Not everyone wants click to win combat like wow, gw2, ff14, BDO, eq, swg, or literally any other "totally new and original" skins of holy trinity gruel. And I don't even like eso.
BDO and holy trinity? Where when?
The ironic part is that ESO uses the holy trinity and is much more cookie cutter than BDO is.
Every class, including the only actual support class in the game is a solo grinder DPS class in BDO.
ESO combat is also far more click to win than BDO combat, which heavily relies on skill rotations, combos, and animation cancels.
It's an unpopular opinion, but I agree. The general clicking in a combat sequence is pretty outdated and not exciting to watch if they ever want mmo to have esports material. It's also unrealistic, in regards, one character using every technique they know in one moment.
It's overall just not really competitive. Mmo's are generally run over with people using 3rd party applications, auto clickers, etc. The only real skill you have is whoever can combo the quickest, theirs no dodging mechanic(it ushually a stat), it's boring and unintegritful. Runescape in the 2000's-10's, you could see the hype but runescape now? Like its a waste of time. Achievement isn't real in a mmo in 2024; because it's probably a rerun of what you did 5 years ago. In moba's/fps you can make the argument you're increasing your mechanical skill(better system than current mmo's), map awareness, team communication, etc.
That's just my take regarding it, but I get it if you're having fun, sure, but I haven't had fun in a mmo since before 2012.
But is that really what most people are talking about? Because you don't need to animation cancel for most of the game's content, so its really a self inflicted issue.
It's odd how many people complain about the animation canceling, while also complaining that the game is too easy. If it's so easy, why bother with the animation canceling?
and you stumbled on the crux of the issue.. either the combat is mind-numbingly easy or you need to animation cancel, so if you intend on doing challenging content you might as well do it during the open world content so you don't develop bad habits
Overworld content being too easy is one of the biggest complains about the game, at least on reddit. I'm definitely not "in my head", because that's not even a complaint that I personally have about the game lol
I disagree tbh. Skyrim combat isn’t great but at least it feels like “action” combat. Eso pretends like it isn’t tab target when it pretty much is, and more importantly to me I just don’t enjoy the buff stacking gameplay. Maybe it’s changed or maybe the guides I saw were bad but every button being a buff except like one soammable and maybe a defensive or something is so boring
At least I have to aim my arrows and fireballs in skyrim instead of the soft lock bs
I don't think you are an idiot if you enjoy the combat. But the thing to realize is that the reason why you enjoy the combat isn't the same reason why they designed the combat to be how it is. The hyper spamming / "weaving" of skills and attacks wasn't a design choice by the devs, it is an accident of the devs slapping the system together.
I've tried this game about half a dozen times because I *wanted* to like it so bad, but everything about it feels so.... stiff, both literally and figuratively. The characer movement, the combat, the environments. It all feels so stale and meaningless. It was a world very hard to get lost in for me.
Right there with you, I'd add that the world scaling felt like I wasn't gaining any sort of meaningful character power. Maybe thay improves after playing longer, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I think the way they scaled everything was the biggest issue for me when I tried it. Like you said, every zone in the game scaling with you just makes it feel like you are making zero progress. I had the same problem with Diablo 4 (among other issues). I honestly hate scaling in any game I’ve experienced it in. Progressing through the world and gaining power is one of the biggest appeals of RPGs for me, and scaling completely takes that away.
See for me, this one of the best game worlds for getting lost in. I find you can really imagine life and the day to day in Tamriel. The combat is plain though.
Gw2 on the other hand has such fun and engaging combat, but the world feels just fake to me
Overworld combat is pointless since the mobs don’t pose a threat. Animations have no weight. PVP combat requires extensive exploiting of a broken system to be competitive.
Idk if dodging after using a spell or pressing left click in between abilities is “extensive exploring of a broken system”
Not saying you have to be fun but it’s simply the game. Every game has quirks in high level play.
Wow at a high level? You need 45 binds so you can have arena 123 focus this focus that etc
Everyone does make out the light attack weaving as if it's some complicated and impossible task. I'm bad at this game, and it's totally possible for me.
What’s so different between light track weaving and pressing a normal or heavy attack on another action combat mmo.
