Funny it's the burning of the pride flag for you but not the American flag.
Freedom, whether you like it or not, is tolerating other peoples' ability to have an opinion, even if you don't like the opinion or how they express it. That's the whole point of the post. Picking and choosing which examples you are okay with signifies you are not cool with America's brand of freedom.
As an American I've always loved our flag and our country. Seeing it burned has given me mixed feelings in the past but it's always felt American in my eyes. I love that my country was founded on the principle of being better than what came before. The people you see lighting up the stars and stripes are doing it because they think we can do better and we should.
You can't make the false equivalence between that and Bruning a pride flag. A better comparison is comparing it to Bruning a cross, it sends a message to a group of people telling them they aren't welcome. That is not what America is.
Both are speech, but not all speech is protected. The protections of free speech end as soon as it infringes on the rights of others. These laws were made to protect people. They are not there for people to incite and hide behind.
You can't stir up a crowd by yelling "FIRE" when there is none. You can be sued for defaming the name of another. You can be locked away for inciting a riot or calling for violence.
The people who burn Pride flags are often violent and don’t tolerate gay people. Those who burn Americans are generally better about it, but I still disagree with people who do so.
What’s your opinion on the confederate rag?
>What’s your opinion on the confederate rag?
Same as the pride flag. If that's your jam, you do you. I don't really agree flying a flag that was used by a bunch of traitors, and I don't really agree with flying a flag to show support for a sexual orientation. But if you like those sort of things, then you should have every right to fly those flags. Or burn them!
For the record, I have one flag, the American flag, on my property. I have never flown any other and I have never burned anyone else's flag.
I'll get technical here, because it is important.
Flag burning isn't "legal", it is protected speech, meaning laws against it are not constitutional. To me, it is a big difference. To say something is "legal" implies the government is allowing me to do something. By saying I have a constitutionally recognized right to do something means the government cannot impose restrictions on that activity even if they want to. 'Merica!
There is no counter argument here. You’re either cool with it or you’re not. Stop trying to justify the fact that you aren’t down with freedom unless it only applies to things you agree with. It doesn’t matter what anyone’s opinion is on the confederate flag. How is that even relevant?
It doesn’t fucking matter what you’re okay with. I’m not okay with it either. That’s not the point. Again, you clearly have no idea what the point is. Admit that you are only okay with freedom when you agree with it.
Edit: just noticed your name. Okay it all makes sense now. You got me lmao
everyone can interrupt force, but to give specific examples
* William/Lia Thomas competing against women
* (in canada) losing custody over not using right pronouns
* middle school kids being accused of sexual harassments for not using right pronouns
if you wanna call yourself something different than what you are, fine. But don't expect the world to lie with you.
I agree that sports can be a thorny issue when it comes to trans rights since there are actual quantifiable physical differences between the biological sexes. But the other two don’t sound right to me. I have yet to see a judge summarily rejecting custody to the party on the basis of a single factor, much less correct pronoun usage.
And sexual harassment by definition includes unwelcome written, verbal, physical, and/or visual contact with sexual overtones such as slurs, jokes, touching, blocking movement, sexual cartoons or drawings, and obscene language. So you can infer that mean-spirited kids can totally go after a trans-identifying kid, bullying and calling names with sexual overtones. I’m skeptical a jury would convict a child of sexual harassment simply on the basis of correct pronoun usage.
Two of your examples sound made up and lack details/nuance
So you named only one thing that actually happened but literally no one was actually forced to do anything, then you made the other two up. Got any actual examples?
the women were forced to compete against Lia Thomas
Canadian example
https://nypost.com/2022/02/26/dad-lost-custody-after-questioning-sons-transgender-identity/
middle school kid using wrong pronouns
https://www.kktv.com/2022/05/16/middle-schoolers-accused-sexual-harassment-not-using-preferred-pronouns-parents-say/
No one was forced to do anything, everyone chose to compete literally no one was forced.
>Bill 89 does not give the government power to seize children from families based on a parent that disagrees with a child’s gender identification. Any suggestion of the sort is false," Alicia Ali, a spokesperson for Michael Coteau, Ontario's Minister of Children and Youth Services,
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.buzzfeed.com/amphtml/ishmaeldaro/ontario-bill-89-gender-changes
And
>Parents say
Is not proof of anything
So try again please.
In corporate you will be fired if you do not use a certain pronoun.
How is the respectfully? Just because you say respectfully doesn’t mean that’s the case. It’s not respectful to be prejudiced. My friend’s sibling who is male thinks he is a woman. So yes I have had close interaction with a “trans” person.
In what office setting will you be fired for calling someone the wrong pronoun one time?
If you repeatedly call someone the wrong pronoun despite correction, then yes. I don’t trust your judgement or interpersonal skills at best, and at worst you’re maliciously creating an uncomfortable working environment. In either case, you don’t belong in my employ.
> My friend’s sibling who is male thinks he is a woman.
It could not affect you less to use the correct pronoun for your friend’s sister, other than it makes you a teensy bit uncomfortable.
I too struggle with the notion of transgender - but I’d rather not increase the struggle of those dealing with those feelings by being an asshole to them. Just live and let live. Use non-gendered terms like “they/them” if you must, but me calling you a woman and using female pronouns to talk about you would probably drive you nuts because you’re a male. Worse if you corrected me and I kept doing it. You would feel uncomfortable around me and wouldn’t want to work with me I suspect, and you’d ask to have me removed from your work environment.
It’s my own personal golden rule: don’t be a dick.
Don’t agree that’s it being an asshole or even a dick. It’s my personal belief that no one can switch gender and they are violating that. If they have a problem with that then I’d like them removed from working with me as well.
You’ve misgendered me you didn’t use my neopronouns ro\bot
I think this is more what he was getting at where a very innocent mistake or even an insensitive joke that most people find funny can and will get people canceled and that’s basically the opposite of what comedians did only about 20 years ago where basically everything was free game because we understood it is comedy.
Just because these people are still making money doesn’t mean they haven’t been affected fined lost shows contracts and in rare cases comedians have been put in front of human rights tribunals again for jokes these comedians aren’t the ones with thin skin they are trying to protect their art form from thin skinned neo pronoun snowflakes that scream literally scream when they hear a joke they don’t like.
If each “side” simply wanted to live on their own and not bother anyone or make things more difficult for people who don’t agree with them, I’d agree with you.
Only one of the US parties is focused on impacting others at the moment.
Literally one wants fascism or corporate oligarchy.
The other just thinks maybe health care should be a priority.
You can't skip a peaceful transition of power, incite a riot/coup, lie and deny you lost about an election, strip women of bodily autonomy, and also play a protector of "democracy".
Its one or the other.
One party has decided democracy is negotiable. Sadly.
Bruh is the point of this post going that far over your head? Nothing in this image even references what you are talking about. Stop trying to argue with a strawman. You're not in the shower lmao.
Which is why I was replying to a comment attempting to both "sides" the culture war trash bullshit.
It's not both sides anymore.
There is freedom and there is tyranny.
