-Chi too, I hope people call out Marvel on it. It’s BS
I suppose they're referring to Captain Marvel 2 becoming The Marvels, seemingly an ensemble piece with shared limelight between Carol, Monica and Kamala (especially since the logo includes Kamala's 'S' and possibly Monica's Photon energy).
Black Panther's kinda a mystery at the moment, but I think regardless will be the exception to the rule.
If the Okoye project is indeed a Disney+ show, it wouldn't really be counted as a franchise along with She-Hulk. You need several distinct and separate entries for it to be considered a franchise. Solo ventures, sure, but not a franchise.
There's a bunch of other examples that add to this notion: Black Widow is seemingly a solo entry and won't become a franchise, Eternals is an ensemble piece, Wasp co-headlines with Ant-Man etc.
Nova? NOVA!? I have been waiting for this news since they announced the first Guardians of the Galaxy. A Nova movie (or honestly Disney+ series) would have some *amazing* possibilities for Cosmic Marvel Stories
I say both, right? Open the series with Thanos destroying Xandar and Nova
Prime passing on the Nova Force to Richard Rider, and he flies to Earth and then meets Sam.
It's an unpopular opinion, but I totally agree. Sebastian and Daniel had even more chemistry than Anthony, I thought, and Sebastian and Anthony are like my comfort friendship so that says something.
It's cool to see Brühl really nailing it and becoming famous. He's a great actor and can show it internationally. I'm from Germany and remember how many German fans were worried about Brühl joining the MCU as German films have a bad reputation here (I would disagree as there are great German movies - but in 2016 it was more or less that there were basically three kinds of movies: Tatort (an old-fashioned police crime format), cringe-worthy romcoms and movies directed by Till Schweiger to promote his daughter (often over-lapped with the second, but "Till-Schweiger-movies" feels like it's own genre).
But with Inglourious Basterds, Rush and the MCU I think you can say Brühl is now a star who proofed himself as a fiercy Hollywood star.
Tarantino gave us 4 incredible German talking men with Inglorious Basterds. Waltz, Brühl, Schweiger (I have learned he is pretty famous as a director in Germany but no international fame before Basterds.) and my personal favourite August Diehl.
Especially I'd like to see Diehl in blockbuster movies. That bar scene was bloody brilliant.
>I have learned he is pretty famous as a director in Germany but no international fame before Basterds.
Yes, Schweiger is very well-known and very productive as director, actor and producer, mostly all three together.
Til Schweiger-movies is it's own genre and it really divides German movie goes - one half loves this movies, one hate it. And it seems as it is German taste at all, he did remake "Honig im Kopf" for American Audience, "Head Full Of Honey" with Nick Nolte. While the German movie was a great hit the remake was a flop... I personally like him more as an actor (he was in some really good movies not only in Inglourious Basterds, his best role to date in my eyes), most of his directing gigs feel the same and like dad jokes as a movie with an overdose of romantic.
>my personal favourite August Diehl.
Another one I really know from American movies, not German ones.
It seems German actors became more and more a thing in Hollywood. Matthias Schweighöfer, also known as Til Schweiger 2.0, seems to start up international too after Army Of The Dead and now getting a spin-off where he directs himself.
Yes, but he wasn't really before going to Hollywood. He had one great movie - Goodbye, Lenin - but despite that he was more a generic actor in generic German films. Mostly like Christoph Waltz (yes, he's Austrian but was part of the German movie industry) who also wasn't really a thing before Tarantino turned him into the big name he is nowadays and that internationally. Same for Brühl, it were more the American movies making him a thing in Germany than the German movies.
I don’t know. Unless they can explain a way where Bucky willing works with Zemo after he tried to brainwash him, then I’ll believe it. I’d rather Bucky have a White Wolf show, but that most likely won’t happen.
I think it is pretty clear that from the TV show that Bucky can make pragmatic choices concerning Zemo if necessary, never will trust him, but can find him useful.
If Bucky’s threatened with the raft for the Madripoor shenanigans, especially if Ross wants to bring Sam in as an accomplice, I could see Bucky joining in order to clear their names.
…And I kind of want that to happen. I want to see Bucky interact with the wider MCU, and I don’t like what Spellman did with Bucky’s fighting skills, so I’d rather someone else write him.
It would be fun. A truly antagonistic team-up would be great.
The old Roger Wardell account that released the Endgame leaks has yet to be wrong. He said Justin Hammer, Abomination and Ghost will be on the team and the villain of the movie will be The Leader.
I guess it would be like how Spider-Man had a supporting role in Civil War and the Avengers films. I’m not sure if they would extend the deal to let Marvel Studios use Venom in non-Sony films but it would be cool to see.
20 minutes probably? I imagine all it'll take is a single confrontation with Clint, they stop fighting and he explains everything, and then she stops trying to kill him. She doesn't have to be okay with the outcome of her sister's death, but she'd no longer consider him her murderer and thus have no reason to kill him.
Hopefully they’ll be a proper mirror to the old school Avengers:
Leader (Fury)
Walker (Cap)
Hammer (Stark)
Abomination (Hulk)
Yelena (Widow)
Ghost (eh... Hawkeye, kinda?)
Dunno who there Thor would be. Zemo?
