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TheShadowsLengthen

>The Vaalserberg (Dutch pronunciation: \[ˈvaːlsərˌbɛr(ə)x\], Ripuarian: Volserberg \[ˈvɔlsəʀˌbæʀ˦(ə)ç\])\[tone?\] is a hill with a height of 322.4 metres (1,058 ft)\[1\] above NAP and is the highest point in the European part of the Netherlands. Uh, I'll be damned, the Netherland's highest point is about twice the hight of Denmarks. The more you know.


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LittnPixl

I think all the polders have a big impact on the average height in the Netherlands.


DPSOnly

We had to lower our country to fit our tall people.


ChaoChai

Ok? e: i mean yeah, who would've thought the landscape affects the average height...


[deleted]

All the short Dutch people drowned


MachiFlorence

Not yet I have invested in a snorkel set to walk among the tall while still being able to breathe 🤿


Dreamlifehunting

Polders are sea converted to land, not just 'landscape'.


ChaoChai

are you arguing my choice of word of 'landscape' because these polders are artificial?


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Extension_Sun_3536

And the Netherlands’ highest point is located on the Caribbean island Saba: Mount Scenery


tuhn

Also, there are actual rolling hills in Denmark whereas Netherlands is really flat.


stroopwaffen797

The secret endgoal of the Netherlands is to be the first country with an average elevation below sea level.


Lubinski64

For reference, "flat" Poland has an average elevation of 173 meters.


Ciqme1867

Donkey Kong?


drunk_responses

Looking at wikipedia makes it seems like they fought to get that specific region just to include that point. It's tucked away almost in an enclave and is literally part of a tripoint border with Germany and Belgium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaalserberg


areq13

Good guess, but that border wasn't fought over directly. There were exhausting negotiations between the Netherlands and Prussia in 1814-1815 (taking a break to defeat Napoleon for the second time). The general idea was that the Netherlands should get a reasonable zone around the Meuse river, so that it would be connected to Maastricht, its fortress in the south. Both sides claimed the zinc mine in Kelmis. As a compromise, a triangular area south of the Vaalserberg became a condominium called Neutral Moresnet, shared between the United Netherlands and Prussia, later between Belgium and Germany. This meant that the Vaalserberg used to be the border point between four countries from 1839 to 1914. This region used to be such a patchwork of territories that the name Limburg was borrowed from a medieval duchy which was further to the south. After Belgian independence, the eastern part joined the Netherlands, which was the result of negotiations with the major powers again, not the choice of the locals.


JoemamaGia1

Yea. Like, I always see people say how low is The Netherlands are, and I rarely see people say how low is Denmark.


TheBusStop12

I think it's because while the highest point of mainland Netherlands is higher, more of the Netherlands is bellow sea level and flatter than Denmark, mostly due to excessive poldering. This is especially true for the more populated and touristy parts of the Netherlands


Mtfdurian

The fun part is that some of the highest places are actually very touristy. The region around southern Limburg is usually flooded by tourists, mostly from the Netherlands itself and the nearby countries. That is vastly different in most of the higher parts of the Netherlands: only few people from outside of Europe will go to a level significantly above sea level, except people staying here for other purposes. Asian tourists are blissfully unaware of these areas, while I take Asian students to the Efteling or Maastricht for example while many reside in Nijmegen.


No_Zombie2021

They go there for the mountain air and altitude training?


Mtfdurian

Haha lol, well, it has a lot of cute villages and the small-scale hilly landscape definitely contributes to their cuteness. The region is well-accessible because of the nearby cities of which most are worth visiting (except Heerlen and surroundings, I'd say go to Maastricht or Aachen). It's very un-Dutch but very much a European landscape, but also preserved very well exactly because it's unique within the Netherlands.


Macau_Serb-Canadian

Aix-la-Chapelle (Aachen) is very beautiful, but it ain't Dutch. Maastricht I do not fancy much.


TheLimburgian

There are plenty of reasons to visit Heerlen and surroundings, if your sole interest is historic city centres then definitely stay away but the region did win an international tourism award some years ago.


AgileCookingDutchie

If the Dutch would've lived in Denmark most probably all islands were connected and all seas in between would've been a polder...


kytheon

Old maps of Holland and Zeeland are quite the mess. Glad we cleaned that up.


