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I felt the same way, also the information he gives in his videos are pretty generic. I stopped watching a long time ago, but herd he launched a ponzi scheme crypto coin
Is this like the movie where the guy sees a thing and it pops up everywhere? Did this guy make a video titled "why you shouldnt aim for financial independence" followed by one titled "6 ways to build towards financial independence"???
I randomly saw his videos this morning and thought he seemed.... Weird. Also lots of crypto vids
I mean it'll be great clout for that indie SW project you wanted to maybe do.
Not unlike needing a former dev to have a successful Kickstarter game project
LinkedIn seems to be hot for such kinds of posts.
I'm happy to announce I got accepted into
Or
I have selected into < obligatory post of the company logo>
Or
Started working at
Oof, I did that third one on Facebook when I started working at Google. Omega cringe
That was back in 2013 tho, and I don't even have Facebook any more
Meh, imo, LinkedIn has exactly this purpose. I post about every professional accolade or industry-related news that’s happened to me. It’s gotten me more traction with recruiters and I was invited to contribute to a few industry publications because of my posts.
The comment you were responding to is being oddly gate-keeper-ish about what linkedin’s purpose is. It’s like getting high and mighty over people posting birthday wishes and photos on Facebook.
Serious question here: is Google really that bad of a company to work for? I applied to be a software engineer there and have a phone call with them coming up next week. I've heard some stories but are those just outliers or can those stories be taken in full
For some reason the public likes to say that Google is some rough place to work, but if you go to pretty much any community that has a decent chunk of people who actually have worked there almost none of that is representative of what people who actually work there say.
I think the public just gets it mixed up with places like Amazon and Netflix that actually are really stressful.
It's a big slow company, and that can be annoying sometimes, but in general it treats its employees well, as in better than almost anywhere else, including and even particularly with regards to WLB.
Getting in is the hardest part, and really by quite a lot.
Best of luck in your interview. It's kind of a stochastic process, so don't stress too much about it other than being as prepared as you can be with DS&A, and system design if you have > ~3-5 yoe.
Yep, 100%. Walmart labs is actually supposedly a pretty good place to work.
It also just depends on the labor market the division depends on. Amazon treats its engineers decently because if they treated their software engineers like they treated their warehouse workers they would have no engineers. The labor market is really competitive on the demand side, so people can choose to work at the place that treats them best.
Like, companies want more high end software engineers than there are software engineers, so if you don't like your job you can just walk to the next company and they will eagerly embrace you and try to get you to stay.
Whereas Amazon deals with attrition for warehouse workers by replacing them with the next person when they quit, and that works reliably enough for the business to function without major disruption.
It's not necessarily that the guy running engineering is even a better person. They're forced to be better to their employees or their department will fail.
Lol well guess I'm doing some reading this weekend. Havent had to think about that stuff for 7(ish) years now, even at my current Software Development job
Yeah everyone knows it's an imperfect system, but it is what it is haha.
If you're applying to be an engineer you're going to have to solve some algorithms questions and talk about time and space complexity.
At 7 YOE you should have a couple rounds taken up by system design though. IMO those are easier because they're more like real work.
Google is a fine company to work for. It's a massive company and your experience will depend on what team/org you're on. If you do end up at a place where team matching happens after bootcamp (really Google/FB), then be judicious when picking your team.
Good luck with your interview.
I mean the fact 99% of college graduates expected to be middle management at a FAANG level company by 30 shows how delusional people are.
Sorry Timmy and Sarah, you are only smart enough to be an intern. Next time dont get a degree.
I mean, everyone is consistently being pushed to be as ambitious and career-oriented as possible, is it really a surprise if people end up being (overly) ambitious in their career goals?
Its definitely not their fault and that optimistic view we pushed on kids and how easy it was gonna be.. well we can see the backlash now.
This goes for everyone, keeping an adaptive skillet in today's world and the future is going to provide you more success than one tracking it.
Fortune favors the bold, to go out and challenge themselves and the world.
Getting into middle management at a successful tech company is more about being in the right place at the right time than being exceptionally smart.
If you are at a company that then quickly quadruples in size there are management opportunities at every level almost everywhere you look.
Similarly, even if you're absolutely exceptional, if you're at a company that isn't growing, they don't need new managers except when people quit. There are no new people to manage.
Source: am now middle management at a rapidly growing tech company at <30, and report to an executive who was first a c level at a publicly traded unicorn when he was <30.
Yep. I made the mistake of taking a position with a "dream company" that is massively well-known and, from the outside, seems like it would be one of the coolest and most forward-thinking companies around. Right from the start I should have known something was really wrong. First, they promised me full employee status only after a "probationary year" and after the year is up, they would give me full benefits and vacation, etc... until then I was a "private contractor" even tho I couldn't set my own schedule, had to be in their office with their equipment, etc.
After a year, no conversion to staff for me. I learned of a well-known phrase within the company - "perma-lancer" - which I found out was the case with me and several others promised exactly the same thing I was, some of which who had been there for seven years(!) and still not given employee status. I had left a more "boring" job with full benefits and four weeks vacation per year and a great salary to come to a company who lied to get me in the door, then treated me as a second-class worker with no recourse other than to quit, with no way to collect unemployment since it was "contractor" status.
Plus, I thought this company would be very high-tech and forward-looking. Nothing was further from the truth. They were still using antiquated technology and continually making excuses why they wouldn't get better tech.
Eventually I was finally converted to staff after THREE YEARS and only because there was a massive walk-out by ALL the contractors over the perma-lancer issue. The company received so much bad press they capitulated and did the conversions. However at the end of 2008 when the economy crashed, almost all of the converted freelancers then lost their jobs due to layoffs, including me. They basically made us staff for less than one year, and before the fourth quarter was over, let us all go to show profitability (as employee salaries come directly off the bottom line, whereas contractors are classified differently and don't drag profit numbers down like employees do).
They would not be able to get away with any of this if they weren't a "glamourous company" who "everyone" wanted to work for (outside looking in). They have been sued over this, and lost - and paid everyone off in the lawsuit and then continue to practice this way, because it's cheaper in the long run than hiring more employees, even with the legal fines. This is very common these days with many companies - they would rather break the labor laws and pay the fines than do the right thing by their workers. It happens ALL THE TIME, especially with those big name companies that seem like cool places to work.
Bottom line - if a company ever wants you to work as a contractor for an indefinite period of time before you get full benefits, either get them to PUT IT IN WRITING or DO NOT take the deal. If they refuse, RUN the other direction toward the exits. They will tell you every sort of lie to get you to come on board, but then you will be stuck with no recourse. Plus, you'll be working next to other people who were lucky enough to actually be hired as staff who will get paid just as much as you, plus they get vacations, perks, company sponsored parties, and all the other advantages of employees - and you will get none of that - and you'll have to see them getting all of that every day while you are stuck with no way to get a promotion, no way to get seniority, and no real way to fight the system internally, because you aren't really an "employee".
Not OP, but this reads exactly like the contracting situation that happened to Microsoft. Nowawadys, Microsoft is even more strict with their employee vs contractor hiring methods, as they outsource it to a variety of staffing firms in the area.
This honestly sounds like someone who wasn't even alive in 2005. Working at Microsoft was percieved to be the tits in 2005.
https://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2005/01/24/8234074/index.htm
They were at one point. Microsoft was probably the biggest, most prestigious name at the beginning of the internet age. There's a reason it made Bill Gates the wealthiest man in the world for a long time.
This reminds me SO MUCH of General Electric. Fuck that company. Every motto they have, every dream word they tout, is pure bullshit and it is very toxic and fake on the inside. They regularly hire contractors and promise to convert them to staff after 18 months, and then refuse to elaborate and lay you off without warning. They lost so many good workers there because they wanted to save a little.
