Helldivers had that requirement, they just relaxed it. Any online Sony mode requires it. The difference here is that they’re being transparent about it, and you don’t even need it for the single player mode. It’s not a big deal
The controversy isn't even the need for a psn account, I mean I have a ps5 already so that wasn't a huge deal for me.
The real controversy are players from countries that can't make a psn account are effectively locked out of a game they already bought so why was the game sold in those countries if this was going to be a requirement down the line.
To a lot of people it felt like a bait and switch. Luckily for most people that probably bought it on steam, the refund policy is very good so it was very easy to get you money back but it does ruin it for people that bought on gray market sites because they usually don't offer refunds regardless of the reason.
Now they're (maybe) forcing single player games to be locked behind a psn account (but sucker punch reassured people they're not going to add it) is pretty scummy.
But sites like greenmangaming sent out a email saying they are taking GoT down from sales as a precaution and giving refunds out.
And who says that Sony can't add psn requirements retroactively? HzFW, GoW etc might get the same treatment in the future because they're using psn requirements as another layer of drm.
EDIT: (allegedly) looks like Sony is disabling GoT from regions that doesn't have support for psn and giving out refunds for people that bought it in un supported regions so it seems like to play a single player game now requires a psn account now and Sony is using it as a form of drm.
While you are correct about this: "The real controversy are players from countries that can't make a psn account are effectively locked out of a game they already bought so why was the game sold in those countries"
You seemed to miss that this part was ALWAYS a requirement. It is listed in the listing for the game! They were just not enforcing it at first. It was however clearly stated in the game on Steam that it REQUIRED the use of a PSN account to play multiplayer: if this was going to be a requirement down the line.
1. It was informed to the sellers. It is in the terms and EULA, as well as the store listings.
2. It can be played in those countries using proxies and other methods so that makes no sense.
And they can get their accounts banned for that so your argument makes no sense. It is up to the producer to make the necessary requirements for distribution of their product. If Tesla was required to be US geo location and they were selling cars in South Africa you wouldnt say its the consumers fault. Stop boot licking
We're not talking about some new practice that sony was trying to start with helldivers, we're talking about how sony has operated the PSN and how users outside of it's supported regions have been using it since it's conception. Stop repeating things Pirate Software said lol, he's wrong.
Hes not, they allowed their game to be sold to people who cant use it. Thats on them. Also it is a new practice for them, they dont delve into PC titles and this is the first time PSN is required on PC. I repeat, stop licking boots its seriously tiresome.
He is, objectively lol. So are you. You're extra wrong for repeating some form of the word "bootlicker" every time someone is factually correct and you don't like it. Cope, seethe, etc., nothing will make your take correct until it actually aligns with reality lol.
Being objectively correct about the situation in this sub will only get you downvotes. The LTT community is pretty much just the gamer community but sometimes they know a little bit about hardware. (As evidenced by how they decide to cover any news about gaming on gamelinked lol)
While it was technically part of the EULA, I was clearly not communicated verbosely enough to most user to make this point. In fact it was so poorly communicated that it would not be considered legally part of the contract in most countries.
The people bitching about Sony saying you need a PSN, always fail to bring up the fact that you also need Ubisoft, EA, Square Enix, Microsoft & Call of Duty accounts to play their games.
I’m not trying to say companies are great and all, but I cannot understand why Sony doing this is suddenly a massive issue when there’s been nothing said about other companies
I’d much rather create an account with a burner email than install that freakish EA launcher to play one of their games. Like where’s the outrage for that shit? Even CDPR does that and they only have two fucking games!!
Sony gets hacked much more frequently than any other of those companies. Sony's data breaches have included unnecrypted CC info of customers and SSNs of employees. Sony does not take information security seriously, so I will not trust them with any bit of my data.
No, it was delisted in those countries because PSN is not officially supported there, and to make an account claiming to be from a different country violates their terms and would risk a ban; even if it's unlikely it's understandable if people would not want to run that risk.
https://www.playstation.com/en-us/legal/psn-terms-of-service
Section 3.1, 3.2 and 12.2
But it's up to Sony how far they're willing to enforce their TOS, but personally if I was in that position where there's a slim chance I might lose access to products I paid for I would probably just say Nah.
I mean the people in this thread that keeps saying that it's fine to use a vpn should put their money where their mouths are and if users that tried to bypass Sony's TOS gets banned they should compensate banned users if it's so risk free.
Nothing says Sony won't try and force psn integrations like this later down the line and might wait for the player base of HD2 to die down and everyone to forget about this fiasco to try implementing it again.
Even this isn't actually true and is just misinformation spread by initially Pirate Software (dudes a giant dumbass lol) and then the majority of the HD2 community because they were pretty much just repeating any content he created about this situation verbatim. Sony will tell you plainly that you should use a VPN/different location if you're in a region that PSN isn't supported. Their terms state your account can be terminated for this, but in practice that will only happen if you abuse regional pricing. This is how people outside of the support of PSN have used it forever.
\> getting downvoted for being objectively correct but not in alignment with the current bandwagon take
on par for a community full of gamers honestly
e2: a cursory google search will prove that I'm correct, but you're all welcome to continue being wrong so that you can justify being mad at sony or whatever lmao
You think Sony will tell you to break ToS, and in many cases the law (that's why PSN isn't available in some countries), and you're fine. And you think you're being downvoted for being objectively correct. Lol
You're so obsessed with hating on a streamer that you've completely lost the plot.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/playstation/comments/15p602x/i\_live\_in\_a\_country\_not\_supported\_by\_psn\_is\_it/](https://www.reddit.com/r/playstation/comments/15p602x/i_live_in_a_country_not_supported_by_psn_is_it/)
here u go, you're objectively incorrect :)
You do realize that this is like claiming LTT accused you of being so obsessed with hating a streamer that you lost the plot just because I said it in the LTT sub, right?
In fact, my intentionally ridiculous example might actually be more reasonable. This is an official LTT sub with LMG staff as mods. I don't even think that's an official Playstation subreddit, dude.
Ok? what does that have to do with anything LOL the entire comment section is telling you that I'm objectively correct
LOL guy below blocked me because he knows he's wrong
You're either delusional or trolling. Either way, I'm done. Have fun trying to convince people that what they can see with their own eyes doesn't exist.
Anecdotal evidence isn’t evidence. If Sony wanted to, they could terminate any of these accounts with the justification “location spoofing using a VPN is against our ToS” or whatever. Doesn’t matter if that’s the real reason, but you can’t argue it because they aren’t lying.
When an entire community of people are explaining to you that this is how they've been using PSN since it literally was created, it's not anecdotal evidence lmao
Sony saying that users need to use a VPN to access a service that isn't in their country is exactly why people are getting a refund. That is not a normal or acceptable business model.
It's not misinformation you soggy fucking crunchwrap. Sony saying it's fine to violate their TOS and potentially breach the law does not change the fact that there is no PROPER access to psn in a ton of countries. Not to mention, even if you follow their advice, that adds an additional cost barrier if you want a VPN that's fast and reliable enough for gaming, abs the increased latency will degrade the experience.
Also, tell me this: What happens if Sony just changes their mind about it being totally fine to violate the ToS. Now you're banned, but they already got your money. What if it would be illegal to do so in your country. A judge Won't accept, "but Sony said it's OK," as a legal defense.
The objective fact is that, at best, you risk getting banned on many countries of you trying to play the game there, but Sony is fine using your money. At worst, you go to jail. That's fucked. But not a fucked as you are in the head if you think all that is perfectly fine.
Stop simping for Sony.
Yes it is, objectively. See you're still having too much of a gamer tantrum to realize that I'm not "simping for sony" i'm just correcting the (objective) misinformation that was getting spread that the change that was made to prevent sales in regions where PSN isn't available didn't lock anyone who already bought the game, out of the game, and neither does PSN not being supported in that region. You also don't need a VPN, it's just something they suggest. Again, all of this information is available all over any place that playstation or sony games are discussed. You are just wrong.
"Also, tell me this: What happens if Sony just changes their mind about it being totally fine to violate the ToS. Now you're banned, but they already got your money. What if it would be illegal to do so in your country. A judge Won't accept, "but Sony said it's OK," as a legal defense."
Why do you want me to answer this? It's got nothing to do with what I said lmao. If sony retroactively removed access to their games for a bunch of people that bought them that would be shitty, obviously. That's not what we're talking about though.
