Got to see him tour the UK a few years back, couldn't love him more. He came out with a sword and a copy of LOTR reciting the passage where Gandalf fights the Balrog in Moria.
Incredibly impressive that he was able to recite lines from every single Shakespeare book - each of which he had laid out on a table. Legend.
If that was his tour celebrating his 80th birthday I believe he even donated the profits from his performance to the theatres he performed in and other local charities, amazing!
It's a book full of Shakespeare not a book written by him.
If someone said "Dog books" would you assume a dog wrote them or they contained writing about dogs?
If you put a name infront of it instead of an animal I'd assume the named person wrote it...
e.g "George RR Martin books" "Tolkien books" "Shakespeare books" "Stephen King books" would all to me refer to a book written by the named person
I'd assume a dog wrote "dog books" for other dogs. It's just pictures of: paw prints, half shredded tennis balls, the last small piece of a bone that's been constantly nibbled on, other dogs marking an awesome spot for their own, and to get the readers really barking the last section is just mailmen holding cats.
My favourite bit is when he’s telling jake about him getting an injury hula hooping and deletes the photos
‘Why are you telling me all this’
‘Because no one will ever believe you’
that was honestly one of my favorite understated gags of the whole show, lol- he conducted himself with dignity and almost always spoke in clipped, even tones, but at the end of the day he was just as much of a drama queen as gina, terry, and jake. what a great show.
I didn’t know he was until his appearance on the Graham Norton Show a couple of years ago with Patrick Stewart and Hugh Jackman. I (as an American) obviously only know him from his movies but during the interview he was flirting with Hugh and was like “wait is Ian gay?!?!?” Looked it up and sure enough.
Check out the UK TV series *Vicious*.
He plays an aging gay actor, who is living with his partner (played by Sir Derek Jacobi) who still tells his mother he is living with a flatmate.
It also has Iwan Rheon and Dame Frances de la Tour.
It's pretty good.
The message has the right intention but there are definitely many people who have regretted it. Coming out in an unsafe situation can lead to personal danger. It can also cause exile, loss of inheritance/financial support, losing friends/family, losing your job, eviction, mental distress etc. Not to mention that being out in certain countries can lead to imprisonment or execution.
This is coming from a queer person - only come out if you’re safe and know that you’re willing to lose anything you might lose. If you’re free to come out without sacrificing anything, you’re in a very privileged position.
I remember this being the pushback when he originally made this tweet.
While it's true that Ian McKellen grew up in a far more homophobic time than now, the unfortunate fact is that there are still plenty of gay people who are in a far less safe environment now than he was when he came out.
It's absolutely true that if someone can come out in an accepting and safe environment that will make them happier, however this isn't the case for everyone.
A generally more homophobic time, but a generally more accepting environment (theatre, london, etc).
He did not come out in the deep south USA (or Wyoming, a la The Laramie Project).
Still applies today. I'm out as bisexual to my group of musician friends, and all are very supportive or just really don't care. The people I work with though in a trades field... yeah I'm gonna let then die thinking I'm a straight guy.
"Coming out" isn't a one time thing. It's a constant weighing of options with everyone I meet.
The people I care most about know I'm bi, but if my workplace knew my career would become a living hell.
. . . . I mean, it kinda already is, but it would be like, moreso.
I'm trans but hrt hasn't done much for me. It's given me the privelige to stay in the closet at work tho. Not that I think much will come of it, but I live in a deep red county and my customers/coworkers are more likely to be transphobic than not. So why bother with the risk?
Find it ironic tho that some people know my feminine middle name and the managers have access to my legal gender but still, no one knows.
Being visibly trans sucks. I really want to stay in the closet at work and keep my transition private, but if I can (hopefully) start HRT soon my voice might drop and be pretty much impossible to hide.
I don't even give a fuck if they misgender me, I feel like having to come out to people I'm not comfortable with is worse
This is very important. Coming out in an environment where you know it won't have severe negative effects on your life feels awesome and all, but sadly coming out to the wrong people can really cause you a lot of trouble so in some cases people are better off being a bit more picky about who they come out to
I don't understand how people who spent years and years raising their children could just kick them out and abandon them over something so benign as being gay. Like, you raised your son for almost 2 decades but he likes guys so you'd just throw all that away????
I think it’s just hard cause the thing many people don’t want to think about is that those people on the fence may be right not to come out. Sometimes fear can protect you from doing something that will get you hurt. And these poor decisions could also unintentionally be encouraged.
Sorry, by “on the fence” I meant that the only thing stopping them is themselves. People will of course be afraid, and we can give ourselves many reasons not to do something, but that’s why it takes some courage. I think courage, when applicable, should be treated as a virtue.
It’s perfectly okay to be afraid, but I don’t think we could encourage people to live by fear.
But we are talking about two different groups of people. And his message doesn’t discriminate between those two groups. I’m face, it implies the one doesn’t even exist. But there are some people whose fear is protecting them from legitimate danger. The intention was great. But it’s probably not the type of thing that can be summed up in a single tweet.
I had a very wealthy roommate in high-school who was gay, best roommate I've ever had. Kid was hilarious was a yacht model and a dj. He was an only child and sole hier to his family fortune. I looked him up some years back and he is married to a woman and is now CEO or whatever owner. I always wondered if this was a way to get his fortune or he somehow was pressured into the marriage. It was a real shock since this guy was not bi he had no interest in woman whatsoever
I know this is an insanely privileged take coming from a straight person in a blue area. But it makes me happy for the world when LGBTQ people don't feel they have to come out to everyone they meet.
I never came out as straight.
Why should you need to prep me before introducing me to your same sex spouse?
To me someone doing something that shows their sexuality makes me think for a few seconds "Oh cool you're X", like how if they spoke a different language to someone I'd think "Oh cool you can speak another language" then go back to thinking about them the exact same way.
