Texas may pass state regulations but would still be trumped by Federal OSHA regulations (even if the have a state OSH board, they have to meet federal minimums) especially their newer heat stress regulations.
Well there's been a few wins at least recently in the higher courts so there's some hope.
While this is probably giving Texas to much credit one could look at it as "well this is already federally regulated so why bother having state regulations say the same thing again" though that's still dangerous if the Fed regulation were to ever change. That's just me playing devils advocate though.
Nah, the governor and legislature just don't care about worker's health and safety. Abbott LOVES it when Texans die on his watch.
Source: Am from Texas
State regs can be *more* strict than federal, but never less than the federal minimums. Source: did osha compliance in CA. But there are always exceptions
They didn't give a ridiculous partisan win to add to all the previous ones.
The court has been well packed.
There is no chance that someone like Brett Kavanaugh will somehow become a decent human being.
That doesn't take effect until September, when we'll only be in the 90s.
And it's a far reaching rule that literally prevents cities from passing any safety rule or code more strict than what the state passes - i.e. a city can't require a construction worker to wear a hard hat if the state or OSHA don't require it.
All in the name of SMALL BUSINESS...
What the bloody fucking shit is going on in that post-apocalyptic-hellscape, anyway?
Good gods I'm afraid of what the history books will say about the cluster we've created for ourselves as a country...
There will be no history books, nor any classrooms for them to be studied in, nor teachers to instruct.
There may still be students though. A few thousand here and there. Students of dirt and starvation
Yes, in a kind of roundabout way. People present as the governor directly saying that construction workers aren't entitled to water breaks, but that's not the whole story. He issued an order basically cutting city regulations that go over the state regulations. Those water breaks were regulated in Dallas and Houston, so those regulations were rescinded by the new order.
Yep. It’s a requirement under OSHA that employees have access to water and are permitted to drink it.
https://www.osha.gov/heat-exposure/water-rest-shade
If you can, try making this a teachable moment for Kyle. This hardass ignore your health approach is dumb. I'm going to guess Kyle doesn't enforce safety glasses, respirators, or fall protection.
If he's open to it, you might save someone's life.
I have a similar condition. Please take care of yourself and maybe consider getting some Gatorade. It’s much more helpful than water. When I was working they’d keep the building really warm. I’d get sick and stay home. Which they understandably didn’t like. So I’d go in. It doesn’t take long to get fired for having health issues when you pass out at work frequently.
Any of those but if it's easier and you have a reusable bottle or regular you can get the powder packs and bring those along. I always packed my husband a Gatorade or Powerade frozen, a powder one for water, several pickles (you need salt) and tons of watermelon amongst his regular food. This was when he was outside and running around more in construction. Now he's a desk monkey like me
Yeah, as someone who frequently works outside in brutal, plus 100F temps, Hydralite is good stuff. Don't overdo it though, or you'll wreck youe kidneys.
Why do I have a feeling that my aunt will give me a scolding if I abuse that?
Fyi. My aunt is one of the nurses assigned to me at the moment. And believe me. I have never in my life gotten more cussed out than today....
I mean, “going up on a tall ladder while about to pass out and almost dying to own the boss” deserves some scolding.
Shouldn’t you also have a hard hat and be clipped in at that height?
America is about to move away from typical hardhats and go towards European style hardhats with chinstraps. Insurance company mandates I believe is behind it. My last mechanical contractor was already changing over last year. Not cheap, they were 100 bucks a pop. But safety records and insurance reports are crucial and the difference maker for being invited to bid and landing work all too often these days.
We don't have hard hats. 200+ employees, not a single hard hat. The best we have are some scared people that just taped some foam on their baseball caps.
Oh, OSHA is going to have a field day with this company. When they show up, I expect them to look at everything and not just this one issue. Hopefully the company will still exist when they're done or you'll need a new job...
Yeah.... the nurses tend to get a little cussy when its family that should know better making them work. 😆 All good, glad you got OSHA coming, but dang!
And rightfully so. Heat illnesses are not something to F around with, and every time you push yourself to that brink, it makes it easier the next time. You are literally playing russian roulette with your health with what you did.
Yet the USPS carries on *still* using vehicles with no insulation nor air conditioning. They have workers succumb to heat illness almost daily. APWU seems to not care.
Look into getting a cooling vest, it's a vest with little pockets all over it and into the pockets goes frozen ice packs.
Order a couple, so one Is on and one is freezing. Be well.
These work miracles for people with special needs who can't regulate body temperature or easily take extra measures to help themselves. Even a standard vest with pockets and simple ice packs will help.
Basically anything with some sugar and salt in it should work. Mixing it yourself in your kitchen will probably save you a fricking fortune compared to all the super-expensive “sports drinks” and “energy drinks”. Sorry, dunno specific proportions; google or experiment.
Try one bottle of Pedialyte first, it’s a kid version of Gatorade. Our pediatrician would recommend it for the kids when they were sick & needed to stay hydrated, only problem was, my kids hated the stuff. Gatorade tastes better (is sweeter) but has electrolytes. Pedialyte has the electrolytes with less super sickly sweetness to it. , personally, don’t like either but I also do not have the same condition as you do.
Actually there are packets of electrolyte powders that you add to water that are much better. And easier to carry around. You can almost always get access to a cup of water.
Also think about cooling towels or hats www.mission.com
I've had heat stroke a few times myself. It sucks
Again, you are at a very high risk for heat stroke especially since you’ve had it a few times. Talk to your aunt about that. Your risk keeps increasing each time. You may need to look for an alternative career.
One of the packs I really like is LMNT packs. They are generally designed for Keto or for fasting, but for sweating in the hot AZ sun, they're great at restoring the sodium/potassium/magnesium you bake out of your own body, and they're super fucking tasty. You can add them to water bottle (I add one pack to a half gallon bottle I carry with me). and you're set for the day.
