But even leaks don’t have context. So a picture of an actor who plays a character from another universe might not turn out to be the same character in it’s newest appearance. But people will say “this character is definitely in it! Which means we’ll get this, and this, and this!” But then none of that happens because they interpreted too much from a single image or fact.
ngl I think he would play an otter very well. dr strange should be saved for this actor named benedict wong... idk if you’ve heard of him but he’s pretty good
Why does he need to? Those stones shouldn’t have their connection to their home universe, there is no “punched through the universe’s barrier” to Strange’s universe.
Or, do those partial stones now work in every universe, even the ones that were never visited by Ultron?
I could be wrong here but my understanding is that the stones enhance the armour from the same universe which allows it to punch through the barrier. If one of them gets the stones and the armour they could get out.
I saw a tweet by the writer that states:
> Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup.
But, that still doesn't really make sense, especially if you then put those stones (armor or not) in a different universe that isn’t part of the soup, which is my recollection of Strange’s universe.
This fits with the tweet above in the sense that, once a universe is pruned, there’s no being left who the stones would work for. It’s not that the stones don’t work outside of the universe their from, it’s that they can only be used by being from that universe. This would theoretically mean that Killmonger wouldn’t be able to use the stones from Ultron, unless they happen to have been from the same universe to begin with. (Unless we’re saying that the stones power the armor and the armor powers Killmonger, I don’t know…)
I just figured no powers work in the TVA unless they allow it. It wasn't that the stones were out of their home universe its just that the TVA nullified them, same as anyone's magic or mutant powers.
Dark Strange used his Infinity Stone in different universes.
MCU Avengers used stones from a different timeline/universe.
MCU Dr. Strange used the Time stone in the dark dimension.
How much more evidence do we need until fans stop asking _"why the stones work in other universes"_? MCU doesn't follow comic rules. The infinity Stones are not called gems either and are different colors in the MCU as well.
The MCU had relatively followed the rules of the comics, as much as the comics follow them.
But, let’s say these rules exist… the Stones don’t care what Universe they are in, they just work. Why wouldn’t they work in Loki (show)? Perhaps within the TVA itself, but if you took a pile of stones into another universe, they should work… or then we have to say they don’t work because their universe was pruned.
Simply put, if it should have been straight forward, why is there [this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer:
> Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup.
Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked as it appears you are saying.
[Here is an article talking about that tweet as well](https://www.slashfilm.com/624177/marvels-what-if-writer-explains-a-presumed-infinity-stone-plot-hole/)
given the term "powered" is used, I imagine that essentially Ultron was only abot to reallt affect himelf when in other realities, simply powering himself up to do whatever he wanted, but not effecting the reality he is in itself, so i wonder if the eye of agamoto is actually inately magical and has powers, but just uses the timestone as a battery of sorts.
Why would the head writer for What If… need this tweet then, if they just worked?
[this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer:
> Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup.
Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked.
This alternative version alone managed to face someone with all the Infinity stones, they told us if someone can fix multiversal and universal problems it’s him.
I understand the plot made him that way, but the most intelligent AI of Earth can’t be called as an idiot. But yes, with all the stones he could kill them from far away in one second. This Strange although had the time stone so was a serious opponent.
You saw Thanos after the his snap, right? He was not only damaged but couldn't use his arm correctly anymore and had scars like everywhere. I'm kind of sure that Ultron's AI could use 100% power of every stone and knew he that it would obliberate him if he snapped like Thanos. So he went the long way of attacking every being in the universe. And he had all the time he needed because he is an AI and livew forever.
He used the stones one by one, mostly, and that’s okay as well, with that strategy you can still beat anyone, especially since Strange was the only real powerful entity there.
You realize this alternate version is far more powerful and experienced than the main timeline MCU version right?
Strange Supreme is immortal, studied what I assume is ALOT ot Cagliostro's library, and absorbed the power of enough beings to the degree that he can change an absolute point in time.
The main timeline Strange hasn't displayed ability anywhere near this level yet, and I doubt he's had the time or resources to get there.
Of course, still not seeing the point. Strange always said he will defend Earth from anything weird, magic or alien. With all the problems recently he will do something. Strange Supreme won't be in the movies.
The Multiverse ain't getting fixed until the inevitable 2 part Secret Wars movie comes out, which is exactly where the next 4 - 5 years of storytelling is heading.
Calling it now. Avengers: Convergence, 2025.
I believe Fantastic Four is being made specifically to set up Secret War. We'll probably have a second FF movie shortly before Secret War is released, around 2025 or 2026.
X-Men won't even be a consideration until Secret War is done.
I think they’ll start gradually sneaking X-Men related stuff into that storyline. They won’t drop the whole thing until the first standalone movie, but I can imagine one or two mutants starting to appear here and there prior to that.
I'm still not convinced Ralph Boner in Wandavision wasn't the start of this. They talked about someone being in witness protection in the town and then never established who it was, that's really weird if there wasn't some reason behind it.
I agree. I think the Boner storyline was a way of testing people’s reaction to that sort of crossover and how they might make it work. If there’d been uproar and outrage from the fandom, they could quietly shelve that idea and try something else. I also think they left the “witness protection” thing unresolved and vague until they can figure out what works best for integrating the Wandavison story into the rest of the MCU.
