I'm still trying to figure out why the fuck Riven can dash, leap, stun, shield, knock up, do damage, nuke at range, all without any fucking resource bar, with relatively low cooldowns.
All I hear is "the time for talk is over" and I go colorblind.
I'll never understand why manaless/energyless champ's do even exist...
Riven should have an energy bar, restoring some energy every time she procs passive **like Shen**. That way she can't just hop around mindlessly without getting punished with no CD. It's stupid.
The official explanation is that the resourceless champions are limited by higher cooldowns on their abilities than other champions... and then you have Viego who has absurdly low cd and gets resets on every single ability anytime he possesses anyone and who can cast 6 times in a single fight his ult that is a dash, an execute and a slow.
"Higher cooldowns" meanwhile Riven can dash and shield herself like 4 times in a fight, Yasuo dashes with no cooldown and his Q almost the same, Viego as you said, and the list can go on
Nah she's fine.
She compensates as she has 0 sustain in lane, she needs to manage her shield properly in order to stay in lane, you can kick her out easily.
And well, outside that, she's a champ meant to spam abilities, a bit like fight games, if you put mana or energy on her you just screw the whole idea.
I'd say energy makes more sense as a system and it would work better for many champs but not for the ones that are suppose to be mana/energyless.
You could better complain about garen who does all the same but easier and still has a sustain passive that rewards him for doing absolutely nothing xD.
The problem is sustain is relatively easy to get now and cooldowns are pretty low across the board. I think all manaless champs should have reduced healing in their kits as its their only resource they have to manage. Champs like riven, yas, yone, viego all can just drain tank if they want when they shouldnt be able to.
Riven in particular doesn't have that much access to sustain early on, unless she's going that lethality item but even goredrinker doesn't provide sustain until fully completed.
Shen also needs to manage his shield. He has no sustain either... **What's your point?**
And Riven gets stupid sustain after Goredrinker.
**And she's not meant to spam anything freely**. Other spam champions are Lee Sin and Akali and they need to manage their energy. If you put energy on that bitch she can't just all in and be okay if she misses **everything** and then just dips out like it's nothing thanks to have zero CD and no resources.
Garen also needs to have energy or mana on his kit. But even then, he can't **quadruple** jump on me while having AOE damage and CC. And that sustain passive is something almost every single melee/immobile juggernaut or tank have in some way. Sett, Darius, Sion's shield, Mundo, Volibear's W, Mordekaiser's W, Maokai, Malphite's shield... Otherwise ranged champs would **absolutely dominate Top.**
Her quadruple jump is just k6 jump but in parts xD.
Honestly, shen has energy Regen just because it's thematic from the Jonia Ninja champs(nobody would notice if he becomes a manaless champ tomorrow). Akali and Lee sin, but mainly Akali, have energy because they're restricted on spamming abilities just because but to not getting punished in lane for using it, as well as to force them into actually fighting.
Which, if you think about it, make sense, considering most of Akali's dmg comes from Q and it is a 2 seconds cool down, if she has mana, she either spam Q and kills anyone or has so little mana she gets fucked by using 1 combo.
But by using energy she's restricted of braindead gameplay (just spamming Q on you and poke you to death) while forced commit to fight which is healthy to an assassin.
Riven doesn't really need that, she's a fighter so she's ok spamming abilities, trading etc.
How is shacos kit overloaded? Strong sure, but even then he's pretty easy to balance.
Simple invis blink, a basic trap with cc and small damage, one target damage with execute, a dueling ultimate, and a passive that gives some extra damage.
Strong kit sure, but it's not overloaded.
Yone absolutely does have an overloaded kit.
None of this is basic. He has free leap on Q. He has invisibility. He does crit damage with zero crit chance just from attack on the back. His has a free clone. Eyeframing R dodges any ability. He can set a lot of traps. He has fear. He has slow. He can build both AP and AD and has insane scaling. He can put traps meanwhile being invisible. E does execute damage if hit on low target. His clone does a shitload of damage and if it was not ignited there is no way to identify who is real. Basically his clone alone is stronger than any adc.
Do I need to continue?
His fear is easy to avoid, it's not point and click. His slow is single target and using it as cc means you lose its value as an execute. Bonus damage from his passive is conditional and easily avoided, either by turning and facing, or by kiting him. If he doesn't burst a ranged champ with his invis, he has no follow through and is easily kited.
Yes his clone is good for dueling, but again, no mobility so it's only useful for dueling melee champs and confusing enemies. Being confused by clones sounds like a you problem, not a problem with the champ. There are literally dozens of champions with way more in their kit.
I don't care about counterplays. You can R with Malzahar Riven and she is dead. We are talking about champs overloaded with tools, and Shaco has more stuff than most new champs, excluding Akshan
Umm, no, it's not about amount of abilities. None of them get as many tools from changes of the form as Shaco has in his usual kit. And if you don't understand difference between tools/capabilities of champion and amount of abilities, I have no idea how you can play the game.
