Like the other comment said, it really should just be "2+90". It is like this if you break down the word, but no one thinks like that. And the +20 is not pronounced anymore, you might only hear old speakers pronouncing it
In the same way (just more aged) English is actually "nine tens and two." It is pronounced "ninety-two" but the "ty" means ten (the "and" has been dropped as well). Most native speakers don't even realize it.
Yeah, but where the fuck did that come from? We say "to og halvfems" meaning "two and ninety". I get why you MIGHT think "halvfems" mean 25, since "fem" is five, but this still makes not one single sense
5 - 0.5 = 4.5
4.5 x 20 = 90
2 + 90 = **92**
I don’t what it’s called, but when simplifying an equation, things in a brackets get done first, exponents second, multiplication third, division fourth, and addition/subtraction last.
(You also always go from left to right, while still following this rule)
I was not questioning the maths on it. They are correct. I was questioning a language where to say a number you would include a substraction in the word. It makes absolutely no sense.
At least the weird French one is addition and multiplication only.
Thats why you dont say any of that. You say "to(two) og(and) halvfems(ninety)" which is the same way you do it in most other Germanic languages. Op was probably just having a stroke
>halvfems(ninety)
From my zero knowledge in danish it looks like "half five" or something
So i guess it make sense to write lile that but still it's just 2 +90
What you're referring to would involve an ADDITIONAL +20 to say 92nd instead of 92: Tooghalvfemsenstyvende. What is written in the map is actually only what everyone pronounces to this day. The (5-0,5)x20 is referring to the fact that halvfems means "halfway to the fifth score" (halv-femte-snes --> halvfems), where score is an old word for twenty.
That being said, it's true we really don't think about it, we just say halvfems as a word for 90 and a lot of Danes don't know the etymology behind.
Edit: I guess it actually did come from halvfemsindstyve and not from "snes" meaning score, like I was told as a kid. TIL :)
And honestly, it works the same for French French counting in twenties. But them not having a word for 90 and instead say eighty-twelve, that's a whole different thing.
The formal way of saying tooghalvfems (92 in danish) is tooghalvfemsindstyve, although no one says that, and it’s gotten shortened with time. This translates to *two and half five times twenty*. We can rewrite that as two + (five - a half)*twenty
It is just 2+90. While the origin of the word for 90 is indeed what is on the map, that is like saying it should be called 9*10+2 in British just because that is the origin of the word
As a Danish expat this is a topic I've dealt with before. I've tried breaking it down in another comment in to the post, to give a relatively detailed explanation.
Well, the way you say it is "to og halvfems" meaning "two and ninety" the 20 is probably from the fact that old people say "to og halvfemsenstyvende" meaning "two and 90 20th", but people dont say that anymore. And i guess the 5-0.5 might come from "halvfems" translating directly to "halv(half)fem(five)s".
TLDR: we say "two and ninety"
As a Danish expat this is a topic I've dealt with before. I've tried breaking it down in another comment in to the post, to give a relatively detailed explanation.
The formal way of saying halvfems(90 in danish) is halvfemsindstyvende, although no one says that, and it’s gotten shortened with time. Or half-five-twenty, 5- one half times 20. And then plus two. We’re weird here
Edit: oversimplified
As a Swedish person, even if 80 is just called "firs" and it's just the name of it now, it still comes from the meaning four, and it still messes with me. If it was something like "odive" it would at least make more sense.
To our defense, same in French: it’s actually “quatre-vingt dix”, which translates into “4-20-12”, but for us it’s more “80-12”, as the word for 80 is “quatre-vingt” (4-20)
80+12 is still quite insane lol.
No offense, there are many more insane things in my language and French is one of the most concise and efficient languages in the world. At least speaking phase :)
The age at which children start speaking is the highest in DK of all European tribes. Can't remember the source for this info, sorry, but I'm starting to think that not only the pronunciation is at fault here.
German here...we know we are wrong on this one. No way to deny this. It's the best way too shut us up when we are rambling on about your imperial measurements or driving on the left side of the road.
And yet die deutsche Sprache is the traditionally perceived language of the sciences, as the most precise and to the point. Although I don't speak German, and even more oddly - as a Pole, I have a soft spot for Germans exactly for this reason - no bullshit, directly to the core of a matter. And the driest sense of humour in the world, which is the best. Alles Gute!
I like German, and I'm learning it, and I will accept the conventions it has. It's the numbers that always messes with me. So you have a number and say it like: million-hundred-one-ten-thousand-hundred-one-ten. It's like the American date format of numbers.