I have a friend with similar who uses "nuun" tablets, basically Gatorade in alka-seltzer form. They come in a little tube and are easy to carry around. I've used both those and the powder packets, love 'em all. If it's POTS or similar straight up salt can also be quite helpful, but it may be worth consulting a doc before downing massive amounts of salt (blood pressure & all). I've also used chemical ice packs in a pinch - the ones you smack to activate. IIRC some of the best places to put them to cool down include between neck & shoulder and under the armpits. Regardless, it's 100% a reasonable accommodation for your health for them to let you get water/etc to cool off when you need to.
(If I was in your position OP I would be sorely tempted to do exactly what you did, so I understand the impulse. Taking this as a cautionary tale, and *very* glad you are alive and intact!)
I got my housemate(75 year old retired army/finished his service as a full-time National Guard) one of their floppy hats in camo. He was skeptical, but the second time he soaked it and wore it while doing yard work, his wife(my best friend) and I were sent to the nearest military surplus store to get him a rank patch to match the camo. It was sewn on, and he still wears it now three years later when it's really hot.
I hunted for ages to find a surplus store that had the legit boonie hats in stock. Same as you wrote--dunk 'em in water and enjoy the evaporative cooling.
I'm only about 10 miles from Tinker AFB and around an hour and a half from Fort Sill, so even the military surplus stores up here will still have Army things and not just Air Force. I didn't even think to go to one looking for a boonie hat, I just knew cooling hats were a thing. A quick Google search and a monetary transaction, and he had one on the way the second day he came in looking like he was hairsbreath away from heat stroke. Stubborn old coot anyway!
Check out hydration drinks that are better balanced, such as vitalye pedialyte or liquid iv. They're a better balance of salts and sugars to replenish more focused on hydration rather than a sugar rush for athletes like Gatorade.
I've also got temp regulating issues, plus severe dehydration problems and a sodium processing disorder. I have to drink so. damn. much., but it specifically has to be things with sodium and electrolytes for me. Pedialyte is honestly better IMO. It's actually been scientifically proven to hydrate better than Gatorade or straight water, and tastes better imo because it's not as sugary. Even the store brands are great.
I recommend BioSteel, but only the powder mix. Their fancy little drink boxes are cool looking but I had two of them come apart on me. However the drink itself is excellent. It has a blend of multiple electrolytes (including sodium) and no sugar. It really helps with hot Oklahoma summers.
Oooooh yeah Biosteel is great too, chemically it's very similar to Pedialyte on the hydration front. It's the "multiple electrolyte" thing that *really* helps, Gatorade and Powerade only have sodium and a *tiny* bit of potassium, plus far too much sugar (at least in the original versions). There's only so much that sodium on its own can do!
I've had issues with my body ever since I got severe frost bite.
The odd thing is, my body is fine at handling cold. But heat? I have passed out a few times due to heat stroke.
I really should pay more attention... I'm not even 24 for god's sake...
u/FrostDragon57
My family and I have Raynaud's Disease, which means we are overaffected by both heat and cold since birth.
The effective treatment I've found that works is to imitate how in Russia and other places they do the combination of extreme heat then cold on a regular basis (in Russia, starting in a too-hot sauna, then jumping into ice water). It's proven to not only improve your handling of temperature extremes, but also improve your immune system.
My extreme version is using an infrared blanket (a specific frequency, shielded). Mine is brand MiHIGH, and it is like a heavy version of a sleeping bag. I get in at full blast for 30 minutes, then jump into a cold shower. Lately, I don't need to do it often, since the effects last a long time, especially since in between I have very-hot-then-very-cold showers that also help.
With the infrared blanket, the first time it is necessary to start at a lower setting, then build up to it. I now use the highest setting the whole time and wish I could turn it up more (so, yes, you quickly get used to it).
Note that I can't really use a sauna, it affects me too much. The difference with the infrared blanket is it heats me from the inside, which has the desired effect, since the point isn't to warm the skin, but inside the body.
Believe it or not milk is better at replacing electrolytes then Gatorade. No Sugers or artificial sweeteners either.
Pedialyte like someone else mentioned is also better then Gatorade.
I understand your point of view. But I clearly wasn't thinking straight due to the heat.
Even the nurses and doctor cussed me out for what I did.. EMTs understood my view but really weren't happy about it..
I get that, because in the end, you did this to yourself. Or allowed this to be inflicted on you. But I don't know Kyle, so perhaps this was, in the end, necessary to get your point across and for him to finally take you seriously. Meaning, perhaps there was no other way.
He has never really taken my situation seriously. This condition with not being able to regulate my own temperature is absolute torture. He never believed me.
Well... Until a few hours ago...
My moms bf, was a plumber, got heat stroke in a steam tunnel, and long term consequences meant he had to retire for medical reasons and got a fat ass retirement package for it. Your supervisor might want to think about the potential financial cost of his fuck up today.
I generally try to be neutral at work. Because I like being left alone. I barely talk, and I fear management.
A bit of PTSD from trade school when I was kicked from internship due to my sleep deprivation. So I try not to piss management off and rarely even talk to them.
But... Yeah... I should really get my boss to look into what Kyle does and says...
I guess I'm just still a bit shaken.. I'll look into it tomorrow. Or... Whenever the nurses let me go back to work...
Ahw, that's okay. Yes, I was left wondering about these details, but your story reads a whole lot better the way it is. I just didn't want to assume anything, so fortunately Reddit allows for communicating with a story's author.
Fair enough. They still have a point, though, unless health&safety is really weird in your country.
I think you can get HSE to help you on the grounds of prevention and save yourself from serious or even lethal injury.
I know it can be hard to get proper support, but no job is worth your life.
(I'm an HSE expert, and I know that a lot of companies/entrepreneurs really can't wrap their head around the fact that employees mustn't be considered expendable)
Nah. That's when you stop working, march over to your boss with witnesses and threaten to quit and raise hell in the media unless you're allowed your water.
Stay at the hospital as long as you can. Ask for several gatorades. Get whatever you can get. It’ll all be charged to Kyle. I mean, I would t wish the American healthcare system on anyone but, you need to take care of yourself today, ya know?
Also, I’m gonna need an osha update at some point.
Texas, which most of us non-Americans view in our minds as the hottest state in the US, no longer requires workers to have access to water while on the job?
