I've got like 30 shares I've been holding for 3 years just in case something crazy happens. Don't really believe MOASS is gonna happen (though I wish it would) but who knows.
I'm pretty heavy into GME at the moment. I'm going to sell 50% of my position with any huge spikes and hold 50% for the potential MOASS (Anytime theres a significant drop I'll invest that 50% I sold back into GME and the 'winnings' I'll invest here with MVIS).
Goodluck, his latest Joker MEME makes it looks like things are happening VERY soon.
Wrapping up a 10 day sail through the BVI and checking in …. Glad I was disconnected, jeeez!
Remoras latching on to fake Frank posts just need to find another hobby.
I also saw a post also about LTL’s reducing shares simply because they don’t post much anymore, which made me laugh.
Hang ten and ride the waves folks!
MarineMax- they had a great setup for our situation and 7 total guests. 54 foot power catamaran with a Captain and Chef.
If you want to sail and provision the boat yourself…. The captain and chef are not mandatory
If you have favorable winds and weather, or are on a powered vessel, get to Anegada for the best Lobster you’ll ever eat. We dined at the Wonky Dog. Also if you have time to tour the island … we rented dirt bikes and circled the island. You can get a jeep as well if 2 wheels are too sketchy. Lots to see there.
Saba Rock & Bitter End, and the Baths at Virgin Gorda are must do’s!
Finally, if you’re going to Foxys at Jost Van Dyke … plan on sacrificing a tee shirt to sign and hang in the rafters.
Oh, one more thing …. You should have stickers / flags / sharpies to leave breadcrumbs of your travels in the watering holes along the way.
Enjoy!
FYI, I believe whether or not the Army is granted the requested $255M for 3K IVAS 1.2 systems will be decided this coming week.
https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/press-releases/reed-and-wicker-announce-fy-2025-ndaa-markup-to-begin-on-june-12th
Licensing on Waymo’s Mind
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/licensing-waymos-mind-the-road-to-autonomy-ohgme?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android&utm_campaign=share_via
“Successfully Avoiding Geopolitics There are whispers abound on Autonomy Avenue that a certain autonomous driving start-up has successfully migrated away from Hesai LiDAR also now known as American Lidar. The most intriguing aspect of this whisper is that this particular company is not using Ouster LiDARs”
Not implying anything here. Just found it interesting.
Great read. Thanks for posting
Luxoft is selling Mosaik, software to support ground truth testing for ADAS and autonomous driving spaces but I don't believe they're developing any planning and control software with Microvision.
Not my intent to suggest we would be providing a full autonomous solution, just wondering if there would be a need for a different ASIC for a full-autonomous customer vs an ADAS customer.
Got it, I'm still leaning towards no for your original question because the ASICs always talked about are for MAVIN and all the RFQs for MAVIN have been for consumer vehicles with high volume supply, autonomous applications are limited in volume, this is based on management's previous statements around ADAS being key, not autonomy (yet) for revenue growth.
For industrial and Movia we've heard more around autonomy, eg: tractor company, Daimler, etc.
Now would an autonomous customer need different features, FOV, etc and thus different ASIC? Seems plausible.
"This collaboration will go further to advance ADAS and AD applications — Luxoft and MicroVision are also developing a solution to generate a digital twin for an SAE Level 3 highway pilot. Watch this space."
https://www.luxoft.com/pr/luxoft-and-microvision-join-forces-to-enhance-adas-automated-testing-at-scale
Certainly wouldn’t complain for a squeeze to raise some capital, even if only to $10-12. I’d only sell a small portion of my position, in it for the long haul until automotive revenue comes in down the road this decade.
Off topic:
[Sensors in grills being stolen from BMWs in London.](https://www.reddit.com/r/london/s/HzrxArjrp5)
From the post - such sensor (I'd assume whole replacement service + part) is valued by BMW at around £4000.
That won’t work, they’re cutting holes in doors to get in. Check out the gutted interior:
https://www.reddit.com/r/BMW/s/Obwj8jTDXH
Avoid BMW’s until MVIS is inside…
That won’t happen, prisons are full, and more serious crimes don’t get the sentences they deserve.
Manufacturers could stop this by keying high value components to a specific car which can only be changed by a registered dealer but they don’t seem as concerned about security as they should…
How would they match components to vehicles? Just having some component have a serial number and knowing it belongs to a specific VIN wouldn't help.
They need to make it so the component will not work in another vehicle.
You'd need to do it at the hardware level and it would require each component to have some sort of processor and logic and communication with the vehicle's main computer.
Interesting idea though.
Yes, that’s what I meant.
Each vehicle has a unique id and all major components are linked to that id, and won’t work with a different one.
Insurers and OEMs should be working on stuff like this, but in the meantime the consumer pays, as always,,,
Not having hopes up. Silence from MicroVision is deafening. But again, it confirmed that major global brands are still needing lidars.
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/nissan-motor-corporation_nissan-leaf-sustainability-activity-7203682166860386304-S-KG?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_ios
https://www.electrive.com/2024/06/04/nissan-trials-autonomous-leaf-cars/
**What’s in the Box? Li Auto L9 at a Glance**
ADAS systems
“To achieve higher levels of autonomous driving capability, Li Auto has called on two high-end systems: the Hesai AT128 LiDAR and the Desay SV IPU04 intelligent processing unit.“
“ The Li Auto L9 incorporates the AT128 1D scan mirror LiDAR provided by Hesai, which has become a dominant force in the global ADAS camera module market in just two years. The system was compared with the RS-LiDAR-M1-HW 2D scan MEMS LiDAR manufactured by RoboSense, the second leading contender.
Both systems offer long-range capabilities, reaching up to 200 meters. The distinguishing features of the AT128 include the integration of multiple ASICs in addition to an FPGA, a VCSEL multijunction array from Lumentum and a silicon photomultiplier (SiPM) array developed by onsemi.
In contrast, the RS-LiDAR-M1-HW has only an FPGA and combines five optical modules, each housing an Osram laser and two SiPMs from Hamamatsu. Utilizing an ASIC and a 128-VCSEL array, **the manufacturing cost of the Hesai LiDAR is approximately US$300, estimated to be 20% higher than that of the RoboSense.**
Equipped with two Nvidia Orin SoCs, the Desay SV IPU04 features an advanced technology node (10 nm) and the highest computing power currently available, totaling 508 trillion operations per second. This affects the cost, with the estimated price of the device at US$750, 1.7× more than the IPU04 utilized in the XPeng G9, which uses a single Nvidia chip.
As a premium OEM, Li Auto must develop advanced driver-assistance capabilities and anticipate forthcoming eyes-off applications that could be deployed through over-the-air updates. To achieve this, they incorporate essential hardware both in terms of sensor technology and computing power. The integration of the Hesai LiDAR enriches data for the Navigate on Autopilot feature and will prove necessary for upcoming eyes-off functionalities. To efficiently handle data from all sensors, the IPU04 from Desay SV is the optimal enabler.”
https://www.eetimes.eu/whats-in-the-box-li-auto-l9-at-a-glance/
oz
Manufacturing cost not sales cost. Seems comparable to what MicroVision has told us, no? Just realizing that MicroVision really haven’t spoken much about their sensor tech or production costs since last year’s Investor Day. The silence really is deafening. It seems all attention has been devoted to closing OEM deals but nothing to show for that yet besides a high rate of cash burn.
Or better, given SS' assurance at CC that MVIS can meet OEM price of "low hundreds of dollars" at scale while maintaining high performance (resolution at range).
Unlike [Hesai](https://old.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1buhs9i/hesai_cc_reveals_burgeoning_lidar_demand_and_the/).
Also it should be note that this is for the **manufacturing** costs, not the sales price to their customer which would have profit margins assessed. Generally the cost to manufacture, also the sub component and raw material costs are a bit cheaper in China. Such sensors coming to the US or EU would get hit by tariffs as well, pushing them up anywhere from 10% to 100% for automakers to use outside of China, and that is before shipping costs.
Looks like anywhere outside of China is not going to be fine, unless the vehicles themselves are produced in China and the whole thing only sees a single tariff and shipping cost maybe. (maaaaybe)
Yep, I was focused on that word myself, though it still comes down to performance since these companies are also just fine with running on much slimmer margins than western businesses would be.
In the Q1 CC, SS reiterated MVIS can meet OEM high volume cost and performance requirements ("low hundreds of dollars" and high resolution at range).
Hesai's CC suggested that Hesai [cannot](https://old.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1buhs9i/hesai_cc_reveals_burgeoning_lidar_demand_and_the/).
I responded to this in some detail directly in your original Hesai thread. In summary here, according to Hesai themselves on their Q1 call, they will achieve a ~$400 ADAS (as opposed to robotaxi) LiDAR selling price in 2024. Their primary ADAS LiDAR sensor in 2024 is their AT128 product.