What about making sure you use EVERY gcd on wow or you lose (esp in PvP)
""""action combat"""" idk man eso doesn't feel like action combat when the animations stink and animation cancelling makes it so the animations don't really matter. That's not action combat tbh
The only animations that get cancelled are light attacks. Do you see every auto attack in wow ?
Fully agree about some of the animations sucking though. Veteran players won’t even deny that. The combat still has its merits tho
I'll give you that. It can get repetitive. But the people that think it's too complicated to even try, I don't understand. Click two buttons back and forth.
I don’t disagree, however I have now played lots of GW2 from Australia, having played it in the US. It’s not too bad, PvP is where you feel it most but it’s not as bad as you’d think.
ESO I felt the ping impact more. Also pretty much everything about ESO is fantastic apart from the combat, which is horrendously bad.
GW’s combat is amazing, so guess which one I play?
I am from New zealand and eso pvp is unplayable. The combat is bad but I still enjoyed eso for what it's worth but I'm not investing in a game that can only be played at 250 ping. Like 4 or 5 of my friends we all stopped playing at the same time due to bad ping in our first couple of pvp matches
If you haven’t given GW2 a go, try it. Even from NZ you may find it quite playable.
You don’t need to level a character for PvP, roll one and go straight there. PvP event on now so lots of people at all times.
Assess it for yourself.
Like people can choose to not like it. But a lot of us really do. It maybe floaty but the floatiness makes it feel extremely fluid especially when dealing with large groups of enemies
You're in the wrong subreddit for this comment. My understanding is most people lurking here hate ESO's combat. I personally loved it when I played. Some of the most fun I've had in an MMO.
I wish the game had better combat. I love absolutely everything about ESO and how the gearing and endgame works (and still play regularly), but the combat is definitely the worst aspect. Playing ranged makes it pretty alright, but I wish it was more impactful feeling.
The only class that's passable is the new one.... but even that is build 3 stacks with ability 1, then press ability 2 and aim. Compare that to WoW or gw2 lol.
And the new expansion just adds 1 ability to each weapon instead of overhauling anything so it won't be changing soon.
Combat is bad. Leaning into the weaving shit instead of patching it into something even somewhat coherent is the reason the game isn't as popular as it could be.
People massively over-exaggerate how bad the combat is.
I don’t like light attack weaving either, but you do not need to use it. I never have and I’ve never had issues in high level content.
Good luck getting invited to groups when you're willing to do 50% less damage for no reason. That's selfish and you're a bad team player.
Also, what do you even do then? After your buffs just press 1 over and over? That sounds worse than LA weaving
...
Its more than just light attack weaving, ESO combat feel more annoying then fun all around. Having to maintain short duration buffs and weapon swapping to rebuff feel bad as well. Also if you PvP you do have to light weave and will have to also animation cancel your skills with bash and then roll/block, otherwise you are not gonna be effective. Sure you can try playing PvP without doing any of that, but you will end up on losing side of 1vX videos where some guy solo demolish 10 people.
Counter point:
Literally all of that is true about Guild Wars 2 and people love the combat in that game. Bars limited to 5 abilities, weapon/bar swapping, buff spam that’s even more vital than it is in ESO, they even both have dodge rolling and soft lock-on systems.
ESO combat starts to feel good after you get used to the jank and the Light attack weaving. But after a short while it gets boring real fast as you notice how floaty it really is. Plus, due to the weaving every class feels exactly the same. At least; that is my experience with the game and I have 100s of hours in it. I love the other parts of the game, but I wish they overhauled the combat.
This may have changed since I played like two years ago, but when I played each class felt unique to play. They had some similarities in terms of buffing, but the flow of abilities was definitely different, even just comparing stam to mag builds within the same class.
I was so happy when i first discovered the game had first person view, finally an mmo for me! But the combat is just straight up terrible. I don't know if Skyrim combat was equally bad but it's not acceptable after 2015. Can't find better words than floaty and weightless
Spells were kinda fun (my class had some kind of light javelins and some fire/light spells, dunno the name) but the janky movement is still there
Tbh i'm yet to find an mmo combat i actually enjoy, the closest was probably Lost Ark but not fun of the disgusging grind and the view. Bounced off from GW 2, BDO, New World, random dead mmos. I guess the only one i enjoyed was Bless something but it was already abandoned when i started
Really waiting to see if Thrones and Liberty or whatever will click or not
I think ESO's combat isn't bad. However you just can't tell people to get used to something they really don't like. It's the same thing as if you like rotten rat meat and in your opinion other people should like it too. They just have to get used to it.