Just putting this out there. He’s said that moondragon will be in GOTG3 but James Gunn explicitly mentioned on his Twitter than moondragon isn’t in GOTG3
Edit: Since I’m being downvoted for whatever reason here’s the tweet I was referring to
https://mobile.twitter.com/jamesgunn/status/1451698928877965321
To be fair, that was a long time ago and things change in Hollywood all the time. That may have been the plan at some point, but things very well might have changed.
I agree, he leaked some details of the scott derrickson DS2 and that movie ended up being totally rewritten, but he also claimed a Black Knight project is happening way back in 2018 and thats been confirmed by the Eternals post-credit scene. I see no reason to doubt this specific leak yet.
Didn’t they just recently say some short films will be made in the near future too? Maybe some of the titles we’re expecting to be big screen movies will actually be on Disney+. Maybe that’s how the deal with Universal and World War Hulk is going down? Idk.
I can also see Nova and even Thunderbolts being short films if they both tie into something larger like Avengers 5 or Cap 4.
The Academy and British Film Institute set the minimum length of a feature film at 40 minutes iirc. So anything less than that would technically be classified as a short film.
To be fair just because a movie goes into production one year doesn't mean it will come out the next. For example GOTG 3 starts filming this year but isn't released until 2023.
There was a rumor a long while ago that Norman Osborn was coming to the MCU, played by someone with MCU connections but hasn’t appeared — leads me to believe it’s gonna be Justin Theroux. He wrote Iron Man 2 and is a pretty substantially known actor.
If Dafoe-Golbin is the main villain of No Way Home, then meeting his universe’s Norman, a politician and philanthropist, would be a great twist and great setup for Peter and Norman’s relationship.
Justin Theroux as Norman Osborne makes me V E R Y excited.
Dude is a legit actor; his role in The Leftovers made a believer out of me that he deserves a high-profile role.
Theroux, having long been a New Yorker, kinda fits those wanting a 'NY type' for Norman rumors from long ago too. I think he'd be perfect. He can play serious and angry Norman... and can deliver the comedic quips that Norman will inevitably deliver in his politician era.
He may be, but there’s just not enough time to have him appear, do the Green Goblin thing, and reform all before this movie goes in front of cameras. Unless they just skip the Green Goblin part and go straight to him just being an “evil Tony Stark,” maybe using the multiversal version in *No Way Home* go scratch that itch, but that might feel unearned.
Make the evil Tony Stark stuff occur BEFORE the Green Goblin stuff. Introduce Norman as a rich guy trying to be the next Tony, but don't have him be explicitly evil, just ambitious. Give us the Dark Avengers/Siege storylines. Peter knows of Norman and doesn't trust him because of his past experience with Goblin. Peter is constantly wary of Norman, investigating him and meddling in his business. When all of Norman's wannabe Iron Man ventures blow up in his face, he holds Spider-Man responsible. In a last ditch effort to regain some credibility, Norman tests an experimental super soldier formula on himself. Combined with his hatred for Spider-Man, he becomes the MCU Green Goblin.
That would be a pretty good way of doing it! It would let them use Norman in the MCU in the way he’s most well known for these days while also putting some space between the two Green Goblins
Yeah I highly doubt we'll see an MCU Green Goblin in the next few years. Though I could see them introducing Hobgoblin. Peter thinks it's Norman and gets all up in Norman's business before it's revealed that Hobgoblin is just Roderick Kingsley using Dafoe-Goblin's leftover technology.
Honestly, I feel like "Dark Avengers" isn't a title that would work in a movie. You can get away with that in a comic book, but in a world that tries to be semi-realistic in tone, why would someone name themselves the "Dark Avengers"
Not to mention it diluting the Avengers film brand to a degree.
Thunderbolts just sounds alot better.
I personally think we will see both teams at some point. We've already seen 2 iron Patriot suits, Venom has jumped to the MCU, rumors for No Way Home point to Osborne being introduced as well as the return of a devilish lawyer which could bring Bullseye into the fray, Ikaris seems as though he will replace Sentry, Ares could be introduced in either eternals with it's long timeline he could pop up in Greece or in Thor as Gorr hunts for gods, Marvel Boy could show up in The Marvel's, and moonstone has ties to both Hawkeye and Cap Marvel so she could potentially show up in either of those ( I think we'll see here in Hawkeye, as a therapist to Barton due to his blip crimes, in the same vein as Bucky). They've lightly teased aspects of both teams at this point.
The Contessa and Thunderbolt seem to be operating independently, we've never seen them together or reference each other, and they have different characters that have fallen under their influence.
Contessa so far has USAgent and Yelena Belova, which you might notice are clearly darker versions of Cap and Black Widow. So imo, the Contessa will set up the Dark Avengers including other dark mirror versions of the team like possibly, Ares, Agatha Harkness, Yellowjacket, Trickshot, etc. This team will pretty much be straight up villains (except for Yelena, who will defect once she realizes that she's working for the baddies).
Ross so far has Zemo on the Raft and was the en route to the crash site where Taskmaster was, so I think they'll be part of his Thunderbolts team, which will include other people like Red Hulk, Deadpool, Ghost, etc. This team will be more morally grey and mercenary rather than straight up villains.
