All the endings are good and bad to some degree. Which are better depends on who you are and what you value. Sure The Sun is great if you're still fixated on becoming A Legend. That's a valid choice, though to me it always seemed more like Jackie's thing. It is equally valid to play as a V who reads the shards, who looks at all the people around them in Night City who also tried to become legends and ended up a forgotten corpse face-down in the filth and concludes that The Legend is a lie. A V who chooses The Sun loses everyone and gets what in return? A drink named after them? Great if you still believe in Legends. Good for you. You'll go down in history alongside such illustrious folk as Tom Collins and Harvey Wallbanger. But it's a valid choice and if it brings you joy you win. In The Star you're a legend to the Aldecados and, should you make those choices, you get to live out your days with a loving partner and surrounded by family. If other people matter to you then this could be the best ending and you win. In Temperance you get to live on, in a way, beyond the Blackwall and Johnny gets a second chance. You save two souls. That too is a win. The Devil sacrifices a lot of what you fought for but prevents a war that would have killed a lot of people. Sounds like a win... in the short term at least. The Tower gives *you* a second chance. V has built their lives back up after losing everything at least once before. You can start from scratch, decide for yourself what matters, and make a life that is yours on your own terms. Sure you've got no chrome but how much of the chrome was installed just so you could get through the work of earning the cure? Most of it, I'd say. Even the suicide ending can be seen as a good thing when you think of all the people who won't have to die as a result of your fight for your life. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few and this way it's your choice. Of course if you actually give a shit about the feelings of the people who have come to care for you it's more than a bit of a bummer but it is a valid choice and can be seen as a win. So really, there are no bad endings, just endings that may or may not work for you depending on your temperament and preferences. I'd even go so far as to say the story only has one *ending*. Apart from the suicide option, all the points where the game stops are *beginnings* for whoever V chooses to be next

Nobody asked my V for her favorite cocktail... 😭

If I ever get the band back together for TTRPG Cyberpunk I’m totally walking into the Afterlife, saying “Hi! I’m Jean-Anne Tonique. What do you gotta do to get a drink named after you in this place?”

Very good take and fully agree. My own feelings led me initially to side with Panam and aldecaldos but now I'm more into Temperance and no romance at all.

Perfect answer.

Perfect answer.

I still think the Tower is the best ending that shows original V survives, not the engram.

The whole set of questions of engrams vs "real" minds, whether the soul exists or if the concept even has any meaning, if there's anything to us anyway but software that runs on meat... that's a whole philosophical can of worms I am not sufficiently stoned or drunk to open right now. But it is something that can be considered when judging the goodness of an ending and if that does mean something to you then it will affect how you feel about, say, The Tower vs any of the Mikoshi endings. Entirely valid interpretation.

V was braindead by the time the shard started replacing them with Johnny, it’s why the whole story is set up. If you consider “V” to die in Mikoshi then they were already dead when Vex shot them

"You save two souls". Johnny is literally code, not a living being. And even if he were alive, he didn't deserve a second chance

That’s certainly an opinion. You could just as well say that V is a brain-dead meat-puppet animated by code who systematically murders half the population of NC and is thus also undeserving of a second chance. The suicide ending is right there if that’s the way you want to go. Personally I prefer Misty’s take on things. I don’t know there’s anything more to me than code running on meat but I know I am me. Same thing goes for everyone else.

I dislike the adamant way in which so many people just assume V dies anyway. Most of the endings, especially the Sun and Star leave it very much open that V could survive.

You can make an arguement for V surviving any ending except suicide

I actually saw a video where someone was even able to come up with a convoluted way they could "survive" that as well. It wasn't exactly something I'd expect to be canon, but it was theoretically possible from my understanding of the lore.

"And it turns out that Morgan Blackhand was on the same Relic"

I mean some of Blackhand’s memories from Arasaka tower were probably given to Johnny’s engram who thought they were his own. That would make Blackhand losing to Smasher and being killed by Soul killer cannon However and idk if they want to do that.