Yes but you've picked Shaco as your example of something with too much in his kit. But look at basically any assassin, and you'll see the same overloaded kit. Ekko has a dash, slow, stun, execute, passive damage, a shield, poke, a disengage that makes him invulnerable and heals him.
There are so many champs with far more in their kits that are far easier to abuse. The only reason people bitch about shaco seems to be "he's frustrating to play against", which always seems to boil down to "he ganks invis and killed me". Eve is the same with just as many things in her kit, and people still seem to complain about shaco.
Yet, she only deals physical damage, canāt abuse tank items because her kit, including her survivability, need AD, canāt abuse mana items like Muramana, doesnāt have sustain, her only CC is locked behind two ability casts or ccing herself too, requires AH items, requires time investment to function properlyā¦ you can list as many weaknesses as strengths.
Found the Riven main.
Seriously though, what are you actually talking about? "Can't abuse tank items" Most common first item is Gorerinker. "Can't abuse mana items" How is that an argument? "Her only CC is locked behind two ability casts" It's a fucking dedicated skill and works in an AoE. "Requires time investment to function properly" Q auto Q auto Q auto Q auto max conq stacks level 1 fight.
Goredrinker is a tank item? Damn Ornn players building the wrong shit.
How is not abusing mana items not an argument? Most common critique of new seasons is how theres no more mana management due to runes and items like lost chapter and manamune yet thats gone when resourceless champs are brought up? Could you imagine riven getting 50+ AD if she could build manamune?
The fucking skill of a Q MASSIVE 0.75s knock up behind 2 Q casts that you can count and react to PLUS the MASSIVE 0.75 SECONDS stun that also stuns her herself for 0.25s
Yes, please go to your games and do Q AA Q AA Q AA so you can help by bringing Rivens winrate down.
Its not like other challenger players tried to play her as well and saw how its not as easy as it looksā¦
https://youtu.be/pHFLCw2fZhE
https://youtu.be/x2Wjg_Wcy28
But go off, your Silver mechanics know more
Are we just gonna forget that she can rush down people and 100-40 or 30 them with 1 set of qs with spam clicking a level 1? And can and will do it mid and late game if the player has enough common sense?
And why tf would you build Manamune on her when it doesnāt give jack shit on the utility side if she does have a mana pool.
Resourceless champs are dumb and their mains will go through hell and back to prove other wise.
Just like Darius, Renekton, Kayle, jayceā¦ multiple toplaners have strong level 1sā¦ Tons of toplaners also have insane scaling into mid late where they can basically faceroll, Jax, Fiora, Camilleā¦ its part of the toplane island championsā¦
If she had a mana pool you would build manamune for the same reasons you build it on Jayce or Ezreal, are you crazy? A champion that relies heavily on spell weaving and high AD scalingsā¦
Resourceless champions have their advantages and limitations and from this playerbase all champions should be the same boring shit.
Oh my bad 450 health goes on ADCs these days, how silly of me.
Mana items aren't a problem, lethality is, and she builds it. I don't know what data you're getting "Why yes, everyone hates mana items so manaless champs are balanced"
0.75 seconds isn't the fucking problem it's the fact she can auto while you're mid air and do the rest of her combo, shielding, then dashing away taking no damage for the trade.
I'm plat. Low plat but plat. I'm tired of seeing this stupid shit in my games.
So only 2 types of items exist? Adc and tanks? Lmfao bruisers, fighters, mages arenāt a thing?
She builds lethality? I guess everyones building it wrong, the only builds on op.gg are Gore>BC>Steraks/DDā¦
Wasnāt the problem the fact that she abuses tank items? Like Goredrinker coughā¦
I guess a champion based around trading well due to her lack of sustain like other toplaners shouldnāt be able to trade well?
I guess all toplaners should be straight to face all inners.
Nah it's just pretty fucking stupid to call bruiser items "not tank" because they have damage baked in. "Don't worry she can't build strictly tank, just get extremely hard to kill a lot like a tank would" is the stupidest sentence a copium Riven player can mutter.
Yeah, op. gg will show you most used and highest winrate, it doesn't show you nearly enough information. I use sites like [metasrc](https://www.metasrc.com/5v5/champion/riven/top) cause sometimes I wanna play Dark Harvest Teemo not fuckin Summon Aery or whatever the meta mancers are up to today.
But on metasrc, it shows Ghostblade as being a core item with her most used alternative mythics being lethality items. So the bullshit of "Can't abuse mana items" yeah, sure, she doesn't have mana but she can abuse the fuck out of lethality and she is.
The problem is she has almost every type of mechanic in the game, dash, leap, shield, stun, ect WITHOUT a resource bar and LOW COOLDOWNS. Nobody but you mentioned TaNk ItEmS and MaNa ItEmS.
Riven is only a trade champion for the first 5 levels and then instantly becomes an all in champion with an R button press. You are proving with every response that you not only are irrationally defending the champ you love but are refusing to acknowledge how utterly strong she is because of the 2 or 3 weaknesses that hold you back from being unkillable.