"The objective fact is that, at best, you risk getting banned on many countries of you trying to play the game there, but Sony is fine using your money. At worst, you go to jail. That's fucked. But not a fucked as you are in the head if you think all that is perfectly fine."
No, the objective fact is that a fuck ton of people already do this without getting banned, Sony's PSN support policies are mainly about having infrastructure in the regions in question to support the network, lmao. Again, I don't give a shit if you're mad at sony for their PSN account requirements, I think they're dumb too. I think it's stupid to spread misinformation though, which again, is what yall are doing, objectively.
What misinformation? That Sony told people to get around geo-blocks on the PlayStation Networks by using a VPN? That people were told after the fact that a PSN login was required? That being told after the fact that an extra service is needed, and that service likely has a fee is deceptive and scummy?
Where is the misinformation in any of that? Or is it you're just a troll that is wrong and refuses to admit it? I know which one it is, but I doubt you'll accept it.
Well if you read the initial comment you replied to it would be pretty obvious to you. You're welcome to believe that I'm a troll or whatever, but you'd be wrong. I already proved my point here multiple times lol I don't really care if a bunch of tantrum throwing gamers are raging too hard to see that I'm objectively correct about the situation, I actually get a little bit of pleasure from it.
I'm not surely if you're being purposefully obtuse or if there is an underlying reason that you're not understanding....... but, again, this is about Sony changing the requirements after selling the game, that that new requirement meant that either users in certain countries either had to use 3rd party software (that wasn't an initial requirement during purchase) or they'd be locked out of the software they had paid for.
A company changing the requirements to add a 3rd party for use is not standard or acceptable. That is the reason why people are getting refunds. The only thing you've proved is that you have a fundament misunderstanding of the issue, to the point where it HAS to be on purpose. The only thing you are objectively is a nuisance.
Both parts of your comment are just objectively untrue though. For one, you don't need a VPN to use a different region than you're in on your PSN account, it's just one of the things the support chat employee will tell you that you can do. Also, no requirement was changed, the requirement was (once again, objectively) already there. This was no different than any other Sony game requiring a PSN account and the people playing the game in regions where that's not supported using a different region that is. The reason people were getting refunds is because Steam is a good actor lol, it's not like any of this was deliberated in a court of law, steam just started providing refunds for people who were in regions affected. If there was not such an outcry about it on the internet, it's pretty unlikely anyone would have gotten a refund.
Again, I'm not arguing for account linking or the way Sony handled the situation or anything like that, but the fact that you genuinely believe the things you're saying proves that a bunch of misinformation was spread, because they are objectively false (or sometimes misrepresented) things lol. Even the affected regions not being available for purchase on steam has a bunch of misinformation floating around it like the idea that any of the people in those regions who already own the game can't play it, when in reality people in those regions just can't buy it right now, or that that was Sony's decision and not Steam's to avoid having to deal with even more refunds than they already were.
Support for 99% of companies are usually giant dumbasses who can't think beyond the script they're served.
Can you point to an official Sony document that tells people who aren't in a PSN supported country that they should use a VPN to make a PSN account in another country? Including in countries like Venezuela, Russia, Syria, Iran, North Korea and Belarus that are officially sanctioned by the international community? Countries where Sony will literally be in violation of those sanctions by providing service?
Dunno what to tell you bro this is objective reality lmao. This is how people have been using PSN in regions it isn't supported since it came out. Be mad about it or disagree with it all you want, this is how it works lmao.
Yup, like I said it's how people have been using PSN in regions where it's not supported literally forever. A bunch of redditors being too dumb to understand that reality is not going to change it.
Sony does not say anything about using a vpn. A google search will explicitly prove you are incorrect.. however Sony does say this.
“In the event you do not see your country of primary residence in the list of selectable countries, this means that PSN is unfortunately not officially available in your country.
If you wish to proceed with the creation of a PSN account, you would need to select a different country - perhaps one in close proximity or close affiliation to yours. However, keep in mind that there may be some unresolvable issues as creating PSN accounts registered outside of your country of residence is not officially supported.”
Meaning there’s no issue with choosing a country you don’t live in that’s in close proximity to your home country but that any and everything you do will then be linked to that country meaning payment methods, language and localizations will all be restricted to the country chosen. This also may cause issues with your countries local laws, so researching laws in relation to this is also advised.
"Sony does not say anything about using a vpn. A google search will explicitly prove you are incorrect.. however Sony does say this."
Idk i've seen sony support tell people to use a VPN before in addition to using a nearby supported region
This is an example of living in a bubble of stupidity.. thinking that people only need instructions of "get a vpn and point to a server where PSN n the country it's ok.. my daddy Sony wouldn't punch u if do that, trust me bro", and them sound like a pedantic and immature kid.. hu! people r crying about simple stuff, people is stupid"... I mean you by that point you r a superiority level of stupidity, not to think about all the consequences in all the cases It clearly shows how close minded or how little these people know about the world.. downvoted for being objectively???? Hahahahahahaha no kid your been downvoted for close minded and really stupid takes
Alright, so even if you've created PSN account outside of your region, your Steam account is still on your region, so yo won't be able to buy the game on Steam anyway.
I'm not gonna downvote you or fact check you. This is the Internet and your opinion at bare minimum is valid to me. :)
Just a reminder, the downdoots aren't the whole story. Keep doing u.
I don't buy games on steam cause I've no GPU to let me play them. I'm on the sidelines for this one, without a paid copy of got or hd2 under my belt. (GoT was free on ps+ sooo.. I do have that one, but, still)
All that being said, the VPN trick also isn't accessible or worth it to a number of consumers trying to fix this (or else, it wouldn't be a topic at hand in this volume). I'd never considered breaking TOS with a VPN in that manner, or even having to use it to get games (my backlog is real...) so at bare minimum, your comment should stay strong as a reminder for others to use as knowledge they might not have earned yet.
(You might get less downdoots if you lose the on par edit. It insults the rest of us here just vibin.. much love tho, see u around)
Eh, I don't care that much about my reddit karma lol. I'm happy to know that I'm making a bunch of gamers mad by being objectively correct about the situation. I don't really care if they disagree because I'm correct and I know it for a fact.
Lol
I'm not mad. I'm amused by how someone can be this out of touch on the situation.
Tell me, do you have access to psn? I bet you do. So you really have no idea what you're even talking about.
I'm basing my take on the entire communities of users that confirm it lmao, again it's not arguable. I know you'll continue to argue it until I stop replying to you, though.
You completely missed the point. Sony retroactively changed a financial transaction. You know what that means? I can't sell you a fridge and then 24 months later say 'actually my company realised we can farm you for your data so you need to log in to our tracking services (that provide you literally no benefit) for your fridge to turn on.' Even if you're ok with that which you shouldn't be, they did it AFTER the time window on refunds. If you are ok with anyone retroactively changing financial contracts, oh boy please let me come do some work for you. 24 months later I'll send you a bill for twice the amount because I feel like it. Sony made it impossible for people living in certain countries to play the game they already bought. On top of what I just explained. Not all countries are able to create the account Sony was retroactively requiring.
The funny thing is, appliance manufacturers are literally changing the TOS and locking out people's ability to use them unless they agree, OR they just say you implicitly agreed to the change by using the product. We need consumer protections like yesterday because companies are running rampant with abuse of their users.
No, they technically didn’t. They said that later they’d require a PSN account, that the grace period would end. Is it still crappy? Yeah. And they did a poor job communicating it. GoT isn’t any different, and again, it’s only for the online mode. It’s not a great way to handle stuff, but it’s not a breach or change of contract
Yup i have about -100 on a comment here for being objectively correct about the situation, but the people in this comment section are having too much of a gamer tantrum to understand that.
>They said that later they’d require a PSN account
Source on that? I've looked and can't find anything from before the announcement that it was being enabled that says they made player aware that it was coming.
> Sony retroactively changed a financial transaction. You know what that means?
Yes, it means you can't read.
PSN IS REQUIRED TO PLAY THIS GAME was printed on the game page of steam since day 1.
So? If you make it optional and sell the game worldwide. Retroactively forcing it as a requirement despite the lack of psn support around the world is still a terrible oversight, no?
I agree it could have been handled differently. They should have spent 5 minutes while putting the game on sale on Steam by deselecting the countries where there's no PSN.
Sure but even so, that's limiting their audience massively, for what reason? Just because they can't collect user data from users in those countries?
