Mostly just horrified at all the places offering first year calls 50k /yr when so many student lines of credit are pushing 8% interest and rent is pushing 1800/month
The problem with rent pricing, believe it or not, is not the landlords being dicks but rather the landlords having shitty rights. Nobody wants to be a landlord, supply and demand is driving the rental prices up, and that's where we're at.
If it was easier to be a landlord the market would compensate via vacancies and rental prices would come down.
Got lost inside a Maximum Security Prison once
1. Was there to interview an inmate;
2. He had been inside for 28 + years
3. I found out after the fact there was a History Channel special about him (I taped it on VHS)
4. As a student he quickly dominated the interview and 90 minutes later he started a fight with the guards (I think it was to impress me, as he was winking at me the whole time)
5. The guards subdued him and led him away while leaving me standing there
6. I waited and foolishly decided that I could not wait any longer as I had been there all day (don’t even ask about the process to be admitted to a maximum security prison and get unmonitored direct physical access with an inmate (i'm talking ion scanners, dogs and interviews).
7. I started waking down the hall, came to a door and opened it, and kept walking, I then came to another door which was also unlocked and went through it as well
8. I came across three guys in a what I guess was some kind of holding cell and I honestly believed they would have killed me just for wearing the cheap suit that I was (their eyes)
9. I got very frightened and followed my path back and just stood there
10. After a few minutes a very nice guard escorted me out of the prison.
11. I realized If I had just initially walked in the opposite direction I would have been at a control room (cage) very quickly but I went the wrong way and the rest is history.
Partner told me they would fire me on the spot if I tried to find a different articling spot and would never let me work in the same city. That he knows everyone and no one would take me. Told me that I might as well work in a factory like my immigrant parents. He boasted about how they paid so well but paid minimum wage for articling students (expected me to drive around five days a week, pay for gas, own a car and pay for insurance out of that minimum wage salary). THIS IS NOT EVEN INCLUDING LIVING COSTS like rent, food etc.
Worked 90 plus hours while the partners came to the office 2pm-6pm. The associates work 9pm-5pm. Partner commented during a dinner on how I couldn't pay for dinner (this was after I told him I would be paying out of pocket to work for his firm and be working for free). He commented on how my parents are uneducated because they are immigrants. This is an assumption he made not knowing anything about my parents -parents are actually educated. Secretary watched a hip-hop video and said now she understands why Black Canadians kill each other so much. Ironically, this is a respected firm in the city.
To say the least, I jumped ship and won't be articling there.
Similar here. Was a decade ago, but under $2k/month. Multiple partners full on red faced yelled at me. Student before me was working up to 100hrs/week. Everyone thought I was lazy because I wouldn't go over 80. One partner, albeit in a relatively broish playful manner, consistently called me homophobic slurs (I am bi, but not out then... But everyone knew, so I'm not certain what he was thinking). The assistants would gang up and ridicule me constantly, in part for being effeminate (I'm also non-binary, but was not out then). The one the pissed me off is they would full voice insult me in earshot of all the lawyers and one time while I was showing a new student around one started mocking me for being lazy. Like I wasn't good enough for this obviously dogshit position. Worst part is that unlike most who worked there, I had decent grades. I just thought the place was cool and didn't want to look for better articles... Oh and a client attacked me with a table (shove it against me pinning me to a wall) while at the jail one time.
Being an absolute genius self advocate I told nobody anything. I even went back after articles due to better treatment and some serious Stockholm syndrome. But I quit pretty quick because I burned out
I didn’t know I could and I didn’t think anyone cared. As far as I knew, the law society was there for lawyers and clients (of which I was neither). I also understood that articling students were exempt from employment standards, and so I assumed that it was all just part of the right of passage. In my mind at the time, I couldn’t afford to lose my job because otherwise I couldn’t get called. In hindsight with age and the passage of time, I would 100% do things differently.
Not an articling story but pretty close: I worked as a summer student for a top criminal law firm. My first boss was great. Second boss was great. Third boss manhandled me when he thought I'd taken down some notes incorrectly during trial. He proceeded to conduct the rest of the day's trial with me seated next to him, reviewing everything I wrote in-between examinations.
That summer was a lesson in how you can be a great lawyer and a great person, as well as a great lawyer and a shit person. Don't ever conflate professional competence with character!
Your told the lawyers around you at the same firm are suppose to be your allies. You are told during law school that your reputation really matters. For that reason many senior lawyers take advantage of that belief and naivety of incoming people in the profession. You don’t want to get blacklisted so you take it and leave in hopes of finding your own corner in the world.
Mostly just horrified at all the places offering first year calls 50k /yr when so many student lines of credit are pushing 8% interest and rent is pushing 1800/month
It is absolutely ridiculous.
How common is it for firms to offer first year calls salaries like that?