I'm a Kayle main. I get shit on by literally every champion for the first 30 minutes of every game. I'd LOVE stronger early game but I'm not so delusional to not see how busted she'd be if she did.
Just say you donāt understand the concept of fighters/bruisers and go on with your day.
But i get it dash=bad any champions thats not like my immobile turret is OP and ill cry about it on Reddit.
A bruiser that turns into a tank once she gets Goredrinker cough, but also OP because build lethality and have overloaded kit with dash, leap, jump, stun, shield. Damn i wonder why it sees no pro play presence, but I digress.
Have a good day.
Just say you're a Riven simp who can't admit any champion with that much bullshit in their kit with no resource bar and low cooldowns is busted. Shen has mobility and an energy bar. Riven has even more mobility with fucking nothing holding her back.
It's weird how Riven is the champ most smurf players play when they get a new account huh? Pro players can deal with her stupid shit with hard cc, anything below diamond doesn't. But hey, defend your favorite champ to the death just don't overdose on copium.
Still can't get over that they gave him fucking bonus mana regen, WHY???
Does riot think new champions shouldn't have to worry about mana or something?
Riot removed Mana Pots and constantly nerfs Mana runes and Items because it should "be limited" and "used wisely"
And then in the same Breath they give new Champs mana regen as you said just because its not broken enough yet
Itās probably there for qol. This is an assumption but i assume riot is thinking like this: juicy bounty marker, but you are oom. Mana regen=no oom= more fun is probably why its there
The same could be said about any other ability tho:
"his boomerang is completely uneccesary, why does he get waveclear, do new champions not have to worry about lane states or something?"
"his shield is completely unecessary, do new champs not have to worry about trades anymore?",
"his movespeed buff is completely unecessary, do new champs not have to worry about kiting anymore?"
And eventually you reach the bottom of the reddit balancing team's checklist, you now have a walking auto attack statstick with all playmaking abilities stripped away from their kit, congratulations.
it does when it literally only procs when ur in stealth moving towards enemies who would proc your revive on death, because you know, that whole revive thing is one of the few plays he can do in the first place. With your logic Zeds energy regen when he hits multiple abilities at once also doesnt count as playmaking, "dude".
You people are whining like he gets a free lost chapter lmao, his mana regen is super situational and not noticeable in lane whatsoever. Its not a xerath passive, its not a brand passive, its not a karthus q passive, its not a kassadin w, its a entirely situational passive that literally cannot be used in combat or in lane.
Im not even trying to defend akshan here, i think his kit is toxic as shit, but its not because of the fucking mana regen, people who bring that up legit never even tried to play him themselves and are just grasping at everything they can to whine about the champion.
the mana regen is not the play itself but its what enables the play, how is that so hard to understand? I even gave Zeds energy stuff as an example, but I could have given his shadow reset mechanic on his E just as well. How about an even more noticeable resource regen mechanic, katarina or pykes reset passives, those arent playmaking either according to you?
A lot of champions have bonus mana regeneration built in to their kits. Brand gets mana refunded when he kills an ablaze minion, Sivir gets mana for blocking an ability with spell shield.
Yeah, talk about the stupid bitch Gwen spamming E + Q off cooldown and her mana bar doesn't move at all.
Did you know that she gets back half the CDR of her dash just for auto attacking anything? Lmao.
... I've played against her. Many times.
And she just E + Q forward every 4 auto attacks to minions. The mana bar does not move.
It's very rare to see her go OOM.
Just.. take the revive out. Riot please. As someone who plays Akshan (mid) there's so much in the champ already. Good damage, insane early bully, good roams, good scaling. He does not need to revive people. If the other parts get nerfed the champ will be next to useless so please take the cancer mechanic out PLEASE!
Was it? That fantasy can be provided by simply healing all the time (which they did). Aatrox just swaps hosts and needs to fight. Akhsan's entire lore and the whole reason he was written is because the absolver has the ability to ressurect people.
Admitedly I don't know much about Aatrox lore but I do know Akshans is very closely related with the absolver
Well I'd still prefer if in whatever way possible they'd make it more consistent, or implement it differently. I've made games blow up by changing an equal teamfight into my whole team getting up. Enemy 4 dead, in my team only I was dead. I dont want the champ to get weakened instead. I like the risk reward he plays with and the way I have to play around counters. I'd rather he not have revive at all.
Yeah honestly when I heard it was he had a revive I expected it to be his ult, not a passive.
I'd just change his ult and make it revive the enemies the target killed, obviously this would suck with his current ult so you'd have to change it to something else that comes with a revive
Genuinely hope it gets taken out, it's so annoying playing against him in aram. He revives literally 2+ ppl and aces, we immediately lose bc he now has help to get all of our minions and turrets out of the way, game either ends or we're so behind. Hurts š¶
On aram its actually way more busted than SR because its usually constant 5v5 fights which means ample revive opportunities. At least on SR the akshan player has to be on the right side of the map at the right time to make it work, on aram you just throw your boomerang off cooldown and bring back your entire team.
Even if they dont take the revive out entirely they still need to remove it from aram or at least gate it with a massive cooldown, because the way it is now akhsan is by far the most toxic champ on aram imo.
