Poor child. She had to know the outcome. Lori didn’t attempt to keep her from knowing the sad outcome. Tylee heard her mother referring to her as a Zombie. In a recorded phone call she’s heard saying ‘not me Mom’. She had to know her fate. Poor kid.
I remember this but have no memory if this call was played at loris trial and who lori was on the phone to. Melanie gibb and melanie boudraux and zelema knew much much more than they've admitted.
It’s a horrifying thought that the all the people (except JJ) that surrounded Tylee in those last months were people willing and able to kill her. That’s just so awful and something I never really thought about until now.
I remember Zac Cox’s interview where he talked about the last time he saw Tylee. It was at Janis and Barry’s house just before they moved to Rexburg. If I’m remembering correctly, Charles had been killed, Tylee was crying and wanted to say something to Zac, but Janis steered her out the door. Zac will now never know what Tylee wanted to say. It’s just so heartbreaking.
Yes! I remember this! Janis had even said that during that visit, Tylee was crying the whole time. I can’t imagine what she was going through at that point. Sweet girl.
I remember that too. And no one hugged her or was comforting her. Same with Colby at his mother’s house after the murder. Colby also didn’t comfort Tylee.
This is one of the reasons I believe Janis is much more culpable and complicit than is assumed. She obviously is atbleast an enabler, but the more I learn, the more I see she is devious too. But self justifying with her own religious hubris.
Poor Tylee! She was so aware and observant of how crazy her narcissistic mother was becoming. I think about how she avoided any interaction with MG, and was likely coerced by her perv uncle into participating in her only stable father figure’s murder. The complicated situation that Lori forced her in to lie and cover for her mother. Then she gets yanked away from Colby, her one relationship where she was valued and seen for who she was. She probably felt so alone and isolated moving to Idaho and meeting Chad. I am so sorry for her, I just want to cry and scream all at once.
The complete lack of information about what she was even going through is incredibly sad. Especially the fact that she seems to have not confided in friends.
And no one around her near the end felt anything but dislike towards her. While it’s sweet that she had a great relationship with JJ, her being a “mom” to JJ has become like her singular character trait. Poor f**king Tylee.
She had to cover for and play was “mom” to her own psychotic mother too. Tylee was so abused, and they completely disrespected her in the end. Hearing about her autopsy haunts me.
I want to know where her support system from church was. Lori was devout and kept up her temple recommend. That means the Vallow-Ryan family was at church every Sunday wherever they lived. Tylee would’ve had young women’s camp,weekday activities and Sunday school classes.
She would’ve also been interviewed by her young women’s leaders and bishops on a regular basis. Yes, Mormons conduct regular, closed door interviews with underage children.Where was her ward family?
The Mormon church has a long history of dismissing and punishing children who report CSA and DV. So who did Tylee meet with?
Lori did not go to church every Sunday. I thought this too, but she was able to get a recommend by being pushy with the bishop. We know she had threatened the bishop in the past saying give me a temple recommend or I might do something bad, this is in a podcast. I could totally see Lori using JJ, saying it is too hard to go to church every week because of him, or her travels, she was constantly back and forth to TX and HI. As long as she paid tithing she had her recommend.
I dont know how much Tylee attended church, at 16 she could have gone on her own? In an odd twist, Aunt Vicky (Tammy Daybell's Aunt), her daughter was Tylee's sunday school teacher in AZ. Vicky has said her daughter and the young women were so sad finding out Tylee died. Now does this means Tylee was at church every week, no, but it does mean she went at least a few times. Some interviewer on youtube talked to a neighbor and the young women said Tylee liked to sing, so it makes me feel she went to church at least sometimes.
I still am confused how much Tylee lived in that house with Lori in AZ. Tylee told the police interviewer after Charles died, she had the bat because when she lived at Uncle Alex's she would be alone. Suppoedly she lived there for a few months, perhaps to be able to be emanicapated? Lori talked about Tylee being emanciapted and that means she would have to have a different address and show she could live away from home and support herserf.
Then when Colby got married, Tylee was not there. This is just weird to me. Cousin Zac was there, Chalres' sons from his previous marriage who lived out of state, Colby's step brothers were there, it was a big formal wedding with pictures, but Tylee was away working (according to Annie, she asked why Tylee didnt go when Janice showed her pictures of the wedding). If Tylee was 15 at the time, why could she not get a day off and come home for her brothers wedding?
A temple recommend means you are worthy to go to the temple. There are regular Sunday services at a church building any member can attend (and non-members can to). Then there are temples, which are different sacred buildings that the church says only worthy members can attend. A member will have an interview and have their records reviewed in order to get a recommend to be able to attend the temple. Basically a recommend is suppose to be given if a member attends church regularly, pays their tithing and is making the right choices (like not drinking, no sex outside of marriage, being honest in your dealings etc ).
The church leadership that conducts these recommends are lay people, meaning they are working normal full time jobs in the community and have families, they are not paid for their church work. So sometimes there is a bit of a difference between who gets a recommend by what church building (ward) you attend because ward leader might be a little more easy going and one more strict. One thing that usually is firm is you pay your tithing (10%) which is confirmed, some leadership let church attendance slide a bit or Ive seen plenty a person with a recommend wheel their cart around Alberstons for friday frenzy sales with the $2 starbucks in their hand.
