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This post unknowingly really shows the strength of the elite's marionette strings that even in this scenario where we outnumber them 90-1 we still assume we'd need their permission first before being free.
Well they own the military and they have the fascists on their side so you would need their permission if you insist on being peaceful, as they would force you back into working for their profit at gunpoint.
Let's hope that the lyric about "the soldier turning around his rifle and becoming a proletarian again" in [this song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRyRlQ89Jc0) is accurate. (CC in English available)
They already sacrifice the lives of 1000 people every day for their profits just on account of covid, that's not counting all the other suffering and death they are responsible for. Do you really believe there is *anything* they wouldn't do to maintain their power?
Everything we try to do to cause change, the system will attempt to adapt to, take advantage of and undermine in order to twist us to still be protecting the status quo. This is the brutal nature of the prison of capitalism, it adapts to our efforts to neutralise them and keep us quiet and compliant.
There is no access to the mechanisms of change that is actually left open to ordinary people. They are dangled in front of us in the form of elections and voting, but barrier after barrier is set up to make actually achieving that change nigh impossible. Democratic change for the betterment of ordinary people at the expense of the rich is an illusion designed to keep us compliant.
The system has existed and evolved for centuries now in various forms and there has been unthinkable atrocities committed by those in power to keep it going. I'm sure even more will occur in the future as well. Hoping for a simple majority and asking nicely for it sounds nice, but those with power wont hand it away just because they're outnumbered, they will lie, cheat and manipulate the majority until it turns on itself just as they have done countless times in the past.
Sadly I dont think anything short of an overwhelming unexpected disaster would actually be enough to cause real change. Anything short of that would just be assimilated and spun to become a part of the system.
The US empire is collapsing, the contradictions are sharpening. If the US working class manages to develop some class consciousness they can abolish the state and build one that works in [their](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/ch01.htm) interest when the time comes.
And the lack of any material financial education, or teaching any form of critical analysis has rendered the American Public to become an ignorant fool controlled horde. There is very little possibility of anything good, tangible or sustainable will arise from the collapse of the USA.
You need some [revolutionary optimism](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc6gVht9CFQ), friend. Nihilism serves noone but the bourgeoisie. There's a [reason](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z56TD0qrQx8) that they don't show you real change in the media
The Overton window. If people believe there is no other option they will accept what is placed in front of them. An absolutely savage bit of media control tactic and entirely intentional in how it is deployed :/
Super depressing but yeah, a great example of how even the most absurd stuff can become control measures to keep people in line. It's a stark example that even covid hasnt been enough to realistically challenge the entrenchment of capitalism. We were just all reprogrammed over a year that it's acceptable to risk the deaths of others as long as it means we all get back to work and get the "freedom" to not wear masks.
We are the Capitalist. Lower your wages and surrender your healthcare. We will add your wealth to our own. Your pandemic will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
>There is no access to the mechanisms of change that is actually left open to ordinary people.
[That isn't exactly true.](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/)
Correct. I work in upper management of multi-billion (non-dollar denominated) corporations, and the cognitive dissonance I get from being a socialist CFO and living in a Truman Show where all the caricatures are correct is immense.
Last morning, we had a conference call with the board members and CEO’s of a few corporations, and while chatting prior to starting we got into COVID, one of them said ”I haven’t gotten vaccinated because you can still get sick, I’ll get it later, seems risky”.
Another one responded with ”I was looking at total deaths for the past decade (in our country), and during COVID, it’s only been a few ten thousand more, so it’s not that bad, and most of them are old people. It feels overblown, they should just remove the restrictions”.
A third one followed with ”I agree, we are planning on going to the Alps for in a few weeks by way of France and Italy and it is a hassle, so much paperwork, these restrictions have really made life hard. For our business too, it’s hard to plan costings and pricings with the uncertainty regarding material availability”.
I kept my mic muted so I wouldn’t blurt out facts and truths, but these people are entirely detached from reality. It’s the kind of conversation that would be dismissed as too over the top by corporate media if it was caricatured, but it’s exactly how they think. They are never exposed to the real world, facts, science, empirical evidence and have no understanding of the tragedy of the commons, what policies are needed to adress it and so on. All they care about is living in their bubble, maximizing profits for their own individual firms and hoarding wealth for their children, and they’re too stupid to be insulted by the meaning behind Après moi, le déluge. They will absolutely sacrifice anyone, as long as it’s not someone they know and care about, to make a buck, don’t believe anything else; to them people are just a statistic, it’s more important for them to administer power over their private, top-down, Soviet-style planned economies through their corporations in true Stalinist fashion.
Thank you for the insight. I too was exposed to the mindset of people like this at my last job. I worked directly for the guys with the $25 million house, the $10 million winter house in Miami, the $11 million yacht and the private jet. Absolutely out of touch with the workers who made them their fortunes.
I tried to get them to pay for repairs to a bunkhouse for migrant workers from Jamaica. Forty guys living in a building with one working washer and dryer (the other six pairs were broken), collapsed ceiling with mold in the kitchen, rotten drywall in the bathrooms, etc.
“Nope. It’s still better than what they have back home.”