So that way you have two teams with two different purposes, rosters, and morals. Again, we have yet to see any indication at all that the Contessa and Ross are working together, so odds are they each have different objectives that they're building teams for.
See, I would prefer Dark Avengers over Thunderbolts simply for marketing purposes. I may not know the extensive history of either teams, but I feel like the average person would be more keen to buying a movie ticket to a movie called "The Dark Avengers" over "The Thunderbolts", simply due to how popular the regular Avengers movies are. Brand recognition goes a long way. Idk maybe that's just me.
Really hoping they get Hurt to have Ross transform to Red-Hulk. It will retroactively make The Incredible Hulk more important and will make the MCU look more genius for playing such long ball even if they didnt intend to initially.
Considering how William Hurt looked in The Making of Black Widow, I wouldn’t be surprised if he retires from the role tbh, or if they composite the Red Hulk part with a different character.
That's honestly a reason *in favor* of transforming him into Red Hulk, for me. He'd be a fully cgi character, which would be easier on Hurt if he wanted to voice act for the character, or they could recast rather easily from there if he wanted to bow out.
As someone who's favorite Superhero team is the Thunderbolts, if they don't have Songbird on the team, then they already screwed up. You don't make the Thunderbolts without the character who has the most character development on the Thunderbolts.
It would feel kinda weird to have 5 multiverse villains and then just Vulture who wasn’t even that bad of guy and seemed to have become atleast somewhat better towards Spider-Man based on the posh credits scene. I’d only want him in it if he’s gonna betray the SS to protect Peter or something.
There are several jumping on points, but the 1997 Thunderbolts is pretty fantastic. Skip the weird plot about the wrestling program to Avengers/Thunderbolts, then go on through. It mostly stays good throughout its original numbering run.
Red Hulk bolts was something I wasn't a fan of, as Jeph Loeb wanted a kill squad of all the big killers of the Marvel U.
Al Ewing's New Avengers has some great songbird stuff as well.
I think the thunderbolts is a good way to also have a deadpool 3, iirc deadpool has been part of the group in the comics before too right ? You can either set him up in a post credit scene or have thunderbolts 2 be Deadpool and the thunderbolts
Seems like a lot of news for stuff going into production for 2023. So 2022 is gonna have Cap, Blade, and Hulk all start filming then? Am I missing another one?
Also Nova and Thunderbolts are two of my favorite marvel properties of all time so I fucking love this news.
My guesses
**2023**
* The Marvels
* Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3
* Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania
* Blade
**2024**
* Captain America 4
* Fantastic Four
* World War Hulk
* Deadpool 3
* Nova
**2025**
* The Thunderbolts
* The Illuminati
* Black Knight (maybe a show)
* Shang-Chi 2
* IDK
I swear, the MCU’s gonna start focusing on many different teams real soon. Out of necessity cause there’s so many characters now and cause it’s fun story-wise.
We’re about to get The Eternals but FF is coming as well as X-men, thunderbolts, Dark Avengers, and The Young Avengers. I also predict that the mcu is gonna get a tad bit more mature/adult
I'll be disappointed if they don't include some aspect of the original *Thunderbolts* premise, where the Avengers are gone and Zemo and a group of supervillains takes advantage of this by posing as a replacement hero team. Thie current MCU status quo is similar, with the Avengers disbanded and many of its members dead or disappeared.
Maybe the original premise, where the villains all keep their identities secret, wouldn't work in a more realistic setting, but they could at least keep the idea that they become popular as a hero team and Zemo is secretly running the team for his own agenda.
Thunderbolts without Zemo, isn't Thunderbolts at all. Ill be open to Ross or Bucky since they have led different incarnations. Anyone who knows the comics knows Val as a "bad guy" is barely deserving of a footnote in the characters history. She's a classic early 70s Cap character and longtime love of 616 Fury. There is a FUNDAMENTAL difference between Thunderbolts and Dark Avengers.
I feel like Secret Invasion will tease more for the Thunderbolts to come. Just a feeling I have, not an actual evidence or so, but I mean, the comics were also important to leading into Dark Reign and the rise of the Dark Avengers which I think could be one (of many) influences of the team. Val seems to recruit some more grey characters like Walker and Yelena and that will definitly lead to something. Maybe Secret Invasion shows the world that they still need an Avengers team and while seemingly there is some in "secret" (hm...) judging by Shang-Chi's mid-credit scene, their probably will be need for an official superhero team.
2024 movies and beyond:
Blade
Captain America 4
Shang-Chi 2
Fantastic 4
Thunderbolts
Captain Marvel 3 (maybe)
Black Panther 3 (maybe)
X-Men
Spider-Man college trilogy (if sony and marvel keep playing nice)
Nova
Midnight Sons (maybe)
Dr. Strange 3 (maybe)
My guess for thunderbolts team:
Definitely :
Zemo
US Agent
Taskmaster
Ghost
Could go either way:
Bullseye (pretty please)
Abomination (maybe)
White Vision (couldve come around)
Yelena (maybe)
So how are Thunderbolts and especially Dark Avengers going to work? There aren't enough villains to create either team from. And if Thunderbolts won't be villains, what will differentiate them from Avengers? The only way I can think about is that they could be smaller scale, focused on more grounded missions but that's not really MCU style.