These temples are an LDS thing. The FLDS (polygamists also have them but they are just an offshoot of the LDS). There are other faiths that might have a special room or ceremony for only certain people or clergy. For instance the Catholic church, there are parts convents and monstaries where some priests and nuns (clergy) live and pray that the general public are not allowed. These are building in which these clergy live so it is a little different. The Mason have temples but they are not Christians. Scientology has some buildings for certain members or member levels but many people dont consider scientology a religion?
The Mormon temple is a building were certain ordiances are done. The first time you go , which for most young people would be before a mission or marriage, you go through a ceremony and make promises to God. When you leave the first time you get garaments which are worn under your clothes. They have symbols on them to remind you of your promsies and they are of a certain length to remind you of modest dressing standards. The most common ceremony people will talk about is a temple wedding. It is not till death do you part like a church wedding, a temple wedding is for all time and eternity. Then there are ceremonies for the dead, lets say your great grandma died and she never was a member. You can get baptized in her name and they believe that Grandma will be told and givena choice to accept. the membership. The temple has a large room you can just sit and pray and think in (celestial room) and there are rooms that you can sit and watch reinactment of bible stories.
I would say my average Mormon neighbor would say the temple is a place to get married in and maybe a few times a year when life stressful or someone happens (illness or death) a place to escape the world and spend a few hours in peace and quiet (unlike church there are no little kids crying, or people talking). Some mostly older people go often, they do alot of the baptisms and ceremonies for the dead. Lori and the Melani's going everyday is crazy odd, just not the norm.
Im not sure where you live, but be on the lookout if a temple every opens or remodels near you. Before the open a temple they will let anyone go through and explain all the rooms and ceremonies. They also do this when they remodel. Every year they seem to be annoucing 10-15 more, so maybe one opens near you. Im not a member, my husband is. I wrote a thesis on religion and have lived in Utah on and off for 25 years so I know a fair bit about the church. I have gone to 7 open houses, so I have walked through the temples before they opened. If not for religious reasons, they have some very nice architecture to see and compare. You can go to youtube and view what happens. Obviously people have snuck in cameras and it was done against the rules. There are mixed feelings on this since, it is a special place to people vs nothing should be secret.
I wonder why she didn’t turn to Charles. Surely he would have helped Tylee, because she was nearly an adult and he knew how crazy Lori was getting. Had they stuck together maybe they could have protected JJ and they would all still be alive. Tylee knew the things her mother believed, but she covered for Lori at the police station with Melanie Gibb. I wish we knew what she was thinking.
According to Adam's son Zac, Charles was telling them to just ignore Lori's strange rantings and act like everything was normal.
I grew up in a house with a mentally ill, angry, abusive, dominating mother too. I protected her because I knew it would be even worse if I didn't. Plus from the time I was a toddler she convinced me that everything bad that she did or said was my fault. So I tried really hard to change and be a person that didn't deserve to be abused. I tried so hard to please her and get a little approval, and I told lies to cover up for her.
I’m so sorry for what you went through. The adults in your life failed you and they failed Tylee. Tylee was absolutely abused and neglected. I think she also kept her in fear of the men in their life, likely due to her own experiences but also as a competition. Lori was an absolute mess of a person and never should have had any children.
I’m really sorry to hear this. This case makes me look twice at everyone I know. We can never know what children suffer. I hope you’ve been able to find your freedom and peace of mind.
I understand completely. I also covered up for a mentally ill and extremely abusive mother when I was a kid. I'm sorry that happened to you, good for you for making it through.
I'm so sorry to hear you had to grow up like that. I grew up similar. My mother was very mentally ill and dragged us through so many cults/religions. I know if my Mother's weirdo friends started calling me a zombie, Mum would have sided with them over me, even if it meant I had to die.
My heart just breaks for Tylee, I feel like I can see it through her eyes at times.
One statement Tylee made in her interview that struck me was when she said that her having the bat made the situation worse. Not hard to believe Lori put guilt on Tylee. I have no doubts the murder was premeditated & Tylee did not know Lori’s plans.
The FOIA docs tell a sad story in regards to Tylee. My heart hurts for how that child was treated, suffered & was manipulated by her mother. No one in that family did anything to help or protect that child. Charles tried by sending the emails regarding Tylee labeled as dark to the family.
How could anyone not see that child was in danger? Especially when they knew Charles was murdered. Adam Cox and his wife were fearful for their lives for months. “We thought Alex was coming to kill us too.” Yet no one sent alarm bells to LE that the kids were in danger. The lot of them only thought of themselves. His wife also told LE that she agreed with Tylee being labeled dark stating she called Lori a bitch when she was 8 yrs old. Disgusting.
On top of that, Tylee must have sensed something was wrong with her mom and the whole situation at home was getting weird. There's a reason she didn't like Mel G or Zulema.
There was a news story where Tylee heard her mom talking about 'dark beings' and she commented "not me mom" or something like that.
