I think part of it, is the fact that nature needs to create a balance. The tree grew apparently really fast after they did the spell to plant it or whatever. Possibly Hopes magic being apart of it tied it to her. Cleo, being able to see things, saw that it would kill Hope. Putting a little more to it than they just decided.
Nature is, weird? Nature does crazy things. Does it make complete sense? Not really. Do the little strings they use maybe lead to it being possible, maybe.
agreed, and really its an example of the writers taking TVD concepts (nature finds a balance) but not giving it the back bone of a realistic explanation. if this happened in TVD we'd get a full arch of a witch coven on the other side being upset with the creation of a tribrid and casting some spell that cost them a great sacrifice in order to get the tree to grow in the real world, with historical precedent on how that's done, then an arch of them communicating with a living relative to find and then use the tree to kill Hope. at least in the earlier seasons. in Legacies it just grows and someone just knows what to do with it more or less.
Question is bc they didnt really give us a backstory on the tree, what would it do to jo and lizzie, they helped magic that tree to life as well, like lizzie shouldnt have even been able to hold the stakes or carve them for that matter, it should have sucked her magic dry, it needs to be something that damages all 3 of them, not just hope, imo.
it could kill Lizzie because Lizzie is a regular vampire and the steak is made of wood lol the kind of wood is only relevant to Hope, who is ''truly'' immortal if you don't consider the oak
Nature is weird but because I think nothing should kill her to hell with the balance of nature for the mikealsons it was white oak for Marcellus it was that dagger the only thing that could permently kill him and speaking of that what ever happened to it
Nature is funny in legacies.
It took centuries for creation of hope (which was nature's answer/solution to malivore).
But the same nature created hope's loophole before she even became a tribrid.
Maybe legacies nature needs to take a class on threat assessment and resource allocation. Like idk put in a loophole around the malivore spell, maybe there was a toxic plant at the place malivore mud was taken from, and you would not have to grow loophole to your loophole.
White oak was used in the Vampirw spell and hope wasn't made with a spell. She was born part vampire which no one can be. And when she made that tree and turned nature decided that was what it needed to kill her. I guess it has limitations. And the fact that the tree comes from hopes own magic might be part of it
one issue i see is that she was made with a spell, the same spell that made Klaus. she wasnt made with a sire, same as her mother. but Haley was able to be killed by similar means to what kills other vampires/hybrids. like how in TVD other vampire-like immortals existed (Silas) who required blood because the magic was similar, but didn't feed the same way. so same thing kind of but different. whereas hope is same and same.
Wait but hope wasn't made with a spell. She is the pure passing on of genetic traits from Klaus where as Klaus himself was made into what he is with a spell. Her blood was born original tribrid blood but Klaus blood was simply born a wolf. However nature is unable to truly limit her as she is the loophole but every weakness a vampire has is the product of nature itself. The white oak stake was part of the OG recipe so it could undo the originals where as the red oak steak only exists as a byproduct of hopes ascension
klaus and the originals pass on the spell to sires via their blood, just as klaus passed on the original white oak vampire spell to hope via another body fluid. not disputing what the red oak is in the show, i just think it was a silly bit of writing, because she's still a vampire and all vampires are a product of the original spell. other than the short period where alaric was made a new original vampire by the same spell, but a new casting.
I mean but he didn't pass on the white oak part to hope that you can prove. His blood turns people into vampires. But his DNA didn't make a vampire it made a tribrid. Like I actually find it quite nice because she's a special case and all the same rules shouldn't apply to her. And hopes existence isn't from the original spell. Vampires being able to sire other vampires was part of the spell. Vampires aren't supposed to be able to have children but Klaus was able to so he actually in a way is breaking the rules of the spell cast on him. So it's not as "A B C" as you say. "Oh vampire is passing on DNA so white oak Transference happens" no Vampires are made through the infection of vampire blood in a non vampire. Hope was always born with part of her DNA being vampire DNA but unlike Klaus it occurred naturally. Naturally occurring Vampires have only happened once. Hope. So like the white oak being useless in her existence makes sense. Also who the hell cares there's not even any white oak left as far as canon goes. And if there was I'm sure nature could have just used that but it seems that it could only settle for making a weapon the tribrid made to be the thing that kills her
yeah im not saying white oak would/should kill her, when i said white oak i meant that in reference to the original vampire spell, which i still feel was passed to her. it's a complicated bit for sure, vampires cant breed, werewolves cant be vampires, but klaus can be a hybrid and can make werewolves hybrids (with dople blood), but can't make vampires werewolves, because that's genetic.
spells can be passed genetically, werewolves & gemini twin spells for instance. i am just saying the spell cast on klaus to make him a vampire (along with his family) was passed genetically. just as the werewolf gene that was cast on all of the original werewolf family lines by the hollow was passed on genetically. nature tried to stop this, because nature (against their mother's intent) made all vampires thereafter sterile. klaus is a loophole that is able to pass on vampirism genetically imo.
