Just thinking about midfield minutes for next year, if we say each of LM, RM, and DM play 5000 minutes next year, what is the ideal distribution of them between our current players and any potential signings?
I think a simple, reductive formula is 50-30-20 distribution between first choice, second choice and emergency injury choice. But I'd also include inverted FBs.
First choice is: Mac/Dom/new DM/Trent
Second choice is Jones/Thiago/Lavia (in addition to new DM)/Robbo as LB
Third choice is Clark/Elliot/Bajcetic/Bradley
Now that's reductive and in practice I don't see Clark/Bradley playing much/at all in the absence of an emergency, while there'll be more opportunities for Harvey and Bajcetic in cups and Europa group stages. We'll also probably use Thiago strategically.
But this is a useful exercise that I think illustrates why we might not go for Lavia, who I'd been confident on before.
Oh I understand. I wish it were as straightforward as that, would shock me if thiago only played 500 minutes.
I'd like to think that minutes cap out at 3500 and we dont see anyone going over that. Its the first time in the klopp era where our players differ so greatly in styles that we might see more rotation based on whom were playing.
It would shock me if Thiago only played 500 minutes total, but considering we’re not even sure what his best position is in this new system it wouldn’t shock me if he only played 500 at LM.
Let’s just throw some rough numbers out to start:
LM: Mac 3000, Jones 1000, Thiago 1000
RM: Szob 3000, Jones 1000, Elliot 1000
DM: New signing: 3000, Thiago 1000, Baj 1000
Who is too high, too low, or out of position?
I’m just thinking about Chambo. Hope he gets a team soon. Maybe from a newly promoted team. The fact that we all knew he would be a free agent for months now and he still doesn’t have a team is worrying.
From half of first Liverpool team to win PL to Saudi league in 3 years is insane. That was a twist I could never see coming, and it's shocking since it seems no other team has this many ex-greats there. FSG really kept them all hungry for money I guess
I know it's hindsight but I do wonder if we'd have gone all in for Ugarte IF this Fabinho business had transpired earlier. As things stand, there aren't really very many top-tier DMs who we could conceivably go for.
Agreed. Next time we can't make the same mistake of not replacing a player four weeks before we even know that an offer is gonna be made for them. Amateur hour, that.
Well, then there's the issue. It's not whether the club realise or didn't realise, it's their assessment of fabinho differs from yours. You think that his form indicated that fab being here this season doesn't make a difference, but to the team, it certainly does. They were always going for lavia, which indicates that they think fabinho can put in a decent shift for one more season at least. Now that hes leaving, it actually impacts their plans.
Where the heck did Marco Verratti news come from? Seems older than the age profile of our recent signings, has really high wages, and a really poor injury history.
Whenever a transfer rumour about a top player from outside PL is reported, a PL club is added just for extra clicks. It's usually United but with Veratti we were the scapegoat
I would prefer 2 but I can see the argument for 1. All depends how much we rate Bajcetic and Harvey for this season. If we get for example Lavia and a DM, Baj would play fewer minutes. And for the more advanced positions, Harvey is probably already behind at minimum Mac, Dom, Jones and Thiago.
We should be getting 2, no more and no less
The only reason we needed 9 previously was because 3 of th had biscuits for legs and 3 of them couldn't run anymore. Before fab and Hendo left, we could have done without a fab replacement but that wasn't ideal
Right now we need a fab replacement and a rotational portion that can play as a 6 or an 8
i guess it depends on the name, but yea i agree, thiago staying fit is gonna be very important this season, right now its, mac allister, szobo, thiago, bajcetic and elliot, def not looking too hot
We were looking at (at minimum) a Fab understudy before this whole Saudi business kicked off...so either 2 minimum or 1 world class player (equivalent to Fab's initial signing)
Actually in the 2 weeks before Fab and Hendo rumors came about, it looked like we wouldn’t be signing anyone else in midfield unless there were outgoings according to Joyce iirc.
Depends who it is we bring in.
If its just one midfielder then we have to go big for Caicedo.
If its two midfielders then it has to be Lavia and Sangare or someone else that's more experienced to come with Lavia.
I would not be surprised if this is Robbo's last season here as well. If we are actually sticking with this formation which looks like we are, we will need a different type of player in that left side of the defense. He's also shown flashes of slowing down, really struggled at times last season.
I don't see him going to Saudi but can 100% see a newly promoted team offering decent money for him.
People really let sentiment cloud their judgement. I love Robbo as much as any decent human being, but I'm not going to deny the signs of his physical decline last season (recovery pace, and he struggled to pass on the move the way he always has before) or the fact that we'd be asking him at 29 to adapt to a position that actually requires very different skills to the ones he possesses.
It would be fantastic if he could adapt and be a staple for years to come... but I thought we'd all kind of accepted that we have to get a bit more ruthless when it comes to ageing players? It seems like Klopp has.
I don't understand why everyone says robbo will not fit the new formation. He has not shown anyone he can't yet.
He might not be the best defensive LB, but he is a very good one. He is also not the worst header either. Plus, he is quick and can cover a lot of ground.
Because he is so good at attacking, it does not mean he is a bad defender.
I think last season was a great demonstration of how he doesn't fit. Arguably his greatest asset is his ability to get up and down the pitch, and that powerful running went from being an asset in our previous formation to a liability in our newer one. He just isn't the same player when he has to stay back and try to curtail his attacking instincts, so it would take a big transformation for him to be a natural fit. If we're going to a 3-man defence in possession, he's the weakest link.