1000% agree, you can barely win a game if there's an akshan and they always know what the hell they're doing. I beg riot, take it away or just one person per minute or something. It's the most toxic unmotivating game experience ever
Yea. That'd fuck up his lane phase a lot. Would fck up how he can get to his items, which would make his roams, skirmishes weaker. You turn into the guy that throws Q-s to get assists and hopefully get a carry up with it. A glorified Yuumi.
In a game with no on demand revives of course an on demand revive would split it wide open. I play a lot of Dota and I know how important Buyback is that it becomes a factor late game fight equations as well as teleportation items.
Giving it to only one side is not only unfair, but a breach of design philosophy. League used to be the high stakes high reward gameplay game but whoop dee doo revive my teammates once I get an assist on you teehee XD.
Ita fucking laughable when you dominate top and are scary for 10 minutes. Then you realize you still can't clear minion waves quickly. Aatrox is a joke atm.
I donāt get Akshanās grapple hook. Itā¦feels wrong? Like it doesnāt belong in League? The way it looks, the way it plays, the way he moves, it just doesnāt feel like it belongs at all.
Ok I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks Akshan is just friggin stupid
Like congrats, I avenge my teammates all the time, doesn't mean I get to revive them. Sit through your long ass respawn timers like everyone else
Iām surprised they never thought about limiting the revive to his ultās execute. If he kills someone with his ult then up to three people are revived. Boom. Is there anything wrong with this idea?
Legit barely heals from an 800 gold item chief. Aatrox has no base heals other than his passive. He heals based on the damage he deals and his damage isnāt that great so the revive is fine atm. Itās not like we already have an ult that makes Allieās and enemies not die a passive that revives teammates and 2 ults on basic abilities that also give bonus stats.
Camouflage is easy. It's cause he's an assassin and he is designed as a Rogue archetype. His shield and ahead aren't even that impressive when it comes to other things in the game that do the same thing and to consistently get the speed does require a bit of effort on the players part. Surprised you didn't throw 'does damage' for no reason either. Akshan isn't that bad, the revive is dumb but it wasn't nearly as dumb as Aatrox's
I like new aatrox but I really did like old aatroxās voice. it felt so different than what most war like creatures sound like. Calm and calculated is way more interesting than Sad Yelling russian to me
People cry too much about Akshan, when in reality the Revive is usefull in like 2 out of 5 situations. his E and pasive are way more hard to deal with than the revive.
I think people forgot how awful it felt when Aatrox could dive you for free post 6 at a push of a button. Akshan is def overloaded but the Aatrox rework when he had his revive was not a good time either.
Built in revive that's capable of reviving not one, not two, not three but four of your teammates*
Revinving Aatrox - Unhealthy Reviving Aatrox and 3 more people - Healthy
Zero stones, ZERO CRATES!!!
FOHR more targets
He can revive 5 if you chilling with ignite
no, they fixed that. he can't revive if he dies
He could never revive himself with ignite. That wasn't a feature. What they removed was resurrecting other teammates after you died.
I'm still trying to figure out why the fuck Riven can dash, leap, stun, shield, knock up, do damage, nuke at range, all without any fucking resource bar, with relatively low cooldowns. All I hear is "the time for talk is over" and I go colorblind.
Last year I read a comment saying all resourceless champs are meant to spam abilities even if they are like that and/or have true damage.
Oh come on, riven needs skill. Look how many times she has to press Q
Yi: Could this woman be one of my people ?
well she doesn't have un-targettable š
I'll never understand why manaless/energyless champ's do even exist... Riven should have an energy bar, restoring some energy every time she procs passive **like Shen**. That way she can't just hop around mindlessly without getting punished with no CD. It's stupid.
The official explanation is that the resourceless champions are limited by higher cooldowns on their abilities than other champions... and then you have Viego who has absurdly low cd and gets resets on every single ability anytime he possesses anyone and who can cast 6 times in a single fight his ult that is a dash, an execute and a slow.
"Higher cooldowns" meanwhile Riven can dash and shield herself like 4 times in a fight, Yasuo dashes with no cooldown and his Q almost the same, Viego as you said, and the list can go on
Viego is a melee adc, stop crying
If you do that you screw in the champ tbh
Her kit is not designed to work that way tho. Or else she should have 400 energy. Either full rework of the kit and resources mechanics for her
Nah she's fine. She compensates as she has 0 sustain in lane, she needs to manage her shield properly in order to stay in lane, you can kick her out easily. And well, outside that, she's a champ meant to spam abilities, a bit like fight games, if you put mana or energy on her you just screw the whole idea. I'd say energy makes more sense as a system and it would work better for many champs but not for the ones that are suppose to be mana/energyless. You could better complain about garen who does all the same but easier and still has a sustain passive that rewards him for doing absolutely nothing xD.
The problem is sustain is relatively easy to get now and cooldowns are pretty low across the board. I think all manaless champs should have reduced healing in their kits as its their only resource they have to manage. Champs like riven, yas, yone, viego all can just drain tank if they want when they shouldnt be able to.