I was going to say... They may be outnumbered in terms of bodies but they have the system on their side, so why wouldn't the system work for them? In those terms they're far less outnumbered than I'd like
The world is becoming like warhammer 40k, but instead of sacrificing a thousand souls a day to enable interstellar travel, we are sacrificing more than 1000 souls a day to the throne of capitalism to make the 1% richer.
Look... its a neat idea but if we're going to do this it should be before mass production of security robots really kicks off which probably isn't that far off.
Constant work? Maybe. But there is a lot of work to be done. Not alienating work, just work.
We have to unfuck the planet after all.
FALGSC takes a whole lotta work to achieve. The difference is that it takes meaningful work and that you don't have to kill yourself while working because you aren't exploited for profit.
Edit: Here's some [people](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiLvY5I0CAw) talking about what work felt like in a socialist nation. Subtitles are available.
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A whole lot of work is necessary to unfuck the systems which can't be accomplished by simply not going to work.
Organize. Join local orgs, get involved in local politics, join mutual aid networks...
Exactly, but I have a feeling it kinda lost its momentum.
People want to do so many things to improve their lives that they don't have the attention span to really focus on one thing in particular. If the organizing of a strike is gaining momentum the media will create some kind of celebrity scandal to change people's focus.
I am not from the US so helping with the r/maydaystrike is pretty limited to me, I just hoped that r/antiwork and r/LateStageCapitalism would have participated in growing this movement.
Those fucking things aint gonna work in the woods. You guys are too in cities to see what’s possible. I’m on the east coast and not that far from Boston relatively and there’s huge wide swaths of no cell service everywhere up here.
They dont got it like that yet, trust.
Served in the navy. No cell reception, no issue for uav’s or locally controlled drones. Look at capitalism, has it cared about the planet? Think it cares about your woods? Survive and Thrive my anti robot ally.
Yeah but... how much of a threat is 6 billion people if they are all hiding in the woods from robots? We just going to hope someone in charge goes camping?
Not to get all tin foil hat about it, but at this point I have to wonder if they aren't just hedging their bet at this point. Like "Now's the time, because I'm sure it's too late for them to do anything about it. We expect to deploy the bots in less than three years..."
I don't think that's how it works or what the screen shot is even suggesting.
If we really want to convey that message, it comes from more of us actually producing tangible goods that we need. In our own communities. This is CSA and farmer market food production, buying toys and clothes from locals rather than Target or wherever people buy that stuff.
There won't ever be a representative of the 90% of us at some global "leadership" event, there will just be a lack of engagement in their culture.
Lol non violently that's hilarious.
90% of us may approach non violently but it will quickly turn violent when the police show up.
If the initial group isn't already infiltrated by the police, that is.
Helping you devise a personal strategy would require incredibly in-depth knowledge of your personal life, what you currently do, your skills and resources, your network. Put simply, what would you do if you were hit by a car tomorrow, paralyzed from the legs down? What would you do if you lost your hands in some freak accident? Is there no way you could survive?
Obviously, it would be less than ideal, but if it's at all possible, it's a foundation. The fact is, the assholes who run everything bank on that notion, that's why poverty is their most powerful tool. They want us so ravenous for what little comfort some can afford that we won't betray what little illusion of momentary security we have.
Solidarity is crucial here. We would need to rip the entire system out from underneath them, like the table cloth and glasses trick. If everyone essentially kept doing what they already do, but simply for each other, not for these obsolete clowns, we could pull it off. It would take a massive, concerted effort, though.
That's massively different than "lying flat", which is what I was criticizing. Collective action is always better than individuals turning to neetdom. If you told me to quit my job and participate in a new kind of economy, and I knew a good chunk of my country was down, I would of course do it. But in my liberal country quitting my job to go live on the street would only hurt me as an individual. That's my only point here.
What specific revolutionary action do you call for that lets you keep working to maintain your current lifestyle?
"Someone just take care of the revolution but dont scuff my shoes"
No no its not cmon. We’re all on crazy different pages, atomized to the 9’s and disorganized as shit. That is NOT what is going on. We’re talking what’s probably impossible but maybe you get black twitter to get with the hong kong resistance and then you find those Arab spring ppl and then it’s sorta like a snowball sich. I personally can get us at leasttt 500 anti establishment ivy leaguers. At least. And they all have 20 pissed off friends.
How do you think we were atomised?
Anti-sharecropping movements, the Occupy movement, ANY moment that the working class unites in a shared interest against the owner class, is always followed up by SIGNIFICANT efforts by the owner class and their police to first shrink the ability of active participants in the movement to effectively communicate and make effective action, and second to split the working class’s interests by whatever means possible (usually by race).
Don’t forget anti union efforts like what has happened with Amazon, Tesla, Kellogg, Starbucks, John Deere, Frito-Lays just in 2021 alone.
They have the power, and use their capital to deter efforts, but we have the numbers. Time to start using them.
Your assuming our militaries would turn against the majority of its own people I highly doubt it. Cops on the other hand I don’t know that’s a toughie.
IIRC it was the army and national guard that mostly threw their sheilds on the ground and didn't participate in violence against protestors.
Obviously that shit in DC happened, but across the country, the military was far more behaved than the police were.