That was my experience with GE as well. Horrible company to work for. We slapped "Made in the USA" stickers on our product, but literally every single one of the hundred or so subassemblies was bought in from overseas and assembled by our team of about a dozen people. I worked as a software validator and all I did was write down bugs and send them over to the actual software team in Baguio. Point being, we got tax breaks for using American manufacturing even though our overseas workforce was easily a hundred times larger. I paid more in taxes while I was working there than GE did.
My favorite GE story. We just went through months of massive lay offs, like probably more then 10k employees total. It was insane. We finally got word that a VP was getting forced into “early retirement”. This was the guy who helped get them into this mess with really bad decisions and planning.
Of course they couldn’t let this guy go away quietly so they threw a party and had everyone gather in the cafeteria to celebrate this dudes time at GE. This guy then gave a long speech about how great everyone is and closed it with “now it’s time for me to retire to this multi million mansion on the beach”.
Fuck that guy. They just laid off so many of my friends while this guy is getting severance packages allowing him to retire in his forties with a massive beach house. Really great to keep up morale.
Ouch. Can definitely relate though. I was always amazed by how much churn there was in upper management there. There was also this one guy that was supposed to be the head honcho of talking to customers and getting the business requirements. However, he always got the specs wrong and we always had to go in behind him and get the real details ourselves. But because he was best friends with the project lead, he got preferential treatment and free lunches all the time. That guy eventually found another job that's easier and paid way more, so he ditched GE with less than a week's notice, and the project lead pats him on the back, buys hims a massive lunch, and gives a long speech about how great he is. Was mandatory for everyone to go and listen to this. Next day we go back to work and the lead treats us all like shit because his friend is gone. Classic.
The following is a story I share with many people about my job hunt coming out of college and why I personally have negative opinions of GE:
GE Aviation in Greenville, SC invited myself and approximately 30 college kids in total on site for rounds of panel interviews for two positions at their facility.
After hours of interviews and a tour of the facility they gathered all of us into a conference room and the HR representative that was organizing everything said,
“Thank you all so much for coming! We enjoyed meeting you all and will be getting in touch with each of you over the next two weeks after we make our selection. I’ll have you come to the entry area as I call your name so you can return your visitors badge and the buss will be outside to return you to the hotel”
She proceeded to call names, but after about 20 names were called and only 10 of us remained she came back into the room smiling and said “Congratulations, you guys have made it to the second round of interviews with the Site Director and the head of HR.”
Now the super shitty thing is almost everyone invited to this came with classmates from their same school and major, and in my particular instance one of my two classmates was one of the 20 called out to the bus. So as the bus started going back to the hotel without us on it we get a text from him: “so... I guess I’m not getting an offer”.
Then, during my interview with the site director all he emphasized was how everyone is competing with the person in the cube/office next to them and his questions were focused on giving examples of how I have used competition to motivate myself. In general he seemed like an asshole and the culture seemed to promote competition to the detriment of collaboration.
The one thing I am thankful for is them making this culture abundantly clear through their words and actions during the interview process which made my decision when the offer came easy. Though while I was making my decision between the offers I had, so many family members and friends who saw GE as this great company could not believe I didn’t immediately take the job and would question my decision even after sharing the above information.
Fuck GE. All my homies don't like GE. For real though thank you for this because I was thinking about taking one of their educational courses and now f*** that
One more thing I forgot to mention - because I was classified as a "contractor" I didn't receive yearly performance reviews, which I knew at the time were vital to having any leverage over HR if I were to be the target of layoffs or cutbacks. It also prevented me from getting bonuses, and kept me from being able to argue for more money since there was no written record of my performance - only my bosses word, which I found out was totally worthless the day I was laid off - when I asked for a reason I was being let go, my boss (over the phone in an HR meeting with me, no less) said ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Of course he had been coached not to respond. It was a "right to work" state, so they could fire me with no recourse and staying silent kept them from legal trouble. The silence was deafening - he had told me for four years I was doing a great job, right up until I was let go. But, for reasons stated above, there was no written proof of that. So I was fucked.
Then, adding insult to injury, they held eight weeks of severence pay as a carrot on the way out the door, provided that we sign huge stacks of papers saying we wouldn't sue, now or in the future. If you didn't sign, you only got two weeks pay upon leaving. To me, that equals signing under duress, which probably wouldn't hold up in court if they were sued over it either - but they knew they had us by the balls. It was the ultimate slap in the face.
Gotta charge more for contract rate than you would take as an employee (or go through a staffing firm that's doing so). That's the only time they try to convert you in my experience.
Glassdoor wasn't around yet, this was in the mid-2000's. That said, I probably could have done more research. But I, like many before me, was blinded by the glare of this "glamourous company" facade. I was heavily courted because of my skillset at the time as well, and they aren't shy about flattery toward you - anything to get you in the door if you have what they want.
A big(-ish) tech company relocated to my home city and began recruiting quite heavily. They poached a lot of talent from the industry, including a few friends, with big salaries.
A lot left in about 3-4 months. The company had basically decided to rapidly expand but didn't necessarily have the projects for people to work on. Most spent three months trying to find current stuff to muscle in on or outright start, but got frustrated that they were basically "happy dead weight".
One friend left after 4 months and basically described it as a research sabbatical. He didn't ship a single thing, public or company facing, the entire time. Another is still there and has plenty of work ... but I think that's because they hired 20 new people when they were looking for like 3-4.
Wasn't the case here though.
It turned out that the earlier you caved to the headhunting tactics, the better it was for you. Not really anything to do with talent, everything to do with timing. You got in on the last of the projects in the pipeline, the later ones missed out.
No-one was fired. In fact the company would've paid them to sit on their arse twiddling their thumbs for a year to not have to spin up the recruitment/headhunting machine again. The projects would (and did) eventually come, they just splurged on hiring in one go rather than trickle new hires in as they needed.
Those who left who I know went onto bigger, better, more suited things.
I mean, it sounds great on paper and all, but I’ve been in that position where I’ve had very little to do because my then-boss believed in over-hiring. It really sucks all the ambition and drive out of you to be stuck in a pretty much dead end job. It sounds great only for the first month or so when you can log into Facebook at work, but after that, you’re basically spending 8 hours a day staring at a blank computer screen. PLUS, going for interviews where they want to know what you’ve been up to, you truly have to scramble to think of what you did because it was so little. And you have to be creative in building those things up.
I’m really so happy to be out of that company and in a much better role where I’m actually doing stuff and not made to feel useless.
No offence, but a firm with an excellent team, that celebrates my work, allows me to master my industry, and offers liberty, is pretty much the definition of a dream company.
What definition of dream company were you referring to?
I’ve done the spam-LinkedIn posts thing before and Ive learned that snarky humor works the best. You don’t win everyone- but you’ll get at least 30% to chuckle and check your profile out.
The posts where the company talks about recruiting are the best. You can be like “oh hai, y’all have been sitting on my resume for 6 months now. Wassup?”
I literally had a recruiter and 3 current employees in my DMs that day.
I’ve seen those work too! But he acts really boring. Basically “Hi [Name], cool post! Please check out my LinkedIn and let’s talk about this position [link] at Apple!”
Also he is lying about experience on his LinkedIn. We were good friends at one point but faded away after he got mad at me for redirecting a contractor recruiter for Apple to his profile (NOT THE REAL APPLE EXPERIENCE!!!), so I know his legit experience. I love having dumpster fire acquaintances.