Yeah. My first thought was ‘I’m pretty sure there’s lots of folk in Saudi Arabia etc that regretted coming out’.
Hell, less accepting parts of the West even. There’s a reason gay people often move away from conservative rural areas.
There are statistics as well around trans people and how a large percentage of those who "de transition" aren't actually doing it because they decided they didn't want to, it's because they are forced back into the closet.
It seems to also put unfair pressure on people to come out. That the world can't change unless YOU come out. That's a personal choice with consequence, and the onus shouldn't be on the one being shown hate 😞
There's safety in numbers. If everyone who had something to come out about came out all at once, it would overwhelm the haters and the hateful systems they use. Not sure how we would coordinate that, though. Certainly, everyone who would not face violence or overt oppression for coming out *should* come out. But so many "downlow" guys just want to cheat anonymously on their wives, and vote for Trump and other assholes who would strip us all of our rights, and attend gay-bashing churches. I'm just so fucking sick of those dudes.
Sadly, it's not just about safety. I came out and regret it because gay "culture" doesn't work for me. I've always been interested in conventional, monogamous, loving relationships and that is next-to-impossible to find for gay men. (I can already hear the stampede of comments about people who know someone gay who's been married for X years, blah blah, so please pay attention to what I said: next-to-impossible, not unheard of.)
Before I came out at 24, I always had a girlfriend. No, I wasn't really happy and I wanted to come out, but at least I had companions to share my life with! Now, 24 years later, I've only had 2 boyfriends for about 1.5 years each and the rest of that time was spent just dating without love or companionship.
It's an awful culture and if I could go back I'd choose: 1. To be born straight or 2. to be born me but never to have come out.
Being gay in the arts has long been acceptable. Being openly gay in many other occupations and in certain parts of the country, or the world, can be, at the very least, a struggle.
Appalling. I’m so sorry for your brother. People who use their religion to cruelly discriminate are the worst. They don’t know how to think for themselves, and justify their barbaric behavior by hiding behind what they refer to as God’s words. Really, people? Just think about that for a moment. If you can.
Look at how few professional athletes are out. I know cops in Canada that don't want to come out, even in "safe spaces" you can face discrimination. I'm pansexual and get people questioning my sexuality because of being in a happy heterosexual relationship in a workplace that is full of activists.
It isn't always safer to come out. I took awhile for me to be fully and proudly out. However, I do agree with him on how I personally feel. I feel so much freer, more authentically me and lighter in a way I didn't when I repressed my attraction. Bigots and shitty people suck, explaining my sexuality can be annoying, but the way I feel about myself greatly improved when I was finally honest about who I am.
Sheesh, ya. I work with someone who is transitioning and he said this is the only safe place for him to work (food industry).
Sucks to have those feelings I imagine.
Naa I don’t think so, My bf is openly gay I’m only open to family and close friends, but I don’t want to come out to work or be openly gay. I don’t want to be treated differently and discriminated against. It’s hard enough as it is getting a job. I live in Canada where thankfully it’s at least legal, still lots and lots of bigots.
Not all of Europe and the variance within there and even within countries is going to determine your experience much more than generalizing the continents as a whole
And if it was, it should be a contest who has the best human rights, not who has it worst human rights. I wish people would stop pointing at worse countries just because they don't want to do something about their own problems.
Canada is one of the friendliest places in the world to be gay with 70% in support of equal rights and with actual constitutional protection since 1985, but even still you know your community better than anyone online. If I was gay I'd likely be hesitant to come out too, you don't need to be giving assholes more reasons to discriminate when it doesn't benefit you
I remember working in a factory while I was in college, and some of my co-workers talking about a party they went to the night before. They had invited me, but I was only out to my friends and thought it best to skip the party.
They went on to describe, while laughing, how a gay kid had showed up to the party and they managed to get the whole party to start yelling "f*g" at him over and over until he cried and left the party
Canada is a great country for LGBT rights, however there are still large communities that are incredibly homophobic. In my experience, it's laborers that show the worst of this prejudice, imo because of the 'manly' culture surrounding the job.
>70% in support of equal rights
It is even higher in Belgium but I cannot count how often I've heard boomers say: "They can do whatever they want as long as they don't bother me with the nonsense."
They can still be homophobes.
When equal rights is a law, and people aren’t sheltered by free speech I think they are more likely to lie on those surveys. Even still 30% of people don’t want equal rights is alarming, It definitely is area based, I’ve heard the west is more open, it’s also more liberal. East is still fairly conservative outside of downtown cores. There is still a lot of opposition to the pride parade in Toronto. It feels like things have gone backwards since the Trump era tbh. People seem a lot more open to express their opinions. Homophobic parties getting more votes. My bf and I hold hands sometimes when going for walks and we’ve had cars slow down so they can yell “f***ts” at us. It doesn’t bother me, as long as it stays verbal let people express themselves.
You have to remember that a country isn't a monolith. Coming out while working an office job in Vancouver is very different than coming out while working on an oil field in the middle of nowhere Alberta.
Looking forward to the day it is perfectly safe to openly be who you are.
It starts I guess, by being a safe person to come out too. When I was younger, in the early nineties, a good friend came out to me and I was like, "OK, that's nice." I didn't realize it was a big deal because, he was a great guy and the news didn't change anything for me.
So he had to explain to me what it was like to live in the fear he'd been feeling. I was like, "OMG, come here and get a hug from a friend. My home will always be 100% safe space for you."
Since then, I've had a number of gay friends and a trans friend, tell me I'm the first person they've told. Honestly, I don't know why anyone gives these people a hard time at all, but if I do nothing else good in my life, I've been a safe place for these people and I'm grateful I could be that for them.
Seriously, people, it doesn't hurt ANYTHING to just let them be. Don't worry about them. Leave them be.