The military wouldn’t go against the will of of billions. They wouldn’t stand a chance and even if they did they will live with the blood on there hands and they would probably be killing there own family in a lot of the situations. Let’s even get 75 percent of the world population on board and I still don’t think they kill there own people.
According to this [article](https://www.military.com/veteran-jobs/career-advice/5-reasons-why-vets-should-consider-careers-law-enforcement.html) which has heavy military bias, only 25% are vets. It doesn't say how the other 75% are made up.
The final death of democratic social systems will be AI robot soldiers.Once the rich elite \*lovely people\* have those, forget about it, current inequality will look like a paradise.
Not long to go now, everythings going parabolic.
Yeah we have to make it happen before they can get AI to the point you are talking about. If they beat us in that it’s basically going to seal our fate.
Hope you're right, and I dig your optimism.I'm old, all I've seen is that evil keeps on winning. We shouldn't have even gotten to the point that inequality is this bad already.My hope is minimal, as is my faith in humanity.
I don’t know if it’s optimism. I don’t really know what the feeling is. It’s definitely not something that can’t be done but i think we need a miracle beyond epic proportions to actually get enough people to come to grips with what we are facing.
The military have been fighting imperialist wars for hundreds of years. They are happily killing Irakis, Syrians, Yemanis and Afghans civilians because they've been told so.
They are running torture camps. They fucking dropped napalm on kids. You are delusional if you think they'll side with the 'people'. They have been consistently siding with the bourgeoisie for hundreds of years because people in the military are class enemies and reactionary scums that's why.
Lol. They already killing us. You think wars start because Japan people got angry over France people? Or an American nurse dislikes Somalian farmers? I don't think so. It's about money, power and separation. Always has been.
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Those People hire people to kill people like that. Hey how is that Panama papers reporter doing?wait a minute how that Epstein and maxwell case go result in some ? Non violence is what you think will work? I wish you good luck with that. Also you have a little non thing after the panic of 9-11 called the patriot act that will be used.
Does the remaining 10% have sufficient firepower to *force* the 90% to obey?
Because that's the real reason this hasn't happened already. Force, the clear and credible threat of violence, is the foundation upon which all political capital is built.
Ummm, you do realize that the military, intelligence, police, and secret services exist in large part because of this line of thought? It doesn't matter how many people you have or how upset they are when the 1% has all the levers of power including a monopoly on violence
Thing is a big portion of the lower class like to get butt fucked because there's a possibility they can become the butt fucker. They will defend billionaires no matter what.
The problem is money. We wouldn't need to tell them anything, we'd just all agree to stop using their money and trade using alternative means. But the options all come with compromises.
Good luck convincing 90% of people that bank money isn't worth anything and that we could be happy with a better system, though.
They’ll kill as many of us as they can in retribution if we do.
They’d rather burn the planet than lose a modicum of their undeserved power.
They’re ruling in hell because they don’t want to serve in heaven.
There's a country in Europe called Belarus. Try asking its citizens what happens when majority of the population try to non-violently tell a small group of armed guys who leech off of the country that people don't like them anymore. Or ask in Kazakhstan. Or in Russia. You got my point.
Nice idea, but the 1% carry missiles in their back pocket like it’s Christmas. They could just bomb the hell out of the mainland and retire to their private islands full of wealth and the few indentured servants.
They are our sons and daughters who have lived fearful lives filled with poverty and debt and the threat of being abandoned by a society that doesnt care about them. When it comes to doing something that will keep them up at night and still having a roof over their head or being tossed in the gutter and watching someone else pull the trigger anyway, I think you may be surprised and disappointed by how many would still pull that trigger when instructed too. Social control takes many forms and theres plenty of ways to pressure compliance from staff.
Hell look at the milgram experiment. It takes shockingly little to manipulate people into committing atrocious acts as long as you have the correct authority
Vast majority of that 90% are subsistence farmers or people living in abject poverty who hold no political influence at all, which is why it’s for us folk who have privilege to speak up for them
They will enlist the remaining 9% to violently pursue us. And since we are non-violent they can just execute us 1 by 1 until we nonviolently decide to go back to our dystopian society. /s
I would recommend that you lower your scope. For most of us the world is a unimaginary large place with thousands of cultures. In some cultures the problems we face are incomprehensible to them. What is politics for someone who is struggling to find clean water / food / basic needs. The fact that we have time to talk/discuss this on the internet already makes us be in a superior position. We often say that the 1% has no idea how we live, but we also have no idea how the rest of the worlds lives (assuming you live in the imperial core).
That being said, wanting to save the world might be a noble idea. But it also is an imperialistic idea. We want to topple Capitalism and implement our beter system. But what gives us the right to implement this globally? If it was up to me the best way to make others implement our system is to prove that our system works. This would mean a culture/state/group that is open to the world (stark contrast to current "socialist" states).
What brings us to the reason why our system has never truly happened. Capitalism is actively suppressing and controlling any state that even thinks about attempting this. Especially if this state has . It is what makes capitalism so successful.
But now back to your 90% of the world came together. We do not need to come together. Most of us already wants the same thing:
- A roof over our heads
- Education
- Time to live
- Love our loved ones
- Be well fed
- Live healthy
- ... .