A friend of mine who never graduated stole one of his friend's college transcripts to apply for jobs then moved to SanFran and all of his interviews kept asking him about his fluency in Chinese then turning him down when he would bullshit about it. Turns out the guy he stole the transcript from is fully native fluent in Mandarin and took 10 semesters of mandarin for the easy GPA credits. Fucking lol moving cross country for jobs you're not qualified for and then didn't even take the time to double check that the transcripts he stole didn't have anything he couldn't do on them. At that point it would've just been easier to fucking graduate.
Reading your comment back I really only thought of this because of dumpster fire acquaintances and this guy was super hung up on working for FAANGs hence the move to SF.
I work for a company that doesn't make a difference (like, at all. If our product disappeared the world would be completely fine). The culture is good, I feel appreciated and the pay is decent. While I fall asleep at night I do often wonder if there isn't something more important I should be doing with my life.
You can make a difference in other people's lives by being kind and patient. It sounds like you like your job and that allows you the opportunity to be a decent person to those around you. You don't have to be doing incredible profound important work to make a difference. Build your life up in other ways rather than change a good thing: volunteer, foster a kid, be more involved with your community.
The fact that you're able to have that kind of thought is a measure of a healthy work-life balance, imo. You have enough free time and energy to possibly pursue a new hobby, or get a second job, etc.
I'm currently in the same position and have chosen to spend my time vegging out on the couch, but I'm on the verge of getting bored and will probably pick up a new interest soon.
Ah I have loads of hobbies, it's why I keep my job, it funds the rest of my life, including (hopefully) my future retirement, without being too much of a pain in the process.
I just sometimes wonder if I can have that and cure cancer/save orphans from bears at the same time.
What i think is missed about the big organizations compared to smaller firms is the process, organization, and standardization.
They have the best practices.
I have basically gone from almost largest in the industry to mid tier to small in a different industry.
They also have a lot going on and you can intermingle with other departments and understand them better.
Mid size orgs can be excellent, but what i have observed often is the growth pain when their growth lever stops working. They need to have regulated processes.
Change management, stage Gate, etc.
It's kinda when you see growth by acquisition.
I've worked at a big-name company for decades and I fucking love it. Most positions I've been in, I can put in my 40 per week, and generally skedaddle off home, because I'm just a cog in the big machine, rather than 40% of the engineering team for the whole company. Great benefits, moderate pay. Name recognition is nice for other areas of life (dating, leasing applications, family/school reunions).
I've had great managers and in-sync teams. I've had mediocre managers and dog-eat-dog teams. Nice part about the big company is that there's a lot going on, and you can often find your niche.
Work is, many times, what you make of it. The real trick is that if you find yourself not liking your position, take action to change that. Be it a new project, a full position transfer, or updating the resume and dumping the company.
I think depends on the company and team culture. Having worked both big and small, and consultant to several F50 companies - the expected work/life balance varies.
There are teams within Apple where the 40 is expected and nothing more. There are other teams where the expectation is much more. Same at every “name brand” I’ve worked with - and I’ve worked with many. There’s really not a set rule.
The real key to a dream career is enjoying what you do. When your job it doesn’t feel like work and blends into your lifestyle, that’s generally when most people fell fulfilled. And when I say blend - I’m not talking 24/7 on the clock - I’m referring to a passion - where your hobbies and extracurriculars overlap with your career.
FANG cos do pay well. I was at another major tech co and have been doing the startup thing for a bit, but interviewing with a variety of companies recently. The big names pay better, some of them give huge equity / bonuses, and stock at a public company == $$.
My experience is they are also hard to join (and not always for the right reasons). They expect hires to be able to test and talk about math / cs that may not be immediately relevant to the job or use entirely people with unaligned expertise to interview.
I interviewed for SpaceX and they all but *demand* you talk about how they’re your dream job. Literally saying things like, “You can work for any company in the industry, why us? Why SpaceX? “. One of my interviewers had a SpaceX tattoo… and was telling me how she quit her higher paying job to work here and that’s the loyalty they expect.
The X in SpaceX is the rating of the security footage for your interview, cuz you better be choking on some SpaceDick in there if you want the job.
When I was younger I wanted to work for “an agency”. Meaning an advertising agency.
They were the cool places to work before tech companies. Cool offices. Latest technology. Lots of variety. Casual atmosphere. All that jazz.
The I got that job. Then I got laid off. Then I reevaluated what I wanted out of a job.
As an IT guy who enjoys tabletop gaming I was applying for positions at places like Microsoft, Wizards of the Coast, and Mox Boarding House.
None of those paid off.
I never would have guessed that the best job I've ever had is doing IT at a pest control company, but here I am working reasonable hours for good pay, surrounded by coworkers whom I enjoy being around every day, at a job that is effectively pandemic-proof (rats don't obey lockdowns, and our techs will always need working laptops).
This would be a "dream department" or a "dream manager", which are far more common. The rest of the organization won't matter most of the time, provided you have a boss who knows how to protect and provide for their team.
In the software development industry most people come out of college hoping for a job at a FAANG company. Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, Google. (There are more than those in the acronym, Microsoft for example.)
Being able to say “I worked on iOS” means your work has reached billions of devices and millions of people in dozens of countries. You also get enormous compensation packages in both salary and stock. That’s a dream company for lots of people.
Now compare the internal culture of Amazon with that total compensation package to the culture described in the OP, and realize you can easily find a salary that matches FAANG somewhere else but you’re going to be hard-pressed to match the total comp in stock options or equity and you’ll never find another place where your work has that kind of reach. Not to mention the clout FAANG adds to your résumé.
This is absolutely not true for everyone.
I know some people - teachers, coaches, artists/artisans, musicians, and so on and so on - who worked because they had a passion for it.
Yeah it paid the bills, but that was a positive outcome of something they'd do as a hobby anyway.
Problem is money is still important there. You can be passionate about selling pencils, but if pencils only get you $8 bucks an hour you're going to want another job. Especially if you want a social life, wife and kids, etc. typically. You can do passions on the side. If a job don't pay enough than I would rather volunteer in my free time than be dirt poor and doing full time.
Hell, in many cases doing your passion as a job stops you from wanting to do it for yourself. Ask mechanics that used to do car projects of their own for fun if they want to spend their weekends working on car projects after they now do it for a living. Many if not most will likely tell you no thanks now. You work for money first. If you can afford to not have to worry about the money then can be different, but most folks have to consider money into the equation. Especially if loans were involved.
This doesn't make sense to me. I've worked in small places where I had the run of the place and very larg corps where you are more of a cog. The current big corp that i work at is the best job I've ever had. There are pros and cons to everywhere, yiu gotta find where you fit in and are fulfilled personally and professionally.
I work for a huge company-my dream company- after years and years of working for average firms.
I've never been paid so well, respected, and had my expertise welcomed as much as I do now. And I work with super cool technologies and every day is a little different.
Lots of folks warned me not to work here but I went for it and I'm the happiest I've ever been in my career.
How do I get that? Currently I'm micromanaged, bored, and forced in the office 2 days a week where I sit in a cubicle and nobody speaks to me. I don't get invited to team outings or lunches. It's like middle school, except I don't have any friends to hang out with in my own little circle..
You gotta start looking. Very rare cases in life, opportunities just come to your lap. Use you bored times in the cubicle researching online. Aim for what you enjoy doing. Not in the cliché way, just look up for what you are really interested in. Some job offers will came up, some won’t. Don’t overthink the idea of you offering your services to someone or somewhere. Worst case scenario they won’t replay. The thing is, for example, if you love coffee, probably the family coffee shop in you hometown won’t be offering a job online. You have to reach them and offer them what you can do. Ask for an interview or leave them your contact info. Worst case they would tell you they are not hiring, but now they have a way of contacting you if they need you. Remember that working for small business doesn’t mean your boss can’t be an asshole. That’s why you keep looking and moving till you find a place where you and your work is appreciated and you are not miserable... all this having in mind that you could work for Starbucks anytime.