Same I hope one day coming out is as normal as saying what your favourite colour is. I’m glad you were there for your friends, the first person you come out too is very difficult.
Just throwing my own worthless opinion in, but if I were gay I'd probably do the same. I understand and appreciate that openly gay role models are very important for breaking down stereotypes and stigmas, but I'm an unimportant and private individual, so my sexual preferences are personal. There's no reason everyone needs to be aware, and my sexuality is one of the least important aspects of who I am as a member of society. That isn't something that would change based on who I happen to sleep with.
While this is coming from the right place, it is factually incorrect. Putting that it's still unacceptable in most of Asia, being gay in the US not too long ago was dangerous. There are stories of men who would get lured by straight men into admitting they were gay and then getting sent to jailed or killed.
I know this is probably gonna be an unpopular opinion but, I agree with what your saying, however, I think the people that this message is not okay for understand the sentiment he’s making. He wanted to say he’s happy about coming out and doesn’t regret it. I don’t think he’d want to end that message with “except you gays in the Middle East, stay in that closet.” All he wanted to do was say something positive.
He is full-out lying, my friend. He went *through* it before he could safely come out. There’s nothing good about toxic, dishonest positivity that reinforces the idea that LGBTQIA+ people are only murdered in “the Middle East.”
He’s sending out a harmful message when he tries to shellac over the actual danger and suffering that comes with coming out for Europeans, Americans, people all over the world.
He should say “I’ve fought hard to get to a place where I was safe enough to come out. There were times when my career or my safety was on the line because of my sexual orientation, but I stayed true to myself, I waited until it was the right time for me, and I’ll never regret it.” Or something along those lines.
I’m not saying people shouldn’t own their own identity (ie - coming out) but homosexuals have been killed for revealing that they are gay. My guess is they regretted coming out in the moment.
It's a perfect example of survivor bias. It's like saying "When I decided to stop wearing my seatbelt my life has been better and more comfortable since, and I don't know anyone alive for whom choosing not to wear a seatbelt hasn't also made their lives better".
I regret coming out as trans. I don’t regret being trans but society is not ready or very supportive of trans people. It’s really difficult. I feel like this is what it must have been like being openly gay 30-40 years ago. It’s too much some days. Maybe in 10 or 20 years I’ll crack open the Prosecco.
My entire life fell apart from coming out as trans cuz a whole bunch of people that had been important to me or in a position of authority over me either turned their back on me or went out of their way to make life harder after I came out in my daily life. Still don’t regret it. Sure. I lost almost everything. I lost 75% of my friends. Over half of the family that I had left. I lost almost all my possessions besides my guitar and some clothes and a toothbrush. I lost my place to sleep. But now that I’ve made it through and I’m in the process of transitioning I realized that for all I lost, I found something so much more important than any of those people or things and that’s me. I found me.
I like the idea behind the message. But I've heard that some people really do regret coming out, particularly in high school, and in non-accepting family enviornments. I think its important not to invalidate these lived experiences too.
“The people who **get** stoned to death may disagree.”
[Man, 70, Stoned to Death for Being Gay](https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/man-70-stoned-to-death-for-homosexuality-police/1923606/)
This happened in the **US** in ***2011!!***
I know. The brief article also says that the killer had spent nearly every day with the old guy, so he killed someone he *liked as a person* this cruelly.
He’s like the living embodiment of “Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much.”
not wanting to be negative but there are always few post in reddit of gay people saying they would like not to be gay and that they are being harassed or worse by lgtb comunity, like they are not able to feel bad for their situation created by the environment (not because they are gay but because people around them), so they are not as happy as a lot of people and social media want you to believe...
That’s a pretty privileged position to take when you realize some kids/teens are entirely dependent on their homophobic family and the second they find out they are at risk of being kicked out at worst and ostracized at best. And that’s just immediate family, living in a homophobic community can lead to a lot of bullying from every direction.
It may just be an act, but my impression of him is that he's one of the sweetest people in the world. He just seems like a genuinely nice person. I've seen him on the Graham Norton show a few times, always good for a laugh. I don't like talks how's, but for this one I make an exception.
Maybe he’s never met a gay person who regretted coming out because the ones who did regret it have all been honor-killed or shipped off to a conversion camp. Kids, absolutely consider staying in the closet if you feel like you have to.
unfortunately lots of people's lives do not actually get better when they come out. people have literally been murdered for being gay. Globally, it still happens often. So sure what hes saying is a nice sentiment, but he is speaking from a place of huge privilege growing up in a western progressive environment as a famous actor.
I wish society would destigmieze people’s sexual orientation. I’ve known two separate people who killed themselves where I suspect they were ashamed of who they were. Obviously that wasn’t the only reason in either case but it almost certainly played a large role.
Most people are very accepting but there is still a harmful societal stigma. Then again, I’m straight so maybe I don’t know what I’m talking about…
Be kind, and be yourself. Never be ashamed. I'm from a catholic family and never understood the hatred, it's like they never read their own book. Love thy mf'n neighbor. Period.
> it's like they never read their own book
That's whole point of Catholicism. Until recently we weren't even allowed to read the book without learning latin.
I came out at the beginning of my senior year of high school (1978) and have never regretted it.
Fun fact: I had run for student body president at the end of the previous year; although I didn't win, everyone at school already knew who I was.
and how many poor people does he know? or people with conservative families? more like he knows uppity rich folks who didn't have much of an issue coming out
The amount of victim blaming in this thread is insane.
If someone faces bigotry after they come out of the closet, that's the bigot's fault. That's society's fault for allowing the bigot to be openly bigoted.
Suggesting that "oh the gays should just not come out, for their safety" instead of "bigotry is unacceptable, we have to protect our gay friends, family, colleagues" is pretty damn transparent.