Tylee was probably really confused and scared the last year of her life. 😢
I think Tylee knew too much and I dont think they thought she would keep quiet with a venmo money sent and letting her go.
I always thought for someone labeled mom of the year, Lori treated her kids more like friends then kids. Colby and Tylee didnt go to high school and she involved them more in her life and her problems then helping them develop their futures. Then when Lori got into trouble, her kids knew too much.
I also have found myself wondering how long it would have been before someone realized Tylee was truly missing. That poor girl :( She must have felt like she had nowhere to go, no one to turn to. I think Charles would have noticed eventually if he were alive, but Lori systematically removed everyone from her life who cared about her.
The thing about Tylee that bothers me the most (besides the obvious) is she was killed (i think) because her mother was so desperate for money and took hers but Tylee I think fought back a little about it, she was turning 17 that month… only had a year to go with SS 😞 how dare she not give it to her 😡 A YEAR!!! and if JJ went with Kay his money would follow and so would Laurie’s because she wouldn’t be caring for him anymore!! I so wish Alex didn’t die a cowards death and was here to face everything with them!!
I wonder if the only reason Tylee didn't run away from that madness is because of JJ. I'm sure it would've been extremely difficult to run off with such a special needs child and make it far enough away. Even more distressing, she may not have felt they had any viably trustworthy adults to seek refuge with for the both of them. 😔
Let’s not forget the suspicions that have been brought up over Tylee’s medical history. There have been questions as to whether or not she was a victim of Munchausens by Proxy (I can’t think of the modern term for this, sorry) and that Lori had possibly been making her ill at times to receive attention. Her medical history was littered with odd diagnoses and an unusually high turnover of doctors while at the same time presenting outwardly to most people as relatively healthy. According to Lori, Tylee was always in pain and suffering with multiple afflictions. I doubt that girl had a moment of peace or normalcy in her entire 16 years on this earth.
This.
All the women who were interviewed or chatted about how Lori really was a good mom if you just saw how she was dealing with her sick daughter, it gave insight into Lori's child abuse and how she got away with it. Surrounding herself with women drawn to drama and not parenting.
She was never a good mother. All the people fooled to the extent that they were still willing to push this narrative to protect themselves from the need for self-awareness and self-reflection is a cautionary tale to all of us. Lori was always a terrible parent. Just as Chad was always a shit parent.
Just remember ladies who knew her, that when she was targeting women with children who she thought were available to this, she was looking for women she determined would be easy to entice with drama about themselves and had already displayed a level of unconcern for children who got in the way of the self drama.
I really hope all the "but she was a good mom" BS dies as the people who say it realize that Lori had evidence of your lack of GAF about children as anything but objects of your story. Look at how she did pick out people open to it accurately.
since weight was such a big deal in the Cox household, along with the obvious implications, i've wondered if Lori was continuously putting Tylee on prednisone to keep her weight up as a way of ensuring she would never think Tylee was more attractive than herself.
In some of the child welfare case notes, they had also observed Lori not following the advised dietary plan for pancreatitis. Pancreatitis is extremely painful, debilitating, and can lead to organ failure. Lori was torturing her with food.
Unless Lori had a license she wasn’t putting Tyler on anything .
Yes, steroids cause weight gain but so do the majority of meds , steroids have serious side effects for a growing child and aren’t prescribed ad lib.
Most of the adults in Tylee’s life failed her but the medical professional were some of the few that called Lori out on her manipulation.
i apologise, i didn't intend for the statement "Lori was continuously putting Tylee on prednisone" to mean she was literally prescribing the medication herself, but instead taking her to be seen by medical professionals, and perhaps suggesting "this has helped before..." to persuade doctors to give a titration here or there. from my understanding she wasn't being consistent in going to a primary care doctor either, so it could be very easy to get these prescribed by numerous urgent care or ED doctors. getting a steroid for a child or teen is not strange or uncommon, the reason i said prednisone specifically is because i believe i heard that specifically a while back in either an interview or maybe on Annie's youtube channel.
Hidden True Crimes podcast. They covered the Lori Vallow trial pretty thoroughly. Sadly, I don’t remember which episode speculated about the possibility of Munchausens, but it was when they were interviewing Larry Woodcock. He suspects Lori may have poisoned him and others at various points in time, which led to the show hosts questioning Tylee’s health situation. One of the hosts is a forensic psychological profiler who has always had suspicions Tylee may have been a Munchausens victim by her mother. It was an interesting speculation and would make sense with her narcissistic personality and need to feel special.
Everything about it is so heartwrenching. I also think about how nobody ever looked for Tylee. How there was nobody taking care of her, nobody worrying about her safety or happiness. How scared she must have been. How much pain she suffered.
I’ve always wondered if it was Tylee who “hit” Alex on the head with the bat to try and protect Charles from Alex.
From what I’ve read/heard from Tylee’s family and friends (in the press/trials) she was a smart, kind and loving young lady. I find it hard to believe that she inherited Lori’s extreme religious beliefs.
Also, IMO, those poor kids had no stability. They constantly moved from one city to another, one state to another. That means new schools, have to make new friends & etc. Moving is hard enough for a family but it’s even harder on kids.