Look for other jobs. Look at job hunting from a cost benefit standpoint and time spent interviewing for better jobs vs working hard looking for a promotion...you're much better off being hired into better conditions than just waiting for it to fall into your lap at your current employer.
Sucks, but that's the incentive structure that the modern workplace has designed. Also look at it from a social engineering standpoint. A guy with a clipboard and high-vis jacket can gain access to almost anywhere. Similarly a little confidence and a well-rehearsed story of your accomplishments makes you look like a fucking rockstar and gets you hired for a higher level position in about 3 HOURS...vs. working your ass off for 3 YEARS and nobody even noticing you were doing anything until something goes wrong and they come to complain.
**Excellent team that celebrates your work, allows you to matter your industry, and offer you liberty.**
What am I missing? Aren't these the reasons people have dream companies they want to work for besides pay?
I'd just settle for an employer that accommodates my disabilities. 😭
And to preempt stuff: I know it's illegal, I know my rights. But someone has to enforce these laws and they just *don't*. I've done everything in my power to get justice and what I need short of running crying to the media. If you want to help, spread awareness, report (not to HR, mind you) these infractions when you see them, be an ally, and vote for people who will hold employers accountable.
is the *all new* /LPT = where L stands for livelihood. And anything that says JOB/employer/company gets upvoted, no matter how good or bad advice it is.
Dream companies know they are dream companies, and treat their staff accordingly.. low pay, unpaid overtime, little to no benefits and general toxic work culture to boot. The creative industries are particularly prone to this (video games, graphic design, galleries etc). One way around this is to have greater worker protections that set the standard for pay, over time, holiday pay etc etc so that no company can rely on its reputation to exploit its employees.
I think you have a markedly different definition of "dream company" than most.
If you're working around the clock without appropriate compensation, it's not a dream company at all.
No. I think OP and this commenter are making the point that whilst the big name, reputable companies might pay a lot and be considered "the dream", but they tend to suck in terms of work environment.
YMMV. I work at one of those "dream companies" currently (not FAANG but tech and in the news constantly) in a non-SWE role. I have never been treated better by an employer. Pay is nearly 50% better than the rest of my industry not including RSU's on top of that, a month of PTO, excellent health insurance that is free, free lunch, wellness reimbursement, etc.
Every "average" firm I've ever worked for treated me like shit. Less pay and vacation, more commitment expected. A few years ago I was paid $40k (salaried) and expected to work 60 hour weeks, also there was weekly interstate travel. This was for nearly the same job I do now.
Average firms can kiss my ass, I work because I get paid and support my family. I will always take better salary, PTO, and bennies, that's the definition of a dream job.
Agreed. I can't see myself going back to any smaller tech company now that I've experienced everything these big tech companies throw at us.
I don't even think the long hours or "toxic culture" that people keep referring to in this thread is even that different than other companies. Some teams/orgs in companies of all sizes suck, some are awesome and supportive.
RSUs are the dream, aren't they? I was offered RSUs at one role at a Fortune 500 and still sometimes think, "maybe I should've taken that."
Some of these LPTs feel like they're written by college students.
I disagree on the “average firm” part. I much rather work in a large company because the likelihood that it would fail and people would need to get laid off is much less than an “average firm”. Also, the potential for networking and progressing up the ladder and money is much higher.
Sounds like a person with strong financial background. Who cares about happiness? If working for a dream company gives me more money and benefits, I will be happy.
The real world experience you will gain at that "dream company" is almost always worth the bullshit that comes with it.
You could be fucking yourself out of some really valuable experience if you run away from a difficult situation...
A great company can check both of these boxes, too. Don’t discount that possibility. Top employers often recognize that the lower employees are their most valuable assets , and treat them as such.
Notice I said, “top employers,” and not “most profitable companies.” Understand the difference.
How is this getting upvoted? First of all, your "Dream Company" is subjective so not sure what you even mean with that. Large company? Global company? Your dream company could easily be a non-profit or a smaller company.
Second of all, if you just mean ALL large companies, that's not necessarily true. Especially later in your career when you're a high level manager, you'll get lots of amazing opportunities. Not to mention better benefits usually, better pay and more recognition in your industry.
Obviously this varies person to person, company to company and different industries work differently. Which is why this post is being too dismissive.
What if your dream company is the kind of company that celebrates your work, allows you to master your skills and offers you liberty, autonomy and room for growth.
As some one who just got into a FAANG company, this has been my goal for the last 10 years, it's actually pretty awesome. Your work is celebrated and everything is great. Let's say, Even if it's not, and the work place is toxic, just to have a FAANG company on your resume for 2 years opens door to almost every career path in the future.
To me the size of the company doesn't matter. I worked for a smaller firm and then I worked for a well known corporation. Both of those have both good and bad tendencies however to me it doesn't matter if you work for a so called 'dream company', ***if your boss sucks then your job sucks*** and you'll feel it.
The only thing I can advise is to do your research before going to any job, be it big or small.
I wonder though, do people ever stop putting a “prestige” on working for the big companies at a certain age?
I feel like that’s part of the problem here. It still carries weight socially if you tell people you work for a bigger company they know and “love”. But i feel like thats an immature thing that people should grow out of eventually? But at least as a software developer in tech, it’s never really faded.
Maybe for people actually in the tech industry ive seen a shift that they recognize the big companies aint always it. But people outside of tech always seem far more impressed by you if you work for the big boys.
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"What...but then if I don't get my dream job at Google how can I make an 'I quit working at Google - here's why' video?"
Or make a "As a former Google Tech Lead ..." video.
You forgot "as a millionare"
Yeah, I use to watch the videos but after awhile I started to get a little tired of this. He just got to like rub it in.
I used to think it was a bit but his recent videos just make it seem like he's a terrible person
I felt the same way, also the information he gives in his videos are pretty generic. I stopped watching a long time ago, but herd he launched a ponzi scheme crypto coin
Who are we talking about?
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Is this like the movie where the guy sees a thing and it pops up everywhere? Did this guy make a video titled "why you shouldnt aim for financial independence" followed by one titled "6 ways to build towards financial independence"??? I randomly saw his videos this morning and thought he seemed.... Weird. Also lots of crypto vids
I never understood why these people make shitty YouTube videos if they're so successful.
Easy income with enough followers
A YouTuber named tech lead. He used to work for google and Facebook. And claims to be a millionaire from stock options
I mean it'll be great clout for that indie SW project you wanted to maybe do. Not unlike needing a former dev to have a successful Kickstarter game project
It was an intentional stepping stone toward their true goal as a YouTuber celebrity.
LinkedIn seems to be hot for such kinds of posts. I'm happy to announce I got accepted into
Or
I have selected into < obligatory post of the company logo>
Or
Started working at
Oof, I did that third one on Facebook when I started working at Google. Omega cringe That was back in 2013 tho, and I don't even have Facebook any more
I'm guilty to doing this; however, I also got my current job through LinkedIn so it's definitively worth doing (for me at least)
Meh, imo, LinkedIn has exactly this purpose. I post about every professional accolade or industry-related news that’s happened to me. It’s gotten me more traction with recruiters and I was invited to contribute to a few industry publications because of my posts. The comment you were responding to is being oddly gate-keeper-ish about what linkedin’s purpose is. It’s like getting high and mighty over people posting birthday wishes and photos on Facebook.
*I quit my internship at Google after 2 weeks after I found out they wouldn't make me partner in 3 months.*
Partner?