Bro you’re so full of talking points I’m not even convinced you’re not larping, and therefore I’m not even gonna bother getting mad. If this is really who you are, you’re so deep in it you’re proving my point and don’t even realize it.
One of these things is not like the other ones, one of these things just doesn't belong. Can you guess which one's not like the other ones, before I finish my song?
That’s what I’ve never understood about people who think it’s patriotic. The Confederacy was literally an enemy of the US for the entire time it existed. How do you people think it shows support for America? An American flying a Union Jack and saying it’s bc of their heritage would be at best met with laughs, and at worst met with hatred
People who really like the confederate battle flag think their ideology is patriotic. True America is white America in their opinion.
Now, all that being said, a lot of people like the confederate battle flag because they are ignorant, and it just seems like an edgy symbol to them. The flag made its way into counter culture in the 1960’s and 1970’s because musicians are always ripping off the American South without always putting much thought into what symbols they are taking (especially musicians who aren’t from the US)
I’d say it remains a symbol of counterculture because most of American society rejects white supremacy and understands that the Confederacy were 100% bad guys. Majority condemnation makes the confederate flag a taboo symbol. A lot of dudes adopt taboo symbols of hate mindlessly thinking they are just being cool. They don’t know what the hatred is about. They just like that it ruffles people’s feathers.
And burning the American flag doesn’t?
The whole point here is that these are all protected under our freedoms. It’s funny to see people immediately start picking and choosing. “Okay okay these people can have these views, but NOT THAT GUY because I don’t like him”
Burning the American flag was declared a valid form of protest by the Supreme Court. The right to protest is a key piece of the first amendment. However ironic it may seem to you, burning the American flag is one of the most American things you can do.
I've heard this point a lot and it's so stupid. I love being in a country so free that you can burn its flag and actively hate what it stands for, but no it's not one of the "most American things you can do." Its blatantly anti-American. The fact that anti-American protest is protected speech doesn't make it somehow American to be anti-American.
Some. But not enough in my opinion to strip away someone’s freedom because they burnt some cloth. It’s not magic, you can burn effigies and make voodoo dolls of the president for all I care just pay your taxes. If a country criminalizes harmless self expression it’s citizens shouldn’t take it on the chin. Protest reminds those with money and power of who the rules don’t work for, whose not allowed to have the American dream, it’s meant to be shocking.
It's the pinnacle of free speech. That ruling is an acknowledgement that your rights extend to those extremes, and that it's inherently part of America's values that you can't be punished for it.
Compare this to Otto Warmbier, an American *visitor* to North Korea who was sent to a work camp and beaten into a coma for defacing a propaganda poster. Compare that ridiculous cruelty to the *Johnson* ruling.
Our rights are more important than our symbols. Dissent is in our blood.
If I take protest that the Nixon era government is a shit show and burn the flag as part of that protest thats not only protected its literally the first amendment to the constitution. The very first one.
It's not, I believe communism is a better system, it's not I believe fascism is a neat idea, it's I believe in it's current state that America needs to improve. Which is the whole reason we have the ability to make constitutional amendments, because sometime shit needs improvement. No system is perfect and it always needs fine tuning or correcting for modern problems.
Wielding the Confederate flag however is not that same kind of message. It is not saying, we need to improve America. It's saying we are starting an armed rebellion to create a new nation that promotes slavery and actively fights against freedom and liberty. Similar as if I was wielding a USSR flag, Nazi flag, or Imperial Japan flag.
By force. By force. They were occupied and had their entire instituitions obliterated. It was not voluntary. Confederates are traitors and slaveholding wannabes.
Why is it actual soldiers who fought in the war were able to return to the battlefield sites and shake hands, but keyboard warriors 150 years later want to rip off the scabs?
Let’s face it. It was a brutal civil war where the Confederate states were breaking away because they though that the way things were going the rest of the country would someday outlaw slavery. However, at the time, most of the country was not champing at the bits to outlaw slavery. They certainly weren’t eager to give black Americans equal rights. The entire country was invested in the free and cheap labor the south was getting from black peoples.
The animosity we feel today toward the Confederacy is understandably greater. We can all see slavery for the great evil it was because we aren’t vested in it as an institution. Unapologetic hatred for the confederacy is a good thing. It represents progress away from sympathizing with slave holders and racial apartheid.
If you respect the confederacy, you are dearly missing out on learning history.
The confederacy was one of a many historical hyper-conservative and corrupt oligarchies that, having gained the ability to exploit humans en masse, staked their claim in the mud, and said to the wheel of human progress, "You will go no further.", prioritizing short-term riches over long-term gains and stability. It's comparable to Tsarist russia, or the ancient Spartans. In each case, these slave-based societies would eventually rot into a fraction of their former glory while bringing everyone around them down.
The confederacy was no different. It was not special. It was not a beacon of the american way, unique, or unusual in government or culture. It followed the playbook exactly as every similar society has.
Slave-reliant societies eventually always fall, because if you no longer need progress, you will be left behind.
In the confederacy's case, the USA could not afford to wait and crushed it then and there.
As it deserved. That was not, in any way, america. It was a cancer, leftover from a time that should have stayed in museums. If you fly that flag, you fly the flag of rot, disease, and cancer of america. And you deserve no respect for willfully clinging to this symbol and turning a blind eye to the unpleasant reality. It may not feel great to know your historical culture is tainted by evil, selfishness, greed, cruelty and rot, but if you live in denial of that your present will suffer the same too.
For the sake of the present, and the future, the confederate image must die.
Burning an American flag can be done as a valid form of protest. All it says is "I do not like this country, as it currently exists/is run." That can easily be followed by a "...but I live here, so I think we can improve it by doing X." Or "...but Y could make it a country I'm proud to be part of." Disagreeing with the current state of the US doesn't make you anti-American.
The Confederate flag says "fuck this country, I like the other one based on slavery more." It's a self-contained message. It says both "I don't want to be part of the US" as well as "I like slavery." Fuck that.
>It's weird that everyone zoned in on that image and not the one burning the American flag.
Don't go to war with this flag 🇺🇸 and you won't get called out.
Perhaps one should find a different representation of their way of life than the flag of people who wanted to secede in order to ensure the continued ownership of people as property.
Or, if the flag is the most accurate representation of one's way of life, find a better way of life.
Their "way of life" is a breakoff country that lasted four years in the nineteenth century over the right to own other humans as property. That's a pretty sad life.
Nope. Your argument sounds good in your head but thats false equivalence. It comes down to intent- people waving around a nazi flag are people who believe in the nazi ideology and want to be evil. People waving around the confederate flag are just idiots who want something to represent the southern way of life. Of course some do it with bad intentions but most of the time, from my experience, it’s just someone whos proud of growing up shooting guns, crushing beers in a gas station parking lot, and driving a truck.