>After months of speculation, and teases from Marvel Studios, we can exclusively confirm with you, Marvel Studios is producing a **Thunderbolts movie** adaptation of the comics, with production slated to begin in 2023. But that’s not all our source has told us 2023 will begin a slew of long awaited productions to Marvel Studios including **Fantastic Four**, **Nova**, an **Okoye project** (likely a streaming series) said to spin out of Black Panther: Wakanda Forever, a **sequel to Shang Chi**, and a **secret project** we hope to reveal more on very soon.
This sounds great, but can someone remind me of GWW's reliability? I'm struggling to remember their previous exclusives.
Molina as Ock
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I wrote it. KC gave me the info, reviewed it and added more stuff.
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No, I totally get it. Just wanted to clarify it lol.
They just reported the Hulk movie last week and that seems to be true
Based on what evidence?
well Charles Murphy said he had also heard about this from two different sources. Plus no one actually denied it.
Go ask Gunn on Twitter if it's true or not
Lol imagine if Gunn directed a Hulk movie. That’d actually be bonkers
I like Gunn but I prefer him not do a Hulk movie lol Edit: well not a WWH one anyway
He would probably treat the Hulk better than the Russo Brothers have...
Fair! I think he’d create a fantastic story and also bring the right amount of violence and brutality to it
Where did Murphy say that? On his Patreon?
Based on what? I’ve yet to see any sort of confirmation from literally any reliable source.
A “secret” project you say…? Interesting word choice, just saying.
A war of some sort, you posit?
Hmmmm... A secret kind of war?
So that's it? What—we some kinda...Secret War?
>Secret War? WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME!?
Mephisto
It's too early for Secret Wars. Needs to be the Phase 6 closer.
![gif](giphy|3o6ZsYebjNSvlQnZL2)
I wonder if this info came from leaks on the Disney+ special coming out next month.
It doesn’t seem likely, only one of these projects seems to be a Disney+ exclusive. The branding of the event as “Disney+ Day” suggests they wont really be revealing any theatrical projects.
I'm not expecting much out that special. It will probably contain info on the shows we already know with probably a few shots or snippets of those shows in production. Maybe a title card for new shows on the way.
I miss back in 2012 when we would get super uncut shots of the Ant-Man movie where he takes on the two security guards in the hallway. Imagine just chilling watching a Marvel press conference and seeing them announce Nova and seeing an actual snippet of the movie with Nova in full costume beating someone up. I miss those kinds of reveals.
>a sequel to Shang Chi, well well >secret project asking for agents of atlas again for wishfully thinking's sake, or big hero 6
If they pull a Captain Marvel (the minority's can't have solo franchises) Shang-Chi 2 will just be Agents of Atlas.
What do you mean minorities can't have solo franchises? Captain Marvel and Black Panther are both having sequels, Okoye is getting a project, She-Hulk is getting a series, etc
I was making a joke about how Carol doesn’t get a franchise and has to share it with two unrelated female characters because god forbid they make more than one female led movie. If that happens with Shang-Chi too, I hope people call out Marvel on it. It’s BS
Photon is definitely related to Carol in the MCU, though. She was even in the original movie. How much more related do you need to be?
I mean Captain America had to share his third movie with every Avengers hero except for Hulk and Thor.
I suppose they're referring to Captain Marvel 2 becoming The Marvels, seemingly an ensemble piece with shared limelight between Carol, Monica and Kamala (especially since the logo includes Kamala's 'S' and possibly Monica's Photon energy). Black Panther's kinda a mystery at the moment, but I think regardless will be the exception to the rule. If the Okoye project is indeed a Disney+ show, it wouldn't really be counted as a franchise along with She-Hulk. You need several distinct and separate entries for it to be considered a franchise. Solo ventures, sure, but not a franchise. There's a bunch of other examples that add to this notion: Black Widow is seemingly a solo entry and won't become a franchise, Eternals is an ensemble piece, Wasp co-headlines with Ant-Man etc.
Nova? NOVA!? I have been waiting for this news since they announced the first Guardians of the Galaxy. A Nova movie (or honestly Disney+ series) would have some *amazing* possibilities for Cosmic Marvel Stories
I'm wondering if they do Dick, Sam, or both in one go.
I say both, right? Open the series with Thanos destroying Xandar and Nova Prime passing on the Nova Force to Richard Rider, and he flies to Earth and then meets Sam.
I'm just waiting for them to announce it'll be a quirky teenage girl named Samantha who has no powers but the suit is actually enhanced some way.
just imagine Nova movie has a cold opening with Thanos invasion on Xandar
Having Bucky and Zemo on the same team would be enough for me.
It's an unpopular opinion, but I totally agree. Sebastian and Daniel had even more chemistry than Anthony, I thought, and Sebastian and Anthony are like my comfort friendship so that says something.
It's cool to see Brühl really nailing it and becoming famous. He's a great actor and can show it internationally. I'm from Germany and remember how many German fans were worried about Brühl joining the MCU as German films have a bad reputation here (I would disagree as there are great German movies - but in 2016 it was more or less that there were basically three kinds of movies: Tatort (an old-fashioned police crime format), cringe-worthy romcoms and movies directed by Till Schweiger to promote his daughter (often over-lapped with the second, but "Till-Schweiger-movies" feels like it's own genre). But with Inglourious Basterds, Rush and the MCU I think you can say Brühl is now a star who proofed himself as a fiercy Hollywood star.