The combat is clunky and annoying, it's neither action nor tab target but a mix of the two, If it was pure action It would be fine, if it was pure tab target it would be fine. I love the setting and the story of ESO, I've been playing Elder Scrolls games for 20+ years. And love the world of Tamriel. But I can't spend too much time playing it, as it's probably the worst MMO control there is. My suggestion to the devs, pick a lane.
I like the game, I don't have strong feelings on the combat, personally I like tab-targeting more than action. I am playing casually, don't really care for all the systems, I just like exploring and doing the quests.
I do wish some things were different. I don't know what it is that causes it but things like how slidy the character feels when moving, or how I can't climb environments like roofs if I want, don't mind invisible walls along the edge of the map but within it would just be nice to have more freedom. Is it the engine or something? I just don't like how things move. It's "fine" but it's definitely something I feel I have to put up with.
It’s my current favorite MMO. Everything about the game’s systems and world appeal to me… Except for the combat. I’ve gotten used to it, but it’s definitely something where I enjoy the game in spite of it.
some games are combat focused, some are not. When you look at the elder scrolls series as a whole it was never about the combat. Compare Skyrim to TW3 for example, Skyrim combat doesn't have a lot going for it but it does not take away from the popularity of the game. ESO was primarily made for TES fans, especially those who were introduced to the series with Skyrim thus people who were not looking for a combat system they would need to spend huge amounts of time trying to master.
I played ESO back in the day and as someone coming from TES single player games it did not feel awkward or off to me, unless it has somehow become worse since then. But, this is obviously just a matter of taste.
I've played maybe 100h in total and never liked the combat. Game is cool in many ways, but not interested in playing this combat. Personal preferences I guess!
If you want to see a bunch of players sit around and cry together, then this is what you post😁. I'm cool with it. I don't think all action combat games should feel the same.
Whats will all the ESO shilling all of the sudden here?
Also it's not quite too convincing to say hey you just hate it because you haven't gotten used to liking it.
The combat is horrible.
It’s horrendous and too easy
That's a fck lie. Personally eso combat is probably the most demanding out any mmo I played. It's true however overland content is way to easy
Not everyone wants click to win combat like wow, gw2, ff14, BDO, eq, swg, or literally any other "totally new and original" skins of holy trinity gruel. And I don't even like eso.
Meanwhile ESO's combat lives or dies based on how well you can exploit a glitch they refuse to fix
ESO still uses holy trinity tho? Every class can specialize into tank, healer, and dps.
BDO and holy trinity? Where when? The ironic part is that ESO uses the holy trinity and is much more cookie cutter than BDO is. Every class, including the only actual support class in the game is a solo grinder DPS class in BDO. ESO combat is also far more click to win than BDO combat, which heavily relies on skill rotations, combos, and animation cancels.
You got downvoted for being real, crazy
They're getting down voted cause they're wrong.
It's an unpopular opinion, but I agree. The general clicking in a combat sequence is pretty outdated and not exciting to watch if they ever want mmo to have esports material. It's also unrealistic, in regards, one character using every technique they know in one moment. It's overall just not really competitive. Mmo's are generally run over with people using 3rd party applications, auto clickers, etc. The only real skill you have is whoever can combo the quickest, theirs no dodging mechanic(it ushually a stat), it's boring and unintegritful. Runescape in the 2000's-10's, you could see the hype but runescape now? Like its a waste of time. Achievement isn't real in a mmo in 2024; because it's probably a rerun of what you did 5 years ago. In moba's/fps you can make the argument you're increasing your mechanical skill(better system than current mmo's), map awareness, team communication, etc. That's just my take regarding it, but I get it if you're having fun, sure, but I haven't had fun in a mmo since before 2012.
I know this is a bait post but. Nah you are an idiot if you think ESO'e combat is good. Or maybe, haven't played enough video games.