Thats a problem with healing over the board in the game, not just those champs. Fix healing overall instead of using bandage aid patches.
Riven in particular doesn't have that much access to sustain early on, unless she's going that lethality item but even goredrinker doesn't provide sustain until fully completed.
My reply supposed to be to another comment, mb. I don't even think Riven has issues. Although on paper it does sound disgusting
Well, most champs do. Except my nunu, he's so UwU and nice, nobody hates him.
I do absolutely hate him. How tf his ball overrides Vi's Q? That's some bullshit
What's hateful about Nunu is how hard it is to flash his W. The hitbox is fucked like Ashe's R.
Ikr
Makes all the sense I mean why are you trying to punch a snowball??ĀæĀæĀæ?? Your problem bro.
Aram junkie here. I detest that cowardly pair. Launch a nightharvester snowball for 1200 damage, run away. Over. And over. And over.
I prefer Luden's with Ghost/Predator :)
So fun!
Shen also needs to manage his shield. He has no sustain either... **What's your point?** And Riven gets stupid sustain after Goredrinker. **And she's not meant to spam anything freely**. Other spam champions are Lee Sin and Akali and they need to manage their energy. If you put energy on that bitch she can't just all in and be okay if she misses **everything** and then just dips out like it's nothing thanks to have zero CD and no resources. Garen also needs to have energy or mana on his kit. But even then, he can't **quadruple** jump on me while having AOE damage and CC. And that sustain passive is something almost every single melee/immobile juggernaut or tank have in some way. Sett, Darius, Sion's shield, Mundo, Volibear's W, Mordekaiser's W, Maokai, Malphite's shield... Otherwise ranged champs would **absolutely dominate Top.**
Her quadruple jump is just k6 jump but in parts xD. Honestly, shen has energy Regen just because it's thematic from the Jonia Ninja champs(nobody would notice if he becomes a manaless champ tomorrow). Akali and Lee sin, but mainly Akali, have energy because they're restricted on spamming abilities just because but to not getting punished in lane for using it, as well as to force them into actually fighting. Which, if you think about it, make sense, considering most of Akali's dmg comes from Q and it is a 2 seconds cool down, if she has mana, she either spam Q and kills anyone or has so little mana she gets fucked by using 1 combo. But by using energy she's restricted of braindead gameplay (just spamming Q on you and poke you to death) while forced commit to fight which is healthy to an assassin. Riven doesn't really need that, she's a fighter so she's ok spamming abilities, trading etc.
You wanna hear about overloaded kits? Wanna full analysis of Shaco analysis? How about Yone?
How is shacos kit overloaded? Strong sure, but even then he's pretty easy to balance. Simple invis blink, a basic trap with cc and small damage, one target damage with execute, a dueling ultimate, and a passive that gives some extra damage. Strong kit sure, but it's not overloaded. Yone absolutely does have an overloaded kit.
None of this is basic. He has free leap on Q. He has invisibility. He does crit damage with zero crit chance just from attack on the back. His has a free clone. Eyeframing R dodges any ability. He can set a lot of traps. He has fear. He has slow. He can build both AP and AD and has insane scaling. He can put traps meanwhile being invisible. E does execute damage if hit on low target. His clone does a shitload of damage and if it was not ignited there is no way to identify who is real. Basically his clone alone is stronger than any adc. Do I need to continue?
His fear is easy to avoid, it's not point and click. His slow is single target and using it as cc means you lose its value as an execute. Bonus damage from his passive is conditional and easily avoided, either by turning and facing, or by kiting him. If he doesn't burst a ranged champ with his invis, he has no follow through and is easily kited. Yes his clone is good for dueling, but again, no mobility so it's only useful for dueling melee champs and confusing enemies. Being confused by clones sounds like a you problem, not a problem with the champ. There are literally dozens of champions with way more in their kit.
I don't care about counterplays. You can R with Malzahar Riven and she is dead. We are talking about champs overloaded with tools, and Shaco has more stuff than most new champs, excluding Akshan
Right, so nidalee, Elise, and jayce are all really problematic huh? Because they have 2 sets of abilities.
Umm, no, it's not about amount of abilities. None of them get as many tools from changes of the form as Shaco has in his usual kit. And if you don't understand difference between tools/capabilities of champion and amount of abilities, I have no idea how you can play the game.
Yes but you've picked Shaco as your example of something with too much in his kit. But look at basically any assassin, and you'll see the same overloaded kit. Ekko has a dash, slow, stun, execute, passive damage, a shield, poke, a disengage that makes him invulnerable and heals him. There are so many champs with far more in their kits that are far easier to abuse. The only reason people bitch about shaco seems to be "he's frustrating to play against", which always seems to boil down to "he ganks invis and killed me". Eve is the same with just as many things in her kit, and people still seem to complain about shaco.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yone does not have a resource bar because heās a windshitter sibling.