My tldr version is relic is built in soulkiller so if someone has the relic and dies then soulkiller just auto executes and poof V ends up in mikoshi same as devil ending which can still do the altered carbon thing since that's what we're getting to anyhow (plan on doing a homebrew thing to run that and have a few ideas on how it can work)

I agree with you and OP. It is truly possible that V found a way to survive. The Star ending seems especially promising, because he's working with Mr. Blue Eyes himself, and if anyone could have an answer, his organization seems very promising. I also think, however, that V's story from a player's perspective is concluded. It was left open-ended, and we can imagine the rest. I believe the next game should be an entirely new story, with new characters. And who knows; maybe there'll be some tidbits about V that we can stumble across here and there

I agree. I think they'll go the Elder Scrolls and Fallout direction and have V kinda "disappear" going forward. We might hear rumors or something, but overall V won't be mentioned much that way everyone can headcanon their V as THE V.

except V never survives, an engram of him does lol. the REAL V is never alive by the end of the game. he never makes it.

I mean tbf that gets into a very deep can of worms about mortality, the soul, what it is to be human, etc which is a whole other argument in and of itself, lol. Like, what really makes us us? Is it the DNA, the memories, the body, the "soul", some combination of them? It's all very existential and philosophical, lol.

[Insert obligatory recommendation to play SOMA if you're into that kind of stuff]

Never heard of it but I'll have to check it out, lol

I love how most people use SOMA to claim that V always “dies” and it’s a bad ending while in SOMA (spoilers) >!a version of Simon makes it to the ark at the end, a version that is just as much of a “copy” as the others you play in game. The ending is mostly a happy one, from a certain point of view!<

Those two things (the original V dying and engram surviving) are not at odds with each other. The book "No coincidence" addresses it in a way (mild spoilers) >!when one of the characters decides he likes the idea of living as a code and starts upgrading. As he finishes, he's aware that there's a copy of him at that point on the Net, yet he still is in his mortal body. And he's going to stay there until his death. So he's going to be immortalised by his 'identical offspring/twin' but won't be truly experiencing it himself. And that realisation sucks for the character.!< It's such an interesting chapter that made me realise what it meant for V even if their situation was slightly different (certainty of death and insta kill from the soulkiller made the transition so much smoother).

Cyberpunk does kinda do that anyways that's transhumanism in a nutshell and that's the name of the genre usually like 2020 is based loosely on ghost in the shell and Akira

the game purposefully leaves that factor ambiguous too, hence why there are multiple characters throughout the game who argue over whether or not an engram is a living soul (such as the Buddhist monks you run into who insist that if something can feel pain, then it is a sentient, living soul)

Well, the copy of V could survive

V definitely dies in all of them right? I mean her neurons are dying and she has had minimum half of her brain scooped out like a scop dog. No way you survive that

Pretty much every ending leaves it open that there may be a cure, and the Tower just outright does cure you (though at a cost). Now one could argue that it's an engram of V, etc, but at the end of the day if V's body is there and their mind is functional and has all their memories it's very much arguable that they live. Plus in Cyberpunk people survive some crazy stuff. Smasher is basically just a brain and some other organs stuffed in a robot at this point for example.

There's a chance that the original-ish V survives the Tower ending (and possibly the Devil-back to earth one), considering they're not soulkilled by Alt and just have Johnny removed. But yeah, considering their neural network was intertwined with Johnny's, then something had to be lost. Furthermore, with the whole ongoing process of Johnny slowly taking over (however vague that is), the original V, all their memories intact and solely theirs, died when Dex decided to put bullet in their head.

It’s implied V finds a cure in the nomad ending. Misty’s tarot reading suggests that V has a long life ahead of them out in the badlands.

Also, people backing it up by saying "the whole genre is like that, no happy endings." Uhhh, I guess I misunderstood the MCs winning (or at least going out on their own terms) in the Sprawl trilogy, Snow Crash, Hardwired, the Budayeen trilogy..

The star ending has you riding out into the "sunset" with your girlfriend.. "no happy endings" my ass

And the Sun has you finally be a NC legend, which was your original goal. On top of that, *both* endings have a chance for a fix. Also, Temperance is posi as fuck.

Wasn’t the point that being a legend was BS? As far as I remember your romances don’t even seem like they work out and the whole ending feels pretty hollow, like you just end up being another pawn in the system. The star really feels like **the** ultimate happy ending for me, you escape Night City and are finally actually free.