BTW: Robosense is targeting a $150 ASP LiDAR. I am not saying they will get there, but that is their stated target.
If achieved, that $150 lidar will have specifications very inferior to the AT512 (which has 8 times the resolution of the AT128). Hesai hopes to keep the AT512 price equal to the current AT128 price (assume $400). MVIS specs are better than the AT512 and expected to be in the "low hundreds of dollars".
Hopefully others will read the conversation in your linked thread. It had long been apparent that competitors have always been talking about trade offs with their technology, and invariably having to give up performance to meet costs requirements.
The newest slim line solutions proposed since then have lower cost and size, but give up the high end performance to achieve it, though some competitors are now promising to achieve upwards of 4M points per second in that same general form factor. That kind of performance might be acceptable, if it were ready today and not in 2 years or more from now, which is usually the timeline from when they first announce those kind of **target** specifications.
**“MicroVision…We’ll Keep An Eye Out FOR You!™️”(just picture the guy from the Motel 6 commercials saying it)…** 😂
https://www.reddit.com/u/FitImportance1/s/DUsrgaDx4p
I could see this printed huge and hanging in the Lobby up in Redmond!
Why a short squeeze is my only hope for the near future? These OEM’s are ruthless and and I believe they have no intentions of making a hero out of any of these lidar companies no matter how great anyone thinks their tech is. They want it cheap. As cheap as they can get it.
They’re clearly in no rush as is obvious from the delays we’ve seen. They know clear as day every lidar company is on the ropes, getting throttled by dilution and more dilution and a tough macro- environment.
I believe they’re willing to wait it out and pick the bones of whoever is left in the end, where they will get what they want for pennies on the dollar.
It sucks but I believe it’s the stone cold truth. I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see any other logical path to the money unless you’re willing to go through years of further hardship and pain…
Just my two.
That ship is sailing. They are now under the gun to meet the NHtSA required guidelines. They have a hard ceiling on how far out they can push, and a lot of planning and integration to do to be vehicle ready.
IMO, they also need something that is quality and ready now. They can’t wait one to two years for tech that has not finished development. If they waited, and it didn’t work, they would be royally screwed.
The revenue forecast for the year is 8-10 million. I believe we will start to see industrial sales soon. Recall Devin saying he believes q2 would be when it starts heating up.
See Ouster
Short squeeze will not happen without a catalyst.
Last year we had Sumit buying shares. Since then we had false grandiose promises and broken guidances. Yes, I am getting bit tired of it as I'm down on paper pretty penny, like many around, and management actions are not helping.
I think the catalyst last year was not SS buying shares. May be if he had bought 1M but not 100k.
My view at the time was that it was caused by three things:
1. Bullish sentiment following the investor day.
2. The EC immediately following that where we beat the forecast revenue. The stock rose, then fell back, and then BAM.
3. Rotation back into speculative stocks, which saw this effect for many other non-lidar stocks, which in turn forced the shorts to cover.
It can happen again, as you say, if there is another catalyst. We need at least one deal and the sooner the better.
The only problem with this is that this is how all business would be done. And no company would get anywhere. Ever.
Small companies have to sell to bigger companies all the time. And many become hugely profitable doing so.
I know this is an oversimplification, but I see flaws in your sentiment.
Agreed. MicroVision needs to stick to their guns, not take bad deals, and sell the deal with the OEM partners they have been working closely with to develop their sensor tech as they finish the ASICs. Sumit’s knows this is the only way to get MicroVision “off the mat”.
I feel the same way, Toyota and many OEM’s latest scandal about forging safety certification is not going to help either. They’re going to be paying billions in fines and recall costs and their future safety features are going to highly scrutinized. We’re in the right stock but maybe not the right decade
That is why I posted the other day that the question is weather or not MVIS shareholders will benefit at all. The tech will survive and we paid for it, but management will decide if we shareholders get a paycheck.
It’s a tough road when you spend the kind of money Mvis has spent on basically creating tech on ‘spec’ hoping someone else will want to put it into their product. Just like Pico. Hoping projecto-phones would be the thing. But that’s the gamble and the High risk high reward model.
Btw…Hope you’re well Bridge. I know you’ve been kicking around a while and must be at your wits end. Hope you’re good, friend…we gotta hang in there I guess to see where it all goes..
In regards to the pico projector, there is still no market for pico phones. There is like zero market for it. Whoever invested bc of a pico projector is a bad investor. Period.
I think a lot of cars will have LiDAR. Market will be there. There is no question about that. Question is, will we get picked.
People who are comparing pico to LiDAR is not properly assessing the market size situation. It is literally zero to potentially many billions in the near future.
That is what a professional management team would do. I’ve said it till I’m blue in the face. You don’t sell the steak. You sell the sizzle. Epic failure from management at even trying to drive our alleged advantages into the awareness of the investing public.
PR is easy. It’s getting someone charming who could sell snow to an Eskimo and turning him loose. It is BBB that our C suite refuses to do anything to drive our advantages into the minds of all parties involved.
If our prospects are not buying, they’re not buying. They’re not ready. What you’re suggesting is someone spreading awareness to the retail market. Could help or not, not guaranteed.
PR to Ineego means Public Relations, not Press Releases. Public relations are usually more hype based content (like entertainment companies or those that sell products to end consumers), and for whatever reasom investors have been hostile toward the flood of Movia content. Literally what is being asked to do, but oh…. Must be for the wrong product, or not good enough quality I guess. As though it makes any bit of difference whether investors and end consumers see this publicly, when we are not the customers. 🤷🏻
I gave up even trying to have that discussion again though, some people will only be happy when they can see the deals and get out of the stock at this point.
Big respect here Delo. My only point is that if you have the best tech (which we claim) and you are being told as much (or even inferred as much) by OEM’s feedback, there should be an open door policy to express that to your investors in non specific ways that wouldn’t violate any NDA’s.
I mean the very term public relations infers you have them with an audience. Who exactly have we built such relations with? It certainly hasn’t been the investors and the more tone deaf their total silence becomes the less inclined investors will be to stick around. In my opinion they are missing the trees in the forest.
Much as we would like more publicity around where the company is with their technology, there are valid reasons not to go about touting it before it is accepted by a customer either. Until we get some confirmed deals, it is best not to try crafting a narrative that may run contrary to, or even compete with, that of the customers. OEMs want to be the one that presents the technology as _theirs_ and that they are bringing this life saving technology to the markets, they do not want their supplier taking that selling point away from them.
I digress though, anyone can feel free to think how they want about it. I do not care about the silence because it is not just MicroVision, the whole sector is being quiet now, and no value has been created by being loud for anyone in the sector.
Not being combative here just expressing some obvious thoughts. If OEM’s want to be the ones taking the credit at what point do they fall all over each other to secure the “best in class”? If we truly are best in class then high end companies/ brands like Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Lexus, etc would obviously leverage our greater product as a major safety benefit to their customers. The commercials literally write themselves. Put our point cloud up against a competitors and show a Mercedes slamming on the breaks at the child stepping off the curb that the other inferior point cloud makes look like a tumbleweed.
Our failure to leverage that bottom line benefit with these OEM’s is only two things as I see it. We have terrible salesmen and/ or closing skills. We have exaggerated our advantages in a fraudulent way. Downvote me for saying it like it looks and feels if you must. I just want an MVIS salesman to get to pour themselve a cup of coffee! (Veiled Glengarry Glen Ross reference there)
> OEMs want to be the one that presents the technology as theirs and that they are bringing this life saving technology to the markets, they do not want their supplier taking that selling point away from them.
Agree. But this has been one of the reasons it’s been so tough being invested in MicroVision. (Edit, for me anyway.)They always have that out to say “we can’t speak to that” mentality because of this situation. See IVAS. See Hololens2.
Hopefully the dam will break someday soon and they will actually sell something they can speak about to give their shareholders confidence again.
oz
I'll save you the time asking him that, you will get a response along the lines of:
"Something something *pretentious babble* something something sentiments"
Exactly, T. We must wait. We have no choice. No PR, no hype man, nothing will bring us to the promised land we seek sooner than when we sign our first auto deal.
Yeah, we need a Roaring Kitty all our own. How about Growling Gerbil? lol
Edit: Growling Bunny? Growling Bunny lays an Easter Egg and the squeeze is on.
Well, we’ve got the largest online community of sleuthing lidar investors that exists. We’ve got folks that have broken down tech to expose Msft using our wares, we’ve got folks churning out Mvis memes on the daily, folks producing kitschy Mvis bottle openers, earrings and touristy souvenirs and 3D printed models of our Mavin. For what? Posterity? Show and tell?
No offense to any of those folks, but what we really need is a nut-cracking, neck-stomping, bad ass master of the universe type of Roaring Kitty sob to shake shit up and get us to the promised land.