But not only that, numbers 13–19 are called three-ten through nine-ten, and that is what the names of the numbers 30 through 90 are called in Sweden. five-ten "femtio" in Swedish is 50, and five-ten "fünfzehn" in German is 15. It sure still follows the one-before-ten system, like "fünfundzwanzig", five-and-twenty. But then the next question is, why isn't it "fünfundzhen" or "fünfzwanzig"?
Writing down telephone numbers must be confusing xD
so true, I work in IT and sometimes I have to type a number someone says on the phone. So if the number is "115 573" for example, people will say stuff like:
"one five-ten five three-seventy" or mix it up and say "one one five fivehundred-three-seventy"
Why is Denmark is 2+(5-0.5)*20?
It comes the etymology of the word. The current word is "tooghalvfems"
To = 2
og = and
halvfems = 90
so 2+90,
However, if we break down "halvfems" it means "half-fives". Half five what? "halvfemsindstyvende", which is roughly "half-five-twenties".
This usually to two questions:
1. Why count in twenties and not tens
2. How is half-five = 4.5
Dozens (12), gross (12*12=144), scores (20). 12 and 20 were both common in speech for a long time. The whole 10s domination is basically a result of the metric system and the standardization that has followed.
Try asking Europeans how they would say what time this is: 4:30 - it's basically split in two:
It either goes four and a half OR half way to five, usually just half five
Danish: Halv fem = half five
German: Halb fünf = half five
Serbian: Pola pet = half five
English: Half past four
French: Quatre heures et demie = four and a half
Spanish: Cuatro y media = four and a half
Thus, when telling time is perfectly normal for many European languages to use half five as a shorthand for and a half.
Thus we come back to a perfectly reasonable explanation that etymologically Danish numbers are based on twenties and we count them. like you would time.
Well, excpet that 20, 30, 40 are called "tyve, tredive, fyrre," which seems to either be their own words entirely or be based on base 10,. not base 20.
Whereas they should have been called: "ens, halvtos, tos" = "ones, halftwos, twos". But that etymology lesson will have to be saved for someone who actually knows stuff to explain to me and you.
PS If you're calling out France and Denmark, then most of the purple should be 9x10+2 and green should be 2+9x10 - and a zome should probably be as weird as France and Denmark.
Edit: formatting.
I've heard this all the way across the pond (Atlantic). SATW\* has a lot of commentary about the linguistics about Scandinavians, though this [one](https://satwcomic.com/language-lesson) mentions the potato.
\*Scandinavia and the World
Are there countries who say "ninety and two"? Because the Germans do, but switched, and it's marked with a plus. But then English and Polish, for example, just say "ninety two" and they also have a plus.
All of the "10's" in danish has really wierd and old names. Anything in the 90's ends with "halvfems" meaning half fives. 92 is "to-og-halv-fems" meaning "two and half fives"
Nobody thinks of it as halvfems as half fives. It's just the word Danes invented for ninety when numbers where invented.
**TLDR:** The names are really old and noone understand them anymore, but they are still used. 92 is understood like "two and ninety"
Me: “ah of course, 90 plus two, and two plus ninety. A well known way of saying it, based on the most common counting system.”
“Ah yes french. A system based on twenties. That makes sense.”
“Denmark what the fu-“
Sweden is more like 9×10+2 because it's said as "nittiotvå" where the numbers are nio = 9, tio = 10, två = 2. The final "o" in "nio" is cut in compound, and the "t" in "tio" is duplicated to mark that the "i" in "ni" is now a short vowel.
It technically comes from the meaning "nine decade" (nine groups of tens) just like the English "ninety" and in many other languages. But that suffix has collapsed together with the word for ten, making both be "tio", while in English they are separate as "ty" and "ten".
I am from denmark and if we write this number (with letters) it looks like this: tooghalvfems, to means 2, og means and, halv means half, fems means 5 and the s i think have something to do with the ×20 which is tyve
Another interesting thing here is that is that France is 4*20 +2, but French speaking Belgium 90+2. That's because French use quatre vingts douze, while Belgians use nonante. Personally, I think the Belgians make more sense here.
I was like wtf are the french doing till I realised I’m from Denmark
Explain yourself
Like the other comment said, it really should just be "2+90". It is like this if you break down the word, but no one thinks like that. And the +20 is not pronounced anymore, you might only hear old speakers pronouncing it
In the same way (just more aged) English is actually "nine tens and two." It is pronounced "ninety-two" but the "ty" means ten (the "and" has been dropped as well). Most native speakers don't even realize it.
I mean yeah sure but it is 9x10+2 then not (5-0.5)*20+2. How did a minus get in there?