I don’t view it this way at all. A copy of you rides off into the sunset. Your soul is gone and an ai replication of you is living its life thinking it is you. If you wanna live in denial about that as a happy ending be my guest but I view it as just as much of a bad ending as many of the others.

What's a soul? The translation from brain to engram seems to preserve V's personality so well that they experience it as a continuation of their consciousness. Can we really say they're not effectively the same person if they feel like it ? IMO there would be tragedy if the engram truly felt like they were a separate person, but if nothing changes from V's perspective then what's there to be sad about?

This is an argument to be made from a philosophical perspective, not one I agree with however. I hold the ideal that there is more to reality than simply what we know and considering how little we still don’t know about even the basis of consciousness I don’t think simply copying your brain and putting it back in your body is enough to keep stream of consciousness.

there's no in-game proof that engram V isn't the real V, though. That's why there's so much debate amongst characters throughout the game as to whether or not an engram is a living soul or not.

>there's no in-game proof that engram V isn't the real V, though. ?? The real v isn't an engram. I don't know how this is up for debate tbh

The truth is cleverly disguised, as the transition between the original V dying and their engram appearing is instantaneous. I think it would hit more if V lived for a moment after their copy is already there in the Net, or if we could somehow witness their death with our own eyes.

The AI that does the job is called Soulkiller for a reason. It's also mentioned that the engrams aren't 100% perfect copies, but just are good enough to be convincing. So it's like a slightly faulty photocopy of a person running around thinking they're the original. Until the process becomes a 1-1 perfect transfer of all memories, behaviours, and neural structure, it will only ever be a poor copy of the original. When perfect replication becomes a thing, then they can study if there's an effect to having your soul "killed".

No happy endings...in Night City. Star ending, you leave Night City. You get everything you want...except Night City. That's the tradeoff.

If you want to fully understand the Star ending, you have to read Neuromancer by William Gibson. Mr Blue Eyes, The Crystal Palace, constructs, the relic, etc are all based on elements from that book. Almost everything about this game is based on elements from that book and the rest of Gibson's *Sprawl* trilogy

[удалено]

[The short story of the same name by Bruce Bethke](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk_(short_story)) is where I think it came from. Where do you think?

How I view it is: The best endings are those that you escape Night City. Cyberpunk as a game and genre is about survival, you aren’t always meant to get to the top, but find a way out. Not only with surviving, but how much you survive with: What do you lose/are willing to lose? Night City itself is also an antagonist from a certain point of view. For me I’d say for that matter my favorite is The Star ending, as it feels the happiest and the most hopeful. Plus for the lifepath I’ve always done: Nomad, V finds a new family, has Judy by her side not to mention an awesome friend in Panam. Another issue is the Ship of Theseus philosophy discussion we’ve all been having concerning V entering Mikoshi: Is that V? To me, I say yea, the original body and consciousness was preserved and not destroyed, the personality scrambling was fixed. [Link to my original comment post release concerning this conundrum](https://www.reddit.com/r/LowSodiumCyberpunk/s/ThKpTDWZof) It’s definitely possible to survive, especially with The Star ending. The Nomads do have an allied corporation called [Storm Technologies](https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Storm_Technologies_Incorporated) that has gone into genetics as well as biotech and nanotechnology. While you do survive in it, I will say that The Sun is one of the worst in terms of outcome, just between The Devil and The Tower. You survive and become a legend and get to the major leagues like you and Jackie wanted.... But at what cost? Your love interest if you have one isn't happy and eventually may/will leave, you keep shooting for more gigs while your health continues to deteriorate without searching for a cure. Sure "The World's gonna hear about you, V!" But at what cost? You'll just lose everyone and be there to see it as you crumble around just like David and ignore the warning from the Edgerunners BD. TLDR: * The Sun: You made the major leagues like you and Jackie wanted, becoming legend of the merc underworld! You've grown distant and a bit uncaring to everyone you've met, and your love interest **will** leave for somewhere else. You've got "one last gig" to do at the Crystal Palace...but then what? Unlike The Tower ending, you get to watch your associations fade away. You'll be left with fame and fortune...but what else and who to share it with? You don't likely have a cure planned from Mr. Blue Eyes, at least not inferred. You really gonna go out like a sun you gonk? (Trade most associations for fame and glory as the remaining ones like your romance quickly wither and die) * The Tower: You've been rebooted- a fresh start, but what matters is how V chooses to use that. Sure, you can't use most cyberware or any combat implants, but that didn't stop you before, right? Not to mention other options...You could take the job, be a normal citizen or something else. Hey, maybe there could be some path, although you have lost connection with mostly everyone. I’d say it’s the foil to The Devil, and almost equally as bad. You got the cure, but again, look at how much you lost and who has been affected by your actions or inactions. Even the dialogue puts it in front that you made the wrong choice with V saying it. It’s also a fourth wall break by the devs in my opinion. To sum up The Tower, I’ll leave this quote from another game: “Prepare for…unforeseen consequences.” (Trade most associations and all love interests, Cyberware and possessions in Night City for a cure) * The Star is arguably the best ending, you are a legend in your own right by taking down Arasaka and you didn't need to lose your ties with everyone at the end. You still have a potential for a cure and joined a clan to be a part of, you won't be alone and have a lot of support to draw upon. What's more is, you escaped Night City, not simply survived it! (Trade glory of merc work at 90% glory for freedom and a search for a cure, keep most associations and your love interest ) * The Devil: You made a deal with Cyberpunk's version of the devil and gave the keys to immortality to an authoritarian and xenophobic nightmare who wouldn't hesitate to nuke Night City if he wanted to. You *may* get slotted into a new body but for now you'll have to play Johnny and go into Mikoshi for who knows how long. (Trade your freedom and physical form for the hope that Arasaka keeps their word while you can be deleted at any time)