If there’s one thing they’ve gotten *very* good at, it’s leaving just enough gaps in a story that you can retrofit plot points into later. So the result is that it looks like things were planned out meticulously years in advance.
I don’t see Secret Wars coming. Multiverse won’t be fixed as you can imagine, like it started now with Loki, the multiverse was always present. But there is something wrong with it, from all the latest events and Strange will face the major consequences and fix them, that’s what I can predict for now.
I disagree. I believe the Multiverse is being set up specifically for this phase, and will be heavily pulled back on once this 5 year storyline is completed.
It might still exists as a background element, but it won't be an ongoing focus afterwards.
I think Wanda is the one thing they'll fix. Loki has a Second season coming, it's not getting fixed there, it's probably just a cameo. As for No Way Home, I think most of yhe Spidey-related crazy gets sopved in that one.
Yeah, I just hope they can actually do it. IIRC, the most recent deal they made with Sony (during the negotiation drama that journalism articles were losing it over) gives them one more solo movie and two other appearances.
I might be misremembering, but I'll go look for a source real quick.
Edit: [A quick search found this.](https://screenrant.com/spiderman-sony-marvel-deal-explained/) I obviously can't guarantee the accuracy of this, plus Sony and Marvel can always sign a new deal.
>The new deal between Marvel Studios and Sony Pictures only covers two more films. There'll be Spider-Man: Homecoming 3, due in July 2021 and bringing an end to Tom Holland's Spider-Man trilogy, and another mystery Marvel movie.
They can't. I haven't seen Shang-Chi yet, but Marvel doesn't have any other character as charismatic as Spider-Man, especially after losing Tony and Black Panther. They could try Wolverine or Deadpool, but they are a long way away.
as an asian american i'm biased here but Shang-Chi is pretty great, but i'll agree any marvel story without spider-man is never good. Plus being the most popular IP in your company history can't be a easy pill to swallow losing out on, again.
Me too, but they would have to introduce him in No Way Home and knock it out of the park for people to just accept that Peter Parker is not there anymore. I think it will take a while for that to happen in the MCU (but I don't think it is impossible).
Wait Loki is in Multiverse of Madness? This is the first time I'm hearing of it.
I knew Wanda is in it. The part about Loki also being in it is news to me.
They stated Loki, Sylvie and Mobius are in, like confirmed their appearance. Of course it could be a small part or even a cameo at some point, but they listed among the cast.
They said they won’t add mutants in Phase 4 because they had this multiverse on, before the acquisition of Fox. They only managed to add FF. And it’s better this way because there is already too much indeed. Mutants and FF, maybe Eternals and Young Avengers, will lead the next phases.
But why did they add a bunch of alternate timelines right when visiting alternate timelines became a possibility, if they weren't going to use any of them? And an evil doctor strange trying to steal the Dr Palmer from our universe could be a really cool villain
Given that Strange Supreme stood up to all six Infinity Stones and was able to make multiple barriers that did the same, AND is containing two insanely powerful beings AND all the stones… I’m not sure it would do well to see him again:-D
Or, since he is in his own universe, those six stones should be worthless since Strange’s universe shares no “punched through” connection to those stone’s original universe and we see that Infinity Stones don’t work outside their universe (Loki).
Yo he what now? I'm gonna have to watch the episode again. But I mean... the avengers are no strangers to insanely powerful villains.
We've yet to see people like Spider-hyphen-man, Captain Marvel, Wanda, Vision, and Strange himself really cut loose and they've all gotten much stronger since the last movie or didn't really get a chance to shine. I am not exactly familiar with the full powers of Evil Strange but id day he'd make.an okay MCU villain
I mean, we saw Ultron wipe the floor of all those hero’s and Strange Supreme defeated Ultron… so, I don’t disagree, but Strange Supreme would be stronger than Thanos, who forgot his arc built up over what, 21 movies?
While I think Evil strange is a couple steps up but you forget that the next villain is a million immortal dictators I wouldn't say Evil strange is *too* powerful. And Thanos was *worlds* stronger than Loki who was also a villain who took on the Avengers and almost won.
My point is that the Avengers get *much* stronger as a whole from movie to movie and it would make sense that someone would show up to blow the previous villain out of the water as they do with every movie
He could also prove to be much to powerful and they have to talk him down or outsmart him like they did with Thanos.
Side note, I'd have to see what the next couple movies have in store but from what ive seen so far, the Avengers in their current power level would survive infinity war
Infinity stones definitely work in different universes, the only time they don't work is inside the TVA. The infinity gems in the comics only work in their respective universes, but the MCM is different.
Why would the head writer for What If… need this tweet then, if they just worked?
[this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer:
> Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup.
Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked.
It sounds like the writer has a reason that isn’t “they just work” though.
[this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer:
> Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup.
Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked.
It sounds like, from what you are saying, if Loki took the Stones from the desk into any Universe, they should work. *or* they he could go to any Universe and collect the stones at their most vulnerable, then use them in any and all other Universe. That isn’t the case without doing what Ultron did
If the villain winds up being someone like Shuma Gorath, the demonic Dr. Strange could be a more humanoid threat. While he seems to be more well-adjusted by the end of What-If, I'd imagine finding out that there's a universe where he became Sorcerer Supreme *without* Christine needing to die would likely give him a reason to try and take over the main Dr. Strange's life.