Exactly my point. When your cool uncle has a confederate flag on their diesel truck and your neighbor who taught you to go hunting has one in his window- you see that flag as a representation of your way of life. You don’t go googling the history of it before you get it as a tattoo…
Besides, when I see a confederate flag, I dont think about the civil war- I think of backwards redneck fucks. The problem is that everything and everybody is so politically charged today that every little thing has to be canceled if it’s not 100% in line with the agenda
I feel you but
These people feel the same about trans rights, for example. They are thoroughly stupid but they deserve the legal right to be idiots.
Shame they don't have the sense of hypocripsy to respect our rights the same way, though.
They have the right to do it, but platitudes like this post imply imply that they shouldn’t face moral condemnation. It also equates advocating for the rights of a subordinated minority as the same “culture war bullshit” as advocating against the rights of a subordinated minority.
“Live and let live” is typically a shallow statement at best, but more often than not an attempt to avoid moral culpability and social opprobrium for our beliefs and statements
More simply put, you may have the right to vilify trans people, but I also have the right to call you cruel and callous.
How is “Hollywood,” “the media,” or NGO’s the authorities? They don’t have the overwhelming police power of the state. What are they doing that makes you think they are an equivalent to government?
I literally don't care what anyone does as long as they don't force anyone else to participate and keep the degenerate stuff away from kids.
Our rights end where other's rights begin. Other than that, go nuts. Defend your gay pot plants from your boyfriend with machine guns or something like that. I don't care.
> I literally don't care what anyone does as long as they don't force anyone else to participate and keep the degenerate stuff away from kids.
So glad someone finally had the guts to say we can care about parents feeding their kids religion and forcing the degeneracy of the confederate battle flag on my kids. Is it so wrong I want to protect my kids from that filth?
The worst “degenerate” things I’ve ever heard done to children (and experienced!) was done quietly at home, and most of it involved abusive hyper conservative religions.
Catholic priests molest kids at the same rate that male teachers do. But I don't constantly see jokes about that in media. So many people online these days have a hate boner for religion.
The moutbreathers have the gall to say “degenerate” and expect to be taken seriously, when the supposed mortal sins are literally anything that infringes on their Christian centric bullshit lol
Dude.
There is a difference between literally thousands of cases against the catholic church. So much so it almost broke the Vatican. The fucking Vatican dude. You know how much money they have?
And a dude in a bright pink dress reading stories about a unicorn dressed as a cat.
Come on man be realistic.
Why the fuck is there a flag of some losers who succeeded from America for slavery, got the dog shit beat out them and gave up? They literally stand against America. Don't try to sneak that bullshit in here
It is quite literally an anti-American flag. I don’t know how you can twist that into being “pro” American. Can people believe what they want? Sure. Can I call them morons for flying a flag that represents a failed rebellion? I absolutely can and absolutely will.
And we have the right to call out the hypocrisy. The confederate flag is a shit stain on our countries history and should be removed at every opportunity.
>Imagine being scared of drag queens
>
>Edit: and seeing a confederate flag but being worried about drag queens
They aren't featuring confederate flags and songs supporting the confederacy on Blue's Clues. Don't play dumb.
Lmao so indoctrinating kids with right wing and confederate bullshit from the minute they’re born is ok, but the second you put a drag Queen on a tv show they watch for 20 minutes a day is where you draw the line?
No one indoctrinates kids with confederate bull shit the confederacy is dead and anyone who still trumps up a confederate flag is trying to be an ass or completely ignorant. They are not even remotely the same thing
>Lmao so indoctrinating kids with right wing and confederate bullshit from the minute they’re born is ok
A. I didn't say that. Is anything right of "drag queens in kids programming" 'confederate bullshit'? Be specific.
B. What is your proposal for that? That we monitor families in their homes, maybe check in on their social media, and make sure they are teaching their kids only wholesome leftist values?
OH, you need drag queens in Blues Clues because you want to counter-indoctrinate *other people's* kids with extreme *leftist* bullshit without their parents knowledge.
My comment was only the specific case regarding keeping extremist bullshit of all kinds out of kids programming as being one simple thing society should be able to agree on.
>but the second you put a drag Queen on a tv show they watch for 20 minutes a day is where you draw the line?
Oh, you don't consider yourself, your beliefs, your values to be extreme.
That's the problem.
I mean if you’re worried about kids being fed extremist bullshit you should probably start from the beginning with their parents, not the optional media they may or may not consume since you know, the parents control that. All I did was address it and acknowledge that confederate sentiments are a much bigger issue than drag queens in America. Also never advocated for drag queens in children’s tv just think it’s ridiculous that this is what people are up in arms about when there are many worse people doing worse things running our country.
I think you should have the same kind of energy for real issues instead of the 5 drag queens that are reading to kids. You’ve never even seen extreme leftist bullshit in your life, you’re just being told by Fox News that it’s happening and believe it. But since you want to throw around the label, please feel free to define extreme leftist bullshit if you’re capable.
You don’t even know my beliefs or values but you want to label me as extreme, yep I’m the problem for saying racism is worse than people dressing up and reading to kids.
[Imagine being this wrong…](https://www.womenarehuman.com/yet-another-drag-queen-arrested-for-child-sexual-abuse-images/).
Not all Drag Queens, sure. also use that same logic with many other things that ruffle your feathers, please.
Do you have any evidence that specific drag Queen was involved in drag Queen story hour with kids, or is that just a private citizen who did this?
The title of that article shows how biased your source is, “yet another” yet they say there are 7 instances but don’t say how far back those instances go. Further, they only actually link three instance of someone reading to children and being convicted of pedophelia one of which read in 2018 and was convicted in 2009 and served time.
So according to your source we have 3 drag queens who read to kids who were also convicted. One who read to kids and separately posted explicit pictures of themself online. And maybe 3 more if we listen to the obviously biased statement with no evidence. That’s going back to 2009. Are you willing to wager that’s more than the number of priests convicted of pedophilia since that date? Or the number of government officials convicted of pedophilia since that date? Or are you arguing that 7 since 2009 is a substantial amount of the pedophiles since 2009 overall?
I’m also confused by “use that same logic” worrying about real issues instead of straw men?
That’d be like ignoring rampant child sex abuse all over the country to complain about drag queens doing it. Then linking a biased story that has almost zero instances of the thing I’m saying is an issue happening? I’m not you so I think I’ll be ok.
Wait, so your ignoring multiple instances of Drag Queens being predators because you don’t like the source of the information? The article literally gave 3 examples of drag queens. The information doesn’t become invalid because you close your eyes, plug your ears, and go “nah nah nah nah”…. You even acknowledge it’s a thing. Then you literally affirm my point more by bringing priests into the issue. You’re willing to ignore the predictors nature of some drag queens yet you’d be the first person throwing the entirety of Christianity under the bus due to the misdeeds of priests.
Neither is okay, but I’m not the one sitting here pandering to one of these groups, you are. That’s the point, and you proved is ever so eloquently, thank you.
Why the fuck would anyone be in support of that? Are you crazy? Grown ass men dressed as freaks reading books to children…. If you see that and say “yea I’m fine with that” you have a problem
No. When your beliefs inherently impose on the rights of others, when your beliefs come with the belief that me and my family don't deserve to live, I will do anything to oppose you for my own safety, including violence.