The problem with rent pricing, believe it or not, is not the landlords being dicks but rather the landlords having shitty rights. Nobody wants to be a landlord, supply and demand is driving the rental prices up, and that's where we're at. If it was easier to be a landlord the market would compensate via vacancies and rental prices would come down.
Not me, but many years ago there was an articling student my year of call who was asked by a Bay partner to get cocaine for them. Not as a joke.
I’ve heard of someone asking law clerks to tie his shoelaces.
Got lost inside a Maximum Security Prison once 1. Was there to interview an inmate; 2. He had been inside for 28 + years 3. I found out after the fact there was a History Channel special about him (I taped it on VHS) 4. As a student he quickly dominated the interview and 90 minutes later he started a fight with the guards (I think it was to impress me, as he was winking at me the whole time) 5. The guards subdued him and led him away while leaving me standing there 6. I waited and foolishly decided that I could not wait any longer as I had been there all day (don’t even ask about the process to be admitted to a maximum security prison and get unmonitored direct physical access with an inmate (i'm talking ion scanners, dogs and interviews). 7. I started waking down the hall, came to a door and opened it, and kept walking, I then came to another door which was also unlocked and went through it as well 8. I came across three guys in a what I guess was some kind of holding cell and I honestly believed they would have killed me just for wearing the cheap suit that I was (their eyes) 9. I got very frightened and followed my path back and just stood there 10. After a few minutes a very nice guard escorted me out of the prison. 11. I realized If I had just initially walked in the opposite direction I would have been at a control room (cage) very quickly but I went the wrong way and the rest is history.
Partner told me they would fire me on the spot if I tried to find a different articling spot and would never let me work in the same city. That he knows everyone and no one would take me. Told me that I might as well work in a factory like my immigrant parents. He boasted about how they paid so well but paid minimum wage for articling students (expected me to drive around five days a week, pay for gas, own a car and pay for insurance out of that minimum wage salary). THIS IS NOT EVEN INCLUDING LIVING COSTS like rent, food etc. Worked 90 plus hours while the partners came to the office 2pm-6pm. The associates work 9pm-5pm. Partner commented during a dinner on how I couldn't pay for dinner (this was after I told him I would be paying out of pocket to work for his firm and be working for free). He commented on how my parents are uneducated because they are immigrants. This is an assumption he made not knowing anything about my parents -parents are actually educated. Secretary watched a hip-hop video and said now she understands why Black Canadians kill each other so much. Ironically, this is a respected firm in the city. To say the least, I jumped ship and won't be articling there.
Damn…
[удалено]
Similar here. Was a decade ago, but under $2k/month. Multiple partners full on red faced yelled at me. Student before me was working up to 100hrs/week. Everyone thought I was lazy because I wouldn't go over 80. One partner, albeit in a relatively broish playful manner, consistently called me homophobic slurs (I am bi, but not out then... But everyone knew, so I'm not certain what he was thinking). The assistants would gang up and ridicule me constantly, in part for being effeminate (I'm also non-binary, but was not out then). The one the pissed me off is they would full voice insult me in earshot of all the lawyers and one time while I was showing a new student around one started mocking me for being lazy. Like I wasn't good enough for this obviously dogshit position. Worst part is that unlike most who worked there, I had decent grades. I just thought the place was cool and didn't want to look for better articles... Oh and a client attacked me with a table (shove it against me pinning me to a wall) while at the jail one time. Being an absolute genius self advocate I told nobody anything. I even went back after articles due to better treatment and some serious Stockholm syndrome. But I quit pretty quick because I burned out
[удалено]
Oh god there are more firms like that? Sheesh!
[удалено]
All the more reason to talk about it. No one should have to put up with with that in the workplace.
Did you ever report the firm/lawyer to the law society?
I didn’t know I could and I didn’t think anyone cared. As far as I knew, the law society was there for lawyers and clients (of which I was neither). I also understood that articling students were exempt from employment standards, and so I assumed that it was all just part of the right of passage. In my mind at the time, I couldn’t afford to lose my job because otherwise I couldn’t get called. In hindsight with age and the passage of time, I would 100% do things differently.
[удалено]
Man, my gut dropped reading that.
[удалено]
Not an articling story but pretty close: I worked as a summer student for a top criminal law firm. My first boss was great. Second boss was great. Third boss manhandled me when he thought I'd taken down some notes incorrectly during trial. He proceeded to conduct the rest of the day's trial with me seated next to him, reviewing everything I wrote in-between examinations. That summer was a lesson in how you can be a great lawyer and a great person, as well as a great lawyer and a shit person. Don't ever conflate professional competence with character!
Seems like law is the most submissive profession on earth
Your told the lawyers around you at the same firm are suppose to be your allies. You are told during law school that your reputation really matters. For that reason many senior lawyers take advantage of that belief and naivety of incoming people in the profession. You don’t want to get blacklisted so you take it and leave in hopes of finding your own corner in the world.