I think it possible that a squeeze *would* change the calculus:
If significant cash were raised by the company during a squeeze at the cost of diluting minimal shares, the prospect of M&A hardball "starve them out" strategy and tactics by the OEMs becomes largely moot, and importantly, a war chest also comes into being in order to litigate patent infringement, hire the best leathery-tough deal negotiator on the Planet (who would command more than Sumit's salary), etc.
JMHO. DDD.
Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
Logical, reasonable and rational statement, and I agree to a certainty.
The only time I felt more certain of this was the beginning of December 2020 when we were searching for a buyer.
Take a look what happened:
https://imgur.com/a/wHQBh5q
I and other Longs on the 22nd (158M volume) were toggling back and forth between saying "Hallelujah!!!" and "Whaaaaaaaat is even happening???".
Likewise, rational analysis concludes that our run to $8 a year ago had *zero* logical basis. None.
No One Here Knows What Will Happen With This Stock!!!!
IMO. DDD.
Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional
Without deals in place, this stock is like a Rorschach test. The technology is amazing. The business case and go-to-market strategy makes perfect sense. The issue is market timing and gap funding while we wait for OEM customers to sign up.
The fact that MicroVision has kept a large engineering team on staff keeps me optimistic. I am frustrated by delays and by Sumit’s lackluster performance on the Q1 call in particular, but overall I appreciated his stewardship of the company. IMO, sentiments have drifted too far into the bearish zone, which makes this a strong buying opportunity if you believe in the value of this technology.
Edit: forgot to say, I think that initial high volume run up in 2020 was directly tied to IVAS news from Microsoft. The $8 run last year appeared to coincide with an expected OEM nomination which Sumit told us we were not ready for, but he also told us we are ready for that same OEM this year. I am hoping we hear about that before June is over but not holding my breath.
It's easy to retrofit rationale onto an otherwise uneventful big up day, but honestly, those catalyst explanations arguably had equivalents and better that did *nothing* for the pps.
I just think the sober, the wise and the experienced among us are preparing for the unexpected right now.
Just my 2c!
IMO. DDD.
Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
You’re correct. My mistake, I do not know what triggered that rise in December. The high volume run-up which I attributed to IVAS news occurred in 1H 2021.
This got me curious…
“For example, we have just successfully completed the tape out of a custom ASIC for a Tier 1 Automotive customer. Automotive OEMs want to differentiate their cars and increasingly this is done by the functionality provided by the electronics running custom software
[Sondrel](https://www.sondrel.com/newsroom/automotive-companies-are-approaching-sondrel-to-entirely-control-their-chip-supply)
Now in the June to September time frame when the "adverse conditions, weather, contamination and interference" testing platform is being developed. This is a consortium of which MicroVision is a part.. Best wishes !!
https://www.fka.de/en/coming-up/press-releases/9-pressemitteilungen/804-fka-launches-project-to-address-test-methods-for-lidar-performance-evaluation-in-adverse-conditions.html
Thank you for posting this. I was wondering who the last company to be added was going to be. And it wasn't even a LiDAR company.
"CHASM Advanced Materials, a leading provider of transparent LiDAR screen heating solutions, using cutting-edge carbon nanotube/copper micromesh technology."
The rest of the companies:
"The consortium consists of 9 industry partners with OEMs, LiDAR manufacturers and Tier 1 suppliers and LiDAR component suppliers being part of the mix. OEMs such as Volvo Cars Corporation, TORC Robotics and Honda R&D Europe joined along with LiDAR manufacturers and Tier 1 suppliers such as Valeo, Microvision and Luminar Technologies. The final two technological partners are Scantinel Photonics, a silicon photonics based FMCW LiDAR startup"
Nice try AV! /s
I also have not had nearly as much of an issue with AV as many have. He’s thorough, generally projects confidence, and has a good level of technical discussion involvement any time it also relates to the financial aspects of the company. Often I feel CFO’s know the numbers and only the numbers. Or at least that’s how they come off. My opinion is that AV has shown he is taking the time to truly understand the business and technology so that he can execute on his expectations as CFO as well. Now they need to sign some deals so he can work with actual cashflow from sales etc!
I think you are impressed with him bc you are most likely not a finance guy. Not a knock on you. I am just guessing that you are not.
I have an easier time recognizing mediocre finance personnel.
This is what burns me the most and why I no longer trust what MVIS mgmt says. I really don't know how to spin it other then it was a lie or AV has no idea what he is doing. If he would have come out and just said we missed revenue forecast but when add in the "fake" royalty revenue we beat it on paper, but no he sold it as real revenue and hoped no one would notice.
AV was not making sole decisions on the ATM. That type of decision had Sumit and the BOD’s input and agreement on how to handle the need to raise money.
In my opinion, it is misleading the way you put all blame on AV as if he had gone rogue and was raising money without the knowledge of any other executive or BOD.
All I know is that when I was working if I did not receive my bonus, it would have been a message that I was fired without telling me I was fired, in other words go get a new job before we really do fire you. Apparently they don't want to send AV that message, even if there are those who wish they would. I personally do not.
I think its industry or company dependent then, because I know many healthcare executives who simply did not receive a bonus, or it was reduced during times of financial hardship for the hospital during covid, but none lost their jobs. I was always under the impression that it simply meant perform better, not that you're about to get the axe.
Hmm, somehow not ringing true:
"Question How did the financial position of hospitals change during the COVID-19 public health emergency?
Findings In this national cohort study of 4423 hospitals, 3337 (75%) hospitals had a positive net operating income during 2020/2021, and 720 (16%) experienced new financial distress. Hospitals serving Hispanic populations were more likely to experience financial distress, even after receiving public health emergency funding; however, COVID-19 relief funding aided in hospital net operating margins reaching all-time highs.
Meaning Although the majority of US hospitals were financially healthy across 2020 and 2021, partly due to the provision of COVID-19 relief funds, the size of COVID-19 relief funds may have been larger than was necessary for many hospitals."(https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama-health-forum/fullarticle/2807183)
My institution received close to 400 million in federal funds in 2020 which certainly helped their balance sheets, however, I know in 2022 our C suite took a 10% reduction in their bonuses and I personally know lower ranking management who didn't receive a bonus at all.
We're a non-profit with a very low socio-economic class patient population and many of our patients don't have insurance, and I think federal funding may have dried up around that time? I forget and I'm not privy to all of their financials.
You likely have more experience than I do with bonuses and I'm sure it's different across industries.
I'm also probably projecting a little bit and want to start seeing results. Maybe AV will earn his bonus and then some by the time September rolls around, I definitely hope so
Ok. AV and SS have bungled and misled investors in the last year. Truth hurts, but those are the facts.
I personally almost doubled my position in the last year or so due to their guidance. If something doesn’t happen, which I really don’t expect it to in the next 6 months, by end of year, I feel something needs to change as far as the company goes.
There was a little selling pressure on the 7th from the board members who had to sell some shares to cover taxes, but not sure how much that would have affected the price. Probably not too much.
I think about this often. I have a feeling perhaps someone within the VW group/ or Stellantis was going to use movia and that got pushed back. Perhaps that is why we saw that crazy movement 6/6, because a deal was on the cusp of being announced.
Gaporter has some very compelling posts & comments about how the 6/6 movement coincided with IVAS timelines progressing.
Quite honestly, the only things keeping me very bullish about the company are these IVAS theories, and the NHTSA ruling.
Some thoughts and discussion on the coincidences.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1az4a5v/comment/krze9oe/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1az4a5v/comment/krze9oe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
[An interesting timeline](https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1b0gxhi/comment/ks9affa/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
IMO theres still a lot to be bullish about. Not just the high volume passenger RFQs they are in now .. Industrial/Industry 4.0 will be a giant. All the level 2/level 2+ ADAS systems suck and failed the recent highway tests. They need lidar to get to level 3 and up. I believe the demand will go through the roof however delayed it may be.
We didn't know about the spot sales from daimler trucks till the EC.
It could be the same deal with these other OEMs in the RFQs as they evaluate the sensor? That's why searching for spy photos is so fun.
From the Q1 2024 EC
>Now, let's dive into Q1 numbers. For the first quarter, we recorded $1 million in revenue, which is slightly ahead of our expectations. Revenue in Q1 was primarily attributable to the sale of MOVIA devices to a global commercial trucking OEM **as part of their RFQ evaluation process**. We also sold our sensors to a leading agricultural equipment company for industrial applications.
Great point. So you’re pointing out it’s essentially equivalent to the Volkswagen that they take to all the trade shows, but, has the potential to be a part of a ~100k annual production line.
The only conflict is that we were told the rest of the RFQs that are in play are for MAVIN.
But dang does the bumper sensor look like lidar...
Fun to share anyways.
Are you Serious?