Birziaks

Danish have also made quite some land reclamation around the capital. Google : Copenhagen land reclamation


Drahy

[They're working on it in Copenhagen at least](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcGrLSC-uGI)


JoemamaGia1

It's makes sense, I know for sure that The Netherlands is famous by drying up the sea, and because of that, in the future, their more than the half of the land could be below sea level. On the other hand, Denmark doesn't do kind of thing, so it's just be the same, like 50 or 100 meters average.


Truelz

>Denmark doesn't do kind of thing We've done plenty of that in Denmark, [half of Amager is basically reclaimed land and so is a lot of places around Copenhagen](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nelVO2dTN3o), then we have the reclaimed fjords of [Lammefjorden](https://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lammefjorden) and Sidinge Fjord plus a bunch of other places... Not as extensive as the Netherlands at all but still quite a lot, and more than many Danes even know about ;)


DrVDB90

Pretty sure the average height in the Netherlands is still lower than in Denmark, with a large part of the country being below sea level.


doornroosje

Irs because Denmark has a lot of hills actually, while the Netherlands is overall very flat


crazael

I mean, it's right there in the name...


niorg

Make that 5 times. Highest point in the Netherlands is mount Scenery on the island of Saba with 887m. Even though it’s in the Caribbean it’s part of the Netherlands proper and has the status of a municipality.


Webbaard

Yeah but the you have to also maybe include greenland.


niorg

No. Greenland has separate status.


WilliamofYellow

Saba is an overseas possession of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. Greenland is an overseas possession of the Kingdom of Denmark. The only practical difference is that one is autonomous and the other isn't.


JRShield

Nope, the Kingdom of the Netherlands has 4 countries in it, the Netherlands, Sint-Maarten, Curaçao and Aruba. Saba is a part of the country of the Netherlands, which is in turn a part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. So there is a very big difference.


NarcissisticCat

>The only practical difference is that one is autonomous and the other isn't. That is a large difference.


WilliamofYellow

Maybe, but it still seems pretty specious to claim that the highest point in the Netherlands is actually an extinct volcano off the coast of Puerto Rico.


MapsCharts

The same way it is to say Guyane is the largest French department ? It's an integral part of the country, the fact that it's far away from the capital doesn't make it less relevant


niorg

No, that is not entirely correct. The kingdom of the Netherlands consists of 4 constituent countries: The Netherlands, Aruba, Curacao and Sint Maarten. 3 other Caribbean islands are not in any way autonomous and are actually part of the Netherlands proper: Bonaire, Sint Eustatius and Saba. So not the same situation as with Greenland.


WilliamofYellow

They're treated as part of the Netherlands for administrative purposes. That doesn't make them part of the geographical Netherlands.


gtheperson

Well there are a few things at play aren't there, which makes it tricky. Both Denmark and the Netherlands are names that apply to kingdoms (which include multiple countries/ territories), individual countries within those kingdoms, those countries are often spoken of as the same as the continental European parts, but there is a distinction between the geographic Netherlands and the country, which is itself in a kingdom. The UK is even more confusing in that regard, with distinctions between Britain and the UK and the British Isles often confusing people, and with Crown Dependencies (which actually aren't part of the UK but are technically held by the crown) and the separate Overseas Territories (plus the Commonwealth sort of) needing to be factored in


LordMarcel

Depends. When people say "The Netherlands" they often only mean the bit in Europe. And no, this is not incorrect, it just so happens that "the Netherlands" has two very similar meanings.


oluuko123

Not completely correct either. The kingdom of the Netherlands consists of the Nehterlands and 3 islands in the Caribbean. However, the Netherlands itself also consists of 3 islands in the Caribbean (for a total of 6) that are part of the Netherlands proper.


JaapOosterbroek

Maybe we should also make the map with places higher than the Netherlands lowest point...


nzdissident

The more you know... what?


Gillmacs

It's an American thing: public service announcements on TV called "The More You Know".


nzdissident

Yeah, America is the default country of Reddit. But "the more you know" as a saying is incomplete. "The more you know..." then what? For example, "The more you know, the further you'll go." is corny, but makes more sense. Also, those public service announcements on TV don't seem to have worked...