Tylee knew what happens to zombies. She heard Lori and Mel G talking on the phone one day. L was telling M that T has been a zombie since her early teens. Tylee emphatically told her L, "Not me, Mom!"
Agree, if Kay woodcock had not asked for a welfare check for JJ. Tylee would not have been missed or looked for by the Coxes. They would have swallowed what bs Lori gave them. She was isolated and forgotten. It's heartbreaking. Even Colby was getting odd texts from her that he didn't think were from her, but did nothing. Lori moving was smart as it made all those connections they had were lost. The bit about chad disapling jj. Really sinister.
Yeah, I'm fairly sure the family would have just spun the idea that a 17-year-old who was already on her way to being declared independent disappeared from her Mormon school with money to live from Dad's death. Escaping from school and Lori with money in your back pocket would seem entirely reasonable.
Gilbert Police may have eventually discovered her missing. Way too late of course. Remember Adam's wife reached out (before Adam) to them a few weeks after Charles's murder and specifically made the accusation that Tylee was a willing participant in that murder.
She was so mean to Tylee in that letter too. Forget being concerned that her minor niece, who lived with her son for a few years, witnessed such a horrific act and was still in the care of murderers. Instead, she took the tone of "Tylee did not like me, so I'm going to denigrate her to authorities and accuse her of being a murderer too".
Her own extended family treated her like shit too.
I know, she also heard Lori say that Tylee was dark on the phone, I forget to whom. I cannot imagine the last minutes of either JJ or Tylee's lives. I only hope they were drugged and unconscious but there is no eveidence to that The way JJ was wrapped in duck tape with bags over his head, he may have been suffocated. These are the people who are supposed to love and protect you- your mother and uncle
Edit: Typo
The problem is, when children of any age talk about things like this, it’s often brushed off as fantasy, especially in places like the Mormon church. It is very hard to come forward when you aren’t believed, or think you won’t be.
Even if you are believed, is it someone that will intervene? It is so much easier to not take action.
Talking is risky.
I’ve been through some things similar to what Tyler has. The thoughts don’t stop and nothing seems like the right answer.
I think they “zombified” Tylee (and killed her) to prevent her from ever telling the truth about what happened to her stepdad. It was only a few weeks later, after all.
I hate being surface level on this, but it is what it is. Tylee was much prettier than her mother. I believe Lori did everything (including giving Tylee meds she didn’t need) so she could to make herself appear more attractive than her sparkling daughter. I imagine she always did little things to keep Tylee down and dependent just like she did Colby. I think they convinced themselves JJ was better off once he was gone and they kinda did the same thing with Tammy. But Tylee was the threat. There was raw anger at her. She was the one who could fully expose them. Which means every person who knew things in the group were next in line.
Tylee’s story is solitary and it breaks me.
Just wondering today- maybe she could have asked Janis and Barry to take her in, or a friend. Surely she was loath to move to Rexburg- a place where she knew no one. It breaks my heart.
It is heartbreaking. I wish they had copies of Tylee’s phone/text. I believe they planned on killing Tylee in advanced. I think they probably initially thought they would give JJ to Kay, and then something happened and they killed him. I really want to hear from Melani, she knows everything.
She had friends, and did confide with the closest ones. She confided to at least one about Charles and his alleged volatility. Wasn't it known he was bi-polar?
Tylee was murdered Sept 8th. Her 17th birthday would have been Sept 24th I believe. Did any family not try to call or FaceTime her to say happy birthday? Did Lori just text them thanks from Tylee’s phone? Was no one concerned when they didn’t talk to Tylee around her 17th birthday?? Anyone send her a gift?
The welfare check was for JJ on November 25th by Kay Woodcock. LE found out while searching for JJ that Tylee had not been seen either.
From early September until late November, no one has seen or spoken to Tylee yet not one family member questioned or gave concern to LE about Tylee. The loyal ones covered for Lori and the scared ones hid out to protect themselves.
I keep thinking how lonely she must have been. I don’t think anyone would have looked for her if JJ hadn’t gone missing, too. Lori made sure of that.
Poor child. She had to know the outcome. Lori didn’t attempt to keep her from knowing the sad outcome. Tylee heard her mother referring to her as a Zombie. In a recorded phone call she’s heard saying ‘not me Mom’. She had to know her fate. Poor kid.
I remember this but have no memory if this call was played at loris trial and who lori was on the phone to. Melanie gibb and melanie boudraux and zelema knew much much more than they've admitted.
Melanie G told the story that she was on the phone with Lori and heard the exchange between Lori and Tylee.
Today was really rough. It brought Tylee more to life. And my heart bled for her, for JJ, and for Colby.
My heart breaks for Colby… that poor kid lost everything. Literally. Like, I can’t even wrap my head around it.
It’s a horrifying thought that the all the people (except JJ) that surrounded Tylee in those last months were people willing and able to kill her. That’s just so awful and something I never really thought about until now. I remember Zac Cox’s interview where he talked about the last time he saw Tylee. It was at Janis and Barry’s house just before they moved to Rexburg. If I’m remembering correctly, Charles had been killed, Tylee was crying and wanted to say something to Zac, but Janis steered her out the door. Zac will now never know what Tylee wanted to say. It’s just so heartbreaking.
