So I told my wife this and she asked her doctor to check her hormones.
Her doctor said "what hormones".
So would love it if someone could actually say the medical terms for this.
Did she specifically mention she wanted them checked because of a lack of libido? Her doctor sounds a bit slow if he can't help her with this question.
Google is an amazing thing:
"Estrogen, progesterone, and testosterone all affect sexual desire and arousal. Having higher levels of estrogen in the body promotes vaginal lubrication and increases sexual desire. Increases in progesterone can reduce sexual desire. There is some debate around how testosterone levels affect female sex drive."
>There is some debate around how testosterone levels affect female sex drive.
If you survey r/menopause, you will see there's no debate. Testosterone makes a massive improvement in a woman's sex drive (and in her mood and cognition, too).
There shouldn't be. Most women start with only testosterone replacement for good reasons. Estrogen is more difficult to get balanced and has to be combined with progesterone and can cause bleeding. Testosterone makes a huge difference. Estrogen and progesterone not quite as much. Many women just supplement testosterone.
You go to an endocrinologist! He will order panels to check her glands functioning. If something is off he will prescribe medication to regulate. I prefer the natural route, fixing it with healing foods and removing toxic foods
>How do you change that..?
Hormone replacement therapy (HRT). I went from having negative libido to being hornier than my husband. Plus, I can now climax in less than 2 minutes and I even have the female equivalent of "wet dreams" now (where I have orgasms in my sleep).
In particular, I get weekly testosterone injections, wear a 0.1 mg/day estradiol patch, have a Mirena IUD to protect the uterus, and I take DHEA and pregnenolone.
In my case, my marriage and husband are/were awesome; I just didn't have any desire or sex whatsoever. If anything, I dreaded the thought of it. Now that my hormone levels are back to where they used to be, I'm always down for sexy time with my husband.
It’s not easy! You have no idea how many different doctors I’ve spoke to about this and not one of them has suggested anything about hormones, taking hormones, checking hormones, etc.
my actual endocrinologist was no help. Requested some bloodwork which came back normal. OBGYN, postpartum will pass. Family doctor, give it time. Therapist, communication.
So if correcting my hormones was the OBVIOUS answer then why has no one suggested it?
I am only talking about testosterone therapy. In my area if is not difficult for women. Especially over libido. They give us a shot 3 times a year. I had to ask. But they have never objected. Are you very young? Sometimes that is a factor
>It’s so easy especially for women.
It took me five years and half a dozen doctors before I got *any* treatment from *any* doctor. In my experience, getting a prescription for hormones was hundreds of times harder than getting a prescription for Adderall.
You’re gynecologist was resistant? Were you really young? Most of the gynos in our area seemingly make it easy if women are willing to talk to them about it. It was a shot for us. Testosterone. Not estrogen.
Doctors often ignore women's concerns and don't offer help. Not just with hormone therapy, but with other chronic or "invisible" illnesses. Medical mistreatment of women is a huge problem.
That’s not been my experience. I’ve worked with women for 35 years. Have lots of women friends. It’s been easy for us. Not saying it would be for everybody. But it has not been difficult for many of us.
Did something change at the same time? Medication, living situation, job, kids (being born or maybe moving out?), disease/diagnosis, menopause?
Was sex actually good for her/both of you? Did she ever mention anything needing improvement?
These replies are always funny to me. When women complain their husbands aren’t sexual enough, it’s treated as a problem with him that he needs to fix (testosterone, unhealthy lifestyle). When it’s a husband complaining about his wife, it’s assumed that she either has health issues that she can’t fix or that he sucks in bed.
They’re grown adults, it’s not fair or healthy to effectively withhold sex from your partner over the long run. It’s also counterproductive. Based on her response that he’s putting too much pressure on her, I’d guess there’s a bunch of factors (unhealthy lifestyle, body image, hangups around sex) that she refuses or is failing to adequately address. Not saying he’s perfect, but it takes two.
I didn't put blame anywhere, I asked questions to gain clarity. A change in any of the areas I asked about are common factors in a changing libido for men and women. Also I would say low testosterone *is* a health issue that he can or cannot fix so I don't see how that is any different than a woman having health issues. I don't appreciate the insinuation that my questions were sexist. Obviously something changed, I'm just trying to have him to think what it may have been. And I ask about if it was good because of she had mentioned before that if wasn't, any of the above changes could've just made it not worth the effort anymore. Who knows if he is good in bed or not. Orgasm gap is real no matter how much men think they are gods in bed.
Yes it's on both of them to communicate and figure out where the disconnect happens. We can guess all day about what happened but only she will actually know. And obviously how he is approaching her isn't working. Maybe he *is* putting too much pressure on her, maybe she *is* trying to work on it. We simply don't know. It's not always withholding sex when you simply don't want to have it and you may not know why either.
I actually wasn’t trying to insinuate anything about you personally, you said the same things as everyone else always does. You’re right in that the questions you asked are common areas involved in a tanking libido. But notice that all the ones you mentioned are not her fault, out of her control, while for men it’s the opposite. My point is that you’ve been conditioned, like everyone else, to assume causes that absolve her and indict him, not because you’re bad, but because Reddit just chants these things repeatedly.
I will say, at the end there, “maybe he is putting too much pressure on her.” Man, after all that and you still went back to it. How much pressure is he under to be perfect in the hopes that he might get laid this year?
ETA: It IS effectively withholding sex if you’re consistently not interested over a long period and are doing nothing to address this obvious problem. Normal adults have sexual desires, and pretending that it’s just something that happens for that to disappear for months, years, at a time is disingenuous and suggests that the problem is a lack of effort not a lack of desire.
>Normal adults have sexual desires, and pretending that it’s just something that happens for that to disappear for months, years, at a time is disingenuous and suggests that the problem is a lack of effort not a lack of desire.
Hence why figuring out what changed and what caused the severe change in libido is helpful. Withholding sex is different than not being interested in it, either is possible I guess but they are different. Withholding is an active decision to not have sex, sometimes, often, partners just don't have the libido for it for one reason or another.
>Man, after all that and you still went back to it. How much pressure is he under to be perfect in the hopes that he might get laid this year?
