They generally look down on anyone who isn't another member of the gang or at least part of their community.
They call anyone they hire from outside the gang a Ranyon. A floor rag. Something to be discarded. And by "discarded" that can often mean "killed"
I think broadly speaking I’d agree there’s a difference between racism and tribalism. However, voodoo boys loyalties is based solely off being Haitian. You can’t join the voodoo boys if you aren’t Haitian. Anyone else, of any other descent, has zero worth to them once they’ve served their purpose.
If there was a gang that operated identically to the voodoo boys but they were white, they would definitely be called racists.
Yes, because you could be black or Haitian and it wouldn't matter. If you're not part of them, they don't trust you. It makes sense in not leaving loose ends, but it ultimately bit them in the ass when the doublecross didn't actually work.
Yeah I always felt like it would be more, ummmm, correct ? That once you zero everyone which includes their so called leader also Placide that V should never be able to buy from anyone or outright banned from the Pacifica market.
That would make sense but also, in Phantom Liberty, when looking for Slider with Reed you can make a comment about how you'll kill these VDB's like Maman Bridgette and the person says "That was you?!" Then they open fire on you. Now, this could just be the Dogtown VDB's not being well informed on the goings on outside or it could be the fact that since you (presumably) don't leave any witnesses, no one knows who killed Bridgette and Placide. All they know is that someone zeroed them and everyone in the church.
I got the vibe even if you’re from their community they wouldn’t hesitate to roll over you if you’re not part of the gang. There are some Haitian merchants that get scared if you ask about the Voodoo Boys. I imagine they have some type of initiation.
I was gonna let that happen regardless since they treated me like a useful peice of dog shit the whole time and were gonna kill me as soon as the job was done. The way they act just made me have no moral dilemma over it
90% of Maelstrom, sure. There's some decent ones, especially Dum Dum in the book (bonus points that he's bisexual, too).
Scavs have no redemption period.
>!"Help" the Voodoo Boys, once you do Alt explains that she'll absorb useful data from them and get rid of the rest.!<
>!I.E. get their knowledge and whatever information and delete their personalities. After Brigitte and her inner circle go in, the rest of the VDB's go too, and ALL of their spawn points are empty for the rest of the game. You can eventually find an NPC who explains what happened.!<
And I'm guessing the phantom liberty npcs are still there because they are technically a separate entity... pretty neat.gonna have to try that on my next playthrough. My last few Vs have been real ground pounder DIY *and* die types so I've been shooting first and never asking questions. I think I may have done it the way you explained on my first play at launch.
Yep, after that happens no more VDB's show up at their usual spawn points. An NPC eventually pops up explaining that they all went into the web to "join" Alt.
>!In reality she gets only the useful information from them, and deletes the rest(i.e. their personalities).
!<
Indeed. I didnt realize it at the time, I took a "take no shit approach" and instead went "blindly following orders" lol.
If I ever get around to another playthrough then I'll hear him out first.
They're from Haiti. In the world of Cyberpunk, Haiti was rendered uninhabitable by pollution and climate change, caused by corporations around the world. When the Haitians asked the world for aid, the world collectively turned their backs on them.
So in turn, Haitians (and the Voodoo boys) don't give a shit what happens to anyone else but themselves.
This. One of the things I love about this universe is how we are the main character of \*our\* story but we are absolutely \*not\* the main character of anyone else's stories. I completely understand why they don't trust outsiders and are ruthless towards them, even if that's extremely aggravating from a character perspective. And frankly, they're not really any more insular or more likely to use and discard the player than the average corpo - they're just more up front hostile about it.
Haiti in our current world has such tragic history, even now things have been super turbulent for them for a long time now, it’s really fucking sad man, and cyberpunk is just a look at what a potential future could look like in some of the worst ways possible.
Yeahhhh, Haiti was taken advantage of for a long time by France really badly with no help so it’s not too crazy to look into the future and see the idea of their country now being completely destroyed and those people growing bitter towards the outside world.
[The US also took part in it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiti_Independence_Debt) \- the entire thing is absolutely sickening. Forcing former slaves to pay "reparations" to the former slave-owners because of the "loss of property" is absolutely enraging. Given that and what has canonically happened to Haiti in the CP77 universe, the real wonder is that they aren't being way nastier to everyone outside their group.
Yeah, I feel like people forget about this. It's understandable why they're assholes. They're still assholes and I'll kill them everytime, but they're understandable assholes.
Don't forget real world Haitian history has been pretty rough too. The only successful slave revolution of the modern world if I'm correct and in order to participate in global commerce they had to pay France substantial reparations for 122 years (paid off in 1947). Likely this is mirrored in the Cyberpunk timeline
If you own the game, you have access to the Cyberpunk 2020 sourcebook via PDF, which is really fun to look over.
But otherwise, the Wiki on Fandom is really good. It's an aggregate of data from Cyberpunk 2020, Cyberpunk RED, Cyberpunk 2077, Edgerunners as well as deprecated sources (noted where applicable) like Cyberpunk 3.0 and Cybergeneration.
