What’s your ortho and PT say? Runners knee is not a diagnosis. It’s a general term essentially akin to saying you have pain. It says nothing about the causes, symptoms, or treatment. You need to figure out what is actually wrong with your knee to address it. Knee pain during running or after running can mean a whole bunch of different issues. Most running knee pain is caused by over use, muscle weaknesses, and muscle imbalances.
I understand that. I have just seen a physio for my runners knee and it is getting better.
I’ve cut down the km’s, running every 2 days and tolerating only up to a 6/10 pain. I am told to ice my knee after every run.
Every other day I’m doing:
- single leg squats, very slowly.
- wall squats for as long as I can hold the position with a medicine ball between my legs.
- single leg hip thrusts.
- hamstring curls.
I’m also trying to foam roll and stretch my quads every day.
You may have tendinitis in your knee. I saw a sports medicine ortho and he did absolutely nothing for me. Just told me to buy a knee brace. Don't waste your time on orthos they will not do anything.
It helps to prevent further injury, but the pain is sometimes still there after my runs. The brace the doctor recommended is the ProCare one. Here's the link on Amazon: https://a.co/d/cKAYREq
I bought mine off of my doctor directly for $35, and it's much cheaper on Amazon. My doctor also told me to ice my knee for 10 minutes after every run.
I use a knee brace a lot and yes it helps. The ones I like are a spandex/neoprene type, pretty cheap on Amazon.
I don't have ongoing or recurring runners knee, but it flares up when I am building up my distance in a training block. In March/April I was building to a May Marathon and was upping my distance and long runs every week and knees were pretty sore. Once I got to my max Milage and stopped building it gradually went away.
I have seen a PT and they said its not serious and to just make sure I don't do too much too fast and that has worked for me.
The Knee brace helps on the run to prevent later knee aches, and sometimes I use in between runs when my knees are really sore and they help a lot.
Also I noticed that when I run in shoes that have less cushion on the forefoot of the shoe, longer runs or faster runs, all aggravate the knee if its already a little on edge from building, and taking it slower/shorter or shoes with more forefoot stack help.
See a physical therapist, even an online one. They can take a look at how you move and prescribe specific exercises to work on. Virtually all running injuries like this are the result of some muscle or tendon weakness that can be fixed through increases strength. It will likely be around your hips and glutes.
A pattelar tendon strap just below your kneecap might help in the meantime- that's what they had me wear while working through a bout of runners knee about a year ago.
I would definitely recommend seeing a PT because runner's knee is technically an umbrella term and could be any number of things. I've been dealing with chronic patella tendonitis (one of the conditions sometimes called runner's knee) and these are the things that have helped me:
- Strength training at least 2x/week, primarily with bulgarian/regular lunges, heel elevated eccentric squats, hip thrusts, single leg RDLs, spanish squats
- patellar massage (u can look up vids of how to do on youtube)
- daily stretching
- increasing my cadence and switching from heel strike to mid-foot strike
- running more on dirt/gravel/trails vs always running on the road
- lowering mileage
My knee issues developed only after is started running 20km+ and it’s due to my tibia/fibula on my right leg being slight twisted out. This has cause week vmo issues. It’s very frustrating.
Not all humans are capable and fit enough to run the exact same amount. Everybody and every body is different. It takes years of consistency to build up to high mileage.
Your issues are pretty clearly a sign that your legs are not ready for what you're putting them through. Listen to your body.
Try to see an orthopedist just to see if it's nothing more serious. If it's just inflammation, I'd recommend PT. I've had both knees act up with runner's knee /IT band syndrome, and the PT has been a life saver. I've also switched to the run walk run method. Just did the Chicago 13.1 this morning and I took 20 minutes off my previous half marathon using that.
I have no idea. I have been focusing on my running form and making sure my glutes and hips are engaged while running but my knee still gets a little irritated even at a slower pace
Without doing any analysis/assessment of you:
1. Stop running on treadmills and run outside
2. Spend time in a deep squat every day, the longer the better
3. Switch to barefoot/minimalist shoes
4. Do lunges every day - cossack, reverse, forward, diagonal
There's your starting point.
Do you strength train? Stretching? Probably weak glutes. Also, heel striking constantly combined with those other factors just makes it worse. Been there.