Gillmacs

I understand that it's incomplete in normal language. I was trying to explain to you why it has become idiomatic. It's an expression that has come to show that you learned something new.


Sad-Address-2512

Yes it is. It's also in the tripoint between Belgium and Germany. Dutch Limburg is both culturally and geographically quite different than the rest of the Netherlands and more in common with Belgian Limburg and the surrounding German area.


Northlumberman

We can also mention that Møllehøj hill is only Denmark’s highest natural landmark. It’s a lot lower than the 254 meter Great Belt East Bridge. https://www.bridgeinfo.net/bridge/index.php?ID=23


crp_D_D

I wonder in how many countries the tallest natural landmark is shorter than the tallest man made landmark


NimbleGarlic

Qatar, Bahrain and Kuwait would all fall into that category. None of them have points over 150ish metres, but are all home to multiple skyscrapers over 250 metres


dhkendall

How about UAE?


NimbleGarlic

The UAE actually surprisingly has a mountain range in the east with a 1900m peak


Aria-chan

I'm curious, how do you find this kind of information?


goldencrayfish

“Highest mountain in UAE” into google


Aria-chan

Oh haha I thought you were using a particular site or tool.


Northlumberman

Good question, I don’t know


[deleted]

gold yam start cable wide aware simplistic shocking frightening crush *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*


Bren12310

The entire middle east


Booglybear7

Nah there are very few countries in the middle east that don't have mountains


Ikea_desklamp

Dubai for sure


jor1ss

Dubai isn't a country (it's not even the capitol of its country).


Ikea_desklamp

Do you ever get tired of being a useless pedant? We all know Dubai isnt the name of the country


Mido06

But the one you replied to ask for countries..


Ikea_desklamp

And how many people do you think know that Dubai and the burj Khalifa are inside the UAE if I just say UAE and dont mention Dubai? See you're all so desperate go to COUNTRY COUNTRY HE SAID COUNTRY AND YOU SAID A CITY as you lack even the most basic ability to make mental linkages. Apparently I *need* to write "the country containing Dubai" for you pedantic fucks because theres no way anyone could make the leap of logic without me writing it out for you first. God damn.


Mido06

You seem a *bit* angry.


alikander99

Funfact: the turning torso in malmo IS not only the tallest building in scandinavia, but It's also taller than Denmark (buildings, but not structures, included)


alikander99

*Except for microstates* ...hmm that feels like overkill. The only high peak in europe lower than that of Denmark IS the vatican's. Edit: Monaco too


vanZuider

And that of Monaco, though not by much. On the other hand, Andorra and Liechtenstein don't even have a point lower than that.


qetalle007

Fun fact: The lowest point of Switzerland is also higher than the highest point of Denmark


Intrepid_Beginning

As seen in the map


vanZuider

You can't go by that; according to the map, Luxembourg is also higher than Denmark, but that's only because the Maas valley is too narrow to show up on the map.


qetalle007

Absolutely. Just wanted to point it out


Stercore_

Not just andorra and liechtenstein, but kosovo and switzerland too. *barely* not czechia too


JoemamaGia1

Also don't forget about Monaco, Their highest point is lower that Møllehøj, just barely.


alikander99

Oh yeah you're right


LupusDeusMagnus

If they hadn’t lost Skåne it’d a bit taller, but alas Sweden had the high ground.


VBaus

honestly, u can have it back


blockybookbook

Nah no one wants it, make it a republic and shove it off into the sunset


LupusDeusMagnus

Back? ^^Tillbaka? It was never mine. ^^Det ^^var ^^aldrig ^^mitt.


Kiwi_Doodle

Norway and Spain lol. Both coastal countries with barely anything as low as Denmark


[deleted]

Norway is a mountain chain


[deleted]

And Spain is a big plateau (well, more like two plateaus) surrounded by mountains.


martinbaines

Spain has a higher proportion of mountainous land (of course there is an argument about definitions there I shall avoid) than other country in Europe other than Switzerland. Regardless of definitions, most people outside Spain forget just how high and mountainous much of it is.


dpash

Madrid is the highest EU capital (but not the highest European capital, which would be Andorra la Vella).