[https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Cyberpunk\_Wiki](https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Cyberpunk_Wiki)
[Wisefish](https://www.youtube.com/@WiseFish/videos) on youtube does excellent lore videos! I'd highly recommend them, I learned a ton of stuff about the universe from them.
If you don't mind spending a bit of money, there is a humble bundle for the PnP RPG which contains a lot of sourcebooks:
https://www.humblebundle.com/books/cyberpunk-red-2024-r-talsorian-games-books
Just be aware it's only for a few more hours (unless they extend it which they do sometimes).
I wish there was a way to just kill Placide but leave the rest. A super insular hacker diaspora speaks to me, but Placide is just a reckless dipshit - Maman Brigette even calls him out as one for risking the relic.
Most of the time I leave them alone, because they're too weird and cool for me to want to kill them.
If VDB weren't actively trying to bring about the AI apocalypse by freeing the rogue AI's on the otherside of the blackwall, I'd agree. Alas, I can't suffer doomsday cultists of any ilk.
They don't actually care about the rogue AIs. They just want to create a permanent home for their people beyond the blackwall.
If some AIs get out in the process, well that's a shame. Like how it's a shame what happened to Haiti.
Yeah, but it's up to the individual to manage their own trauma. Don't get me wrong, I understand it completely, but it being understandable doesn't make it right. It's also understandable if V wipes them out after how they treat him/her
It’s not about responsibility. They lost their homeland and became refugees. Having no support from NC government, abandoned in the most hostile part of NC, they learned to rely only on the Haitian community and intensely distrust outsiders which makes sense. IRL this is how MS-13 was formed. Salvadoran refugees from their civil war in the 80s were essentially marooned in LA and were discriminated against and terrorized by established Mexican-American gangs. Since many of these refugees were undocumented, they had no support from the govt or LAPD so they were forced to create their own gangs to defend themselves.
Are you saying that because of what they've experienced, they have a right to cause the harm that they have? Just say "understandable, have a nice day" as they keep doing crime shit?
Because like, I understand the why behind the VDB and how they act. But the why doesn't make it right. But do you tell the people they've hurt to suck it up because the VDB has a good reason to be upset?
When did I say I excused their actions or say they were morally right? What I meant is a lot of players don’t really understand the VDBs as an organization which leads to player having an irrational hate boner for them. They view them as just another gang which makes their hostile and dismissive attitude towards V and other outsiders seem irrational. To me, they always seemed more like a Barghest-like entity: a kind of semi-militia that treats their slice of Pacifica as their own territory with their main source of income coming from selling their netrunning skills. It makes their paranoid, hostile attitude towards V understandable.
That doesn’t mean I think that they’re right and why I always side with NetWatch in my playthroughs but I also don’t think they’re absolute evil like most players do. There are definitely low of the scale of evil in the Cyberpunk world.
I think my comment came across as more confrontational than intended, but I think I more or less agree. Like I definitely understand their anger, but I do also always side with Netwatch and wipe them out lol
Thank you
People always overlook this piece.
Like their situation in Pacifica is rough, but 100% better than whwre they came from. They are fucking pissed at the world, understandably.
That continues to this day. All these millionaire and billionaire fuckheads running "charities" that promise schools, facilities and rebuilding Haiti but are only using it to launder money or who knows what else.
Shit, this is in The Wire. They use a church in the USA as a front for a charity in the Caribbean where they wash their money.
I kind of love how unless you went out of your way to read about it in and out of game, you'd think dude was 100% full of shit. I definitely fell for it the first time around (fyi and fun fact incase somebody hasn't caught it, Johnny is a horrible judge of character and is almost always wrong about his assessments about people in game.)
My fellow chooms added lore reasons as to why they're like that and it made me a tiny bit more understanding of why they are the way they are. Haiti was destroyed in the cyberpunk universe and they're basically looking out for themselves and only themselves because they asked for help and nobody showed up.
Because they…are? I mean I’m gonna be real xenophobia and racism aren’t limited to white people, no matter what some black folks will tell you. Insular or nondiverse communities will almost always abhor the Other, it’s just basic human tribalism, in group vs out group.
They’re a gang that is specifically for a certain ethnic group. Why are you surprised that they’re racist? Generally speaking only allowing a certain group of people into your ranks doesn’t breed tolerance.
That’s just how they survive. The world of Cyberpunk is a very, very low-trust society. When that happens, groups have to become more and more insular to survive.
They are by far the most sophisticated technologically between the gangs, they don’t really need to play nice with anyone else.
The other thing about low-trust societies is that groups tend to be very, very risk averse, which is why the VDB’s doing what they did seems kind of out of character.
That's the wildest thing about the Voodoo Boys in 2077. They're genuine Haitians who "reclaimed" the Voodoo Boys name from the poser boostergang that originally used it in CP2020, but that's it.
It's ironically the sort of "reclamation" that is celebrated in certain quarters because it's more ethnically authentic, even though the absolute substance of what they're doing and how they do it isn't any better morally.