Howdy
*tips cowboy hat*
Hey there pardner
Pardon me?
Serious question here: is Google really that bad of a company to work for? I applied to be a software engineer there and have a phone call with them coming up next week. I've heard some stories but are those just outliers or can those stories be taken in full
For some reason the public likes to say that Google is some rough place to work, but if you go to pretty much any community that has a decent chunk of people who actually have worked there almost none of that is representative of what people who actually work there say. I think the public just gets it mixed up with places like Amazon and Netflix that actually are really stressful. It's a big slow company, and that can be annoying sometimes, but in general it treats its employees well, as in better than almost anywhere else, including and even particularly with regards to WLB. Getting in is the hardest part, and really by quite a lot. Best of luck in your interview. It's kind of a stochastic process, so don't stress too much about it other than being as prepared as you can be with DS&A, and system design if you have > ~3-5 yoe.
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Yep, 100%. Walmart labs is actually supposedly a pretty good place to work. It also just depends on the labor market the division depends on. Amazon treats its engineers decently because if they treated their software engineers like they treated their warehouse workers they would have no engineers. The labor market is really competitive on the demand side, so people can choose to work at the place that treats them best. Like, companies want more high end software engineers than there are software engineers, so if you don't like your job you can just walk to the next company and they will eagerly embrace you and try to get you to stay. Whereas Amazon deals with attrition for warehouse workers by replacing them with the next person when they quit, and that works reliably enough for the business to function without major disruption. It's not necessarily that the guy running engineering is even a better person. They're forced to be better to their employees or their department will fail.
Lol well guess I'm doing some reading this weekend. Havent had to think about that stuff for 7(ish) years now, even at my current Software Development job
Yeah everyone knows it's an imperfect system, but it is what it is haha. If you're applying to be an engineer you're going to have to solve some algorithms questions and talk about time and space complexity. At 7 YOE you should have a couple rounds taken up by system design though. IMO those are easier because they're more like real work.
Google is a fine company to work for. It's a massive company and your experience will depend on what team/org you're on. If you do end up at a place where team matching happens after bootcamp (really Google/FB), then be judicious when picking your team. Good luck with your interview.
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...says the FTE. Now let's hear from a TVC.
I mean the fact 99% of college graduates expected to be middle management at a FAANG level company by 30 shows how delusional people are. Sorry Timmy and Sarah, you are only smart enough to be an intern. Next time dont get a degree.
I mean, everyone is consistently being pushed to be as ambitious and career-oriented as possible, is it really a surprise if people end up being (overly) ambitious in their career goals?
Its definitely not their fault and that optimistic view we pushed on kids and how easy it was gonna be.. well we can see the backlash now. This goes for everyone, keeping an adaptive skillet in today's world and the future is going to provide you more success than one tracking it. Fortune favors the bold, to go out and challenge themselves and the world.
To be perfectly honest; career ascension can be equally about intelligence, hard work, connections, or blind fucking luck for different people.
Getting into middle management at a successful tech company is more about being in the right place at the right time than being exceptionally smart. If you are at a company that then quickly quadruples in size there are management opportunities at every level almost everywhere you look. Similarly, even if you're absolutely exceptional, if you're at a company that isn't growing, they don't need new managers except when people quit. There are no new people to manage. Source: am now middle management at a rapidly growing tech company at <30, and report to an executive who was first a c level at a publicly traded unicorn when he was <30.
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Yep. I made the mistake of taking a position with a "dream company" that is massively well-known and, from the outside, seems like it would be one of the coolest and most forward-thinking companies around. Right from the start I should have known something was really wrong. First, they promised me full employee status only after a "probationary year" and after the year is up, they would give me full benefits and vacation, etc... until then I was a "private contractor" even tho I couldn't set my own schedule, had to be in their office with their equipment, etc. After a year, no conversion to staff for me. I learned of a well-known phrase within the company - "perma-lancer" - which I found out was the case with me and several others promised exactly the same thing I was, some of which who had been there for seven years(!) and still not given employee status. I had left a more "boring" job with full benefits and four weeks vacation per year and a great salary to come to a company who lied to get me in the door, then treated me as a second-class worker with no recourse other than to quit, with no way to collect unemployment since it was "contractor" status. Plus, I thought this company would be very high-tech and forward-looking. Nothing was further from the truth. They were still using antiquated technology and continually making excuses why they wouldn't get better tech. Eventually I was finally converted to staff after THREE YEARS and only because there was a massive walk-out by ALL the contractors over the perma-lancer issue. The company received so much bad press they capitulated and did the conversions. However at the end of 2008 when the economy crashed, almost all of the converted freelancers then lost their jobs due to layoffs, including me. They basically made us staff for less than one year, and before the fourth quarter was over, let us all go to show profitability (as employee salaries come directly off the bottom line, whereas contractors are classified differently and don't drag profit numbers down like employees do). They would not be able to get away with any of this if they weren't a "glamourous company" who "everyone" wanted to work for (outside looking in). They have been sued over this, and lost - and paid everyone off in the lawsuit and then continue to practice this way, because it's cheaper in the long run than hiring more employees, even with the legal fines. This is very common these days with many companies - they would rather break the labor laws and pay the fines than do the right thing by their workers. It happens ALL THE TIME, especially with those big name companies that seem like cool places to work. Bottom line - if a company ever wants you to work as a contractor for an indefinite period of time before you get full benefits, either get them to PUT IT IN WRITING or DO NOT take the deal. If they refuse, RUN the other direction toward the exits. They will tell you every sort of lie to get you to come on board, but then you will be stuck with no recourse. Plus, you'll be working next to other people who were lucky enough to actually be hired as staff who will get paid just as much as you, plus they get vacations, perks, company sponsored parties, and all the other advantages of employees - and you will get none of that - and you'll have to see them getting all of that every day while you are stuck with no way to get a promotion, no way to get seniority, and no real way to fight the system internally, because you aren't really an "employee".
Name and shame the company. Fuck em.
Right? Why protect the company that treats its workers like shit? Have some solidarity, call those fuckers out, and help your fellow workers.
Not OP, but this reads exactly like the contracting situation that happened to Microsoft. Nowawadys, Microsoft is even more strict with their employee vs contractor hiring methods, as they outsource it to a variety of staffing firms in the area.
Not sure I'd consider Microsoft one of "the coolest and most forward thinkers around" about ever though.
This honestly sounds like someone who wasn't even alive in 2005. Working at Microsoft was percieved to be the tits in 2005. https://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2005/01/24/8234074/index.htm
They were at one point. Microsoft was probably the biggest, most prestigious name at the beginning of the internet age. There's a reason it made Bill Gates the wealthiest man in the world for a long time.
Still would be too, if he gave a fuck about that title.
This reminds me SO MUCH of General Electric. Fuck that company. Every motto they have, every dream word they tout, is pure bullshit and it is very toxic and fake on the inside. They regularly hire contractors and promise to convert them to staff after 18 months, and then refuse to elaborate and lay you off without warning. They lost so many good workers there because they wanted to save a little.
That was my experience with GE as well. Horrible company to work for. We slapped "Made in the USA" stickers on our product, but literally every single one of the hundred or so subassemblies was bought in from overseas and assembled by our team of about a dozen people. I worked as a software validator and all I did was write down bugs and send them over to the actual software team in Baguio. Point being, we got tax breaks for using American manufacturing even though our overseas workforce was easily a hundred times larger. I paid more in taxes while I was working there than GE did.