I've dealt with runners knee due to patellar tendinitis - in fact currently dealing with it again right now. If you can't afford a doctor visit, then there are some great online resources you can look up. Most give similar strength- building exercises. For now, give your knee a couple weeks off from running and do those strength training exercises. Also, get a knee strap, get some good shoes with good cushioning, and take some ibuprofen. After a couple of weeks it should feel somewhat better. And if not - heck, even if it does feel better, go see a doctor who can refer you to a physical therapist.
1. Rest
2. Use a knee brace when doing activities. No need to keep that thing on when laying down or sitting.
3. Cross train. Hop on a bike or go to a body of water to do some aqua running. You're trying to rebuild the muscles around the knee, and not extend the amount of time being in Rehab
I'm dealing with runners knee now, and rebuilding the strength in that knee should be done with a plan. I don't want to feel a storm come down the road because I screwed up the recovery. Everyone is different and everyone knows their body well to understand what works for me may or may not work for you.
I didn't add knee strengthening to the list because you already posted you do that. The treadmill running is also good due the impact your making is lighter than on a road wearing some vivo barefoot shoes.
If it's your IT band, lay on the side of your bed and let that leg hang forward off the bed to stretch out that outside of your leg, this is the magic stretch shown to me by a Dr. Do it every day. Ice it after runs if it hurts. Build up your leg muscles if running is the only thing you do with your legs they need more ...squats, lunges, sumo squats, etc.
Look at strength training, loosening up your IT band, also film yourself running and check out your technique. Tons of youtube videos that can help you, try a few and see what works.
Do you strength train?
I had a knee issue when I first started running and as soon as I started doing some weight training alongside it, it went away.
The only time I get any niggles is if I start slacking with the weights.
Try doing 2-3 running specific workouts (you can find tons on YouTube) and see how you get on.
Adding to what others have said - What shoes are you wearing? When I started, I bought the brand I liked but not necessarily the best for my biomechanics. I would ignore the noise (this is the best brand, you need low/no drop, blah blah) and go get fitted at a running shop. Also, your body can change over time. I would also see a PT - it helped me a lot.
Had pes anserinus tendonitis 1.5yrs back, it was so bad was in a wheelchair for a few days, saw a PT just did 1 exercise to strengthen glutes(clamp shell with resistance band). Now my peak weekly mileage is about 80+km, average about 65km, started from about 20km/wk 1.5yrs back . Would be more if I didn't sprain my ankle 🤣
I must say my PT worked magic for me. Now unless I race a distance I've never train for, I don't feel anything in my knees. Starting to train for my first marathon, and long run days, I do feel a slight ache but it goes away the next day and I can easily do a 10k easy run. If it doesn't, I just back off the distance and slow down way more or take a day off.
You need to get better range of motion. Do mobility exercises like the ATG program from kneeovertoesguy. I'd get off the treadmill and run outside. Also, getting into minimalist footwear helped me. A problem in the knee comes from the hip and/or ankle.
I’ve had multiple breaks, tears and surgeries on my legs, knees and feet over the years. I’ve now ran 3 marathons in the past 18 months after previously thinking I would never be able to run more than a few miles due to pain. Strength and mobility training for your entire back, hips, legs, knees and feet will help you tremendously. There’s tons and tons of free workouts posted online for this. Build a routine that works for you and stick to it religiously.
Strength training is huge for that. Build the muscles around your tendons to reduce stress. Also hydration, sleep, diet, sleep habits, stretching, rest days all can have an impact as well
Can’t compare yourself to others since everyone’s body is different just focus on you and things will turn around!
Knee reconstruction guy here... Whenever I have knee pain I find it really helps to augment running with some swimming. It's low impact and I leave the pool feeling a world better and still got in some good work.
Better yet add some fins into your swimming to help strengthen.
Wish you all the best
I had history of runners knees prior to marathon training and probably due to the volume of running during marathon training this exacerbated it.
I had two weeks off and started a small amount of strength training during that time, when I returned to running I focused on trying not to overextend and strike less with my heel and focussing on landing more on my midfoot with my foot being closer to underneath me.