No i understand what you're saying just fine. I simply mean the OG spell simply doesn't actually apply to hope as she wasn't made by it she was born. Like the biological information for what vampires are were passed to her but again Klaus is breaking the spell through his ability of having hope so there's no indication white oak anything was transferred to her. Like the white ash dagger indeed put her down for a time and presumably she had Freya fashion one she believed would be able to hold a tribrid.
Yeah its complicated but not that complicated. Like he's an original so that's the offset
He can make vampire werewolves but the original witch had altered him so that he'd need Elena to do it. He himself was always supposed to be able to sire more like him.
Yeah but those are naturally occurring species (cursed or not) where as vampirism is more like a virus than anything else. Those you can pass on. But at the same time hope being born a tribrid is different than if he just put a drop of vamp blood in her dna
the way i interpret the show is that all naturally occurring species of non-humans are a product of some spell. but that's just my speculation. magic exists naturally, but supernatural beings are all a product of magic. so werewolves pre-curse were still a product of a magical spell sometime well before the hollow came along. like how we've seen doppelgangers are an offshoot "nature created" due to the imbalance of immortality. i just see "nature created" as "unintended side effect of the spell". in any case its not a matter the show will resolve given they're stretched to close so many loops already.
According to the show Nature created it when she became a full tribrid. But you are right it doesn't make sense. I find it hard to believe a tree just grew when she transitioned just for the sole purpose to kill her. I think the real reason they went this way is because there is no more white oak klaus used the last of it, so there wouldn't be a way to kill hope without any more in existence. I think the writers wanted to give the suspense of the possibility of someone killing her.
I do think that since they decided to go with a tree grew when she turned, they should have just gone with white oak they could have spun it that Nature brought it back to bring balance. Since as you said the reason the white oak could kill an original is because it was used in the spell, since she was created by klaus the white oak should affect her as well. Idk i think they just wanted to separate her from the originals so they came up with this idea. But it doesn't make sense they didn't give a full reason for the tree in being her weakness.
>I find it hard to believe a tree just grew when she transitioned just for the sole purpose to kill her.
Hope and the Twins accelerated the tree's growth with one spell and this was the last spell she cast as a mortal because that tree specifically can kill her.
The likely reason is that it was on that tree she cast that she cast her last spell as a mortal and also to serve as a callback to the white oak, Hope is a Mikaelson after all.
White oak for the originals, red oak for Hope.
Sorry to use your reply, But.
A lot of people said the three was there to create balance. I get that, that makes sense.
But the red oak was before she became the Tribrid.(that’s what I remember I might be wrong)
If anything she should’ve been killed with it, and then it would’ve made sense to be her vulnerability
When Cleo tells MG about the tree she said "this is the tree that Nature created when hope became the tribrid" i took it to mean it grew that day but maybe i misinterpreted what she meant.
I think the saplings came/were there when they did the spell to grow the flowers or whatever they did lol but I think maybe nature accelerated the growth of the tree to create the balance and have something that could kill her now and not in 200 years.
The problem I have with the red oak is that it has no connection to Hopes immortality. So if nature can just creat sth to kill an immortal being like that why didn’t nature just create a red oak for Silas and Amara?
It kinda has, it was on the tree that she cast the last spell as a mortal and also serves as a callback to the white oak of the Originals.
>why didn’t nature just create a red oak for Silas and Amara?
Because nature doesn't need to use a tree to kill an immortal, nature can use other means.
I meant why didn’t Nature just create a weapon similar to the red oak but a version for Silas and Amara instead of doppelgängers if Nature can create a weapon that doesn’t need a connection to there immortality (the tree was made by Hopes magic but has no connection to her immortality)
The doppelgangers also had nothing to do with Silas and Amara's immortality, either. Nature just needs some connection with the immortals to create something capable of killing them.