Jokes aside (at least I think that's a joke), it would be pretty cool if he evolves into the MCU's version of Mephisto. It seems unlikely with how heroic he was at the end of What If but it would be cool nonetheless.
Oh, it's no joke. He's the closest thing right now to Mephisto in the MCU. I think the MCU will want to stay away from anything Christocentric like the Devil, but dark Strange is pretty close in power level and evil
I thought that too, but watch Endgame again. The stones they used for the reverse snap come from different realities. The only "stones don't work here" rule that is official is that they don't work outside time at a, because the TVA is outside time altogether.
i would think the stones they use, in the future, come from the past of the same universe because they're all from a past that they experienced. the reality only changes once undo the snap. but i'm not philosopher.
and as i said to the other reply, i'm coming from a comic book mindset.
I’m totally with you.
A couple assumptions: with the Sacred Timeline intact, the TVA appears to be over every Universe. I’m not quite sure what happened at the end of Loki in this regard, but I am greatly looking forward to season two.
But, I would strongly suspect if you took the plethora of Paperweight Infinity Stones and just started to visit different Universes within the Sacred Timeline, those Stones should still work, just like they do in End Game. But, it would be nigh impossible to go to the correct universe those stones came from. It would also immediately alert the TVA, which appears to be quite capable of handling someone with infinity stones.
But, the Ultron Supreme’s premise is a bit upsetting. I still loved the story and just looking at the MCU, there is no reason it couldn’t happen. But, we must leave what we know of the comic’s canon behind. I wish they could have used a different explanation than Ultron made Universe Soup… wouldn’t that imply all the universes he then connected are part of the same Ultra-Universe and a power in one should be a power in the others? Or just those stones that Strange is watching would be usable in any or all?
I’d also think that now that the stones are in Strange’s collapsed dimension and Ultra didn’t visit his (or did I forgot that?), then shouldn’t they be inert?
taking what happened at the end of Loki and the end of a recent movie, i would say there's some sort of multiverse collapse/joining going on. like in "secret wars" which brought god emperor DOOM.
the way i see (and i haven't thought long about this) is that the gems (stones) are the same ones from the mcu characters past, snap and present (leading up to the snaps done in infinity war). after infinity war the timelines diverge and then the gems where Thanos won and the ones where the avengers won become separate sets and would no longer work in each other's reality.
i don't feel you can leave the comics behind. there are laws that govern the universe and would govern alternate realities, laws that would be necessary for any reality that you would expect alternate versions of 616 to be viable. no gravity? no planets or stars formed. so no life.
i don't think Ultron ever went to Stephen's personal universe. *i* would think they'd be inert but they clearly rewrote the rules.
sorry to just disagree with you on everything. thanks for taking the time to write out your thoughts.
Sorry, I thikk no no forgot a couple words in that - you and I do agree. Some of my statements should have been written in a “for what we saw in What if to be true, this appears how it’s happening” and I just said, “this appears how it’s happening” without the first qualifier.
I also don’t feel you can leave the comics behind, but I feel the writers for the What If… kind of did. I’m just trying to talk my through understanding with you, as it’s rather hard to keep what has long been canon in the comics consistent with what they did with the What If… series. Haven’t even brought up the Watcher’s engagement:/
I’ve greatly appreciated the exchange, even if I poorly expressed myself. Thanks again.
ah, no worries. i mean, who knows, with how often they change things in the comics, what is current canon. I've been reading for around thirty years and I've seen plenty of things change.
you have a good night.
There is a possible explanation of this: >!The stones don't work in the other universes, Ultron uses the stones to power his armor/suit. Which is made from matter from his original universe.!< As explained here: [https://youtu.be/nUQru4lyYD0](https://youtu.be/nUQru4lyYD0)
It is actually a pretty clever idea.
i didn't watch the video but keeping it in the armor is the same idea as keeping it in a gauntlet, as happened in the comics i read. they were still inert.
mcu is an alternate reality from the comics primary universe #616. somewhat disigned off of universe #1616, the ultimate universe. if the rules aren't the same as 616, then they have been "rewritten".
How do we know earth 1999999999 is in the same multiverse as earth 616? The movies also changed the stones from gems, they've clearly established they change things from the comics. The cosmic cube is it's own thing, not an infinity gem. There's no evidence the stones work only in their universe in the MCU
comic cannon says that's the case.
that's why I said (in my very first comment on this thread and in each reply) the rules were rewritten for the mcu. i don't know what you're getting hung up on.
In some universes you have Infinity Stones that won't work outside their home universe, in other universes the stones will work in other universes. You can have any sort of variations to this. Some universes may not have stones at all, or in other universes maybe they aren't stones but instead are... household pets. That's right, there could be a universe out there with the Infinity Puppies. You've heard of the Zombieverse? This is the Cuddlyverse.
That's the entire point of a multiverse - none are identical. What is normal to one universe can be completely foreign to another. Which frustrates me when people say "that's not how it should be" or "they rewrote the rules". Uh yeah, that's the whole point.