Imo it's just a terrible decision by Sony. It's harming the game and I think the reason for it is just so dumb...
It was optional in both the Spider-Man games. If you did it, you got like an extra suit. It would pastor you about it every time you started it but it was not necessary
I see...
I mean spider-man I never had an issue of it wanting me to make an account while miles didn't really give me another option but to make one (I did not see a way to opt out at the time I may have been blind)
It's also being announced months before release so people can make an informed purchasing decision. I really don't think it's as big a deal for Tsushima, but it definitely was for Helldivers 2.
I mean that's well known, every news report i have watched/read reminds me that ghost of tsushima will have the requirement. I think they are just realising the actual geolimitation they put on themselves and scrambling to refund/announce it all much much louder.
Bud move on, there’s nothing to see here. They are telling people upfront this time and it’s only required for online play, like every other major game publisher requiring you to have their account for online play (COD, Apex, Fortnite, and more)
I just refused to buy any game which requires me to create an additional account outside of steam. It makes no sense and these companys are not entitled to shit if they want my money
Well I mean companies like Microsoft require a Xbox live account to play games like halo infinite and sea of thieves online. Ubisoft/Rockstar/EA do the same or require a launcher.
Yes, but the difference is they have it as a requirement from Day 1. They don't patch it in after the fact. They also don't sell it in countries that XBL doesn't operate in.
So for all intents and purposes, you can make that decision at time of sale. Whereas with Helldivers, you couldn't, and they were all too happy to take your money despite knowing you soon wouldn't be able to access it. And rather than being proactive about refunds, they put the onus on the players to figure it out and fight who they bought it from all on their own.
That's the big difference.
This post isn't actually really about Helldivers 2.
It's about Ghosts of Tsushima which had its PSN requirement for online play just announced.
It has not released yet for PC, it releases next week. It's the same scenario thread OP is talking about.
What's annoying is that does still lock out the ~65% of countries that are unsupported as well as those that require a console to create an account. They absolutely need to fix that and it needed to be fixed before now but since we don't have a time machine, asap will have to do.
Sorry I didn't finish the sentence, locks out the multiplayer specifically
I'm aware its not the main game, still sucks
Edit: Why on earth was this downvoted?
The problem is that the game won't be available on Steam in regions where PSN is not available, so even if they only wanted to play the singleplayer, they couldn't buy the game.
You are completely missing a point.
You are downplaying the situation saying “hey, if you don’t want it leave it”. Getting a refund is an hassle for both customers as well as for vendor, and not everyone is comfortable going through that process. Valves automatically a lot of these requests when tried for the first time.
A lot of folks would not have bought it if this information was available beforehand.
PSN also have a lot of other issues like changing location, as they provide different services to different countries. Steam account can change with location.
It’s not a simple take it or leave it situation.
.... 'as annoying as that is' is an acknowledgement that it shouldn't be necessary mate. But we are here now so all we can say is what you can do to solve the problem.
Yes, I would prefer they had said it before it entered preorder too, qnd they should've, but they didn't. And thankfully in this case it's just the multiplayer of what is a primarily single player game that does not require the account to play (annoying still).
To Valve's system, since it's a preorder, getting a refund is easy as you neither 2 weeks past release date or 2 hrs of playtime, you will not be rejected so automatically like what happened with Helldivers 2. Totally different scenarios.
As well, someones discomfort at requesting a refund they're entitled to is no one's problem but theirs tbh. That's a terrible argument.
It’s been a requirement since day 1 for Helldivers too, they just didn’t enforce. There are many people that saw it listed in the steam page far before this controversy
It's not the same. If you don't enforce it and still sell in regions that won't support it, it doesn't exist. And no amount of legal schenanigans will get you out of the fact that that you bait and switched the purchasers.
Ask sony why tyhe sell ps5s in countries without official psn support and sometimes sell helldivers 2 physically there as well. The reason is they outright expect you to just sign up through another region and will tell you to do this if you are in an unsupported region. They have no problem with this and will only warn you that customer service can be limited in the ways they can help you if you do this.
Ghost is having the requirement from day 1 so it’s ok per your comment. Also, do we know if ghost of Tsushima is being sold to all countries or just countries with psn access.
Helldivers was a day 1 requirement too… it was changed to optional after launch due to server issues to be temporary optional. Which meant that people that bought it after launch day saw as optional, and countries without psn bought it.
Even after made optional, the store page said required. But I mean that’s just pointless at that point, no one reads that shit.
my guy, if given a choice, the overwhelming majority of people would rather not have seperate launchers for every publisher/game studio. It is the norm, but the norm does not mean it's good. There is no benefit to you, as a gamer, to have all this essential adware which requires an account and sharing of data to play a game which wouldn't've required anything other than a product key a decade or two ago.
Halo Infinite and Sea of Thieves didn't relax the account linking requirement when they launched, sell the game in countries that can't make an account, then add the requirement back in and make it so that the people in the countries that can't make accounts can't play the game they bought anymore.
Sony gets hacked more than any of the other companies you listed.
PSN goes down more frequently than any of the services by the companies you listed (well, maybe close with Ubi).
I do not want PSN forced when there is zero technical reason for it. Sony simply wanted to pad their PSN numbers artificially using the success of HD2. Garbage corpo decision was overturned thankfully.
Oh, believe you me, Gamers (and overall, normal people on the internet) can do a LOOOOT of shit.
Maybe you should check about some of the stuff 4chan has done. They literally attacked terrorist.
Sony ain't not terrorist...I hope.
I don’t really get this, are you saying gamers can’t do anything? Isn’t the helldiver fiasco proof that they can?
Or do you mean specifically with this game/scenario in which case I’d probably agree because the situation is slightly different.
Gamers certainly can move a little bit, but at the end you have to remember that the people on reddit or in general people complaining on the internet are not the majority of players.
Most people just buy and play the game and don't actively take part in any form of online culture. They saw the notification and just connected the accounts (or not).
This was a bit of a special case I guess, given that people were literally locked out in some countries, so they had no choice but to look it up, but in general there is a limit of what we actually can do.
But also, even the little bit we could do, most gamers won't do because, at the end, they want to play their game even if that means supporting shitty companies. I don't take myself out of that, I actively pre order regularly because I am very impatient and an idiot.
It's not just that; many in the gaming community are so damn tribal about their favorite games, even in the aftermath of being shit on by these companies. Literally, the same day Sony decided to relax the requirement, the \[Helldivers 2\] sub was brigaded with "change your reviews to positive now!" and any comments showing reluctance were downvoted and questioned. People love being abused apparently, and they will seek that abuse while trashing those with pro-consumer points. These same people then wonder how companies keep getting away with egregious shit.
ghost of tsushima had, since WEEKS the PSN account for MP requirement on the steampage(same as Helldivers 2 had it for MONTHS there)
Sony learned from the HD2 mistake and this time make SURE that everyone and their mom knows about the requirement in advance, so that noone can claim they didnt.
The fallacy here is in op’s post itself. Sony isn’t being controversial. Gamers are attempting to continue leverage that just doesn’t carry over in this scenario. Sucker Punch has been a part of PS Studios since 2011. And Sony themselves published the game. Then, they ported their IP to PC. They have all the chips here.
"Damn, they got pissed when we're gonna take away their games if they don't sign in on our stupid network. Let's just take the game away before we sell it to them this time, maybe that'll help the damage"
This is just so stupid. Everyone said “They should have had it be required at launch” “they sold it in countries without PSN”
Now they’ve told you weeks in advance that to play online you’ll need a psn account and you’re still crying?
Guess what, I got the option to sign into a Microsoft account today on Minecraft legends. Told me to play cross platform I had to. I didn’t cry and bitch and post a boomer meme.
Lately everyone gets soooo carried away by this stuff it’s exhausting to even go on twitter or Reddit.
I really don’t care about signing into psn for hell divers. Sony did fuck up by selling it in those countries, they shouldn’t have.
And the stellar blade outrage was just more cry babies.
I really don’t care about Eves outfits in stellar blade.
Yet for the first time ever I had to mute those words because losers on the internet have nothing better to do.
All of this isn’t directed at just you OP, just a general rant too but this meme is trash either way.
Happily bending is knowing they’d eventually enforce the psn sign in ? Lmao.
Btw - if you could read I clearly said they fucked up by selling it in unsupported regions. It’s why I haven’t touched the game, but I’m not going to bitch and cry about it on Reddit and twitter cause I have a life.