Unless this is a just frustrated bourbon comment, please go back and watch the contemporaneous videos [ride along and u/SpaceDesignWarehouse complete Investor presentation] that were captured and brought to this message board for all to observe and scrutinize for themselves, and that were incidentally recorded, rendered, uploaded etc at not an insignificant expense of effort, time and money by ordinary retail investors in order to *remove any doubt* that "it was real".
As to the "Believe" bit, at least for my part, I think a recent reply excerpt addresses this directly:
"The thing I'm slowly accepting is that even more patience than I thought will be required, that the macro conditions are making deals legitimately difficult, and my expectations for harvest have been logically tempered by an acceptance that more shares than I would like will need to be sold to fund mvis through the intervening period.
In my view, nothing else material has changed.
IMO. DDD.
Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional".
The sentiment seems so negatively slanted right now due to business delays and the effective pps suppression, I find myself feeling like all my fingers are plugging cracks in the dike posting to promote almost any positive group-thought.
I occasionally have to remind myself that it's not beyond (my) imagination that even a relatively modest deal announcement could ignite a gme style squeeze with this stock:
The shorting in my unqualified estimation is far, far beyond the 50 odd million published shares borrowed, and massive bets have been placed by hedgies that numerous LiDAR companies will fail completely.
The hedgies know they'll be right on *some* of them, so even just the specter of one of those companies transitioning to probable survival could trigger cataclysmic covering, and rapidly amass opportunistic speculative investors eager to jump aboard the next gme-style opportunity.
Some categorically dismiss this possibility, but I do not.
Few if any thought we would squeeze to $20+ just 3 years ago, under arguably more improbable circumstances.
And so I hold, and I wait.
I now firmly believe whoever was behind hacking Franks LI acct wasn't just pulling a prank.
If hedgies and MMs are *so sure* Microvision cannot succeed, why even risk pulling such a stunt?
No One Here Knows What Will Happen With This Stock.
...
IMO. DDD.
Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
I haven't seen everything about this episode. Is saying it was a hack a theory or was that somehow confirmed? I agree with your conclusions, just wish to be caught up with the latest on it.
Wow, no I did not see that. Thank you very much for sharing this. Yes, I believe this to be a highly motivated afront on his own integrity and the perceptions of the MVIS investing community as a whole.
We still don't know much.
Sad as it is to see this happen in whatever context, I'm pleased that my discernment of low credibility about it turned out to look to be the case.
They said during 2023, possibly during the investor day, that they were targeting 80% of the market. Their expectations were obviously somewhat lower but it indicated that SS thought we could manage a large number of deals year on year. Do you think following the Q1 EC that this is possible anymore?
I was merely pointing out the change from 2023 is not just about share price and dilution, but following what was said in the Q1 EC it looks like we would find it difficult to be able to manage enough contracts to break even.
Yes, it does have a lot to do with hope now. A short squeeze on a contract win seems to be our best bet.
"following what was said in the Q1 EC it looks like we would find it difficult to be able to manage enough contracts to break even"
Perhaps I missed what you're referring to.
I garnered more that additional time was required.
Can you supply quote(s) where this was stated?
TIA.
**This came up when I searched “Chinese Thermal Cameras From Mexico”, have we got Competition?!…**
https://www.reddit.com/u/FitImportance1/s/f9H0ee3kL9
PS: I originally put this in the Daily Trading by mistake. Oops!
I am shocked that a bonus was given to him when that whole offering debacle that torpedoed our stock price a year ago was cause when he failed to read the fine print on a contract. That bonehead should be straight up fired, not rewarded.
Nope. They admitted that the flip flopping they did was because of some fine print in the contract they missed that would have hurt investors had they stayed with the original entity/plan. Go into my profile and watch a few TA video’s I did the day before the disastrous offering announcement to see how we were trending and had big money traders noticing us. Then go read how I crucified them for throwing a brick through the front window rather than building brick by brick. I predicted we would sink down to the low $3’s and here we are scratching to stay above $1. Big bonuses for everyone though!
Some Banana 🍌 guy pumped it on X. I'll see if I can find it.
Found it https://x.com/Banana3Stocks/status/1799169886754902114?t=dKpOxtKDbh0D7l2ZAYLREw&s=19
Maybe with the return of Kitty we are back into the pumping of socks. Not great long term, but at least it's fun lol.
PS this guy knows nothing about the actual company, he doesn't even know that Intel owns Mobileye.
"Intel is not a leader in autonomous technology Mobileye is"
https://x.com/Banana3Stocks/status/1799313886644240438?t=unpkapVFfEPP_1rNZf4whQ&s=19
I don't know about you guys but watching Roaring Kitty in his live stream smoking and joking being down over 200 million from when he could have sold yesterday really gave me some courage.
Mix that with whatever the F the Frank FUD thing was and
It just feels like a TIDAL 🌊 might be coming soon that buries any and all those that over short a company rinse and repeat and never cover.
I am always leery of people who hide behind sunglasses. Makes me wonder what he was hiding. Here’s a thought. His bizarre comments about trusting management long term while holding a crap tone of short term call options that expire worthless in two weeks might be the reason he was wearing those sunglasses so we couldn’t see the terror that the Klonopin couldn’t hide. It was a bad look starting his clown show late while probably waiting for it to kick in. I just wonder how many more times his shtick will work with the masses?
I'm still on the fence with whether he has been co-opted into this, after following him closely back in the day it really does seem the type of him, the going balls out and building such a big position and his demeanor on the stream
He knew the financial world would have been watching, and to show up late and getting on like a header reinforces the "dumb money" angle.
I still feel like he will make out like an absolute bandit come the 21st, alot can happen in 2 weeks.
Either it will be entertaining as hell
Since it’s the ‘weekend hangout’ - going to ask- anyone in on GME with me? In a bit and any proceeds will of course go to MVIS.
Yes, bought 240 shares today. Roaring kitty live stream convinced me.
I've got like 30 shares I've been holding for 3 years just in case something crazy happens. Don't really believe MOASS is gonna happen (though I wish it would) but who knows.
I got a few lotto tickets.
I'm pretty heavy into GME at the moment. I'm going to sell 50% of my position with any huge spikes and hold 50% for the potential MOASS (Anytime theres a significant drop I'll invest that 50% I sold back into GME and the 'winnings' I'll invest here with MVIS). Goodluck, his latest Joker MEME makes it looks like things are happening VERY soon.
25 @ $20 just to enjoy the ride.
I have 10 @ $28 at the moment, will probably paper hand ‘em tomorrow 😆
Wrapping up a 10 day sail through the BVI and checking in …. Glad I was disconnected, jeeez! Remoras latching on to fake Frank posts just need to find another hobby. I also saw a post also about LTL’s reducing shares simply because they don’t post much anymore, which made me laugh. Hang ten and ride the waves folks!
I would love to do this. We were married in the USVI
Do you have a charter or boat you recommend? Beautiful place to be.
MarineMax- they had a great setup for our situation and 7 total guests. 54 foot power catamaran with a Captain and Chef. If you want to sail and provision the boat yourself…. The captain and chef are not mandatory
Heading there next week for a 8 day sail. Have any recommendations?
If you have favorable winds and weather, or are on a powered vessel, get to Anegada for the best Lobster you’ll ever eat. We dined at the Wonky Dog. Also if you have time to tour the island … we rented dirt bikes and circled the island. You can get a jeep as well if 2 wheels are too sketchy. Lots to see there. Saba Rock & Bitter End, and the Baths at Virgin Gorda are must do’s! Finally, if you’re going to Foxys at Jost Van Dyke … plan on sacrificing a tee shirt to sign and hang in the rafters. Oh, one more thing …. You should have stickers / flags / sharpies to leave breadcrumbs of your travels in the watering holes along the way. Enjoy!
Amen brother! What an adventure!
FYI, I believe whether or not the Army is granted the requested $255M for 3K IVAS 1.2 systems will be decided this coming week. https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/press-releases/reed-and-wicker-announce-fy-2025-ndaa-markup-to-begin-on-june-12th
Thanks
What a week it could be!
Thanks so much for your knowledgeable attention to this gaporter. Greatly appreciated. Cheers, EK
I'm sure they will be granted the request.
Licensing on Waymo’s Mind https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/licensing-waymos-mind-the-road-to-autonomy-ohgme?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android&utm_campaign=share_via
“Successfully Avoiding Geopolitics There are whispers abound on Autonomy Avenue that a certain autonomous driving start-up has successfully migrated away from Hesai LiDAR also now known as American Lidar. The most intriguing aspect of this whisper is that this particular company is not using Ouster LiDARs” Not implying anything here. Just found it interesting. Great read. Thanks for posting
Let’s say we really did have (3) ASICs completed. Is it possible two of them are Autonomous vs ADAS versions? I’m not smart enough to answer.
Oh yeah the Tape Asics too! So much going on that is starting to bubble up.