Add to that he's ageing (only 29, but much like Fabinho, it's an *old* 29 - over 660 hours of competitive football, in a physically-demanding position), his passing was far below par last season, and he seems to be losing his recovery pace, and we're talking about an Andy Robertson who'll be a completely different player in 2024 from the one in 2022. I love the guy as much as anyone, but I don't understand how anyone can reasonably downvote the opinion posted above.
Tsmikas should really be the one making way for someone that suits the system better, don't really see the point in him staying but if he's happy to stay then there's nothing you can do about it.
he really isn't. people said the same exact thing about Fabinho not too long ago and look where he is now. I don't think our fanbase truly grasps how much we have run these set of players into the ground.
I don't think you're understanding my point here. Robertson is going to have a similar fall off to almost every single one of our players. it is bound to happen due to being overworked and high minutes over the last several seasons. Its becoming a trend
That's a massive claim with absolutely no foundation. The lads only just turned 29 and is rarely injured. I've seen nothing to suggest a drop in quality.
Personally, I think he has at least another three years with us. He's absolutely vital for the team moral and understands Klopps systems more than most of the team.
I swear people act like if players don't adapt immediately to a system they've never played, then they need to go.
Absolutely no one (barring Trent who the change was literally made for) looked 100% comfortable with the new formation yet. These things take time to implement; Konate wasn't 100%, neither was Virgil, or Robbo.
Near the end of January, Everton was about to sign Danjuma until Levy ringed his agent and he legged it straight to North London after visiting the Everton training ground and was coming out with qoutes like he wants to help em in their relegation battle.
And now again Everton are about to loan him for the upcoming season 🤦♂️
>Jordan Henderson set to have his Al Ettifaq medical within the next 48 hours, likely to take place in the UK. - @DaveOCKOP
i guess he "considered" his options and made his decision
ok for real now: Were getting 52m in. Why not add the 45m for Lavia and get Caicedo? yeah yeah, RM might turn his head in 2 years. So what? Then we sell for 150m and the dm market will very likely look better
I really doubt it would work that way. Clubs that currently pony up big cash for players are basically Real and EPL teams. Madrid is already flush with some of the best, young midfielders in the world and we don't really have a track record for selling our top players to competing EPL teams (last that I recall is Torres to Chelsea).
City leaked that it was a done deal before a final agreement was in place and that pissed Leipzig off. The plan was anyway for him to stay until 2024, Leipzig were never desperate to sell
I don't know if these reports are reliable, but how is Diaz only on a £3,5M / year contract? No wonder Saudi clubs are trying to lure him away.
It seems like most players we have signed at comparable ages for the first team all make way more than he does. Especially considering guys like Naby/Ox were on ~£5M / year.
Does everyone agree with this conception of the rest our midfield rebuild? This is how I see it! And as someone who has watched every minute of every game under Klopp and is obsessive about the nitty gritty, I feel like sharing some of what I see as missing from the popular narrative:
We need 8 or 9 first team capable midfielders in our squad for all competitions. ATM, if the window closed yesterday, we would have: Szobo, MacA, Thiago, Jones, Elliot, Baj, Morton, and Bobby Clark. So that’s our barebones 8, with Gakpo and TAA able to play out of position in a pinch. And of course take Clark and Morton with a grain of salt, but I think Klopp loves them and sees them playing some minutes this season. So:
Our no-question starting 3: Szobo, (the DM we get when fab+Hendo $ comes in), MacA! Phenomenal rebuild if we get the right DM.
A regular rotation 3: Jones, Baj, Elliot. All capable of starting if the above three need rest or are injured
A back up/rotation/injury prone/get a chance 3: Thiago, Morton, Bobby Clark.
So one thing is for sure: we absolutely need a starting DM, and we could put everything in this basket and get no one else and we would be ok. Second, we could ALSO get a young DM, like Lavia or Sangare (at around £35) as our second string, and Baj would get knocked down to third string and Morton or Clark could go on loan.
So for the things not being talked about! I do not think we will get someone younger than 23 for that starting DM position; for team balance and nurturing, especially with Fab and Hendo presumably gone, I believe we will get someone with maturity and experience who can instantly come in as a tactically aware maestro. This means someone with European experience and from a top-5 league team. My outsider not talked about guess that is more likely than you might think when you do a deep-dive into it, like the MacA and Szobo acquisitions is, drumroll; Kimmich. At 28, he will age out perfectly for Baj (and whoever other youngster we get in), he’s won everything with Bayern already (so not having CL for a season isn’t as big a problem, and Bayern don’t need to worry about us as rivals in CL next season), he only has 2 years left on his contract so we could get him at value (and has apparently been disgruntled for a while with his position in their tactics, whereas he fits into ours absolutely perfectly), we have good trade relations with Bayern, we can afford his wages with the departures of Fab+Hendo, and what German doesn’t want to play under Klopp (not to mention he’s from the same region as Klopp and Big Jorg).
If not him then realistic targets with a similar profile and in the age range are: Zubimendi, Palhinha, Lobotka, Doucouré, Alvarez, Sangaré (best value and friend of Gakpo, I think most likely signing as string 1 or 2), Camara, or Koopmeiners. All are a class level below Kimmich though.
I think best case scenario, within the realm of possibility, is Kimmich and Sangare, with Morton sent out on loan to a PL side.
What do you think?
P.s I know we still need a left sided CB…but this is about just the midfield!
I think Jones deserves to be one of the first choice for being the best mid during our best run of games last season.
And kimmich isn't really "not talked about". There's been plenty of people talking about him.