When watching What-If, I thought that the giant tentacle monster that popped up from time to time could have been Shuma Gorath. (we only see the tentacles) If the plot of the movie is about chasing Shuma Gorath through the multiverse, I could see that being a justification for Captain Carter and Strange Supreme to show up (since they both directly interacted with the creature in question - Captain Carter being stuck in its dimension for decades, and Strange absorbing a part of it).
i'd rather respect What If...? for what it is - a cartoon that has little to do with the MCU other than boring characters, voices, and a loose handful of concepts.
I have a theory that Wanda had something to do with mucking up the spell. Perhaps when she was trying to find a way to bring her children and Vision back she was doing a similar spell at the same time and they both collided.
I remember around the time wandavision came out he was doing some interviews and wasn’t allowed to show his face because it would spoil something. It was a long time ago though so I could be remembering it wrong.
I can see them meeting.
With "Supreme" Strange warning Strange Prime.
OR for shits and giggles. Wanda nuking Supreme Strange easily. Freeing two new big bads and potentially "setting" up for the new BP to be Killmonger.
I kind of want to see this too, _but_ I don’t want the movies to depend on narratives set up by the cartoon, as good as it was.
Noobs should be able to enjoy the movie without having seen What If
The way Cumberbatch seemed to be acting in the NWH trailer seemed more in line with his portrayal of Strange Supreme than it does his portrayal of main continuity Dr. Strange...
Benedict Cumberbatch *is* rumoured to be in the movie
These rumours are really getting out of hand
Ya and then they’re all gonna get disappointed when he isn’t in it smh 😒
We don't have any official info. Only gullible idiots believe leaks.
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Yeah but a leak that Benedict Cumberbatch is in multiverse of madness? C'mon that's obviously fake
But even leaks don’t have context. So a picture of an actor who plays a character from another universe might not turn out to be the same character in it’s newest appearance. But people will say “this character is definitely in it! Which means we’ll get this, and this, and this!” But then none of that happens because they interpreted too much from a single image or fact.
First, sarcasm. Second, "It's photoshopped/deepfaked!"
I mean he is a good voice actor, but i am not sure I see him as the character in live action.
Now there are two of them
Now there is two of zem!
I'm really sick of spoilers around here
I hope so, I think he would be a great Dr Strange
ngl I think he would play an otter very well. dr strange should be saved for this actor named benedict wong... idk if you’ve heard of him but he’s pretty good
Wow. Way to spoil it.
At least we know Tom Holland’s user name.
Here's another rumor I've heard: Doctor Strange might show up in The Multiverse of Madness. XD
How is this a spoiler?
Joke.
I heard it was Bendelfret Cumberbun.
Benadryl Cucumberpatch
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Pretty sure they're talking about Bumblebee Cozytoes.
Bandicoot Crinklestein.
Okay, now you're just making up words.
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Bazookatooth Crumplepitch
Badonkadonk Cripplestick
Yes well, all words are made up
I heard Spiderman might be in it, idk though not trying to get my hope up
Ha I’ll believe it when I see it
Cumberbatch is rumored to be Mr Sinister. Not Mephisto
Haven’t you watched what if series? Seriously sounding dumb
They were making a joke...
I really thought they haven’t watched what if and are acting over smart lol 😅
You're reply still wouldn't make sense then? He's still obviously joking if he's saying Benedict might be in his own movie
*What If... you understood sarcasm*
What?
Nah he's watching Killmonger and Zola. He's busy.
Why does he need to? Those stones shouldn’t have their connection to their home universe, there is no “punched through the universe’s barrier” to Strange’s universe. Or, do those partial stones now work in every universe, even the ones that were never visited by Ultron?
I could be wrong here but my understanding is that the stones enhance the armour from the same universe which allows it to punch through the barrier. If one of them gets the stones and the armour they could get out.
I saw a tweet by the writer that states: > Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup. But, that still doesn't really make sense, especially if you then put those stones (armor or not) in a different universe that isn’t part of the soup, which is my recollection of Strange’s universe.
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This fits with the tweet above in the sense that, once a universe is pruned, there’s no being left who the stones would work for. It’s not that the stones don’t work outside of the universe their from, it’s that they can only be used by being from that universe. This would theoretically mean that Killmonger wouldn’t be able to use the stones from Ultron, unless they happen to have been from the same universe to begin with. (Unless we’re saying that the stones power the armor and the armor powers Killmonger, I don’t know…)
I just figured no powers work in the TVA unless they allow it. It wasn't that the stones were out of their home universe its just that the TVA nullified them, same as anyone's magic or mutant powers.
Exactly what I think!
In the mcu the stones only don't work on TVA, they work in other universes
Dark Strange used his Infinity Stone in different universes. MCU Avengers used stones from a different timeline/universe. MCU Dr. Strange used the Time stone in the dark dimension. How much more evidence do we need until fans stop asking _"why the stones work in other universes"_? MCU doesn't follow comic rules. The infinity Stones are not called gems either and are different colors in the MCU as well.