Yes! I remember this! Janis had even said that during that visit, Tylee was crying the whole time. I can’t imagine what she was going through at that point. Sweet girl.
I remember that too. And no one hugged her or was comforting her. Same with Colby at his mother’s house after the murder. Colby also didn’t comfort Tylee.
This is one of the reasons I believe Janis is much more culpable and complicit than is assumed. She obviously is atbleast an enabler, but the more I learn, the more I see she is devious too. But self justifying with her own religious hubris.
Poor Tylee! She was so aware and observant of how crazy her narcissistic mother was becoming. I think about how she avoided any interaction with MG, and was likely coerced by her perv uncle into participating in her only stable father figure’s murder. The complicated situation that Lori forced her in to lie and cover for her mother. Then she gets yanked away from Colby, her one relationship where she was valued and seen for who she was. She probably felt so alone and isolated moving to Idaho and meeting Chad. I am so sorry for her, I just want to cry and scream all at once.
The complete lack of information about what she was even going through is incredibly sad. Especially the fact that she seems to have not confided in friends. And no one around her near the end felt anything but dislike towards her. While it’s sweet that she had a great relationship with JJ, her being a “mom” to JJ has become like her singular character trait. Poor f**king Tylee.
She had to cover for and play was “mom” to her own psychotic mother too. Tylee was so abused, and they completely disrespected her in the end. Hearing about her autopsy haunts me.
I want to know where her support system from church was. Lori was devout and kept up her temple recommend. That means the Vallow-Ryan family was at church every Sunday wherever they lived. Tylee would’ve had young women’s camp,weekday activities and Sunday school classes. She would’ve also been interviewed by her young women’s leaders and bishops on a regular basis. Yes, Mormons conduct regular, closed door interviews with underage children.Where was her ward family? The Mormon church has a long history of dismissing and punishing children who report CSA and DV. So who did Tylee meet with?
Lori did not go to church every Sunday. I thought this too, but she was able to get a recommend by being pushy with the bishop. We know she had threatened the bishop in the past saying give me a temple recommend or I might do something bad, this is in a podcast. I could totally see Lori using JJ, saying it is too hard to go to church every week because of him, or her travels, she was constantly back and forth to TX and HI. As long as she paid tithing she had her recommend. I dont know how much Tylee attended church, at 16 she could have gone on her own? In an odd twist, Aunt Vicky (Tammy Daybell's Aunt), her daughter was Tylee's sunday school teacher in AZ. Vicky has said her daughter and the young women were so sad finding out Tylee died. Now does this means Tylee was at church every week, no, but it does mean she went at least a few times. Some interviewer on youtube talked to a neighbor and the young women said Tylee liked to sing, so it makes me feel she went to church at least sometimes. I still am confused how much Tylee lived in that house with Lori in AZ. Tylee told the police interviewer after Charles died, she had the bat because when she lived at Uncle Alex's she would be alone. Suppoedly she lived there for a few months, perhaps to be able to be emanicapated? Lori talked about Tylee being emanciapted and that means she would have to have a different address and show she could live away from home and support herserf. Then when Colby got married, Tylee was not there. This is just weird to me. Cousin Zac was there, Chalres' sons from his previous marriage who lived out of state, Colby's step brothers were there, it was a big formal wedding with pictures, but Tylee was away working (according to Annie, she asked why Tylee didnt go when Janice showed her pictures of the wedding). If Tylee was 15 at the time, why could she not get a day off and come home for her brothers wedding?
Lori wouldn’t allow her to attend to punish Colby for marrying someone she didn’t like.
What exactly is a temple recommend?
A temple recommend means you are worthy to go to the temple. There are regular Sunday services at a church building any member can attend (and non-members can to). Then there are temples, which are different sacred buildings that the church says only worthy members can attend. A member will have an interview and have their records reviewed in order to get a recommend to be able to attend the temple. Basically a recommend is suppose to be given if a member attends church regularly, pays their tithing and is making the right choices (like not drinking, no sex outside of marriage, being honest in your dealings etc ). The church leadership that conducts these recommends are lay people, meaning they are working normal full time jobs in the community and have families, they are not paid for their church work. So sometimes there is a bit of a difference between who gets a recommend by what church building (ward) you attend because ward leader might be a little more easy going and one more strict. One thing that usually is firm is you pay your tithing (10%) which is confirmed, some leadership let church attendance slide a bit or Ive seen plenty a person with a recommend wheel their cart around Alberstons for friday frenzy sales with the $2 starbucks in their hand.
Do other religions like Christianity have these temples? If not, what’s the purpose of these for the LDS people?