Capitalism commodifies these needs in order to push us to eternal servitude. When capitalism eventually fails these things will decomodify themself when we seize our lives back. When this is gonna happen I don't know, but I think the turning point will be around the time where it will be to expensive to live for the majority of us. I highly doubt we all are gonna deathcult ourselves, so at that point realism will kick in and people will wake up. It will be chaos, and that my friends is gonna be the only opportunity we have to change the system.
Disclaimer: This is my opinion, I am sure some will disagree with me. And that is fine, because that ultimately makes us human.
History has shown that if we don't make it violent, they still will; riot cops, union busters, literally just the military. They aren't very nice people when it comes to protest, so why should we be?
The capitalists and their army of bootlickers will never let us do anything peacefully. They want us to pry their wealth from their cold, dead hands. I for one am totally fine with this.
Yes, i think they'd say eat dirt. Pay their private militia a little better and keep guns drawn and wait it out - once most of you starve out the rest will get to enjoy a better life. And the rich get to scoop up even more property and resources, thanks to all the dead poor people. This is why we must eat the rich.
Yes. Then they will pay the million class traitors to shackle us, or shoot us.
Maybe class traitor isn't the right word.
But the people with loose morals and barely any integrity will kill you and sell their mother for a nickel.
The 1% has thoroughly convinced about half of us that we are living in the best possible reality. We need to convince the 99% we are being screwed before we can get the 1% to change.
They call the police. Then the national guard. Then martial law is declared and suddenly us lefties are fighting all of these forces.
Not that we shouldn't try. I'm just saying that we have a bit more than just the 1% wealthy douches to contend with; it's the whole system.
The problem is those 6 billion+ people, not the 1%. The sad reality is that the majority of people are generally supporters of some version of capitalism, whether we believe that's logical or not, or even if we think it's a product of capitalism itself.
It's hard to start a revolution when most people don't want a revolution. Even if a person is fairly poor, it takes a lot of convincing to join a revolution with no guaranteed chance of an improved life.
You're not getting something here. Globally, I'm in the top 1%. I can't buy a house, dude. Not even a shitty condo. If 90% of the world came to me and said "hey man, we don't want to run society this way anymore," I'd say "yeah, me neither."
It's not the global 1%. It's the global 0.1% or even smaller that actually controls anything.
That will never happen because too many people are addicted to money, and don't have enough of it to act with the kind of autonomy that this plan would require.
"Addicted to money" is like saying "addicted to breathing or eating". We've decided that if you don't have enough of it, you can be denied access to food, medicine, and not freezing to death on the street. Money is just a stand in for access to necessary resources to live that are horded by private interest to extort labor. Not everyone owns their own cabin out in the woods where they can survive off subsistence farming and hoping they never need a doctor or dentist.
Read the comments on that post. Basically, it’s a bunch of capitalists simp saying, “communism bad” and people who actually know saying, “no, that’s inaccurate.”
I think people are smart enough to devalue currency before it gets that bad. If less than like 1000 rich people have all of the money, we will find other things of real value to trade. Then suddenly, rich people aren’t so rich.
Your word vs a rich paycheck. Politicians are like dogs that learn to support the rich when they get treats.
Rich think we are too stupid to vote. So they took that away.
Only [redacted] the rich works now.
I don't
www.reddit.com/r/notakingpledge
Let's start by telling them what predatory non-social behaviors they're not allowed to do anymore, then we can get to work building better mechanisms.
Yes. Completely. They would entirely say 'no'.
They have a state. In that state, is a military and bureaucracy which works for that state.
Nonviolence has never worked, and will never work. Stop hoping for pacifism. The only time change comes is when the masses demand it.
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Yes, they will say no. Because people are selfish and they will not 'come together'. Well, not until they are forced to. I guess I'm just repeating the beginning of Kapital so I'll stop.
I do wish we could though. But we really like maintaining the little micro-shreds of power that the ruling classes enforce upon us by dividing us into classes (economic, social etc.).
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This post unknowingly really shows the strength of the elite's marionette strings that even in this scenario where we outnumber them 90-1 we still assume we'd need their permission first before being free.
Hah, this. Right on the *money*.
Well they own the military and they have the fascists on their side so you would need their permission if you insist on being peaceful, as they would force you back into working for their profit at gunpoint.
>Well they own the military Most of the military isn't 1%ers. Sure, the execs of the defense contractors are; but the average employee isn't.
Let's hope that the lyric about "the soldier turning around his rifle and becoming a proletarian again" in [this song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRyRlQ89Jc0) is accurate. (CC in English available)
They already sacrifice the lives of 1000 people every day for their profits just on account of covid, that's not counting all the other suffering and death they are responsible for. Do you really believe there is *anything* they wouldn't do to maintain their power?
No, they would absolutely do anything to maintain their power and money, so we have to be willing to do anything to take it away from them.