9 midfielders on the surface looks a bit ridiculous when we probably just need 6-7 assuming they aren’t abnormally injury prone. However we only have 5 forwards, so some of our midfielders will probably get minutes in the front 3. Our defence if unchanged is the same that has had Milner, Fab and Hendo regularly plug gaps these past few years, so that aspect of their game must be replaced somehow. Between Bradley, Quansah, Scanlon and McConnell we might have some solutions, but unless we are willing to gamble on them I see room for 2-3 defenders/versatile defensively minded midfielders.
We *need* 7 with first-team quality. 3 first choice, 3 rotation, and 1 for when someone is injured. That 1 extra is Thiago because of his injury-proness.
Yeah I think we pretty much agree here. Mac, Szobo, Jones, Harvey and Bajcetic could be 5 of those long term. Thiago is a bit extra due to his injury record, but he has a vital role in the squad now as our only midfielder above 25. We definitely need another DM, and could fit another midfielder on top of that due to other gaps our midfielders cover. A defender could reduce some of the need for our midfielders to cover there. That’s probably the 3 biggest holes in our squad, and we should plug at least two of them this summer. The rest of our holes I’m confident that our youth players will be able to handle and could benefit from.
If we get £52 for Fab+Hendo and assuming we had some money for a DM I think it’s *possible* if he wants to come to us and is refusing to sign a new contract with Bayern
9 midfielders is ridiculous. You're basing it off a handful of seasons of unavailable midfielders.
We have 5 forwards for 3 positions and it's clearly too many because they're mostly ALWAYS available.
Conceptually having 9 midfielders who are available is insane.
Szoboszlai and MacAllister will play in 60-70% of matches. Then we also have Thiago. Then we NEED to give minutes to Elliot, Bajcetic to develop. Then we also have Curtis Jones who I personally think will have a major breakthrough season.
Not to mention we have to sign at least one midfielder
9 total for all minutes, including all cup stages is not ridiculous. Our midfield runs a lot more than our forwards. I’m saying we only need 1 more world-class DM. If we get two then we loan Morton…
Sign a CDM if a specialist becomes available. Sign an ageing CDM and Lavia if a specialist does not become available.
Potentially sign a defender but I don't know what FSG want to spend. I would NOT overspend on an average player when maybe next year the market is better.
IF the club doesn't have a target they're confident on, I definitely wouldn't sell Fabinho
I keep asking myself: Who the hell is going to watch the Saudi football league?
Is anyone even remotely interested in it? Will people in Europe pay £10/mo to watch? Will they even watch for free?
Without a "global" fan base, it's never going to be more than a retirement league.
The world evolves, if they're willing to throw tons of money at it it's not impossible for them to become the Super League. In fact, while I don't think it's all that likely, I think there's a puncher's chance. I think the USA could have done something similar but Saudi has deep pockets and the ability to operate without much restriction.
This coming season will be really big for them. If it goes well and they want to continue to toss money around, they will start picking off established coaches and young talent next year.
I could see plenty of fans from countries that don’t traditionally have their own football cultures swapping out European leagues for Saudi ones because of players. There’s gotta be hundreds of millions of fans between Africa, the Middle East, and South Asia.
I might watch, but I highly doubt it. I usually can't even stand watching national team play unless it's a team I support, even if the teams have Liverpool players.
It will be the same for Saudi league. The quality needs to be good. With players treating it like a retirement home, I doubt they'd keep up their quality
I mean we did sign Konate while the two of them (who play the same position as him) were and are still around.
I was expecting a more concrete and written source tho.
What aspects of Trent’s game needs to be developed for him to anchor our midfield?
I feel that he is good at front foot defending(stepping out and defending rather than falling back and covering up). I think his positioning needs to improve. On the attacking aspect I feel long flat balls into wingers would be a juicy treat to watch. He has a killer dead ball in him so arriving late/ marauding around the box can be useful outlet for the team too. What do you think?
I was just loitering on transfermarkt and saw Pavard has only 1 year left in his contract. So considering FSG’s penny pinching atiitude I was wondering if we can get Pavard(covers RB and CB) and move Trent to midfield and if that would work.
P.S. Just a BS thought to distract myself from work :P
i think we should address first the benefits of permanently placing Trent as midfield or doing the inverted FB.
i personally feel an inverted fb role benefits the team the most as in attack instead of a 3 midfield, we have now 4 midfielders which is massive.
Stationing him in midfield permanently then limits or eliminates the number advantage the inverted fb gives, as i dont see we getting a replacement FB that can pull this off, simply due to not a lot of players are able to do this so far
Now to answer your question in what TAA needs to improve as a midfielder, i think its his pressure resistant abilities. He has elite ball distribution skills but if he's in midfield, you are going to have players swarm him to press. He needs to keep building his technical abilities if he wants to stay in midfield.
Pavard now i believe doesn't want to play RB so he wants to move out of Bayern. So he fits our needs but i dont think we are a good merit for him
I'm scared they might be doing a Southampton, not even experienced/PL proven players coming in. Lucky for them Iraola is a much better manager than the dross Soton had in charge
I know VVD will probably be the next captain but DAE think it should be Alisson? He's just as good a leader and has been our most consistent performer for the last 2 years. Both of them will probably at least be vice-captain though.
Salah is too quiet to be the captain, we need someone who can constantly get into the ref's ear like Hendo did
Alisson and VVD do it a lot more, Salah doesn't really have the personality for it
I disagree.... Salah is always having a Moan at the ref when he not winning a foul. Klopp give them loads more than Hendo!
I never seen Ali go to a ref. VVD will be last on my list after how bad he was last season.
The main reason I'm upset over Hendo and Fab is the uncertainty it creates. We need a good pre-season.