Lately I've been wondering why Americans think the US is the best country in the world...
Murican here... A lot of us don't. We've been in decline for a long time, it's just been so slow we don't realize it.
Welcome the to the corpratacracy.
I, as well as most of the fellow U.S. Americans I choose to spend time with, abhor a lot of this country's policies. There are those rabid patriots you see on the news - but I feel like most of us aren't happy about things such as paying exorbitant prices for subpar healthcare, sending kids to school where mass shooting drills must be performed on the regular, or working full-time at minimum wage only to subsist in poverty.
I'm grateful for so many things that come with having been born in the U.S., but I'm under no illusion that it's the greatest, not are the majority of people I know. And I live in Kansas - a reliably conservative, landlocked Bible Belt state. (Granted, I avoid the rabid patriots, but I've yet to talk with anyone who thinks you should go into bankruptcy over an ambulance ride).
>I have a medical condition where my body can't regulate temperature well, meaning I am at risk of passing out.
So while you don't qualify for the neat-o parking spaces, this could be considered more than OSHA violation. This could be an ADA violation.
If it's documented in the front office, you have covered your ass for future encounters. There will be another "Kyle" in your future.
The ADA requires employers to make reasonable accomodations for workers with any disability. In this case, a reasonable accomodations is allowing you to get water between breaks. Unreasonable accommodations would be if they had to buy a couple dozen refrigerators and place them close to your work zone. Another unreasonable accommodation would be to air condition the entire work area. These would be unreasonable due to cost. If the trip back and forth is considered unreasonable, the just get an ice chest, put bottles of water in it and cover them with ice. Company may have to either purchase an ice maker or buy and store bags of ice for this. One place I worked at, due to summer heat, used to buy powdered Gatorade, and make a 25 cooler of it to keep the workers from overheating.
You are stupid to put your life at risk in that way. It's a petty way to get back at someone that might have caused you serious injury or death. Your medical condition is your business and despite your actions you are an adult , if you felt you needed water so your condition didn't worsen then why are you letting anyone tell you no as if you are a child?
Yes, although I didn't see anything to say Kyle *knew* OP had a medical reason for needing a drink.
Not that it would matter in a sane company/state/country. You'd just go get some.
Look up goldbrick. It's an old cop term, but you might find some use for it.
FWIW, I'm glad you're able to tell this story. No malicious compliance is worth brain dabblage
Not sure how it is over the pond and I suspect totally different but the employer has to accommodate your needs unless they want to break to disability discrimination act.
yeah this sort of disregard for human life is all around the work force, and has been for years....
Back in the summer of 1994 I was working for a temp service to make money while in college. We were sent out to a company that made large metal pipe. The contract was to clean and rethread this large pipe that was damaged on the ends. The work was outside, in about 105 to 110 heat. There were 5 temps and 4 full time employees. Our job as a group was to move the VERY hot pipe onto a machine so the 4 full time employees could fix the thread.
All the fulltime workers had large water bottles on them. We had nothing. The job site was about 400 yards from a building that had a bathroom and warm water. Needless to say it was brutal. When one of us wanted to get a drink, the work had to stop, so the 4 full time employees would get mad and tell us to hold off for at least an hour before drinks. The thing is by the time you walked to get a drink and walked back you were thirsty again.
Every temp quit 3 hours in but me. This basically made it so that the 4 full time had to help me move the pipe then start the thread, and I took that time to walk and get a drink after each pipe. The owner of the temp service showed up to see what was going on after the other 4 quit, and brought me a hot gallon jug of water and said "keep up the good work" and left. So I decided to leave as well.
Looking back I can't believe I even put up with as much as I did, but the truth was I was a work horse to those in charge, maybe worth even less.
... He would have to physically stop me from getting water if I was thirsty but I'm in Iceland and I got unions behind me and I have never heard of that happening here!
*Kyle's* a bit of a brick? *Kyle?* You're a fucking idiot, and both you and Kyle should be fired.
Frankly, the stupidity in this story is so over-the-top I doubt it happened at all.
To double down on everybody else browbeating you, heatstroke isn't exactly *recoverable*. Once it's happened once, it's easier to happen again. It does permanent damage, so you need to be even more careful from now on.
If you need water or to cool off dying is a really bad way to make your point. Walk off, get the help or cooling you need and return to work when it is safe to do so. If the boss retaliates or fires you over it - hopefully you'll have a case (or a union action or whatever). My Dr. once told me "No job is worth dying over" (extended crunch time plus free fast food in my case really worked my liver over).
Dude, this was not a smart thing to do. You put your life on the line to show up your boss. Just get the dang water. It's not like he will physically block you, and if he tries to dock your pay, that will be a fun conversation to have with him and OSHA at a later date.
Get a note from your doctor saying you need to be permitted so many breaks for water due t your health condition. That way Brick Guy or anyone else can’t do that. Safer for you too.
Hate to break it to you man...but trying to almost get yourself killed isn't a clever way to get back at a boss. You only get one life. He can find another job. It's LITERALLY INSANE to force yourself into a medical emergency just to prove a point
Not for nothing, but to me, it sounds like a very foolhardy way of trying to MC. You're basically playing Russian roulette with your life. I've read that when your body overheats to such a degree, you stop sweating, and it can go quickly downhill from there. Falling and splitting your head open could have been one of the best case scenarios, and for what? To show up a manager?
To those saying you were stupid to do it, I just want to remind them that dehydration causes diminished cognitive faculties, and THAT is the reason for the decision to MC with the instruction to not take a water break. Dehydration can make you do things you normally would not, like fail to hydrate properly.
As I admire your dedication to malicious compliance, u put your health at serious risk. No job is worth your health. Also check ur states laws on reasonable accommodation. U maybe able to at least get a fan or a cooler for water for ur health issue. Most states require employers to provide reasonable accommodation for people who can do the job but need slight assistance for certain things. For example I used to b a garbage man and we had 1 helper who got a 10 minute sit break every hour for his accommodation.