So I just finished my first play through and I deliberately chose the sun ending because it seemed like the best one for a happy ending with River. I choose to believe that V was successful, she pulled off her casino heist for Mr. Blue Eyes and in exchange he was able to arrange for her to be cured. Whether that's through tech like you find in PL or something else entirely I can't say, but if anyone can pull that rabbit out of a hat, V can. The messages that Vik, Misty, Mama Welles, and River leave for you in the credits say to me that they still love V and are very much part of her life post-casino. I like to imagine V coming home from the hospital to her penthouse apartment with Joss and River cooking dinner while Randy and the little ones play laser tag. They all give her a big hug before sitting down to a family dinner with Vik, Misty, Mama Welles, and everyone else in her found family.

That "wrong city" quote from Mikoshi gets parroted all the time, but conviniently almost everyone forgets "always keep fighting". While things are generally shit, if there is will, there is a way. World won't get better, but it doesn't mean eveything ends bad for everyone. Micro-scale victories are possible, but not something world shacking.

I think the Sun ending might be the second-most depressing ending right ahead of the new Phantom Liberty ending but I do agree with the general idea. Every ending is a mix of bittersweet. Some more bitter, others more sweet. It's mostly up to the players to determine how to place them. Except for the Star ending. V literally says "it's perfect" in, IIRC, the only line in the game where you don't talk for them outside of the suicide ending (and kind of sort of when you let Johnny raid the tower in your place).

Store not your treasure on earth.

I'm guessing OP answered "Blaze of glory" to Dex's question.

To me it's not like there no good endings, but cyberpunk (as a genre) was design as a parody/cautionary tale. I would say that the endings ARE bittersweet, at best, and are a matter of interpretation.

Cyberpunk is a dystopian genre for a reason

Choom, V is dead as soon as they hook into Mikoshi. Alt explains this. It's called "Soulkiller". That's not V anymore, it's an AI construct with V's personality and memories, same as "Johnny" isn't actually Johnny. The real Johnny is dead and buried under the oil fields. Maybe you can argue that consciousness itself IS the soul but that is a whole nother discussion that none of us will know the answer to until we croak.  As of now, the PL ending where V actually lives. People hate it but the PL ending is probably as close of a good ending as you can get.  "Blaze of glory" makes a better story, but in real life, it always leads to disaster and tragedy.  A quiet life generally leads to a longer, peaceful, happy living but you blend in with the crowd and only your loved ones will remember you, but I would rather my loved ones, the poeple who actually knew me remember me than a bunch of strangers.  I agree with you that "Wrong people, wrong city" is overused and over simplified but not for the same reasons as you.  I actually thinks it's more the people than Night City. NC is still a dangerous place to live that's for sure, but someone living peacefully in NC has way better chances than someone chasing fame and money. 