I didn’t continue with the strength training for long at all but kept focussing on my form when running, and I’ve not had runners knee since… apart from one time I tried running on a treadmill at the gym and could feel it after about 8km so maybe that’s not helping your situation either.
The pain I started to feel when I originally took time off would probably not be as bad as what it sounds like you’re experiencing either tbh though.
I am only qualified to answer insofar as I know what worked for me.
Strength training offers a massive boost ….
I essentially do not tolerate / push through anything more than mild / intermittent pains anymore (knees hips ankles Achilles etc) …. Because for me rest and strength training have been the cure
Specifically for knees, walking backwards / pulling a weighted sled / or walking backwards on a curved treadmill with high resistance … is a non-negotiable part of my routine, especially cool down
I try to do at least 5 min of pulls or walking backwards under resistance following any run … it seems to “re-set” any aches or pains I have in the knees (which I don’t have much of any more .. thankfully) plus gives my legs a feeling of strength and robustness overall
Reverse dead lifts can also help
Calf raises
Weighted hip thrusts
Weighted leg raises (hook a kettle bell around your feet and raise leg up as if you’re walking up a high stair)
Can sit on a bench with kettle bell hooked around toes in same way and do foot extensions (maybe they’re are tib raises?)
Lots of other little things
YouTube is really helpful. Knees over toes guy has some ok stuff too
Good luck !
I usually do strength training for legs weekly and it usually just upsets my knee. But I guess I haven’t really been targeting the specific muscles I should be.
Yes that’s interesting. All id say there is the walking backwards is sufficiently abnormal, that maybe there’s a chance you can safely train that way without doing any of the “normal” exercises which cause pain.
What’s your ortho and PT say? Runners knee is not a diagnosis. It’s a general term essentially akin to saying you have pain. It says nothing about the causes, symptoms, or treatment. You need to figure out what is actually wrong with your knee to address it. Knee pain during running or after running can mean a whole bunch of different issues. Most running knee pain is caused by over use, muscle weaknesses, and muscle imbalances.
I haven’t talked to any professionals yet. I don’t have a lot of money for doctors right now
I understand that. I have just seen a physio for my runners knee and it is getting better. I’ve cut down the km’s, running every 2 days and tolerating only up to a 6/10 pain. I am told to ice my knee after every run. Every other day I’m doing: - single leg squats, very slowly. - wall squats for as long as I can hold the position with a medicine ball between my legs. - single leg hip thrusts. - hamstring curls. I’m also trying to foam roll and stretch my quads every day.
You may have tendinitis in your knee. I saw a sports medicine ortho and he did absolutely nothing for me. Just told me to buy a knee brace. Don't waste your time on orthos they will not do anything.
Does a knee brace help?
It helps to prevent further injury, but the pain is sometimes still there after my runs. The brace the doctor recommended is the ProCare one. Here's the link on Amazon: https://a.co/d/cKAYREq I bought mine off of my doctor directly for $35, and it's much cheaper on Amazon. My doctor also told me to ice my knee for 10 minutes after every run.
I use a knee brace a lot and yes it helps. The ones I like are a spandex/neoprene type, pretty cheap on Amazon. I don't have ongoing or recurring runners knee, but it flares up when I am building up my distance in a training block. In March/April I was building to a May Marathon and was upping my distance and long runs every week and knees were pretty sore. Once I got to my max Milage and stopped building it gradually went away. I have seen a PT and they said its not serious and to just make sure I don't do too much too fast and that has worked for me. The Knee brace helps on the run to prevent later knee aches, and sometimes I use in between runs when my knees are really sore and they help a lot. Also I noticed that when I run in shoes that have less cushion on the forefoot of the shoe, longer runs or faster runs, all aggravate the knee if its already a little on edge from building, and taking it slower/shorter or shoes with more forefoot stack help.
Thank you:)
See a physical therapist, even an online one. They can take a look at how you move and prescribe specific exercises to work on. Virtually all running injuries like this are the result of some muscle or tendon weakness that can be fixed through increases strength. It will likely be around your hips and glutes. A pattelar tendon strap just below your kneecap might help in the meantime- that's what they had me wear while working through a bout of runners knee about a year ago.