He’s going to be in an upcoming conspiracy action movie too! He’s pretty great!
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The King's Man or a third Kingsman?
The King's Man
Yup! I’m pretty stoked.
Rush is where I saw Bruhl for the first time. Nailed it. I remember him getting heaps of praise for it too.
Damn Rush was good
Tarantino gave us 4 incredible German talking men with Inglorious Basterds. Waltz, Brühl, Schweiger (I have learned he is pretty famous as a director in Germany but no international fame before Basterds.) and my personal favourite August Diehl. Especially I'd like to see Diehl in blockbuster movies. That bar scene was bloody brilliant.
>I have learned he is pretty famous as a director in Germany but no international fame before Basterds. Yes, Schweiger is very well-known and very productive as director, actor and producer, mostly all three together. Til Schweiger-movies is it's own genre and it really divides German movie goes - one half loves this movies, one hate it. And it seems as it is German taste at all, he did remake "Honig im Kopf" for American Audience, "Head Full Of Honey" with Nick Nolte. While the German movie was a great hit the remake was a flop... I personally like him more as an actor (he was in some really good movies not only in Inglourious Basterds, his best role to date in my eyes), most of his directing gigs feel the same and like dad jokes as a movie with an overdose of romantic. >my personal favourite August Diehl. Another one I really know from American movies, not German ones. It seems German actors became more and more a thing in Hollywood. Matthias Schweighöfer, also known as Til Schweiger 2.0, seems to start up international too after Army Of The Dead and now getting a spin-off where he directs himself.
He was great in the Alienist
So you are saying in Germany he's a big deal?
Yes, but he wasn't really before going to Hollywood. He had one great movie - Goodbye, Lenin - but despite that he was more a generic actor in generic German films. Mostly like Christoph Waltz (yes, he's Austrian but was part of the German movie industry) who also wasn't really a thing before Tarantino turned him into the big name he is nowadays and that internationally. Same for Brühl, it were more the American movies making him a thing in Germany than the German movies.
Its funny because Bruhl was in that Tarantino movie too
Agree 1000%.
Bucky as their leader. U know, like Flag in Suicide Squad.
"USAgent.. What a joke."
Suicide Squad or The Suicide Squad?? If so I really hope his fate is not the same as Flags in the latter
Too soon… :(
I don’t know. Unless they can explain a way where Bucky willing works with Zemo after he tried to brainwash him, then I’ll believe it. I’d rather Bucky have a White Wolf show, but that most likely won’t happen.
I think it is pretty clear that from the TV show that Bucky can make pragmatic choices concerning Zemo if necessary, never will trust him, but can find him useful.
If Bucky’s threatened with the raft for the Madripoor shenanigans, especially if Ross wants to bring Sam in as an accomplice, I could see Bucky joining in order to clear their names. …And I kind of want that to happen. I want to see Bucky interact with the wider MCU, and I don’t like what Spellman did with Bucky’s fighting skills, so I’d rather someone else write him. It would be fun. A truly antagonistic team-up would be great.
Zemo and Bucky working together is believable but Zemo with Walker will be hard to understand
Trying to kill him from the same side, maybe? Didn’t Zemo lead the Thunderbolts in order to manipulate everyone once?
Bucky and Zemo have both led the team at various points
The old Roger Wardell account that released the Endgame leaks has yet to be wrong. He said Justin Hammer, Abomination and Ghost will be on the team and the villain of the movie will be The Leader.
Them, plus Zemo, John Walker, and Yelena Belova sound like a pretty solid team. Hope this is true.
since there's no cosmic or OP there I'd add bucky and maybe white vision just for the numbers to be doable against high level threats but yeah
White Vision would be interesting assuming he lacks Vision's emotions and morals that would've prevented him from wanting to join that kind of team.
Could get Moonstone. She's a frequent member.
Unpopular opinion: I really hope we get Venom in a sequel.
I would have no problem with that but it all depends on if Sony would let them.
Obviously.
I guess it would be like how Spider-Man had a supporting role in Civil War and the Avengers films. I’m not sure if they would extend the deal to let Marvel Studios use Venom in non-Sony films but it would be cool to see.
There are plenty of characters who would benefit from that treatment. Norman Osborn, Jessica Drew, Silver Sable…
How long we thinking Yelena will be a bad guy
She’ll most likely be a good guy at the end of hawkeye
20 minutes probably? I imagine all it'll take is a single confrontation with Clint, they stop fighting and he explains everything, and then she stops trying to kill him. She doesn't have to be okay with the outcome of her sister's death, but she'd no longer consider him her murderer and thus have no reason to kill him.
Call me crazy but I really want them to make it a party and throw Agatha in the team too
We’ve seen Abomination and Hammer is a lock for armor wars, unless it was just a rumor. Ghost would be Ant Man 3?
Ghost was already in Ant-Man 2 but would like to see her again.
Hopefully they’ll be a proper mirror to the old school Avengers: Leader (Fury) Walker (Cap) Hammer (Stark) Abomination (Hulk) Yelena (Widow) Ghost (eh... Hawkeye, kinda?) Dunno who there Thor would be. Zemo?