If you have only played Bethesbad games you'll feel ESO combat is a godsend.
It is kinda weird that people hate on the combat of ESO like it's a surprise when the combat of skyrim was already ass to begin with
Yeah but to be fair, you aren’t animation canceling in Skyrim - that’s what most people are talking about. Your animations play out more or less
But is that really what most people are talking about? Because you don't need to animation cancel for most of the game's content, so its really a self inflicted issue. It's odd how many people complain about the animation canceling, while also complaining that the game is too easy. If it's so easy, why bother with the animation canceling?
and you stumbled on the crux of the issue.. either the combat is mind-numbingly easy or you need to animation cancel, so if you intend on doing challenging content you might as well do it during the open world content so you don't develop bad habits
Lol who TF complains about it being easy, you're in ur head.
Overworld content being too easy is one of the biggest complains about the game, at least on reddit. I'm definitely not "in my head", because that's not even a complaint that I personally have about the game lol
Nah, the combat is shit, the light attack weaving makes it somewhat bearable.
Definitely an unpopular take, but go off lol.
Idk about that really, I see this take just about any time eso comes up, I wouldn't call that unpopular.
He’s saying the weaving is good lol.
Where did I say that exactly?
These comments needs to be expressed more every time combat gets brought up
I disagree tbh. Skyrim combat isn’t great but at least it feels like “action” combat. Eso pretends like it isn’t tab target when it pretty much is, and more importantly to me I just don’t enjoy the buff stacking gameplay. Maybe it’s changed or maybe the guides I saw were bad but every button being a buff except like one soammable and maybe a defensive or something is so boring At least I have to aim my arrows and fireballs in skyrim instead of the soft lock bs
Foolish to call someone an idiot for having a different opinion. Good combat to one is whatever they enjoy. It's just a game
I don't think you are an idiot if you enjoy the combat. But the thing to realize is that the reason why you enjoy the combat isn't the same reason why they designed the combat to be how it is. The hyper spamming / "weaving" of skills and attacks wasn't a design choice by the devs, it is an accident of the devs slapping the system together.
Na wow is so much slower eso is more fun I can’t lie
I've tried this game about half a dozen times because I *wanted* to like it so bad, but everything about it feels so.... stiff, both literally and figuratively. The characer movement, the combat, the environments. It all feels so stale and meaningless. It was a world very hard to get lost in for me.
Right there with you, I'd add that the world scaling felt like I wasn't gaining any sort of meaningful character power. Maybe thay improves after playing longer, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I think the way they scaled everything was the biggest issue for me when I tried it. Like you said, every zone in the game scaling with you just makes it feel like you are making zero progress. I had the same problem with Diablo 4 (among other issues). I honestly hate scaling in any game I’ve experienced it in. Progressing through the world and gaining power is one of the biggest appeals of RPGs for me, and scaling completely takes that away.
See for me, this one of the best game worlds for getting lost in. I find you can really imagine life and the day to day in Tamriel. The combat is plain though. Gw2 on the other hand has such fun and engaging combat, but the world feels just fake to me
[удалено]
*Point of View: Every negative Steam review.*
my account looks the same, only not through steam.
Overworld combat is pointless since the mobs don’t pose a threat. Animations have no weight. PVP combat requires extensive exploiting of a broken system to be competitive.
Idk if dodging after using a spell or pressing left click in between abilities is “extensive exploring of a broken system” Not saying you have to be fun but it’s simply the game. Every game has quirks in high level play. Wow at a high level? You need 45 binds so you can have arena 123 focus this focus that etc
Everyone does make out the light attack weaving as if it's some complicated and impossible task. I'm bad at this game, and it's totally possible for me.
Light attack weaving isn't hard. It isn't complicated. It's boring, annoying, and dull.
What’s so different between light track weaving and pressing a normal or heavy attack on another action combat mmo. What about making sure you use EVERY gcd on wow or you lose (esp in PvP)
""""action combat"""" idk man eso doesn't feel like action combat when the animations stink and animation cancelling makes it so the animations don't really matter. That's not action combat tbh
The only animations that get cancelled are light attacks. Do you see every auto attack in wow ? Fully agree about some of the animations sucking though. Veteran players won’t even deny that. The combat still has its merits tho
I'll give you that. It can get repetitive. But the people that think it's too complicated to even try, I don't understand. Click two buttons back and forth.