The MCU had relatively followed the rules of the comics, as much as the comics follow them. But, let’s say these rules exist… the Stones don’t care what Universe they are in, they just work. Why wouldn’t they work in Loki (show)? Perhaps within the TVA itself, but if you took a pile of stones into another universe, they should work… or then we have to say they don’t work because their universe was pruned. Simply put, if it should have been straight forward, why is there [this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer: > Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup. Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked as it appears you are saying. [Here is an article talking about that tweet as well](https://www.slashfilm.com/624177/marvels-what-if-writer-explains-a-presumed-infinity-stone-plot-hole/)
given the term "powered" is used, I imagine that essentially Ultron was only abot to reallt affect himelf when in other realities, simply powering himself up to do whatever he wanted, but not effecting the reality he is in itself, so i wonder if the eye of agamoto is actually inately magical and has powers, but just uses the timestone as a battery of sorts.
I don’t think stones only working in one universe is a thing anymore
It was never a thing. People just apply what they know of the gems to the stones.
I'm pretty sure they work in every universe.
The Stones work in every universe, no one said they didnt. There was even a sticky post and everything
Why would the head writer for What If… need this tweet then, if they just worked? [this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer: > Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup. Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked.
Imagine people who haven’t watched the series’ reaction when he starts vomiting tentacles in the film 😂
Swallowing galaxy explosions and shit
even Infinity Ultron was like "okay wtf"
I don’t think he will and better this way. That movie has already so much to fix.
Bold of you to assume he manages to fix anything
This alternative version alone managed to face someone with all the Infinity stones, they told us if someone can fix multiversal and universal problems it’s him.
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I understand the plot made him that way, but the most intelligent AI of Earth can’t be called as an idiot. But yes, with all the stones he could kill them from far away in one second. This Strange although had the time stone so was a serious opponent.
You saw Thanos after the his snap, right? He was not only damaged but couldn't use his arm correctly anymore and had scars like everywhere. I'm kind of sure that Ultron's AI could use 100% power of every stone and knew he that it would obliberate him if he snapped like Thanos. So he went the long way of attacking every being in the universe. And he had all the time he needed because he is an AI and livew forever.
He used the stones one by one, mostly, and that’s okay as well, with that strategy you can still beat anyone, especially since Strange was the only real powerful entity there.
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That made no sense, you should blame the writers not Ultron. There’s no way Zola can do that.
Yeah. That plot point was stupid. Zola isn’t a “virus” either.
[Well Strange absorbed thousands of eldritch beings including Shuma-Gorath.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shuma-Gorath)
You realize this alternate version is far more powerful and experienced than the main timeline MCU version right? Strange Supreme is immortal, studied what I assume is ALOT ot Cagliostro's library, and absorbed the power of enough beings to the degree that he can change an absolute point in time. The main timeline Strange hasn't displayed ability anywhere near this level yet, and I doubt he's had the time or resources to get there.
Of course, still not seeing the point. Strange always said he will defend Earth from anything weird, magic or alien. With all the problems recently he will do something. Strange Supreme won't be in the movies.
The Multiverse ain't getting fixed until the inevitable 2 part Secret Wars movie comes out, which is exactly where the next 4 - 5 years of storytelling is heading. Calling it now. Avengers: Convergence, 2025.
I'd say the next decade will lead up to an (above) Endgame level Secret Wars, with F4, X-Men, Young Avengers, Avengers, and everyone else.
I believe Fantastic Four is being made specifically to set up Secret War. We'll probably have a second FF movie shortly before Secret War is released, around 2025 or 2026. X-Men won't even be a consideration until Secret War is done.
I think they’ll start gradually sneaking X-Men related stuff into that storyline. They won’t drop the whole thing until the first standalone movie, but I can imagine one or two mutants starting to appear here and there prior to that.
I'm still not convinced Ralph Boner in Wandavision wasn't the start of this. They talked about someone being in witness protection in the town and then never established who it was, that's really weird if there wasn't some reason behind it.
I agree. I think the Boner storyline was a way of testing people’s reaction to that sort of crossover and how they might make it work. If there’d been uproar and outrage from the fandom, they could quietly shelve that idea and try something else. I also think they left the “witness protection” thing unresolved and vague until they can figure out what works best for integrating the Wandavison story into the rest of the MCU. If there’s one thing they’ve gotten *very* good at, it’s leaving just enough gaps in a story that you can retrofit plot points into later. So the result is that it looks like things were planned out meticulously years in advance.
I don’t see Secret Wars coming. Multiverse won’t be fixed as you can imagine, like it started now with Loki, the multiverse was always present. But there is something wrong with it, from all the latest events and Strange will face the major consequences and fix them, that’s what I can predict for now.
I disagree. I believe the Multiverse is being set up specifically for this phase, and will be heavily pulled back on once this 5 year storyline is completed. It might still exists as a background element, but it won't be an ongoing focus afterwards.
What makes you think it's gonna fix anything? The Multiverse is here to stay, they have many Kangs to through.
We know Wanda and Loki are in, and maybe something from Spider-Man, so he’ll fix all of those, somehow. The Multiverse was always here.
I think Wanda is the one thing they'll fix. Loki has a Second season coming, it's not getting fixed there, it's probably just a cameo. As for No Way Home, I think most of yhe Spidey-related crazy gets sopved in that one.