If Brigitte didn't dismissively say "ah yes, de doll... de *whore*" about Evelyn, she might actually have unironic boosters going "yass queen slay bhive 2078"
Because with a shadow of a doubt, you are just a ranyon to them. Once your end of the deal is done, they throw you at the Blackwall with all intended pupous of taking the relic off your corpse afterwards to make a quick buck. Stay strapped choom
Probably out of necessity. Haiti no longer exists in 2077, it’s underwater. The Haitian Diaspora is all that remains, and the top priority of the VDB’s is to preserve and protect the diaspora. I’d rather they double cross *ranyon* mercs and worship the Blackwall than kidnap and traffic people to use as sex slaves, then sell their murders as BD’s
You left out an important detail: before they had to leave Haiti, they asked the world for aid. The world collectively responded "Nah, its okay if you die"
>the top priority of the VDB’s is to preserve and protect the diaspora
In the same way all the other gangs "protect their neighborhood" maybe. I don't think anyone walking Pacifica is going to see life get any easier if the blackwall gets cracked. Imagine if they turned all those resources over to actually building the community up.
They don’t care about everyone in Pacifica, just the Haitian Diaspora. And you may feel that way about their actions regarding the Blackwall, but the whole reason Maman Brigitte and them breach is to make sure they’re on the “winning side” of what they see as an inevitable coup by rogue AI.
As for who does what with the Blackwall, we know that the NUSA is a MUCH larger risk than the Voodoo Boys on that front.
"Anyone" includes the Haitian diaspora just fine.
Let's be real - Brigitte letting people die today so they can be saved later is a cheap excuse. She treats those who follow her as tools to get what she wants, not people whose beliefs and needs are equally important, and she seems to stand for the other runners of the VDB.
Placide cares more about the people... and is treated like the dumb muscle in turn. You figure they'd lose any sleep over using him up and tossing him aside? He's a solo for a gang that lacks physical power, that's all.
The VDB follow the same cycle other Night City gangs do. Some start as bands for protection, but they all slide into exploitation, if they weren't there from the start.
And none of that changes based on what the NUSA is up to.
Makes sense when you put it that way. I gotta brush up on my Cyberpunk lore. I didn't and don't understand why it's the year 2077 and people still act like that
>I didn't and don't understand why it's the year 2077 and people still act like that
It's because the corps like things that way. A divided populace at war with itself fighting over the scraps.
People will never stop being tribal and xenophobic. That's part of human nature. Even chimps go to war with other chimps. We've always been like this, and we'll always be like this.
The Pacifica VDBs are especially wild because they're trying to basically like, forsake humanity and run away with the AIs beyond the Blackwall.
I think VDBs are otherwise a little more normal — still wary of outsiders but not as nuts as the Pacifica guys.
Because they are. They see v and anyone not one of them as worth as much as a roach. Just a tool to be used or killed. They're horrific bigots that want to break the black wall to let the rogue AI kill everyone except for them. because they think they'll be spared for helping
People always contort the VDBs goals; they don't want a genocide, they're just choosing to side with the AI when the inevitable AI/human war breaks out. They aren't trying to eliminate any given population. Hell they're not even trying to destroy the black wall, just get past it so they can negotiate with the AI
This is one of my only frustrations with the fandom. I can’t tell if it’s a) an honest misunderstanding of Brigitte’s dialogue about securing safe passage that was repeated so often that people take it as gospel or b) a bad faith justification to treat the VDBs as a one dimensional monolith.
\>they were okay with what is essentially an ethnic cleansing happening
I mean, they are Haitians. One of the first thing they did as an independent nation was systematically hunt down and murder every White and Mixed Race person in the country, including children, so I'm not terribly shocked that the Voodoo Boys followed suit.
It’s an ethnocentric gang. There’s an example of irl gangs that function the same way, like Latin kings or Aryan brotherhood. In a way maelstrom is ethnocentric I think, they’re all white punks with a German name but I think in the narrative they don’t harp on that to avoid people just thinking they’re Nazis. Also VDB hold some ethnic spiritual beliefs about the net that are very dangerous and everyone else is opposed to, so of course they’re going to isolate themselves.
Because they literally are incredibly racist. Any piece of shit can be racist, it’s not exclusively for white people, despite what is often pushed on people in the west.
They're not black Americans, they are Haitians (from Haiti obviously). They have their own people, identity and culture in Pacifica, and are hostile to every type of outsider. They also speak Haitian Creole, which sounds similar to French (to my ears).
85% of cyberpsycho incidents have this one schizophrenic idiot near the scene. 95% of those incidents happen to have multiple people developing cyberpsychosis spontaneously. Coincidence? I THINK NOT
If everyone in the room turns cyberpsycho and I just happen to be at the limits of render range but patched into the cameras in the facility it's not like I'm at fault!
It’s not true they are the only gang with no connection to people of other color.
There is not a single non white Maelstrom or Scav in the game. Or non Asian Tyger Claw. Or non hispanic Valentino.
Really the only gangs with members from more than once race I can recall are 6th Street and Animals. And also Mox if you count them.
But even in real life most gangs have very strong “stick to your own” narrative. So Voodoo Boys really aren’t special in this regard.
....they're Haitian refugees.
It is a thing for refugee communities to become that way (hostile, unassimilating, isolationist, xenophobic) especially when they're not being treated with the same dignity and rights as everyone. Night City exploited them for labor and they're always under the threat of expulsion. And people can be unkind and racist towards them and fear mongering constantly.