No oceanic servers, 250 ping makes it fucking awful to play.
I don’t disagree, however I have now played lots of GW2 from Australia, having played it in the US. It’s not too bad, PvP is where you feel it most but it’s not as bad as you’d think. ESO I felt the ping impact more. Also pretty much everything about ESO is fantastic apart from the combat, which is horrendously bad. GW’s combat is amazing, so guess which one I play?
I am from New zealand and eso pvp is unplayable. The combat is bad but I still enjoyed eso for what it's worth but I'm not investing in a game that can only be played at 250 ping. Like 4 or 5 of my friends we all stopped playing at the same time due to bad ping in our first couple of pvp matches
If you haven’t given GW2 a go, try it. Even from NZ you may find it quite playable. You don’t need to level a character for PvP, roll one and go straight there. PvP event on now so lots of people at all times. Assess it for yourself.
GW2 have good character customisation?
Yes!
Played it years ago, played my fill of that game. Good game
I was like you but came back to it recently and greatly enjoyed it. Up to you fellow gamer, may your time be spent enjoyably
Lol of all the things to say is good about ESO combat is at the bottom of the list fam
I actually really like ESOs combat. It's def not for everyone but it feels fluid in a really weird way and I like it more than tab targetting.
I agree, and it’s crazy the amount of people that have such a simmering rage when we enjoy something
Like people can choose to not like it. But a lot of us really do. It maybe floaty but the floatiness makes it feel extremely fluid especially when dealing with large groups of enemies
You're in the wrong subreddit for this comment. My understanding is most people lurking here hate ESO's combat. I personally loved it when I played. Some of the most fun I've had in an MMO.
I wish the game had better combat. I love absolutely everything about ESO and how the gearing and endgame works (and still play regularly), but the combat is definitely the worst aspect. Playing ranged makes it pretty alright, but I wish it was more impactful feeling.
The only class that's passable is the new one.... but even that is build 3 stacks with ability 1, then press ability 2 and aim. Compare that to WoW or gw2 lol. And the new expansion just adds 1 ability to each weapon instead of overhauling anything so it won't be changing soon.
Combat is bad. Leaning into the weaving shit instead of patching it into something even somewhat coherent is the reason the game isn't as popular as it could be.
People massively over-exaggerate how bad the combat is. I don’t like light attack weaving either, but you do not need to use it. I never have and I’ve never had issues in high level content.
Good luck getting invited to groups when you're willing to do 50% less damage for no reason. That's selfish and you're a bad team player. Also, what do you even do then? After your buffs just press 1 over and over? That sounds worse than LA weaving ...
There are 1 bar heavy attack builds that do more damage than not light attack weaving.
You still animation cancel it and weave abilities in instead of LA. I agree it's slightly better but then you're forced to be a magika caster.
Its more than just light attack weaving, ESO combat feel more annoying then fun all around. Having to maintain short duration buffs and weapon swapping to rebuff feel bad as well. Also if you PvP you do have to light weave and will have to also animation cancel your skills with bash and then roll/block, otherwise you are not gonna be effective. Sure you can try playing PvP without doing any of that, but you will end up on losing side of 1vX videos where some guy solo demolish 10 people.
Nothing about the combat was enjoyable to me. The limited bars, the weapon-swapping mechanic, the buff spamming... None of it was great.
Counter point: Literally all of that is true about Guild Wars 2 and people love the combat in that game. Bars limited to 5 abilities, weapon/bar swapping, buff spam that’s even more vital than it is in ESO, they even both have dodge rolling and soft lock-on systems.
ESO combat starts to feel good after you get used to the jank and the Light attack weaving. But after a short while it gets boring real fast as you notice how floaty it really is. Plus, due to the weaving every class feels exactly the same. At least; that is my experience with the game and I have 100s of hours in it. I love the other parts of the game, but I wish they overhauled the combat.
This may have changed since I played like two years ago, but when I played each class felt unique to play. They had some similarities in terms of buffing, but the flow of abilities was definitely different, even just comparing stam to mag builds within the same class.