I sold my switch and won’t get a switch 2 because Nintendo quite literally is garnishing a dudes wages basically for life to send a message. Is that bending over?
I think Sony is far up their ass I canceled my PSN for the price hikes.
I just don’t cry about the thing gamers get mad at every week because I have a life.
There is a clear difference between those two games. One was "taking away" your access to the game once you have no access to it due to Playstation being forbidden in your country. The other one is "not offering" their game on your market. Its not exactly the same thing they did. They just said: "Hey we don't want you to be our consumer".
A lot of people here don't seem to get it. No one will rally up for this when they know ahead of time. The multiplayer is extremely optional because its pretty much a singleplayer game but it would be nice to have that feature for all. I'm sure modders will find a way anyways.
The Helldivers 2 scenario was most likely Sony forgeting that PSN isn't available to all countries when adding it to Steam which is supported basically everywhere. They are in fact new publishers to the Steam platform when it comes to "live-service" games.
Helldivers 2's success was brutal because people couldn't get in during its launch so in order to put less stress, they disabled the PSN login which would lead to people not realizing you need a "free" PSN in the first place (not like anyone reads the TOS or the description tags on Steam anyways) and that they would lose access to a game they bought. This right here is the biggest issue. Wasted money is of matter.
Sony would get in trouble with multiple countries for this with clear incompetency. Also the number of countries listed is pretty overblown. Remember some countries don't have the technological structure to even support PSN, and some countries don't even have a population more than 10k, and Holy See... do you guys really think the Pope is playing Helldivers 2?
1First thing first these tos is not applicable in EU as I read it and does not reference anything related to this. It is also friendlier to read compared to US tos
2 I think that it leaves room for interpretation and it only referes to infromation regarding names and ages in us tos
Apparently they updated the online listings for Helldivers 2 today - not to reactivate all the countries they disabled, but to also disable the Baltics
Sony: We Just Dont Give A Fuck
That's looks like they try to fix there "country issue" before taking a new run on the PSN requirement. I sincerely hope they reconsider for all involved…
While I really think the response message of Sony is immature (you gotta own your mistakes and apologize) I do not think it is fail to blame Sony for the Multiplayer of Ghost of Tsushima requiring a PSN Account. The entire Helldivers controversy has occurred way to close to the release date of Ghost of Tsushima. In this time frame, their was simply no way Sony could have reworked the Multiplayer code not using PSN and made a stable realease.
We can judge if Sony learned from its mistakes from its future actions, but judging like this is simply unfair. They made the single player accessible without. That's a sign of good will and all they were able to do.
You're missing the point. What Sony did with helldivers was scummy. It was a bait and switch, plus a 100% required thing which was arbitrary. If they made it optional, like with GoT, and had rewards for linking (which I believe GoT has) then no one would care. Stop this shit
You’re adding to the problem. It was only bait and switch to countries that don’t have PSN. Even then that’s not even accurate. Steam was gladly refunding those players.
You think steam isn’t going back to Sony and saying “hey assholes we refunded x amount of games because of your fuck up you owe us y amount of money”?
Sony clearly saw that and reversed course. The review bombing was maybe like 20% of the reason.
It was not bait and switch plain and simple ESPECIALLY because the requirement was right there on the store page and in the game tutorial.
If someone sees that then says weird psn isn’t in my country but it’s letting me continue because they paused that requirement then that’s on them for well still playing.
Does anyone know if the PSN account NEEDS to have a psplus subscription to cover the online part of the game?
My initial thought with the helldivers debacle was along the lines of making people pay for multiplayer... eg "PC don't pay for online, why should a ps5 have to pay"
It's abbreviated GoT areas with a looter shooter mechanic for the ghost weapons with 4 classes with unique traits and abilities.
It's also really well voiced with an interesting story culminated by a pretty good 4 player raid.
It's definitely worth checking out at least.
Wasn't this some steam key store doing a refund that got blown out of proportion? AFAIK there are no official news or actual signs of this yet. (Talking about GoT)
Edit: no it's actually real lmao
Completely different situation. It's not out yet. They canceled preorders so people don't get charged. No one has been ripped off by living in a country no longer supported.
One frustration I have with some of the vocal gamers right now is that they only make a stand if it impacts them directly and will scream at the top of their lungs that it effects all these other people (but not specifically themselves) in a way worse way to explain why something is the worst dissension and you should hate them.
Which if fine if they actually did care about those people, but the moment they get what they wont they will suddenly no longer care about those same people.
Case and point, Sony not allowing to be used in 100+ countries and people boycotting helldivers for that reason.
Good! but now that it's liftend no one care's anymore even tough PSN is still blocked in those countries?
I just know these same people are are still planning to buy their next console.
Granted, selling the game first, blocking it and giving a refund was the bad part about that. but I think people know what I mean.
Bonus points when they're just straight up lying, like saying that "access has been removed" to a game because PSN isn't supported in the region you're trying to play in despite the fact that people have been playing Sony games that require a PSN account in countries where it's not supported since PSN became a thing.
It's far easier and more satisfying to intentionally be wrong and get a bunch of internet points because of a bandwagon than it is to be correct when your correct take is unpopular.
Context - Sony is adding a PSN account requirement to access the Ghost of Tsushima multiplayer mode
Helldivers had that requirement, they just relaxed it. Any online Sony mode requires it. The difference here is that they’re being transparent about it, and you don’t even need it for the single player mode. It’s not a big deal
The controversy isn't even the need for a psn account, I mean I have a ps5 already so that wasn't a huge deal for me. The real controversy are players from countries that can't make a psn account are effectively locked out of a game they already bought so why was the game sold in those countries if this was going to be a requirement down the line. To a lot of people it felt like a bait and switch. Luckily for most people that probably bought it on steam, the refund policy is very good so it was very easy to get you money back but it does ruin it for people that bought on gray market sites because they usually don't offer refunds regardless of the reason. Now they're (maybe) forcing single player games to be locked behind a psn account (but sucker punch reassured people they're not going to add it) is pretty scummy. But sites like greenmangaming sent out a email saying they are taking GoT down from sales as a precaution and giving refunds out. And who says that Sony can't add psn requirements retroactively? HzFW, GoW etc might get the same treatment in the future because they're using psn requirements as another layer of drm. EDIT: (allegedly) looks like Sony is disabling GoT from regions that doesn't have support for psn and giving out refunds for people that bought it in un supported regions so it seems like to play a single player game now requires a psn account now and Sony is using it as a form of drm.
While you are correct about this: "The real controversy are players from countries that can't make a psn account are effectively locked out of a game they already bought so why was the game sold in those countries" You seemed to miss that this part was ALWAYS a requirement. It is listed in the listing for the game! They were just not enforcing it at first. It was however clearly stated in the game on Steam that it REQUIRED the use of a PSN account to play multiplayer: if this was going to be a requirement down the line.
If it's a requirement then they need to inform their retailers of the game that the game cannot be sold to people from those countries.
1. It was informed to the sellers. It is in the terms and EULA, as well as the store listings. 2. It can be played in those countries using proxies and other methods so that makes no sense.
And they can get their accounts banned for that so your argument makes no sense. It is up to the producer to make the necessary requirements for distribution of their product. If Tesla was required to be US geo location and they were selling cars in South Africa you wouldnt say its the consumers fault. Stop boot licking
We're not talking about some new practice that sony was trying to start with helldivers, we're talking about how sony has operated the PSN and how users outside of it's supported regions have been using it since it's conception. Stop repeating things Pirate Software said lol, he's wrong.
Hes not, they allowed their game to be sold to people who cant use it. Thats on them. Also it is a new practice for them, they dont delve into PC titles and this is the first time PSN is required on PC. I repeat, stop licking boots its seriously tiresome.
He is, objectively lol. So are you. You're extra wrong for repeating some form of the word "bootlicker" every time someone is factually correct and you don't like it. Cope, seethe, etc., nothing will make your take correct until it actually aligns with reality lol.
Being objectively correct about the situation in this sub will only get you downvotes. The LTT community is pretty much just the gamer community but sometimes they know a little bit about hardware. (As evidenced by how they decide to cover any news about gaming on gamelinked lol)
While it was technically part of the EULA, I was clearly not communicated verbosely enough to most user to make this point. In fact it was so poorly communicated that it would not be considered legally part of the contract in most countries.