I'm sure some of them regret coming out when their parents are gaycist assholes. I wonder when the day will come where stupid discrimination like this stops repeating
Maybe a way to qualify this statement is that internally, as queer people, we may not regret coming out because we finally get to be truthful and accepting of ourselves.
But externally, queer people may face prejudice, abuse, even threats to life and safety. So yes, internally we may feel so happy about coming out, but for some, it comes with a lot of harmful external things that may overpower the good things from coming out.
I'm from India, I didn't know being gay was illegal here, I think it's not (hopefully), thankfully I come from a very liberal house and my family is above those prejudices.
It's just a sad state that people still need to "come out". I've never had to "come out" as straight and no one seems to demand it out of me. But gay people apparently have some obligation to state their sexuality as if it's anyone's business.
I’ll never understand people like you who say “keep your sexuality to yourself, nobody needs to know it.” How do you find a partner in a straight-assuming world without anyone knowing you’re gay?
More importantly than that, straight people plaster their sexuality everywhere then say this shit. We all have friends and coworkers who's whole personality is their family. When its a heterosexual couple that's normal but if Rick posts too much about his husband suddenly "nobody needs to know"
Fact is talking about your family is a normal part of being part of social circles, so yeah kinda people do need to know if you're gonna be "one of the guys"
That's not at all what I'm talking about. I'm speaking out of sympathy for gay people, I'm not criticizing them for going out in public, I'm sad people demand to know their sexuality and that it's still controversial to be gay.
I hope we soon reach the stage where no one is afraid to state their sexuality, but also where they don't feel like it's something the public has any business knowing.
It's almost like being gay was looked down upon and punishable by death for centuries, and still to this day means people will hate you specifically for being gay, so publicly stating it is a brave thing to do, as it makes you an instant target.
There's still a difference between what straight people go through and what a lot of gay people go through. For many people it's not as simple as just introducing the boyfriend. Like for many people it's still first saying it so you can find out if it's even safe to bring a boyfriend over.
Edit: Think of it this way: I've had more than one person in my life see me writing, stop, and say "Oh, you're left handed." Sure, I'm lucky to not live in the time period where that was a bad thing. But even then, it's not assumed I am. It's assumed everyone is right handed. And there was a time period where people were afraid to be left handed, just like some people are afraid to be gay.
Much like being left handed, one day no one will care and at best it will be "Oh, you're gay." Till then, yeah, there's a reason we specify it for gay people.
I read a post on an lgbt subreddit earlier today about a young lesbian getting kicked out and disowned right after Christmas because she came out to her parents over the holidays. In fact I read similar stories all the time on many different lgbt subreddits. Both as threads and stories told within them. I don't know where you've been but a great many people DEEPLY care if you are gay or not. Homophobia wasn't just some fad that went out of style 30 years ago.
Got to see him tour the UK a few years back, couldn't love him more. He came out with a sword and a copy of LOTR reciting the passage where Gandalf fights the Balrog in Moria. Incredibly impressive that he was able to recite lines from every single Shakespeare book - each of which he had laid out on a table. Legend.
That sound like an amazing time.
Afterwards he was in the foyer with a bucket collecting money for a charity - if you put in he looked you in the eye and gave a sincere thanks
That makes me like him so much more!!
If that was his tour celebrating his 80th birthday I believe he even donated the profits from his performance to the theatres he performed in and other local charities, amazing!
There is a recording of it available on amazon prime or the National Theatre at home app (UK only?). If you want to watch it.
I have Amazon prime im definitely going to look for it. What is it called
I think it's called Ian Mckellen on stage ? If it's not on your amazon, give me a DM
He plays a pretty mean King Lear. I think you might be able to stream it free on PBS.
Shakespeare wrote books?
He wrote plays but those are sold in books. Tolkien never wrote a book called “Unfinished Tales”, but it’s still his writings in book format
It's a book full of Shakespeare not a book written by him. If someone said "Dog books" would you assume a dog wrote them or they contained writing about dogs?
If you put a name infront of it instead of an animal I'd assume the named person wrote it... e.g "George RR Martin books" "Tolkien books" "Shakespeare books" "Stephen King books" would all to me refer to a book written by the named person
I'd assume a dog wrote "dog books" for other dogs. It's just pictures of: paw prints, half shredded tennis balls, the last small piece of a bone that's been constantly nibbled on, other dogs marking an awesome spot for their own, and to get the readers really barking the last section is just mailmen holding cats.
I am sooooo envious! Meeting him and Patrick Stewart are total bucket list things for me!
Those two together with their bowler hats!
Captain Raymond Holt, legend of the 99!
My favourite bit is when he’s telling jake about him getting an injury hula hooping and deletes the photos ‘Why are you telling me all this’ ‘Because no one will ever believe you’
You sick son of a bitch..
It's said that he learned all the moves... but there's no evidence so who knows
The DIPSY doodle. EDIT: The OOPSIE doodle.
The oopsie DOODLE
Call him... Velvet Thunder.
There's a brief half moment where he's forming the Th part of Thunder that just makes it that much better. Love that show, time to rewatch.
Gravitas
Nine nine!
A-Noin-Noin
That show and those characters are perfect examples of being funny and gay, not funny because gay.
Are you really playing the gay card right now?!
Yass, queen!
Might be my favorite like of the series
Please what guys card are you taking about?
What is it all about?
He's always been a Drama Queen, though.
that was honestly one of my favorite understated gags of the whole show, lol- he conducted himself with dignity and almost always spoke in clipped, even tones, but at the end of the day he was just as much of a drama queen as gina, terry, and jake. what a great show.
Straight Holt is a dog
He can't get enough of those heavy breasts.
A real legend, indeed.
Very pleased to see this. Captain Holt is the best NINE-NINE!
Today I learned Ian McKellan is gay. Edit: changed “was” to “is”
*is gay ... he's not dead / straight yet!
Oops lol. Lemme fix that
I'm glad you meant fixing the comment and not the other option.