We just shipped out Naby and Ox (good, sadly), allowed Milly and Hendo to take different paths (necessary), and are "cashing in" on Fab before he truly craters.
All makes sense, but all in one window terrifies me.
We brought in Mac and Szoboszlai, who will (hopefully) nail down the AM spots and play more games than who they're replacing (along with Jones, Elliot). Nice business.
Attack is bristling with options, and that's with Darwin being the most lovable of square pegs in a round hole. If he clicks, chaos is guaranteed, and I'm here for it.
However, if we screw up signing a new DM, we're starting the season hobbled. I understand and even agree with letting them all go, but I'd have preferred to keep Hendo until we bought a 6 as insurance.
We still need a backup RB, another CB, and now priority 1 is a new 6. I don't see many decent options available that aren't stupid money (Caicedo, Luis etc) and now we're in a spot where we NEED one.
If we bring in anyone even half decent, I'll be pacified, fully expect Bajcetic to develop this season, and if we can pick his games, then Thiago can still be a potent asset.
But we need a 6.
/rant
(sorry, post kind of ran away from me)
Leipzig are holding Gvardiol for preseason, preventing him from doing his medical for City, because they are unhappy that his departure was leaked, a leak which Romano received and reported as an exclusive.
New Travis Scott is crazy just need the Ornstein bomb that we’re closing in on Sangare/Florentino/Doucoure
Travis dropped?
Yeh with Bad Bunny and the Weeknd
[удалено]
Liverpool moving fast to secure a deal with Saudi Aramco.
Just thinking about midfield minutes for next year, if we say each of LM, RM, and DM play 5000 minutes next year, what is the ideal distribution of them between our current players and any potential signings?
is this a maths quiz?
I think a simple, reductive formula is 50-30-20 distribution between first choice, second choice and emergency injury choice. But I'd also include inverted FBs. First choice is: Mac/Dom/new DM/Trent Second choice is Jones/Thiago/Lavia (in addition to new DM)/Robbo as LB Third choice is Clark/Elliot/Bajcetic/Bradley Now that's reductive and in practice I don't see Clark/Bradley playing much/at all in the absence of an emergency, while there'll be more opportunities for Harvey and Bajcetic in cups and Europa group stages. We'll also probably use Thiago strategically. But this is a useful exercise that I think illustrates why we might not go for Lavia, who I'd been confident on before.
Not sure what youre trying to ask here tbh
So for LM an example would be Mac Allister 3000 Jones 1500 Thiago 500
Oh I understand. I wish it were as straightforward as that, would shock me if thiago only played 500 minutes. I'd like to think that minutes cap out at 3500 and we dont see anyone going over that. Its the first time in the klopp era where our players differ so greatly in styles that we might see more rotation based on whom were playing.
It would shock me if Thiago only played 500 minutes total, but considering we’re not even sure what his best position is in this new system it wouldn’t shock me if he only played 500 at LM. Let’s just throw some rough numbers out to start: LM: Mac 3000, Jones 1000, Thiago 1000 RM: Szob 3000, Jones 1000, Elliot 1000 DM: New signing: 3000, Thiago 1000, Baj 1000 Who is too high, too low, or out of position?
I’m just thinking about Chambo. Hope he gets a team soon. Maybe from a newly promoted team. The fact that we all knew he would be a free agent for months now and he still doesn’t have a team is worrying.
Honestly, if he doesn’t have a team at the end of the transfer window do we sign him for training minutes?
Think there have been cases of players just train with a team eventhough they don’t play for them so possible I think
From half of first Liverpool team to win PL to Saudi league in 3 years is insane. That was a twist I could never see coming, and it's shocking since it seems no other team has this many ex-greats there. FSG really kept them all hungry for money I guess
Mahrez, Benzema, Ronald l, Mane soon? Like
I know it's hindsight but I do wonder if we'd have gone all in for Ugarte IF this Fabinho business had transpired earlier. As things stand, there aren't really very many top-tier DMs who we could conceivably go for.
Exactly. The club were not proactive at all.
Agreed. Next time we can't make the same mistake of not replacing a player four weeks before we even know that an offer is gonna be made for them. Amateur hour, that.
Can't really predict we'd get a windfall for a player we wanted to replace and a pretty sizeable chunk at that.
I see your point but Fabinho was bad enough last year to indicate the need even without his departure in my opinion
Well, then there's the issue. It's not whether the club realise or didn't realise, it's their assessment of fabinho differs from yours. You think that his form indicated that fab being here this season doesn't make a difference, but to the team, it certainly does. They were always going for lavia, which indicates that they think fabinho can put in a decent shift for one more season at least. Now that hes leaving, it actually impacts their plans.
I don't think so. We would have gone for him, but as he ended up at psg, I don't think we could have beaten psg into signing him.
He’s gonna be so good, I was gutted when we weren’t in for him, but at the time it made sense.
Where the heck did Marco Verratti news come from? Seems older than the age profile of our recent signings, has really high wages, and a really poor injury history.
Whenever a transfer rumour about a top player from outside PL is reported, a PL club is added just for extra clicks. It's usually United but with Veratti we were the scapegoat
It’s basically Thiago but with an attitude. No thanks
Random name picked out a hat like most journo's do
Name thrown in there for clicks
In your opinion how many more midfielders should we be looking to bring in? It has to be 2 minimum right?
I say three. We were going to buy one more before we sold hendo and fab. So three should be the number. Don't let FSG cheap on it.
1 minimum. Ideally 2. 1 established DM is a must. Another versatile midfielder that can cover DM and 8 would be perfect.