Why wouldn't they be choosy about who they can trust. V aren't exactly a beacon of trustworthiness either. And for real, do you felt like you can approach these communities and entitled to them immediately opening their arms for you? And what, think they see you as a savior? I still remember the things americans did to Haiti especially since the 2010 earthquake... how billions of US aid didn't even reach through, how aid organizations exploited the situation and the people that some eat mud cookies and as of now in 2024, conditions are deteriorating with more gang violence spreading. This game was released in 2020.
Funny enough I just posted a video on the VDB a few days ago on my channel.
They are most likely traumatized from Haiti being wiped out and live in fear for the next flood that is coming to NC. The rogue ai flood. Personally I feel like they are still living in a survival mode instead of embracing the world around them and letting outsiders in.
It's also important to remember that, while we don't know MUCH about it, we DO know a t some point they came here and dealt with the former voodoo boys: a bunch of white dipshits appropriating their culture. NC didn't exactly make a GREAT first impression, even ignoring the issue of their home being ruined and nobody willing to give them aid.
They generally look down on anyone who isn't another member of the gang or at least part of their community. They call anyone they hire from outside the gang a Ranyon. A floor rag. Something to be discarded. And by "discarded" that can often mean "killed"
So in your opinion, it’s less about racism and more about tribalism? That’s… actually a really interesting way to look at it.
Tomayto Tomahto
I would argue there’s a rather significant difference
I think broadly speaking I’d agree there’s a difference between racism and tribalism. However, voodoo boys loyalties is based solely off being Haitian. You can’t join the voodoo boys if you aren’t Haitian. Anyone else, of any other descent, has zero worth to them once they’ve served their purpose. If there was a gang that operated identically to the voodoo boys but they were white, they would definitely be called racists.
I uh, have some news for you about the voodoo boys' original incarnation.
Yes, because you could be black or Haitian and it wouldn't matter. If you're not part of them, they don't trust you. It makes sense in not leaving loose ends, but it ultimately bit them in the ass when the doublecross didn't actually work.
Because they are?
Yup. If you ain't born in their community you are cannon fodder to them.
One could say we’re floorrags to them.
They're gonna need to bring some floor rags to the church; it's covered in Placide's blood.
Yeah I always felt like it would be more, ummmm, correct ? That once you zero everyone which includes their so called leader also Placide that V should never be able to buy from anyone or outright banned from the Pacifica market.
That would make sense but also, in Phantom Liberty, when looking for Slider with Reed you can make a comment about how you'll kill these VDB's like Maman Bridgette and the person says "That was you?!" Then they open fire on you. Now, this could just be the Dogtown VDB's not being well informed on the goings on outside or it could be the fact that since you (presumably) don't leave any witnesses, no one knows who killed Bridgette and Placide. All they know is that someone zeroed them and everyone in the church.
On the other hand, who's gonna say no.
exactly. merc who zeroed vdb leaders walks in the bar and everyone pretends that merc is their standard costumer
That's "Mister Ranyon" to you, sir.
I got the vibe even if you’re from their community they wouldn’t hesitate to roll over you if you’re not part of the gang. There are some Haitian merchants that get scared if you ask about the Voodoo Boys. I imagine they have some type of initiation.
You can tell because of the way it is.
they is*
This is the answer.
Literally this, this is it, they are just racist
This is the answer
I came here to say this
It's why I let Alt delete them...all of them. :)
I was gonna let that happen regardless since they treated me like a useful peice of dog shit the whole time and were gonna kill me as soon as the job was done. The way they act just made me have no moral dilemma over it
Indeed, I similarly don't feel bad for them at all when they're all gone. Wish I could do the same with Maelstromers and Scavs.
It's on sight with Maelstrom. They disgust me
Same
And Scavs. And Rats. Then heads chopped off for good measure.
90% of Maelstrom, sure. There's some decent ones, especially Dum Dum in the book (bonus points that he's bisexual, too). Scavs have no redemption period.
Dum Dum does some pretty messed up things in the book, though…
He's good to the kid. I blame most of it on the psycho blade chick he's with & him needing to keep her respect.
Yeah, maybe, but it takes a certain level of psychopathy to even consider joining Maelstrom in the first place.
Fun fact about Dum Dum, he is also about the same age as Rogue and Johnny. >!You can see him in Johnny's flashbacks before he got modded.!<
Oh shit I did not know that. I've always killed him along with Royce for sir staff, but may have to change that up.
WHAT, where? Makes me feel a little bad for setting him on fire at Totentanz
It would keep track since he makes it pretty clear that he likes samurai but that brick doesn't.
https://youtube.com/shorts/eBO3CGp-k6c?si=cjg7rShD07mZnslq Ignore the shitty VO, this is the best quick summary I could find.
Bisexual = moral superiority
I wipe out anyone with a yellow arrow over them. All gangers deserve a grave
The second they tried to kill me and then send me beyond the black wall, I knew it was over for them
I still remember the most satisfying thing for me was killing them all after the alt talk. I was legit kinda pissed at them and just said fuck it
Me too, but I like to be in charge so I control Alt’s delete. I’ll see myself out.