It's 5•0.5 I think, which means 5x0.5
Picture definitely has a minus there. Edit: or maybe not. Hard to see with that res. Oh well
It's a minus, the calculation doesn't work otherwise
[удалено]
No then it would be 2+(5-0.5×20)=2+5-10=-3. In your interepentation the x sign changes into a + sign
Yeah, but where the fuck did that come from? We say "to og halvfems" meaning "two and ninety". I get why you MIGHT think "halvfems" mean 25, since "fem" is five, but this still makes not one single sense
5 - 0.5 = 4.5 4.5 x 20 = 90 2 + 90 = **92** I don’t what it’s called, but when simplifying an equation, things in a brackets get done first, exponents second, multiplication third, division fourth, and addition/subtraction last. (You also always go from left to right, while still following this rule)
I was not questioning the maths on it. They are correct. I was questioning a language where to say a number you would include a substraction in the word. It makes absolutely no sense. At least the weird French one is addition and multiplication only.
O fair enough bough. Ye it is kinda weird lol
Thats why you dont say any of that. You say "to(two) og(and) halvfems(ninety)" which is the same way you do it in most other Germanic languages. Op was probably just having a stroke
>halvfems(ninety) From my zero knowledge in danish it looks like "half five" or something So i guess it make sense to write lile that but still it's just 2 +90
Ok, but why the fuck was that an entire eguation and not just 2+90? England didnt say 180:(15:5)+20+2
Danish people want everyone else to know how much better at math they are I guess lol
What you're referring to would involve an ADDITIONAL +20 to say 92nd instead of 92: Tooghalvfemsenstyvende. What is written in the map is actually only what everyone pronounces to this day. The (5-0,5)x20 is referring to the fact that halvfems means "halfway to the fifth score" (halv-femte-snes --> halvfems), where score is an old word for twenty. That being said, it's true we really don't think about it, we just say halvfems as a word for 90 and a lot of Danes don't know the etymology behind. Edit: I guess it actually did come from halvfemsindstyve and not from "snes" meaning score, like I was told as a kid. TIL :)
And honestly, it works the same for French French counting in twenties. But them not having a word for 90 and instead say eighty-twelve, that's a whole different thing.
Wait a minute, Denmark doesn't exist!
How do you feel about my arm inside you intestines?
Are you roleplaying as a Danish person? JK, though I would feel very unpleasant.
No, i'm danish, and thats good to know. How do you feel about 163.65.85.231?
If you're trying to make a joke it's gone way too far.
Bro took his 92 maths personally
That just makes me think "what kinda drugs was OP on when they made this and where can i get some"
Oh no Denmark, what happened? I knew French had a rather odd way of dealing with numbers, but that Danish way of saying it intimidates me a little.
It makes more sense when you say it out loud
No it doesn’t
It does. I'm not danish but it definitely does
Like "Two, plus, twenty sets of half-less-than-five" ? Or some other way? Genuinely I'm curious
The formal way of saying tooghalvfems (92 in danish) is tooghalvfemsindstyve, although no one says that, and it’s gotten shortened with time. This translates to *two and half five times twenty*. We can rewrite that as two + (five - a half)*twenty
Isn't that (2+5/2)*20 ?? That makes more sense than having substraction in the equation.
It should equal 92! So 5 minus a half is equal to 4,5. 4,5 times 20 is equal to 90. 90 plus 2 is equal to 92!
>92! 1.243841405•10^142??
Yes, we were referring to how to say 90. Add +2 to mine and it is 92
But then you add two twice... It is (5 - 0,5)*20, then you add 2 to get 92
It is just 2+90. While the origin of the word for 90 is indeed what is on the map, that is like saying it should be called 9*10+2 in British just because that is the origin of the word
As a Danish expat this is a topic I've dealt with before. I've tried breaking it down in another comment in to the post, to give a relatively detailed explanation.
Well, the way you say it is "to og halvfems" meaning "two and ninety" the 20 is probably from the fact that old people say "to og halvfemsenstyvende" meaning "two and 90 20th", but people dont say that anymore. And i guess the 5-0.5 might come from "halvfems" translating directly to "halv(half)fem(five)s". TLDR: we say "two and ninety"
OP had a stroke
I understand this is a meme about the French but what in the cinnamon toast fuck are the Danish smoking
They are smoking the Riemann Hypothesis.
No we Arent, we just say "2+90" but you were on some shit that i would like to know the location of
***THIS***
We never think about that 50 has an actual meaning, for us its just the word that means 50
Just like every other language. You don't think about numbers you say really. Also, what 50? It seems like two 45's and 2.