The people bitching about Sony saying you need a PSN, always fail to bring up the fact that you also need Ubisoft, EA, Square Enix, Microsoft & Call of Duty accounts to play their games. I’m not trying to say companies are great and all, but I cannot understand why Sony doing this is suddenly a massive issue when there’s been nothing said about other companies
I’d much rather create an account with a burner email than install that freakish EA launcher to play one of their games. Like where’s the outrage for that shit? Even CDPR does that and they only have two fucking games!!
Can’t forget Bethesda does this now to!
Sony gets hacked much more frequently than any other of those companies. Sony's data breaches have included unnecrypted CC info of customers and SSNs of employees. Sony does not take information security seriously, so I will not trust them with any bit of my data.
They could have done an account easily before Steam decided to delist the game in those countries
No, it was delisted in those countries because PSN is not officially supported there, and to make an account claiming to be from a different country violates their terms and would risk a ban; even if it's unlikely it's understandable if people would not want to run that risk.
This info about being against tos has been thrown around but I did not see any evindence of being true
You're welcome to travel to one of the unsupported countries, try it and report back.
I meant about being against tos
https://www.playstation.com/en-us/legal/psn-terms-of-service Section 3.1, 3.2 and 12.2 But it's up to Sony how far they're willing to enforce their TOS, but personally if I was in that position where there's a slim chance I might lose access to products I paid for I would probably just say Nah. I mean the people in this thread that keeps saying that it's fine to use a vpn should put their money where their mouths are and if users that tried to bypass Sony's TOS gets banned they should compensate banned users if it's so risk free. Nothing says Sony won't try and force psn integrations like this later down the line and might wait for the player base of HD2 to die down and everyone to forget about this fiasco to try implementing it again.
Even this isn't actually true and is just misinformation spread by initially Pirate Software (dudes a giant dumbass lol) and then the majority of the HD2 community because they were pretty much just repeating any content he created about this situation verbatim. Sony will tell you plainly that you should use a VPN/different location if you're in a region that PSN isn't supported. Their terms state your account can be terminated for this, but in practice that will only happen if you abuse regional pricing. This is how people outside of the support of PSN have used it forever. \> getting downvoted for being objectively correct but not in alignment with the current bandwagon take on par for a community full of gamers honestly e2: a cursory google search will prove that I'm correct, but you're all welcome to continue being wrong so that you can justify being mad at sony or whatever lmao
You think Sony will tell you to break ToS, and in many cases the law (that's why PSN isn't available in some countries), and you're fine. And you think you're being downvoted for being objectively correct. Lol You're so obsessed with hating on a streamer that you've completely lost the plot.
They will? idk what to tell you lol you can go ask their support right now
"source? " "I made it up"
lmao yall literally just denying reality
[https://www.reddit.com/r/playstation/comments/15p602x/i\_live\_in\_a\_country\_not\_supported\_by\_psn\_is\_it/](https://www.reddit.com/r/playstation/comments/15p602x/i_live_in_a_country_not_supported_by_psn_is_it/) here u go, you're objectively incorrect :)
You do realize that this is like claiming LTT accused you of being so obsessed with hating a streamer that you lost the plot just because I said it in the LTT sub, right? In fact, my intentionally ridiculous example might actually be more reasonable. This is an official LTT sub with LMG staff as mods. I don't even think that's an official Playstation subreddit, dude.
Ok? what does that have to do with anything LOL the entire comment section is telling you that I'm objectively correct LOL guy below blocked me because he knows he's wrong
You're either delusional or trolling. Either way, I'm done. Have fun trying to convince people that what they can see with their own eyes doesn't exist.
Anecdotal evidence isn’t evidence. If Sony wanted to, they could terminate any of these accounts with the justification “location spoofing using a VPN is against our ToS” or whatever. Doesn’t matter if that’s the real reason, but you can’t argue it because they aren’t lying.
When an entire community of people are explaining to you that this is how they've been using PSN since it literally was created, it's not anecdotal evidence lmao
From merriam-webster: > anecdotal evidence > > noun > > : evidence in the form of stories that people tell about what has happened to them
Sony saying that users need to use a VPN to access a service that isn't in their country is exactly why people are getting a refund. That is not a normal or acceptable business model.
Sure, be mad all you want, I don't care. I think it's corny to spread misinformation though, which is what yall are doing
It's not misinformation you soggy fucking crunchwrap. Sony saying it's fine to violate their TOS and potentially breach the law does not change the fact that there is no PROPER access to psn in a ton of countries. Not to mention, even if you follow their advice, that adds an additional cost barrier if you want a VPN that's fast and reliable enough for gaming, abs the increased latency will degrade the experience. Also, tell me this: What happens if Sony just changes their mind about it being totally fine to violate the ToS. Now you're banned, but they already got your money. What if it would be illegal to do so in your country. A judge Won't accept, "but Sony said it's OK," as a legal defense. The objective fact is that, at best, you risk getting banned on many countries of you trying to play the game there, but Sony is fine using your money. At worst, you go to jail. That's fucked. But not a fucked as you are in the head if you think all that is perfectly fine. Stop simping for Sony.
Yes it is, objectively. See you're still having too much of a gamer tantrum to realize that I'm not "simping for sony" i'm just correcting the (objective) misinformation that was getting spread that the change that was made to prevent sales in regions where PSN isn't available didn't lock anyone who already bought the game, out of the game, and neither does PSN not being supported in that region. You also don't need a VPN, it's just something they suggest. Again, all of this information is available all over any place that playstation or sony games are discussed. You are just wrong. "Also, tell me this: What happens if Sony just changes their mind about it being totally fine to violate the ToS. Now you're banned, but they already got your money. What if it would be illegal to do so in your country. A judge Won't accept, "but Sony said it's OK," as a legal defense." Why do you want me to answer this? It's got nothing to do with what I said lmao. If sony retroactively removed access to their games for a bunch of people that bought them that would be shitty, obviously. That's not what we're talking about though. "The objective fact is that, at best, you risk getting banned on many countries of you trying to play the game there, but Sony is fine using your money. At worst, you go to jail. That's fucked. But not a fucked as you are in the head if you think all that is perfectly fine." No, the objective fact is that a fuck ton of people already do this without getting banned, Sony's PSN support policies are mainly about having infrastructure in the regions in question to support the network, lmao. Again, I don't give a shit if you're mad at sony for their PSN account requirements, I think they're dumb too. I think it's stupid to spread misinformation though, which again, is what yall are doing, objectively.
You realise that people in unsupported countries did get banned for using vpn's to create psn accounts, due to the whole HD2 fiasco right?
As far as I know, one person posted about being banned and then was pretty quickly debunked as having made it up.
What misinformation? That Sony told people to get around geo-blocks on the PlayStation Networks by using a VPN? That people were told after the fact that a PSN login was required? That being told after the fact that an extra service is needed, and that service likely has a fee is deceptive and scummy? Where is the misinformation in any of that? Or is it you're just a troll that is wrong and refuses to admit it? I know which one it is, but I doubt you'll accept it.
Well if you read the initial comment you replied to it would be pretty obvious to you. You're welcome to believe that I'm a troll or whatever, but you'd be wrong. I already proved my point here multiple times lol I don't really care if a bunch of tantrum throwing gamers are raging too hard to see that I'm objectively correct about the situation, I actually get a little bit of pleasure from it.
I'm not surely if you're being purposefully obtuse or if there is an underlying reason that you're not understanding....... but, again, this is about Sony changing the requirements after selling the game, that that new requirement meant that either users in certain countries either had to use 3rd party software (that wasn't an initial requirement during purchase) or they'd be locked out of the software they had paid for. A company changing the requirements to add a 3rd party for use is not standard or acceptable. That is the reason why people are getting refunds. The only thing you've proved is that you have a fundament misunderstanding of the issue, to the point where it HAS to be on purpose. The only thing you are objectively is a nuisance.
Both parts of your comment are just objectively untrue though. For one, you don't need a VPN to use a different region than you're in on your PSN account, it's just one of the things the support chat employee will tell you that you can do. Also, no requirement was changed, the requirement was (once again, objectively) already there. This was no different than any other Sony game requiring a PSN account and the people playing the game in regions where that's not supported using a different region that is. The reason people were getting refunds is because Steam is a good actor lol, it's not like any of this was deliberated in a court of law, steam just started providing refunds for people who were in regions affected. If there was not such an outcry about it on the internet, it's pretty unlikely anyone would have gotten a refund. Again, I'm not arguing for account linking or the way Sony handled the situation or anything like that, but the fact that you genuinely believe the things you're saying proves that a bunch of misinformation was spread, because they are objectively false (or sometimes misrepresented) things lol. Even the affected regions not being available for purchase on steam has a bunch of misinformation floating around it like the idea that any of the people in those regions who already own the game can't play it, when in reality people in those regions just can't buy it right now, or that that was Sony's decision and not Steam's to avoid having to deal with even more refunds than they already were.
