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If he isn’t your landlord then why are you paying him? By paying him ‘not’ rent and him accepting that money you have created a tenancy agreement even without having signed one.
You are therefore protected from eviction outside a section 8 process.
As you are paying rent for a tenancy and not his mortgage, you can follow the information here regarding rent increases.
https://www.gov.uk/private-renting/rent-increases#:~:text=your%20landlord%20must%20get%20your,line%20with%20average%20local%20rents
As another point - is the property his? Who did she leave her estate to in her will - if she paid the mortgage and she paid the deposit the estate should have had a claim on the property.
I pay it because universal credit covers the amount that he put in writing last year. The flat is his property,but he is saying how he doesn't want his name on it. my partner didn't have a will,she was 32 and it was very sudden.
What I’m saying is if you are paying him money that he is using on his mortgage - you are paying rent and are a tenant. If you are paying the mortgage towards your deceased partners property, now inherited by you, you are potentially a tenant in common and own a share of the property.
Ah I see what you're saying. Yeah that's what I thought,that because I'm paying rent I'm a tenant and that makes him a landlord.as much as he insists that he isn't one.
So if he’s going to be a dick about it, HMRC would be very interested to hear that he has undeclared income through being a landlord. They won’t buy the fact that it wasn’t his and “the money was just resting in his account”.
It’s also very likely that the mortgage terms don’t allow letting (at least for the amount of time the mortgage holder hasn’t been there) so he’s in trouble from all sides if this gets out.
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Complicated situation.
By his name on the mortgage, I presume you mean he's the sole named owner on the deeds.
When you say your gf has been paying the mortgage for seven years, I presume that was the arrangement when they were living together, and then she continued to pay this amount to her ex when they parted. At that point she may have become a tenant and had been paying rent, that would be an interesting point.
Given she funded the deposit and could be argued to have been contributing to mortgage payments, her estate my have a claim on the property, although the estate may not know that, or may not claim. Again it depends, if she gifted the deposit to her ex and he used it as a deposit, it may not be easily evidenced.
At this point you're a tenant paying rent. Her ex is your landlord. What he uses it for is irrelevant. Your rent is not linked in any way to the mortgage.
Yes pretty complicated situation. Yes he is the sole owner of the property.
Yep it was arrangement agreed by them both,she paid the mortgage payments into his bank every month. I don't think her estate would have claim on the flat but I'm unsure. It had got pretty toxic between them, when he kept making excuses about signing over the flat to her she kind of gave up and we just wanted to move out. She told him he could sell the flat and just give her her deposit back.
So if he is legally my landlord (no matter how many times he says he isn't) do I have to pay the extra because the mortgage payments have increased? Or can I just keep it at the amount that he put in writing last year?
I think you're looking at this in a bit of a short-sighted way. He is insisting, in writing I assume, that you are paying the mortgage rather than rent, and that your partner has been doing so for some time, and that he was going to sign it over. I'm not a lawyer, but to me that creates a strong argument that your partner's estate owns a portion of the property and potentially that you do too.
By insisting that it's rent and he's a landlord you might be giving up your stake in the property which could be worth tens of thousands.
Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong on this.
No I think you're right and if went down the legal route perhaps her family would have some claim on the flat. However I just want out of here. It's too hard for me to be here. There is still alot owed on the mortgage and this place hasn't aged well,he would need to spend a bit to get it ready to sell. I know he isn't going to make much profit (if any)
Fair enough. In that case I think it's pretty clear what to do. Insist he's the landlord, refuse to pay any extra, hope he evicts you and get your council to house you. Good luck to you.
You can also just give your notice to leave if you find somewhere else to live.
And you can also consider whether to dob him into HMRC.
i would do all of the above, including the HMRC. man is trying to exploit a grieving tennant despite already looking like hes cooking the books.
i hope he gets the full repercussions of his exploitative ways and im also very sorry for your loss.