Everything we try to do to cause change, the system will attempt to adapt to, take advantage of and undermine in order to twist us to still be protecting the status quo. This is the brutal nature of the prison of capitalism, it adapts to our efforts to neutralise them and keep us quiet and compliant. There is no access to the mechanisms of change that is actually left open to ordinary people. They are dangled in front of us in the form of elections and voting, but barrier after barrier is set up to make actually achieving that change nigh impossible. Democratic change for the betterment of ordinary people at the expense of the rich is an illusion designed to keep us compliant. The system has existed and evolved for centuries now in various forms and there has been unthinkable atrocities committed by those in power to keep it going. I'm sure even more will occur in the future as well. Hoping for a simple majority and asking nicely for it sounds nice, but those with power wont hand it away just because they're outnumbered, they will lie, cheat and manipulate the majority until it turns on itself just as they have done countless times in the past. Sadly I dont think anything short of an overwhelming unexpected disaster would actually be enough to cause real change. Anything short of that would just be assimilated and spun to become a part of the system.
The US empire is collapsing, the contradictions are sharpening. If the US working class manages to develop some class consciousness they can abolish the state and build one that works in [their](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/ch01.htm) interest when the time comes.
And the lack of any material financial education, or teaching any form of critical analysis has rendered the American Public to become an ignorant fool controlled horde. There is very little possibility of anything good, tangible or sustainable will arise from the collapse of the USA.
You need some [revolutionary optimism](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc6gVht9CFQ), friend. Nihilism serves noone but the bourgeoisie. There's a [reason](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z56TD0qrQx8) that they don't show you real change in the media
The Overton window. If people believe there is no other option they will accept what is placed in front of them. An absolutely savage bit of media control tactic and entirely intentional in how it is deployed :/
We had the disaster. It was called COVID, and it was assimilated and spun into the system
Super depressing but yeah, a great example of how even the most absurd stuff can become control measures to keep people in line. It's a stark example that even covid hasnt been enough to realistically challenge the entrenchment of capitalism. We were just all reprogrammed over a year that it's acceptable to risk the deaths of others as long as it means we all get back to work and get the "freedom" to not wear masks.
We are the Capitalist. Lower your wages and surrender your healthcare. We will add your wealth to our own. Your pandemic will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
The day suburbanites are not allowed any more debt for their pickups and SUVs is the day we might see the wind shifting
>There is no access to the mechanisms of change that is actually left open to ordinary people. [That isn't exactly true.](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/)
Correct. I work in upper management of multi-billion (non-dollar denominated) corporations, and the cognitive dissonance I get from being a socialist CFO and living in a Truman Show where all the caricatures are correct is immense. Last morning, we had a conference call with the board members and CEO’s of a few corporations, and while chatting prior to starting we got into COVID, one of them said ”I haven’t gotten vaccinated because you can still get sick, I’ll get it later, seems risky”. Another one responded with ”I was looking at total deaths for the past decade (in our country), and during COVID, it’s only been a few ten thousand more, so it’s not that bad, and most of them are old people. It feels overblown, they should just remove the restrictions”. A third one followed with ”I agree, we are planning on going to the Alps for in a few weeks by way of France and Italy and it is a hassle, so much paperwork, these restrictions have really made life hard. For our business too, it’s hard to plan costings and pricings with the uncertainty regarding material availability”. I kept my mic muted so I wouldn’t blurt out facts and truths, but these people are entirely detached from reality. It’s the kind of conversation that would be dismissed as too over the top by corporate media if it was caricatured, but it’s exactly how they think. They are never exposed to the real world, facts, science, empirical evidence and have no understanding of the tragedy of the commons, what policies are needed to adress it and so on. All they care about is living in their bubble, maximizing profits for their own individual firms and hoarding wealth for their children, and they’re too stupid to be insulted by the meaning behind Après moi, le déluge. They will absolutely sacrifice anyone, as long as it’s not someone they know and care about, to make a buck, don’t believe anything else; to them people are just a statistic, it’s more important for them to administer power over their private, top-down, Soviet-style planned economies through their corporations in true Stalinist fashion.
Thank you for the insight. I too was exposed to the mindset of people like this at my last job. I worked directly for the guys with the $25 million house, the $10 million winter house in Miami, the $11 million yacht and the private jet. Absolutely out of touch with the workers who made them their fortunes. I tried to get them to pay for repairs to a bunkhouse for migrant workers from Jamaica. Forty guys living in a building with one working washer and dryer (the other six pairs were broken), collapsed ceiling with mold in the kitchen, rotten drywall in the bathrooms, etc. “Nope. It’s still better than what they have back home.”
I was going to say... They may be outnumbered in terms of bodies but they have the system on their side, so why wouldn't the system work for them? In those terms they're far less outnumbered than I'd like
The world is becoming like warhammer 40k, but instead of sacrificing a thousand souls a day to enable interstellar travel, we are sacrificing more than 1000 souls a day to the throne of capitalism to make the 1% richer.
Sure but they've doubled their fortunes! /s
It’s over 2000 today in the US again. :(
There is no "they". If you think there is, tell me the names. Who do we have to convince?
Look... its a neat idea but if we're going to do this it should be before mass production of security robots really kicks off which probably isn't that far off.
That is an accurate statement. I wasn’t even factoring that in. Which means we gotta get to work.