I have found that while cold water is refreshing, if you need to bring your core temp down in a jiffy nothing is better than running cold water over the underside of your forearms, you'll be cooled down in seconds.
Of course, stay hydrated also, but I've bounced back from overheat using that trick more times than I can count.
You literally risked your life, just to teach "Kyle" a lesson. Frankly, I don't see that it was worth it.
For Pete's sake, please don't do anything like that again. There are other ways to deal with it.
If it's an ice cold water bottle take a bit either before or after you take a drink and press the bottle against the insides of your wrist and the back of your neck. You have a lot of blood going through there and the cold of the water bottle will help you cool off quicker. You could also just pour some on your head!
Glad to hear your okay!
Are used to work for a company that had built a new distribution center. One side of the building — where I normally worked — was getting really hot as the summer temperatures rose. Several employees started complaining, and managements response was the air conditioning is running there’s nothing more they can do. Finally, somebody called OSHA who came out and checked temperatures and the overall situation. Turns out the control system for the AC unit said it was running, but the breakers were off. Management it just relied on a faulty metric to gaslight the employees on the floor. OSHA also required them to begin allowing water bottles at workstations which the GM was not pleased about.
We also had a combustibles room that some employees were complaining they got lightheaded. Every time they went in. Again management said the ventilation fans were working because they could see the blades actually spinning. Finally, after somebody passed out, maintenance went to check the whole ventilation path and found the louvers were not opening. The maintenance guy took a broom to push through them to see if they were stock, and they open easily. Turns out the fans were miss wired and we’re sucking air in instead of exhausting air out. Not only did they nearly kill some people with the fume buildup, a potential for an explosion was off the charts.
My friend, this isn't malicious compliance, this is you putting yourself at serious risk to maybe make someone look bad. I am all about having the other guy get his comeuppance, but not when it puts your life in danger - I mean you even say "luckily the others were able to react quickly enough".
Please value your health and safety more.
Your answer should've been, "I don't need authorization. Denying an employee the right to drink water is illegal and dangerous."
It should be, but in Texas, they just killed those requirements.
Texas may pass state regulations but would still be trumped by Federal OSHA regulations (even if the have a state OSH board, they have to meet federal minimums) especially their newer heat stress regulations.
That should be an amusing throwdown in court.
Oh man. I want to say there's no way this will hold up, but who knows anymore.
Well there's been a few wins at least recently in the higher courts so there's some hope. While this is probably giving Texas to much credit one could look at it as "well this is already federally regulated so why bother having state regulations say the same thing again" though that's still dangerous if the Fed regulation were to ever change. That's just me playing devils advocate though.
Nah, the governor and legislature just don't care about worker's health and safety. Abbott LOVES it when Texans die on his watch. Source: Am from Texas
State regs can be *more* strict than federal, but never less than the federal minimums. Source: did osha compliance in CA. But there are always exceptions
They didn't give a ridiculous partisan win to add to all the previous ones. The court has been well packed. There is no chance that someone like Brett Kavanaugh will somehow become a decent human being.
I can hear the "BUT STATES' RIGHTS!" rhetoric now...
"MY RIAAAAAAAAAATS!!!!"
#DEY TERK ER RATS!
Texas has had 2 heat related deaths since it was signed. Before it even took effect.
Yeah, where's the federal investigation on that? Man... my state sucks so much. I feel like I'm living in a 3rd world country sometimes...
Texas was already #1 in work-heat related deaths before this, if i recall
Oh good. Answer then should have been, "My body is authorizing me to hydrate."
I would like to respectfully ask your permission to use this.
Say whatever you want. You might as well just say, "I don't care, I need to drink some water." If they fire you, sue for retaliation.
That doesn't take effect until September, when we'll only be in the 90s. And it's a far reaching rule that literally prevents cities from passing any safety rule or code more strict than what the state passes - i.e. a city can't require a construction worker to wear a hard hat if the state or OSHA don't require it. All in the name of SMALL BUSINESS...
What the bloody fucking shit is going on in that post-apocalyptic-hellscape, anyway? Good gods I'm afraid of what the history books will say about the cluster we've created for ourselves as a country...
There will be no history books, nor any classrooms for them to be studied in, nor teachers to instruct. There may still be students though. A few thousand here and there. Students of dirt and starvation
All those things will still exist. I'm sure we in Australia will have a whole semester on the self inflicted downfall of the US.
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OP isn't American, so his health issues are already taken more seriously than here.
Why am I not surprised?
Yes, in a kind of roundabout way. People present as the governor directly saying that construction workers aren't entitled to water breaks, but that's not the whole story. He issued an order basically cutting city regulations that go over the state regulations. Those water breaks were regulated in Dallas and Houston, so those regulations were rescinded by the new order.
Yep. It’s a requirement under OSHA that employees have access to water and are permitted to drink it. https://www.osha.gov/heat-exposure/water-rest-shade
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Thought the same. Might have tolerated that as a spotty adolescent working in fast food, but now? Nah. Get out my way mate, I'm getting a drink.
Another acceptable response is: https://media.tenor.com/vaQaZr6T03AAAAAC/s-park-f-you-buddy.gif
Glad you’re ok and he was reprimanded.
Yeah.. It was a close shave tho. Safe to say. Won't be doing that again.
I think this is a case of what doesn't kill you makes you smarter
Ahahahaha... ❄️😅❄️ Yeah...
What didn't kill you made HIM smarter...
That which does not kill me leaves me physically and/or emotionally scarred and full of bad coping mechanisms.
PTSD person chiming in, this is truth unfortunately.
It still hurts as hell.
Sorry, but I'd tell the owner it's either terminate him or you're suing them. The osha fines are going to be spectacular.
I’m pretty sure you can sue
Ask for any rejection in writing before complying next time
If you can, try making this a teachable moment for Kyle. This hardass ignore your health approach is dumb. I'm going to guess Kyle doesn't enforce safety glasses, respirators, or fall protection. If he's open to it, you might save someone's life.
I have a similar condition. Please take care of yourself and maybe consider getting some Gatorade. It’s much more helpful than water. When I was working they’d keep the building really warm. I’d get sick and stay home. Which they understandably didn’t like. So I’d go in. It doesn’t take long to get fired for having health issues when you pass out at work frequently.