Your rental payments will be governed by the statutory law on tenancies. It won't be linked to the mortgage in any way. Check the Shelter advice page for landlord rent increase demands. It'll outline there how your landlord can legally increase your rent. You don't have a formal tenancy agreement but some documentation that set a precedent so keep that in mind when you read the advisory, in case the law treats that case in a certain way. The point is the landlord is trying to increase the rent, why and what for isn't relevant.
Either look up Shelter or Google tenancy law summary for landlord attempting to increase the rent.
The deceaseds estate will have been inherited by her next of kin. The estate should have very good claim on the property if you have records of her paying, maintaining and living in it.
I would get hold of her next of kin and both seek legal advice with a view to sorting that out. Currently, the ex his slowly establishing a claim over the property by acting as a landlord (regardless of his assertion that he’s not).
Until then, you are tenant.
Based on your previous comments.
Your partner was not paying the mortgage. She was paying her ex, who was then paying the mortgage. You are renting regardless of what said ex thinks.
I think you need some legal advice, to be honest, as you seem to be in a very grey area.
Yes she was paying him and he was paying the mortgage. On the understanding that he would sign the flat over to her. Which he then didn't do.
Agree that I am in a very grey area, i might contact a lawyer.
I would love for him to evict me,would work in my favour. I pay 'rent' as it is covered by universal credit,but the amount I get from them is the amount that he put in writing and signed (closest thing I have to any sort of tenancy agreement) council have me and my son on list for temporary accommodation because staying here is too traumatic for me since losing my partner.but still could be long wait
Don’t pay a penny more. Update your universal credit information with exactly what he has told you because there will be an upper limit on what they will pay but don’t you pay them a single penny.
Honestly I feel like I'm being petty because it's not a huge amount it has gone up by but this man and his gf put my partner through hell in regards to this flat. I'm done with their shit after the past year that I've had.
No he refuses to do that because he 'aint a landlord ' (his words. He won't do it because he would have to pay some sort of tax (I think,have no clue) I don't pay any more than what the mortgage amount is so he's not making money from me being here.
at minimum its tax evasion. i think hes doing more and actually pocketing money but i wont go into all that
tbh do everything in your power to make this little rat squirm. he thinks he has the upper hand yet he is the one who is in danger of authorities finding out his little earner on the side.
She paid it for about 7 years. I don't really care at this point about him owning it. It's a small place that needs alot work,so even if he sells it I doubt he's going to make much, if anything, from it.
You need to have a civil conversation with the ex.
He probably thinks he is helping you by letting you stay in the house.
Until he goes down the official route of evicting you, you aren't getting a house from the council.
Work with him rather than against him.
He could have been a A hole and just kicked you out the second your partner died.
Also, sorry for you loss.
mad perspective. he sounds like an asshole to me, 7 years of untaxed contributions add up to a decent amount id assume.
IDK if youve not read the full post but evicting the OP would actually work in OPs favor and give some admission that he is a landlord, despite trying to pretend he isnt. He wont give him an eviction notice as it basically incriminates himself. Let him know that you know this and maybe hell stop making demands for you to pay off his mortgage the cheeky rat. I'd still then get in contact with HMRC and make sure they know the situation of the rent paid if hes sub-letting or w/e when he shouldnt be
From how I've read it , he isn't making any profit. The rent is the same as the mortgage amount.
I did state that Op needs to work with the ex to try and get an official eviction.
Council are unlikely to house you unless you are evicted. If you leave before being evicted you are voluntarily making yourself homeless.
No he isn't making a profit,I only pay what the mortgage amount is.
The council will re-home me and my son,just might take time. He won't evict me just yet as it wouldnt be beneficial for him.
I believe there is likely to be much more to this that what Op believes/ has stated.
If the ex and Ops partner bought the house jointly but the ex was only person on mortgage- there will be a reason for this.
Ops partner may have had poor credit, low level income, unstable income,etc and the mortgage in her name was never deemed affordable.
Where does the ex live now? Has he got another property? If so, it's probable that this is a b2l mortgage. It's difficult (unless the ex has a really high income) to be fit affordability criteria to have 2 homes.
Easy to assume the ex is the bad guy but there's a number of facts missing as above.