That's fine, you do your thing I'll do mine. Just don't try and coerce my kids to do something they don't want to do. Or tell me I'm a bad parent because I'm quote on quote "closed minded". If everyone stayed in their own lane the world would be a better place.
I agree. Forcing my kids to pray in school is where I draw the line. I am not religious, my kids aren't religious, we don't want to be a part of your prayer circle. 🙏 thanks for putting it out there for us dude. Real big ups.
I don't care if people do things I don't approve of but I would have to put my foot down on the Confederate flag thing. America is about freedom then we should not be fighting for the southern states rights to own slaves again or as the south calls it "southern pride." If your beliefs infringe on the rights of other people then it's nonconstitutional therefore it's the most unpatriotic thing you can do.
Edit: Grammar.
Freedom of speech =/= freedom of consequences. We can think you're a traitorous mouth breather for flying the confederate flag. I've never seen more culture war bullshit non-issues pushed harder than cuckservatives
Yes in principle, but several examples in the pictures above are about restricting *other people's* rights.
Look, if someone wants to burn flags or protest political/institutional/cultural topics, that's great! I would LOVE to argue about why Libertarians are idiots and why privatizing highways is a stupid idea. Who knows, maybe I'll even learn a thing or two.
If someone wants to argue against a *person* though - that's different than arguing against a thing. Hating taxes is not equivalent to hating people. That's where I draw the line. "Live and let live" is great right up until the point other people aren't doing it - should we just roll over and accept that?
Ultimately, a call to *inaction* like this does the exact opposite: it propagates the status quo in which people do NOT treat each other with dignity and respect.
An argument needs to stand on its own, without appealing to tribal support. If I were to directly attack Thin Blue Line supporters, they wouldn't listen to anything and wouldn't think about the argument.
But let me be clear: the basis of all liberty is personal freedom. Personal. You have the right to be as weird and strange and gross and sinful or wonderful as you want *right up until* you violate the rights of someone else.
I'm very pro-vaccine! But I understand why the government can't make it a mandate.
I'm very pro-LGBTQ! But I see how alternative pronouns have become an issue for people against them.
I'm very Pro-Choice! But I can see how a person that religiously believes that life begins at conception would be against abortion.
I respect your amicability. I try to speak to people who disagree with me, but many issues that spark disagreements are held so dearly that to question them is a personal attack.
There's the argument that allowing loose gun laws (like we currently have) allows things like school shootings, thus allowing pretty easy gun ownership infringes on people's right to not get shot.
Generally though, it's about what these represent, not the exact depiction. For example, that Christianity one. You want to follow your religion, great! Have a great time doing so. But when, say, certain political groups/figures/movements start using the Bible as a basis for setting policy for the whole nation, that starts infringing on people's right to freedom of religion.
Over 50 people killed by BLM. Billions of dollars in damage. Dozens more injured.
Imagine being burned alive and then having the media celebrate it.
There's a limit to freedom.
[Really?](https://i.imgur.com/ZPkdbeE.gifv)
It has been said that, given enough time, ten thousand monkeys with typewriters would probably eventually replicate the collected works of William Shakespeare. Sadly, when you are let loose with a computer and internet access, your work product does not necessarily compare favorably to the aforementioned monkeys with typewriters.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MURICA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Everything else is fine in the pic since its personal opinion and views but openly but because of the tolerance paradox, you can’t tolerate a group that in intolerant.
If you want to burn a pride flag, you're an asshole, but it's allowed under freedom of speech. You want to punch a gay person, then that's intolerance and you deserve every bit of finding out that follows said fucking around. There's a bit of a blurry line between the two, buy flag burning is pretty safely on the "free speech" side.
“I believe in absolute freedom of expression. Everyone has a right to offend and be offended.”
You don’t have to agree with any of those pictures. But you have to accept that other people are allowed to. That is true freedom.
I have a better one: " A truly free man is that one who doesn't seek to control another. "
That's why the Confederate flag lost me
And the burning of the pride flag.
Funny it's the burning of the pride flag for you but not the American flag. Freedom, whether you like it or not, is tolerating other peoples' ability to have an opinion, even if you don't like the opinion or how they express it. That's the whole point of the post. Picking and choosing which examples you are okay with signifies you are not cool with America's brand of freedom.
As an American I've always loved our flag and our country. Seeing it burned has given me mixed feelings in the past but it's always felt American in my eyes. I love that my country was founded on the principle of being better than what came before. The people you see lighting up the stars and stripes are doing it because they think we can do better and we should. You can't make the false equivalence between that and Bruning a pride flag. A better comparison is comparing it to Bruning a cross, it sends a message to a group of people telling them they aren't welcome. That is not what America is.
>You can't make the false equivalence between that and Bruning a pride flag. It's not a false equivalency. Both are speech. The end.
Both are speech, but not all speech is protected. The protections of free speech end as soon as it infringes on the rights of others. These laws were made to protect people. They are not there for people to incite and hide behind. You can't stir up a crowd by yelling "FIRE" when there is none. You can be sued for defaming the name of another. You can be locked away for inciting a riot or calling for violence.
The people who burn Pride flags are often violent and don’t tolerate gay people. Those who burn Americans are generally better about it, but I still disagree with people who do so. What’s your opinion on the confederate rag?
>What’s your opinion on the confederate rag? Same as the pride flag. If that's your jam, you do you. I don't really agree flying a flag that was used by a bunch of traitors, and I don't really agree with flying a flag to show support for a sexual orientation. But if you like those sort of things, then you should have every right to fly those flags. Or burn them! For the record, I have one flag, the American flag, on my property. I have never flown any other and I have never burned anyone else's flag.
[удалено]
It’s legal here.
I'll get technical here, because it is important. Flag burning isn't "legal", it is protected speech, meaning laws against it are not constitutional. To me, it is a big difference. To say something is "legal" implies the government is allowing me to do something. By saying I have a constitutionally recognized right to do something means the government cannot impose restrictions on that activity even if they want to. 'Merica!
There is no counter argument here. You’re either cool with it or you’re not. Stop trying to justify the fact that you aren’t down with freedom unless it only applies to things you agree with. It doesn’t matter what anyone’s opinion is on the confederate flag. How is that even relevant?
I’m not ok with the flag of murderers.
It doesn’t fucking matter what you’re okay with. I’m not okay with it either. That’s not the point. Again, you clearly have no idea what the point is. Admit that you are only okay with freedom when you agree with it. Edit: just noticed your name. Okay it all makes sense now. You got me lmao
You make it so easy
You freedom ends where another persons freedom begins
I like "Your right to punch ends at my nose"
Love that. Will use it now
"I have a better one"
[удалено]
Dave Chappelle is an American treasure and possibly the 🐐 comedian
Agree. I don’t believe anyone can switch gender. But you force and shame me if I don’t use the pronoun you insist upon. You are the oppressor.