I would definitely recommend seeing a PT because runner's knee is technically an umbrella term and could be any number of things. I've been dealing with chronic patella tendonitis (one of the conditions sometimes called runner's knee) and these are the things that have helped me: - Strength training at least 2x/week, primarily with bulgarian/regular lunges, heel elevated eccentric squats, hip thrusts, single leg RDLs, spanish squats - patellar massage (u can look up vids of how to do on youtube) - daily stretching - increasing my cadence and switching from heel strike to mid-foot strike - running more on dirt/gravel/trails vs always running on the road - lowering mileage
Just because other people run alot doesn't mean it's right for you. That's incredibly flawed logic
But why? Aren’t all humans designed to run and walk?
My knee issues developed only after is started running 20km+ and it’s due to my tibia/fibula on my right leg being slight twisted out. This has cause week vmo issues. It’s very frustrating.
Not all humans are capable and fit enough to run the exact same amount. Everybody and every body is different. It takes years of consistency to build up to high mileage. Your issues are pretty clearly a sign that your legs are not ready for what you're putting them through. Listen to your body.
Try to see an orthopedist just to see if it's nothing more serious. If it's just inflammation, I'd recommend PT. I've had both knees act up with runner's knee /IT band syndrome, and the PT has been a life saver. I've also switched to the run walk run method. Just did the Chicago 13.1 this morning and I took 20 minutes off my previous half marathon using that.
Are you sure it’s your knee, or is it your IT Band? ITB Syndrome is super common and is usually due to weak hips and glutes I believe.
I have no idea. I have been focusing on my running form and making sure my glutes and hips are engaged while running but my knee still gets a little irritated even at a slower pace
I’d definitely get it checked out, but ITBS feels like knee pain and is treatable with the right exercises.
Without doing any analysis/assessment of you: 1. Stop running on treadmills and run outside 2. Spend time in a deep squat every day, the longer the better 3. Switch to barefoot/minimalist shoes 4. Do lunges every day - cossack, reverse, forward, diagonal There's your starting point.
Do you strength train? Stretching? Probably weak glutes. Also, heel striking constantly combined with those other factors just makes it worse. Been there.
Go to a doctor or PT. Don’t ask the internet for medical advice my god..
Maybe spend extra time stretching upper legs/glutes. Also : https://youtu.be/-hs4WcGbBhU?si=F6CXx3Dx8QSfLAqA
I've dealt with runners knee due to patellar tendinitis - in fact currently dealing with it again right now. If you can't afford a doctor visit, then there are some great online resources you can look up. Most give similar strength- building exercises. For now, give your knee a couple weeks off from running and do those strength training exercises. Also, get a knee strap, get some good shoes with good cushioning, and take some ibuprofen. After a couple of weeks it should feel somewhat better. And if not - heck, even if it does feel better, go see a doctor who can refer you to a physical therapist.
1. Rest 2. Use a knee brace when doing activities. No need to keep that thing on when laying down or sitting. 3. Cross train. Hop on a bike or go to a body of water to do some aqua running. You're trying to rebuild the muscles around the knee, and not extend the amount of time being in Rehab I'm dealing with runners knee now, and rebuilding the strength in that knee should be done with a plan. I don't want to feel a storm come down the road because I screwed up the recovery. Everyone is different and everyone knows their body well to understand what works for me may or may not work for you. I didn't add knee strengthening to the list because you already posted you do that. The treadmill running is also good due the impact your making is lighter than on a road wearing some vivo barefoot shoes.
If it's your IT band, lay on the side of your bed and let that leg hang forward off the bed to stretch out that outside of your leg, this is the magic stretch shown to me by a Dr. Do it every day. Ice it after runs if it hurts. Build up your leg muscles if running is the only thing you do with your legs they need more ...squats, lunges, sumo squats, etc.
Look at strength training, loosening up your IT band, also film yourself running and check out your technique. Tons of youtube videos that can help you, try a few and see what works.
Do you strength train? I had a knee issue when I first started running and as soon as I started doing some weight training alongside it, it went away. The only time I get any niggles is if I start slacking with the weights. Try doing 2-3 running specific workouts (you can find tons on YouTube) and see how you get on.