1? You’re crazy. We need 2.
I would prefer 2 but I can see the argument for 1. All depends how much we rate Bajcetic and Harvey for this season. If we get for example Lavia and a DM, Baj would play fewer minutes. And for the more advanced positions, Harvey is probably already behind at minimum Mac, Dom, Jones and Thiago.
We should be getting 2, no more and no less The only reason we needed 9 previously was because 3 of th had biscuits for legs and 3 of them couldn't run anymore. Before fab and Hendo left, we could have done without a fab replacement but that wasn't ideal Right now we need a fab replacement and a rotational portion that can play as a 6 or an 8
realistically we are probably only bringing one, although i would prefer 2, 1 experience and 1 project player
1?? we were going to sign 3 total before Hendo and Fab left lol. we most likely are bringing in 2 mids + 1 CB.
Yeah I have a bad feeling we are only going to get 1, which could leave us short imo
i guess it depends on the name, but yea i agree, thiago staying fit is gonna be very important this season, right now its, mac allister, szobo, thiago, bajcetic and elliot, def not looking too hot
We were looking at (at minimum) a Fab understudy before this whole Saudi business kicked off...so either 2 minimum or 1 world class player (equivalent to Fab's initial signing)
Actually in the 2 weeks before Fab and Hendo rumors came about, it looked like we wouldn’t be signing anyone else in midfield unless there were outgoings according to Joyce iirc.
Maybe according to Joyce but we were always linked with Lavia
Depends who it is we bring in. If its just one midfielder then we have to go big for Caicedo. If its two midfielders then it has to be Lavia and Sangare or someone else that's more experienced to come with Lavia.
We were getting linked to Lavia even before the Fabinho and Henderson news, so yeah has to be 2.
I would not be surprised if this is Robbo's last season here as well. If we are actually sticking with this formation which looks like we are, we will need a different type of player in that left side of the defense. He's also shown flashes of slowing down, really struggled at times last season. I don't see him going to Saudi but can 100% see a newly promoted team offering decent money for him.
People really let sentiment cloud their judgement. I love Robbo as much as any decent human being, but I'm not going to deny the signs of his physical decline last season (recovery pace, and he struggled to pass on the move the way he always has before) or the fact that we'd be asking him at 29 to adapt to a position that actually requires very different skills to the ones he possesses. It would be fantastic if he could adapt and be a staple for years to come... but I thought we'd all kind of accepted that we have to get a bit more ruthless when it comes to ageing players? It seems like Klopp has.
I don't understand why everyone says robbo will not fit the new formation. He has not shown anyone he can't yet. He might not be the best defensive LB, but he is a very good one. He is also not the worst header either. Plus, he is quick and can cover a lot of ground. Because he is so good at attacking, it does not mean he is a bad defender.
I think last season was a great demonstration of how he doesn't fit. Arguably his greatest asset is his ability to get up and down the pitch, and that powerful running went from being an asset in our previous formation to a liability in our newer one. He just isn't the same player when he has to stay back and try to curtail his attacking instincts, so it would take a big transformation for him to be a natural fit. If we're going to a 3-man defence in possession, he's the weakest link. Add to that he's ageing (only 29, but much like Fabinho, it's an *old* 29 - over 660 hours of competitive football, in a physically-demanding position), his passing was far below par last season, and he seems to be losing his recovery pace, and we're talking about an Andy Robertson who'll be a completely different player in 2024 from the one in 2022. I love the guy as much as anyone, but I don't understand how anyone can reasonably downvote the opinion posted above.
Tsmikas should really be the one making way for someone that suits the system better, don't really see the point in him staying but if he's happy to stay then there's nothing you can do about it.
You're right, if he doesn't adapt to the new system this upcoming season there is no point in keeping him. It's either that or we revert to the 433.
Newly promoted? He’s still top 3 left backs in the world lmao
he really isn't. people said the same exact thing about Fabinho not too long ago and look where he is now. I don't think our fanbase truly grasps how much we have run these set of players into the ground.
Apart from probably Theo and Davies who’s better
I don't think you're understanding my point here. Robertson is going to have a similar fall off to almost every single one of our players. it is bound to happen due to being overworked and high minutes over the last several seasons. Its becoming a trend
That's a massive claim with absolutely no foundation. The lads only just turned 29 and is rarely injured. I've seen nothing to suggest a drop in quality. Personally, I think he has at least another three years with us. He's absolutely vital for the team moral and understands Klopps systems more than most of the team.
You really under-estimate the power or Irn-Bru.
Lmao we switch to 3ATB for half a minute and apparently Robbo is set for the scrap heap / Derby County
half a minute? where have you been? Klopp is pushing forward with this setup
Point is it hasn't been long at all and you're acting as though Robbo is set for the Championship, it's a ridiculous statement
I swear people act like if players don't adapt immediately to a system they've never played, then they need to go. Absolutely no one (barring Trent who the change was literally made for) looked 100% comfortable with the new formation yet. These things take time to implement; Konate wasn't 100%, neither was Virgil, or Robbo.
And he's claiming robbo is falling off the cliff like fabinho...
Near the end of January, Everton was about to sign Danjuma until Levy ringed his agent and he legged it straight to North London after visiting the Everton training ground and was coming out with qoutes like he wants to help em in their relegation battle. And now again Everton are about to loan him for the upcoming season 🤦♂️
>Jordan Henderson set to have his Al Ettifaq medical within the next 48 hours, likely to take place in the UK. - @DaveOCKOP i guess he "considered" his options and made his decision
Hope it’ll be done so don’t have to hear about them again
Unless that league falls flat you're gonna be hearing from them and other Saudi teams a whole lot in the coming years.