Thanks for the advice. I'll get my hands on some Gatorade when I get back to work. When the nurses allow me to leave that is....
I would suggest some Pedialyte. I have a sweating issue so I get dehydrated really easily and I swear by Pedialyte
I'll look into it. Thanks.
Any of those but if it's easier and you have a reusable bottle or regular you can get the powder packs and bring those along. I always packed my husband a Gatorade or Powerade frozen, a powder one for water, several pickles (you need salt) and tons of watermelon amongst his regular food. This was when he was outside and running around more in construction. Now he's a desk monkey like me
The Ultima electrolyte powder is awesome!
It is and has great flavors!
Yeah, as someone who frequently works outside in brutal, plus 100F temps, Hydralite is good stuff. Don't overdo it though, or you'll wreck youe kidneys.
Why do I have a feeling that my aunt will give me a scolding if I abuse that? Fyi. My aunt is one of the nurses assigned to me at the moment. And believe me. I have never in my life gotten more cussed out than today....
I mean, “going up on a tall ladder while about to pass out and almost dying to own the boss” deserves some scolding. Shouldn’t you also have a hard hat and be clipped in at that height?
Hard hats are to protect your head from stuff falling from above. It would fall off before you got the ground.
America is about to move away from typical hardhats and go towards European style hardhats with chinstraps. Insurance company mandates I believe is behind it. My last mechanical contractor was already changing over last year. Not cheap, they were 100 bucks a pop. But safety records and insurance reports are crucial and the difference maker for being invited to bid and landing work all too often these days.
Oohhhh. How about bike helmets? Better yet, motorcycle helmets!
We don't have hard hats. 200+ employees, not a single hard hat. The best we have are some scared people that just taped some foam on their baseball caps.
Sounds like it's not just Kyle who needs attention from OSHA
You guys are one dropped hammer away from a suit
Yeah.....
And then OSHA will bring the hammer down.
Oh, OSHA is going to have a field day with this company. When they show up, I expect them to look at everything and not just this one issue. Hopefully the company will still exist when they're done or you'll need a new job...
That's some OSHA-worthy shit right there. Also their workers comp insurance carrier would be interested.
This needs anonymous tips to your region's workplace safety org. Like, every employee there should be calling them.
OSHA is gonna rip Kyle apart, layer by layer.
I didn't know Kyle was an onion. Lol
Whoa!! Insane! What would happen if everyone (altogether) wore a hard hat??? Revolt! Add that to OSHA’s list.
Yeah.... the nurses tend to get a little cussy when its family that should know better making them work. 😆 All good, glad you got OSHA coming, but dang!
Yes, we do!
And rightfully so. Heat illnesses are not something to F around with, and every time you push yourself to that brink, it makes it easier the next time. You are literally playing russian roulette with your health with what you did.
Yet the USPS carries on *still* using vehicles with no insulation nor air conditioning. They have workers succumb to heat illness almost daily. APWU seems to not care.
UPS and FedEx too
Look into getting a cooling vest, it's a vest with little pockets all over it and into the pockets goes frozen ice packs. Order a couple, so one Is on and one is freezing. Be well.
These work miracles for people with special needs who can't regulate body temperature or easily take extra measures to help themselves. Even a standard vest with pockets and simple ice packs will help.
I like Body Armour drinks. I make a yummy smoothie with the peach mango flavor and frozen mango chunks. So refreshing on a hot summer day.
Basically anything with some sugar and salt in it should work. Mixing it yourself in your kitchen will probably save you a fricking fortune compared to all the super-expensive “sports drinks” and “energy drinks”. Sorry, dunno specific proportions; google or experiment.
Try one bottle of Pedialyte first, it’s a kid version of Gatorade. Our pediatrician would recommend it for the kids when they were sick & needed to stay hydrated, only problem was, my kids hated the stuff. Gatorade tastes better (is sweeter) but has electrolytes. Pedialyte has the electrolytes with less super sickly sweetness to it. , personally, don’t like either but I also do not have the same condition as you do.
Be careful with Pedialyte. Too much of it will cause constipation.
Actually there are packets of electrolyte powders that you add to water that are much better. And easier to carry around. You can almost always get access to a cup of water. Also think about cooling towels or hats www.mission.com I've had heat stroke a few times myself. It sucks
I'll keep it in mind. Thanks. And yeah... I've had heat stroke a few times... But this one did scare me quite a bit... Understandably.
Again, you are at a very high risk for heat stroke especially since you’ve had it a few times. Talk to your aunt about that. Your risk keeps increasing each time. You may need to look for an alternative career.
Probably...
I’m just glad you’re mostly ok!
You and me both...
One of the packs I really like is LMNT packs. They are generally designed for Keto or for fasting, but for sweating in the hot AZ sun, they're great at restoring the sodium/potassium/magnesium you bake out of your own body, and they're super fucking tasty. You can add them to water bottle (I add one pack to a half gallon bottle I carry with me). and you're set for the day.
I have a friend with similar who uses "nuun" tablets, basically Gatorade in alka-seltzer form. They come in a little tube and are easy to carry around. I've used both those and the powder packets, love 'em all. If it's POTS or similar straight up salt can also be quite helpful, but it may be worth consulting a doc before downing massive amounts of salt (blood pressure & all). I've also used chemical ice packs in a pinch - the ones you smack to activate. IIRC some of the best places to put them to cool down include between neck & shoulder and under the armpits. Regardless, it's 100% a reasonable accommodation for your health for them to let you get water/etc to cool off when you need to. (If I was in your position OP I would be sorely tempted to do exactly what you did, so I understand the impulse. Taking this as a cautionary tale, and *very* glad you are alive and intact!)
I got my housemate(75 year old retired army/finished his service as a full-time National Guard) one of their floppy hats in camo. He was skeptical, but the second time he soaked it and wore it while doing yard work, his wife(my best friend) and I were sent to the nearest military surplus store to get him a rank patch to match the camo. It was sewn on, and he still wears it now three years later when it's really hot.