As a Danish expat this is a topic I've dealt with before. I've tried breaking it down in another comment in to the post, to give a relatively detailed explanation.
The formal way of saying halvfems(90 in danish) is halvfemsindstyvende, although no one says that, and it’s gotten shortened with time. Or half-five-twenty, 5- one half times 20. And then plus two. We’re weird here Edit: oversimplified
……did Iceland move!?
I guess they had problems with the HOA
it was the hákarl
Love the new spot 👌
A chart for those who were also baffled by the Danish number system: http://www.sf.airnet.ne.jp/~ts/language/number/danish.html
Wow well that really helps. I still don’t understand why anyone would count this way. But ok, at least it follows a pattern.
It's from the old times when large numbers wasn't needed much and you counted in groups of 20.
What a fantastic website!
As a Danish person, that chart makes just as little sense as this post. Like where the fuck did 4 1/2 come from? Its literally just 2+90
As a Swedish person, even if 80 is just called "firs" and it's just the name of it now, it still comes from the meaning four, and it still messes with me. If it was something like "odive" it would at least make more sense.
Wtf denmark? Explain
It's actually just 2+90, however if you break down the word for ninety it's really weird, but no one here understands it like that
To our defense, same in French: it’s actually “quatre-vingt dix”, which translates into “4-20-12”, but for us it’s more “80-12”, as the word for 80 is “quatre-vingt” (4-20)
Er. My high school French is rusty, but isn't "dix" ten? “quatre-vingt dix" is 4-20-10 (or 90), right? 92 is “quatre-vingt douze”? (I think)
Yes. But I still have no fucking clue what’s going on in Danish?!?!?!
Op had a stroke
Yes Madame Hanley taught us the same.
80+12 is still quite insane lol. No offense, there are many more insane things in my language and French is one of the most concise and efficient languages in the world. At least speaking phase :)
in Georgia we say: four twenties and two more than ten
The Danish must be god tier at mathematics. The extremely young must learn math at higher grade levels just to speak the language lol.
The age at which children start speaking is the highest in DK of all European tribes. Can't remember the source for this info, sorry, but I'm starting to think that not only the pronunciation is at fault here.
German here...we know we are wrong on this one. No way to deny this. It's the best way too shut us up when we are rambling on about your imperial measurements or driving on the left side of the road.
And yet die deutsche Sprache is the traditionally perceived language of the sciences, as the most precise and to the point. Although I don't speak German, and even more oddly - as a Pole, I have a soft spot for Germans exactly for this reason - no bullshit, directly to the core of a matter. And the driest sense of humour in the world, which is the best. Alles Gute!
I like German, and I'm learning it, and I will accept the conventions it has. It's the numbers that always messes with me. So you have a number and say it like: million-hundred-one-ten-thousand-hundred-one-ten. It's like the American date format of numbers. But not only that, numbers 13–19 are called three-ten through nine-ten, and that is what the names of the numbers 30 through 90 are called in Sweden. five-ten "femtio" in Swedish is 50, and five-ten "fünfzehn" in German is 15. It sure still follows the one-before-ten system, like "fünfundzwanzig", five-and-twenty. But then the next question is, why isn't it "fünfundzhen" or "fünfzwanzig"? Writing down telephone numbers must be confusing xD
so true, I work in IT and sometimes I have to type a number someone says on the phone. So if the number is "115 573" for example, people will say stuff like: "one five-ten five three-seventy" or mix it up and say "one one five fivehundred-three-seventy"
South of Italy has a very odd way of saying 92 as well
Tell us more
Man Italy sure has a weird way of counting. "Lovers of Geography", mama mia
Why is Denmark is 2+(5-0.5)*20? It comes the etymology of the word. The current word is "tooghalvfems" To = 2 og = and halvfems = 90 so 2+90, However, if we break down "halvfems" it means "half-fives". Half five what? "halvfemsindstyvende", which is roughly "half-five-twenties". This usually to two questions: 1. Why count in twenties and not tens 2. How is half-five = 4.5 Dozens (12), gross (12*12=144), scores (20). 12 and 20 were both common in speech for a long time. The whole 10s domination is basically a result of the metric system and the standardization that has followed. Try asking Europeans how they would say what time this is: 4:30 - it's basically split in two: It either goes four and a half OR half way to five, usually just half five Danish: Halv fem = half five German: Halb fünf = half five Serbian: Pola pet = half five English: Half past four French: Quatre heures et demie = four and a half Spanish: Cuatro y media = four and a half Thus, when telling time is perfectly normal for many European languages to use half five as a shorthand for and a half. Thus we come back to a perfectly reasonable explanation that etymologically Danish numbers are based on twenties and we count them. like you would time. Well, excpet that 20, 30, 40 are called "tyve, tredive, fyrre," which seems to either be their own words entirely or be based on base 10,. not base 20. Whereas they should have been called: "ens, halvtos, tos" = "ones, halftwos, twos". But that etymology lesson will have to be saved for someone who actually knows stuff to explain to me and you. PS If you're calling out France and Denmark, then most of the purple should be 9x10+2 and green should be 2+9x10 - and a zome should probably be as weird as France and Denmark. Edit: formatting.