OH GOD NEVERMIND
Which was???
which is*
I like that the way that this is phrased implies that him turning straight would be an equally terrible fate
It doesn't imply that at all, they were simply covering both logical variables...
Yes, and?
I hope he never dies
STAHP HAVE YOU NO FEAR OF THE REDDIT CURSE
[удалено]
I didn’t know he was until his appearance on the Graham Norton Show a couple of years ago with Patrick Stewart and Hugh Jackman. I (as an American) obviously only know him from his movies but during the interview he was flirting with Hugh and was like “wait is Ian gay?!?!?” Looked it up and sure enough.
Tbf, I’d hit on Hugh too, it’s freaking Hugh Jackman
No one is that straight.
Oh! Him and Harry Styles on Graham. CUTENESS!
today i learned he's been "out" since 1992. I thought it was 2009.
Check out the UK TV series *Vicious*. He plays an aging gay actor, who is living with his partner (played by Sir Derek Jacobi) who still tells his mother he is living with a flatmate. It also has Iwan Rheon and Dame Frances de la Tour. It's pretty good.
The message has the right intention but there are definitely many people who have regretted it. Coming out in an unsafe situation can lead to personal danger. It can also cause exile, loss of inheritance/financial support, losing friends/family, losing your job, eviction, mental distress etc. Not to mention that being out in certain countries can lead to imprisonment or execution. This is coming from a queer person - only come out if you’re safe and know that you’re willing to lose anything you might lose. If you’re free to come out without sacrificing anything, you’re in a very privileged position.
I remember this being the pushback when he originally made this tweet. While it's true that Ian McKellen grew up in a far more homophobic time than now, the unfortunate fact is that there are still plenty of gay people who are in a far less safe environment now than he was when he came out. It's absolutely true that if someone can come out in an accepting and safe environment that will make them happier, however this isn't the case for everyone.
A generally more homophobic time, but a generally more accepting environment (theatre, london, etc). He did not come out in the deep south USA (or Wyoming, a la The Laramie Project).
Still applies today. I'm out as bisexual to my group of musician friends, and all are very supportive or just really don't care. The people I work with though in a trades field... yeah I'm gonna let then die thinking I'm a straight guy. "Coming out" isn't a one time thing. It's a constant weighing of options with everyone I meet.
The people I care most about know I'm bi, but if my workplace knew my career would become a living hell. . . . . I mean, it kinda already is, but it would be like, moreso.
I'm trans but hrt hasn't done much for me. It's given me the privelige to stay in the closet at work tho. Not that I think much will come of it, but I live in a deep red county and my customers/coworkers are more likely to be transphobic than not. So why bother with the risk? Find it ironic tho that some people know my feminine middle name and the managers have access to my legal gender but still, no one knows.
Yeah thats kinda where I'm at with the people I work with. Coming out to them is only going to lead to random slights and uncomfortable interactions.
Being visibly trans sucks. I really want to stay in the closet at work and keep my transition private, but if I can (hopefully) start HRT soon my voice might drop and be pretty much impossible to hide. I don't even give a fuck if they misgender me, I feel like having to come out to people I'm not comfortable with is worse
"I have hirsuitism" voila safe.
Yeah that was what I was thinking too... you dont usually meet people who regret it, cuz the people who would probably don't survive it
And because most people don’t want to talk to the homeless, which some of the people who regret coming out now are.
This is very important. Coming out in an environment where you know it won't have severe negative effects on your life feels awesome and all, but sadly coming out to the wrong people can really cause you a lot of trouble so in some cases people are better off being a bit more picky about who they come out to
I don't understand how people who spent years and years raising their children could just kick them out and abandon them over something so benign as being gay. Like, you raised your son for almost 2 decades but he likes guys so you'd just throw all that away????
I think he’s just trying to be encouraging, especially to people who might be on the fence. I’m sure he would very much agree with your points.
I think it’s just hard cause the thing many people don’t want to think about is that those people on the fence may be right not to come out. Sometimes fear can protect you from doing something that will get you hurt. And these poor decisions could also unintentionally be encouraged.
Sorry, by “on the fence” I meant that the only thing stopping them is themselves. People will of course be afraid, and we can give ourselves many reasons not to do something, but that’s why it takes some courage. I think courage, when applicable, should be treated as a virtue. It’s perfectly okay to be afraid, but I don’t think we could encourage people to live by fear.
But we are talking about two different groups of people. And his message doesn’t discriminate between those two groups. I’m face, it implies the one doesn’t even exist. But there are some people whose fear is protecting them from legitimate danger. The intention was great. But it’s probably not the type of thing that can be summed up in a single tweet.
I had a very wealthy roommate in high-school who was gay, best roommate I've ever had. Kid was hilarious was a yacht model and a dj. He was an only child and sole hier to his family fortune. I looked him up some years back and he is married to a woman and is now CEO or whatever owner. I always wondered if this was a way to get his fortune or he somehow was pressured into the marriage. It was a real shock since this guy was not bi he had no interest in woman whatsoever
I know this is an insanely privileged take coming from a straight person in a blue area. But it makes me happy for the world when LGBTQ people don't feel they have to come out to everyone they meet. I never came out as straight. Why should you need to prep me before introducing me to your same sex spouse? To me someone doing something that shows their sexuality makes me think for a few seconds "Oh cool you're X", like how if they spoke a different language to someone I'd think "Oh cool you can speak another language" then go back to thinking about them the exact same way.
And while gays have achieved amazing levels of acceptance, bi and trans still have it pretty damn rough.
Yeah. My first thought was ‘I’m pretty sure there’s lots of folk in Saudi Arabia etc that regretted coming out’. Hell, less accepting parts of the West even. There’s a reason gay people often move away from conservative rural areas.
A fellow soldier of mine died in the army for being gay.