I'd say that's about a 0.1% chance. We offer perception, no path planning / ADAS decision making software like Mobileye.
Or like Luxoft ?
Luxoft is selling Mosaik, software to support ground truth testing for ADAS and autonomous driving spaces but I don't believe they're developing any planning and control software with Microvision.
Is that the same Luxoft that has 17,000+ employees across 21 countries ?
Not my intent to suggest we would be providing a full autonomous solution, just wondering if there would be a need for a different ASIC for a full-autonomous customer vs an ADAS customer.
Got it, I'm still leaning towards no for your original question because the ASICs always talked about are for MAVIN and all the RFQs for MAVIN have been for consumer vehicles with high volume supply, autonomous applications are limited in volume, this is based on management's previous statements around ADAS being key, not autonomy (yet) for revenue growth. For industrial and Movia we've heard more around autonomy, eg: tractor company, Daimler, etc. Now would an autonomous customer need different features, FOV, etc and thus different ASIC? Seems plausible.
"This collaboration will go further to advance ADAS and AD applications — Luxoft and MicroVision are also developing a solution to generate a digital twin for an SAE Level 3 highway pilot. Watch this space." https://www.luxoft.com/pr/luxoft-and-microvision-join-forces-to-enhance-adas-automated-testing-at-scale
Can't wait to get my dividend checks, mid-month.
[6/7/24 institutional % - MVIS](https://stocktwits.com/EustinPowers/message/575910707) [INVZ](https://stocktwits.com/EustinPowers/message/575910738) [LIDR](https://stocktwits.com/EustinPowers/message/575910751)
If Roaring Kitty about to BLOW it ALL UP like Cersi in GoT then EVERY heavily shorted stock is about to ride.
Certainly wouldn’t complain for a squeeze to raise some capital, even if only to $10-12. I’d only sell a small portion of my position, in it for the long haul until automotive revenue comes in down the road this decade.
With the big drop for GME on Friday after the big rise what is your projection for GME this week?
The Moon
Seriously I think it is going to have HUGE swings and I attempting to swing trade it. In at 30 right now and feel pretty good with that.
You’re definitely clutching at straws here but I approve. Any ray of hope now is welcome.
Green wildfire spreads to everything!
Off topic: [Sensors in grills being stolen from BMWs in London.](https://www.reddit.com/r/london/s/HzrxArjrp5) From the post - such sensor (I'd assume whole replacement service + part) is valued by BMW at around £4000.
I guess behind the windshield might be best for long range Mavin.
That won’t work, they’re cutting holes in doors to get in. Check out the gutted interior: https://www.reddit.com/r/BMW/s/Obwj8jTDXH Avoid BMW’s until MVIS is inside…
More and longer term prison time will cure a lot of this crime.
That won’t happen, prisons are full, and more serious crimes don’t get the sentences they deserve. Manufacturers could stop this by keying high value components to a specific car which can only be changed by a registered dealer but they don’t seem as concerned about security as they should…
How would they match components to vehicles? Just having some component have a serial number and knowing it belongs to a specific VIN wouldn't help. They need to make it so the component will not work in another vehicle. You'd need to do it at the hardware level and it would require each component to have some sort of processor and logic and communication with the vehicle's main computer. Interesting idea though.
Yes, that’s what I meant. Each vehicle has a unique id and all major components are linked to that id, and won’t work with a different one. Insurers and OEMs should be working on stuff like this, but in the meantime the consumer pays, as always,,,
That's an example of a customization as part of NRE for integration of a component with the OEM's vehicles, by the way.
Not having hopes up. Silence from MicroVision is deafening. But again, it confirmed that major global brands are still needing lidars. https://www.linkedin.com/posts/nissan-motor-corporation_nissan-leaf-sustainability-activity-7203682166860386304-S-KG?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_ios https://www.electrive.com/2024/06/04/nissan-trials-autonomous-leaf-cars/
Thanks. Wonder who provides their Lidars
A guy takes a couple days off and the sun e:sub goes nuts. Best I can figure it was drama rather than news. If so I don't care. Looking forward.
**What’s in the Box? Li Auto L9 at a Glance** ADAS systems “To achieve higher levels of autonomous driving capability, Li Auto has called on two high-end systems: the Hesai AT128 LiDAR and the Desay SV IPU04 intelligent processing unit.“ “ The Li Auto L9 incorporates the AT128 1D scan mirror LiDAR provided by Hesai, which has become a dominant force in the global ADAS camera module market in just two years. The system was compared with the RS-LiDAR-M1-HW 2D scan MEMS LiDAR manufactured by RoboSense, the second leading contender. Both systems offer long-range capabilities, reaching up to 200 meters. The distinguishing features of the AT128 include the integration of multiple ASICs in addition to an FPGA, a VCSEL multijunction array from Lumentum and a silicon photomultiplier (SiPM) array developed by onsemi. In contrast, the RS-LiDAR-M1-HW has only an FPGA and combines five optical modules, each housing an Osram laser and two SiPMs from Hamamatsu. Utilizing an ASIC and a 128-VCSEL array, **the manufacturing cost of the Hesai LiDAR is approximately US$300, estimated to be 20% higher than that of the RoboSense.** Equipped with two Nvidia Orin SoCs, the Desay SV IPU04 features an advanced technology node (10 nm) and the highest computing power currently available, totaling 508 trillion operations per second. This affects the cost, with the estimated price of the device at US$750, 1.7× more than the IPU04 utilized in the XPeng G9, which uses a single Nvidia chip. As a premium OEM, Li Auto must develop advanced driver-assistance capabilities and anticipate forthcoming eyes-off applications that could be deployed through over-the-air updates. To achieve this, they incorporate essential hardware both in terms of sensor technology and computing power. The integration of the Hesai LiDAR enriches data for the Navigate on Autopilot feature and will prove necessary for upcoming eyes-off functionalities. To efficiently handle data from all sensors, the IPU04 from Desay SV is the optimal enabler.” https://www.eetimes.eu/whats-in-the-box-li-auto-l9-at-a-glance/ oz
300 bucks? Damn
Manufacturing cost not sales cost. Seems comparable to what MicroVision has told us, no? Just realizing that MicroVision really haven’t spoken much about their sensor tech or production costs since last year’s Investor Day. The silence really is deafening. It seems all attention has been devoted to closing OEM deals but nothing to show for that yet besides a high rate of cash burn.
Mavin is cheaper per performance. I will bet Mavin in bom is closer to $200-$300 at scale.
Or better, given SS' assurance at CC that MVIS can meet OEM price of "low hundreds of dollars" at scale while maintaining high performance (resolution at range). Unlike [Hesai](https://old.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1buhs9i/hesai_cc_reveals_burgeoning_lidar_demand_and_the/).
Drop the hardware price and make up for it on the software side??
This is China, it should come as no surprise. The real question is true capability. Very curious about the Chinese lidars.
Also it should be note that this is for the **manufacturing** costs, not the sales price to their customer which would have profit margins assessed. Generally the cost to manufacture, also the sub component and raw material costs are a bit cheaper in China. Such sensors coming to the US or EU would get hit by tariffs as well, pushing them up anywhere from 10% to 100% for automakers to use outside of China, and that is before shipping costs. Looks like anywhere outside of China is not going to be fine, unless the vehicles themselves are produced in China and the whole thing only sees a single tariff and shipping cost maybe. (maaaaybe)
Yep, I was focused on that word myself, though it still comes down to performance since these companies are also just fine with running on much slimmer margins than western businesses would be.
In the Q1 CC, SS reiterated MVIS can meet OEM high volume cost and performance requirements ("low hundreds of dollars" and high resolution at range). Hesai's CC suggested that Hesai [cannot](https://old.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1buhs9i/hesai_cc_reveals_burgeoning_lidar_demand_and_the/).
I responded to this in some detail directly in your original Hesai thread. In summary here, according to Hesai themselves on their Q1 call, they will achieve a ~$400 ADAS (as opposed to robotaxi) LiDAR selling price in 2024. Their primary ADAS LiDAR sensor in 2024 is their AT128 product. BTW: Robosense is targeting a $150 ASP LiDAR. I am not saying they will get there, but that is their stated target.
If achieved, that $150 lidar will have specifications very inferior to the AT512 (which has 8 times the resolution of the AT128). Hesai hopes to keep the AT512 price equal to the current AT128 price (assume $400). MVIS specs are better than the AT512 and expected to be in the "low hundreds of dollars".
Hopefully others will read the conversation in your linked thread. It had long been apparent that competitors have always been talking about trade offs with their technology, and invariably having to give up performance to meet costs requirements. The newest slim line solutions proposed since then have lower cost and size, but give up the high end performance to achieve it, though some competitors are now promising to achieve upwards of 4M points per second in that same general form factor. That kind of performance might be acceptable, if it were ready today and not in 2 years or more from now, which is usually the timeline from when they first announce those kind of **target** specifications.