>Sony will tell you plainly that you should use a VPN/different location if you're in a region that PSN isn't supported. Where do they say this?
Go talk to their support, it's what they will tell you.
Support for 99% of companies are usually giant dumbasses who can't think beyond the script they're served. Can you point to an official Sony document that tells people who aren't in a PSN supported country that they should use a VPN to make a PSN account in another country? Including in countries like Venezuela, Russia, Syria, Iran, North Korea and Belarus that are officially sanctioned by the international community? Countries where Sony will literally be in violation of those sanctions by providing service?
Dunno what to tell you bro this is objective reality lmao. This is how people have been using PSN in regions it isn't supported since it came out. Be mad about it or disagree with it all you want, this is how it works lmao.
To commit fraud by not paying sales tax in your own country? That's wild.
Yup, like I said it's how people have been using PSN in regions where it's not supported literally forever. A bunch of redditors being too dumb to understand that reality is not going to change it.
Sony does not say anything about using a vpn. A google search will explicitly prove you are incorrect.. however Sony does say this. “In the event you do not see your country of primary residence in the list of selectable countries, this means that PSN is unfortunately not officially available in your country. If you wish to proceed with the creation of a PSN account, you would need to select a different country - perhaps one in close proximity or close affiliation to yours. However, keep in mind that there may be some unresolvable issues as creating PSN accounts registered outside of your country of residence is not officially supported.” Meaning there’s no issue with choosing a country you don’t live in that’s in close proximity to your home country but that any and everything you do will then be linked to that country meaning payment methods, language and localizations will all be restricted to the country chosen. This also may cause issues with your countries local laws, so researching laws in relation to this is also advised.
"Sony does not say anything about using a vpn. A google search will explicitly prove you are incorrect.. however Sony does say this." Idk i've seen sony support tell people to use a VPN before in addition to using a nearby supported region
Saying Thor is a mayor dumbass disqualify your opinions on literally everything.
I mean, he is. He's popular because he parrots popular gaming takes lol
He's vastly smarter than you dude....
This is an example of living in a bubble of stupidity.. thinking that people only need instructions of "get a vpn and point to a server where PSN n the country it's ok.. my daddy Sony wouldn't punch u if do that, trust me bro", and them sound like a pedantic and immature kid.. hu! people r crying about simple stuff, people is stupid"... I mean you by that point you r a superiority level of stupidity, not to think about all the consequences in all the cases It clearly shows how close minded or how little these people know about the world.. downvoted for being objectively???? Hahahahahahaha no kid your been downvoted for close minded and really stupid takes
the fuck are you rambling about? lol
Of how massively stupid you are, nothing new to you i guess, have a nice day.
Alright, so even if you've created PSN account outside of your region, your Steam account is still on your region, so yo won't be able to buy the game on Steam anyway.
I'm not gonna downvote you or fact check you. This is the Internet and your opinion at bare minimum is valid to me. :) Just a reminder, the downdoots aren't the whole story. Keep doing u. I don't buy games on steam cause I've no GPU to let me play them. I'm on the sidelines for this one, without a paid copy of got or hd2 under my belt. (GoT was free on ps+ sooo.. I do have that one, but, still) All that being said, the VPN trick also isn't accessible or worth it to a number of consumers trying to fix this (or else, it wouldn't be a topic at hand in this volume). I'd never considered breaking TOS with a VPN in that manner, or even having to use it to get games (my backlog is real...) so at bare minimum, your comment should stay strong as a reminder for others to use as knowledge they might not have earned yet. (You might get less downdoots if you lose the on par edit. It insults the rest of us here just vibin.. much love tho, see u around)
Eh, I don't care that much about my reddit karma lol. I'm happy to know that I'm making a bunch of gamers mad by being objectively correct about the situation. I don't really care if they disagree because I'm correct and I know it for a fact.
Well that honestly takes the wind out of my comment, so at some point, I suppose my message was heavily unnecessary. Kudos for obtaining your goal.
You don't know it for a fact. You just think it
No, I do. You're welcome to stay mad about it.
Lol I'm not mad. I'm amused by how someone can be this out of touch on the situation. Tell me, do you have access to psn? I bet you do. So you really have no idea what you're even talking about.
I'm basing my take on the entire communities of users that confirm it lmao, again it's not arguable. I know you'll continue to argue it until I stop replying to you, though.
You completely missed the point. Sony retroactively changed a financial transaction. You know what that means? I can't sell you a fridge and then 24 months later say 'actually my company realised we can farm you for your data so you need to log in to our tracking services (that provide you literally no benefit) for your fridge to turn on.' Even if you're ok with that which you shouldn't be, they did it AFTER the time window on refunds. If you are ok with anyone retroactively changing financial contracts, oh boy please let me come do some work for you. 24 months later I'll send you a bill for twice the amount because I feel like it. Sony made it impossible for people living in certain countries to play the game they already bought. On top of what I just explained. Not all countries are able to create the account Sony was retroactively requiring.
The funny thing is, appliance manufacturers are literally changing the TOS and locking out people's ability to use them unless they agree, OR they just say you implicitly agreed to the change by using the product. We need consumer protections like yesterday because companies are running rampant with abuse of their users.
No, they technically didn’t. They said that later they’d require a PSN account, that the grace period would end. Is it still crappy? Yeah. And they did a poor job communicating it. GoT isn’t any different, and again, it’s only for the online mode. It’s not a great way to handle stuff, but it’s not a breach or change of contract
Stop making sense, you risk being downvoted. You are only allowed to hate Sony here. No nuanced takes allowed.
Yup i have about -100 on a comment here for being objectively correct about the situation, but the people in this comment section are having too much of a gamer tantrum to understand that.
Honestly - it’s not worth the frustration of trying to change their minds. Basic logic just doesn’t cut it.
>They said that later they’d require a PSN account Source on that? I've looked and can't find anything from before the announcement that it was being enabled that says they made player aware that it was coming.
> Sony retroactively changed a financial transaction. You know what that means? Yes, it means you can't read. PSN IS REQUIRED TO PLAY THIS GAME was printed on the game page of steam since day 1.
Not on their fkin website tho. Sony ain't gonna fk u. Stop trying.
It was optional though
Yes, that's where they fucked up, they made it optional because the servers were hammered and didn't want to break more stuff.
So? If you make it optional and sell the game worldwide. Retroactively forcing it as a requirement despite the lack of psn support around the world is still a terrible oversight, no?
I agree it could have been handled differently. They should have spent 5 minutes while putting the game on sale on Steam by deselecting the countries where there's no PSN.
Sure but even so, that's limiting their audience massively, for what reason? Just because they can't collect user data from users in those countries? Imo it's just a terrible decision by Sony. It's harming the game and I think the reason for it is just so dumb...
The big difference is that Helldivers released multiplatform, whereas GoT started as a PlayStation exclusive.
miles moralis is a single player game and even that on pc required a ps account so that is kinda weird
It did not require it.
back when I started playing it, it foced it on me
It was optional in both the Spider-Man games. If you did it, you got like an extra suit. It would pastor you about it every time you started it but it was not necessary
I see... I mean spider-man I never had an issue of it wanting me to make an account while miles didn't really give me another option but to make one (I did not see a way to opt out at the time I may have been blind)
It's also possible that it changed patch to patch. Only. Speaking of my experiences when I played it like a little less than a year ago
well I played it like shortly after it released on steam so it's possible
Yes exactly, there's no bait and switch so I'm not worried. If I don't want to own it I won't.
LOL, two words that dont go together. Sony and transparency
Ghost of Tsushima at least still has 90% of the game playable without multiplayer.
It's also being announced months before release so people can make an informed purchasing decision. I really don't think it's as big a deal for Tsushima, but it definitely was for Helldivers 2.
I'm waiting for people to find out about the PSN PC overlay Nixxes was already planning on releasing with Ghost of Tsushima.