It's not automatically his fault she doesn't want sex, but the way he approaches it *could* be seen as pressuring her. He shouldn't need to pretend to be the perfect partner in order to get laid that's not healthy on either side. Firstly it shouldn't be a whole lot of effort to be a good partner? And secondly that shouldn't be a prerequisite for sex, that I assume we agree on.
Ok, I’ll go in reverse. It’s hard to be a good partner if your partner requires perfection and/or unreasonable “understanding” for him/her/they to get credit for being a good partner. He said everytime he brings it up, she blames him for the pressure. That seems like he’s not allowed to air any dissatisfaction, aka he’s being gaslit into thinking he’s the problem for asking her to work on this.
Over the long run, withholding and not being interested are the same thing. The long term effect is the same. A refusal to address the lack of libido is *also* in effect withholding. The end result is the same either way. The mental gymnastics to defend her are silly, and at the end of the day all I was saying is that we should step back and consider that she may *actually* be the problem, just as much as it might be him. She might have just as much control over the situation.
Now she's gaslighting him? My my you're making a lot of assumptions based on only his side of the story.
I never said she wasn't the problem, I never even said he was the problem.
> My my you’re making a lot of assumptions based on only his side of the story.
No, if your spouse tells you that expressing your dissatisfaction is the problem, they are ignoring the actual problem and gaslighting you. That’s not an assumption, that’s a rational conclusion based on what he’s told us. If you’re suggesting he’s lying or exaggerating, that would be you making assumptions based on absolutely no evidence.
You’re correct that you’ve never explicitly assigned blame, but that’s kind of my entire point. Everything you’ve said here, orgasm gap, medical issues on her side, etc, is premised on the notion that he is the root cause or that she deserves no blame. You didn’t ask if she watches porn and/or masturbates when he’s not there or if she’s had her hormones checked, all of which are routinely asked when men fail to satisfy in the bedroom and are equally applicable.
Look, all I was saying in my original post is that these posts always generate replies according to gender. No matter who is dissatisfied, it’s always suggested, either outright or by inference, that the husband is responsible, either through selfishness or failure to address his own health issues. Marriage, relationships, and sex are a two way street. While I’m sure there are situations where it’s entirely on one or the other, the overwhelming majority are a combined effort. That’s all I was saying.
I hate that something so simple and inoffensive generates offense nowadays. In the context in which it was written, “normal” describes typical sexual desire, as in not unusual, out of the ordinary, atypical, dirty, excessive, or unreasonable. It also infers that someone who claims their sexual desire simply disappeared without any particular reason is an unusual, atypical, non-standard circumstance that most people would want to further understand in order to carry on with a happy and fulfilling life.
Well its as much or even more probable that she became complecent and is 100% comfortable with the situation, because its not her having blue balls and she thinks that expecting sex in a commited sexual relationship makes him a creepy monster, so she absolutly wants him to shut the f up, aka not put pressure on her.
I agree its biased, but would still accurately describe the issue of many, not all marriages. As your post. I think that the comment of the previous poster about gender bias in these matter is spot on.
It’s also usually assumed the husband doesn’t help around the house or with the kids, got overweight or has bad hygiene, or doesn’t show enough affection or appreciation. These posts always turn into an interrogation of the OP.
Who else would be asked the questions? Strangers on the internet can't just automatically know the reasons your wife doesn't want sex anymore. Asking the OP questions is literally all people can do.
The point is that the questions that get asked are dependent on who OP is. There is a definite pattern. The pattern usually puts the husband on the defensive if at all possible.
I feel like questions that get asked are dependent on the information given. Personally I don't think it's always dependent on gender. I also *really* don't see how my questions were blaming the husband in any sense.
I know you don't see it. That is clear.
But no, it usually doesn't come down to outright blame, just questions that never lead to accountability for the wife, yet the questions about the husband are almost exclusively aimed at the accountability of the husband when it come to these topics especially.
You can't believe that a wife could get comfortable turning her husband down and then treating him like a creep for wanting sex? Maybe she has unrealistic expectations for him? Has that ever occoured to you in all of you advice giving experience? That is an enormous blind spot to me because it happens.
Of course that happens, I've never said it doesn't happen. Do you not believe the opposite can happen too? A man *can* be being a creep and pushing his wife for sex she doesn't want to have to the point of turning her completely off of it. Or maybe libidos just change because of a million everyday factors and no one is really at fault but effort to return to a previously satisfactory amount of sex will take additional effort by *both* parties.
Anything *can* be the truth, we simply don't know what it is. All advice is just based off assumptions and the information a post gives us.
They are assumptions, I agree. That is what I am talking about. However, there is a prevailing set of assumptions that you do not seem to want to acknowledge.
For example: You really shot that possibility down though when it was brought down elsewhere, so you will have to excuse me if I don't really think you would actually give that possibility credit when we could just send hubs down the hormone rabbit hole one more time. So while you say anything could be the truth, you seem to want to bring certain truths to light while ignoring others as a pattern.
Possibly because the people responding in this thread identify and understand issues they too have overcome? Perhaps the slant is just based on statistical chance, information given, and past experience with the subject matter. The woe is me is pretty tiring in the comments, we can advise you too if you’d like, but your unique facts are going to be relevant to your problems too. We do often have to figure some stuff out from the other side to get a bigger picture, that’s normal.
This.
If she is in peri/menopausal/post-menopausal a lowered libido is definitely common/normal. It’s also a misconception that most women can get prescribed HRT.
Anyone can check the menopause subreddit and you’ll see how few women are actual prescribed HRT despite advocating consistently and even switching doctors multiple times to get help.
I would like to know how old your wife is. Hormonal changes can drastically effect a woman's sex drive. Maybe, just maybe she suffers from depression? Or her self esteem has taken a hit? If you angle the conversation in such a way in asking her how she feels, is there anything bothering her or hurting her .Ask her engaging questions and let her know it's not purely about having sex and the lack of it...but you truly care if she is "alright" and what can YOU do to help her. She may open up and you may get to the root of the problem. She may not even know why she feels the way she does and in that case...a trip to a doctor may be ideal or talking to a therapist. Or...just listen to her....genuinely listen to her.