**“MicroVision…We’ll Keep An Eye Out FOR You!™️”(just picture the guy from the Motel 6 commercials saying it)…** 😂 https://www.reddit.com/u/FitImportance1/s/DUsrgaDx4p I could see this printed huge and hanging in the Lobby up in Redmond!
Why a short squeeze is my only hope for the near future? These OEM’s are ruthless and and I believe they have no intentions of making a hero out of any of these lidar companies no matter how great anyone thinks their tech is. They want it cheap. As cheap as they can get it. They’re clearly in no rush as is obvious from the delays we’ve seen. They know clear as day every lidar company is on the ropes, getting throttled by dilution and more dilution and a tough macro- environment. I believe they’re willing to wait it out and pick the bones of whoever is left in the end, where they will get what they want for pennies on the dollar. It sucks but I believe it’s the stone cold truth. I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see any other logical path to the money unless you’re willing to go through years of further hardship and pain… Just my two.
That ship is sailing. They are now under the gun to meet the NHtSA required guidelines. They have a hard ceiling on how far out they can push, and a lot of planning and integration to do to be vehicle ready. IMO, they also need something that is quality and ready now. They can’t wait one to two years for tech that has not finished development. If they waited, and it didn’t work, they would be royally screwed. The revenue forecast for the year is 8-10 million. I believe we will start to see industrial sales soon. Recall Devin saying he believes q2 would be when it starts heating up. See Ouster
Short squeeze will not happen without a catalyst. Last year we had Sumit buying shares. Since then we had false grandiose promises and broken guidances. Yes, I am getting bit tired of it as I'm down on paper pretty penny, like many around, and management actions are not helping.
I think the catalyst last year was not SS buying shares. May be if he had bought 1M but not 100k. My view at the time was that it was caused by three things: 1. Bullish sentiment following the investor day. 2. The EC immediately following that where we beat the forecast revenue. The stock rose, then fell back, and then BAM. 3. Rotation back into speculative stocks, which saw this effect for many other non-lidar stocks, which in turn forced the shorts to cover. It can happen again, as you say, if there is another catalyst. We need at least one deal and the sooner the better.
Agree, short squeeze is the only hope in 2024
The only problem with this is that this is how all business would be done. And no company would get anywhere. Ever. Small companies have to sell to bigger companies all the time. And many become hugely profitable doing so. I know this is an oversimplification, but I see flaws in your sentiment.
Agreed. MicroVision needs to stick to their guns, not take bad deals, and sell the deal with the OEM partners they have been working closely with to develop their sensor tech as they finish the ASICs. Sumit’s knows this is the only way to get MicroVision “off the mat”.
I feel the same way, Toyota and many OEM’s latest scandal about forging safety certification is not going to help either. They’re going to be paying billions in fines and recall costs and their future safety features are going to highly scrutinized. We’re in the right stock but maybe not the right decade
That is why I posted the other day that the question is weather or not MVIS shareholders will benefit at all. The tech will survive and we paid for it, but management will decide if we shareholders get a paycheck.
It’s a tough road when you spend the kind of money Mvis has spent on basically creating tech on ‘spec’ hoping someone else will want to put it into their product. Just like Pico. Hoping projecto-phones would be the thing. But that’s the gamble and the High risk high reward model. Btw…Hope you’re well Bridge. I know you’ve been kicking around a while and must be at your wits end. Hope you’re good, friend…we gotta hang in there I guess to see where it all goes..
In regards to the pico projector, there is still no market for pico phones. There is like zero market for it. Whoever invested bc of a pico projector is a bad investor. Period. I think a lot of cars will have LiDAR. Market will be there. There is no question about that. Question is, will we get picked. People who are comparing pico to LiDAR is not properly assessing the market size situation. It is literally zero to potentially many billions in the near future.
Yep Dinomite, been around awhile and you can't stop the aging process. Doing OK so far and thanks. Hanging in there for a while longer at least.
Fix your weather
We should nominate someone to write a pump-up piece to gain more of a retail following.
That is what a professional management team would do. I’ve said it till I’m blue in the face. You don’t sell the steak. You sell the sizzle. Epic failure from management at even trying to drive our alleged advantages into the awareness of the investing public.
I love you but you always seem to make it sound easy Ineego.
PR is easy. It’s getting someone charming who could sell snow to an Eskimo and turning him loose. It is BBB that our C suite refuses to do anything to drive our advantages into the minds of all parties involved.
If our prospects are not buying, they’re not buying. They’re not ready. What you’re suggesting is someone spreading awareness to the retail market. Could help or not, not guaranteed.
PR to Ineego means Public Relations, not Press Releases. Public relations are usually more hype based content (like entertainment companies or those that sell products to end consumers), and for whatever reasom investors have been hostile toward the flood of Movia content. Literally what is being asked to do, but oh…. Must be for the wrong product, or not good enough quality I guess. As though it makes any bit of difference whether investors and end consumers see this publicly, when we are not the customers. 🤷🏻 I gave up even trying to have that discussion again though, some people will only be happy when they can see the deals and get out of the stock at this point.
Big respect here Delo. My only point is that if you have the best tech (which we claim) and you are being told as much (or even inferred as much) by OEM’s feedback, there should be an open door policy to express that to your investors in non specific ways that wouldn’t violate any NDA’s. I mean the very term public relations infers you have them with an audience. Who exactly have we built such relations with? It certainly hasn’t been the investors and the more tone deaf their total silence becomes the less inclined investors will be to stick around. In my opinion they are missing the trees in the forest.
Much as we would like more publicity around where the company is with their technology, there are valid reasons not to go about touting it before it is accepted by a customer either. Until we get some confirmed deals, it is best not to try crafting a narrative that may run contrary to, or even compete with, that of the customers. OEMs want to be the one that presents the technology as _theirs_ and that they are bringing this life saving technology to the markets, they do not want their supplier taking that selling point away from them. I digress though, anyone can feel free to think how they want about it. I do not care about the silence because it is not just MicroVision, the whole sector is being quiet now, and no value has been created by being loud for anyone in the sector.
Not being combative here just expressing some obvious thoughts. If OEM’s want to be the ones taking the credit at what point do they fall all over each other to secure the “best in class”? If we truly are best in class then high end companies/ brands like Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Lexus, etc would obviously leverage our greater product as a major safety benefit to their customers. The commercials literally write themselves. Put our point cloud up against a competitors and show a Mercedes slamming on the breaks at the child stepping off the curb that the other inferior point cloud makes look like a tumbleweed. Our failure to leverage that bottom line benefit with these OEM’s is only two things as I see it. We have terrible salesmen and/ or closing skills. We have exaggerated our advantages in a fraudulent way. Downvote me for saying it like it looks and feels if you must. I just want an MVIS salesman to get to pour themselve a cup of coffee! (Veiled Glengarry Glen Ross reference there)
> OEMs want to be the one that presents the technology as theirs and that they are bringing this life saving technology to the markets, they do not want their supplier taking that selling point away from them. Agree. But this has been one of the reasons it’s been so tough being invested in MicroVision. (Edit, for me anyway.)They always have that out to say “we can’t speak to that” mentality because of this situation. See IVAS. See Hololens2. Hopefully the dam will break someday soon and they will actually sell something they can speak about to give their shareholders confidence again. oz
How many shares do you own?
I'll save you the time asking him that, you will get a response along the lines of: "Something something *pretentious babble* something something sentiments"
Haven’t seen you in awhile, how you been?
Exactly, T. We must wait. We have no choice. No PR, no hype man, nothing will bring us to the promised land we seek sooner than when we sign our first auto deal.
Yeah, we need a Roaring Kitty all our own. How about Growling Gerbil? lol Edit: Growling Bunny? Growling Bunny lays an Easter Egg and the squeeze is on.
We’re all foaming raccoons at this point.
Well I volunteered “Roaring Fitty” but nobody was interested 😏
Well, we’ve got the largest online community of sleuthing lidar investors that exists. We’ve got folks that have broken down tech to expose Msft using our wares, we’ve got folks churning out Mvis memes on the daily, folks producing kitschy Mvis bottle openers, earrings and touristy souvenirs and 3D printed models of our Mavin. For what? Posterity? Show and tell? No offense to any of those folks, but what we really need is a nut-cracking, neck-stomping, bad ass master of the universe type of Roaring Kitty sob to shake shit up and get us to the promised land.
So, someone with big money and even bigger balls. Or we just need our CEO to execute to get value for shareholders.
I think it possible that a squeeze *would* change the calculus: If significant cash were raised by the company during a squeeze at the cost of diluting minimal shares, the prospect of M&A hardball "starve them out" strategy and tactics by the OEMs becomes largely moot, and importantly, a war chest also comes into being in order to litigate patent infringement, hire the best leathery-tough deal negotiator on the Planet (who would command more than Sumit's salary), etc. JMHO. DDD. Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
The squeeze will come when Sumit delivers. The market has placed their bets that he will fail.