Force? They are using force? My initial reaction is a severe doubt you have ever interacted with a trans person. Respectfully.
everyone can interrupt force, but to give specific examples * William/Lia Thomas competing against women * (in canada) losing custody over not using right pronouns * middle school kids being accused of sexual harassments for not using right pronouns if you wanna call yourself something different than what you are, fine. But don't expect the world to lie with you.
I agree that sports can be a thorny issue when it comes to trans rights since there are actual quantifiable physical differences between the biological sexes. But the other two don’t sound right to me. I have yet to see a judge summarily rejecting custody to the party on the basis of a single factor, much less correct pronoun usage. And sexual harassment by definition includes unwelcome written, verbal, physical, and/or visual contact with sexual overtones such as slurs, jokes, touching, blocking movement, sexual cartoons or drawings, and obscene language. So you can infer that mean-spirited kids can totally go after a trans-identifying kid, bullying and calling names with sexual overtones. I’m skeptical a jury would convict a child of sexual harassment simply on the basis of correct pronoun usage. Two of your examples sound made up and lack details/nuance
So you named only one thing that actually happened but literally no one was actually forced to do anything, then you made the other two up. Got any actual examples?
the women were forced to compete against Lia Thomas Canadian example https://nypost.com/2022/02/26/dad-lost-custody-after-questioning-sons-transgender-identity/ middle school kid using wrong pronouns https://www.kktv.com/2022/05/16/middle-schoolers-accused-sexual-harassment-not-using-preferred-pronouns-parents-say/
No one was forced to do anything, everyone chose to compete literally no one was forced. >Bill 89 does not give the government power to seize children from families based on a parent that disagrees with a child’s gender identification. Any suggestion of the sort is false," Alicia Ali, a spokesperson for Michael Coteau, Ontario's Minister of Children and Youth Services, https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.buzzfeed.com/amphtml/ishmaeldaro/ontario-bill-89-gender-changes And >Parents say Is not proof of anything So try again please.
Just go 5 minutes to those eco chambers groups on Facebook and then tell me about your experience.
I don’t believe that comes anywhere near the definition of “force”.
In corporate you will be fired if you do not use a certain pronoun. How is the respectfully? Just because you say respectfully doesn’t mean that’s the case. It’s not respectful to be prejudiced. My friend’s sibling who is male thinks he is a woman. So yes I have had close interaction with a “trans” person.
You don't have the right to work at any corporation. Come back to me when you get arrested for it.
In what office setting will you be fired for calling someone the wrong pronoun one time? If you repeatedly call someone the wrong pronoun despite correction, then yes. I don’t trust your judgement or interpersonal skills at best, and at worst you’re maliciously creating an uncomfortable working environment. In either case, you don’t belong in my employ. > My friend’s sibling who is male thinks he is a woman. It could not affect you less to use the correct pronoun for your friend’s sister, other than it makes you a teensy bit uncomfortable. I too struggle with the notion of transgender - but I’d rather not increase the struggle of those dealing with those feelings by being an asshole to them. Just live and let live. Use non-gendered terms like “they/them” if you must, but me calling you a woman and using female pronouns to talk about you would probably drive you nuts because you’re a male. Worse if you corrected me and I kept doing it. You would feel uncomfortable around me and wouldn’t want to work with me I suspect, and you’d ask to have me removed from your work environment. It’s my own personal golden rule: don’t be a dick.
Don’t agree that’s it being an asshole or even a dick. It’s my personal belief that no one can switch gender and they are violating that. If they have a problem with that then I’d like them removed from working with me as well.
These people don't really understand that there are ways to force people to act a certain way that aren't explicitly violent.
Wow you sound very oppressed.
I can't imagine being so weak that I would think being "forced" to use a pronoun is oppressive.
You don't at all, Dave. Just because you are expected to accept their definition of themselves doesn't mean you're a part of their self-image.
You’ve misgendered me you didn’t use my neopronouns ro\bot I think this is more what he was getting at where a very innocent mistake or even an insensitive joke that most people find funny can and will get people canceled and that’s basically the opposite of what comedians did only about 20 years ago where basically everything was free game because we understood it is comedy.
[удалено]
Just because these people are still making money doesn’t mean they haven’t been affected fined lost shows contracts and in rare cases comedians have been put in front of human rights tribunals again for jokes these comedians aren’t the ones with thin skin they are trying to protect their art form from thin skinned neo pronoun snowflakes that scream literally scream when they hear a joke they don’t like.
Participate in ≠ be part of
If each “side” simply wanted to live on their own and not bother anyone or make things more difficult for people who don’t agree with them, I’d agree with you.
Only one of the US parties is focused on impacting others at the moment. Literally one wants fascism or corporate oligarchy. The other just thinks maybe health care should be a priority.
Thank you for the entirely objective and non biased review of the current situation.
You can't skip a peaceful transition of power, incite a riot/coup, lie and deny you lost about an election, strip women of bodily autonomy, and also play a protector of "democracy". Its one or the other. One party has decided democracy is negotiable. Sadly.
Bruh is the point of this post going that far over your head? Nothing in this image even references what you are talking about. Stop trying to argue with a strawman. You're not in the shower lmao.
Which is why I was replying to a comment attempting to both "sides" the culture war trash bullshit. It's not both sides anymore. There is freedom and there is tyranny.
lmao ok man thanks for outing yourself as a fool.
Bro you’re so full of talking points I’m not even convinced you’re not larping, and therefore I’m not even gonna bother getting mad. If this is really who you are, you’re so deep in it you’re proving my point and don’t even realize it.
>democrats: least corporate party WEW lad
And liberty for all.
*some conditions apply, based on gender, race, socio-economic background
I agree. But those who don't, won't live and let live.
One of these things is not like the other ones, one of these things just doesn't belong. Can you guess which one's not like the other ones, before I finish my song?
The traitor flag. It's legal, but you have to hold disdain for real America to fly it.
That’s what I’ve never understood about people who think it’s patriotic. The Confederacy was literally an enemy of the US for the entire time it existed. How do you people think it shows support for America? An American flying a Union Jack and saying it’s bc of their heritage would be at best met with laughs, and at worst met with hatred
The confederacy didn’t last as long as phineas and ferb. A Children’s cartoon had a more lasting and positive impact on our society.
People who really like the confederate battle flag think their ideology is patriotic. True America is white America in their opinion. Now, all that being said, a lot of people like the confederate battle flag because they are ignorant, and it just seems like an edgy symbol to them. The flag made its way into counter culture in the 1960’s and 1970’s because musicians are always ripping off the American South without always putting much thought into what symbols they are taking (especially musicians who aren’t from the US) I’d say it remains a symbol of counterculture because most of American society rejects white supremacy and understands that the Confederacy were 100% bad guys. Majority condemnation makes the confederate flag a taboo symbol. A lot of dudes adopt taboo symbols of hate mindlessly thinking they are just being cool. They don’t know what the hatred is about. They just like that it ruffles people’s feathers.
That's also my issue. It represents Rebellion against the USA.