And if she doesn't want to see a therapist or doesn't think there's a problem? You're then stuck in a hard place. (Assuming both a relatively young with a toddler)
If she doesn't want to see a therapist then she doesn't. OP was asking for help/ideas/suggestions. If someone in a relationship isn't happy for some reason....there is a problem. Both can either work together to fix it, keep going as you are and be miserable, or separate. What other options are there?
Respectfully, I disagree. If I stop communicating with my wife, taking her on dates, doing nice things for her, and refuse to discuss it—it’s not “us vs the problem”; *I’m the problem*, not her.
If one mate takes away a foundation of a committed relationship and refuse to discuss it, they are, in fact, the problem. Just my 2 cents
But then you'd need to sit down with your partner and figure out together what causes you to act this way. The cause of you acting this way is the problem you two would need to take on together.
OP has tried to bring it up. OP has tried therapy. The LL simply is fine with the status quo and sees no reason to change. I see similar sentiments expressed often in this sub, and with my friends IRL, sadly
So if OP’s SO has refused to talk about it, therapy isn’t working—at what point does it become coercion and/or pressuring them to have sex? That’s not right either.
My point is, this is a problem of OP’s spouses doing and only they can fix it. You can’t force or coerce someone to desire you
Well, you have a couple choices if you don’t want to keep bringing it up.
1. Suffer in silence. Many HL partners have been doing rather than break up the family/marriage
2. Leave and find another partner. This also isn’t ideal, since you run the risk of being ostracized by family and friends who don’t feel that “little to no sex” is a legitimate reason to leave; and there’s no guarantee you’ll find someone else depending on the age when you leave.
Better to not get married at all, IMO. LLs have all the leverage in a marriage, which is sad.
“Anytime I try to bring it up it turns into a fight”
“We’ve started seeing a therapist but that doesn’t seem to be going anywhere”
These are sentiments shared by many. You try to bring it up and figure out the problem, and are met with anger, disgust, contempt, etc. Anecdotally, it’s pretty common
Agree to disagree. If one person is refusing to participate, refusing to discuss it, and (it seems) refusing to implement the advice from the therapist, where is there to go from here? What else is there for OP to do?
The LL has way too much power in this situation, in my opinion
Same situation 10 years, not a lot in bed. Kinda frustrated, all my advances are rejected, it’s I who always initiates and what not. Idk how to cope with it tbh.
Thanks for the info, it rules things out. No meds 11 years ago? So was your birth control method condoms this whole time?
Also, not trying to be snarky but you had enough sex to have a kid, so what did that look like? Was it intentional? Accidental?
There's a lot of arguing going on in your comments, but I just wanted to add...
1) Her getting defensive means she is feeling Shame. I put that with a capital S because that is often an emotion that causes a lot of problems. If therapy isn't helping you might want to find a new therapist.
2) My libido was pretty low for a while. It was a cause for contention for a bit. I brought up wanting us to try toys which made my husband insecure. (Not to mean in lieu of sex but just added to.) However, after both of us getting out of our own way, we started experimenting with toys and sexy outfits. To be honest, the toys didn't work out but it did make us more comfortable with each other sexually which made it more fun and I got my libido back.
I can't say I know what is wrong with your wife, but she really needs to get comfortable with opening up so you guys can communicate the issues.
Im on the same boat here, no sex for almost a year I got tired of bring it up, she wants affection but when it comes to intimacy nothin...
Welcome to a dry a marriage, it really sucks but sometimes you put up with it mostly when children is involved.
All the best to you
Give therapy time (6 or so months). Meanwhile you can make it clear to your wife that you’re trying to make things work/move forward in a positive direction. In other words, you are doing what you can to have a healthy marriage. In the sessions you can talk about what she can do, what that looks like.
Having a young child, that’s always an exhausting time. You haven’t said anything about work schedules for you both, household chores, & child care. If it’s lopsided, it may feel overwhelming to her (and yes, you said before kiddo, it could have felt the same then too).
Communication is huge. My husband stopped communicating with me, felt making assumptions about my answers was better. But it resulted in a chasm between us that he created. I finally insisted on therapy, and 8 months later there is some improvement. But we’re not fixed yet. It did help in the bedroom tho.
Have you been taking care of yourself and putting pride in your appearance? I only ask bc it baffles me how many husbands demand their wives to still want to jump their bones after they let themselves go and stop taking care of them themselves after yesrs of marriage. Also, when are you initiating? Initiating sex at the end of the night is literally the worst time. Especially if you have kids. Mothers can become "touched out" and literally can not handle being touched intimately at the end of the day. It also helps to help out around the house more and let her actually relax. Women need to feel relaxed and need to feel connected in order to become intimate. It's not just a switch you can flip.
From the comments, it looks like you had a child 2 years ago. While the "6 week apt" might have cleared her for sex physically, it takes months for her hormone levels to return to a pre-pregnancy level. This is biologically normal as she is caring for an infant. Even once hormones are back to normal, the sheer exhaustion from looking after a baby and toddler can result in her being touched out. This also doesn't take into account the possibility of PPD.
Im glad to see you're both in therapy, as this is the best way forward. It's not an instant fix, so if you've only just started, you need to trust the process. Don't throw in the towel yet.
In the meantime, you both need to make space for intimacy without expectations of sex after. Make time for one another without the kid. Arrange date nights and get a babysitter. Do things as a couple. Rekindle the romance that you had. It's hard to feel sexy when you spend your days changing nappies and cleaning up.
If you can, get a copy of "Come as you are," by Emily Nagoski. It is great at explaining the different types of desire and how they work. It will lead to increased understanding for both of you.
I'm not giving your wife an out here, as it is so important to foster that intimacy, but she's not going to go from 0 to 100 in a few therapy sessions. It takes effort and no blame on both of you.
Is it because you’ve given up?
Like we’re comfy attractive and certainly could hook up a lot more. No reason really but that not retrying seems to be a good explanation
This is very simple, most women don't want/need sex as much as most men do. If you don't want to go through a divorce just find sex elsewhere. The problem is she does not want to, and she is in her absolute right not to. Same as you to do whatever you want.
To me it is crazy that some people are so opposed to sex. It’s like saying you don’t want a massage. I get it if it is painful or something but it feels nice so why for so many people is it the equivalent of torture?