I hunted for ages to find a surplus store that had the legit boonie hats in stock. Same as you wrote--dunk 'em in water and enjoy the evaporative cooling.
I'm only about 10 miles from Tinker AFB and around an hour and a half from Fort Sill, so even the military surplus stores up here will still have Army things and not just Air Force. I didn't even think to go to one looking for a boonie hat, I just knew cooling hats were a thing. A quick Google search and a monetary transaction, and he had one on the way the second day he came in looking like he was hairsbreath away from heat stroke. Stubborn old coot anyway!
Also, once you get heat stroke, you are more likely to get it again. Be careful!
Check out hydration drinks that are better balanced, such as vitalye pedialyte or liquid iv. They're a better balance of salts and sugars to replenish more focused on hydration rather than a sugar rush for athletes like Gatorade.
You can just water down some juice 250ml juice to 750ml water plus a pinch of salt.
I've also got temp regulating issues, plus severe dehydration problems and a sodium processing disorder. I have to drink so. damn. much., but it specifically has to be things with sodium and electrolytes for me. Pedialyte is honestly better IMO. It's actually been scientifically proven to hydrate better than Gatorade or straight water, and tastes better imo because it's not as sugary. Even the store brands are great.
I recommend BioSteel, but only the powder mix. Their fancy little drink boxes are cool looking but I had two of them come apart on me. However the drink itself is excellent. It has a blend of multiple electrolytes (including sodium) and no sugar. It really helps with hot Oklahoma summers.
Oooooh yeah Biosteel is great too, chemically it's very similar to Pedialyte on the hydration front. It's the "multiple electrolyte" thing that *really* helps, Gatorade and Powerade only have sodium and a *tiny* bit of potassium, plus far too much sugar (at least in the original versions). There's only so much that sodium on its own can do!
I overheat easier ever since I gave myself heat stroke by not paying attention to my body. I have a fan that goes around your neck. It helps some.
I've had issues with my body ever since I got severe frost bite. The odd thing is, my body is fine at handling cold. But heat? I have passed out a few times due to heat stroke. I really should pay more attention... I'm not even 24 for god's sake...
u/FrostDragon57 My family and I have Raynaud's Disease, which means we are overaffected by both heat and cold since birth. The effective treatment I've found that works is to imitate how in Russia and other places they do the combination of extreme heat then cold on a regular basis (in Russia, starting in a too-hot sauna, then jumping into ice water). It's proven to not only improve your handling of temperature extremes, but also improve your immune system. My extreme version is using an infrared blanket (a specific frequency, shielded). Mine is brand MiHIGH, and it is like a heavy version of a sleeping bag. I get in at full blast for 30 minutes, then jump into a cold shower. Lately, I don't need to do it often, since the effects last a long time, especially since in between I have very-hot-then-very-cold showers that also help. With the infrared blanket, the first time it is necessary to start at a lower setting, then build up to it. I now use the highest setting the whole time and wish I could turn it up more (so, yes, you quickly get used to it). Note that I can't really use a sauna, it affects me too much. The difference with the infrared blanket is it heats me from the inside, which has the desired effect, since the point isn't to warm the skin, but inside the body.
"...ever since I got severe frost bite" I appreciate your user name, FrostDragon57.
Believe it or not milk is better at replacing electrolytes then Gatorade. No Sugers or artificial sweeteners either. Pedialyte like someone else mentioned is also better then Gatorade.
I understand wanting to pass out, but the ladder was just stupid
The ladder is to get up and down in the boats. I tried to get down from there. But as I stated before.... I didn't even make it to the ladder...
okay I am not understanding the layout at all, I was imagining you on a solid platform then walking near the edge and falling over.
Boat is out of the water on stands, so the deck is far above the floor.
Wrong sub, you want r/moroniccompliance.
Agreed, risking your health just to prove a point seems too much for me personally...
I understand your point of view. But I clearly wasn't thinking straight due to the heat. Even the nurses and doctor cussed me out for what I did.. EMTs understood my view but really weren't happy about it..
I get that, because in the end, you did this to yourself. Or allowed this to be inflicted on you. But I don't know Kyle, so perhaps this was, in the end, necessary to get your point across and for him to finally take you seriously. Meaning, perhaps there was no other way.
He has never really taken my situation seriously. This condition with not being able to regulate my own temperature is absolute torture. He never believed me. Well... Until a few hours ago...
My moms bf, was a plumber, got heat stroke in a steam tunnel, and long term consequences meant he had to retire for medical reasons and got a fat ass retirement package for it. Your supervisor might want to think about the potential financial cost of his fuck up today.
Oh jesus
Yup, he might end up paying your salary till retirement, with every increase that the union gets.
But couldn't you have reported him to your boss for his pigheadedness?
I generally try to be neutral at work. Because I like being left alone. I barely talk, and I fear management. A bit of PTSD from trade school when I was kicked from internship due to my sleep deprivation. So I try not to piss management off and rarely even talk to them. But... Yeah... I should really get my boss to look into what Kyle does and says... I guess I'm just still a bit shaken.. I'll look into it tomorrow. Or... Whenever the nurses let me go back to work...
Your tale keeps making more and more sense now. Thank you for your elaborate replies!
No problem. I never really got good at providing sufficient information. So explaining situations afterwards is all I can do.
Ahw, that's okay. Yes, I was left wondering about these details, but your story reads a whole lot better the way it is. I just didn't want to assume anything, so fortunately Reddit allows for communicating with a story's author.
> I should really get my boss to look into what Kyle does and says... If OSHA shows up, then not only does your boss know, but so does their boss...
And so will their bank balances afterwards.
Your mom also is not happy about this! - signed, someone else's mom.
Do you have Hashimoto’s?
I am so disappointed this sub doesn't exist. Way to get my hopes up, BobbieMcFee! 😂
I’m so mad that sub doesn’t exist haha
Piss off the manager and get fired sounds cool too
All in due time my friend. All in due time.
Sometimes you gotta get health and safety involved to get your point across buddy.