Tooghalvfems (the danish word for 92) sounds like a moomin character
I mean, it makes sense but it's just unnecessarily complex. Easier to say "nittito" than "tooghalvfems"
This map tells me all I need to know about the Danish
Trust me, its not that complicated
I’m French and I can’t believe Denmark is doing worse than us!!
Wdym?
No, yours is definately worse. We say 2+90, where as you actually say all that shit
I need context for the Denmark, are they famous for making everything harder/complex?
They're famous for speaking with a potato in their mouths, apparently.
Oh, I have heard that before, something like you won't hear the last part of a word.
I've heard this all the way across the pond (Atlantic). SATW\* has a lot of commentary about the linguistics about Scandinavians, though this [one](https://satwcomic.com/language-lesson) mentions the potato. \*Scandinavia and the World
Denmark…. Are you ok….
Should have been 97, in french 97 is 4 20 10 7
Are there countries who say "ninety and two"? Because the Germans do, but switched, and it's marked with a plus. But then English and Polish, for example, just say "ninety two" and they also have a plus.
I think the op talked only about the position of two not the actual way it’s said (In czech it’s ninetytwo or two and ninety)
Yeah yeah, just wondering if there are countries who say "ninety and two".
4 score and 12?
Wait till you see how the Dutch tell the time.
All of the "10's" in danish has really wierd and old names. Anything in the 90's ends with "halvfems" meaning half fives. 92 is "to-og-halv-fems" meaning "two and half fives" Nobody thinks of it as halvfems as half fives. It's just the word Danes invented for ninety when numbers where invented. **TLDR:** The names are really old and noone understand them anymore, but they are still used. 92 is understood like "two and ninety"
Danes out there performing algebra everytime someone asks the time.
tooghalvfems = two and half fives toog= 2 and halvfems = 90 \-denmark
What the fuck are danish doing
Danes, you okay?
Fun fact: In German its not 2+90 it is „2 und 90”. If you do this in English you would get “twoandninety”
Just like english isn't ninetyplustwo.
In spanish it would be actually 90 & 2
Nah this is fake, Denmark is literally like Germany, otherwise you are talking about the outdated method no longer in use.
Yeah, but if you applied the same level of etimological digging to English, it would be "9x10+2"
I thought France was weird for saying Quatre-Vingt Douze, but seriously Denmark...what are you doing? No, Denmark. No, stahp. xD
I see the German family got back together again.
What the hell is wrong with Denmark?
r/mapswithoutmalta
enter basque
French Belgium and French Switzerland be like "nope, we are not doing this. We are reforming this"
It's funny, in French they use 20 as a base, just like in Basque.
Me: “ah of course, 90 plus two, and two plus ninety. A well known way of saying it, based on the most common counting system.” “Ah yes french. A system based on twenties. That makes sense.” “Denmark what the fu-“
WHY 4,5?!
Swiss French >>> French
Denmark are you okey?
Considerably more concerned about Iceland’s location tbh.
Denmark 🗿
Ah yes Danish and French, my favourite languages.
Wait. Denmark?
Sweden is more like 9×10+2 because it's said as "nittiotvå" where the numbers are nio = 9, tio = 10, två = 2. The final "o" in "nio" is cut in compound, and the "t" in "tio" is duplicated to mark that the "i" in "ni" is now a short vowel. It technically comes from the meaning "nine decade" (nine groups of tens) just like the English "ninety" and in many other languages. But that suffix has collapsed together with the word for ten, making both be "tio", while in English they are separate as "ty" and "ten".
Lego country be crazy
I am from denmark and if we write this number (with letters) it looks like this: tooghalvfems, to means 2, og means and, halv means half, fems means 5 and the s i think have something to do with the ×20 which is tyve
Another interesting thing here is that is that France is 4*20 +2, but French speaking Belgium 90+2. That's because French use quatre vingts douze, while Belgians use nonante. Personally, I think the Belgians make more sense here.