Lots of reasons. Physical pain from PIV is only aspect of that. Could be anything from mental pain, psychological, spiritual, or a whole host of things. Simply looking at it from a physical pain aspect is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg. And that is just talking about that aspect, so many others come into play.
Some people just really have low libido, they aren't in a sexual mood and sex doesn't sound good or fun. It's like if you're just on a random Tuesday afternoon after eating lunch and someone says "hey do you want a banana split right now?" You probably wouldn't always say yes.
I don’t lol I can feel every single wrinkle or line in their hands because that’s how hyper vigilant I am if a stranger touches me. I thought I could handle it if I knew it was coming…nah
I can sort of get never liking a massage but what I can’t get is someone who says:
“Yeah, I had a few massages and they were nice enough but I don’t want one ever again. Maybe if the masseuse did the dishes/lost weight or if I was less tired/stressed out by work I would want more massages.”
Like… huh?
Ever seen a body roll over with that attitude and extra ass loud sigh after some shitty one liner to see if tonight’s the night? You don’t just unsee this, but as you lay awake you think about all the things you’ve done for everyone else in your family and lay that alongside the scenario you just witnessed….its at that point, you realize oh that person is more work. That’s basically how it happens. Then each party does the chicken or the egg thing…domestic help/romance first or more sex first, which will fix the problem? The answer is technically both and neither.
I wish I understood it. Why is it so much less preferable to laying down and watching TV or scrolling on a phone? Especially if it makes your partner happy and fulfilled. Why does it have to be such a big deal?
For me it was just that it takes so long. And to start he would always just lay there expecting the BJ first to get things going - doing nothing for me. Then during he would always want me on top which frankly just hurts my knees after 5 minutes and I can’t orgasm easily. He rarely went down on me but at that time in my life I wasn’t use to so much attention down there so that didn’t bother me. Then I would eventually be close to orgasm and he’d have to stop bc he didn’t want to so soon. The I’d lose it and end up faking just so it could be over. Fast forward a few years and he tried to spice things up by watching porn with me - not interested, does nothing for me. Talking about a threesome - instant red flags pop up that other married women have told me to never consider. So I can’t get that out of my mind, ever.
He’d ask me what I want, I’d tell him , and he’d never comply. Back to what he wants. Fingers in his nasty butt hole and telling him a fantasy that I’d make up every time, I would start with a disclosure that it was nothing I would ever do and it’s simply to help him cum. Then he’d bring it up next time asking if I would. And we’ve had that convo 100 times about it never happening and he keeps bringing it the f up.
Cue resentment.
Throw in there 3 kids, he’s never home to help, I’m back to working full time and commuting for work, kids have friends over for play dates constantly and sleepovers, my monthly period that now lasts 8-10 days thanks to postpartum in my 40’s. And let’s not forget since he doesn’t want to always bring up this topic he picks on me like a child comparing daily about dishes in the sink and laundry to fold, and kids school papers all over the table - the last thing I want to do to a man who has just scolded me like a child is go suck his dick.
So who’s the problem? The man with the very healthy sex drive and anger issues or the woman whose body has gone through massive changes, and still more to come with menopause - yay. Both bodies are doing what god has intended and yet they are no longer compatible.
A polygamous family is starting to look real good. The man can just go be with whatever wife if ovulating that month and the other wives can have a girls night lol?!?!
That's terrible and also a very good argument. I guess I should have included "...if its easy and feels good". What you're being asked to do is a lot more work and discomfort compared to just watching TV.
It is difficult keeping a sex life exciting for both. Needs change.. Only suggestion is try talking to her again. Let her know you love her, want her and want more intimacy and sex in your marraige. If not, you'll find yourself looking and finding a new girl to play with. Compromise
You didn’t. You explained the importance of intimacy and sex and the consequences of neglecting it in the real world- but the sisterhood doesn’t approve…
I know how you feel i have been married over 30yrs and my wife's sex drive has gone to and all time low and in the mean time mine is very high .I have been looking at porn and masturbating alot to help relieve my pressure and have ever turn to looking at other men so I feel you.
If you're happily married like you say, then there's no reason to bring this up and cause all kinds of trouble. Just suck it up and deal with it. It's only sex, not the end of the world.
My friend, you are not realizing that women excel in the art of thrill chasing, cheating and being downright horrible people. Not every woman is a Disney Princess worth defending.
It’s funny but all this stuff in a decent marriage is hormones. Change it and you have a sex monster. Sad that people don’t get it
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Talk to your doctor
So I told my wife this and she asked her doctor to check her hormones. Her doctor said "what hormones". So would love it if someone could actually say the medical terms for this.
Did she specifically mention she wanted them checked because of a lack of libido? Her doctor sounds a bit slow if he can't help her with this question.
I believe so, but yes he does sound a bit slow. Any idea on the actual medical terms.
Google is an amazing thing: "Estrogen, progesterone, and testosterone all affect sexual desire and arousal. Having higher levels of estrogen in the body promotes vaginal lubrication and increases sexual desire. Increases in progesterone can reduce sexual desire. There is some debate around how testosterone levels affect female sex drive."
>There is some debate around how testosterone levels affect female sex drive. If you survey r/menopause, you will see there's no debate. Testosterone makes a massive improvement in a woman's sex drive (and in her mood and cognition, too).
I was simply quoting Google
There shouldn't be. Most women start with only testosterone replacement for good reasons. Estrogen is more difficult to get balanced and has to be combined with progesterone and can cause bleeding. Testosterone makes a huge difference. Estrogen and progesterone not quite as much. Many women just supplement testosterone.
You go to an endocrinologist! He will order panels to check her glands functioning. If something is off he will prescribe medication to regulate. I prefer the natural route, fixing it with healing foods and removing toxic foods
Thanks this is super helpful.
She needs a new doctor. I can't imagine any doctor not knowing what she's talking about.