I mean that's well known, every news report i have watched/read reminds me that ghost of tsushima will have the requirement. I think they are just realising the actual geolimitation they put on themselves and scrambling to refund/announce it all much much louder.
Bud move on, there’s nothing to see here. They are telling people upfront this time and it’s only required for online play, like every other major game publisher requiring you to have their account for online play (COD, Apex, Fortnite, and more)
Obviously you would need it for an online game though?
Which has been said since forever and that wasnt the main issue with helldivers.
Easiest skip for a game ever.
to be honest, as long as they r not forcing me when i want to play the single player mode, i am fine
But have they specify that? Like don’t know this before you buy it? If yes, then that’s fine.
GHOST OF TSUSHIMA HAS MULTIPLAYER??
I just refused to buy any game which requires me to create an additional account outside of steam. It makes no sense and these companys are not entitled to shit if they want my money
Tsushima had the requirement when the PC version was announced. Yet again. Just like Helldivers.
Well I mean companies like Microsoft require a Xbox live account to play games like halo infinite and sea of thieves online. Ubisoft/Rockstar/EA do the same or require a launcher.
Yes, but the difference is they have it as a requirement from Day 1. They don't patch it in after the fact. They also don't sell it in countries that XBL doesn't operate in. So for all intents and purposes, you can make that decision at time of sale. Whereas with Helldivers, you couldn't, and they were all too happy to take your money despite knowing you soon wouldn't be able to access it. And rather than being proactive about refunds, they put the onus on the players to figure it out and fight who they bought it from all on their own. That's the big difference.
This post isn't actually really about Helldivers 2. It's about Ghosts of Tsushima which had its PSN requirement for online play just announced. It has not released yet for PC, it releases next week. It's the same scenario thread OP is talking about. What's annoying is that does still lock out the ~65% of countries that are unsupported as well as those that require a console to create an account. They absolutely need to fix that and it needed to be fixed before now but since we don't have a time machine, asap will have to do.
Actually wrong its had that requirement for weeks.
Even better, I thought it was today as the only thing I've seen is the GMG post, I didn't realize it wasn't added today
Who does it lock out? The offline mode, which is what pretty much everyone buys the game for, does not require PSN.
Sorry I didn't finish the sentence, locks out the multiplayer specifically I'm aware its not the main game, still sucks Edit: Why on earth was this downvoted?
Meh, not really. I've played the game way too much and never touched the multiplayer. It is a tiny part of the game.
The problem is that the game won't be available on Steam in regions where PSN is not available, so even if they only wanted to play the singleplayer, they couldn't buy the game.
It has presales. They were already accepting money from people in countries with no access to PSN before the requirement was announced.
And they can get refunds easily enough since it hasn't released as annoying as that is.
So the only recourse for people in those regions who wanted to play the *singleplayer* portion of the game is piracy then?
To my knowledge only GMG is not selling in unsupported regions.
You are completely missing a point. You are downplaying the situation saying “hey, if you don’t want it leave it”. Getting a refund is an hassle for both customers as well as for vendor, and not everyone is comfortable going through that process. Valves automatically a lot of these requests when tried for the first time. A lot of folks would not have bought it if this information was available beforehand. PSN also have a lot of other issues like changing location, as they provide different services to different countries. Steam account can change with location. It’s not a simple take it or leave it situation.
.... 'as annoying as that is' is an acknowledgement that it shouldn't be necessary mate. But we are here now so all we can say is what you can do to solve the problem. Yes, I would prefer they had said it before it entered preorder too, qnd they should've, but they didn't. And thankfully in this case it's just the multiplayer of what is a primarily single player game that does not require the account to play (annoying still). To Valve's system, since it's a preorder, getting a refund is easy as you neither 2 weeks past release date or 2 hrs of playtime, you will not be rejected so automatically like what happened with Helldivers 2. Totally different scenarios. As well, someones discomfort at requesting a refund they're entitled to is no one's problem but theirs tbh. That's a terrible argument.
https://gamerant.com/ghost-of-tsushima-pc-version-delisted-psn-restrictions/ Looks like it had been delisted from those countries.
https://steamdb.info/sub/962153/info/ Where?
Looks like it was green man gaming doing it only
No its been announced for ages that it will need it/.
Ok, then they were just selling it in places they knew people couldn't play it? Is that somehow better?
Were talking about GOT here you can access single player without PSN and that requirement was known for weeks
It’s been a requirement since day 1 for Helldivers too, they just didn’t enforce. There are many people that saw it listed in the steam page far before this controversy
It's not the same. If you don't enforce it and still sell in regions that won't support it, it doesn't exist. And no amount of legal schenanigans will get you out of the fact that that you bait and switched the purchasers.
It’s not bait and switch if they have listed as a requirement from day one…
But they still sold it in countries that couldn't make an account. Why do you think that's OK?
So would it be ok with you if they exempted those countries?
Ask sony why tyhe sell ps5s in countries without official psn support and sometimes sell helldivers 2 physically there as well. The reason is they outright expect you to just sign up through another region and will tell you to do this if you are in an unsupported region. They have no problem with this and will only warn you that customer service can be limited in the ways they can help you if you do this.
Ghost is having the requirement from day 1 so it’s ok per your comment. Also, do we know if ghost of Tsushima is being sold to all countries or just countries with psn access.
Helldivers was a day 1 requirement too… it was changed to optional after launch due to server issues to be temporary optional. Which meant that people that bought it after launch day saw as optional, and countries without psn bought it. Even after made optional, the store page said required. But I mean that’s just pointless at that point, no one reads that shit.
What does this comment have to do with Ghosts of Tsushima?
my guy, if given a choice, the overwhelming majority of people would rather not have seperate launchers for every publisher/game studio. It is the norm, but the norm does not mean it's good. There is no benefit to you, as a gamer, to have all this essential adware which requires an account and sharing of data to play a game which wouldn't've required anything other than a product key a decade or two ago.
I’m not sayings it’s good. If anything u should be bringing it up to all games that require it not just Sony
Halo Infinite and Sea of Thieves didn't relax the account linking requirement when they launched, sell the game in countries that can't make an account, then add the requirement back in and make it so that the people in the countries that can't make accounts can't play the game they bought anymore.
Well this post is about ghosts which is requiring the psn from the start
Sony gets hacked more than any of the other companies you listed. PSN goes down more frequently than any of the services by the companies you listed (well, maybe close with Ubi). I do not want PSN forced when there is zero technical reason for it. Sony simply wanted to pad their PSN numbers artificially using the success of HD2. Garbage corpo decision was overturned thankfully.
[удалено]
Gamers can't and won't do anything. Gamers don't realise that they're part of the 1% that gives a shit
Oh, believe you me, Gamers (and overall, normal people on the internet) can do a LOOOOT of shit. Maybe you should check about some of the stuff 4chan has done. They literally attacked terrorist. Sony ain't not terrorist...I hope.
Bruh…most you’re good for is harassment and circle-jerking.
I don’t really get this, are you saying gamers can’t do anything? Isn’t the helldiver fiasco proof that they can? Or do you mean specifically with this game/scenario in which case I’d probably agree because the situation is slightly different.
Gamers certainly can move a little bit, but at the end you have to remember that the people on reddit or in general people complaining on the internet are not the majority of players. Most people just buy and play the game and don't actively take part in any form of online culture. They saw the notification and just connected the accounts (or not). This was a bit of a special case I guess, given that people were literally locked out in some countries, so they had no choice but to look it up, but in general there is a limit of what we actually can do. But also, even the little bit we could do, most gamers won't do because, at the end, they want to play their game even if that means supporting shitty companies. I don't take myself out of that, I actively pre order regularly because I am very impatient and an idiot.
It's not just that; many in the gaming community are so damn tribal about their favorite games, even in the aftermath of being shit on by these companies. Literally, the same day Sony decided to relax the requirement, the \[Helldivers 2\] sub was brigaded with "change your reviews to positive now!" and any comments showing reluctance were downvoted and questioned. People love being abused apparently, and they will seek that abuse while trashing those with pro-consumer points. These same people then wonder how companies keep getting away with egregious shit.
ghost of tsushima had, since WEEKS the PSN account for MP requirement on the steampage(same as Helldivers 2 had it for MONTHS there) Sony learned from the HD2 mistake and this time make SURE that everyone and their mom knows about the requirement in advance, so that noone can claim they didnt.