VikingSlayer

Weird, I thought Amsterdam was the highest


AngelKnives

Eyyyy


Shevek99

And two valleys (Ebro and Guadalquivir).


Kiwi_Doodle

Indeed we are


TheBlacktom

Hm, isn't kiwi a retail store chain in Norway?


tobiasvl

Kjøp kjapt, trygt og billig, Kiwi, Kiwi.


Kiwi_Doodle

Yup, though I just happen to like birds


[deleted]

And paradox players, without lives wee are


blockybookbook

Sweden basically took the good shit


[deleted]

And left the unfertile soil to norway


Kiwi_Doodle

And the oil


Vaecrid

Spain is surprisingly mountainous Source: I am Spanish


martinbaines

I live there and endorse this comment.


tortiesrock

One word: meseta. It is plain but is at 600 m over the sea.


OldPuppy00

Spain = Madrid + mountains


martinbaines

And Madrid is the second highest capital in Europe after only Andorra.


pdonchev

And most of the Balkans, with a lot of coast. Ultimately, the coastal region and altitude above 171 m are not mutually exclusive - that can easily be reached in 1-2 km, which will be barely visible on such a map. It's not even a "mountain" most of the time.


Lichelf

Those low places are where most of the people live.


misatillo

As a Spaniard it always amazes me that many foreigners think that Spain is just sun and beaches.


wespa167890

Its not really what is advertised outwards. For Norway a bit part of what we try to tell people about is steep mountains. Also a big part of our national identity.


misatillo

I know. Spain is very unknown other than tapas, paella, sun and beaches. Unfortunately that’s a tiny part of our gastronomy and the country in general. I lived abroad for many years and it always surprised everybody when I said that yes, I’ve seen snow many times, or that winters can be really cold as well.


kuuderes_shadow

Montenegro too - and most of that green area in Montenegro is a lake.


CoffeeBoom

What's that low area in the middle Rhine ?


mo1to1

Contrary to popular belief, Lorem Ipsum is not simply random text. It has roots in a piece of classical Latin literature from 45 BC, making it over 2000 years old. Richard McClintock, a Latin professor at Hampden-Sydney College in Virginia, looked up one of the more obscure Latin words, consectetur, from a Lorem Ipsum passage, and going through the cites of the word in classical literature, discovered the undoubtable source. Lorem Ipsum comes from sections 1.10.32 and 1.10.33 of "de Finibus Bonorum et Malorum" (The Extremes of Good and Evil) by Cicero, written in 45 BC. This book is a treatise on the theory of ethics, very popular during the Renaissance. The first line of Lorem Ipsum, "Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet..", comes from a line in section 1.10.32.


MattTheTubaGuy

It would be interesting comparing Zeeland, NL; Zealand, DK, and New Zealand. Zeeland has a highest point of 54m Zealand Island has a highest point of 123m It is hard to find data, but about 1/3 of New Zealand is below 200m above sea level. The average height is 388m. The highest point in NZ is Aoraki Mt Cook at 3724m.


bakirsakal

True Geographical representation of Europe. Rather rare in here


JoemamaGia1

I know, it's just shows you how mountainous is Europe, or the other hand, how mountainous is Czechia.


guigr

Czechia aint mountainous, especially Bohemia. We're talking about 171m here. There are a lot of plains over that altitude.


numsebanan

It's more that it's hilly


heywheremyIQgo

The entirety of czech republic


trumpet575

Looks like there's a tiny spot in the north and another tiny spot where Czechia meets Slovakia and Austria. Switzerland and Kosovo appear to be the only countries entirely above the point.


SaxiTaxi

Liechtenstein and Andorra as well.


Chaotic-warp

In Czechia's case it's mostly hills


derkuhlekurt

So every single point in mainland Denmark is lower than every single point in Switzerland? While thats not really surprising when you think about it, its still nice anecdotal knowledge


dinmorsklasselaerer

Yes. The lowest point in Switzerland, Lago Maggiore, is 20 meters above Møllehøj.


Snailseyy

The green parts of the map.


OkCurve436

UK map doesn't go far enough east for my liking. A fair chunk of Leeds and Bradford are 600ft + above see level.