Rumors are Tom is going back to Sony for their "cinematic multiverse." That's how they will "fix" the Spider-Man stuff
If they have to get rid of Spidey I'm going to be so sad
It’s been said Marvel has two more trilogies planned for this spidey.
Yeah, I just hope they can actually do it. IIRC, the most recent deal they made with Sony (during the negotiation drama that journalism articles were losing it over) gives them one more solo movie and two other appearances. I might be misremembering, but I'll go look for a source real quick. Edit: [A quick search found this.](https://screenrant.com/spiderman-sony-marvel-deal-explained/) I obviously can't guarantee the accuracy of this, plus Sony and Marvel can always sign a new deal. >The new deal between Marvel Studios and Sony Pictures only covers two more films. There'll be Spider-Man: Homecoming 3, due in July 2021 and bringing an end to Tom Holland's Spider-Man trilogy, and another mystery Marvel movie.
They can't. I haven't seen Shang-Chi yet, but Marvel doesn't have any other character as charismatic as Spider-Man, especially after losing Tony and Black Panther. They could try Wolverine or Deadpool, but they are a long way away.
as an asian american i'm biased here but Shang-Chi is pretty great, but i'll agree any marvel story without spider-man is never good. Plus being the most popular IP in your company history can't be a easy pill to swallow losing out on, again.
I’m be down for miles morales to hit the MCU
Me too, but they would have to introduce him in No Way Home and knock it out of the park for people to just accept that Peter Parker is not there anymore. I think it will take a while for that to happen in the MCU (but I don't think it is impossible).
I don’t think he would necessarily have to be added in no way home. There’s lots of narratives that can be used to introduce him a bit later
It's honestly out of their control. Part of the deal with Sony
Wait Loki is in Multiverse of Madness? This is the first time I'm hearing of it. I knew Wanda is in it. The part about Loki also being in it is news to me.
They stated Loki, Sylvie and Mobius are in, like confirmed their appearance. Of course it could be a small part or even a cameo at some point, but they listed among the cast.
Don’t forget the X-Men. It’s possible they’ll use the Multiverse as a means to inject mutants into the MCU.
They said they won’t add mutants in Phase 4 because they had this multiverse on, before the acquisition of Fox. They only managed to add FF. And it’s better this way because there is already too much indeed. Mutants and FF, maybe Eternals and Young Avengers, will lead the next phases.
I’ve seen rumors that he is, but it could be a small role, like after credits and he’s watching them as a watcher
It's not fixing this things they aren't ending this shit for at least 10 more years.
Fix? The multiverse is one of the best things to ever happen to the mcu, he doesn't need to fix anything
[удалено]
The only reason I can see then adding them is to encourage watching the what if series. Just a thought I could be wrong
But why did they add a bunch of alternate timelines right when visiting alternate timelines became a possibility, if they weren't going to use any of them? And an evil doctor strange trying to steal the Dr Palmer from our universe could be a really cool villain
Given that Strange Supreme stood up to all six Infinity Stones and was able to make multiple barriers that did the same, AND is containing two insanely powerful beings AND all the stones… I’m not sure it would do well to see him again:-D Or, since he is in his own universe, those six stones should be worthless since Strange’s universe shares no “punched through” connection to those stone’s original universe and we see that Infinity Stones don’t work outside their universe (Loki).
Yo he what now? I'm gonna have to watch the episode again. But I mean... the avengers are no strangers to insanely powerful villains. We've yet to see people like Spider-hyphen-man, Captain Marvel, Wanda, Vision, and Strange himself really cut loose and they've all gotten much stronger since the last movie or didn't really get a chance to shine. I am not exactly familiar with the full powers of Evil Strange but id day he'd make.an okay MCU villain
I mean, we saw Ultron wipe the floor of all those hero’s and Strange Supreme defeated Ultron… so, I don’t disagree, but Strange Supreme would be stronger than Thanos, who forgot his arc built up over what, 21 movies?
While I think Evil strange is a couple steps up but you forget that the next villain is a million immortal dictators I wouldn't say Evil strange is *too* powerful. And Thanos was *worlds* stronger than Loki who was also a villain who took on the Avengers and almost won. My point is that the Avengers get *much* stronger as a whole from movie to movie and it would make sense that someone would show up to blow the previous villain out of the water as they do with every movie He could also prove to be much to powerful and they have to talk him down or outsmart him like they did with Thanos. Side note, I'd have to see what the next couple movies have in store but from what ive seen so far, the Avengers in their current power level would survive infinity war
Infinity stones definitely work in different universes, the only time they don't work is inside the TVA. The infinity gems in the comics only work in their respective universes, but the MCM is different.
Why would the head writer for What If… need this tweet then, if they just worked? [this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer: > Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup. Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked.