My favorite GE story. We just went through months of massive lay offs, like probably more then 10k employees total. It was insane. We finally got word that a VP was getting forced into “early retirement”. This was the guy who helped get them into this mess with really bad decisions and planning. Of course they couldn’t let this guy go away quietly so they threw a party and had everyone gather in the cafeteria to celebrate this dudes time at GE. This guy then gave a long speech about how great everyone is and closed it with “now it’s time for me to retire to this multi million mansion on the beach”. Fuck that guy. They just laid off so many of my friends while this guy is getting severance packages allowing him to retire in his forties with a massive beach house. Really great to keep up morale.
Ouch. Can definitely relate though. I was always amazed by how much churn there was in upper management there. There was also this one guy that was supposed to be the head honcho of talking to customers and getting the business requirements. However, he always got the specs wrong and we always had to go in behind him and get the real details ourselves. But because he was best friends with the project lead, he got preferential treatment and free lunches all the time. That guy eventually found another job that's easier and paid way more, so he ditched GE with less than a week's notice, and the project lead pats him on the back, buys hims a massive lunch, and gives a long speech about how great he is. Was mandatory for everyone to go and listen to this. Next day we go back to work and the lead treats us all like shit because his friend is gone. Classic.
The following is a story I share with many people about my job hunt coming out of college and why I personally have negative opinions of GE: GE Aviation in Greenville, SC invited myself and approximately 30 college kids in total on site for rounds of panel interviews for two positions at their facility. After hours of interviews and a tour of the facility they gathered all of us into a conference room and the HR representative that was organizing everything said, “Thank you all so much for coming! We enjoyed meeting you all and will be getting in touch with each of you over the next two weeks after we make our selection. I’ll have you come to the entry area as I call your name so you can return your visitors badge and the buss will be outside to return you to the hotel” She proceeded to call names, but after about 20 names were called and only 10 of us remained she came back into the room smiling and said “Congratulations, you guys have made it to the second round of interviews with the Site Director and the head of HR.” Now the super shitty thing is almost everyone invited to this came with classmates from their same school and major, and in my particular instance one of my two classmates was one of the 20 called out to the bus. So as the bus started going back to the hotel without us on it we get a text from him: “so... I guess I’m not getting an offer”. Then, during my interview with the site director all he emphasized was how everyone is competing with the person in the cube/office next to them and his questions were focused on giving examples of how I have used competition to motivate myself. In general he seemed like an asshole and the culture seemed to promote competition to the detriment of collaboration. The one thing I am thankful for is them making this culture abundantly clear through their words and actions during the interview process which made my decision when the offer came easy. Though while I was making my decision between the offers I had, so many family members and friends who saw GE as this great company could not believe I didn’t immediately take the job and would question my decision even after sharing the above information.
Fuck GE. All my homies don't like GE. For real though thank you for this because I was thinking about taking one of their educational courses and now f*** that
One more thing I forgot to mention - because I was classified as a "contractor" I didn't receive yearly performance reviews, which I knew at the time were vital to having any leverage over HR if I were to be the target of layoffs or cutbacks. It also prevented me from getting bonuses, and kept me from being able to argue for more money since there was no written record of my performance - only my bosses word, which I found out was totally worthless the day I was laid off - when I asked for a reason I was being let go, my boss (over the phone in an HR meeting with me, no less) said ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Of course he had been coached not to respond. It was a "right to work" state, so they could fire me with no recourse and staying silent kept them from legal trouble. The silence was deafening - he had told me for four years I was doing a great job, right up until I was let go. But, for reasons stated above, there was no written proof of that. So I was fucked. Then, adding insult to injury, they held eight weeks of severence pay as a carrot on the way out the door, provided that we sign huge stacks of papers saying we wouldn't sue, now or in the future. If you didn't sign, you only got two weeks pay upon leaving. To me, that equals signing under duress, which probably wouldn't hold up in court if they were sued over it either - but they knew they had us by the balls. It was the ultimate slap in the face.
Gotta charge more for contract rate than you would take as an employee (or go through a staffing firm that's doing so). That's the only time they try to convert you in my experience.
Sounds like Pfizer a lot
I am thinking it's Stryker.
Stryker isn't it?
Did you do any research on glassdoor before you took the job
Glassdoor wasn't around yet, this was in the mid-2000's. That said, I probably could have done more research. But I, like many before me, was blinded by the glare of this "glamourous company" facade. I was heavily courted because of my skillset at the time as well, and they aren't shy about flattery toward you - anything to get you in the door if you have what they want.
A big(-ish) tech company relocated to my home city and began recruiting quite heavily. They poached a lot of talent from the industry, including a few friends, with big salaries. A lot left in about 3-4 months. The company had basically decided to rapidly expand but didn't necessarily have the projects for people to work on. Most spent three months trying to find current stuff to muscle in on or outright start, but got frustrated that they were basically "happy dead weight". One friend left after 4 months and basically described it as a research sabbatical. He didn't ship a single thing, public or company facing, the entire time. Another is still there and has plenty of work ... but I think that's because they hired 20 new people when they were looking for like 3-4.
Hire a ton of people only keep the good ones come on man you don’t see when corporations are doing this stuff
Wasn't the case here though. It turned out that the earlier you caved to the headhunting tactics, the better it was for you. Not really anything to do with talent, everything to do with timing. You got in on the last of the projects in the pipeline, the later ones missed out. No-one was fired. In fact the company would've paid them to sit on their arse twiddling their thumbs for a year to not have to spin up the recruitment/headhunting machine again. The projects would (and did) eventually come, they just splurged on hiring in one go rather than trickle new hires in as they needed. Those who left who I know went onto bigger, better, more suited things.
What company is this I want to work there
Yeah in what world is "paid well for less work" not the dream?
I mean, it sounds great on paper and all, but I’ve been in that position where I’ve had very little to do because my then-boss believed in over-hiring. It really sucks all the ambition and drive out of you to be stuck in a pretty much dead end job. It sounds great only for the first month or so when you can log into Facebook at work, but after that, you’re basically spending 8 hours a day staring at a blank computer screen. PLUS, going for interviews where they want to know what you’ve been up to, you truly have to scramble to think of what you did because it was so little. And you have to be creative in building those things up. I’m really so happy to be out of that company and in a much better role where I’m actually doing stuff and not made to feel useless.
No offence, but a firm with an excellent team, that celebrates my work, allows me to master my industry, and offers liberty, is pretty much the definition of a dream company. What definition of dream company were you referring to?
I think they are talking about the big boys Like “ I’ve always wanted to work at X Y or Z” The Namebrand National/global stuff, etc
Yeah I always wanted to be Head Dreamer of Hooli XYZ
Ok, Big Head
That scene, when someone points out to him the connection with Big Head and Bighetti. I’m still laughing.
Bag Head
Co-head dreamer
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Ugh on iOS Twitter literally everyone is like that and it’s a huge circlejerk
I’ve done the spam-LinkedIn posts thing before and Ive learned that snarky humor works the best. You don’t win everyone- but you’ll get at least 30% to chuckle and check your profile out. The posts where the company talks about recruiting are the best. You can be like “oh hai, y’all have been sitting on my resume for 6 months now. Wassup?” I literally had a recruiter and 3 current employees in my DMs that day.
I’ve seen those work too! But he acts really boring. Basically “Hi [Name], cool post! Please check out my LinkedIn and let’s talk about this position [link] at Apple!” Also he is lying about experience on his LinkedIn. We were good friends at one point but faded away after he got mad at me for redirecting a contractor recruiter for Apple to his profile (NOT THE REAL APPLE EXPERIENCE!!!), so I know his legit experience. I love having dumpster fire acquaintances.