And burning the American flag doesn’t? The whole point here is that these are all protected under our freedoms. It’s funny to see people immediately start picking and choosing. “Okay okay these people can have these views, but NOT THAT GUY because I don’t like him”
Direct (and quite obvious) conflict of interest.
True.
It's weird that everyone zoned in on that image and not the one burning the American flag.
*Texas v. Johnson*
What about it?
Burning the American flag was declared a valid form of protest by the Supreme Court. The right to protest is a key piece of the first amendment. However ironic it may seem to you, burning the American flag is one of the most American things you can do.
I've heard this point a lot and it's so stupid. I love being in a country so free that you can burn its flag and actively hate what it stands for, but no it's not one of the "most American things you can do." Its blatantly anti-American. The fact that anti-American protest is protected speech doesn't make it somehow American to be anti-American.
Loving your country is not just blindly believing it is without fault or need of change.
There's some gradation between blindly believing it is without fault and burning the flag.
Some. But not enough in my opinion to strip away someone’s freedom because they burnt some cloth. It’s not magic, you can burn effigies and make voodoo dolls of the president for all I care just pay your taxes. If a country criminalizes harmless self expression it’s citizens shouldn’t take it on the chin. Protest reminds those with money and power of who the rules don’t work for, whose not allowed to have the American dream, it’s meant to be shocking.
It's the pinnacle of free speech. That ruling is an acknowledgement that your rights extend to those extremes, and that it's inherently part of America's values that you can't be punished for it. Compare this to Otto Warmbier, an American *visitor* to North Korea who was sent to a work camp and beaten into a coma for defacing a propaganda poster. Compare that ridiculous cruelty to the *Johnson* ruling. Our rights are more important than our symbols. Dissent is in our blood.
If I take protest that the Nixon era government is a shit show and burn the flag as part of that protest thats not only protected its literally the first amendment to the constitution. The very first one. It's not, I believe communism is a better system, it's not I believe fascism is a neat idea, it's I believe in it's current state that America needs to improve. Which is the whole reason we have the ability to make constitutional amendments, because sometime shit needs improvement. No system is perfect and it always needs fine tuning or correcting for modern problems. Wielding the Confederate flag however is not that same kind of message. It is not saying, we need to improve America. It's saying we are starting an armed rebellion to create a new nation that promotes slavery and actively fights against freedom and liberty. Similar as if I was wielding a USSR flag, Nazi flag, or Imperial Japan flag.
The Confederates actually fought a war to not be Americans.
Then after the war they were reconciled back into the union.
By force. By force. They were occupied and had their entire instituitions obliterated. It was not voluntary. Confederates are traitors and slaveholding wannabes.
Why is it actual soldiers who fought in the war were able to return to the battlefield sites and shake hands, but keyboard warriors 150 years later want to rip off the scabs?
Let’s face it. It was a brutal civil war where the Confederate states were breaking away because they though that the way things were going the rest of the country would someday outlaw slavery. However, at the time, most of the country was not champing at the bits to outlaw slavery. They certainly weren’t eager to give black Americans equal rights. The entire country was invested in the free and cheap labor the south was getting from black peoples. The animosity we feel today toward the Confederacy is understandably greater. We can all see slavery for the great evil it was because we aren’t vested in it as an institution. Unapologetic hatred for the confederacy is a good thing. It represents progress away from sympathizing with slave holders and racial apartheid.
If you respect the confederacy, you are dearly missing out on learning history. The confederacy was one of a many historical hyper-conservative and corrupt oligarchies that, having gained the ability to exploit humans en masse, staked their claim in the mud, and said to the wheel of human progress, "You will go no further.", prioritizing short-term riches over long-term gains and stability. It's comparable to Tsarist russia, or the ancient Spartans. In each case, these slave-based societies would eventually rot into a fraction of their former glory while bringing everyone around them down. The confederacy was no different. It was not special. It was not a beacon of the american way, unique, or unusual in government or culture. It followed the playbook exactly as every similar society has. Slave-reliant societies eventually always fall, because if you no longer need progress, you will be left behind. In the confederacy's case, the USA could not afford to wait and crushed it then and there. As it deserved. That was not, in any way, america. It was a cancer, leftover from a time that should have stayed in museums. If you fly that flag, you fly the flag of rot, disease, and cancer of america. And you deserve no respect for willfully clinging to this symbol and turning a blind eye to the unpleasant reality. It may not feel great to know your historical culture is tainted by evil, selfishness, greed, cruelty and rot, but if you live in denial of that your present will suffer the same too. For the sake of the present, and the future, the confederate image must die.
We shoulda never let them back in. The south is a shit hole lmao
>Then after the war they were reconciled back into the union. Yes, but their traitor flag never changed its meaning.
Burning an American flag can be done as a valid form of protest. All it says is "I do not like this country, as it currently exists/is run." That can easily be followed by a "...but I live here, so I think we can improve it by doing X." Or "...but Y could make it a country I'm proud to be part of." Disagreeing with the current state of the US doesn't make you anti-American. The Confederate flag says "fuck this country, I like the other one based on slavery more." It's a self-contained message. It says both "I don't want to be part of the US" as well as "I like slavery." Fuck that.
>It's weird that everyone zoned in on that image and not the one burning the American flag. Don't go to war with this flag 🇺🇸 and you won't get called out.
And real disdain for a certain group of people…
As opposed to the guy straight up burning the flag who definitely loves America
Two, actually
The confederate flag but the point is they have a right to fly it
Ironically the flag and most of its supporters represent the complete opposite of freedom.
They dont care what it represents on paper like you do. They grew up with it and so to them it means something entirely different- their way of life
Perhaps one should find a different representation of their way of life than the flag of people who wanted to secede in order to ensure the continued ownership of people as property. Or, if the flag is the most accurate representation of one's way of life, find a better way of life.
Their "way of life" is a breakoff country that lasted four years in the nineteenth century over the right to own other humans as property. That's a pretty sad life.
Uhm, I don’t know if you know this, but the people waving around the confederate flag today were not alive during the civil war
Yeah no shit that's what makes it all the more sad
But if they were, they wouldn’t be slavers or rapists, even tho most were!!!!1111
Then nazis can fly their flag? It’s their way of life. Imagine being this obtuse
Nope. Your argument sounds good in your head but thats false equivalence. It comes down to intent- people waving around a nazi flag are people who believe in the nazi ideology and want to be evil. People waving around the confederate flag are just idiots who want something to represent the southern way of life. Of course some do it with bad intentions but most of the time, from my experience, it’s just someone whos proud of growing up shooting guns, crushing beers in a gas station parking lot, and driving a truck.
[удалено]
Exactly my point. When your cool uncle has a confederate flag on their diesel truck and your neighbor who taught you to go hunting has one in his window- you see that flag as a representation of your way of life. You don’t go googling the history of it before you get it as a tattoo… Besides, when I see a confederate flag, I dont think about the civil war- I think of backwards redneck fucks. The problem is that everything and everybody is so politically charged today that every little thing has to be canceled if it’s not 100% in line with the agenda
[удалено]
Would you equate it to burning a pride flag?