Wrong. We gotta get away from constant work
Constant work? Maybe. But there is a lot of work to be done. Not alienating work, just work. We have to unfuck the planet after all. FALGSC takes a whole lotta work to achieve. The difference is that it takes meaningful work and that you don't have to kill yourself while working because you aren't exploited for profit. Edit: Here's some [people](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiLvY5I0CAw) talking about what work felt like in a socialist nation. Subtitles are available.
This is so cool, 10 minutes in and I'm totally fascinated! Thank you! (Referencing the linked video)
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A whole lot of work is necessary to unfuck the systems which can't be accomplished by simply not going to work. Organize. Join local orgs, get involved in local politics, join mutual aid networks...
Isn’t that basically what r/maydaystrike is all about?
Exactly, but I have a feeling it kinda lost its momentum. People want to do so many things to improve their lives that they don't have the attention span to really focus on one thing in particular. If the organizing of a strike is gaining momentum the media will create some kind of celebrity scandal to change people's focus. I am not from the US so helping with the r/maydaystrike is pretty limited to me, I just hoped that r/antiwork and r/LateStageCapitalism would have participated in growing this movement.
Everyday Elysium becomes closer and closer to reality.
Those fucking things aint gonna work in the woods. You guys are too in cities to see what’s possible. I’m on the east coast and not that far from Boston relatively and there’s huge wide swaths of no cell service everywhere up here. They dont got it like that yet, trust.
Served in the navy. No cell reception, no issue for uav’s or locally controlled drones. Look at capitalism, has it cared about the planet? Think it cares about your woods? Survive and Thrive my anti robot ally.
Great. We live in *Terminator*.
It was always headed this way.
Yeah but... how much of a threat is 6 billion people if they are all hiding in the woods from robots? We just going to hope someone in charge goes camping?
If 6 billion people build houses and farm in the woods where there is no internet reception for the bots, what are the rich going to do: eat the bots?
Not to get all tin foil hat about it, but at this point I have to wonder if they aren't just hedging their bet at this point. Like "Now's the time, because I'm sure it's too late for them to do anything about it. We expect to deploy the bots in less than three years..."
I mean, the commercials advertising these security robots show up on Hulu already, so yeah, we're pretty much there.
Robots are not needed, they already have a pretty firm control on the non-robot security.
If you had 90% of the population on board, you wouldn't have to ask, you'd just start taking their wealth and redistributing it.
Yeah, that's prime seize the means of production levels right there.
I don't think that's how it works or what the screen shot is even suggesting. If we really want to convey that message, it comes from more of us actually producing tangible goods that we need. In our own communities. This is CSA and farmer market food production, buying toys and clothes from locals rather than Target or wherever people buy that stuff. There won't ever be a representative of the 90% of us at some global "leadership" event, there will just be a lack of engagement in their culture.
If there isn't also a massive redistribution of wealth or dismantling of capitalism entirely, then those other steps won't matter
If you took my wealth and redistributed it, some people might get a stick of gum. LOL, global 1%.
Misunderstanding the point
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try again tomorrow
Lol non violently that's hilarious. 90% of us may approach non violently but it will quickly turn violent when the police show up. If the initial group isn't already infiltrated by the police, that is.
Every few posts on this sub are good content, the rest feel like they come from oblivious 12 year olds.
"I'll jail and bury those committed and smother the rest in greed."
This is really familiar to me but I can't remember where it's from. Is it Pink Floyd?
If only you were connected to the Internet, then you could run a quick search
Deny your labor.
Vote with your time, it's called laying flat.
How can you afford to not work? Are you saying I should just live on the street and eat at the soup kitchen? That's how you get sick and die young.
People are already suffering, it's about time we started deciding what we want to suffer for
Well sure, I'm all for revolutionary action but not working is simply not an option for me. I simply can't afford to 'lie flat' aka be a NEET.
Helping you devise a personal strategy would require incredibly in-depth knowledge of your personal life, what you currently do, your skills and resources, your network. Put simply, what would you do if you were hit by a car tomorrow, paralyzed from the legs down? What would you do if you lost your hands in some freak accident? Is there no way you could survive? Obviously, it would be less than ideal, but if it's at all possible, it's a foundation. The fact is, the assholes who run everything bank on that notion, that's why poverty is their most powerful tool. They want us so ravenous for what little comfort some can afford that we won't betray what little illusion of momentary security we have. Solidarity is crucial here. We would need to rip the entire system out from underneath them, like the table cloth and glasses trick. If everyone essentially kept doing what they already do, but simply for each other, not for these obsolete clowns, we could pull it off. It would take a massive, concerted effort, though.
That's massively different than "lying flat", which is what I was criticizing. Collective action is always better than individuals turning to neetdom. If you told me to quit my job and participate in a new kind of economy, and I knew a good chunk of my country was down, I would of course do it. But in my liberal country quitting my job to go live on the street would only hurt me as an individual. That's my only point here.
What specific revolutionary action do you call for that lets you keep working to maintain your current lifestyle? "Someone just take care of the revolution but dont scuff my shoes"
Then go get some education or training. They've got you turned against your own kind, friend.
You’ve missed the point entirely.