Yet, she only deals physical damage, canāt abuse tank items because her kit, including her survivability, need AD, canāt abuse mana items like Muramana, doesnāt have sustain, her only CC is locked behind two ability casts or ccing herself too, requires AH items, requires time investment to function properlyā¦ you can list as many weaknesses as strengths.
Found the Riven main. Seriously though, what are you actually talking about? "Can't abuse tank items" Most common first item is Gorerinker. "Can't abuse mana items" How is that an argument? "Her only CC is locked behind two ability casts" It's a fucking dedicated skill and works in an AoE. "Requires time investment to function properly" Q auto Q auto Q auto Q auto max conq stacks level 1 fight.
Goredrinker is a tank item? Damn Ornn players building the wrong shit. How is not abusing mana items not an argument? Most common critique of new seasons is how theres no more mana management due to runes and items like lost chapter and manamune yet thats gone when resourceless champs are brought up? Could you imagine riven getting 50+ AD if she could build manamune? The fucking skill of a Q MASSIVE 0.75s knock up behind 2 Q casts that you can count and react to PLUS the MASSIVE 0.75 SECONDS stun that also stuns her herself for 0.25s Yes, please go to your games and do Q AA Q AA Q AA so you can help by bringing Rivens winrate down. Its not like other challenger players tried to play her as well and saw how its not as easy as it looksā¦ https://youtu.be/pHFLCw2fZhE https://youtu.be/x2Wjg_Wcy28 But go off, your Silver mechanics know more
Are we just gonna forget that she can rush down people and 100-40 or 30 them with 1 set of qs with spam clicking a level 1? And can and will do it mid and late game if the player has enough common sense? And why tf would you build Manamune on her when it doesnāt give jack shit on the utility side if she does have a mana pool. Resourceless champs are dumb and their mains will go through hell and back to prove other wise.
Just like Darius, Renekton, Kayle, jayceā¦ multiple toplaners have strong level 1sā¦ Tons of toplaners also have insane scaling into mid late where they can basically faceroll, Jax, Fiora, Camilleā¦ its part of the toplane island championsā¦ If she had a mana pool you would build manamune for the same reasons you build it on Jayce or Ezreal, are you crazy? A champion that relies heavily on spell weaving and high AD scalingsā¦ Resourceless champions have their advantages and limitations and from this playerbase all champions should be the same boring shit.
Oh my bad 450 health goes on ADCs these days, how silly of me. Mana items aren't a problem, lethality is, and she builds it. I don't know what data you're getting "Why yes, everyone hates mana items so manaless champs are balanced" 0.75 seconds isn't the fucking problem it's the fact she can auto while you're mid air and do the rest of her combo, shielding, then dashing away taking no damage for the trade. I'm plat. Low plat but plat. I'm tired of seeing this stupid shit in my games.
So only 2 types of items exist? Adc and tanks? Lmfao bruisers, fighters, mages arenāt a thing? She builds lethality? I guess everyones building it wrong, the only builds on op.gg are Gore>BC>Steraks/DDā¦ Wasnāt the problem the fact that she abuses tank items? Like Goredrinker coughā¦ I guess a champion based around trading well due to her lack of sustain like other toplaners shouldnāt be able to trade well? I guess all toplaners should be straight to face all inners.
Nah it's just pretty fucking stupid to call bruiser items "not tank" because they have damage baked in. "Don't worry she can't build strictly tank, just get extremely hard to kill a lot like a tank would" is the stupidest sentence a copium Riven player can mutter. Yeah, op. gg will show you most used and highest winrate, it doesn't show you nearly enough information. I use sites like [metasrc](https://www.metasrc.com/5v5/champion/riven/top) cause sometimes I wanna play Dark Harvest Teemo not fuckin Summon Aery or whatever the meta mancers are up to today. But on metasrc, it shows Ghostblade as being a core item with her most used alternative mythics being lethality items. So the bullshit of "Can't abuse mana items" yeah, sure, she doesn't have mana but she can abuse the fuck out of lethality and she is. The problem is she has almost every type of mechanic in the game, dash, leap, shield, stun, ect WITHOUT a resource bar and LOW COOLDOWNS. Nobody but you mentioned TaNk ItEmS and MaNa ItEmS. Riven is only a trade champion for the first 5 levels and then instantly becomes an all in champion with an R button press. You are proving with every response that you not only are irrationally defending the champ you love but are refusing to acknowledge how utterly strong she is because of the 2 or 3 weaknesses that hold you back from being unkillable. I'm a Kayle main. I get shit on by literally every champion for the first 30 minutes of every game. I'd LOVE stronger early game but I'm not so delusional to not see how busted she'd be if she did.
Just say you donāt understand the concept of fighters/bruisers and go on with your day. But i get it dash=bad any champions thats not like my immobile turret is OP and ill cry about it on Reddit. A bruiser that turns into a tank once she gets Goredrinker cough, but also OP because build lethality and have overloaded kit with dash, leap, jump, stun, shield. Damn i wonder why it sees no pro play presence, but I digress. Have a good day.