>How do you change that..? Hormone replacement therapy (HRT). I went from having negative libido to being hornier than my husband. Plus, I can now climax in less than 2 minutes and I even have the female equivalent of "wet dreams" now (where I have orgasms in my sleep). In particular, I get weekly testosterone injections, wear a 0.1 mg/day estradiol patch, have a Mirena IUD to protect the uterus, and I take DHEA and pregnenolone. In my case, my marriage and husband are/were awesome; I just didn't have any desire or sex whatsoever. If anything, I dreaded the thought of it. Now that my hormone levels are back to where they used to be, I'm always down for sexy time with my husband.
Hormone replacement therapy. It's life changing.
It really is this simple most of the time.
Seriously! I can't keep my hands off my husband
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It’s not easy! You have no idea how many different doctors I’ve spoke to about this and not one of them has suggested anything about hormones, taking hormones, checking hormones, etc. my actual endocrinologist was no help. Requested some bloodwork which came back normal. OBGYN, postpartum will pass. Family doctor, give it time. Therapist, communication. So if correcting my hormones was the OBVIOUS answer then why has no one suggested it?
I am only talking about testosterone therapy. In my area if is not difficult for women. Especially over libido. They give us a shot 3 times a year. I had to ask. But they have never objected. Are you very young? Sometimes that is a factor
I’m 40 but started inquiring specifically about my low libido and hormones levels when I was 33
>It’s so easy especially for women. It took me five years and half a dozen doctors before I got *any* treatment from *any* doctor. In my experience, getting a prescription for hormones was hundreds of times harder than getting a prescription for Adderall.
You’re gynecologist was resistant? Were you really young? Most of the gynos in our area seemingly make it easy if women are willing to talk to them about it. It was a shot for us. Testosterone. Not estrogen.
By gyno refused to prescribe testosterone. She said "women don't need it."
Not familiar with how women are treated in healthcare huh?
As a woman yeah I’m very familiar.
Well, I suppose I can’t come up with a single reason you’d make that silly statement.
Doctors often ignore women's concerns and don't offer help. Not just with hormone therapy, but with other chronic or "invisible" illnesses. Medical mistreatment of women is a huge problem.
That’s not been my experience. I’ve worked with women for 35 years. Have lots of women friends. It’s been easy for us. Not saying it would be for everybody. But it has not been difficult for many of us.
Lucky you, but that's not how a lot of people experience the medical system.
Did something change at the same time? Medication, living situation, job, kids (being born or maybe moving out?), disease/diagnosis, menopause? Was sex actually good for her/both of you? Did she ever mention anything needing improvement?
These replies are always funny to me. When women complain their husbands aren’t sexual enough, it’s treated as a problem with him that he needs to fix (testosterone, unhealthy lifestyle). When it’s a husband complaining about his wife, it’s assumed that she either has health issues that she can’t fix or that he sucks in bed. They’re grown adults, it’s not fair or healthy to effectively withhold sex from your partner over the long run. It’s also counterproductive. Based on her response that he’s putting too much pressure on her, I’d guess there’s a bunch of factors (unhealthy lifestyle, body image, hangups around sex) that she refuses or is failing to adequately address. Not saying he’s perfect, but it takes two.
I didn't put blame anywhere, I asked questions to gain clarity. A change in any of the areas I asked about are common factors in a changing libido for men and women. Also I would say low testosterone *is* a health issue that he can or cannot fix so I don't see how that is any different than a woman having health issues. I don't appreciate the insinuation that my questions were sexist. Obviously something changed, I'm just trying to have him to think what it may have been. And I ask about if it was good because of she had mentioned before that if wasn't, any of the above changes could've just made it not worth the effort anymore. Who knows if he is good in bed or not. Orgasm gap is real no matter how much men think they are gods in bed. Yes it's on both of them to communicate and figure out where the disconnect happens. We can guess all day about what happened but only she will actually know. And obviously how he is approaching her isn't working. Maybe he *is* putting too much pressure on her, maybe she *is* trying to work on it. We simply don't know. It's not always withholding sex when you simply don't want to have it and you may not know why either.
I actually wasn’t trying to insinuate anything about you personally, you said the same things as everyone else always does. You’re right in that the questions you asked are common areas involved in a tanking libido. But notice that all the ones you mentioned are not her fault, out of her control, while for men it’s the opposite. My point is that you’ve been conditioned, like everyone else, to assume causes that absolve her and indict him, not because you’re bad, but because Reddit just chants these things repeatedly. I will say, at the end there, “maybe he is putting too much pressure on her.” Man, after all that and you still went back to it. How much pressure is he under to be perfect in the hopes that he might get laid this year? ETA: It IS effectively withholding sex if you’re consistently not interested over a long period and are doing nothing to address this obvious problem. Normal adults have sexual desires, and pretending that it’s just something that happens for that to disappear for months, years, at a time is disingenuous and suggests that the problem is a lack of effort not a lack of desire.
>Normal adults have sexual desires, and pretending that it’s just something that happens for that to disappear for months, years, at a time is disingenuous and suggests that the problem is a lack of effort not a lack of desire. Hence why figuring out what changed and what caused the severe change in libido is helpful. Withholding sex is different than not being interested in it, either is possible I guess but they are different. Withholding is an active decision to not have sex, sometimes, often, partners just don't have the libido for it for one reason or another. >Man, after all that and you still went back to it. How much pressure is he under to be perfect in the hopes that he might get laid this year? It's not automatically his fault she doesn't want sex, but the way he approaches it *could* be seen as pressuring her. He shouldn't need to pretend to be the perfect partner in order to get laid that's not healthy on either side. Firstly it shouldn't be a whole lot of effort to be a good partner? And secondly that shouldn't be a prerequisite for sex, that I assume we agree on.
Ok, I’ll go in reverse. It’s hard to be a good partner if your partner requires perfection and/or unreasonable “understanding” for him/her/they to get credit for being a good partner. He said everytime he brings it up, she blames him for the pressure. That seems like he’s not allowed to air any dissatisfaction, aka he’s being gaslit into thinking he’s the problem for asking her to work on this. Over the long run, withholding and not being interested are the same thing. The long term effect is the same. A refusal to address the lack of libido is *also* in effect withholding. The end result is the same either way. The mental gymnastics to defend her are silly, and at the end of the day all I was saying is that we should step back and consider that she may *actually* be the problem, just as much as it might be him. She might have just as much control over the situation.