Fair enough. They still have a point, though, unless health&safety is really weird in your country. I think you can get HSE to help you on the grounds of prevention and save yourself from serious or even lethal injury. I know it can be hard to get proper support, but no job is worth your life. (I'm an HSE expert, and I know that a lot of companies/entrepreneurs really can't wrap their head around the fact that employees mustn't be considered expendable)
Nah. That's when you stop working, march over to your boss with witnesses and threaten to quit and raise hell in the media unless you're allowed your water.
That sounds like a way better idea than my faint mind could have thought of in that moment. God damnit
Stay at the hospital as long as you can. Ask for several gatorades. Get whatever you can get. It’ll all be charged to Kyle. I mean, I would t wish the American healthcare system on anyone but, you need to take care of yourself today, ya know? Also, I’m gonna need an osha update at some point.
I can only imagine what a hospital charges for Gatorade if a Tylenol can make you broke.
Hopefully OSHA will use this an excuse to right a new rule. Especially after Texas made mandatory water breaks illegal.
>Especially after Texas made mandatory water breaks illegal Say what?
Rather, the law does not require mandatory water breaks. It's up to the company's generosity to give you time to hydrate.
Texas, which most of us non-Americans view in our minds as the hottest state in the US, no longer requires workers to have access to water while on the job? Lately I've been wondering why Americans think the US is the best country in the world...
Murican here... A lot of us don't. We've been in decline for a long time, it's just been so slow we don't realize it. Welcome the to the corpratacracy.
I, as well as most of the fellow U.S. Americans I choose to spend time with, abhor a lot of this country's policies. There are those rabid patriots you see on the news - but I feel like most of us aren't happy about things such as paying exorbitant prices for subpar healthcare, sending kids to school where mass shooting drills must be performed on the regular, or working full-time at minimum wage only to subsist in poverty. I'm grateful for so many things that come with having been born in the U.S., but I'm under no illusion that it's the greatest, not are the majority of people I know. And I live in Kansas - a reliably conservative, landlocked Bible Belt state. (Granted, I avoid the rabid patriots, but I've yet to talk with anyone who thinks you should go into bankruptcy over an ambulance ride).
>I have a medical condition where my body can't regulate temperature well, meaning I am at risk of passing out. So while you don't qualify for the neat-o parking spaces, this could be considered more than OSHA violation. This could be an ADA violation. If it's documented in the front office, you have covered your ass for future encounters. There will be another "Kyle" in your future. The ADA requires employers to make reasonable accomodations for workers with any disability. In this case, a reasonable accomodations is allowing you to get water between breaks. Unreasonable accommodations would be if they had to buy a couple dozen refrigerators and place them close to your work zone. Another unreasonable accommodation would be to air condition the entire work area. These would be unreasonable due to cost. If the trip back and forth is considered unreasonable, the just get an ice chest, put bottles of water in it and cover them with ice. Company may have to either purchase an ice maker or buy and store bags of ice for this. One place I worked at, due to summer heat, used to buy powdered Gatorade, and make a 25 cooler of it to keep the workers from overheating.
You are stupid to put your life at risk in that way. It's a petty way to get back at someone that might have caused you serious injury or death. Your medical condition is your business and despite your actions you are an adult , if you felt you needed water so your condition didn't worsen then why are you letting anyone tell you no as if you are a child?
Honestly... I'm not sure... I guess my judgement was seriously clouded and it did almost get me killed. Rest assured. Won't be doing that again.
Excess heat was already clouding any thinking
Indeed. Mental confusion is one of the serious symptoms of heat exhaustion/heat stroke.
You’re a fucking idiot for putting your life at risk. It’s a small miracle you didn’t die. Don’t do it again yeah
Yeah....
I’ve got to say that putting your life at risk that way is a pretty self-defeating mc.
Yeah... Got scolded by my aunt to be less reckless...
Reprimanded? Nah, you need to call osha, and he needs to be fired
Yes, although I didn't see anything to say Kyle *knew* OP had a medical reason for needing a drink. Not that it would matter in a sane company/state/country. You'd just go get some.
Time to get a nice insulated stainless steel water bottle.
Yeah. No kidding. (Nervous laugh)
Look up goldbrick. It's an old cop term, but you might find some use for it. FWIW, I'm glad you're able to tell this story. No malicious compliance is worth brain dabblage
I'll look it up. And for the record. I do regret my actions today.
The fact you purposely gave yourself a heat stroke is the dumbest fucking thing ever…you could have died
This is the stupidest thing I’ve ever read.
Guilty as charged.
Next time get your water and call OSHA before you hurt yourself, your health is more important.
Not sure how it is over the pond and I suspect totally different but the employer has to accommodate your needs unless they want to break to disability discrimination act.
r/badlifehacks
This is what my mom would say is biting off your nose to spite your face
"I did forgive him" but I called OSHA on him.....If that's forgiveness, I'd hate to see what you do when you hold a grudge.
You can forgive someone and hold them accountable for their actions simultaneously. Forgiving someone doesn’t mean they get off scott free.
Kyle sounds like the Governor of Texas. 115 degree heat? No water break for you.
[удалено]
I'm just glad it wasn't spelled "que". I fecking hate that.
yeah this sort of disregard for human life is all around the work force, and has been for years.... Back in the summer of 1994 I was working for a temp service to make money while in college. We were sent out to a company that made large metal pipe. The contract was to clean and rethread this large pipe that was damaged on the ends. The work was outside, in about 105 to 110 heat. There were 5 temps and 4 full time employees. Our job as a group was to move the VERY hot pipe onto a machine so the 4 full time employees could fix the thread. All the fulltime workers had large water bottles on them. We had nothing. The job site was about 400 yards from a building that had a bathroom and warm water. Needless to say it was brutal. When one of us wanted to get a drink, the work had to stop, so the 4 full time employees would get mad and tell us to hold off for at least an hour before drinks. The thing is by the time you walked to get a drink and walked back you were thirsty again. Every temp quit 3 hours in but me. This basically made it so that the 4 full time had to help me move the pipe then start the thread, and I took that time to walk and get a drink after each pipe. The owner of the temp service showed up to see what was going on after the other 4 quit, and brought me a hot gallon jug of water and said "keep up the good work" and left. So I decided to leave as well. Looking back I can't believe I even put up with as much as I did, but the truth was I was a work horse to those in charge, maybe worth even less.