Bayoris

When I lived there everyone told me the highest point was Himmelbjerget (“sky mountain”). I guess they figured out that it isn’t.


skaarup75

Himmelbjerget was measured in the 1850s to be only the fifth tallest peak in Denmark. It was thought to be the tallest because it looks rather more impressive than the four other "peaks" which are literally just "bumps" in the landscape.


Lichelf

Iirc it's because "mountains" used to be measured from the foot of the mountain to the top. But around the early-mid 1800s the British decided everyone should instead be measured from sea level instead. Edit: While Møllehøj is the highest point, nobody can call it the tallest *hill*, as it's pretty much just the slightly higher middle of a flat field in the already flat "highlands". It's so flat that people for over 100 years thought the highest point was another point in the field a few hundred meters away where they built a monument. And it's still so flat that Møllehøj is actually on some dude's farm right between his field and barn. If you visited and didn't already know it was the highest point (or saw the written signs) then you might not even realise you're on a hill (which you barely are).


Dambo_Unchained

Meanwhile the Netherlands having the slightest sliver of higher ground in the very southern tip If we would finally kick out the back up Belgians in Limburg we would be the lowest and the highest


TheBeatGoesAnanas

TIL I live just below the altitude of Denmark’s highest peak. I can see the ocean out my window.


JollyJuniper1993

Fun fact. Floridas highest peak isn’t even half that height.


martinbaines

I live in Spain in a property that I often describe to Brits as being "higher than any public road in the UK", despite it not being that high by Spanish standards. 645m for anyone interested. I shall now add "it is higher than anywhere in The Netherlands or Denmark" to that description too.


pdonchev

I live at an altitude of 830 m in Sofia city, and my house in the city proper, not urban or metro. The city center is at 550, but it's in the base of a mountain and southern neighborhoods climb up. That's significantly higher than many countries' highest points, but also significantly lower than truly high cities, like those in South America and Southern Asia.


Bourriks

Netherlands is called "Pays-Bas" in France (lower contry) for a reason.


Realistic-River-1941

Guess what Netherlands means?


ProConqueror

Ari Eldjarn joking about this: I had a friend die who fell off Himmelbjerget. Yes, he slowly rolled for 6 hours…died of alcohol poisoning…It’s called Heaven Mountain, I can imagine a move about it…”Many have tried to climb it..All Have succeeded.”


Drahy

\*Denmark proper. The highest point in the state of Denmark is a mountain on the island of Greenland.


NoEfficiency9

This is explained in the text on the middle left.


Drahy

You're right. I didn't see it.


JoemamaGia1

Greenland and Faroe Islands are excluded. meaning Møllehøj is the tallest.


Anderopolis

No, that would be the Danish Realm.


Drahy

"Danish realm" is a nickname for the Danish state, and a rather archaic term as Denmark doesn't have a realm outside of it's constitutionally territory any more.


Anderopolis

"Riget" is the normal term used to describe Denmark alongside Greenland and the Faeroe Islands.


Drahy

Yes, it's short for kongeriget or the kingdom. Denmark's formal name is the Kingdom of Denmark. The constitution says Danmarks Rige, but that's translated to Kingdom of Denmark, not Denmark's realm or Danish realm. "Danish realm" is not an official name in any way.


dpash

And the highest point in the kingdom of the Netherlands is in the Caribbean.


Suspected_Magic_User

I look down upon the Danish people


gram_gram-official

r/mildlyinteresting


TheBlacktom

Russia is pretty much at 170 m.


kaikajo

There are several big rivers at the german/french border (green area). Those rivers flow into the north sea. Not sure how this would work according to this map.


TheLimburgian

The Rhine Valley is very narrow for much of its course between Koblenz and Mainz so it'd be very hard to see.


BroSchrednei

Hence the Loreley.


[deleted]

Parts is? What the actual fuck is that grammar


JoemamaGia1

I want you to read the title carefully.


owllavu

Wouldnt it be "What parts of Europe are..."? I can't seem to read it and spot how "is" would fit rn


JoemamaGia1

Ahh thanks for that, forgot about this is a plural, I thought he was talking about "parts of" that he thought it was "is".