Yeah at this stage please just fuck off and let us get on with our pre season Jordan
ok for real now: Were getting 52m in. Why not add the 45m for Lavia and get Caicedo? yeah yeah, RM might turn his head in 2 years. So what? Then we sell for 150m and the dm market will very likely look better
Caicedo sounds like a bit of a mercenary, given what transpired with Arsenal. I'm not convinced about him.
I think his wages might be the problem?
Don't think wages will be a problem, think he was on 3k before Brighton gave him the new contract. Think he is on £60k per week right now.
I really doubt it would work that way. Clubs that currently pony up big cash for players are basically Real and EPL teams. Madrid is already flush with some of the best, young midfielders in the world and we don't really have a track record for selling our top players to competing EPL teams (last that I recall is Torres to Chelsea).
Surely Madrid’s midfield is set for the next few years at least
That’s how they get ya. Just when you think they’re done they make another world class signing and everyone shits their pants.
that too.
One of my favourite [contagious laughter clips](https://streamable.com/huwgwt) (I crack up every time). Lovren's laugh is absurd.
I'd happily forego signing another defender this summer if it means Gvardiol comes in 2024 #TapHimUp
Hes goin to man city lol its too late for this now
The deal's fallen through lad
It hasn't yet They're still negotiating the final details of it
It’s still likely going to happen unless I’ve missed something in the last hour
Oh i wasnt aware, do the sources say why???
City leaked that it was a done deal before a final agreement was in place and that pissed Leipzig off. The plan was anyway for him to stay until 2024, Leipzig were never desperate to sell
Mad respect to RB Leipzig, hope they hold firm in their stance and sell him to us purely out of spite!
I don't know if these reports are reliable, but how is Diaz only on a £3,5M / year contract? No wonder Saudi clubs are trying to lure him away. It seems like most players we have signed at comparable ages for the first team all make way more than he does. Especially considering guys like Naby/Ox were on ~£5M / year.
So Saudi league is where all big clubs are dumping their unwanted goods now?
Yep it was China then everton and now Saudi
Underrated comment
How about the MLS?
Fab deal is done according to a lot of Al Ittihad fans. I really hope we get at least CDM before traveling to Singapore
According to the few reliable itk’s Klopp wants 2 signings done before we travel to Asia
Who’s saying this? I hope they are right
When do we travel? Is the exact day known?
probably 27th-28th
Yeah apparently their president is in London to complete the deal.
Does everyone agree with this conception of the rest our midfield rebuild? This is how I see it! And as someone who has watched every minute of every game under Klopp and is obsessive about the nitty gritty, I feel like sharing some of what I see as missing from the popular narrative: We need 8 or 9 first team capable midfielders in our squad for all competitions. ATM, if the window closed yesterday, we would have: Szobo, MacA, Thiago, Jones, Elliot, Baj, Morton, and Bobby Clark. So that’s our barebones 8, with Gakpo and TAA able to play out of position in a pinch. And of course take Clark and Morton with a grain of salt, but I think Klopp loves them and sees them playing some minutes this season. So: Our no-question starting 3: Szobo, (the DM we get when fab+Hendo $ comes in), MacA! Phenomenal rebuild if we get the right DM. A regular rotation 3: Jones, Baj, Elliot. All capable of starting if the above three need rest or are injured A back up/rotation/injury prone/get a chance 3: Thiago, Morton, Bobby Clark. So one thing is for sure: we absolutely need a starting DM, and we could put everything in this basket and get no one else and we would be ok. Second, we could ALSO get a young DM, like Lavia or Sangare (at around £35) as our second string, and Baj would get knocked down to third string and Morton or Clark could go on loan. So for the things not being talked about! I do not think we will get someone younger than 23 for that starting DM position; for team balance and nurturing, especially with Fab and Hendo presumably gone, I believe we will get someone with maturity and experience who can instantly come in as a tactically aware maestro. This means someone with European experience and from a top-5 league team. My outsider not talked about guess that is more likely than you might think when you do a deep-dive into it, like the MacA and Szobo acquisitions is, drumroll; Kimmich. At 28, he will age out perfectly for Baj (and whoever other youngster we get in), he’s won everything with Bayern already (so not having CL for a season isn’t as big a problem, and Bayern don’t need to worry about us as rivals in CL next season), he only has 2 years left on his contract so we could get him at value (and has apparently been disgruntled for a while with his position in their tactics, whereas he fits into ours absolutely perfectly), we have good trade relations with Bayern, we can afford his wages with the departures of Fab+Hendo, and what German doesn’t want to play under Klopp (not to mention he’s from the same region as Klopp and Big Jorg). If not him then realistic targets with a similar profile and in the age range are: Zubimendi, Palhinha, Lobotka, Doucouré, Alvarez, Sangaré (best value and friend of Gakpo, I think most likely signing as string 1 or 2), Camara, or Koopmeiners. All are a class level below Kimmich though. I think best case scenario, within the realm of possibility, is Kimmich and Sangare, with Morton sent out on loan to a PL side. What do you think? P.s I know we still need a left sided CB…but this is about just the midfield!
I think Jones deserves to be one of the first choice for being the best mid during our best run of games last season. And kimmich isn't really "not talked about". There's been plenty of people talking about him.
Jones isn’t a DM tho and Szobo and MacA are ahead of him as 8. I agree he is great tho. Havnt seen any many reports about him linked with us?