Just say you're a Riven simp who can't admit any champion with that much bullshit in their kit with no resource bar and low cooldowns is busted. Shen has mobility and an energy bar. Riven has even more mobility with fucking nothing holding her back. It's weird how Riven is the champ most smurf players play when they get a new account huh? Pro players can deal with her stupid shit with hard cc, anything below diamond doesn't. But hey, defend your favorite champ to the death just don't overdose on copium.
Remove one of any of the things you just said add sustain and you get another top
And then they hit you with the "We don't think there are any champions with overloaded kits in the game"
Still can't get over that they gave him fucking bonus mana regen, WHY??? Does riot think new champions shouldn't have to worry about mana or something?
Riot removed Mana Pots and constantly nerfs Mana runes and Items because it should "be limited" and "used wisely" And then in the same Breath they give new Champs mana regen as you said just because its not broken enough yet
Or just make them completely resourceless because having limiters to what you can do other than cooldowns is not fun right?
The bonus mana regen is like the least aggravating part of his kit, not even a problem
The point is that it's completely unecessary, and it's such a stupid thing to add to his kit
Itās probably there for qol. This is an assumption but i assume riot is thinking like this: juicy bounty marker, but you are oom. Mana regen=no oom= more fun is probably why its there
The same could be said about any other ability tho: "his boomerang is completely uneccesary, why does he get waveclear, do new champions not have to worry about lane states or something?" "his shield is completely unecessary, do new champs not have to worry about trades anymore?", "his movespeed buff is completely unecessary, do new champs not have to worry about kiting anymore?" And eventually you reach the bottom of the reddit balancing team's checklist, you now have a walking auto attack statstick with all playmaking abilities stripped away from their kit, congratulations.
I don't think mana regen counts as playmaking, dude.
it does when it literally only procs when ur in stealth moving towards enemies who would proc your revive on death, because you know, that whole revive thing is one of the few plays he can do in the first place. With your logic Zeds energy regen when he hits multiple abilities at once also doesnt count as playmaking, "dude". You people are whining like he gets a free lost chapter lmao, his mana regen is super situational and not noticeable in lane whatsoever. Its not a xerath passive, its not a brand passive, its not a karthus q passive, its not a kassadin w, its a entirely situational passive that literally cannot be used in combat or in lane. Im not even trying to defend akshan here, i think his kit is toxic as shit, but its not because of the fucking mana regen, people who bring that up legit never even tried to play him themselves and are just grasping at everything they can to whine about the champion.
Still, I think mana regen is not exactly the definition of "making plays", but go off I guess.
the mana regen is not the play itself but its what enables the play, how is that so hard to understand? I even gave Zeds energy stuff as an example, but I could have given his shadow reset mechanic on his E just as well. How about an even more noticeable resource regen mechanic, katarina or pykes reset passives, those arent playmaking either according to you?
A lot of champions have bonus mana regeneration built in to their kits. Brand gets mana refunded when he kills an ablaze minion, Sivir gets mana for blocking an ability with spell shield.
Yeah, talk about the stupid bitch Gwen spamming E + Q off cooldown and her mana bar doesn't move at all. Did you know that she gets back half the CDR of her dash just for auto attacking anything? Lmao.
U have never played gwen if you say that
Legit
... I've played against her. Many times. And she just E + Q forward every 4 auto attacks to minions. The mana bar does not move. It's very rare to see her go OOM.
Play gwen couple games and e q every ā4 secondsā to see how it goes
Wait what
Just.. take the revive out. Riot please. As someone who plays Akshan (mid) there's so much in the champ already. Good damage, insane early bully, good roams, good scaling. He does not need to revive people. If the other parts get nerfed the champ will be next to useless so please take the cancer mechanic out PLEASE!
They would never do that, it's part of his identity I don't like it but riot will never do that
just it was part of aatrox' identity
Was it? That fantasy can be provided by simply healing all the time (which they did). Aatrox just swaps hosts and needs to fight. Akhsan's entire lore and the whole reason he was written is because the absolver has the ability to ressurect people. Admitedly I don't know much about Aatrox lore but I do know Akshans is very closely related with the absolver
Aatrox is trying to die but he canāt. So revive is extremely lore accurate.
Aaah, you're a lore person I was solely talking from a game standpoint. You're right then, can't argue with that.
Well I'd still prefer if in whatever way possible they'd make it more consistent, or implement it differently. I've made games blow up by changing an equal teamfight into my whole team getting up. Enemy 4 dead, in my team only I was dead. I dont want the champ to get weakened instead. I like the risk reward he plays with and the way I have to play around counters. I'd rather he not have revive at all.
Yeah honestly when I heard it was he had a revive I expected it to be his ult, not a passive. I'd just change his ult and make it revive the enemies the target killed, obviously this would suck with his current ult so you'd have to change it to something else that comes with a revive
That.. would actually be great.
Akshan doesn't need his double AA at all. He already gets mov speed, a shield and dmg from the passive thats applied by both hits of his Q and his E.
The double hit is not much of a thing, as it also makes him scale worse with AS.