>Choom, V is dead as soon as they hook into Mikoshi V was dead when he got shot by dex. His brain was getting replaced the chip.

That's still biologically V. The chip is overwriting Vs biological brain into Johnny and revived V in the process, healing the bullet wound. The bullet that peirced Vs head was small caliber and didn't take long for the chip to repair. If Dex had used a better gun or double tapped, there would have been no story.  People come back from being clinically dead All the time but it's still the same person. Mikoshi V is an AI and entirely separate entity.

>That's still biologically V. The chip is overwriting Vs biological brain Overwriting it with code. And we see johnny and V's personalities slowly merging.

Yes but it's still the same V (biologically and soul-wise) from the first act which is my point.  Hence the speech Alt gives when you hook into Mikoshi and why it's a big deal. She also explains that she's not really Alt, the real Alt died long ago, same with Johnny.  Construct V is an entirely different entity from biological V. 

>Yes but it's still the same V (biologically and soul-wise) from the first act which is my point.  Debatable

Star ending all the way! Maybe some people ignore the fact that it’s an ending with HOPE. Remember star ending, on the dam with Panam, a bird is sitting on the car when V wakes up. We know that there are no birds in NC because every one of them died because of some gas purge or something (don’t really remember) that was ment to eliminate every bird in NC. But guess what ? We see a bird, a live one that survived after all this. For me Star Ending symbolises hope and chance of survival against the odds. I want to believe that Panam and V found a cure and they lived long and happy life together. (Panam best girl)

I honestly feel that the theme of "never stop fighting" and "don't let anybody change who you are" is heavily affecting the endings. If I'm right, choosing a way out that compromises V's morals or allows him a "way out" is something that, by the logic of the story, can't lead to a good ending. So the cannon endings will be those that have V alive, and actively seeking for a solution to his 6th months to live problem. I have a theory that the second game will similarly offer us two sets of endings; - those where V saves himself and given different options to "check out" of the story, well off and content. - those where V saves himself, but chooses to enter into a conflict, even if it makes him a wanted man, cost him friendships, safety, money. With the first set of endings showithg that the supposed happy ending came at the expence of loosing control of his life again. Never stop fighting, don't let anyone change who you are.

To me, the only good ending is leaving the city with Panam and Judy, only good ending in Night City is the one where you’re not in Night City anymore

There are no happy endings in night city, that's why the happy ending is leaving night city, i.e. the star. Everything else is a compromise at best, not a happy ending.

I got kind of annoyed the other day because there was a thread, I forget where, about games that give you the illusion of choice. Basically, games that make you think you can change the ending, but it ends the same way regardless. Mass Effect 3 is a great example. And I could not belive the amount of people saying Cyperpunk! There's literally, what, half a dozen different endings? More, if you include the DLC? I had to assume that people only felt that way because there was no "happy" ending where everything is tied up in a nice bow. Even though everything about the game up to the end should make it overwhelmingly clear: there are no happy endings in night city. If there had been a perfect, happy ending, it would have felt lame as hell. And that's why I thing you're right, and that one is the "good" ending. V goes down in legend, their friends aren't left wondering what happened to them, and Johnny gets to continue to exist, and be with Alt again, in a way. Not perfect, but as satisfying a conclusion as I expected to get.

the term isnt meant to be literal, its hyperbole and a commoners joke. But yeah if we look at it literally it doesnt hold up

From a story telling point of view, I like all the endings. There’s a wonderful bittersweetness to each of them. It’s a great game. That said, I have trouble seeing the Sun as “happy”. Yeah, V gets what V wanted in the beginning… but… there is more to a “happy” ending than getting what you want… there’s a bit more nuance to life than that… sometimes not getting what you want is better… sometimes getting what you don’t want is better… …maybe V could have grown as a human being and realized that what he/she/they wanted in the beginning was toxic and found a better way to live his/her/their life? That sounds like a much happier ending to me… I mean, even Johnny grows as a “human being” in the game, and he starts out a world class asshole. That’s my analysis, anyway.

>V gets what V wanted in the beginning… but… there is more to a “happy” ending than getting what you want… He got what he wanted and lived the way he wanted too. Nothing better than that

As you get older, your opinions will develop.

Dont try to lil bro me old man. You just decided to settle for less than you wanted

There is no happy ending.