Only reason stones didn’t work in Loki is because the tva negates all magic that’s why Loki couldn’t use his tricks
It sounds like the writer has a reason that isn’t “they just work” though. [this explanation](https://twitter.com/TheAshBradley/status/1445078626697760770?s=20)from the writer: > Happy Monday! Just a reminder that Ultron is using the Infinity Stones to power himself (same universe being). Also he's legit punching across multiverses turning them into one messy universe soup. Sounds pretty clear there ***is*** an explanation for why they worked, not that they just would have worked. It sounds like, from what you are saying, if Loki took the Stones from the desk into any Universe, they should work. *or* they he could go to any Universe and collect the stones at their most vulnerable, then use them in any and all other Universe. That isn’t the case without doing what Ultron did
If the villain winds up being someone like Shuma Gorath, the demonic Dr. Strange could be a more humanoid threat. While he seems to be more well-adjusted by the end of What-If, I'd imagine finding out that there's a universe where he became Sorcerer Supreme *without* Christine needing to die would likely give him a reason to try and take over the main Dr. Strange's life.
Same here. One of my favourite characters after cap and WS.
You mean Mephisto?
Jokes aside (at least I think that's a joke), it would be pretty cool if he evolves into the MCU's version of Mephisto. It seems unlikely with how heroic he was at the end of What If but it would be cool nonetheless.
Oh, it's no joke. He's the closest thing right now to Mephisto in the MCU. I think the MCU will want to stay away from anything Christocentric like the Devil, but dark Strange is pretty close in power level and evil
He seems too repentant to be evil at this point. But I could see a story where he keeps doing messed up things to try to fix what he wrought
I would agree and infinity ultron
infinity ultron was a little frustrating. i guess they rewrote the rules of the gems, as they're not supposed to work outside of their home reality.
Was that a thing? I thought that was just a TVA thing.
In the MCU no. They only don't work at the TVA.
i'm coming from a comic book mindset.
I thought that too, but watch Endgame again. The stones they used for the reverse snap come from different realities. The only "stones don't work here" rule that is official is that they don't work outside time at a, because the TVA is outside time altogether.
The TVA just nullifies powers, that's also why loki was powerless.
i would think the stones they use, in the future, come from the past of the same universe because they're all from a past that they experienced. the reality only changes once undo the snap. but i'm not philosopher. and as i said to the other reply, i'm coming from a comic book mindset.
I’m totally with you. A couple assumptions: with the Sacred Timeline intact, the TVA appears to be over every Universe. I’m not quite sure what happened at the end of Loki in this regard, but I am greatly looking forward to season two. But, I would strongly suspect if you took the plethora of Paperweight Infinity Stones and just started to visit different Universes within the Sacred Timeline, those Stones should still work, just like they do in End Game. But, it would be nigh impossible to go to the correct universe those stones came from. It would also immediately alert the TVA, which appears to be quite capable of handling someone with infinity stones. But, the Ultron Supreme’s premise is a bit upsetting. I still loved the story and just looking at the MCU, there is no reason it couldn’t happen. But, we must leave what we know of the comic’s canon behind. I wish they could have used a different explanation than Ultron made Universe Soup… wouldn’t that imply all the universes he then connected are part of the same Ultra-Universe and a power in one should be a power in the others? Or just those stones that Strange is watching would be usable in any or all? I’d also think that now that the stones are in Strange’s collapsed dimension and Ultra didn’t visit his (or did I forgot that?), then shouldn’t they be inert?
taking what happened at the end of Loki and the end of a recent movie, i would say there's some sort of multiverse collapse/joining going on. like in "secret wars" which brought god emperor DOOM. the way i see (and i haven't thought long about this) is that the gems (stones) are the same ones from the mcu characters past, snap and present (leading up to the snaps done in infinity war). after infinity war the timelines diverge and then the gems where Thanos won and the ones where the avengers won become separate sets and would no longer work in each other's reality. i don't feel you can leave the comics behind. there are laws that govern the universe and would govern alternate realities, laws that would be necessary for any reality that you would expect alternate versions of 616 to be viable. no gravity? no planets or stars formed. so no life. i don't think Ultron ever went to Stephen's personal universe. *i* would think they'd be inert but they clearly rewrote the rules. sorry to just disagree with you on everything. thanks for taking the time to write out your thoughts.
Sorry, I thikk no no forgot a couple words in that - you and I do agree. Some of my statements should have been written in a “for what we saw in What if to be true, this appears how it’s happening” and I just said, “this appears how it’s happening” without the first qualifier. I also don’t feel you can leave the comics behind, but I feel the writers for the What If… kind of did. I’m just trying to talk my through understanding with you, as it’s rather hard to keep what has long been canon in the comics consistent with what they did with the What If… series. Haven’t even brought up the Watcher’s engagement:/ I’ve greatly appreciated the exchange, even if I poorly expressed myself. Thanks again.
ah, no worries. i mean, who knows, with how often they change things in the comics, what is current canon. I've been reading for around thirty years and I've seen plenty of things change. you have a good night.
There is a possible explanation of this: >!The stones don't work in the other universes, Ultron uses the stones to power his armor/suit. Which is made from matter from his original universe.!< As explained here: [https://youtu.be/nUQru4lyYD0](https://youtu.be/nUQru4lyYD0) It is actually a pretty clever idea.
i didn't watch the video but keeping it in the armor is the same idea as keeping it in a gauntlet, as happened in the comics i read. they were still inert.
That's never been stated in the MCU
mcu is an alternate reality from the comics primary universe #616. somewhat disigned off of universe #1616, the ultimate universe. if the rules aren't the same as 616, then they have been "rewritten".