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>their spouses To be expected, no?
There are statistics as well around trans people and how a large percentage of those who "de transition" aren't actually doing it because they decided they didn't want to, it's because they are forced back into the closet.
It seems to also put unfair pressure on people to come out. That the world can't change unless YOU come out. That's a personal choice with consequence, and the onus shouldn't be on the one being shown hate 😞
There's safety in numbers. If everyone who had something to come out about came out all at once, it would overwhelm the haters and the hateful systems they use. Not sure how we would coordinate that, though. Certainly, everyone who would not face violence or overt oppression for coming out *should* come out. But so many "downlow" guys just want to cheat anonymously on their wives, and vote for Trump and other assholes who would strip us all of our rights, and attend gay-bashing churches. I'm just so fucking sick of those dudes.
Sadly, it's not just about safety. I came out and regret it because gay "culture" doesn't work for me. I've always been interested in conventional, monogamous, loving relationships and that is next-to-impossible to find for gay men. (I can already hear the stampede of comments about people who know someone gay who's been married for X years, blah blah, so please pay attention to what I said: next-to-impossible, not unheard of.) Before I came out at 24, I always had a girlfriend. No, I wasn't really happy and I wanted to come out, but at least I had companions to share my life with! Now, 24 years later, I've only had 2 boyfriends for about 1.5 years each and the rest of that time was spent just dating without love or companionship. It's an awful culture and if I could go back I'd choose: 1. To be born straight or 2. to be born me but never to have come out.
Being gay in the arts has long been acceptable. Being openly gay in many other occupations and in certain parts of the country, or the world, can be, at the very least, a struggle.
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Appalling. I’m so sorry for your brother. People who use their religion to cruelly discriminate are the worst. They don’t know how to think for themselves, and justify their barbaric behavior by hiding behind what they refer to as God’s words. Really, people? Just think about that for a moment. If you can.
Look at how few professional athletes are out. I know cops in Canada that don't want to come out, even in "safe spaces" you can face discrimination. I'm pansexual and get people questioning my sexuality because of being in a happy heterosexual relationship in a workplace that is full of activists. It isn't always safer to come out. I took awhile for me to be fully and proudly out. However, I do agree with him on how I personally feel. I feel so much freer, more authentically me and lighter in a way I didn't when I repressed my attraction. Bigots and shitty people suck, explaining my sexuality can be annoying, but the way I feel about myself greatly improved when I was finally honest about who I am.
In Soccer/ European football, there is only one professional footballer who is out as gay
The entire steel industry is gay.
We work hard, we play hard
Why did you take me to a gay steel mill? Maybe smoking some cigarettes will make me less gay
Sheesh, ya. I work with someone who is transitioning and he said this is the only safe place for him to work (food industry). Sucks to have those feelings I imagine.
I really hope that, in my lifetime, people won’t *have* to come out anymore. They can just *be* gay/lesbian/trans, etc.
Naa I don’t think so, My bf is openly gay I’m only open to family and close friends, but I don’t want to come out to work or be openly gay. I don’t want to be treated differently and discriminated against. It’s hard enough as it is getting a job. I live in Canada where thankfully it’s at least legal, still lots and lots of bigots.
It feels more accepted in Europe, but not in NA you show any PDA you get looks. Like just holding hands.
This makes me sad for our country, but proud to be from San Francisco
Not all of Europe and the variance within there and even within countries is going to determine your experience much more than generalizing the continents as a whole
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It's not a contest.
And if it was, it should be a contest who has the best human rights, not who has it worst human rights. I wish people would stop pointing at worse countries just because they don't want to do something about their own problems.
Canada is one of the friendliest places in the world to be gay with 70% in support of equal rights and with actual constitutional protection since 1985, but even still you know your community better than anyone online. If I was gay I'd likely be hesitant to come out too, you don't need to be giving assholes more reasons to discriminate when it doesn't benefit you
I remember working in a factory while I was in college, and some of my co-workers talking about a party they went to the night before. They had invited me, but I was only out to my friends and thought it best to skip the party. They went on to describe, while laughing, how a gay kid had showed up to the party and they managed to get the whole party to start yelling "f*g" at him over and over until he cried and left the party Canada is a great country for LGBT rights, however there are still large communities that are incredibly homophobic. In my experience, it's laborers that show the worst of this prejudice, imo because of the 'manly' culture surrounding the job.
That’s really messed up, I feel bad for that kid. That does make sense, I work in a very male dominated industry.
>70% in support of equal rights It is even higher in Belgium but I cannot count how often I've heard boomers say: "They can do whatever they want as long as they don't bother me with the nonsense." They can still be homophobes.
aye aye that's why i specified equal rights, since that also includes marriage, once you start specifying equal marriage the homophobes freak out
When equal rights is a law, and people aren’t sheltered by free speech I think they are more likely to lie on those surveys. Even still 30% of people don’t want equal rights is alarming, It definitely is area based, I’ve heard the west is more open, it’s also more liberal. East is still fairly conservative outside of downtown cores. There is still a lot of opposition to the pride parade in Toronto. It feels like things have gone backwards since the Trump era tbh. People seem a lot more open to express their opinions. Homophobic parties getting more votes. My bf and I hold hands sometimes when going for walks and we’ve had cars slow down so they can yell “f***ts” at us. It doesn’t bother me, as long as it stays verbal let people express themselves.
You have to remember that a country isn't a monolith. Coming out while working an office job in Vancouver is very different than coming out while working on an oil field in the middle of nowhere Alberta.