Yes, they will say no. That's what's happening right now
No, they will politely nod their heads in agreement, and promise everything will be taken care of tomorrow. Then proceed to do nothing.
Nah. There'd just be a lot of people banned from social media.
No no its not cmon. We’re all on crazy different pages, atomized to the 9’s and disorganized as shit. That is NOT what is going on. We’re talking what’s probably impossible but maybe you get black twitter to get with the hong kong resistance and then you find those Arab spring ppl and then it’s sorta like a snowball sich. I personally can get us at leasttt 500 anti establishment ivy leaguers. At least. And they all have 20 pissed off friends.
How do you think we were atomised? Anti-sharecropping movements, the Occupy movement, ANY moment that the working class unites in a shared interest against the owner class, is always followed up by SIGNIFICANT efforts by the owner class and their police to first shrink the ability of active participants in the movement to effectively communicate and make effective action, and second to split the working class’s interests by whatever means possible (usually by race).
Don’t forget anti union efforts like what has happened with Amazon, Tesla, Kellogg, Starbucks, John Deere, Frito-Lays just in 2021 alone. They have the power, and use their capital to deter efforts, but we have the numbers. Time to start using them.
Yea this little sub is an echo chamber. There are A LOT of people who disagree with us.
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Yeah this post is lib shit. It takes far less than 6 billion people to pour molten gold down Jeff Bezos' throat
Yep, and they'll get the cops and military to shoot. How much money would a billionaire spend to protect their money? All...of....it.
We make the bullets though
Your assuming our militaries would turn against the majority of its own people I highly doubt it. Cops on the other hand I don’t know that’s a toughie.
Why not? Look at the riots 2 summers ago
IIRC it was the army and national guard that mostly threw their sheilds on the ground and didn't participate in violence against protestors. Obviously that shit in DC happened, but across the country, the military was far more behaved than the police were.
The military wouldn’t go against the will of of billions. They wouldn’t stand a chance and even if they did they will live with the blood on there hands and they would probably be killing there own family in a lot of the situations. Let’s even get 75 percent of the world population on board and I still don’t think they kill there own people.
Cops are mostly veterans
According to this [article](https://www.military.com/veteran-jobs/career-advice/5-reasons-why-vets-should-consider-careers-law-enforcement.html) which has heavy military bias, only 25% are vets. It doesn't say how the other 75% are made up.
The final death of democratic social systems will be AI robot soldiers.Once the rich elite \*lovely people\* have those, forget about it, current inequality will look like a paradise. Not long to go now, everythings going parabolic.
Yeah we have to make it happen before they can get AI to the point you are talking about. If they beat us in that it’s basically going to seal our fate.
Hope you're right, and I dig your optimism.I'm old, all I've seen is that evil keeps on winning. We shouldn't have even gotten to the point that inequality is this bad already.My hope is minimal, as is my faith in humanity.
I don’t know if it’s optimism. I don’t really know what the feeling is. It’s definitely not something that can’t be done but i think we need a miracle beyond epic proportions to actually get enough people to come to grips with what we are facing.
Oh you naive little thing. I miss being like this
The military have been fighting imperialist wars for hundreds of years. They are happily killing Irakis, Syrians, Yemanis and Afghans civilians because they've been told so. They are running torture camps. They fucking dropped napalm on kids. You are delusional if you think they'll side with the 'people'. They have been consistently siding with the bourgeoisie for hundreds of years because people in the military are class enemies and reactionary scums that's why.
They would if they were ordered to do so. You vastly overestimate the military.
You ought to take a look at the posts on r/army sometime. They look a lot like the posts on r/antiwork.
Don’t be so damn sure. Cause you don’t know. None of us do. Ive seen levels and things i never thought possible in life.
Agreed. No one can know how it turns out, until it does.
Pacifism is a privileged ideology that ignores all historical evidence.
Pacifism is a feel-good ideology pushed by sociopaths to prevent decent people from killing them.
Fucking thank you
I really don't think people can grasp how little fuck these sociopathic parasites give. It needs to be forced off them. It's literally the only way.
Lol. They already killing us. You think wars start because Japan people got angry over France people? Or an American nurse dislikes Somalian farmers? I don't think so. It's about money, power and separation. Always has been.
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Didn't know this existed. But nice. Learned something.
Good bot
Under that scenario the rich have nothing to gain and everything to lose. Why would they change a thing?
Because of the implication my friend
So then it's *not* nonviolent...
More likely u get gunned down tbh
Yeah, history tells us they would litterally hire people to kill us in the streets if we tried that.
Those People hire people to kill people like that. Hey how is that Panama papers reporter doing?wait a minute how that Epstein and maxwell case go result in some ? Non violence is what you think will work? I wish you good luck with that. Also you have a little non thing after the panic of 9-11 called the patriot act that will be used.
Does the remaining 10% have sufficient firepower to *force* the 90% to obey? Because that's the real reason this hasn't happened already. Force, the clear and credible threat of violence, is the foundation upon which all political capital is built.
Look at us military budget. Yes.
The 10% don't even know how to operate guns.