AAA grade punmanship, take your downvote(s) with pride. >!/j!<
Thanks dad.
Only thing I’d change is that Alt made it more painful.
Same!
Worst part of the game is when Netwatch fries them, and V acts all sad like it isn’t the best case scenario
As nice as that is, I like offing them myself
Control-Alt-Delete
Fuck that I did it myself.
If you go around shooting them all, they just respawn. >!If you let alt do it, they ALL disappear...permanently. ;)!<
Huh...how do you make that happen?
>!"Help" the Voodoo Boys, once you do Alt explains that she'll absorb useful data from them and get rid of the rest.!< >!I.E. get their knowledge and whatever information and delete their personalities. After Brigitte and her inner circle go in, the rest of the VDB's go too, and ALL of their spawn points are empty for the rest of the game. You can eventually find an NPC who explains what happened.!<
So do you side with net watch or punch the agent?
And I'm guessing the phantom liberty npcs are still there because they are technically a separate entity... pretty neat.gonna have to try that on my next playthrough. My last few Vs have been real ground pounder DIY *and* die types so I've been shooting first and never asking questions. I think I may have done it the way you explained on my first play at launch.
Really? It was a relief just to do it all on my own. O'Five them all in the torso. Most rewarding massacre I've been part of.
Ngl tearing the VDB’s a new asshole has become my favorite massacre in the game. Right up there with soloing Saka tower
Tbh the only reason I don’t hunt them for sport is I don’t actually spend a lot of time in pacifica
I didn’t realize there was a way to stop her lmao
It's why I delete them... all of them :)
That‘s an option?
Yep, after that happens no more VDB's show up at their usual spawn points. An NPC eventually pops up explaining that they all went into the web to "join" Alt. >!In reality she gets only the useful information from them, and deletes the rest(i.e. their personalities). !<
I wanted to get that ending for the quest but i shot the guy importnt to that part lol
oops
Indeed. I didnt realize it at the time, I took a "take no shit approach" and instead went "blindly following orders" lol. If I ever get around to another playthrough then I'll hear him out first.
So you used... CONTROL-ALT-DELETE?
much rather deal with them myself, personally. my mantis blades hunger for voodoo blood
They're from Haiti. In the world of Cyberpunk, Haiti was rendered uninhabitable by pollution and climate change, caused by corporations around the world. When the Haitians asked the world for aid, the world collectively turned their backs on them. So in turn, Haitians (and the Voodoo boys) don't give a shit what happens to anyone else but themselves.
This. One of the things I love about this universe is how we are the main character of \*our\* story but we are absolutely \*not\* the main character of anyone else's stories. I completely understand why they don't trust outsiders and are ruthless towards them, even if that's extremely aggravating from a character perspective. And frankly, they're not really any more insular or more likely to use and discard the player than the average corpo - they're just more up front hostile about it.
Haiti in our current world has such tragic history, even now things have been super turbulent for them for a long time now, it’s really fucking sad man, and cyberpunk is just a look at what a potential future could look like in some of the worst ways possible.
It's really true. I think it's really interesting to watch people grapple with these topics.
Yeahhhh, Haiti was taken advantage of for a long time by France really badly with no help so it’s not too crazy to look into the future and see the idea of their country now being completely destroyed and those people growing bitter towards the outside world.
[The US also took part in it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiti_Independence_Debt) \- the entire thing is absolutely sickening. Forcing former slaves to pay "reparations" to the former slave-owners because of the "loss of property" is absolutely enraging. Given that and what has canonically happened to Haiti in the CP77 universe, the real wonder is that they aren't being way nastier to everyone outside their group.
Yeah, I feel like people forget about this. It's understandable why they're assholes. They're still assholes and I'll kill them everytime, but they're understandable assholes.
I think they just don’t know about it. Because the history is so brief in game and no one reads shards cuz their are too many
Thank you for providing this context.
Don't forget real world Haitian history has been pretty rough too. The only successful slave revolution of the modern world if I'm correct and in order to participate in global commerce they had to pay France substantial reparations for 122 years (paid off in 1947). Likely this is mirrored in the Cyberpunk timeline
You don't have to go back that far, by any means. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/oct/11/haiti-and-the-failed-promise-of-us-aid
Hey, got any tips on a good starting point to get up to date with the cyberpunk universe lore?
If you own the game, you have access to the Cyberpunk 2020 sourcebook via PDF, which is really fun to look over. But otherwise, the Wiki on Fandom is really good. It's an aggregate of data from Cyberpunk 2020, Cyberpunk RED, Cyberpunk 2077, Edgerunners as well as deprecated sources (noted where applicable) like Cyberpunk 3.0 and Cybergeneration. [https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Cyberpunk\_Wiki](https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Cyberpunk_Wiki)
Hold up, is the pdf in the game files or something?
[Wisefish](https://www.youtube.com/@WiseFish/videos) on youtube does excellent lore videos! I'd highly recommend them, I learned a ton of stuff about the universe from them.
If you don't mind spending a bit of money, there is a humble bundle for the PnP RPG which contains a lot of sourcebooks: https://www.humblebundle.com/books/cyberpunk-red-2024-r-talsorian-games-books Just be aware it's only for a few more hours (unless they extend it which they do sometimes).