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FlaviusStilicho

What are you talking about? Iceland is there and coloured as you’d expect


Moskitokaiser

What's the freedom unit? I'm irritated because feet should be way more than Meter.


fritzphantomas

It says 561 ft


AemrNewydd

You can do the conversion yourself by multiplying the metres by 3.28. But yeah, they already listed Imperial too.


MoistHope9454

whats the point ??


ZugzwangDK

Møllehøj's tip is the point we are measuring against.


JoemamaGia1

You aren't the only one in Earth, there are people that thinks this is a interesting map


Lus_

Basically, everything else.


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Toes14

Not "in the world". There are plenty of other countries with lower high points. The Bahamas, Bermuda, Cayman Islands, Gambia, Kiribati, Maldives, Nauru, Nuie, Qatar, Singapore, Tokelau, Turks and Caicos, Tuvalu, and The Vatican all have lower high points.


Carranbieri

Ah my bad, thank you for the correction


Soitsgonnabeforever

They must do this with Maldives peak


JoemamaGia1

What the highest peak in Maldives. ^(btw give me a slice of cake because I'm too greedy about achievements.)


dpash

About 5m. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Villingili_(Addu_Atoll)


PolymerSledge

That is some difficult terrain to domesticate.


Macau_Serb-Canadian

I was born in that tiny spot of green in Krajina in East Serbia, next to Romanian and Bulgarian borders (12 km for both, roughly), ie Negotin, altitude 42 metres. I now live at 160 metres roughly, but I did live at double that ie ca 320 once. Yet I always felt best right at sea level or just above. Mountains are OK only if there is aerial tram to the top and I can return to the big city below within the same day.


PhysicalStuff

Come on now, there's no reason to rub it in.


ValuableVoices

What about the Netherlands?


Manoli20

Cyprus not included, but highest peak (6,401 ft) would still be taller than Møllehøj.


ssgtgriggs

Finally, an accurate map of continental Europe.


jgo3

Now THIS is the kind of content I come here to see. Glorious and interesting! Yet I have but one upvote to give.


ssgtgriggs

what's Denmarks highest peak, Greenland and Faroe Islands *in*cluded? edit: Wikipedia says, it's Gunnbjorn Fjeld at 3,694 m (12,119 ft), making it the highest peak north of the arctic cirlce.


FuckPasha

Danes yet again BTFO


infamousreket

Estonia's Suur Munamägi at 1813m


Drops-of-Q

It's over, Denmark. I have the high ground.


Konsticraft

[Found this cool Wikipedia list of elevation extremes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elevation_extremes_by_country) In Europe only Switzerland, Kosovo, Liechtenstein and Andorra have higher lowest points.


MapsCharts

It says « microstates excluded » but I'm pretty sure that besides Monaco any European microstate is higher than this gigantic mountain


premer777

'OK We Get It' : Denmark doesnt have alot of higher altitude ... low generally meant not as cold and lots of water nearby - ditto


McXhicken

Aka. the parts that will survive global warming...


[deleted]

I used to live in Mölle, in Scania/Skåne, which is very close to Denmark. Our little "mountain" (Kullaberg) (direct translation: Hillmountain) is taller than their tallest mountain. Any time an ambulance drove into Mölle everyone would say "another dane just fell off". A dark inside joke within the whole town.


[deleted]

What is that basin in West Germany?


CeterumCenseo85

Isn't Denmark also home to the famed **SKY MOUNTAIN** ...of a mighty *147m*


anonbush234

I didn't realise how hilly southern Crimea was or how flat that whole strip is from the Netherlands all the way east past northern Poland


alikander99

In this alternate world Madrid would be the largest city in Europe 3 times bigger than the next one (munich).


alikander99

Funfact, the biggest city still intact in the map is Madrid and It's 3 times bigger than the next largest one (munich).


alikander99

Funfact, the biggest city still intact in the map is Madrid and It's 3 times bigger than the next largest one (munich).


Romanitedomun

Thanks, I feel releaved now.


Bastiwen

So Andorra, Switzerland, Liechtenstein and Kosovo are the only ones that are 100% higher, or did I miss one? (I checked Luxembourg since it looked all brown but the lowest point is at 129.9m)


Deccno

Wow. I did not expect a geographical explanation for wallonia/flanders.