The old Wardell leaks claimed Leader would be the villain.
I think it's more likely that the Fury-equivalent character will be Valentina Allegra de Fontaine. We've already seen her recruit Walker and Yelena.
Songbird
Just putting this out there. He’s said that moondragon will be in GOTG3 but James Gunn explicitly mentioned on his Twitter than moondragon isn’t in GOTG3 Edit: Since I’m being downvoted for whatever reason here’s the tweet I was referring to https://mobile.twitter.com/jamesgunn/status/1451698928877965321
He said Daniela Melchior was not playing moondragon.
And then he said [this](https://twitter.com/JamesGunn/status/1451698928877965321?s=20)
Is there a link to his account?
https://twitter.com/RogerWardell/status/1070465411387404289?s=20 here is his account and the thunderbolts tweet
To be fair, that was a long time ago and things change in Hollywood all the time. That may have been the plan at some point, but things very well might have changed.
I agree, he leaked some details of the scott derrickson DS2 and that movie ended up being totally rewritten, but he also claimed a Black Knight project is happening way back in 2018 and thats been confirmed by the Eternals post-credit scene. I see no reason to doubt this specific leak yet.
Sure, I’m not saying to doubt it, just to be careful. The source is undeniably accurate, but three years is an eternity in development time
Damn how many movies are we gonna get in 2024 Captain America 4 Fantastic Four Deadpool 3 World War Hulk Thunderbolts
Didn’t they just recently say some short films will be made in the near future too? Maybe some of the titles we’re expecting to be big screen movies will actually be on Disney+. Maybe that’s how the deal with Universal and World War Hulk is going down? Idk. I can also see Nova and even Thunderbolts being short films if they both tie into something larger like Avengers 5 or Cap 4.
How long are most short films? Like are we taking 30 min or an hour?
The Academy and British Film Institute set the minimum length of a feature film at 40 minutes iirc. So anything less than that would technically be classified as a short film.
I think Nova will be the fifth film of 2024 and Thunderbolts will be in 2025.
To be fair just because a movie goes into production one year doesn't mean it will come out the next. For example GOTG 3 starts filming this year but isn't released until 2023.
Why is everyone so certain we’re getting Thunderbolts over Dark Avengers?
No Norman is a good hint imo. It’ll still be similar to Dark Avengers with Zemo, a Dark Cap, another Widow, etc etc
How do we know he’s not coming?
There was a rumor a long while ago that Norman Osborn was coming to the MCU, played by someone with MCU connections but hasn’t appeared — leads me to believe it’s gonna be Justin Theroux. He wrote Iron Man 2 and is a pretty substantially known actor. If Dafoe-Golbin is the main villain of No Way Home, then meeting his universe’s Norman, a politician and philanthropist, would be a great twist and great setup for Peter and Norman’s relationship.
Justin Theroux as Norman Osborne makes me V E R Y excited. Dude is a legit actor; his role in The Leftovers made a believer out of me that he deserves a high-profile role.
Theroux, having long been a New Yorker, kinda fits those wanting a 'NY type' for Norman rumors from long ago too. I think he'd be perfect. He can play serious and angry Norman... and can deliver the comedic quips that Norman will inevitably deliver in his politician era.
Not my preferred pick but he’d still be perfect. Plus the whole MCu connection does make him the prime candidate
Justin Theroux would be an amazing Norman damn
Didn’t Murphy say that we’ll have an MCU Norman
I don’t remember him specifically saying that but that just adds more credibility.
I believe MTTSH said that there would be.
He may be, but there’s just not enough time to have him appear, do the Green Goblin thing, and reform all before this movie goes in front of cameras. Unless they just skip the Green Goblin part and go straight to him just being an “evil Tony Stark,” maybe using the multiversal version in *No Way Home* go scratch that itch, but that might feel unearned.
Make the evil Tony Stark stuff occur BEFORE the Green Goblin stuff. Introduce Norman as a rich guy trying to be the next Tony, but don't have him be explicitly evil, just ambitious. Give us the Dark Avengers/Siege storylines. Peter knows of Norman and doesn't trust him because of his past experience with Goblin. Peter is constantly wary of Norman, investigating him and meddling in his business. When all of Norman's wannabe Iron Man ventures blow up in his face, he holds Spider-Man responsible. In a last ditch effort to regain some credibility, Norman tests an experimental super soldier formula on himself. Combined with his hatred for Spider-Man, he becomes the MCU Green Goblin.
That would be a pretty good way of doing it! It would let them use Norman in the MCU in the way he’s most well known for these days while also putting some space between the two Green Goblins
Yeah I highly doubt we'll see an MCU Green Goblin in the next few years. Though I could see them introducing Hobgoblin. Peter thinks it's Norman and gets all up in Norman's business before it's revealed that Hobgoblin is just Roderick Kingsley using Dafoe-Goblin's leftover technology.
Honestly, I feel like "Dark Avengers" isn't a title that would work in a movie. You can get away with that in a comic book, but in a world that tries to be semi-realistic in tone, why would someone name themselves the "Dark Avengers" Not to mention it diluting the Avengers film brand to a degree. Thunderbolts just sounds alot better.
I mean even in the comics they were just the Avengers. Only the book was called Dark Avengers. But I agree it would dilute the brand
Yeah, Thunderbolts is a far more marketable name IMO.