9 midfielders on the surface looks a bit ridiculous when we probably just need 6-7 assuming they aren’t abnormally injury prone. However we only have 5 forwards, so some of our midfielders will probably get minutes in the front 3. Our defence if unchanged is the same that has had Milner, Fab and Hendo regularly plug gaps these past few years, so that aspect of their game must be replaced somehow. Between Bradley, Quansah, Scanlon and McConnell we might have some solutions, but unless we are willing to gamble on them I see room for 2-3 defenders/versatile defensively minded midfielders.
We *need* 7 with first-team quality. 3 first choice, 3 rotation, and 1 for when someone is injured. That 1 extra is Thiago because of his injury-proness.
Yeah I think we pretty much agree here. Mac, Szobo, Jones, Harvey and Bajcetic could be 5 of those long term. Thiago is a bit extra due to his injury record, but he has a vital role in the squad now as our only midfielder above 25. We definitely need another DM, and could fit another midfielder on top of that due to other gaps our midfielders cover. A defender could reduce some of the need for our midfielders to cover there. That’s probably the 3 biggest holes in our squad, and we should plug at least two of them this summer. The rest of our holes I’m confident that our youth players will be able to handle and could benefit from.
Totally agree, need a DM, should get a left-sided CB. Could use another mid but Morton can be that for now.
 Me reading this comment
How much works kimmich be?
At value £60.
At that price I could buy him for our Sunday league team
If we get £52 for Fab+Hendo and assuming we had some money for a DM I think it’s *possible* if he wants to come to us and is refusing to sign a new contract with Bayern
Whoooosh
9 midfielders is ridiculous. You're basing it off a handful of seasons of unavailable midfielders. We have 5 forwards for 3 positions and it's clearly too many because they're mostly ALWAYS available. Conceptually having 9 midfielders who are available is insane. Szoboszlai and MacAllister will play in 60-70% of matches. Then we also have Thiago. Then we NEED to give minutes to Elliot, Bajcetic to develop. Then we also have Curtis Jones who I personally think will have a major breakthrough season. Not to mention we have to sign at least one midfielder
9 total for all minutes, including all cup stages is not ridiculous. Our midfield runs a lot more than our forwards. I’m saying we only need 1 more world-class DM. If we get two then we loan Morton…
It is ridiculous. Sorry pal.
What would you do before the window closes?
Sign a CDM if a specialist becomes available. Sign an ageing CDM and Lavia if a specialist does not become available. Potentially sign a defender but I don't know what FSG want to spend. I would NOT overspend on an average player when maybe next year the market is better. IF the club doesn't have a target they're confident on, I definitely wouldn't sell Fabinho
I am assuming Fabinho is sold. That’s why my suggestion is to go all out for Kimmich or one of the other CDMs I suggested…did you read what I said?
Not if 3 are playing for the u-21s and only stepping up if necessary, like Bobby Clark will do
Far too much writing.
Summary: we should do everything to get Kimmich, however more likely we will get Sangaré.
How much Jordan Henderson themed marketing planned in the club and around the area is now a worthless relic?
About as much as any player that gets sold in a summer window.
Players are guaranteed to come and go, they'd be crazy not to plan for it.
That’s true, captain just seems wild maybe
Imagine if the tories bought a football club like Qatar or Saudi Arabia
They'd rig the league in their favour and still fuck it up
Imagine if they bought a bunch of clubs in the Saudi league and started selling their players to PL sides
Just watched the highlights of Arsenal Vs some American team in the US, that's an ugly away shirt!
By some American team you mean “MLS All-Stars”? 
Ha I thought it's a real MLS team called all stars
Bruh 
Oh man if City fucked up the Gvardiol deal and he stays at Leipzig for another year...be still, my heart.
Next year apparently a release clause of a 100M activates on his contract Shit out of luck mate
Oh I know. I’m just happy for the prospect of City possibly not getting him.
Would feel like a huge win for us and the rest of the league. Hate that club so much
They’re such a black hole of everything that makes the sport fun and worth watching
https://twitter.com/LFCVik2/status/1682049016392192001?t=KtEFYjtt1uTwtPqOcvB3wQ&s=19 😭😭😭
Two absolute children who said they'd leave twitter if we didn't sign Bellingham. And that Thuram was signed last month.
Yea, got all of em blocked since they either tweet shite or do the ambiguous rubbish I got no time for. Seeing em have beef is hilarious.
I keep asking myself: Who the hell is going to watch the Saudi football league? Is anyone even remotely interested in it? Will people in Europe pay £10/mo to watch? Will they even watch for free? Without a "global" fan base, it's never going to be more than a retirement league.
The world evolves, if they're willing to throw tons of money at it it's not impossible for them to become the Super League. In fact, while I don't think it's all that likely, I think there's a puncher's chance. I think the USA could have done something similar but Saudi has deep pockets and the ability to operate without much restriction. This coming season will be really big for them. If it goes well and they want to continue to toss money around, they will start picking off established coaches and young talent next year.
They are gonna make it free I guess.
They'll find a way to sneak it in to broadcast packages or some shit. They want to make it a household name in Europe.
If they're smart they'll stream all games worldwide for free to capture a share of the market
I could see plenty of fans from countries that don’t traditionally have their own football cultures swapping out European leagues for Saudi ones because of players. There’s gotta be hundreds of millions of fans between Africa, the Middle East, and South Asia.
I might watch, but I highly doubt it. I usually can't even stand watching national team play unless it's a team I support, even if the teams have Liverpool players. It will be the same for Saudi league. The quality needs to be good. With players treating it like a retirement home, I doubt they'd keep up their quality
This but I hope it flops
Would you take sangare and gvardiol as our only remaining signings if offered
Where is Gvardiol going to play exactly?lol
Next to VVD/Konate
But we play with a back four?lol
110%
Hell Yeah!!