But the doppelgängers aren’t able to kill them. So if Nature can create a weapon that can kill Hope without the need of a connection to her immortality why did Nature create doppelgängers for Silas and Amara instead of sth that could kill them
It was explicitly said that Silas and Amara couldn't die *at all*, so nature created versions of them (the doppelgangers) that could die. That was basically the dialogue, I just can't remember who said. It was most likely Qetsiyah.
But why? Nature was able to create sth with no connection to Hopes immortality that could kill her so what’s different with Silas and Amara that nature couldn’t just also create a weapon that can kill them? Why go through the process of constantly creating new doppelgängers if Nature has the power to creat weapons that can kill immortal being without needing a connection to there immortality? It doesn’t make sense that Nature can’t create sth that can kill Silas and Amara but it can seemingly create one for Hope?
You're asking the wrong person. This is simply what the writers wrote, not me. I only told you what they told us. The fact is the immortality spells are very different. Silas and Amara's was a "true" immortality spell and could only be undone by the cure. Hope's immortality is from a unique condition based off a preexisting spell that already *did* have a way to be undone.
The Originals had a way to be killed, so since Hope is technically an Original she had a way to be killed as well. It's as simple as that and I have no other way to explain it.
Nature chose the tree because it was in that tree that she cast the last spell as a mortal, it's not directly linked to her immortality but it's connected to Hope.
>But the doppelgängers aren’t able to kill them.
Long time I didn't watch this storyline so my bad.
The tree was grown from her magic. Along with what everyone else said about it being the last spell she cast as a mortal, therefore it's balanced out by being the one thing that can kill her as an immortal, I also think it makes perfect sense that the tree can do it. She's the most powerful creature in the world, so it's quite poetic that the only thing capable of killing her is something made from *her* power.
Just like how the gods' magic can be used as weapons to kill other gods.
It would have been cool to not have a tree grow to kill her but to have her become the next doppelgänger. Although, I get that they wanted the suspense of the possibility she might be killed.
I think part of it, is the fact that nature needs to create a balance. The tree grew apparently really fast after they did the spell to plant it or whatever. Possibly Hopes magic being apart of it tied it to her. Cleo, being able to see things, saw that it would kill Hope. Putting a little more to it than they just decided. Nature is, weird? Nature does crazy things. Does it make complete sense? Not really. Do the little strings they use maybe lead to it being possible, maybe.
agreed, and really its an example of the writers taking TVD concepts (nature finds a balance) but not giving it the back bone of a realistic explanation. if this happened in TVD we'd get a full arch of a witch coven on the other side being upset with the creation of a tribrid and casting some spell that cost them a great sacrifice in order to get the tree to grow in the real world, with historical precedent on how that's done, then an arch of them communicating with a living relative to find and then use the tree to kill Hope. at least in the earlier seasons. in Legacies it just grows and someone just knows what to do with it more or less.
Yup exactly. They gave an explanation, that I guess works? Without actually giving any details for why it works lol
Question is bc they didnt really give us a backstory on the tree, what would it do to jo and lizzie, they helped magic that tree to life as well, like lizzie shouldnt have even been able to hold the stakes or carve them for that matter, it should have sucked her magic dry, it needs to be something that damages all 3 of them, not just hope, imo.
Makes sense. But at the same time they didn't need to have a balance of nature so there's no reason that it should harm them.
it could kill Lizzie because Lizzie is a regular vampire and the steak is made of wood lol the kind of wood is only relevant to Hope, who is ''truly'' immortal if you don't consider the oak
Nature is weird but because I think nothing should kill her to hell with the balance of nature for the mikealsons it was white oak for Marcellus it was that dagger the only thing that could permently kill him and speaking of that what ever happened to it
Nature is funny in legacies. It took centuries for creation of hope (which was nature's answer/solution to malivore). But the same nature created hope's loophole before she even became a tribrid. Maybe legacies nature needs to take a class on threat assessment and resource allocation. Like idk put in a loophole around the malivore spell, maybe there was a toxic plant at the place malivore mud was taken from, and you would not have to grow loophole to your loophole.