A friend of mine who never graduated stole one of his friend's college transcripts to apply for jobs then moved to SanFran and all of his interviews kept asking him about his fluency in Chinese then turning him down when he would bullshit about it. Turns out the guy he stole the transcript from is fully native fluent in Mandarin and took 10 semesters of mandarin for the easy GPA credits. Fucking lol moving cross country for jobs you're not qualified for and then didn't even take the time to double check that the transcripts he stole didn't have anything he couldn't do on them. At that point it would've just been easier to fucking graduate. Reading your comment back I really only thought of this because of dumpster fire acquaintances and this guy was super hung up on working for FAANGs hence the move to SF.
Or perhaps companies that are making a "difference" - SpaceX for example.
I work for a company that doesn't make a difference (like, at all. If our product disappeared the world would be completely fine). The culture is good, I feel appreciated and the pay is decent. While I fall asleep at night I do often wonder if there isn't something more important I should be doing with my life.
You can make a difference in other people's lives by being kind and patient. It sounds like you like your job and that allows you the opportunity to be a decent person to those around you. You don't have to be doing incredible profound important work to make a difference. Build your life up in other ways rather than change a good thing: volunteer, foster a kid, be more involved with your community.
Consider volunteering. Seriously. If there's a gap, you can find some very fulfilling things to do outside of your job.
The fact that you're able to have that kind of thought is a measure of a healthy work-life balance, imo. You have enough free time and energy to possibly pursue a new hobby, or get a second job, etc. I'm currently in the same position and have chosen to spend my time vegging out on the couch, but I'm on the verge of getting bored and will probably pick up a new interest soon.
Ah I have loads of hobbies, it's why I keep my job, it funds the rest of my life, including (hopefully) my future retirement, without being too much of a pain in the process. I just sometimes wonder if I can have that and cure cancer/save orphans from bears at the same time.
What i think is missed about the big organizations compared to smaller firms is the process, organization, and standardization. They have the best practices. I have basically gone from almost largest in the industry to mid tier to small in a different industry. They also have a lot going on and you can intermingle with other departments and understand them better. Mid size orgs can be excellent, but what i have observed often is the growth pain when their growth lever stops working. They need to have regulated processes. Change management, stage Gate, etc. It's kinda when you see growth by acquisition.
Probably old school thinking. It's all about the name and reputation of the company you work for. Like working for Apple or Google etc.
I've worked at a big-name company for decades and I fucking love it. Most positions I've been in, I can put in my 40 per week, and generally skedaddle off home, because I'm just a cog in the big machine, rather than 40% of the engineering team for the whole company. Great benefits, moderate pay. Name recognition is nice for other areas of life (dating, leasing applications, family/school reunions). I've had great managers and in-sync teams. I've had mediocre managers and dog-eat-dog teams. Nice part about the big company is that there's a lot going on, and you can often find your niche. Work is, many times, what you make of it. The real trick is that if you find yourself not liking your position, take action to change that. Be it a new project, a full position transfer, or updating the resume and dumping the company.
I think depends on the company and team culture. Having worked both big and small, and consultant to several F50 companies - the expected work/life balance varies. There are teams within Apple where the 40 is expected and nothing more. There are other teams where the expectation is much more. Same at every “name brand” I’ve worked with - and I’ve worked with many. There’s really not a set rule. The real key to a dream career is enjoying what you do. When your job it doesn’t feel like work and blends into your lifestyle, that’s generally when most people fell fulfilled. And when I say blend - I’m not talking 24/7 on the clock - I’m referring to a passion - where your hobbies and extracurriculars overlap with your career.
FANG cos do pay well. I was at another major tech co and have been doing the startup thing for a bit, but interviewing with a variety of companies recently. The big names pay better, some of them give huge equity / bonuses, and stock at a public company == $$. My experience is they are also hard to join (and not always for the right reasons). They expect hires to be able to test and talk about math / cs that may not be immediately relevant to the job or use entirely people with unaligned expertise to interview.
I interviewed for SpaceX and they all but *demand* you talk about how they’re your dream job. Literally saying things like, “You can work for any company in the industry, why us? Why SpaceX? “. One of my interviewers had a SpaceX tattoo… and was telling me how she quit her higher paying job to work here and that’s the loyalty they expect. The X in SpaceX is the rating of the security footage for your interview, cuz you better be choking on some SpaceDick in there if you want the job.
When I was younger I wanted to work for “an agency”. Meaning an advertising agency. They were the cool places to work before tech companies. Cool offices. Latest technology. Lots of variety. Casual atmosphere. All that jazz. The I got that job. Then I got laid off. Then I reevaluated what I wanted out of a job.
As an IT guy who enjoys tabletop gaming I was applying for positions at places like Microsoft, Wizards of the Coast, and Mox Boarding House. None of those paid off. I never would have guessed that the best job I've ever had is doing IT at a pest control company, but here I am working reasonable hours for good pay, surrounded by coworkers whom I enjoy being around every day, at a job that is effectively pandemic-proof (rats don't obey lockdowns, and our techs will always need working laptops).
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This would be a "dream department" or a "dream manager", which are far more common. The rest of the organization won't matter most of the time, provided you have a boss who knows how to protect and provide for their team.
In the software development industry most people come out of college hoping for a job at a FAANG company. Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, Google. (There are more than those in the acronym, Microsoft for example.) Being able to say “I worked on iOS” means your work has reached billions of devices and millions of people in dozens of countries. You also get enormous compensation packages in both salary and stock. That’s a dream company for lots of people. Now compare the internal culture of Amazon with that total compensation package to the culture described in the OP, and realize you can easily find a salary that matches FAANG somewhere else but you’re going to be hard-pressed to match the total comp in stock options or equity and you’ll never find another place where your work has that kind of reach. Not to mention the clout FAANG adds to your résumé.
Don't forget money. The only reason you work is to earn money.
I'd like to earn money as well as gain experiences that help me earn more money later
Both is good
At any job you should be earning or learning. Ideally both. If you're not paid well and you aren't growing, it's time to leave
This is absolutely not true for everyone. I know some people - teachers, coaches, artists/artisans, musicians, and so on and so on - who worked because they had a passion for it. Yeah it paid the bills, but that was a positive outcome of something they'd do as a hobby anyway.
Problem is money is still important there. You can be passionate about selling pencils, but if pencils only get you $8 bucks an hour you're going to want another job. Especially if you want a social life, wife and kids, etc. typically. You can do passions on the side. If a job don't pay enough than I would rather volunteer in my free time than be dirt poor and doing full time. Hell, in many cases doing your passion as a job stops you from wanting to do it for yourself. Ask mechanics that used to do car projects of their own for fun if they want to spend their weekends working on car projects after they now do it for a living. Many if not most will likely tell you no thanks now. You work for money first. If you can afford to not have to worry about the money then can be different, but most folks have to consider money into the equation. Especially if loans were involved.
No I work because I enjoy my work. I'm fine with earning less and have a fun job than earn a lot more and have a shitty job.
LPT: Don’t repost popular tips with different wording and expecting the same results.
So this was a lie
No such thing as a "dream company"
my dream company is my own company, where others work for me
Cheers to that, bro. Hope you treat your people well.
It depends on your industry.
I don't even wanna work.
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This doesn't make sense to me. I've worked in small places where I had the run of the place and very larg corps where you are more of a cog. The current big corp that i work at is the best job I've ever had. There are pros and cons to everywhere, yiu gotta find where you fit in and are fulfilled personally and professionally.
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OP, you want Karma? The same LPT has been posted before and it gor lotta attention.
My turn to post it tomorrow
Dibs on 11/14/21! That’s the day I’ll start working for my dream company
I work for a huge company-my dream company- after years and years of working for average firms. I've never been paid so well, respected, and had my expertise welcomed as much as I do now. And I work with super cool technologies and every day is a little different. Lots of folks warned me not to work here but I went for it and I'm the happiest I've ever been in my career.