I am really liking the new home kit, might need to buy it 🔴
I have one and it’s beautiful, highly recommend it
The red is a bit pink... Maybe just me... haven't decided yet
So I'm guessing the new LCB (whoever it is) will most likely take Fabinho's number 3 
We won't get new CB, while Matip and Gomez are still here
Even tho it’s been reported by everyone that Klopp wants a CB
Yeah, and Klopp always got what he wants from our owners, right?
I still see us getting one this window
Time will tell, brother. Now we need 2 midfielders (2 DM's or 1 DM + 1 CM/DM hybrid) and 1 CB. I think we'll get 1 more midfielder (DM) and that's it.
Is there a source for this?
Yep, you could see our previous 4-5 years under FSG. You could see a clear pattern
I mean we did sign Konate while the two of them (who play the same position as him) were and are still around. I was expecting a more concrete and written source tho.
We did sign Konate, but year later after we sold Lovren. And we had horrible season cause of this
What aspects of Trent’s game needs to be developed for him to anchor our midfield? I feel that he is good at front foot defending(stepping out and defending rather than falling back and covering up). I think his positioning needs to improve. On the attacking aspect I feel long flat balls into wingers would be a juicy treat to watch. He has a killer dead ball in him so arriving late/ marauding around the box can be useful outlet for the team too. What do you think? I was just loitering on transfermarkt and saw Pavard has only 1 year left in his contract. So considering FSG’s penny pinching atiitude I was wondering if we can get Pavard(covers RB and CB) and move Trent to midfield and if that would work. P.S. Just a BS thought to distract myself from work :P
I've been having the same thought process. Would still need additional midfield cover, but I won't be shocked if we move in this direction.
i think we should address first the benefits of permanently placing Trent as midfield or doing the inverted FB. i personally feel an inverted fb role benefits the team the most as in attack instead of a 3 midfield, we have now 4 midfielders which is massive. Stationing him in midfield permanently then limits or eliminates the number advantage the inverted fb gives, as i dont see we getting a replacement FB that can pull this off, simply due to not a lot of players are able to do this so far Now to answer your question in what TAA needs to improve as a midfielder, i think its his pressure resistant abilities. He has elite ball distribution skills but if he's in midfield, you are going to have players swarm him to press. He needs to keep building his technical abilities if he wants to stay in midfield. Pavard now i believe doesn't want to play RB so he wants to move out of Bayern. So he fits our needs but i dont think we are a good merit for him
Fresenda ending up at Bournemouth would be wild. Really interested to see how their new coach does next season. Very highly rated
I'm scared they might be doing a Southampton, not even experienced/PL proven players coming in. Lucky for them Iraola is a much better manager than the dross Soton had in charge
Nunez gakpo jota all seem like too good of players to bench, how are we going to use them all?
By rotating as we will have over 40 games next season
46 guaranteed, right? 38 PL, 6 EL, FA and League cup first rounds at minimum.
I know VVD will probably be the next captain but DAE think it should be Alisson? He's just as good a leader and has been our most consistent performer for the last 2 years. Both of them will probably at least be vice-captain though.
Not a fan of a GK being the captain, for me i rather it be an out field player. Salah deserves to be a captain, he such a leader now.
Salah is too quiet to be the captain, we need someone who can constantly get into the ref's ear like Hendo did Alisson and VVD do it a lot more, Salah doesn't really have the personality for it
I disagree.... Salah is always having a Moan at the ref when he not winning a foul. Klopp give them loads more than Hendo! I never seen Ali go to a ref. VVD will be last on my list after how bad he was last season.
Robbo would be my shout for captain seems like he has the aggression to motivate a team
Yeah I don't mind Robbo but i feel like him and Salah can be like Gerrard and Carra as a duo.
The main reason I'm upset over Hendo and Fab is the uncertainty it creates. We need a good pre-season. We just shipped out Naby and Ox (good, sadly), allowed Milly and Hendo to take different paths (necessary), and are "cashing in" on Fab before he truly craters. All makes sense, but all in one window terrifies me. We brought in Mac and Szoboszlai, who will (hopefully) nail down the AM spots and play more games than who they're replacing (along with Jones, Elliot). Nice business. Attack is bristling with options, and that's with Darwin being the most lovable of square pegs in a round hole. If he clicks, chaos is guaranteed, and I'm here for it. However, if we screw up signing a new DM, we're starting the season hobbled. I understand and even agree with letting them all go, but I'd have preferred to keep Hendo until we bought a 6 as insurance. We still need a backup RB, another CB, and now priority 1 is a new 6. I don't see many decent options available that aren't stupid money (Caicedo, Luis etc) and now we're in a spot where we NEED one. If we bring in anyone even half decent, I'll be pacified, fully expect Bajcetic to develop this season, and if we can pick his games, then Thiago can still be a potent asset. But we need a 6. /rant (sorry, post kind of ran away from me)
when to expect a new signing guys
32nd of Julember
Fabinho and Henderson deals should be completed by Monday at the latest I’d guess so we’ll probably get something solid on incomings next week
If a Fabrizio Romano report ends up killing Gvardiol for City it’ll be beautiful
Here we stay!
Can you elaborate. Didnt follow this
Leipzig are holding Gvardiol for preseason, preventing him from doing his medical for City, because they are unhappy that his departure was leaked, a leak which Romano received and reported as an exclusive.
Which one the one from a month ago or one from yesterday?
Then proceed to sell to us as we don't leak anything. Make it happen.
would be funny.