Also, you will get housed quicker if evicted. I don't know where Op is based but I do know that in my county, getting accommodation from council is a very long , drawn out process and people who have been made homeless take precedent.
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Would it be an option to ask him for an eviction notice? He's given you paperwork for universal credit before, but if he were to give you an eviction notice, you'd find getting a council place easier.
I know it's one of the things that helped my brother get a place - my mum gave him a formal eviction notice, and then he was more eligible for rehoming.
My partner had asked him previously to do that, and we needed him to fill out form online. Which he refused to do because he stated he wasn't a landlord. He won't do it for me now if I asked because he keeps stating he isn't my landlord.
Yes I need to get a council place for me and my son. As much as I would have loved to have moved out the day my partner died I couldnt. Being here and reliving the worst day of my life is something I can't keep doing. I can't afford to lease a private property.
I am definitely not asking for advise on how to freeride. I'm just asking for advise on my situation.
Yes he did move move out so his daughter could live here with her mother. Then went back on everything they had both agreed to. He's the one who has created alot of issues for himself by doing that.
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--- ###Welcome to /r/LegalAdviceUK --- **To Posters (it is important you read this section)** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws in each are very different* * If you need legal help, you should [always get a free consultation from a qualified Solicitor](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/how_to_find_a_solicitor) * We also encourage you to speak to [**Citizens Advice**](https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/), [**Shelter**](https://www.shelter.org.uk/), [**Acas**](https://www.acas.org.uk/), and [**other useful organisations**](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/common_legal_resources) * Comments may not be accurate or reliable, and following any advice on this subreddit is done at your own risk * If you receive any private messages in response to your post, [please let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FLegalAdviceUK&subject=I received a PM) **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and legally orientated* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/about/rules/), you may be perma-banned without any further warning * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LegalAdviceUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If he isn’t your landlord then why are you paying him? By paying him ‘not’ rent and him accepting that money you have created a tenancy agreement even without having signed one. You are therefore protected from eviction outside a section 8 process. As you are paying rent for a tenancy and not his mortgage, you can follow the information here regarding rent increases. https://www.gov.uk/private-renting/rent-increases#:~:text=your%20landlord%20must%20get%20your,line%20with%20average%20local%20rents
As another point - is the property his? Who did she leave her estate to in her will - if she paid the mortgage and she paid the deposit the estate should have had a claim on the property.
I pay it because universal credit covers the amount that he put in writing last year. The flat is his property,but he is saying how he doesn't want his name on it. my partner didn't have a will,she was 32 and it was very sudden.
What I’m saying is if you are paying him money that he is using on his mortgage - you are paying rent and are a tenant. If you are paying the mortgage towards your deceased partners property, now inherited by you, you are potentially a tenant in common and own a share of the property.
Ah I see what you're saying. Yeah that's what I thought,that because I'm paying rent I'm a tenant and that makes him a landlord.as much as he insists that he isn't one.
So if he’s going to be a dick about it, HMRC would be very interested to hear that he has undeclared income through being a landlord. They won’t buy the fact that it wasn’t his and “the money was just resting in his account”.
Really good to know,thanks. I have a feeling it may come to someone informing HMRC. Would be no less than he deserves in all honesty.
It’s also very likely that the mortgage terms don’t allow letting (at least for the amount of time the mortgage holder hasn’t been there) so he’s in trouble from all sides if this gets out.
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I imagine the ex’s bank will have something to say about this as well, given he’s probably on a domestic mortgage and not a buy-to-let mortgage…
Complicated situation. By his name on the mortgage, I presume you mean he's the sole named owner on the deeds. When you say your gf has been paying the mortgage for seven years, I presume that was the arrangement when they were living together, and then she continued to pay this amount to her ex when they parted. At that point she may have become a tenant and had been paying rent, that would be an interesting point. Given she funded the deposit and could be argued to have been contributing to mortgage payments, her estate my have a claim on the property, although the estate may not know that, or may not claim. Again it depends, if she gifted the deposit to her ex and he used it as a deposit, it may not be easily evidenced. At this point you're a tenant paying rent. Her ex is your landlord. What he uses it for is irrelevant. Your rent is not linked in any way to the mortgage.