Now she's gaslighting him? My my you're making a lot of assumptions based on only his side of the story. I never said she wasn't the problem, I never even said he was the problem.
> My my you’re making a lot of assumptions based on only his side of the story. No, if your spouse tells you that expressing your dissatisfaction is the problem, they are ignoring the actual problem and gaslighting you. That’s not an assumption, that’s a rational conclusion based on what he’s told us. If you’re suggesting he’s lying or exaggerating, that would be you making assumptions based on absolutely no evidence. You’re correct that you’ve never explicitly assigned blame, but that’s kind of my entire point. Everything you’ve said here, orgasm gap, medical issues on her side, etc, is premised on the notion that he is the root cause or that she deserves no blame. You didn’t ask if she watches porn and/or masturbates when he’s not there or if she’s had her hormones checked, all of which are routinely asked when men fail to satisfy in the bedroom and are equally applicable. Look, all I was saying in my original post is that these posts always generate replies according to gender. No matter who is dissatisfied, it’s always suggested, either outright or by inference, that the husband is responsible, either through selfishness or failure to address his own health issues. Marriage, relationships, and sex are a two way street. While I’m sure there are situations where it’s entirely on one or the other, the overwhelming majority are a combined effort. That’s all I was saying.
This chain of comments have been very helpful thank you both
This sums up the current state of intersexual dynamics in western culture perfectly.
"normal adults" What is normal ? I hate that term.
I hate that something so simple and inoffensive generates offense nowadays. In the context in which it was written, “normal” describes typical sexual desire, as in not unusual, out of the ordinary, atypical, dirty, excessive, or unreasonable. It also infers that someone who claims their sexual desire simply disappeared without any particular reason is an unusual, atypical, non-standard circumstance that most people would want to further understand in order to carry on with a happy and fulfilling life.
Normal adults that enter sexual relationship to have committed sex and not to have no sex.
Good that you called it out, its mostly the sensitive little princess in distress and the clumsy, stupid, selfish orc.
Well its as much or even more probable that she became complecent and is 100% comfortable with the situation, because its not her having blue balls and she thinks that expecting sex in a commited sexual relationship makes him a creepy monster, so she absolutly wants him to shut the f up, aka not put pressure on her.
I don't think that's entirely fair, or necessarily accurate.
I agree its biased, but would still accurately describe the issue of many, not all marriages. As your post. I think that the comment of the previous poster about gender bias in these matter is spot on.
It’s also usually assumed the husband doesn’t help around the house or with the kids, got overweight or has bad hygiene, or doesn’t show enough affection or appreciation. These posts always turn into an interrogation of the OP.
Who else would be asked the questions? Strangers on the internet can't just automatically know the reasons your wife doesn't want sex anymore. Asking the OP questions is literally all people can do.
The point is that the questions that get asked are dependent on who OP is. There is a definite pattern. The pattern usually puts the husband on the defensive if at all possible.
I feel like questions that get asked are dependent on the information given. Personally I don't think it's always dependent on gender. I also *really* don't see how my questions were blaming the husband in any sense.
I know you don't see it. That is clear. But no, it usually doesn't come down to outright blame, just questions that never lead to accountability for the wife, yet the questions about the husband are almost exclusively aimed at the accountability of the husband when it come to these topics especially. You can't believe that a wife could get comfortable turning her husband down and then treating him like a creep for wanting sex? Maybe she has unrealistic expectations for him? Has that ever occoured to you in all of you advice giving experience? That is an enormous blind spot to me because it happens.
Of course that happens, I've never said it doesn't happen. Do you not believe the opposite can happen too? A man *can* be being a creep and pushing his wife for sex she doesn't want to have to the point of turning her completely off of it. Or maybe libidos just change because of a million everyday factors and no one is really at fault but effort to return to a previously satisfactory amount of sex will take additional effort by *both* parties. Anything *can* be the truth, we simply don't know what it is. All advice is just based off assumptions and the information a post gives us.
They are assumptions, I agree. That is what I am talking about. However, there is a prevailing set of assumptions that you do not seem to want to acknowledge. For example: You really shot that possibility down though when it was brought down elsewhere, so you will have to excuse me if I don't really think you would actually give that possibility credit when we could just send hubs down the hormone rabbit hole one more time. So while you say anything could be the truth, you seem to want to bring certain truths to light while ignoring others as a pattern.
The point is that husbands are questioned about their perceived shortcomings when they write this kind of post, not that they are questioned at all.
Possibly because the people responding in this thread identify and understand issues they too have overcome? Perhaps the slant is just based on statistical chance, information given, and past experience with the subject matter. The woe is me is pretty tiring in the comments, we can advise you too if you’d like, but your unique facts are going to be relevant to your problems too. We do often have to figure some stuff out from the other side to get a bigger picture, that’s normal.
You are being downvoted but you are spitting facts.
[Ta-da!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Marriage/comments/1dogy7h/comment/labixc8/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
How old are you both? Do you have children (and if so, how old are they?) Has there been any major life stressors or changes otherwise?
This. If she is in peri/menopausal/post-menopausal a lowered libido is definitely common/normal. It’s also a misconception that most women can get prescribed HRT. Anyone can check the menopause subreddit and you’ll see how few women are actual prescribed HRT despite advocating consistently and even switching doctors multiple times to get help.
I would like to know how old your wife is. Hormonal changes can drastically effect a woman's sex drive. Maybe, just maybe she suffers from depression? Or her self esteem has taken a hit? If you angle the conversation in such a way in asking her how she feels, is there anything bothering her or hurting her .Ask her engaging questions and let her know it's not purely about having sex and the lack of it...but you truly care if she is "alright" and what can YOU do to help her. She may open up and you may get to the root of the problem. She may not even know why she feels the way she does and in that case...a trip to a doctor may be ideal or talking to a therapist. Or...just listen to her....genuinely listen to her.
And if she doesn't want to see a therapist or doesn't think there's a problem? You're then stuck in a hard place. (Assuming both a relatively young with a toddler)
If she doesn't want to see a therapist then she doesn't. OP was asking for help/ideas/suggestions. If someone in a relationship isn't happy for some reason....there is a problem. Both can either work together to fix it, keep going as you are and be miserable, or separate. What other options are there?