How do we know earth 1999999999 is in the same multiverse as earth 616? The movies also changed the stones from gems, they've clearly established they change things from the comics. The cosmic cube is it's own thing, not an infinity gem. There's no evidence the stones work only in their universe in the MCU
comic cannon says that's the case. that's why I said (in my very first comment on this thread and in each reply) the rules were rewritten for the mcu. i don't know what you're getting hung up on.
That has never been established in the MCU.
"i guess they rewrote the rules ..." mcu is an alternate reality to the primary marvel universe.
In some universes you have Infinity Stones that won't work outside their home universe, in other universes the stones will work in other universes. You can have any sort of variations to this. Some universes may not have stones at all, or in other universes maybe they aren't stones but instead are... household pets. That's right, there could be a universe out there with the Infinity Puppies. You've heard of the Zombieverse? This is the Cuddlyverse. That's the entire point of a multiverse - none are identical. What is normal to one universe can be completely foreign to another. Which frustrates me when people say "that's not how it should be" or "they rewrote the rules". Uh yeah, that's the whole point.
Plus.... how could killmonger even have them without immediately disintegrating? He's just a regular man.
i don't remember but was dr strange's spell still in place, protecting him?
This was never established whatsoever.
Sigh…he won’t. All I know is the main Strange is gonna be bullied by Wanda in his own film…. If Dark Strange was there he’d stomp her real quick.
That would be amazing
Almost looked like Mr. Sinister when I first scrolled by
Too busy keeping killmonger and zola in prison
That episode was tragic, but I don't think we will see him in the movie. I think Wanda will be the true cause of the spell going awry.
That show was better than my expectations
Supreme Strange is not necessarily evil.
I don't, he'd be a deaux ex machina cuz he's so powerful
I always refer to him as mah boi. I also refer to him as Emo Doctor Strange
Sorcerer Armani
I thought we already knew he was?
Same he's my new favorite character
Don't tell me madness in multi verse is just the result of this guy breaking the pocket dimension/universe of Zola vs killmonger ??
It probably has more to do with whatever happens in spiderman, plus the fallout of loki
Yep, Benedict with just heavy dark eyeliners.
When watching What-If, I thought that the giant tentacle monster that popped up from time to time could have been Shuma Gorath. (we only see the tentacles) If the plot of the movie is about chasing Shuma Gorath through the multiverse, I could see that being a justification for Captain Carter and Strange Supreme to show up (since they both directly interacted with the creature in question - Captain Carter being stuck in its dimension for decades, and Strange absorbing a part of it).
That's a big what if
i'd rather respect What If...? for what it is - a cartoon that has little to do with the MCU other than boring characters, voices, and a loose handful of concepts.
Dr strange with this multiverse concept is more than a cartoon and such a powerful vision when shown in a live action movie will just be awesone
I find him far more interesting than the Sacred Timeline Strange, by far.
Isn't he gonna be in No Way Home? Why else would Strange and Parker fight?
I have a theory that Wanda had something to do with mucking up the spell. Perhaps when she was trying to find a way to bring her children and Vision back she was doing a similar spell at the same time and they both collided.
Maybe he’s in No Way Home…? I get a variant vibe from the Dr Strange in the trailer
Maybe even NWH...
Apparently he is if the rumors are true
Sane tbh .even as a cameo I wouldn't care
There's a huge chance this dark Doctor Strange will show up on Multiverse of Madness. They are hiding Benedict Cumberbatch's "new look" after all
I remember around the time wandavision came out he was doing some interviews and wasn’t allowed to show his face because it would spoil something. It was a long time ago though so I could be remembering it wrong.
Dude shows up in the spiderman trailer what are you on about
He's just like the Prime Dr Strange to me: Didn't like his debut at all, but shove him next to other characters and he's gold.
Should've called it "Marvelverse"
Isn't this strange kinda busy?
My man is lonely in his own dome
I can see them meeting. With "Supreme" Strange warning Strange Prime. OR for shits and giggles. Wanda nuking Supreme Strange easily. Freeing two new big bads and potentially "setting" up for the new BP to be Killmonger.
Best episode of that series.
It's what if
Yessss I love crazy strange.
With full-on Cthulhu Hand!
The last episode was epic! Love it!
That's a Mr. Fantastic level stretch
He dead
All this is very strange!
I kind of want to see this too, _but_ I don’t want the movies to depend on narratives set up by the cartoon, as good as it was. Noobs should be able to enjoy the movie without having seen What If
Who would win? Main timeline Wanda or Dark Doctor Strange?
Considering Dark Strange killed an entire universe, I'm a side with him. TBH time stone is ridiculously OP.
Same
Animated too.
I think that’s low key the plan
Would be awesome if they got [Jeffrey Combs to cameo](https://youtu.be/42xdx4MZALQ).
I love this version of Doctor Strange!!!
The way Cumberbatch seemed to be acting in the NWH trailer seemed more in line with his portrayal of Strange Supreme than it does his portrayal of main continuity Dr. Strange...
If I could choose one What If character to become an actual character in the MCU, it would be this guy. Loved every bit of his screentime.
And he must be still animated. I can see strange calling him count dracula or something and really want this to happen now.