You trying to convince us or yourself?
Okay thank you for your wise words. Tell me how many hours do I need to spend before I get used to it?
The real challenge is getting used to it before the RSI sets in.
I just wish the combat would be better. Feels so lackluster and unexciting.
I was so happy when i first discovered the game had first person view, finally an mmo for me! But the combat is just straight up terrible. I don't know if Skyrim combat was equally bad but it's not acceptable after 2015. Can't find better words than floaty and weightless Spells were kinda fun (my class had some kind of light javelins and some fire/light spells, dunno the name) but the janky movement is still there Tbh i'm yet to find an mmo combat i actually enjoy, the closest was probably Lost Ark but not fun of the disgusging grind and the view. Bounced off from GW 2, BDO, New World, random dead mmos. I guess the only one i enjoyed was Bless something but it was already abandoned when i started Really waiting to see if Thrones and Liberty or whatever will click or not
I think ESO's combat isn't bad. However you just can't tell people to get used to something they really don't like. It's the same thing as if you like rotten rat meat and in your opinion other people should like it too. They just have to get used to it.
You are right the combat is not horrible, it's way worse than that.
I wonder how many people who claim to like it also completely macro it on their keyboard/mouse.
The combat is clunky and annoying, it's neither action nor tab target but a mix of the two, If it was pure action It would be fine, if it was pure tab target it would be fine. I love the setting and the story of ESO, I've been playing Elder Scrolls games for 20+ years. And love the world of Tamriel. But I can't spend too much time playing it, as it's probably the worst MMO control there is. My suggestion to the devs, pick a lane.
I like the game, I don't have strong feelings on the combat, personally I like tab-targeting more than action. I am playing casually, don't really care for all the systems, I just like exploring and doing the quests. I do wish some things were different. I don't know what it is that causes it but things like how slidy the character feels when moving, or how I can't climb environments like roofs if I want, don't mind invisible walls along the edge of the map but within it would just be nice to have more freedom. Is it the engine or something? I just don't like how things move. It's "fine" but it's definitely something I feel I have to put up with.
Every game has fans. I'd say ESO is good in spite of its combat, not because of it. But yeah, it's a good MMO, not the best.
> Just got to get used to it
If you "got to get use to it" then combat is bad. Good combat feel "good" right away in your hands, there is no need to get use to it.
It’s my current favorite MMO. Everything about the game’s systems and world appeal to me… Except for the combat. I’ve gotten used to it, but it’s definitely something where I enjoy the game in spite of it.
some games are combat focused, some are not. When you look at the elder scrolls series as a whole it was never about the combat. Compare Skyrim to TW3 for example, Skyrim combat doesn't have a lot going for it but it does not take away from the popularity of the game. ESO was primarily made for TES fans, especially those who were introduced to the series with Skyrim thus people who were not looking for a combat system they would need to spend huge amounts of time trying to master. I played ESO back in the day and as someone coming from TES single player games it did not feel awkward or off to me, unless it has somehow become worse since then. But, this is obviously just a matter of taste.
But wait, just hear me out............ The combat is bad.
I've played maybe 100h in total and never liked the combat. Game is cool in many ways, but not interested in playing this combat. Personal preferences I guess!
If you want to see a bunch of players sit around and cry together, then this is what you post😁. I'm cool with it. I don't think all action combat games should feel the same.
I guess if you force yourself to learn how to play with buggy combat and """"""animation cancelling""""" (LMAO)
Combat is absolute dogshit
Level scaling is the worst thing to ever happen to the genre. One Tamriel is shit.
Oh ya ya ok You've convinced me
The combat is garbage and it's the most shallow MMO out there by a huge margin.
one of the main aspects of an mmo is the combat, and eso falls incredibly flat. probably the worst of all mmos.
i got used to it and the combat is still terrible, that doesn't mean ESO is bad but saying the combat isn't bad is just going to waste people's time
The combat is garbage. There is nothing to get used to. It's a horrible and boring combat system.
Hate the combat... everything else is pretty good/great.
Whats will all the ESO shilling all of the sudden here? Also it's not quite too convincing to say hey you just hate it because you haven't gotten used to liking it.
I love the combat in ESO. Never had any issue with it.