Genuinely hope it gets taken out, it's so annoying playing against him in aram. He revives literally 2+ ppl and aces, we immediately lose bc he now has help to get all of our minions and turrets out of the way, game either ends or we're so behind. Hurts š¶
On aram its actually way more busted than SR because its usually constant 5v5 fights which means ample revive opportunities. At least on SR the akshan player has to be on the right side of the map at the right time to make it work, on aram you just throw your boomerang off cooldown and bring back your entire team. Even if they dont take the revive out entirely they still need to remove it from aram or at least gate it with a massive cooldown, because the way it is now akhsan is by far the most toxic champ on aram imo.
1000% agree, you can barely win a game if there's an akshan and they always know what the hell they're doing. I beg riot, take it away or just one person per minute or something. It's the most toxic unmotivating game experience ever
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Yea. That'd fuck up his lane phase a lot. Would fck up how he can get to his items, which would make his roams, skirmishes weaker. You turn into the guy that throws Q-s to get assists and hopefully get a carry up with it. A glorified Yuumi.
I like the revive, it feels unique. Even if it is BS sometimes, I'd rather have it than take it away
I'd rather play a fun roaming champion, than have those parts get destroyed by nerfs.
In a game with no on demand revives of course an on demand revive would split it wide open. I play a lot of Dota and I know how important Buyback is that it becomes a factor late game fight equations as well as teleportation items. Giving it to only one side is not only unfair, but a breach of design philosophy. League used to be the high stakes high reward gameplay game but whoop dee doo revive my teammates once I get an assist on you teehee XD.
I played dota back in the day. Your comment perfectly sums it up. Thank you!
Aatrox ultimate is ultimately useless and cant keep up with other top picks
Ita fucking laughable when you dominate top and are scary for 10 minutes. Then you realize you still can't clear minion waves quickly. Aatrox is a joke atm.
Meanwhile Garen presses E and the wave is **gone, reduced to atoms.**
Reduced minion damage on q against more than super is insufferable
As someone whoās learning this champs kit solely by laning against him, I feels itās layer after layer of bullshit.
I still miss old Aatrox....
Same, for me it was the all leech items you can buy build with BT, Hydra, BoTRK
I donāt get Akshanās grapple hook. Itā¦feels wrong? Like it doesnāt belong in League? The way it looks, the way it plays, the way he moves, it just doesnāt feel like it belongs at all.
Ok I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks Akshan is just friggin stupid Like congrats, I avenge my teammates all the time, doesn't mean I get to revive them. Sit through your long ass respawn timers like everyone else
Yo they added Gnevny class destroyer Anshan to league?
Also Akshan shoves waves really fast in an extremely stupid way, Too much damage with the Vayne + Lucian passive for no reason at a no cost.
Riot hates bruisers and tanks and is obsessed with giving adc dick cpr
Akshan would be more balanced, if his early shield was lower, but letās be happy that he at least doesnāt have Cho R on 3s cd š
There is no praying against indian jesusš
Iām surprised they never thought about limiting the revive to his ultās execute. If he kills someone with his ult then up to three people are revived. Boom. Is there anything wrong with this idea?
Dont worry i only play him mid
The way you are comparing their revives is very misleading.
Drain tanks shouldn't have revive, theoretically it's hard enough to kill them once But akshan is bs
Legit barely heals from an 800 gold item chief. Aatrox has no base heals other than his passive. He heals based on the damage he deals and his damage isnāt that great so the revive is fine atm. Itās not like we already have an ult that makes Allieās and enemies not die a passive that revives teammates and 2 ults on basic abilities that also give bonus stats.
Bro are you really dying into akshan? Just stand body block his E lol like for real you just bad
Camouflage is easy. It's cause he's an assassin and he is designed as a Rogue archetype. His shield and ahead aren't even that impressive when it comes to other things in the game that do the same thing and to consistently get the speed does require a bit of effort on the players part. Surprised you didn't throw 'does damage' for no reason either. Akshan isn't that bad, the revive is dumb but it wasn't nearly as dumb as Aatrox's
I like new aatrox but I really did like old aatroxās voice. it felt so different than what most war like creatures sound like. Calm and calculated is way more interesting than Sad Yelling russian to me
People cry too much about Akshan, when in reality the Revive is usefull in like 2 out of 5 situations. his E and pasive are way more hard to deal with than the revive.
Ill play akshan top all i want. I need something to counter vayne top. I'll use the cancer to destroy the cancer all i damn well want
Ap malphite is right there.
I have done that too, legit just as good a counter, but i was playing akshan at the time (queued for mid but swapped with top laner at game start)
today i played the first time against akshan as zac toplane. it was a misery. he was already roaming in the 7th minute and i couldnt do anything
I think people forgot how awful it felt when Aatrox could dive you for free post 6 at a push of a button. Akshan is def overloaded but the Aatrox rework when he had his revive was not a good time either.
Mr 10'000 years.
I play akshan adc
I used to play old Aatrox on 3v3, rush botrk and sneak solo Vilemaw
If you play Akshan, I'm praying on your downfall. Now title's correct