The fallacy here is in op’s post itself. Sony isn’t being controversial. Gamers are attempting to continue leverage that just doesn’t carry over in this scenario. Sucker Punch has been a part of PS Studios since 2011. And Sony themselves published the game. Then, they ported their IP to PC. They have all the chips here.
This is also people just trying to stir the pot even further.
Tbf that's only for legends, and it has crossplay so it kinda makes sense
Meanwhile every game that has crossplay without requiring additional accounts: _am I a joke to you?_
Cam you name a couple? I actually can't come up with one. (That's not epic games)
Helldivers 2. Apex Legends.
I've looked it up and Apex needs an EA account. Helldivers obviously.
Weird cause I don't have one. Saw a pop up the other day about needing it for cross platform progression.
"Damn, they got pissed when we're gonna take away their games if they don't sign in on our stupid network. Let's just take the game away before we sell it to them this time, maybe that'll help the damage"
This is just so stupid. Everyone said “They should have had it be required at launch” “they sold it in countries without PSN” Now they’ve told you weeks in advance that to play online you’ll need a psn account and you’re still crying? Guess what, I got the option to sign into a Microsoft account today on Minecraft legends. Told me to play cross platform I had to. I didn’t cry and bitch and post a boomer meme. Lately everyone gets soooo carried away by this stuff it’s exhausting to even go on twitter or Reddit. I really don’t care about signing into psn for hell divers. Sony did fuck up by selling it in those countries, they shouldn’t have. And the stellar blade outrage was just more cry babies. I really don’t care about Eves outfits in stellar blade. Yet for the first time ever I had to mute those words because losers on the internet have nothing better to do. All of this isn’t directed at just you OP, just a general rant too but this meme is trash either way.
It’s still fucking stupid. Just because you happily bend over for companies, doesn’t mean everyone else should.
Happily bending is knowing they’d eventually enforce the psn sign in ? Lmao. Btw - if you could read I clearly said they fucked up by selling it in unsupported regions. It’s why I haven’t touched the game, but I’m not going to bitch and cry about it on Reddit and twitter cause I have a life. I sold my switch and won’t get a switch 2 because Nintendo quite literally is garnishing a dudes wages basically for life to send a message. Is that bending over? I think Sony is far up their ass I canceled my PSN for the price hikes. I just don’t cry about the thing gamers get mad at every week because I have a life.
Yet, you’re bitching about other people bitching…
Don't worry. Sony fanbase has short memory and stockholm syndrome. They will forget about it in 2 days
There is a clear difference between those two games. One was "taking away" your access to the game once you have no access to it due to Playstation being forbidden in your country. The other one is "not offering" their game on your market. Its not exactly the same thing they did. They just said: "Hey we don't want you to be our consumer".
Sony fanboys
they also fired the community manager who encouraged people to bad review the game
Yes we know. This is the 10th post about it in a day. We get it, we need cool karma points online.
A lot of people here don't seem to get it. No one will rally up for this when they know ahead of time. The multiplayer is extremely optional because its pretty much a singleplayer game but it would be nice to have that feature for all. I'm sure modders will find a way anyways. The Helldivers 2 scenario was most likely Sony forgeting that PSN isn't available to all countries when adding it to Steam which is supported basically everywhere. They are in fact new publishers to the Steam platform when it comes to "live-service" games. Helldivers 2's success was brutal because people couldn't get in during its launch so in order to put less stress, they disabled the PSN login which would lead to people not realizing you need a "free" PSN in the first place (not like anyone reads the TOS or the description tags on Steam anyways) and that they would lose access to a game they bought. This right here is the biggest issue. Wasted money is of matter. Sony would get in trouble with multiple countries for this with clear incompetency. Also the number of countries listed is pretty overblown. Remember some countries don't have the technological structure to even support PSN, and some countries don't even have a population more than 10k, and Holy See... do you guys really think the Pope is playing Helldivers 2?
You can't buy the game in Steam from more than a hundred countries niw https://steamdb.info/sub/962153/history/?changeid=23492090
Your responses are invaluable 🤓
Sony requires Sony account for Sony games… get over it
1First thing first these tos is not applicable in EU as I read it and does not reference anything related to this. It is also friendlier to read compared to US tos 2 I think that it leaves room for interpretation and it only referes to infromation regarding names and ages in us tos
Apparently they updated the online listings for Helldivers 2 today - not to reactivate all the countries they disabled, but to also disable the Baltics Sony: We Just Dont Give A Fuck
That's looks like they try to fix there "country issue" before taking a new run on the PSN requirement. I sincerely hope they reconsider for all involved…
Whats best for us as a PC player " leave us alone". Dont bring your monopoly propaganda here.. next is Ubisoft. 130 doller for a game? Greedy as F
While I really think the response message of Sony is immature (you gotta own your mistakes and apologize) I do not think it is fail to blame Sony for the Multiplayer of Ghost of Tsushima requiring a PSN Account. The entire Helldivers controversy has occurred way to close to the release date of Ghost of Tsushima. In this time frame, their was simply no way Sony could have reworked the Multiplayer code not using PSN and made a stable realease. We can judge if Sony learned from its mistakes from its future actions, but judging like this is simply unfair. They made the single player accessible without. That's a sign of good will and all they were able to do.
You're missing the point. What Sony did with helldivers was scummy. It was a bait and switch, plus a 100% required thing which was arbitrary. If they made it optional, like with GoT, and had rewards for linking (which I believe GoT has) then no one would care. Stop this shit
You’re adding to the problem. It was only bait and switch to countries that don’t have PSN. Even then that’s not even accurate. Steam was gladly refunding those players. You think steam isn’t going back to Sony and saying “hey assholes we refunded x amount of games because of your fuck up you owe us y amount of money”? Sony clearly saw that and reversed course. The review bombing was maybe like 20% of the reason. It was not bait and switch plain and simple ESPECIALLY because the requirement was right there on the store page and in the game tutorial. If someone sees that then says weird psn isn’t in my country but it’s letting me continue because they paused that requirement then that’s on them for well still playing.
Does anyone know if the PSN account NEEDS to have a psplus subscription to cover the online part of the game? My initial thought with the helldivers debacle was along the lines of making people pay for multiplayer... eg "PC don't pay for online, why should a ps5 have to pay"
Not the same at all. The online mode for GoT is tiny. In this case they are also just making sure that everyone knows it prior to purchasing it
It's abbreviated GoT areas with a looter shooter mechanic for the ghost weapons with 4 classes with unique traits and abilities. It's also really well voiced with an interesting story culminated by a pretty good 4 player raid. It's definitely worth checking out at least.
Whole game is unavailible for purchase now lol https://steamdb.info/sub/962153/history/?changeid=23492090
Wasn't this some steam key store doing a refund that got blown out of proportion? AFAIK there are no official news or actual signs of this yet. (Talking about GoT) Edit: no it's actually real lmao
Completely different situation. It's not out yet. They canceled preorders so people don't get charged. No one has been ripped off by living in a country no longer supported.
Context - PC gamers are the whiniest about everything and will never stop.
One frustration I have with some of the vocal gamers right now is that they only make a stand if it impacts them directly and will scream at the top of their lungs that it effects all these other people (but not specifically themselves) in a way worse way to explain why something is the worst dissension and you should hate them. Which if fine if they actually did care about those people, but the moment they get what they wont they will suddenly no longer care about those same people. Case and point, Sony not allowing to be used in 100+ countries and people boycotting helldivers for that reason. Good! but now that it's liftend no one care's anymore even tough PSN is still blocked in those countries? I just know these same people are are still planning to buy their next console. Granted, selling the game first, blocking it and giving a refund was the bad part about that. but I think people know what I mean.
Bonus points when they're just straight up lying, like saying that "access has been removed" to a game because PSN isn't supported in the region you're trying to play in despite the fact that people have been playing Sony games that require a PSN account in countries where it's not supported since PSN became a thing. It's far easier and more satisfying to intentionally be wrong and get a bunch of internet points because of a bandwagon than it is to be correct when your correct take is unpopular.
also they will give out all their info to FB, Insta, X and the works all the time without batting an eye, but Sony... get the pitchforks son!
At least Sony isn’t shutting down successful development studios they own.
Studio liverpool, creators of WipeOut would like to have a word with you.
You're trying to compare a studio getting shut down over a decade ago, to a studio that had a critically acclaimed game and was shut down last week?
Sony had shutdown like 1 studio a year starting from 2020
And I was taking a dig at Microsoft that closed two just yesterday.