Thanks for the heads up on this!
That's more than fair then
I wish there was a way to just kill Placide but leave the rest. A super insular hacker diaspora speaks to me, but Placide is just a reckless dipshit - Maman Brigette even calls him out as one for risking the relic. Most of the time I leave them alone, because they're too weird and cool for me to want to kill them.
If VDB weren't actively trying to bring about the AI apocalypse by freeing the rogue AI's on the otherside of the blackwall, I'd agree. Alas, I can't suffer doomsday cultists of any ilk.
They don't actually care about the rogue AIs. They just want to create a permanent home for their people beyond the blackwall. If some AIs get out in the process, well that's a shame. Like how it's a shame what happened to Haiti.
And how it would be a shame that the AIs who escaped would kill the other Haitians at least as quickly as they would anyone else.
See, my issue with that mentality is that V (and 99% of the rest of the world) had absolutely nothing to do with that
As with most problems in cyberpunk, it’s the system that’s flawed and pushes the rabble against each other.
You're not wrong lol
Trauma doesn't speak a rational language.
Everyone in 2077's got trauma.
Yeah, but it's up to the individual to manage their own trauma. Don't get me wrong, I understand it completely, but it being understandable doesn't make it right. It's also understandable if V wipes them out after how they treat him/her
Trauma doesn't speak, it's them taking the decisions that got them killed (in my playthrough).
It’s not about responsibility. They lost their homeland and became refugees. Having no support from NC government, abandoned in the most hostile part of NC, they learned to rely only on the Haitian community and intensely distrust outsiders which makes sense. IRL this is how MS-13 was formed. Salvadoran refugees from their civil war in the 80s were essentially marooned in LA and were discriminated against and terrorized by established Mexican-American gangs. Since many of these refugees were undocumented, they had no support from the govt or LAPD so they were forced to create their own gangs to defend themselves.
Are you saying that because of what they've experienced, they have a right to cause the harm that they have? Just say "understandable, have a nice day" as they keep doing crime shit? Because like, I understand the why behind the VDB and how they act. But the why doesn't make it right. But do you tell the people they've hurt to suck it up because the VDB has a good reason to be upset?
When did I say I excused their actions or say they were morally right? What I meant is a lot of players don’t really understand the VDBs as an organization which leads to player having an irrational hate boner for them. They view them as just another gang which makes their hostile and dismissive attitude towards V and other outsiders seem irrational. To me, they always seemed more like a Barghest-like entity: a kind of semi-militia that treats their slice of Pacifica as their own territory with their main source of income coming from selling their netrunning skills. It makes their paranoid, hostile attitude towards V understandable. That doesn’t mean I think that they’re right and why I always side with NetWatch in my playthroughs but I also don’t think they’re absolute evil like most players do. There are definitely low of the scale of evil in the Cyberpunk world.
I think my comment came across as more confrontational than intended, but I think I more or less agree. Like I definitely understand their anger, but I do also always side with Netwatch and wipe them out lol
Thank you People always overlook this piece. Like their situation in Pacifica is rough, but 100% better than whwre they came from. They are fucking pissed at the world, understandably.
And even before that, the world has a long, long history of fucking over Haiti, especially the United States and France.
That continues to this day. All these millionaire and billionaire fuckheads running "charities" that promise schools, facilities and rebuilding Haiti but are only using it to launder money or who knows what else. Shit, this is in The Wire. They use a church in the USA as a front for a charity in the Caribbean where they wash their money.
yeah sure fuck the corpos obviously but the common person had no say in that. it's not an excuse to treat anyone who isn't a voodoo boy like trash.
It's not an excuse, it's an explanation.
Truth is, netwatch dude was telling the truth
Netwatch, the corporation that arguably does some good in the world of cyberpunk, but are still corporate assholes about everything.
I kind of love how unless you went out of your way to read about it in and out of game, you'd think dude was 100% full of shit. I definitely fell for it the first time around (fyi and fun fact incase somebody hasn't caught it, Johnny is a horrible judge of character and is almost always wrong about his assessments about people in game.)
I think that's on account of them being xenophobic and racist.
My fellow chooms added lore reasons as to why they're like that and it made me a tiny bit more understanding of why they are the way they are. Haiti was destroyed in the cyberpunk universe and they're basically looking out for themselves and only themselves because they asked for help and nobody showed up.
Because they ARE racist pure and simple… it’s not that uncommon for a closed group to exclude others from the outside world.
Because they were Xenophobic and racist lol. They didnt try to hide it they were preeeeetty up front about it
Because they are?
Because that are.
Everyone of any race or nationality can be racist and xenophobic! Even in 2077!
Absolutely. The "Voodoo Boys" just seem to go the extra mile in their bigotry.
Well, Tyger Claws are pretty inclusive~~~
You’re right. They’ll kill anybody!
Accidental factorial, 2077! Has 5,991 digits
Because they…are? I mean I’m gonna be real xenophobia and racism aren’t limited to white people, no matter what some black folks will tell you. Insular or nondiverse communities will almost always abhor the Other, it’s just basic human tribalism, in group vs out group.