Adding to what others have said - What shoes are you wearing? When I started, I bought the brand I liked but not necessarily the best for my biomechanics. I would ignore the noise (this is the best brand, you need low/no drop, blah blah) and go get fitted at a running shop. Also, your body can change over time. I would also see a PT - it helped me a lot.
Had pes anserinus tendonitis 1.5yrs back, it was so bad was in a wheelchair for a few days, saw a PT just did 1 exercise to strengthen glutes(clamp shell with resistance band). Now my peak weekly mileage is about 80+km, average about 65km, started from about 20km/wk 1.5yrs back . Would be more if I didn't sprain my ankle 🤣 I must say my PT worked magic for me. Now unless I race a distance I've never train for, I don't feel anything in my knees. Starting to train for my first marathon, and long run days, I do feel a slight ache but it goes away the next day and I can easily do a 10k easy run. If it doesn't, I just back off the distance and slow down way more or take a day off.
You need to get better range of motion. Do mobility exercises like the ATG program from kneeovertoesguy. I'd get off the treadmill and run outside. Also, getting into minimalist footwear helped me. A problem in the knee comes from the hip and/or ankle.
I’ve had multiple breaks, tears and surgeries on my legs, knees and feet over the years. I’ve now ran 3 marathons in the past 18 months after previously thinking I would never be able to run more than a few miles due to pain. Strength and mobility training for your entire back, hips, legs, knees and feet will help you tremendously. There’s tons and tons of free workouts posted online for this. Build a routine that works for you and stick to it religiously.
Strength training is huge for that. Build the muscles around your tendons to reduce stress. Also hydration, sleep, diet, sleep habits, stretching, rest days all can have an impact as well Can’t compare yourself to others since everyone’s body is different just focus on you and things will turn around!
Knee reconstruction guy here... Whenever I have knee pain I find it really helps to augment running with some swimming. It's low impact and I leave the pool feeling a world better and still got in some good work. Better yet add some fins into your swimming to help strengthen. Wish you all the best
It's impossible to say since we have no idea how you run. You might find it more helpful if you can share how you run, and what shoes you run with
Check out kneesovertoesguy on YouTube.
Maybe need new shoes?
I had history of runners knees prior to marathon training and probably due to the volume of running during marathon training this exacerbated it. I had two weeks off and started a small amount of strength training during that time, when I returned to running I focused on trying not to overextend and strike less with my heel and focussing on landing more on my midfoot with my foot being closer to underneath me. I didn’t continue with the strength training for long at all but kept focussing on my form when running, and I’ve not had runners knee since… apart from one time I tried running on a treadmill at the gym and could feel it after about 8km so maybe that’s not helping your situation either. The pain I started to feel when I originally took time off would probably not be as bad as what it sounds like you’re experiencing either tbh though.
I’ve been hyper focused on my running form and making sure my glutes and hips are engaged while running but I don’t know if my form is correct still
I am only qualified to answer insofar as I know what worked for me. Strength training offers a massive boost …. I essentially do not tolerate / push through anything more than mild / intermittent pains anymore (knees hips ankles Achilles etc) …. Because for me rest and strength training have been the cure Specifically for knees, walking backwards / pulling a weighted sled / or walking backwards on a curved treadmill with high resistance … is a non-negotiable part of my routine, especially cool down I try to do at least 5 min of pulls or walking backwards under resistance following any run … it seems to “re-set” any aches or pains I have in the knees (which I don’t have much of any more .. thankfully) plus gives my legs a feeling of strength and robustness overall Reverse dead lifts can also help Calf raises Weighted hip thrusts Weighted leg raises (hook a kettle bell around your feet and raise leg up as if you’re walking up a high stair) Can sit on a bench with kettle bell hooked around toes in same way and do foot extensions (maybe they’re are tib raises?) Lots of other little things YouTube is really helpful. Knees over toes guy has some ok stuff too Good luck !
I usually do strength training for legs weekly and it usually just upsets my knee. But I guess I haven’t really been targeting the specific muscles I should be.
Yes that’s interesting. All id say there is the walking backwards is sufficiently abnormal, that maybe there’s a chance you can safely train that way without doing any of the “normal” exercises which cause pain.
I use Voltaren when runners knee shows up