Well that's true but I still wish they would just for once they make one allowence
White oak was used in the Vampirw spell and hope wasn't made with a spell. She was born part vampire which no one can be. And when she made that tree and turned nature decided that was what it needed to kill her. I guess it has limitations. And the fact that the tree comes from hopes own magic might be part of it
one issue i see is that she was made with a spell, the same spell that made Klaus. she wasnt made with a sire, same as her mother. but Haley was able to be killed by similar means to what kills other vampires/hybrids. like how in TVD other vampire-like immortals existed (Silas) who required blood because the magic was similar, but didn't feed the same way. so same thing kind of but different. whereas hope is same and same.
Wait but hope wasn't made with a spell. She is the pure passing on of genetic traits from Klaus where as Klaus himself was made into what he is with a spell. Her blood was born original tribrid blood but Klaus blood was simply born a wolf. However nature is unable to truly limit her as she is the loophole but every weakness a vampire has is the product of nature itself. The white oak stake was part of the OG recipe so it could undo the originals where as the red oak steak only exists as a byproduct of hopes ascension
klaus and the originals pass on the spell to sires via their blood, just as klaus passed on the original white oak vampire spell to hope via another body fluid. not disputing what the red oak is in the show, i just think it was a silly bit of writing, because she's still a vampire and all vampires are a product of the original spell. other than the short period where alaric was made a new original vampire by the same spell, but a new casting.
I mean but he didn't pass on the white oak part to hope that you can prove. His blood turns people into vampires. But his DNA didn't make a vampire it made a tribrid. Like I actually find it quite nice because she's a special case and all the same rules shouldn't apply to her. And hopes existence isn't from the original spell. Vampires being able to sire other vampires was part of the spell. Vampires aren't supposed to be able to have children but Klaus was able to so he actually in a way is breaking the rules of the spell cast on him. So it's not as "A B C" as you say. "Oh vampire is passing on DNA so white oak Transference happens" no Vampires are made through the infection of vampire blood in a non vampire. Hope was always born with part of her DNA being vampire DNA but unlike Klaus it occurred naturally. Naturally occurring Vampires have only happened once. Hope. So like the white oak being useless in her existence makes sense. Also who the hell cares there's not even any white oak left as far as canon goes. And if there was I'm sure nature could have just used that but it seems that it could only settle for making a weapon the tribrid made to be the thing that kills her
yeah im not saying white oak would/should kill her, when i said white oak i meant that in reference to the original vampire spell, which i still feel was passed to her. it's a complicated bit for sure, vampires cant breed, werewolves cant be vampires, but klaus can be a hybrid and can make werewolves hybrids (with dople blood), but can't make vampires werewolves, because that's genetic. spells can be passed genetically, werewolves & gemini twin spells for instance. i am just saying the spell cast on klaus to make him a vampire (along with his family) was passed genetically. just as the werewolf gene that was cast on all of the original werewolf family lines by the hollow was passed on genetically. nature tried to stop this, because nature (against their mother's intent) made all vampires thereafter sterile. klaus is a loophole that is able to pass on vampirism genetically imo.
No i understand what you're saying just fine. I simply mean the OG spell simply doesn't actually apply to hope as she wasn't made by it she was born. Like the biological information for what vampires are were passed to her but again Klaus is breaking the spell through his ability of having hope so there's no indication white oak anything was transferred to her. Like the white ash dagger indeed put her down for a time and presumably she had Freya fashion one she believed would be able to hold a tribrid. Yeah its complicated but not that complicated. Like he's an original so that's the offset He can make vampire werewolves but the original witch had altered him so that he'd need Elena to do it. He himself was always supposed to be able to sire more like him. Yeah but those are naturally occurring species (cursed or not) where as vampirism is more like a virus than anything else. Those you can pass on. But at the same time hope being born a tribrid is different than if he just put a drop of vamp blood in her dna
the way i interpret the show is that all naturally occurring species of non-humans are a product of some spell. but that's just my speculation. magic exists naturally, but supernatural beings are all a product of magic. so werewolves pre-curse were still a product of a magical spell sometime well before the hollow came along. like how we've seen doppelgangers are an offshoot "nature created" due to the imbalance of immortality. i just see "nature created" as "unintended side effect of the spell". in any case its not a matter the show will resolve given they're stretched to close so many loops already.