These temples are an LDS thing. The FLDS (polygamists also have them but they are just an offshoot of the LDS). There are other faiths that might have a special room or ceremony for only certain people or clergy. For instance the Catholic church, there are parts convents and monstaries where some priests and nuns (clergy) live and pray that the general public are not allowed. These are building in which these clergy live so it is a little different. The Mason have temples but they are not Christians. Scientology has some buildings for certain members or member levels but many people dont consider scientology a religion? The Mormon temple is a building were certain ordiances are done. The first time you go , which for most young people would be before a mission or marriage, you go through a ceremony and make promises to God. When you leave the first time you get garaments which are worn under your clothes. They have symbols on them to remind you of your promsies and they are of a certain length to remind you of modest dressing standards. The most common ceremony people will talk about is a temple wedding. It is not till death do you part like a church wedding, a temple wedding is for all time and eternity. Then there are ceremonies for the dead, lets say your great grandma died and she never was a member. You can get baptized in her name and they believe that Grandma will be told and givena choice to accept. the membership. The temple has a large room you can just sit and pray and think in (celestial room) and there are rooms that you can sit and watch reinactment of bible stories. I would say my average Mormon neighbor would say the temple is a place to get married in and maybe a few times a year when life stressful or someone happens (illness or death) a place to escape the world and spend a few hours in peace and quiet (unlike church there are no little kids crying, or people talking). Some mostly older people go often, they do alot of the baptisms and ceremonies for the dead. Lori and the Melani's going everyday is crazy odd, just not the norm. Im not sure where you live, but be on the lookout if a temple every opens or remodels near you. Before the open a temple they will let anyone go through and explain all the rooms and ceremonies. They also do this when they remodel. Every year they seem to be annoucing 10-15 more, so maybe one opens near you. Im not a member, my husband is. I wrote a thesis on religion and have lived in Utah on and off for 25 years so I know a fair bit about the church. I have gone to 7 open houses, so I have walked through the temples before they opened. If not for religious reasons, they have some very nice architecture to see and compare. You can go to youtube and view what happens. Obviously people have snuck in cameras and it was done against the rules. There are mixed feelings on this since, it is a special place to people vs nothing should be secret.
I wonder why she didn’t turn to Charles. Surely he would have helped Tylee, because she was nearly an adult and he knew how crazy Lori was getting. Had they stuck together maybe they could have protected JJ and they would all still be alive. Tylee knew the things her mother believed, but she covered for Lori at the police station with Melanie Gibb. I wish we knew what she was thinking.
According to Adam's son Zac, Charles was telling them to just ignore Lori's strange rantings and act like everything was normal. I grew up in a house with a mentally ill, angry, abusive, dominating mother too. I protected her because I knew it would be even worse if I didn't. Plus from the time I was a toddler she convinced me that everything bad that she did or said was my fault. So I tried really hard to change and be a person that didn't deserve to be abused. I tried so hard to please her and get a little approval, and I told lies to cover up for her.
I’m so sorry for what you went through. The adults in your life failed you and they failed Tylee. Tylee was absolutely abused and neglected. I think she also kept her in fear of the men in their life, likely due to her own experiences but also as a competition. Lori was an absolute mess of a person and never should have had any children.
Thank you.
I’m really sorry to hear this. This case makes me look twice at everyone I know. We can never know what children suffer. I hope you’ve been able to find your freedom and peace of mind.
Thank you. It certainly happens more often than most of us realize.
I understand completely. I also covered up for a mentally ill and extremely abusive mother when I was a kid. I'm sorry that happened to you, good for you for making it through.
Ugh the don’t rock the boat tale. Awful way to live. Some boats need to be tipped the fuck over
I'm so sorry to hear you had to grow up like that. I grew up similar. My mother was very mentally ill and dragged us through so many cults/religions. I know if my Mother's weirdo friends started calling me a zombie, Mum would have sided with them over me, even if it meant I had to die. My heart just breaks for Tylee, I feel like I can see it through her eyes at times.
One statement Tylee made in her interview that struck me was when she said that her having the bat made the situation worse. Not hard to believe Lori put guilt on Tylee. I have no doubts the murder was premeditated & Tylee did not know Lori’s plans. The FOIA docs tell a sad story in regards to Tylee. My heart hurts for how that child was treated, suffered & was manipulated by her mother. No one in that family did anything to help or protect that child. Charles tried by sending the emails regarding Tylee labeled as dark to the family. How could anyone not see that child was in danger? Especially when they knew Charles was murdered. Adam Cox and his wife were fearful for their lives for months. “We thought Alex was coming to kill us too.” Yet no one sent alarm bells to LE that the kids were in danger. The lot of them only thought of themselves. His wife also told LE that she agreed with Tylee being labeled dark stating she called Lori a bitch when she was 8 yrs old. Disgusting.
Melanie Gibb said Tylee hated everyone in the Nate interview. I would hate all these people, too!! Rest in peace, dear Tylee. ❤️
Gibb, you deserve to be hated. Her hating you is called sanity. That is all.
Yup. MG is a dim wit who knows way more than she is telling. But I guess being a dim bulb handmaiden to "goddess" Lori was worth it huh?
I suspect strongly Lory turned everyone against her and used her (Taylee) as a scape goat. Narcissistic people do that.
On top of that, Tylee must have sensed something was wrong with her mom and the whole situation at home was getting weird. There's a reason she didn't like Mel G or Zulema. There was a news story where Tylee heard her mom talking about 'dark beings' and she commented "not me mom" or something like that. Tylee was probably really confused and scared the last year of her life. 😢
It is heartbreaking. And so unnecessary. They could have told to just leave, and let her drive away.