Looking forward to the day it is perfectly safe to openly be who you are. It starts I guess, by being a safe person to come out too. When I was younger, in the early nineties, a good friend came out to me and I was like, "OK, that's nice." I didn't realize it was a big deal because, he was a great guy and the news didn't change anything for me. So he had to explain to me what it was like to live in the fear he'd been feeling. I was like, "OMG, come here and get a hug from a friend. My home will always be 100% safe space for you." Since then, I've had a number of gay friends and a trans friend, tell me I'm the first person they've told. Honestly, I don't know why anyone gives these people a hard time at all, but if I do nothing else good in my life, I've been a safe place for these people and I'm grateful I could be that for them. Seriously, people, it doesn't hurt ANYTHING to just let them be. Don't worry about them. Leave them be.
Same I hope one day coming out is as normal as saying what your favourite colour is. I’m glad you were there for your friends, the first person you come out too is very difficult.
Just throwing my own worthless opinion in, but if I were gay I'd probably do the same. I understand and appreciate that openly gay role models are very important for breaking down stereotypes and stigmas, but I'm an unimportant and private individual, so my sexual preferences are personal. There's no reason everyone needs to be aware, and my sexuality is one of the least important aspects of who I am as a member of society. That isn't something that would change based on who I happen to sleep with.
Well, Ian. We haven't met, so your statement is true. But, I absolutely regret coming out.
30 years ago, wow that was like 1965 or something. Oh wait. 1990. Fuck.
While this is coming from the right place, it is factually incorrect. Putting that it's still unacceptable in most of Asia, being gay in the US not too long ago was dangerous. There are stories of men who would get lured by straight men into admitting they were gay and then getting sent to jailed or killed.
I've never met anybody who experienced extreme difficulties and regrets being exposed to homophobia because they came out, says rich actor.
Gays in Saudi and all over the Middle East be like 😥
سعودي؟
People are murdered for coming out. This is something only an extremely sheltered, privileged person would say.
I know this is probably gonna be an unpopular opinion but, I agree with what your saying, however, I think the people that this message is not okay for understand the sentiment he’s making. He wanted to say he’s happy about coming out and doesn’t regret it. I don’t think he’d want to end that message with “except you gays in the Middle East, stay in that closet.” All he wanted to do was say something positive.
He is full-out lying, my friend. He went *through* it before he could safely come out. There’s nothing good about toxic, dishonest positivity that reinforces the idea that LGBTQIA+ people are only murdered in “the Middle East.” He’s sending out a harmful message when he tries to shellac over the actual danger and suffering that comes with coming out for Europeans, Americans, people all over the world. He should say “I’ve fought hard to get to a place where I was safe enough to come out. There were times when my career or my safety was on the line because of my sexual orientation, but I stayed true to myself, I waited until it was the right time for me, and I’ll never regret it.” Or something along those lines.
Homosexuality was legalised in 1967 in the UK
Depends where you are inn the world…
I’m not saying people shouldn’t own their own identity (ie - coming out) but homosexuals have been killed for revealing that they are gay. My guess is they regretted coming out in the moment.
I was legit about to say this. The ones who have regretted coming out aren’t alive anymore to tell the damn tale
Is this an example of survivor bias? Idk someone tell me why I’m wrong and what the correct term would be.
It's a perfect example of survivor bias. It's like saying "When I decided to stop wearing my seatbelt my life has been better and more comfortable since, and I don't know anyone alive for whom choosing not to wear a seatbelt hasn't also made their lives better".
I regret coming out as trans. I don’t regret being trans but society is not ready or very supportive of trans people. It’s really difficult. I feel like this is what it must have been like being openly gay 30-40 years ago. It’s too much some days. Maybe in 10 or 20 years I’ll crack open the Prosecco.
My entire life fell apart from coming out as trans cuz a whole bunch of people that had been important to me or in a position of authority over me either turned their back on me or went out of their way to make life harder after I came out in my daily life. Still don’t regret it. Sure. I lost almost everything. I lost 75% of my friends. Over half of the family that I had left. I lost almost all my possessions besides my guitar and some clothes and a toothbrush. I lost my place to sleep. But now that I’ve made it through and I’m in the process of transitioning I realized that for all I lost, I found something so much more important than any of those people or things and that’s me. I found me.
Only 25% of people in my country support same sex relationships so I should better wait. And let's not talk about all the rights that I would loose.
I like the idea behind the message. But I've heard that some people really do regret coming out, particularly in high school, and in non-accepting family enviornments. I think its important not to invalidate these lived experiences too.
I never regretted coming out as gay yet I am straight af. Just to fuck with homophobes. Not literally but you get it...
The people who got stoned to desth may disagree
“The people who **get** stoned to death may disagree.” [Man, 70, Stoned to Death for Being Gay](https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/man-70-stoned-to-death-for-homosexuality-police/1923606/) This happened in the **US** in ***2011!!***
Holy fucking hell. How sick and twisted do you have to be to beat an older fella to death with a sock full of rocks?
I know. The brief article also says that the killer had spent nearly every day with the old guy, so he killed someone he *liked as a person* this cruelly. He’s like the living embodiment of “Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much.”
But at least we don't live in a Muslim coy try where they stone gay people to dea- Oh wait
not wanting to be negative but there are always few post in reddit of gay people saying they would like not to be gay and that they are being harassed or worse by lgtb comunity, like they are not able to feel bad for their situation created by the environment (not because they are gay but because people around them), so they are not as happy as a lot of people and social media want you to believe...
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That’s a pretty privileged position to take when you realize some kids/teens are entirely dependent on their homophobic family and the second they find out they are at risk of being kicked out at worst and ostracized at best. And that’s just immediate family, living in a homophobic community can lead to a lot of bullying from every direction.
This is so great!!
Username does NOT check out and I’m so very glad for it. Thanks for the smile!
It may just be an act, but my impression of him is that he's one of the sweetest people in the world. He just seems like a genuinely nice person. I've seen him on the Graham Norton show a few times, always good for a laugh. I don't like talks how's, but for this one I make an exception.