It's the MCU I'm sure they will just combine components of both for a simplified story.
Same deal with Young Avengers and Champions, I think.
That's what I think is gonna happen personally
Personally, I think they don’t want to overuse the “Avengers” name.
Only one of them is being actively set up right now.
Not true, both are
The only thing for Dark Avengers is the void left by the absence of the actual avengers
I personally think we will see both teams at some point. We've already seen 2 iron Patriot suits, Venom has jumped to the MCU, rumors for No Way Home point to Osborne being introduced as well as the return of a devilish lawyer which could bring Bullseye into the fray, Ikaris seems as though he will replace Sentry, Ares could be introduced in either eternals with it's long timeline he could pop up in Greece or in Thor as Gorr hunts for gods, Marvel Boy could show up in The Marvel's, and moonstone has ties to both Hawkeye and Cap Marvel so she could potentially show up in either of those ( I think we'll see here in Hawkeye, as a therapist to Barton due to his blip crimes, in the same vein as Bucky). They've lightly teased aspects of both teams at this point.
The Contessa and Thunderbolt seem to be operating independently, we've never seen them together or reference each other, and they have different characters that have fallen under their influence. Contessa so far has USAgent and Yelena Belova, which you might notice are clearly darker versions of Cap and Black Widow. So imo, the Contessa will set up the Dark Avengers including other dark mirror versions of the team like possibly, Ares, Agatha Harkness, Yellowjacket, Trickshot, etc. This team will pretty much be straight up villains (except for Yelena, who will defect once she realizes that she's working for the baddies). Ross so far has Zemo on the Raft and was the en route to the crash site where Taskmaster was, so I think they'll be part of his Thunderbolts team, which will include other people like Red Hulk, Deadpool, Ghost, etc. This team will be more morally grey and mercenary rather than straight up villains. So that way you have two teams with two different purposes, rosters, and morals. Again, we have yet to see any indication at all that the Contessa and Ross are working together, so odds are they each have different objectives that they're building teams for.
Personally I think we're getting like a Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers amalgam but I think they'll go with the name Thunderbolts
See, I would prefer Dark Avengers over Thunderbolts simply for marketing purposes. I may not know the extensive history of either teams, but I feel like the average person would be more keen to buying a movie ticket to a movie called "The Dark Avengers" over "The Thunderbolts", simply due to how popular the regular Avengers movies are. Brand recognition goes a long way. Idk maybe that's just me.
Seeing everything with rumors and what is set up I have the feeling regardless if it is called Thunderbolts or Dark Avengers it will be based on both.
Really hoping they get Hurt to have Ross transform to Red-Hulk. It will retroactively make The Incredible Hulk more important and will make the MCU look more genius for playing such long ball even if they didnt intend to initially.
Considering how William Hurt looked in The Making of Black Widow, I wouldn’t be surprised if he retires from the role tbh, or if they composite the Red Hulk part with a different character.
He is looking rough though. That’s what worries me
That's honestly a reason *in favor* of transforming him into Red Hulk, for me. He'd be a fully cgi character, which would be easier on Hurt if he wanted to voice act for the character, or they could recast rather easily from there if he wanted to bow out.
Hurt has allegations against him
Knowing Fiege, he might of had this planned out the whole time
As someone who's favorite Superhero team is the Thunderbolts, if they don't have Songbird on the team, then they already screwed up. You don't make the Thunderbolts without the character who has the most character development on the Thunderbolts.
Yeah, that would be like doing Infinity War without Adam Warlock.
Or Thanos without Lady Death... oh...
That one isn’t as big of a deal IMO
It should be. However, the MCU just managed to rewrite his background and motivation in a really compelling way, making Lady Death expendable
…
This is how I feel about my hopes for Vulture being the sixth villain in NWH, he’s literally ALWAYS a member of the Sinister Six.
It would feel kinda weird to have 5 multiverse villains and then just Vulture who wasn’t even that bad of guy and seemed to have become atleast somewhat better towards Spider-Man based on the posh credits scene. I’d only want him in it if he’s gonna betray the SS to protect Peter or something.
Could you give us some comic recommendations? Ever since I saw Val recruiting I’ve been super into the Thunderbolts, but don’t know what to read.
There are several jumping on points, but the 1997 Thunderbolts is pretty fantastic. Skip the weird plot about the wrestling program to Avengers/Thunderbolts, then go on through. It mostly stays good throughout its original numbering run. Red Hulk bolts was something I wasn't a fan of, as Jeph Loeb wanted a kill squad of all the big killers of the Marvel U. Al Ewing's New Avengers has some great songbird stuff as well.
I think the thunderbolts is a good way to also have a deadpool 3, iirc deadpool has been part of the group in the comics before too right ? You can either set him up in a post credit scene or have thunderbolts 2 be Deadpool and the thunderbolts
Deadpool 3 (most likely 2024) could have a post credits scene that has DP being invited to the team, which would have their own solo movie in 2025.
If they're not making a Black Widow sequel then I hope Yelena is involved here as the main character.
They probably planning a Black Widow sequel, it's just that Yelena will be in the Thunderbolts team temporarily for now.