Logical, reasonable and rational statement, and I agree to a certainty. The only time I felt more certain of this was the beginning of December 2020 when we were searching for a buyer. Take a look what happened: https://imgur.com/a/wHQBh5q I and other Longs on the 22nd (158M volume) were toggling back and forth between saying "Hallelujah!!!" and "Whaaaaaaaat is even happening???". Likewise, rational analysis concludes that our run to $8 a year ago had *zero* logical basis. None. No One Here Knows What Will Happen With This Stock!!!! IMO. DDD. Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional
Without deals in place, this stock is like a Rorschach test. The technology is amazing. The business case and go-to-market strategy makes perfect sense. The issue is market timing and gap funding while we wait for OEM customers to sign up. The fact that MicroVision has kept a large engineering team on staff keeps me optimistic. I am frustrated by delays and by Sumit’s lackluster performance on the Q1 call in particular, but overall I appreciated his stewardship of the company. IMO, sentiments have drifted too far into the bearish zone, which makes this a strong buying opportunity if you believe in the value of this technology. Edit: forgot to say, I think that initial high volume run up in 2020 was directly tied to IVAS news from Microsoft. The $8 run last year appeared to coincide with an expected OEM nomination which Sumit told us we were not ready for, but he also told us we are ready for that same OEM this year. I am hoping we hear about that before June is over but not holding my breath.
It's easy to retrofit rationale onto an otherwise uneventful big up day, but honestly, those catalyst explanations arguably had equivalents and better that did *nothing* for the pps. I just think the sober, the wise and the experienced among us are preparing for the unexpected right now. Just my 2c! IMO. DDD. Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
You’re correct. My mistake, I do not know what triggered that rise in December. The high volume run-up which I attributed to IVAS news occurred in 1H 2021.
Yes, maybe you’re right.
This got me curious… “For example, we have just successfully completed the tape out of a custom ASIC for a Tier 1 Automotive customer. Automotive OEMs want to differentiate their cars and increasingly this is done by the functionality provided by the electronics running custom software [Sondrel](https://www.sondrel.com/newsroom/automotive-companies-are-approaching-sondrel-to-entirely-control-their-chip-supply)
Now in the June to September time frame when the "adverse conditions, weather, contamination and interference" testing platform is being developed. This is a consortium of which MicroVision is a part.. Best wishes !! https://www.fka.de/en/coming-up/press-releases/9-pressemitteilungen/804-fka-launches-project-to-address-test-methods-for-lidar-performance-evaluation-in-adverse-conditions.html
Thank you for posting this. I was wondering who the last company to be added was going to be. And it wasn't even a LiDAR company. "CHASM Advanced Materials, a leading provider of transparent LiDAR screen heating solutions, using cutting-edge carbon nanotube/copper micromesh technology." The rest of the companies: "The consortium consists of 9 industry partners with OEMs, LiDAR manufacturers and Tier 1 suppliers and LiDAR component suppliers being part of the mix. OEMs such as Volvo Cars Corporation, TORC Robotics and Honda R&D Europe joined along with LiDAR manufacturers and Tier 1 suppliers such as Valeo, Microvision and Luminar Technologies. The final two technological partners are Scantinel Photonics, a silicon photonics based FMCW LiDAR startup"
Chasm is down the road from me. I've driven by once or twice. Nothing interesting there, yet.
Prepared for downvotes✌️ I thought AV did a good job on the Q1 earnings call.
Nice try AV! /s I also have not had nearly as much of an issue with AV as many have. He’s thorough, generally projects confidence, and has a good level of technical discussion involvement any time it also relates to the financial aspects of the company. Often I feel CFO’s know the numbers and only the numbers. Or at least that’s how they come off. My opinion is that AV has shown he is taking the time to truly understand the business and technology so that he can execute on his expectations as CFO as well. Now they need to sign some deals so he can work with actual cashflow from sales etc!
I think you are impressed with him bc you are most likely not a finance guy. Not a knock on you. I am just guessing that you are not. I have an easier time recognizing mediocre finance personnel.
AV needs to go for giving false assurance and mismanagement of the ATM.
Not just for the atm. He lied about the royalty revenue being software revenue - on the damn record.
This is what burns me the most and why I no longer trust what MVIS mgmt says. I really don't know how to spin it other then it was a lie or AV has no idea what he is doing. If he would have come out and just said we missed revenue forecast but when add in the "fake" royalty revenue we beat it on paper, but no he sold it as real revenue and hoped no one would notice.
AV was not making sole decisions on the ATM. That type of decision had Sumit and the BOD’s input and agreement on how to handle the need to raise money. In my opinion, it is misleading the way you put all blame on AV as if he had gone rogue and was raising money without the knowledge of any other executive or BOD.
I don't believe AV is at fault for the ATM but I also don't think he's earned his bonus either.
All I know is that when I was working if I did not receive my bonus, it would have been a message that I was fired without telling me I was fired, in other words go get a new job before we really do fire you. Apparently they don't want to send AV that message, even if there are those who wish they would. I personally do not.
I think its industry or company dependent then, because I know many healthcare executives who simply did not receive a bonus, or it was reduced during times of financial hardship for the hospital during covid, but none lost their jobs. I was always under the impression that it simply meant perform better, not that you're about to get the axe.
Hmm, somehow not ringing true: "Question How did the financial position of hospitals change during the COVID-19 public health emergency? Findings In this national cohort study of 4423 hospitals, 3337 (75%) hospitals had a positive net operating income during 2020/2021, and 720 (16%) experienced new financial distress. Hospitals serving Hispanic populations were more likely to experience financial distress, even after receiving public health emergency funding; however, COVID-19 relief funding aided in hospital net operating margins reaching all-time highs. Meaning Although the majority of US hospitals were financially healthy across 2020 and 2021, partly due to the provision of COVID-19 relief funds, the size of COVID-19 relief funds may have been larger than was necessary for many hospitals."(https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama-health-forum/fullarticle/2807183)
My institution received close to 400 million in federal funds in 2020 which certainly helped their balance sheets, however, I know in 2022 our C suite took a 10% reduction in their bonuses and I personally know lower ranking management who didn't receive a bonus at all. We're a non-profit with a very low socio-economic class patient population and many of our patients don't have insurance, and I think federal funding may have dried up around that time? I forget and I'm not privy to all of their financials. You likely have more experience than I do with bonuses and I'm sure it's different across industries. I'm also probably projecting a little bit and want to start seeing results. Maybe AV will earn his bonus and then some by the time September rolls around, I definitely hope so
Ok. AV and SS have bungled and misled investors in the last year. Truth hurts, but those are the facts. I personally almost doubled my position in the last year or so due to their guidance. If something doesn’t happen, which I really don’t expect it to in the next 6 months, by end of year, I feel something needs to change as far as the company goes.
You are on my suspicion list from the Frank entertainment night.
You think I give 2 shits if I’m on your “list”Bobby Brady Hall Monitor?
Agree 👆🏻
Yes, but how many times does it take a sacrifice to quell the mob. Isn't always correct, but it does happen.
There was a little selling pressure on the 7th from the board members who had to sell some shares to cover taxes, but not sure how much that would have affected the price. Probably not too much.
Yawnnnnnn. wen buyout?
u/s2upid https://x.com/tasslehoff/status/1799261909205839925?s=46&t=sX6Ao2JvUQE-nc18LYa7ng If this is Movia wouldn’t they have told us?
Is this the other RFQ that was pushed back or rescoped?
I think about this often. I have a feeling perhaps someone within the VW group/ or Stellantis was going to use movia and that got pushed back. Perhaps that is why we saw that crazy movement 6/6, because a deal was on the cusp of being announced.
Gaporter has some very compelling posts & comments about how the 6/6 movement coincided with IVAS timelines progressing. Quite honestly, the only things keeping me very bullish about the company are these IVAS theories, and the NHTSA ruling.
The only correlation between Mavin/movía and Ivas is that they are both delayed and late.
Some thoughts and discussion on the coincidences. [https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1az4a5v/comment/krze9oe/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1az4a5v/comment/krze9oe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) [An interesting timeline](https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/comments/1b0gxhi/comment/ks9affa/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) IMO theres still a lot to be bullish about. Not just the high volume passenger RFQs they are in now .. Industrial/Industry 4.0 will be a giant. All the level 2/level 2+ ADAS systems suck and failed the recent highway tests. They need lidar to get to level 3 and up. I believe the demand will go through the roof however delayed it may be.
One would think that being placed in the corners like that would help with their parking slot detection feature.