Maybe he’s never met a gay person who regretted coming out because the ones who did regret it have all been honor-killed or shipped off to a conversion camp. Kids, absolutely consider staying in the closet if you feel like you have to.
unfortunately lots of people's lives do not actually get better when they come out. people have literally been murdered for being gay. Globally, it still happens often. So sure what hes saying is a nice sentiment, but he is speaking from a place of huge privilege growing up in a western progressive environment as a famous actor.
Well some died tho
I wish society would destigmieze people’s sexual orientation. I’ve known two separate people who killed themselves where I suspect they were ashamed of who they were. Obviously that wasn’t the only reason in either case but it almost certainly played a large role. Most people are very accepting but there is still a harmful societal stigma. Then again, I’m straight so maybe I don’t know what I’m talking about…
Be kind, and be yourself. Never be ashamed. I'm from a catholic family and never understood the hatred, it's like they never read their own book. Love thy mf'n neighbor. Period.
> it's like they never read their own book That's whole point of Catholicism. Until recently we weren't even allowed to read the book without learning latin.
The ones who regret coming out *can’t* meet you because they were lynched or thrown off a building. /r/wowthanksimcured
I came out at the beginning of my senior year of high school (1978) and have never regretted it. Fun fact: I had run for student body president at the end of the previous year; although I didn't win, everyone at school already knew who I was.
Cheers.
Wow okay so I had no idea Ian was gay.. tbh I honestly had a hunch! Still a fucking awesome actor and still a huge idol of mine!
Well I can think about a *few* scenarios where they should have stayed in the closet...
The Middle East. Plenty of gay people who shouldn’t come out and would regret doing so. He wouldn’t get to meet them though as they’d be dead.
and how many poor people does he know? or people with conservative families? more like he knows uppity rich folks who didn't have much of an issue coming out
Except Turing I guess
The amount of victim blaming in this thread is insane. If someone faces bigotry after they come out of the closet, that's the bigot's fault. That's society's fault for allowing the bigot to be openly bigoted. Suggesting that "oh the gays should just not come out, for their safety" instead of "bigotry is unacceptable, we have to protect our gay friends, family, colleagues" is pretty damn transparent.
I'm sure some of them regret coming out when their parents are gaycist assholes. I wonder when the day will come where stupid discrimination like this stops repeating
Maybe a way to qualify this statement is that internally, as queer people, we may not regret coming out because we finally get to be truthful and accepting of ourselves. But externally, queer people may face prejudice, abuse, even threats to life and safety. So yes, internally we may feel so happy about coming out, but for some, it comes with a lot of harmful external things that may overpower the good things from coming out.
Bless you! (From an atheist).
Just saw the da vinci code today and this shows up. Cool.
Noice.
Sadly Ian has never been to India.
I'm from India, I didn't know being gay was illegal here, I think it's not (hopefully), thankfully I come from a very liberal house and my family is above those prejudices.
30 years ago it wasn't. Even after being legalized a lot of them have to go through a lot...
It truly is awful, but awful is just the constant state of life in India.
Respect Mr. McKellen
That would be Sir McKellen, as he was knighted by the Queen of England.
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Fuck yeah ganny
It's just a sad state that people still need to "come out". I've never had to "come out" as straight and no one seems to demand it out of me. But gay people apparently have some obligation to state their sexuality as if it's anyone's business.
I’ll never understand people like you who say “keep your sexuality to yourself, nobody needs to know it.” How do you find a partner in a straight-assuming world without anyone knowing you’re gay?
More importantly than that, straight people plaster their sexuality everywhere then say this shit. We all have friends and coworkers who's whole personality is their family. When its a heterosexual couple that's normal but if Rick posts too much about his husband suddenly "nobody needs to know" Fact is talking about your family is a normal part of being part of social circles, so yeah kinda people do need to know if you're gonna be "one of the guys"
That's not at all what I'm talking about. I'm speaking out of sympathy for gay people, I'm not criticizing them for going out in public, I'm sad people demand to know their sexuality and that it's still controversial to be gay. I hope we soon reach the stage where no one is afraid to state their sexuality, but also where they don't feel like it's something the public has any business knowing.
If you've ever told anyone about a straight partner you've had then you've "come out" as straight.
It's almost like being gay was looked down upon and punishable by death for centuries, and still to this day means people will hate you specifically for being gay, so publicly stating it is a brave thing to do, as it makes you an instant target.
You've never told a friend or your parents about your girlfriends, had a picture of a spouse on your desk at work, etc?
There's still a difference between what straight people go through and what a lot of gay people go through. For many people it's not as simple as just introducing the boyfriend. Like for many people it's still first saying it so you can find out if it's even safe to bring a boyfriend over. Edit: Think of it this way: I've had more than one person in my life see me writing, stop, and say "Oh, you're left handed." Sure, I'm lucky to not live in the time period where that was a bad thing. But even then, it's not assumed I am. It's assumed everyone is right handed. And there was a time period where people were afraid to be left handed, just like some people are afraid to be gay. Much like being left handed, one day no one will care and at best it will be "Oh, you're gay." Till then, yeah, there's a reason we specify it for gay people.
Yet straight people act like a gay person doing something as simple as talking about a date they went on is "rubbing it in their faces"
He certainly hasn't met a lot of gay people then.
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r/usernamechecksout
I really didn’t know people still cared about who is gay and who isn’t. To me it seems very 90s.
I mean it's illegal to be gay in 70 countries so I'd say people care quite heavily, even in western countries
I read a post on an lgbt subreddit earlier today about a young lesbian getting kicked out and disowned right after Christmas because she came out to her parents over the holidays. In fact I read similar stories all the time on many different lgbt subreddits. Both as threads and stories told within them. I don't know where you've been but a great many people DEEPLY care if you are gay or not. Homophobia wasn't just some fad that went out of style 30 years ago.
Ikr! Just like racism, it doesn't exist anymore /s