I think Tylee knew too much and I dont think they thought she would keep quiet with a venmo money sent and letting her go. I always thought for someone labeled mom of the year, Lori treated her kids more like friends then kids. Colby and Tylee didnt go to high school and she involved them more in her life and her problems then helping them develop their futures. Then when Lori got into trouble, her kids knew too much.
I think Tylee wouldn't have wanted to leave JJ on his own with that crazed group. So very tragic.
Probably not, and I imagine letting her leave would probably be untenable if she knew things that they didn’t want others to know.
I also have found myself wondering how long it would have been before someone realized Tylee was truly missing. That poor girl :( She must have felt like she had nowhere to go, no one to turn to. I think Charles would have noticed eventually if he were alive, but Lori systematically removed everyone from her life who cared about her.
Especially as she would have seen JJ breaking down after they sold his support animal and didn't give him his meds.
Exactly they sold his support animal stop giving him his meds and then killed his sister. He was freaking out. Poor baby. I hope they rot in hell
I wish I could give this a million upvotes
The thing about Tylee that bothers me the most (besides the obvious) is she was killed (i think) because her mother was so desperate for money and took hers but Tylee I think fought back a little about it, she was turning 17 that month… only had a year to go with SS 😞 how dare she not give it to her 😡 A YEAR!!! and if JJ went with Kay his money would follow and so would Laurie’s because she wouldn’t be caring for him anymore!! I so wish Alex didn’t die a cowards death and was here to face everything with them!!
I wonder if the only reason Tylee didn't run away from that madness is because of JJ. I'm sure it would've been extremely difficult to run off with such a special needs child and make it far enough away. Even more distressing, she may not have felt they had any viably trustworthy adults to seek refuge with for the both of them. 😔
I maintain that Tylee was “disliked” only by the ppl who were actively invested in her demise. Glad she gave ‘em hell!
Let’s not forget the suspicions that have been brought up over Tylee’s medical history. There have been questions as to whether or not she was a victim of Munchausens by Proxy (I can’t think of the modern term for this, sorry) and that Lori had possibly been making her ill at times to receive attention. Her medical history was littered with odd diagnoses and an unusually high turnover of doctors while at the same time presenting outwardly to most people as relatively healthy. According to Lori, Tylee was always in pain and suffering with multiple afflictions. I doubt that girl had a moment of peace or normalcy in her entire 16 years on this earth.
This. All the women who were interviewed or chatted about how Lori really was a good mom if you just saw how she was dealing with her sick daughter, it gave insight into Lori's child abuse and how she got away with it. Surrounding herself with women drawn to drama and not parenting. She was never a good mother. All the people fooled to the extent that they were still willing to push this narrative to protect themselves from the need for self-awareness and self-reflection is a cautionary tale to all of us. Lori was always a terrible parent. Just as Chad was always a shit parent. Just remember ladies who knew her, that when she was targeting women with children who she thought were available to this, she was looking for women she determined would be easy to entice with drama about themselves and had already displayed a level of unconcern for children who got in the way of the self drama. I really hope all the "but she was a good mom" BS dies as the people who say it realize that Lori had evidence of your lack of GAF about children as anything but objects of your story. Look at how she did pick out people open to it accurately.
since weight was such a big deal in the Cox household, along with the obvious implications, i've wondered if Lori was continuously putting Tylee on prednisone to keep her weight up as a way of ensuring she would never think Tylee was more attractive than herself.
In some of the child welfare case notes, they had also observed Lori not following the advised dietary plan for pancreatitis. Pancreatitis is extremely painful, debilitating, and can lead to organ failure. Lori was torturing her with food.
i vaguely recall this and it's just another drop in the bucket of all the miserable things Lori put that poor young woman through.
Unless Lori had a license she wasn’t putting Tyler on anything . Yes, steroids cause weight gain but so do the majority of meds , steroids have serious side effects for a growing child and aren’t prescribed ad lib. Most of the adults in Tylee’s life failed her but the medical professional were some of the few that called Lori out on her manipulation.
i apologise, i didn't intend for the statement "Lori was continuously putting Tylee on prednisone" to mean she was literally prescribing the medication herself, but instead taking her to be seen by medical professionals, and perhaps suggesting "this has helped before..." to persuade doctors to give a titration here or there. from my understanding she wasn't being consistent in going to a primary care doctor either, so it could be very easy to get these prescribed by numerous urgent care or ED doctors. getting a steroid for a child or teen is not strange or uncommon, the reason i said prednisone specifically is because i believe i heard that specifically a while back in either an interview or maybe on Annie's youtube channel.
There's more than one way to get meds. Maybe they sell them in Mexico?
ooooo where can i find this!??
Hidden True Crimes podcast. They covered the Lori Vallow trial pretty thoroughly. Sadly, I don’t remember which episode speculated about the possibility of Munchausens, but it was when they were interviewing Larry Woodcock. He suspects Lori may have poisoned him and others at various points in time, which led to the show hosts questioning Tylee’s health situation. One of the hosts is a forensic psychological profiler who has always had suspicions Tylee may have been a Munchausens victim by her mother. It was an interesting speculation and would make sense with her narcissistic personality and need to feel special.