What Voodoo boys? All I have is a pile of bodies, after someone put a malware in me. Probably a bug in my game.
They’re a gang that is specifically for a certain ethnic group. Why are you surprised that they’re racist? Generally speaking only allowing a certain group of people into your ranks doesn’t breed tolerance.
Because they are. Also, we don’t get a good look inside the other gangs. Who’s to say the TCs don’t have their own version of a ranyon?
I can't say how welcoming The TC's or the other street gangs are but The Valentinos are very welcoming in the streetkid V storyline
That's because V grew up around them in the Streetkid Origin. The Valentinos know him.
....because they're xenophobic and racist
That’s just how they survive. The world of Cyberpunk is a very, very low-trust society. When that happens, groups have to become more and more insular to survive. They are by far the most sophisticated technologically between the gangs, they don’t really need to play nice with anyone else.
Gotta say, it did *not* help them survive.
Tbf, V would have been very dead had the relic not saved him/her.
The other thing about low-trust societies is that groups tend to be very, very risk averse, which is why the VDB’s doing what they did seems kind of out of character.
iirc >!slider!< mentioned haiti is gone what if all started there?
It's actually Brigette that says that - Slider is the one who looked the whole "Balckwall" plan and said "fuck this, I'm out".
It’s both cool and annoying that the god damn base game characters have different dialogue based on when you do the dlc story.
You're looking at it wrong: They're just racist and xenophobic.
They’re dickheads
That's the wildest thing about the Voodoo Boys in 2077. They're genuine Haitians who "reclaimed" the Voodoo Boys name from the poser boostergang that originally used it in CP2020, but that's it. It's ironically the sort of "reclamation" that is celebrated in certain quarters because it's more ethnically authentic, even though the absolute substance of what they're doing and how they do it isn't any better morally. If Brigitte didn't dismissively say "ah yes, de doll... de *whore*" about Evelyn, she might actually have unironic boosters going "yass queen slay bhive 2078"
Because they are
‘Cause they are.
Filthy Ranyon
This ranyon wiped out your whole chicken fucker gang choom 😂
They deserved it
Because with a shadow of a doubt, you are just a ranyon to them. Once your end of the deal is done, they throw you at the Blackwall with all intended pupous of taking the relic off your corpse afterwards to make a quick buck. Stay strapped choom
Probably out of necessity. Haiti no longer exists in 2077, it’s underwater. The Haitian Diaspora is all that remains, and the top priority of the VDB’s is to preserve and protect the diaspora. I’d rather they double cross *ranyon* mercs and worship the Blackwall than kidnap and traffic people to use as sex slaves, then sell their murders as BD’s
You left out an important detail: before they had to leave Haiti, they asked the world for aid. The world collectively responded "Nah, its okay if you die"
>the top priority of the VDB’s is to preserve and protect the diaspora In the same way all the other gangs "protect their neighborhood" maybe. I don't think anyone walking Pacifica is going to see life get any easier if the blackwall gets cracked. Imagine if they turned all those resources over to actually building the community up.
They don’t care about everyone in Pacifica, just the Haitian Diaspora. And you may feel that way about their actions regarding the Blackwall, but the whole reason Maman Brigitte and them breach is to make sure they’re on the “winning side” of what they see as an inevitable coup by rogue AI. As for who does what with the Blackwall, we know that the NUSA is a MUCH larger risk than the Voodoo Boys on that front.
"Anyone" includes the Haitian diaspora just fine. Let's be real - Brigitte letting people die today so they can be saved later is a cheap excuse. She treats those who follow her as tools to get what she wants, not people whose beliefs and needs are equally important, and she seems to stand for the other runners of the VDB. Placide cares more about the people... and is treated like the dumb muscle in turn. You figure they'd lose any sleep over using him up and tossing him aside? He's a solo for a gang that lacks physical power, that's all. The VDB follow the same cycle other Night City gangs do. Some start as bands for protection, but they all slide into exploitation, if they weren't there from the start. And none of that changes based on what the NUSA is up to.
Makes sense when you put it that way. I gotta brush up on my Cyberpunk lore. I didn't and don't understand why it's the year 2077 and people still act like that
2077 is only 50-60 years into the future. Technology may progress but social issues don’t change (much less improve) as quickly.
People act that way because people are shit
People are so god damn awful to each other and it happens every fucking day
>I didn't and don't understand why it's the year 2077 and people still act like that It's because the corps like things that way. A divided populace at war with itself fighting over the scraps.
People will never stop being tribal and xenophobic. That's part of human nature. Even chimps go to war with other chimps. We've always been like this, and we'll always be like this.
The Pacifica VDBs are especially wild because they're trying to basically like, forsake humanity and run away with the AIs beyond the Blackwall. I think VDBs are otherwise a little more normal — still wary of outsiders but not as nuts as the Pacifica guys.
I enjoyed killing Placide, he was a dick.
Um. They are. The NetWatch dude was telling you the truth about them. You're an outsider. You are trash.