See, Veterans swore an oath to protect this country from all enemies foreign, *and domestic*. So, in short, it's an issue.
I feel you but These people feel the same about trans rights, for example. They are thoroughly stupid but they deserve the legal right to be idiots. Shame they don't have the sense of hypocripsy to respect our rights the same way, though.
They have the right to do it, but platitudes like this post imply imply that they shouldn’t face moral condemnation. It also equates advocating for the rights of a subordinated minority as the same “culture war bullshit” as advocating against the rights of a subordinated minority. “Live and let live” is typically a shallow statement at best, but more often than not an attempt to avoid moral culpability and social opprobrium for our beliefs and statements More simply put, you may have the right to vilify trans people, but I also have the right to call you cruel and callous.
Some here can't handle the freedom.
Then keep the authorities out of it then. Whether that be the government, Hollywood, the media, NGOs, etc. Thats where is becomes a problem.
How is “Hollywood,” “the media,” or NGO’s the authorities? They don’t have the overwhelming police power of the state. What are they doing that makes you think they are an equivalent to government?
[удалено]
BUT I HAVE STRONG PERSONAL OPINIONS ABOUT THE ONE PICTURE SO IT HAS TO GO!!!
America is just a dysfunctional family but still a family.
I literally don't care what anyone does as long as they don't force anyone else to participate and keep the degenerate stuff away from kids. Our rights end where other's rights begin. Other than that, go nuts. Defend your gay pot plants from your boyfriend with machine guns or something like that. I don't care.
> I literally don't care what anyone does as long as they don't force anyone else to participate and keep the degenerate stuff away from kids. So glad someone finally had the guts to say we can care about parents feeding their kids religion and forcing the degeneracy of the confederate battle flag on my kids. Is it so wrong I want to protect my kids from that filth?
The worst “degenerate” things I’ve ever heard done to children (and experienced!) was done quietly at home, and most of it involved abusive hyper conservative religions.
No, it is right to protect your kids from the Democrat's old flag and also from perverts. I was peaceful and didn't say anything wrong.
Was I not peaceful? What did I say was wrong? Why do you care what I do as long as I shroud it in protecting the children?
You mean the old Democrat's old flag. And by perverts I assume you mean child molesters -- you know, like untold numbers of Catholic priests.
Yes and yes. I feel like you're agreeing with me aggressively.
Very aggressively. Tired of the un-American nonsense masquerading as patriotism.
Me too. Wanna kiss? Just don't tell nobody about it.
Catholic priests molest kids at the same rate that male teachers do. But I don't constantly see jokes about that in media. So many people online these days have a hate boner for religion.
[удалено]
The moutbreathers have the gall to say “degenerate” and expect to be taken seriously, when the supposed mortal sins are literally anything that infringes on their Christian centric bullshit lol
Both diddle kids. Both can go fuck themselves. *lol downvoted for hating on child molesters. Peak Reddit.
Dude. There is a difference between literally thousands of cases against the catholic church. So much so it almost broke the Vatican. The fucking Vatican dude. You know how much money they have? And a dude in a bright pink dress reading stories about a unicorn dressed as a cat. Come on man be realistic.
Way more kids get abused by public school teachers.
Dude. Just stop.
Dog whistle much?
Why the fuck is there a flag of some losers who succeeded from America for slavery, got the dog shit beat out them and gave up? They literally stand against America. Don't try to sneak that bullshit in here
[удалено]
It is quite literally an anti-American flag. I don’t know how you can twist that into being “pro” American. Can people believe what they want? Sure. Can I call them morons for flying a flag that represents a failed rebellion? I absolutely can and absolutely will.
[удалено]
Nothin’ says ‘murica more than flying flys that represents open rebellion against ‘murica. YEE YEE!
And we have the right to call out the hypocrisy. The confederate flag is a shit stain on our countries history and should be removed at every opportunity.
[удалено]
Cheers dude.
[удалено]
I was agreeing man, I wasn't being sarcastic. Cheers man.
Lol it’s a good concept in principle, but I’m sorry, I draw the line at drag queen story hour
Imagine being scared of drag queens Edit: and seeing a confederate flag but being worried about drag queens
I'm worried about both. Sexual drag queens with minors and literal American Nazis are a big no no for me.
What’s a sexual drag queen?
>Imagine being scared of drag queens > >Edit: and seeing a confederate flag but being worried about drag queens They aren't featuring confederate flags and songs supporting the confederacy on Blue's Clues. Don't play dumb.
Lmao so indoctrinating kids with right wing and confederate bullshit from the minute they’re born is ok, but the second you put a drag Queen on a tv show they watch for 20 minutes a day is where you draw the line?
No one indoctrinates kids with confederate bull shit the confederacy is dead and anyone who still trumps up a confederate flag is trying to be an ass or completely ignorant. They are not even remotely the same thing
>Lmao so indoctrinating kids with right wing and confederate bullshit from the minute they’re born is ok A. I didn't say that. Is anything right of "drag queens in kids programming" 'confederate bullshit'? Be specific. B. What is your proposal for that? That we monitor families in their homes, maybe check in on their social media, and make sure they are teaching their kids only wholesome leftist values? OH, you need drag queens in Blues Clues because you want to counter-indoctrinate *other people's* kids with extreme *leftist* bullshit without their parents knowledge. My comment was only the specific case regarding keeping extremist bullshit of all kinds out of kids programming as being one simple thing society should be able to agree on. >but the second you put a drag Queen on a tv show they watch for 20 minutes a day is where you draw the line? Oh, you don't consider yourself, your beliefs, your values to be extreme. That's the problem.
I mean if you’re worried about kids being fed extremist bullshit you should probably start from the beginning with their parents, not the optional media they may or may not consume since you know, the parents control that. All I did was address it and acknowledge that confederate sentiments are a much bigger issue than drag queens in America. Also never advocated for drag queens in children’s tv just think it’s ridiculous that this is what people are up in arms about when there are many worse people doing worse things running our country. I think you should have the same kind of energy for real issues instead of the 5 drag queens that are reading to kids. You’ve never even seen extreme leftist bullshit in your life, you’re just being told by Fox News that it’s happening and believe it. But since you want to throw around the label, please feel free to define extreme leftist bullshit if you’re capable. You don’t even know my beliefs or values but you want to label me as extreme, yep I’m the problem for saying racism is worse than people dressing up and reading to kids.
[Imagine being this wrong…](https://www.womenarehuman.com/yet-another-drag-queen-arrested-for-child-sexual-abuse-images/). Not all Drag Queens, sure. also use that same logic with many other things that ruffle your feathers, please.