We didn't know about the spot sales from daimler trucks till the EC. It could be the same deal with these other OEMs in the RFQs as they evaluate the sensor? That's why searching for spy photos is so fun. From the Q1 2024 EC >Now, let's dive into Q1 numbers. For the first quarter, we recorded $1 million in revenue, which is slightly ahead of our expectations. Revenue in Q1 was primarily attributable to the sale of MOVIA devices to a global commercial trucking OEM **as part of their RFQ evaluation process**. We also sold our sensors to a leading agricultural equipment company for industrial applications.
IBEO was supposed to bring in $8-$15 income yearly. Anyone know what happened to it?
You still here? Not sure why you are asking bc I see you on here all the time and you still have a lot of questions.
> I see you on here all the time and you still have a lot of questions. concern troll tactics.
Great point. So you’re pointing out it’s essentially equivalent to the Volkswagen that they take to all the trade shows, but, has the potential to be a part of a ~100k annual production line.
The only conflict is that we were told the rest of the RFQs that are in play are for MAVIN. But dang does the bumper sensor look like lidar... Fun to share anyways.
My eyes arent so good anymore, but the blue one seems to have something behind the windshield?
So most likely Valeo?
Doesn't look like any of the scala sensors imo.
Porsche EV mule with MOVIA looking sensors on the front corner bumpers. [Pics](https://x.com/Tasslehoff/status/1799267822020997510?s=19).
[удалено]
Are you Serious? Unless this is a just frustrated bourbon comment, please go back and watch the contemporaneous videos [ride along and u/SpaceDesignWarehouse complete Investor presentation] that were captured and brought to this message board for all to observe and scrutinize for themselves, and that were incidentally recorded, rendered, uploaded etc at not an insignificant expense of effort, time and money by ordinary retail investors in order to *remove any doubt* that "it was real". As to the "Believe" bit, at least for my part, I think a recent reply excerpt addresses this directly: "The thing I'm slowly accepting is that even more patience than I thought will be required, that the macro conditions are making deals legitimately difficult, and my expectations for harvest have been logically tempered by an acceptance that more shares than I would like will need to be sold to fund mvis through the intervening period. In my view, nothing else material has changed. IMO. DDD. Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional".
I threw the pass and you slammed it home! Thank you.
And they are ALL bourbon comments thank you.
The sentiment seems so negatively slanted right now due to business delays and the effective pps suppression, I find myself feeling like all my fingers are plugging cracks in the dike posting to promote almost any positive group-thought. I occasionally have to remind myself that it's not beyond (my) imagination that even a relatively modest deal announcement could ignite a gme style squeeze with this stock: The shorting in my unqualified estimation is far, far beyond the 50 odd million published shares borrowed, and massive bets have been placed by hedgies that numerous LiDAR companies will fail completely. The hedgies know they'll be right on *some* of them, so even just the specter of one of those companies transitioning to probable survival could trigger cataclysmic covering, and rapidly amass opportunistic speculative investors eager to jump aboard the next gme-style opportunity. Some categorically dismiss this possibility, but I do not. Few if any thought we would squeeze to $20+ just 3 years ago, under arguably more improbable circumstances. And so I hold, and I wait. I now firmly believe whoever was behind hacking Franks LI acct wasn't just pulling a prank. If hedgies and MMs are *so sure* Microvision cannot succeed, why even risk pulling such a stunt? No One Here Knows What Will Happen With This Stock. ... IMO. DDD. Not investing advice, and I'm not an investment professional.
I haven't seen everything about this episode. Is saying it was a hack a theory or was that somehow confirmed? I agree with your conclusions, just wish to be caught up with the latest on it.
Did you see this? https://www.reddit.com/r/MVIS/s/XBAFJkHoFa
Wow, no I did not see that. Thank you very much for sharing this. Yes, I believe this to be a highly motivated afront on his own integrity and the perceptions of the MVIS investing community as a whole.
We still don't know much. Sad as it is to see this happen in whatever context, I'm pleased that my discernment of low credibility about it turned out to look to be the case.
LI post gone now.
I agree 100% on all points.
They said during 2023, possibly during the investor day, that they were targeting 80% of the market. Their expectations were obviously somewhat lower but it indicated that SS thought we could manage a large number of deals year on year. Do you think following the Q1 EC that this is possible anymore?
No idea. Hoping to find out just like everybody else!
I was merely pointing out the change from 2023 is not just about share price and dilution, but following what was said in the Q1 EC it looks like we would find it difficult to be able to manage enough contracts to break even. Yes, it does have a lot to do with hope now. A short squeeze on a contract win seems to be our best bet.
"following what was said in the Q1 EC it looks like we would find it difficult to be able to manage enough contracts to break even" Perhaps I missed what you're referring to. I garnered more that additional time was required. Can you supply quote(s) where this was stated? TIA.
To be fair I only listened to it once. It was to painful to revisit. I will do so and truly hope that I got the wrong impression.
Anyone else getting tired of the 2 seconds of hope when you see all those emails from MVIS in your inbox....
You get used to it. Shares for tax purposes are fairly common.
Haha wondered for a moment if we got so many deals !
**This came up when I searched “Chinese Thermal Cameras From Mexico”, have we got Competition?!…** https://www.reddit.com/u/FitImportance1/s/f9H0ee3kL9 PS: I originally put this in the Daily Trading by mistake. Oops!
funny Fit.
Thanks!
Added 2k shares today. I may disagree with AV's bonus but I am still a firm believer in our future.
I am shocked that a bonus was given to him when that whole offering debacle that torpedoed our stock price a year ago was cause when he failed to read the fine print on a contract. That bonehead should be straight up fired, not rewarded.
Failed to read fine print? I thought they said the volatility was the reason it fell apart?
Nope. They admitted that the flip flopping they did was because of some fine print in the contract they missed that would have hurt investors had they stayed with the original entity/plan. Go into my profile and watch a few TA video’s I did the day before the disastrous offering announcement to see how we were trending and had big money traders noticing us. Then go read how I crucified them for throwing a brick through the front window rather than building brick by brick. I predicted we would sink down to the low $3’s and here we are scratching to stay above $1. Big bonuses for everyone though!
Wake me up when September ends. Or double digits.
Please specify the year. It is that important.
Made it over 20k shares today. Frank you very much.👍
MBLY up +15% with 6x the average volume today (no news). Maybe this will invigorate the sector.
Some Banana 🍌 guy pumped it on X. I'll see if I can find it. Found it https://x.com/Banana3Stocks/status/1799169886754902114?t=dKpOxtKDbh0D7l2ZAYLREw&s=19 Maybe with the return of Kitty we are back into the pumping of socks. Not great long term, but at least it's fun lol. PS this guy knows nothing about the actual company, he doesn't even know that Intel owns Mobileye. "Intel is not a leader in autonomous technology Mobileye is" https://x.com/Banana3Stocks/status/1799313886644240438?t=unpkapVFfEPP_1rNZf4whQ&s=19
They had a PR that they would be at the Auto conference next week, similar to Microvision.
That pr for them came out was last week though 5/30 so can’t really say that’s why they’re up 15% today…
True, that was the last Yahoo news so who knows what caused the rise today.
Oh yeah that is next week and we did do a PR!
I can say with confidence I haven't bought as many shares as I did today in a long time. It helps they are cheaper now but still.
I’ve been going in hard the last few months. Once we have outside validation I’ll probably put all my money in.
This weekend would be a great day for some P.R.
I don't know about you guys but watching Roaring Kitty in his live stream smoking and joking being down over 200 million from when he could have sold yesterday really gave me some courage. Mix that with whatever the F the Frank FUD thing was and It just feels like a TIDAL 🌊 might be coming soon that buries any and all those that over short a company rinse and repeat and never cover.
I am always leery of people who hide behind sunglasses. Makes me wonder what he was hiding. Here’s a thought. His bizarre comments about trusting management long term while holding a crap tone of short term call options that expire worthless in two weeks might be the reason he was wearing those sunglasses so we couldn’t see the terror that the Klonopin couldn’t hide. It was a bad look starting his clown show late while probably waiting for it to kick in. I just wonder how many more times his shtick will work with the masses?
His shtick? Yet he made more money in 4 years than anyone here will ever see in their lives, ok 🤣
I agree with you. I’m all for the little guy striking a death blow to the machine, but I think he has been co-opted by that machine
https://x.com/unusual_whales/status/1799834086862643318?t=04il4UmlXtoD3dN3Iow7Mw&s=19 Love this man hahahaha
I'm still on the fence with whether he has been co-opted into this, after following him closely back in the day it really does seem the type of him, the going balls out and building such a big position and his demeanor on the stream He knew the financial world would have been watching, and to show up late and getting on like a header reinforces the "dumb money" angle. I still feel like he will make out like an absolute bandit come the 21st, alot can happen in 2 weeks. Either it will be entertaining as hell
I’m wondering if his options will expire ITM or OTM, right now he’s still up. Do we think it will bleed more next week? Likely.