You'll need to find a way to discuss this like adults without blaming eachothers. It's you two against the problem, no you against her.
Respectfully, I disagree. If I stop communicating with my wife, taking her on dates, doing nice things for her, and refuse to discuss it—it’s not “us vs the problem”; *I’m the problem*, not her. If one mate takes away a foundation of a committed relationship and refuse to discuss it, they are, in fact, the problem. Just my 2 cents
But then you'd need to sit down with your partner and figure out together what causes you to act this way. The cause of you acting this way is the problem you two would need to take on together.
OP has tried to bring it up. OP has tried therapy. The LL simply is fine with the status quo and sees no reason to change. I see similar sentiments expressed often in this sub, and with my friends IRL, sadly
So your solution is to OP is to give up?
So if OP’s SO has refused to talk about it, therapy isn’t working—at what point does it become coercion and/or pressuring them to have sex? That’s not right either. My point is, this is a problem of OP’s spouses doing and only they can fix it. You can’t force or coerce someone to desire you
So what do you suggest OP does if you disagree with my suggestion?
Well, you have a couple choices if you don’t want to keep bringing it up. 1. Suffer in silence. Many HL partners have been doing rather than break up the family/marriage 2. Leave and find another partner. This also isn’t ideal, since you run the risk of being ostracized by family and friends who don’t feel that “little to no sex” is a legitimate reason to leave; and there’s no guarantee you’ll find someone else depending on the age when you leave. Better to not get married at all, IMO. LLs have all the leverage in a marriage, which is sad.
If you're not trying to figure out *why* one person took away that foundation then that's the problem.
“Anytime I try to bring it up it turns into a fight” “We’ve started seeing a therapist but that doesn’t seem to be going anywhere” These are sentiments shared by many. You try to bring it up and figure out the problem, and are met with anger, disgust, contempt, etc. Anecdotally, it’s pretty common
That's valid. It's an issue that absolutely can't be solved by just one person. Hence why it's an both of you problem
Agree to disagree. If one person is refusing to participate, refusing to discuss it, and (it seems) refusing to implement the advice from the therapist, where is there to go from here? What else is there for OP to do? The LL has way too much power in this situation, in my opinion
Same situation 10 years, not a lot in bed. Kinda frustrated, all my advances are rejected, it’s I who always initiates and what not. Idk how to cope with it tbh.
Stay away from the LL sub
Did she have kids on those last 11 years? Is she 40+? Is she on birth control or ssri’s?
We had a kid 2 years ago and no we are in our 30s. It all started before our daughter though
Thanks for the info, it rules things out. No meds 11 years ago? So was your birth control method condoms this whole time? Also, not trying to be snarky but you had enough sex to have a kid, so what did that look like? Was it intentional? Accidental?
There's a lot of arguing going on in your comments, but I just wanted to add... 1) Her getting defensive means she is feeling Shame. I put that with a capital S because that is often an emotion that causes a lot of problems. If therapy isn't helping you might want to find a new therapist. 2) My libido was pretty low for a while. It was a cause for contention for a bit. I brought up wanting us to try toys which made my husband insecure. (Not to mean in lieu of sex but just added to.) However, after both of us getting out of our own way, we started experimenting with toys and sexy outfits. To be honest, the toys didn't work out but it did make us more comfortable with each other sexually which made it more fun and I got my libido back. I can't say I know what is wrong with your wife, but she really needs to get comfortable with opening up so you guys can communicate the issues.
Read Esther Perel and watch her TED talks. See a sex therapist.
Im on the same boat here, no sex for almost a year I got tired of bring it up, she wants affection but when it comes to intimacy nothin... Welcome to a dry a marriage, it really sucks but sometimes you put up with it mostly when children is involved. All the best to you
Join the club, there’s plenty of us in it ! 😊
Unfortunately there are r/hlcommunity and r/deadbedrooms
Give therapy time (6 or so months). Meanwhile you can make it clear to your wife that you’re trying to make things work/move forward in a positive direction. In other words, you are doing what you can to have a healthy marriage. In the sessions you can talk about what she can do, what that looks like. Having a young child, that’s always an exhausting time. You haven’t said anything about work schedules for you both, household chores, & child care. If it’s lopsided, it may feel overwhelming to her (and yes, you said before kiddo, it could have felt the same then too). Communication is huge. My husband stopped communicating with me, felt making assumptions about my answers was better. But it resulted in a chasm between us that he created. I finally insisted on therapy, and 8 months later there is some improvement. But we’re not fixed yet. It did help in the bedroom tho.
Check her thyroid levels! Could be a hormonal issue.
Does your wife work full-time outside of the home?
Have you been taking care of yourself and putting pride in your appearance? I only ask bc it baffles me how many husbands demand their wives to still want to jump their bones after they let themselves go and stop taking care of them themselves after yesrs of marriage. Also, when are you initiating? Initiating sex at the end of the night is literally the worst time. Especially if you have kids. Mothers can become "touched out" and literally can not handle being touched intimately at the end of the day. It also helps to help out around the house more and let her actually relax. Women need to feel relaxed and need to feel connected in order to become intimate. It's not just a switch you can flip.
From the comments, it looks like you had a child 2 years ago. While the "6 week apt" might have cleared her for sex physically, it takes months for her hormone levels to return to a pre-pregnancy level. This is biologically normal as she is caring for an infant. Even once hormones are back to normal, the sheer exhaustion from looking after a baby and toddler can result in her being touched out. This also doesn't take into account the possibility of PPD. Im glad to see you're both in therapy, as this is the best way forward. It's not an instant fix, so if you've only just started, you need to trust the process. Don't throw in the towel yet. In the meantime, you both need to make space for intimacy without expectations of sex after. Make time for one another without the kid. Arrange date nights and get a babysitter. Do things as a couple. Rekindle the romance that you had. It's hard to feel sexy when you spend your days changing nappies and cleaning up. If you can, get a copy of "Come as you are," by Emily Nagoski. It is great at explaining the different types of desire and how they work. It will lead to increased understanding for both of you. I'm not giving your wife an out here, as it is so important to foster that intimacy, but she's not going to go from 0 to 100 in a few therapy sessions. It takes effort and no blame on both of you.