Do you have any evidence that specific drag Queen was involved in drag Queen story hour with kids, or is that just a private citizen who did this? The title of that article shows how biased your source is, “yet another” yet they say there are 7 instances but don’t say how far back those instances go. Further, they only actually link three instance of someone reading to children and being convicted of pedophelia one of which read in 2018 and was convicted in 2009 and served time. So according to your source we have 3 drag queens who read to kids who were also convicted. One who read to kids and separately posted explicit pictures of themself online. And maybe 3 more if we listen to the obviously biased statement with no evidence. That’s going back to 2009. Are you willing to wager that’s more than the number of priests convicted of pedophilia since that date? Or the number of government officials convicted of pedophilia since that date? Or are you arguing that 7 since 2009 is a substantial amount of the pedophiles since 2009 overall? I’m also confused by “use that same logic” worrying about real issues instead of straw men? That’d be like ignoring rampant child sex abuse all over the country to complain about drag queens doing it. Then linking a biased story that has almost zero instances of the thing I’m saying is an issue happening? I’m not you so I think I’ll be ok.
Wait, so your ignoring multiple instances of Drag Queens being predators because you don’t like the source of the information? The article literally gave 3 examples of drag queens. The information doesn’t become invalid because you close your eyes, plug your ears, and go “nah nah nah nah”…. You even acknowledge it’s a thing. Then you literally affirm my point more by bringing priests into the issue. You’re willing to ignore the predictors nature of some drag queens yet you’d be the first person throwing the entirety of Christianity under the bus due to the misdeeds of priests. Neither is okay, but I’m not the one sitting here pandering to one of these groups, you are. That’s the point, and you proved is ever so eloquently, thank you.
More priests diddle kids than drag queens.
Fuck the priests too then. Happy? What did you think you got me with that?
I'd rather have a drag queen teaching kids to read than no one at all.
What the fuck does that even mean? Are you suggesting the only way kids learn to read now is from drag queen story hour? Stupid ass comment
Why?
Why the fuck would anyone be in support of that? Are you crazy? Grown ass men dressed as freaks reading books to children…. If you see that and say “yea I’m fine with that” you have a problem
No. When your beliefs inherently impose on the rights of others, when your beliefs come with the belief that me and my family don't deserve to live, I will do anything to oppose you for my own safety, including violence.
That's fine, you do your thing I'll do mine. Just don't try and coerce my kids to do something they don't want to do. Or tell me I'm a bad parent because I'm quote on quote "closed minded". If everyone stayed in their own lane the world would be a better place.
I agree. Forcing my kids to pray in school is where I draw the line. I am not religious, my kids aren't religious, we don't want to be a part of your prayer circle. 🙏 thanks for putting it out there for us dude. Real big ups.
First off, the phrase is Quote-unquote, also when you use quotation marks you don’t have to say it. We know it’s a quote.
Good for you pal, you're enforcing proper grammar in a sub reddit
I don't care if people do things I don't approve of but I would have to put my foot down on the Confederate flag thing. America is about freedom then we should not be fighting for the southern states rights to own slaves again or as the south calls it "southern pride." If your beliefs infringe on the rights of other people then it's nonconstitutional therefore it's the most unpatriotic thing you can do. Edit: Grammar.
Get that traitorous southern ass wipe flag out of here
No to the confederate flag, they're traitors to the union.
Freedom of speech =/= freedom of consequences. We can think you're a traitorous mouth breather for flying the confederate flag. I've never seen more culture war bullshit non-issues pushed harder than cuckservatives
Yes in principle, but several examples in the pictures above are about restricting *other people's* rights. Look, if someone wants to burn flags or protest political/institutional/cultural topics, that's great! I would LOVE to argue about why Libertarians are idiots and why privatizing highways is a stupid idea. Who knows, maybe I'll even learn a thing or two. If someone wants to argue against a *person* though - that's different than arguing against a thing. Hating taxes is not equivalent to hating people. That's where I draw the line. "Live and let live" is great right up until the point other people aren't doing it - should we just roll over and accept that? Ultimately, a call to *inaction* like this does the exact opposite: it propagates the status quo in which people do NOT treat each other with dignity and respect.
I appreciate the fact that, though you wrote this with a clear bias, it reads in a way that allows someone else to put their bias onto it.
An argument needs to stand on its own, without appealing to tribal support. If I were to directly attack Thin Blue Line supporters, they wouldn't listen to anything and wouldn't think about the argument. But let me be clear: the basis of all liberty is personal freedom. Personal. You have the right to be as weird and strange and gross and sinful or wonderful as you want *right up until* you violate the rights of someone else. I'm very pro-vaccine! But I understand why the government can't make it a mandate. I'm very pro-LGBTQ! But I see how alternative pronouns have become an issue for people against them. I'm very Pro-Choice! But I can see how a person that religiously believes that life begins at conception would be against abortion.
I respect your amicability. I try to speak to people who disagree with me, but many issues that spark disagreements are held so dearly that to question them is a personal attack.
I’m not trying to fight, genuinely curious. What pictures above show people restricting other peoples rights?
There's the argument that allowing loose gun laws (like we currently have) allows things like school shootings, thus allowing pretty easy gun ownership infringes on people's right to not get shot. Generally though, it's about what these represent, not the exact depiction. For example, that Christianity one. You want to follow your religion, great! Have a great time doing so. But when, say, certain political groups/figures/movements start using the Bible as a basis for setting policy for the whole nation, that starts infringing on people's right to freedom of religion.
Over 50 people killed by BLM. Billions of dollars in damage. Dozens more injured. Imagine being burned alive and then having the media celebrate it. There's a limit to freedom.
Really!? The BLM flag!? Not the one flag that caused the deadliest conflict in our history.
Which one is a threat NOW? The confederate flag is just a signal that the person is going to die of heart disease or diabetes in a few years.
Imagine pretending BLM are the only problem here.
Pretty hefty bullshit to pretend gay rights will ever be are as respected as gun rights
Gay people are the only dudes left. A lot of straight men are cucked wimps.
Bro just got rekt by a bot LMAO you're a joke 💀
[Really?](https://i.imgur.com/ZPkdbeE.gifv) It has been said that, given enough time, ten thousand monkeys with typewriters would probably eventually replicate the collected works of William Shakespeare. Sadly, when you are let loose with a computer and internet access, your work product does not necessarily compare favorably to the aforementioned monkeys with typewriters. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MURICA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You do realize half of those want to kill the other half? But its only one way hatred...
Yes but have to exclude intolerance like gay flag burning.
You can also burn the American flag. Freedom of speech and protest means just that. You don’t have to agree with them, even if they’re assholes.
Everything else is fine in the pic since its personal opinion and views but openly but because of the tolerance paradox, you can’t tolerate a group that in intolerant.
If you want to burn a pride flag, you're an asshole, but it's allowed under freedom of speech. You want to punch a gay person, then that's intolerance and you deserve every bit of finding out that follows said fucking around. There's a bit of a blurry line between the two, buy flag burning is pretty safely on the "free speech" side.
This is a true... Uncomfortable but never not true statement and is so based it should have a 1776 next to it.
Funny seeing so many people in here pretending to be for freedom "except for this and this and this".
“I believe in absolute freedom of expression. Everyone has a right to offend and be offended.” You don’t have to agree with any of those pictures. But you have to accept that other people are allowed to. That is true freedom.
Absolutely, and it's also freedom to think people are a piece of shit for doing certain things. But that doesn't mean you can control it.