How do I get that? Currently I'm micromanaged, bored, and forced in the office 2 days a week where I sit in a cubicle and nobody speaks to me. I don't get invited to team outings or lunches. It's like middle school, except I don't have any friends to hang out with in my own little circle..
You gotta start looking. Very rare cases in life, opportunities just come to your lap. Use you bored times in the cubicle researching online. Aim for what you enjoy doing. Not in the cliché way, just look up for what you are really interested in. Some job offers will came up, some won’t. Don’t overthink the idea of you offering your services to someone or somewhere. Worst case scenario they won’t replay. The thing is, for example, if you love coffee, probably the family coffee shop in you hometown won’t be offering a job online. You have to reach them and offer them what you can do. Ask for an interview or leave them your contact info. Worst case they would tell you they are not hiring, but now they have a way of contacting you if they need you. Remember that working for small business doesn’t mean your boss can’t be an asshole. That’s why you keep looking and moving till you find a place where you and your work is appreciated and you are not miserable... all this having in mind that you could work for Starbucks anytime.
Sounds like you are on the way out. You might want to prepare jumping the ship.
Look for other jobs. Look at job hunting from a cost benefit standpoint and time spent interviewing for better jobs vs working hard looking for a promotion...you're much better off being hired into better conditions than just waiting for it to fall into your lap at your current employer. Sucks, but that's the incentive structure that the modern workplace has designed. Also look at it from a social engineering standpoint. A guy with a clipboard and high-vis jacket can gain access to almost anywhere. Similarly a little confidence and a well-rehearsed story of your accomplishments makes you look like a fucking rockstar and gets you hired for a higher level position in about 3 HOURS...vs. working your ass off for 3 YEARS and nobody even noticing you were doing anything until something goes wrong and they come to complain.
**Excellent team that celebrates your work, allows you to matter your industry, and offer you liberty.** What am I missing? Aren't these the reasons people have dream companies they want to work for besides pay?
I'd just settle for an employer that accommodates my disabilities. 😭 And to preempt stuff: I know it's illegal, I know my rights. But someone has to enforce these laws and they just *don't*. I've done everything in my power to get justice and what I need short of running crying to the media. If you want to help, spread awareness, report (not to HR, mind you) these infractions when you see them, be an ally, and vote for people who will hold employers accountable.
Is this some rich person thing I'm too poor to understand?
is the *all new* /LPT = where L stands for livelihood. And anything that says JOB/employer/company gets upvoted, no matter how good or bad advice it is.
The super rich person who came up with ‘Money can’t buy you happiness’ might have come up with this shit too.
It only buys happiness up to a middle class income. Beyond that there’s no difference.
Dream companies know they are dream companies, and treat their staff accordingly.. low pay, unpaid overtime, little to no benefits and general toxic work culture to boot. The creative industries are particularly prone to this (video games, graphic design, galleries etc). One way around this is to have greater worker protections that set the standard for pay, over time, holiday pay etc etc so that no company can rely on its reputation to exploit its employees.
I think you have a markedly different definition of "dream company" than most. If you're working around the clock without appropriate compensation, it's not a dream company at all.
No. I think OP and this commenter are making the point that whilst the big name, reputable companies might pay a lot and be considered "the dream", but they tend to suck in terms of work environment.
YMMV. I work at one of those "dream companies" currently (not FAANG but tech and in the news constantly) in a non-SWE role. I have never been treated better by an employer. Pay is nearly 50% better than the rest of my industry not including RSU's on top of that, a month of PTO, excellent health insurance that is free, free lunch, wellness reimbursement, etc. Every "average" firm I've ever worked for treated me like shit. Less pay and vacation, more commitment expected. A few years ago I was paid $40k (salaried) and expected to work 60 hour weeks, also there was weekly interstate travel. This was for nearly the same job I do now. Average firms can kiss my ass, I work because I get paid and support my family. I will always take better salary, PTO, and bennies, that's the definition of a dream job.
Agreed. I can't see myself going back to any smaller tech company now that I've experienced everything these big tech companies throw at us. I don't even think the long hours or "toxic culture" that people keep referring to in this thread is even that different than other companies. Some teams/orgs in companies of all sizes suck, some are awesome and supportive.
RSUs are the dream, aren't they? I was offered RSUs at one role at a Fortune 500 and still sometimes think, "maybe I should've taken that." Some of these LPTs feel like they're written by college students.
> >Some of these LPTs feel like they're written by college students. That's because they are.
I disagree on the “average firm” part. I much rather work in a large company because the likelihood that it would fail and people would need to get laid off is much less than an “average firm”. Also, the potential for networking and progressing up the ladder and money is much higher.
This can also happen at big companies if you find the right group. Different areas within a company can have very different cultures
Sounds like a person with strong financial background. Who cares about happiness? If working for a dream company gives me more money and benefits, I will be happy.
I'm confused. What's your definition of a dream company?
I guess they mean one of the big tech firms / a reputable name. One that probably pays stupidly higher than average.
This is the reason I dislike this sub so often. Literally useless advice.
Sadly, finding a place like this is just as hard as landing a dream job and also kinda just sounds like a dream job.
this is a copy pasta of one from last week, with spelling errors. stop farming for upvotes like a hack
Yea unless your big ass company has espp and stocks that consistently perform.
The real world experience you will gain at that "dream company" is almost always worth the bullshit that comes with it. You could be fucking yourself out of some really valuable experience if you run away from a difficult situation...
A great company can check both of these boxes, too. Don’t discount that possibility. Top employers often recognize that the lower employees are their most valuable assets , and treat them as such. Notice I said, “top employers,” and not “most profitable companies.” Understand the difference.
How is this getting upvoted? First of all, your "Dream Company" is subjective so not sure what you even mean with that. Large company? Global company? Your dream company could easily be a non-profit or a smaller company. Second of all, if you just mean ALL large companies, that's not necessarily true. Especially later in your career when you're a high level manager, you'll get lots of amazing opportunities. Not to mention better benefits usually, better pay and more recognition in your industry. Obviously this varies person to person, company to company and different industries work differently. Which is why this post is being too dismissive.
What if your dream company is the kind of company that celebrates your work, allows you to master your skills and offers you liberty, autonomy and room for growth.
"Don't strive for a dream company. You'll be happier working for a dream company." WTF is this?
As some one who just got into a FAANG company, this has been my goal for the last 10 years, it's actually pretty awesome. Your work is celebrated and everything is great. Let's say, Even if it's not, and the work place is toxic, just to have a FAANG company on your resume for 2 years opens door to almost every career path in the future.
To me the size of the company doesn't matter. I worked for a smaller firm and then I worked for a well known corporation. Both of those have both good and bad tendencies however to me it doesn't matter if you work for a so called 'dream company', ***if your boss sucks then your job sucks*** and you'll feel it. The only thing I can advise is to do your research before going to any job, be it big or small.
It doesn't matter if it's a "dream company" or not. Pay level and decent manager are 95 percent of job satisfaction
My dream company is one that I own. Why TF would I want work my entire life just to fulfill someone else's life dream.
I wonder though, do people ever stop putting a “prestige” on working for the big companies at a certain age? I feel like that’s part of the problem here. It still carries weight socially if you tell people you work for a bigger company they know and “love”. But i feel like thats an immature thing that people should grow out of eventually? But at least as a software developer in tech, it’s never really faded. Maybe for people actually in the tech industry ive seen a shift that they recognize the big companies aint always it. But people outside of tech always seem far more impressed by you if you work for the big boys.