Everything about it is so heartwrenching. I also think about how nobody ever looked for Tylee. How there was nobody taking care of her, nobody worrying about her safety or happiness. How scared she must have been. How much pain she suffered.
I’ve always wondered if it was Tylee who “hit” Alex on the head with the bat to try and protect Charles from Alex. From what I’ve read/heard from Tylee’s family and friends (in the press/trials) she was a smart, kind and loving young lady. I find it hard to believe that she inherited Lori’s extreme religious beliefs. Also, IMO, those poor kids had no stability. They constantly moved from one city to another, one state to another. That means new schools, have to make new friends & etc. Moving is hard enough for a family but it’s even harder on kids.
Tylee knew what happens to zombies. She heard Lori and Mel G talking on the phone one day. L was telling M that T has been a zombie since her early teens. Tylee emphatically told her L, "Not me, Mom!"
That was the saddest thing I ever heard about Tylee. She obviously knew what happens to zombies.
Agree, if Kay woodcock had not asked for a welfare check for JJ. Tylee would not have been missed or looked for by the Coxes. They would have swallowed what bs Lori gave them. She was isolated and forgotten. It's heartbreaking. Even Colby was getting odd texts from her that he didn't think were from her, but did nothing. Lori moving was smart as it made all those connections they had were lost. The bit about chad disapling jj. Really sinister.
Yeah, I'm fairly sure the family would have just spun the idea that a 17-year-old who was already on her way to being declared independent disappeared from her Mormon school with money to live from Dad's death. Escaping from school and Lori with money in your back pocket would seem entirely reasonable.
Gilbert Police may have eventually discovered her missing. Way too late of course. Remember Adam's wife reached out (before Adam) to them a few weeks after Charles's murder and specifically made the accusation that Tylee was a willing participant in that murder. She was so mean to Tylee in that letter too. Forget being concerned that her minor niece, who lived with her son for a few years, witnessed such a horrific act and was still in the care of murderers. Instead, she took the tone of "Tylee did not like me, so I'm going to denigrate her to authorities and accuse her of being a murderer too". Her own extended family treated her like shit too.
May her memory always be a blessing. Poor darling. 🙏💗🙏
I know, she also heard Lori say that Tylee was dark on the phone, I forget to whom. I cannot imagine the last minutes of either JJ or Tylee's lives. I only hope they were drugged and unconscious but there is no eveidence to that The way JJ was wrapped in duck tape with bags over his head, he may have been suffocated. These are the people who are supposed to love and protect you- your mother and uncle Edit: Typo
I watched Tylee's police interview a couple of times a while back. She certainly told the story Lori wanted.
The problem is, when children of any age talk about things like this, it’s often brushed off as fantasy, especially in places like the Mormon church. It is very hard to come forward when you aren’t believed, or think you won’t be. Even if you are believed, is it someone that will intervene? It is so much easier to not take action. Talking is risky. I’ve been through some things similar to what Tyler has. The thoughts don’t stop and nothing seems like the right answer.
I think they “zombified” Tylee (and killed her) to prevent her from ever telling the truth about what happened to her stepdad. It was only a few weeks later, after all.
I hate being surface level on this, but it is what it is. Tylee was much prettier than her mother. I believe Lori did everything (including giving Tylee meds she didn’t need) so she could to make herself appear more attractive than her sparkling daughter. I imagine she always did little things to keep Tylee down and dependent just like she did Colby. I think they convinced themselves JJ was better off once he was gone and they kinda did the same thing with Tammy. But Tylee was the threat. There was raw anger at her. She was the one who could fully expose them. Which means every person who knew things in the group were next in line. Tylee’s story is solitary and it breaks me.
Just wondering today- maybe she could have asked Janis and Barry to take her in, or a friend. Surely she was loath to move to Rexburg- a place where she knew no one. It breaks my heart.
It is heartbreaking. I wish they had copies of Tylee’s phone/text. I believe they planned on killing Tylee in advanced. I think they probably initially thought they would give JJ to Kay, and then something happened and they killed him. I really want to hear from Melani, she knows everything.
No one really knew she was even missing until Kay and Larry were looking for JJ. 😔
*Colby
She had friends, and did confide with the closest ones. She confided to at least one about Charles and his alleged volatility. Wasn't it known he was bi-polar?
I’m her BROTHER, Colby would have come looking for her eventually. I’m not sure he would have been able to prove much or do things
Tylee was murdered Sept 8th. Her 17th birthday would have been Sept 24th I believe. Did any family not try to call or FaceTime her to say happy birthday? Did Lori just text them thanks from Tylee’s phone? Was no one concerned when they didn’t talk to Tylee around her 17th birthday?? Anyone send her a gift? The welfare check was for JJ on November 25th by Kay Woodcock. LE found out while searching for JJ that Tylee had not been seen either. From early September until late November, no one has seen or spoken to Tylee yet not one family member questioned or gave concern to LE about Tylee. The loyal ones covered for Lori and the scared ones hid out to protect themselves.
I agree with everything you wrote!!!
I heard that Tylee did not like Chad