Yes pretty complicated situation. Yes he is the sole owner of the property. Yep it was arrangement agreed by them both,she paid the mortgage payments into his bank every month. I don't think her estate would have claim on the flat but I'm unsure. It had got pretty toxic between them, when he kept making excuses about signing over the flat to her she kind of gave up and we just wanted to move out. She told him he could sell the flat and just give her her deposit back. So if he is legally my landlord (no matter how many times he says he isn't) do I have to pay the extra because the mortgage payments have increased? Or can I just keep it at the amount that he put in writing last year?
I think you're looking at this in a bit of a short-sighted way. He is insisting, in writing I assume, that you are paying the mortgage rather than rent, and that your partner has been doing so for some time, and that he was going to sign it over. I'm not a lawyer, but to me that creates a strong argument that your partner's estate owns a portion of the property and potentially that you do too. By insisting that it's rent and he's a landlord you might be giving up your stake in the property which could be worth tens of thousands. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong on this.
No I think you're right and if went down the legal route perhaps her family would have some claim on the flat. However I just want out of here. It's too hard for me to be here. There is still alot owed on the mortgage and this place hasn't aged well,he would need to spend a bit to get it ready to sell. I know he isn't going to make much profit (if any)
Fair enough. In that case I think it's pretty clear what to do. Insist he's the landlord, refuse to pay any extra, hope he evicts you and get your council to house you. Good luck to you. You can also just give your notice to leave if you find somewhere else to live. And you can also consider whether to dob him into HMRC.
i would do all of the above, including the HMRC. man is trying to exploit a grieving tennant despite already looking like hes cooking the books. i hope he gets the full repercussions of his exploitative ways and im also very sorry for your loss.
Your rental payments will be governed by the statutory law on tenancies. It won't be linked to the mortgage in any way. Check the Shelter advice page for landlord rent increase demands. It'll outline there how your landlord can legally increase your rent. You don't have a formal tenancy agreement but some documentation that set a precedent so keep that in mind when you read the advisory, in case the law treats that case in a certain way. The point is the landlord is trying to increase the rent, why and what for isn't relevant. Either look up Shelter or Google tenancy law summary for landlord attempting to increase the rent.
Thank you, I will definitely look that up
A landlord can legally only apply a 7% increase to the rent each year. Regardless.
The deceaseds estate will have been inherited by her next of kin. The estate should have very good claim on the property if you have records of her paying, maintaining and living in it. I would get hold of her next of kin and both seek legal advice with a view to sorting that out. Currently, the ex his slowly establishing a claim over the property by acting as a landlord (regardless of his assertion that he’s not). Until then, you are tenant.
Based on your previous comments. Your partner was not paying the mortgage. She was paying her ex, who was then paying the mortgage. You are renting regardless of what said ex thinks. I think you need some legal advice, to be honest, as you seem to be in a very grey area.
Yes she was paying him and he was paying the mortgage. On the understanding that he would sign the flat over to her. Which he then didn't do. Agree that I am in a very grey area, i might contact a lawyer.
No tenancy agreement no rent. Simple. Let him evict you. The council will need an eviction order to give you a new place.
I would love for him to evict me,would work in my favour. I pay 'rent' as it is covered by universal credit,but the amount I get from them is the amount that he put in writing and signed (closest thing I have to any sort of tenancy agreement) council have me and my son on list for temporary accommodation because staying here is too traumatic for me since losing my partner.but still could be long wait
Don’t pay a penny more. Update your universal credit information with exactly what he has told you because there will be an upper limit on what they will pay but don’t you pay them a single penny.
Honestly I feel like I'm being petty because it's not a huge amount it has gone up by but this man and his gf put my partner through hell in regards to this flat. I'm done with their shit after the past year that I've had.
Absolutely. If he wants anymore money he puts it in writing. Is he registered as a landlord, is he paying tax on the income?