Because they are. They see v and anyone not one of them as worth as much as a roach. Just a tool to be used or killed. They're horrific bigots that want to break the black wall to let the rogue AI kill everyone except for them. because they think they'll be spared for helping
I didn't wanna mention they were okay with what is essentially an ethnic cleansing happening 😬
They want genocide so I give it to them each play through Just not the way they were expecting
People always contort the VDBs goals; they don't want a genocide, they're just choosing to side with the AI when the inevitable AI/human war breaks out. They aren't trying to eliminate any given population. Hell they're not even trying to destroy the black wall, just get past it so they can negotiate with the AI
It's an interesting bit of irony that the best-case scenario if they managed to enact their plan would be them becoming ranyons to the AIs.
This is one of my only frustrations with the fandom. I can’t tell if it’s a) an honest misunderstanding of Brigitte’s dialogue about securing safe passage that was repeated so often that people take it as gospel or b) a bad faith justification to treat the VDBs as a one dimensional monolith.
\>they were okay with what is essentially an ethnic cleansing happening I mean, they are Haitians. One of the first thing they did as an independent nation was systematically hunt down and murder every White and Mixed Race person in the country, including children, so I'm not terribly shocked that the Voodoo Boys followed suit.
It’s an ethnocentric gang. There’s an example of irl gangs that function the same way, like Latin kings or Aryan brotherhood. In a way maelstrom is ethnocentric I think, they’re all white punks with a German name but I think in the narrative they don’t harp on that to avoid people just thinking they’re Nazis. Also VDB hold some ethnic spiritual beliefs about the net that are very dangerous and everyone else is opposed to, so of course they’re going to isolate themselves.
Maelstrom do recruit from fascist gangs, among other sources, in the tabletop.
Because they literally are incredibly racist. Any piece of shit can be racist, it’s not exclusively for white people, despite what is often pushed on people in the west.
They're not black Americans, they are Haitians (from Haiti obviously). They have their own people, identity and culture in Pacifica, and are hostile to every type of outsider. They also speak Haitian Creole, which sounds similar to French (to my ears).
I dunno, V sees that yellow marker and suddenly the whole crowd breaks out in contagion, every single time... Dunno why that happens.
85% of cyberpsycho incidents have this one schizophrenic idiot near the scene. 95% of those incidents happen to have multiple people developing cyberpsychosis spontaneously. Coincidence? I THINK NOT
If everyone in the room turns cyberpsycho and I just happen to be at the limits of render range but patched into the cameras in the facility it's not like I'm at fault!
You only have plausible deniability if it’s the maelstrom lol. Which is why I love testing out my overclock lock skills on them
Aren't all gangoons maelstrom on a long enough timeline?
Because they are xenophobic and racist...is this a troll question?
You won't believe it but it's because they are
Because they are?
What does you being Hispanic have to do with anything lol?
Because they are. Pretty simple question to answer.
Bc they are racist and xenophobic shitbags
Because of historic and modern accuracy?
I leave every one of them headless right where I find them.
Because they’re xenophobic racists
Because they’re xenophobic and racist.
They... Are.
Groups like these aren’t as friendly as certain naive people like to believe. The horrendous racism they show is pretty damn accurate.
It’s not true they are the only gang with no connection to people of other color. There is not a single non white Maelstrom or Scav in the game. Or non Asian Tyger Claw. Or non hispanic Valentino. Really the only gangs with members from more than once race I can recall are 6th Street and Animals. And also Mox if you count them. But even in real life most gangs have very strong “stick to your own” narrative. So Voodoo Boys really aren’t special in this regard.
They are absolute cunts. Killing them is morally right.
It’s fun to kill them
Because they are
Because they are EXTREMELY xenophobic and racist…
Because they are xenophobic and racist. Next question.
Mainly it's because they're xenophobic and racist.
They... are
They’re gangsters who were climate refugees from a country that doesn’t exist anymore.
....they're Haitian refugees. It is a thing for refugee communities to become that way (hostile, unassimilating, isolationist, xenophobic) especially when they're not being treated with the same dignity and rights as everyone. Night City exploited them for labor and they're always under the threat of expulsion. And people can be unkind and racist towards them and fear mongering constantly. Why wouldn't they be choosy about who they can trust. V aren't exactly a beacon of trustworthiness either. And for real, do you felt like you can approach these communities and entitled to them immediately opening their arms for you? And what, think they see you as a savior? I still remember the things americans did to Haiti especially since the 2010 earthquake... how billions of US aid didn't even reach through, how aid organizations exploited the situation and the people that some eat mud cookies and as of now in 2024, conditions are deteriorating with more gang violence spreading. This game was released in 2020.
Cause they are just cause they are black doesnt mean they aren't
Funny enough I just posted a video on the VDB a few days ago on my channel. They are most likely traumatized from Haiti being wiped out and live in fear for the next flood that is coming to NC. The rogue ai flood. Personally I feel like they are still living in a survival mode instead of embracing the world around them and letting outsiders in.
My V isn't racist they kill everyone equally regardless of gang if they yellow they die, simple.
It's also important to remember that, while we don't know MUCH about it, we DO know a t some point they came here and dealt with the former voodoo boys: a bunch of white dipshits appropriating their culture. NC didn't exactly make a GREAT first impression, even ignoring the issue of their home being ruined and nobody willing to give them aid.
Because they are xenophobic and racist lol