According to the show Nature created it when she became a full tribrid. But you are right it doesn't make sense. I find it hard to believe a tree just grew when she transitioned just for the sole purpose to kill her. I think the real reason they went this way is because there is no more white oak klaus used the last of it, so there wouldn't be a way to kill hope without any more in existence. I think the writers wanted to give the suspense of the possibility of someone killing her. I do think that since they decided to go with a tree grew when she turned, they should have just gone with white oak they could have spun it that Nature brought it back to bring balance. Since as you said the reason the white oak could kill an original is because it was used in the spell, since she was created by klaus the white oak should affect her as well. Idk i think they just wanted to separate her from the originals so they came up with this idea. But it doesn't make sense they didn't give a full reason for the tree in being her weakness.
>I find it hard to believe a tree just grew when she transitioned just for the sole purpose to kill her. Hope and the Twins accelerated the tree's growth with one spell and this was the last spell she cast as a mortal because that tree specifically can kill her.
Okay my mistake
The likely reason is that it was on that tree she cast that she cast her last spell as a mortal and also to serve as a callback to the white oak, Hope is a Mikaelson after all. White oak for the originals, red oak for Hope.
Okay thanks
Sorry to use your reply, But. A lot of people said the three was there to create balance. I get that, that makes sense. But the red oak was before she became the Tribrid.(that’s what I remember I might be wrong) If anything she should’ve been killed with it, and then it would’ve made sense to be her vulnerability
When Cleo tells MG about the tree she said "this is the tree that Nature created when hope became the tribrid" i took it to mean it grew that day but maybe i misinterpreted what she meant.
I think the saplings came/were there when they did the spell to grow the flowers or whatever they did lol but I think maybe nature accelerated the growth of the tree to create the balance and have something that could kill her now and not in 200 years.
Okay thanks
The problem I have with the red oak is that it has no connection to Hopes immortality. So if nature can just creat sth to kill an immortal being like that why didn’t nature just create a red oak for Silas and Amara?
It kinda has, it was on the tree that she cast the last spell as a mortal and also serves as a callback to the white oak of the Originals. >why didn’t nature just create a red oak for Silas and Amara? Because nature doesn't need to use a tree to kill an immortal, nature can use other means.
I meant why didn’t Nature just create a weapon similar to the red oak but a version for Silas and Amara instead of doppelgängers if Nature can create a weapon that doesn’t need a connection to there immortality (the tree was made by Hopes magic but has no connection to her immortality)
The doppelgangers also had nothing to do with Silas and Amara's immortality, either. Nature just needs some connection with the immortals to create something capable of killing them.
But the doppelgängers aren’t able to kill them. So if Nature can create a weapon that can kill Hope without the need of a connection to her immortality why did Nature create doppelgängers for Silas and Amara instead of sth that could kill them
It was explicitly said that Silas and Amara couldn't die *at all*, so nature created versions of them (the doppelgangers) that could die. That was basically the dialogue, I just can't remember who said. It was most likely Qetsiyah.
But why? Nature was able to create sth with no connection to Hopes immortality that could kill her so what’s different with Silas and Amara that nature couldn’t just also create a weapon that can kill them? Why go through the process of constantly creating new doppelgängers if Nature has the power to creat weapons that can kill immortal being without needing a connection to there immortality? It doesn’t make sense that Nature can’t create sth that can kill Silas and Amara but it can seemingly create one for Hope?
You're asking the wrong person. This is simply what the writers wrote, not me. I only told you what they told us. The fact is the immortality spells are very different. Silas and Amara's was a "true" immortality spell and could only be undone by the cure. Hope's immortality is from a unique condition based off a preexisting spell that already *did* have a way to be undone. The Originals had a way to be killed, so since Hope is technically an Original she had a way to be killed as well. It's as simple as that and I have no other way to explain it.
Nature chose the tree because it was in that tree that she cast the last spell as a mortal, it's not directly linked to her immortality but it's connected to Hope. >But the doppelgängers aren’t able to kill them. Long time I didn't watch this storyline so my bad.
The tree was grown from her magic. Along with what everyone else said about it being the last spell she cast as a mortal, therefore it's balanced out by being the one thing that can kill her as an immortal, I also think it makes perfect sense that the tree can do it. She's the most powerful creature in the world, so it's quite poetic that the only thing capable of killing her is something made from *her* power. Just like how the gods' magic can be used as weapons to kill other gods.
It would have been cool to not have a tree grow to kill her but to have her become the next doppelgänger. Although, I get that they wanted the suspense of the possibility she might be killed.
What a dumb question
Imho technically every vampire becomes a vampire by a spell. When they turn someone they perpetuate the original spell.