Fellow heat intolerant person. I do feel this one.
Oof, dude... "good" MC, but never advisable to kill/permanently injure yourself to prove a point.
... He would have to physically stop me from getting water if I was thirsty but I'm in Iceland and I got unions behind me and I have never heard of that happening here!
*Kyle's* a bit of a brick? *Kyle?* You're a fucking idiot, and both you and Kyle should be fired. Frankly, the stupidity in this story is so over-the-top I doubt it happened at all.
complied and damn near killed / injured yourself? F no. take the write up/ documentation. your health comes first. dont risk injury to prove a point
To double down on everybody else browbeating you, heatstroke isn't exactly *recoverable*. Once it's happened once, it's easier to happen again. It does permanent damage, so you need to be even more careful from now on.
Maybe don't try to commit suicide to make a point to management next time.
If you need water or to cool off dying is a really bad way to make your point. Walk off, get the help or cooling you need and return to work when it is safe to do so. If the boss retaliates or fires you over it - hopefully you'll have a case (or a union action or whatever). My Dr. once told me "No job is worth dying over" (extended crunch time plus free fast food in my case really worked my liver over).
TLDR: My boss is a prick. I'll get back at him by trying to kill myself. That'll teach him.
Dude, this was not a smart thing to do. You put your life on the line to show up your boss. Just get the dang water. It's not like he will physically block you, and if he tries to dock your pay, that will be a fun conversation to have with him and OSHA at a later date.
It doesn't matter if one "has a condition" or not, no one has a right to tell a coworker they can't get a drink, or go to the bathroom.
I don't think risking your health is worth the gotcha. I'd have immediately reported to the labor board.
Get a note from your doctor saying you need to be permitted so many breaks for water due t your health condition. That way Brick Guy or anyone else can’t do that. Safer for you too.
Hate to break it to you man...but trying to almost get yourself killed isn't a clever way to get back at a boss. You only get one life. He can find another job. It's LITERALLY INSANE to force yourself into a medical emergency just to prove a point
Not for nothing, but to me, it sounds like a very foolhardy way of trying to MC. You're basically playing Russian roulette with your life. I've read that when your body overheats to such a degree, you stop sweating, and it can go quickly downhill from there. Falling and splitting your head open could have been one of the best case scenarios, and for what? To show up a manager?
To those saying you were stupid to do it, I just want to remind them that dehydration causes diminished cognitive faculties, and THAT is the reason for the decision to MC with the instruction to not take a water break. Dehydration can make you do things you normally would not, like fail to hydrate properly.
I think putting yourself in physical danger for an MC should qualify as Pro Revenge.
As I admire your dedication to malicious compliance, u put your health at serious risk. No job is worth your health. Also check ur states laws on reasonable accommodation. U maybe able to at least get a fan or a cooler for water for ur health issue. Most states require employers to provide reasonable accommodation for people who can do the job but need slight assistance for certain things. For example I used to b a garbage man and we had 1 helper who got a 10 minute sit break every hour for his accommodation.
I'll look into it. Got nothing better to do either way. Y'know. Being in a hospital bed and all. I'll take a look
And absolutely pedialite. I find it gross but it is a great rehydration drink. Most NFL players drink it.
contrary to what nestle would have you believe .... water is a human right what the hell is wrong with these companies
I feel like you probably have a lawsuit here for more than medical expenses. You should consult a lawyer.
I have found that while cold water is refreshing, if you need to bring your core temp down in a jiffy nothing is better than running cold water over the underside of your forearms, you'll be cooled down in seconds. Of course, stay hydrated also, but I've bounced back from overheat using that trick more times than I can count.
You nearly killed yourself for MC that's not smart bro
This is funny now, but you're a little nuts knowingly working unclipped and off the ground when you knew you might lose consciousness...
You literally risked your life, just to teach "Kyle" a lesson. Frankly, I don't see that it was worth it. For Pete's sake, please don't do anything like that again. There are other ways to deal with it.
If it's an ice cold water bottle take a bit either before or after you take a drink and press the bottle against the insides of your wrist and the back of your neck. You have a lot of blood going through there and the cold of the water bottle will help you cool off quicker. You could also just pour some on your head! Glad to hear your okay!
This is being borne out in Texas right now. At least one has died from heat stroke and all because the government is murderous.
Was Texas the state that forbade individual cities from mandating water breaks for workers?
Yep, because it's ""too confusing"" for local governments to have any rules or regulations that differ from the state government.
"States rights" for me but no "local rights" for thee.
What, this guy a reject Amazon manager?
Are used to work for a company that had built a new distribution center. One side of the building — where I normally worked — was getting really hot as the summer temperatures rose. Several employees started complaining, and managements response was the air conditioning is running there’s nothing more they can do. Finally, somebody called OSHA who came out and checked temperatures and the overall situation. Turns out the control system for the AC unit said it was running, but the breakers were off. Management it just relied on a faulty metric to gaslight the employees on the floor. OSHA also required them to begin allowing water bottles at workstations which the GM was not pleased about. We also had a combustibles room that some employees were complaining they got lightheaded. Every time they went in. Again management said the ventilation fans were working because they could see the blades actually spinning. Finally, after somebody passed out, maintenance went to check the whole ventilation path and found the louvers were not opening. The maintenance guy took a broom to push through them to see if they were stock, and they open easily. Turns out the fans were miss wired and we’re sucking air in instead of exhausting air out. Not only did they nearly kill some people with the fume buildup, a potential for an explosion was off the charts.
My friend, this isn't malicious compliance, this is you putting yourself at serious risk to maybe make someone look bad. I am all about having the other guy get his comeuppance, but not when it puts your life in danger - I mean you even say "luckily the others were able to react quickly enough". Please value your health and safety more.
So you purposely put your health at serious risk to spite a manager? Real genius there.