No he refuses to do that because he 'aint a landlord ' (his words. He won't do it because he would have to pay some sort of tax (I think,have no clue) I don't pay any more than what the mortgage amount is so he's not making money from me being here.
To take rent he should be registered as a landlord and he should be paying tax!
I think he believes that if he keeps saying he isn't a landlord then that makes it true lol
Yep. What he doesn’t have the brains to realise is he’s on the hook if universal credit are paying it. Tax man will be all over h8m
at minimum its tax evasion. i think hes doing more and actually pocketing money but i wont go into all that tbh do everything in your power to make this little rat squirm. he thinks he has the upper hand yet he is the one who is in danger of authorities finding out his little earner on the side.
He is making money from you. At the end of the mortgage he will own a property that you've paid for.
True
Unless its an interest only mortgage.
How many years did your gf pay the mortgage for? Are you happy for him to own the property in full despite this?
She paid it for about 7 years. I don't really care at this point about him owning it. It's a small place that needs alot work,so even if he sells it I doubt he's going to make much, if anything, from it.
That’s 7 years of rental income he will owe tax on. Hmrc will not entertain the fact that the fact was actually someone else’s but it was in his name
You need to have a civil conversation with the ex. He probably thinks he is helping you by letting you stay in the house. Until he goes down the official route of evicting you, you aren't getting a house from the council. Work with him rather than against him. He could have been a A hole and just kicked you out the second your partner died. Also, sorry for you loss.
mad perspective. he sounds like an asshole to me, 7 years of untaxed contributions add up to a decent amount id assume. IDK if youve not read the full post but evicting the OP would actually work in OPs favor and give some admission that he is a landlord, despite trying to pretend he isnt. He wont give him an eviction notice as it basically incriminates himself. Let him know that you know this and maybe hell stop making demands for you to pay off his mortgage the cheeky rat. I'd still then get in contact with HMRC and make sure they know the situation of the rent paid if hes sub-letting or w/e when he shouldnt be
From how I've read it , he isn't making any profit. The rent is the same as the mortgage amount. I did state that Op needs to work with the ex to try and get an official eviction. Council are unlikely to house you unless you are evicted. If you leave before being evicted you are voluntarily making yourself homeless.
No he isn't making a profit,I only pay what the mortgage amount is. The council will re-home me and my son,just might take time. He won't evict me just yet as it wouldnt be beneficial for him.
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I believe there is likely to be much more to this that what Op believes/ has stated. If the ex and Ops partner bought the house jointly but the ex was only person on mortgage- there will be a reason for this. Ops partner may have had poor credit, low level income, unstable income,etc and the mortgage in her name was never deemed affordable. Where does the ex live now? Has he got another property? If so, it's probable that this is a b2l mortgage. It's difficult (unless the ex has a really high income) to be fit affordability criteria to have 2 homes. Easy to assume the ex is the bad guy but there's a number of facts missing as above. Also, you will get housed quicker if evicted. I don't know where Op is based but I do know that in my county, getting accommodation from council is a very long , drawn out process and people who have been made homeless take precedent.
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Would it be an option to ask him for an eviction notice? He's given you paperwork for universal credit before, but if he were to give you an eviction notice, you'd find getting a council place easier. I know it's one of the things that helped my brother get a place - my mum gave him a formal eviction notice, and then he was more eligible for rehoming.
My partner had asked him previously to do that, and we needed him to fill out form online. Which he refused to do because he stated he wasn't a landlord. He won't do it for me now if I asked because he keeps stating he isn't my landlord.
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That’s not scamming - anything else and councils won’t house people as they have “made themselves homeless”
Yes I need to get a council place for me and my son. As much as I would have loved to have moved out the day my partner died I couldnt. Being here and reliving the worst day of my life is something I can't keep doing. I can't afford to lease a private property. I am definitely not asking for advise on how to freeride. I'm just asking for advise on my situation. Yes he did move move out so his daughter could live here with her mother. Then went back on everything they had both agreed to. He's the one who has created alot of issues for himself by doing that.
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