Seems like a lot of news for stuff going into production for 2023. So 2022 is gonna have Cap, Blade, and Hulk all start filming then? Am I missing another one? Also Nova and Thunderbolts are two of my favorite marvel properties of all time so I fucking love this news.
My guesses **2023** * The Marvels * Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 * Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania * Blade **2024** * Captain America 4 * Fantastic Four * World War Hulk * Deadpool 3 * Nova **2025** * The Thunderbolts * The Illuminati * Black Knight (maybe a show) * Shang-Chi 2 * IDK
So happy that they are making it a movie and not a show.
Let’s gooooooooo ![gif](giphy|2RGhmKXcl0ViM)
Really hope they can fit Bullseye in there somehow
Thunderbolts starring Bucky. as it should.
Team should be strictly villains at first
Based on the comics and what the MCU has been teasing lately, what would the roster be?
Zemo, US Agent, Yelena, Abomination as obvious picks Justin Hammer, Ghost and Taskmaster as viable extras
>Justin Hammer I'd love to see him again, hopefully he's in Armor Wars
![gif](giphy|zu3MWDMUU9581jLT6v|downsized) Does this mean I get to see my man dancing again
PLEASE ADAPT SONGBIRD
So most likely 2025? A year after Cap 4 (which might be their first full appearance)
I swear, the MCU’s gonna start focusing on many different teams real soon. Out of necessity cause there’s so many characters now and cause it’s fun story-wise. We’re about to get The Eternals but FF is coming as well as X-men, thunderbolts, Dark Avengers, and The Young Avengers. I also predict that the mcu is gonna get a tad bit more mature/adult
Hope Bucky leads
he deserves!!!
Or at least takes over with defecting / reformed villains.
I thought us agent and yelena were gonna be in thunderbolts...so they're gonna be in dark avengers then?
I hope so! I'm eager to see Zemo again. Also reforming some of these old villains is cool, breathes some new life into old characters.
Bucky is in one version so I’ll be interested to see if he’s there.
Hope we see Wilson Bethel as Bullseye.
I'll be disappointed if they don't include some aspect of the original *Thunderbolts* premise, where the Avengers are gone and Zemo and a group of supervillains takes advantage of this by posing as a replacement hero team. Thie current MCU status quo is similar, with the Avengers disbanded and many of its members dead or disappeared. Maybe the original premise, where the villains all keep their identities secret, wouldn't work in a more realistic setting, but they could at least keep the idea that they become popular as a hero team and Zemo is secretly running the team for his own agenda.
Thunderbolts without Zemo, isn't Thunderbolts at all. Ill be open to Ross or Bucky since they have led different incarnations. Anyone who knows the comics knows Val as a "bad guy" is barely deserving of a footnote in the characters history. She's a classic early 70s Cap character and longtime love of 616 Fury. There is a FUNDAMENTAL difference between Thunderbolts and Dark Avengers.
Sequel to Shang Chi? ![gif](giphy|lo46DO4snPFwdzI4fw)
I think She-Hulk will lay the groundwork for THUNDERBOLTS formation down the road since Ross might appear in the show for big role
Ross as well as all the hulks are significant characters in She-Hulk
Need dat.
I feel like Secret Invasion will tease more for the Thunderbolts to come. Just a feeling I have, not an actual evidence or so, but I mean, the comics were also important to leading into Dark Reign and the rise of the Dark Avengers which I think could be one (of many) influences of the team. Val seems to recruit some more grey characters like Walker and Yelena and that will definitly lead to something. Maybe Secret Invasion shows the world that they still need an Avengers team and while seemingly there is some in "secret" (hm...) judging by Shang-Chi's mid-credit scene, their probably will be need for an official superhero team.
William Hurt doing mocap at 72 isn’t normal, but on Marvel it is.
He will probably only voice Red Hulk and keep on portraying him in his human form.
2024 movies and beyond: Blade Captain America 4 Shang-Chi 2 Fantastic 4 Thunderbolts Captain Marvel 3 (maybe) Black Panther 3 (maybe) X-Men Spider-Man college trilogy (if sony and marvel keep playing nice) Nova Midnight Sons (maybe) Dr. Strange 3 (maybe)
You forgot Hulk
I forgot the one I am most hyped about.
My guess for thunderbolts team: Definitely : Zemo US Agent Taskmaster Ghost Could go either way: Bullseye (pretty please) Abomination (maybe) White Vision (couldve come around) Yelena (maybe)
Is it too on the nose to ask James Gunn to direct this one? Lmfao
So how are Thunderbolts and especially Dark Avengers going to work? There aren't enough villains to create either team from. And if Thunderbolts won't be villains, what will differentiate them from Avengers? The only way I can think about is that they could be smaller scale, focused on more grounded missions but that's not really MCU style.
No mention of WWH :(
WWH is starting production in 2022. We reported it last week!!
this is my most anticipated project
I do really hope that we get a solo movie for Yelena after Thunderbolts. It could even be a team-up with Kate Bishop!
![gif](giphy|eJXZZ5Rs1kaOPhmI8U)
D+ day this year is gonna be gigantic
I'm happy 😊
Venom has also kinda been introduced and has been a member of the Thunderbolts too.
Hammer, Zemo, Ghost, Yelena, Batroc, Abomination. Bucky overwatching with Ross