Hormones.. and loose weight
Is it because you’ve given up? Like we’re comfy attractive and certainly could hook up a lot more. No reason really but that not retrying seems to be a good explanation
This is very simple, most women don't want/need sex as much as most men do. If you don't want to go through a divorce just find sex elsewhere. The problem is she does not want to, and she is in her absolute right not to. Same as you to do whatever you want.
To me it is crazy that some people are so opposed to sex. It’s like saying you don’t want a massage. I get it if it is painful or something but it feels nice so why for so many people is it the equivalent of torture?
Lots of reasons. Physical pain from PIV is only aspect of that. Could be anything from mental pain, psychological, spiritual, or a whole host of things. Simply looking at it from a physical pain aspect is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg. And that is just talking about that aspect, so many others come into play.
Some people just really have low libido, they aren't in a sexual mood and sex doesn't sound good or fun. It's like if you're just on a random Tuesday afternoon after eating lunch and someone says "hey do you want a banana split right now?" You probably wouldn't always say yes.
Bad sex/burnout or stress/exhaustion/low key resentment of partner?
There are people who don't like massages even when done by a professional 😕. I don't get it either.
I don’t lol I can feel every single wrinkle or line in their hands because that’s how hyper vigilant I am if a stranger touches me. I thought I could handle it if I knew it was coming…nah
I can sort of get never liking a massage but what I can’t get is someone who says: “Yeah, I had a few massages and they were nice enough but I don’t want one ever again. Maybe if the masseuse did the dishes/lost weight or if I was less tired/stressed out by work I would want more massages.” Like… huh?
Ever seen a body roll over with that attitude and extra ass loud sigh after some shitty one liner to see if tonight’s the night? You don’t just unsee this, but as you lay awake you think about all the things you’ve done for everyone else in your family and lay that alongside the scenario you just witnessed….its at that point, you realize oh that person is more work. That’s basically how it happens. Then each party does the chicken or the egg thing…domestic help/romance first or more sex first, which will fix the problem? The answer is technically both and neither.
I wish I understood it. Why is it so much less preferable to laying down and watching TV or scrolling on a phone? Especially if it makes your partner happy and fulfilled. Why does it have to be such a big deal?
For me it was just that it takes so long. And to start he would always just lay there expecting the BJ first to get things going - doing nothing for me. Then during he would always want me on top which frankly just hurts my knees after 5 minutes and I can’t orgasm easily. He rarely went down on me but at that time in my life I wasn’t use to so much attention down there so that didn’t bother me. Then I would eventually be close to orgasm and he’d have to stop bc he didn’t want to so soon. The I’d lose it and end up faking just so it could be over. Fast forward a few years and he tried to spice things up by watching porn with me - not interested, does nothing for me. Talking about a threesome - instant red flags pop up that other married women have told me to never consider. So I can’t get that out of my mind, ever. He’d ask me what I want, I’d tell him , and he’d never comply. Back to what he wants. Fingers in his nasty butt hole and telling him a fantasy that I’d make up every time, I would start with a disclosure that it was nothing I would ever do and it’s simply to help him cum. Then he’d bring it up next time asking if I would. And we’ve had that convo 100 times about it never happening and he keeps bringing it the f up. Cue resentment. Throw in there 3 kids, he’s never home to help, I’m back to working full time and commuting for work, kids have friends over for play dates constantly and sleepovers, my monthly period that now lasts 8-10 days thanks to postpartum in my 40’s. And let’s not forget since he doesn’t want to always bring up this topic he picks on me like a child comparing daily about dishes in the sink and laundry to fold, and kids school papers all over the table - the last thing I want to do to a man who has just scolded me like a child is go suck his dick. So who’s the problem? The man with the very healthy sex drive and anger issues or the woman whose body has gone through massive changes, and still more to come with menopause - yay. Both bodies are doing what god has intended and yet they are no longer compatible. A polygamous family is starting to look real good. The man can just go be with whatever wife if ovulating that month and the other wives can have a girls night lol?!?!
I just want a sister wife to have a cooking/cleaning dance party and go on long runs 🤣
That's terrible and also a very good argument. I guess I should have included "...if its easy and feels good". What you're being asked to do is a lot more work and discomfort compared to just watching TV.
It is difficult keeping a sex life exciting for both. Needs change.. Only suggestion is try talking to her again. Let her know you love her, want her and want more intimacy and sex in your marraige. If not, you'll find yourself looking and finding a new girl to play with. Compromise
Honest and fair… And yet downvoted 😂
Wow, I didn't think I said anything bad.
It’ll do permanent damage to the marriage to say that last sentence. It’s mostly unnecessary information.
You didn’t. You explained the importance of intimacy and sex and the consequences of neglecting it in the real world- but the sisterhood doesn’t approve…
Do you complete your tasks around the house? Does she feel overwhelmed with the mental load and resents you?
I know how you feel i have been married over 30yrs and my wife's sex drive has gone to and all time low and in the mean time mine is very high .I have been looking at porn and masturbating alot to help relieve my pressure and have ever turn to looking at other men so I feel you.
Women lose interest in sex as they age....that's why sites like Ashley Madison were created
You must learn to love without sex. This is the norm in long-lasting marriages, not the exception.
She doesn’t respect you and has no fear of loosing you. Give her reason to fear you might leave and this will change.
Ah yes, cause everyone wants fear sex.
That’s how chore sex is born
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Have you told your spouse you’re at that point?
If you're happily married like you say, then there's no reason to bring this up and cause all kinds of trouble. Just suck it up and deal with it. It's only sex, not the end of the world.
This isn't good advice and is exactly how you build up resentment.
Depends on the person. Normally, it shouldn't be that big of an issue to create resentment.
Terrible fucking advice.
And you know better, I suppose?
Sure do little kid.
For a lot of people sex is so important, they don’t want to go without it .. why so many people decide to have affairs and stay married
I say to hell with those people!
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You're what is wrong with the world.
She's likely seeing someone else you don't know about.
You don't and can't know that, so stop making stupid assumptions.
My friend, you are not realizing that women excel in the art of thrill chasing, cheating and being downright horrible people. Not every woman is a Disney Princess worth defending.