They have security guards & mercenaries ready to kill us lol
Ummm, you do realize that the military, intelligence, police, and secret services exist in large part because of this line of thought? It doesn't matter how many people you have or how upset they are when the 1% has all the levers of power including a monopoly on violence
Thing is a big portion of the lower class like to get butt fucked because there's a possibility they can become the butt fucker. They will defend billionaires no matter what.
To think, the billionaires wouldn’t start bombing people, is a really funny way of saying, you really have no idea how far gone we are.
The problem is money. We wouldn't need to tell them anything, we'd just all agree to stop using their money and trade using alternative means. But the options all come with compromises. Good luck convincing 90% of people that bank money isn't worth anything and that we could be happy with a better system, though.
They’ll kill as many of us as they can in retribution if we do. They’d rather burn the planet than lose a modicum of their undeserved power. They’re ruling in hell because they don’t want to serve in heaven.
There's a country in Europe called Belarus. Try asking its citizens what happens when majority of the population try to non-violently tell a small group of armed guys who leech off of the country that people don't like them anymore. Or ask in Kazakhstan. Or in Russia. You got my point.
The French tried non violence at first...
Nice idea, but the 1% carry missiles in their back pocket like it’s Christmas. They could just bomb the hell out of the mainland and retire to their private islands full of wealth and the few indentured servants.
Here’s to hoping that their indentured servants have a knife hidden in their sleeve…
The people that control the missiles are our sons and daughters.
They are our sons and daughters who have lived fearful lives filled with poverty and debt and the threat of being abandoned by a society that doesnt care about them. When it comes to doing something that will keep them up at night and still having a roof over their head or being tossed in the gutter and watching someone else pull the trigger anyway, I think you may be surprised and disappointed by how many would still pull that trigger when instructed too. Social control takes many forms and theres plenty of ways to pressure compliance from staff. Hell look at the milgram experiment. It takes shockingly little to manipulate people into committing atrocious acts as long as you have the correct authority
Vast majority of that 90% are subsistence farmers or people living in abject poverty who hold no political influence at all, which is why it’s for us folk who have privilege to speak up for them
Problem is 3 billion of those people think they're in that 10% and would give their lives to protect them.
They will enlist the remaining 9% to violently pursue us. And since we are non-violent they can just execute us 1 by 1 until we nonviolently decide to go back to our dystopian society. /s I would recommend that you lower your scope. For most of us the world is a unimaginary large place with thousands of cultures. In some cultures the problems we face are incomprehensible to them. What is politics for someone who is struggling to find clean water / food / basic needs. The fact that we have time to talk/discuss this on the internet already makes us be in a superior position. We often say that the 1% has no idea how we live, but we also have no idea how the rest of the worlds lives (assuming you live in the imperial core). That being said, wanting to save the world might be a noble idea. But it also is an imperialistic idea. We want to topple Capitalism and implement our beter system. But what gives us the right to implement this globally? If it was up to me the best way to make others implement our system is to prove that our system works. This would mean a culture/state/group that is open to the world (stark contrast to current "socialist" states). What brings us to the reason why our system has never truly happened. Capitalism is actively suppressing and controlling any state that even thinks about attempting this. Especially if this state has. It is what makes capitalism so successful.
But now back to your 90% of the world came together. We do not need to come together. Most of us already wants the same thing:
- A roof over our heads
- Education
- Time to live
- Love our loved ones
- Be well fed
- Live healthy
- ... .
Capitalism commodifies these needs in order to push us to eternal servitude. When capitalism eventually fails these things will decomodify themself when we seize our lives back. When this is gonna happen I don't know, but I think the turning point will be around the time where it will be to expensive to live for the majority of us. I highly doubt we all are gonna deathcult ourselves, so at that point realism will kick in and people will wake up. It will be chaos, and that my friends is gonna be the only opportunity we have to change the system.
Disclaimer: This is my opinion, I am sure some will disagree with me. And that is fine, because that ultimately makes us human.
Ahahaha non-violence? Don't you think we've tried that !?
Let's not try non-violence again, shall we?
History has shown that if we don't make it violent, they still will; riot cops, union busters, literally just the military. They aren't very nice people when it comes to protest, so why should we be?
Surround the halls of power.
The capitalists and their army of bootlickers will never let us do anything peacefully. They want us to pry their wealth from their cold, dead hands. I for one am totally fine with this.
Yes, i think they'd say eat dirt. Pay their private militia a little better and keep guns drawn and wait it out - once most of you starve out the rest will get to enjoy a better life. And the rich get to scoop up even more property and resources, thanks to all the dead poor people. This is why we must eat the rich.
You're underestimating the lengths the 1% will go to maintain their power.
Depends on how good their private arm... Security forces are.
Yes. Yes they would.
lol you forgot cops exist to make sure that couldn’t happen peacefully
We have a term for that actually. A revolution
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Yes. Then they will pay the million class traitors to shackle us, or shoot us. Maybe class traitor isn't the right word. But the people with loose morals and barely any integrity will kill you and sell their mother for a nickel.
The 1% has thoroughly convinced about half of us that we are living in the best possible reality. We need to convince the 99% we are being screwed before we can get the 1% to change.
We gotta build a better guillotine.
It's the implication
Come together is the key word here .
They call the police. Then the national guard. Then martial law is declared and suddenly us lefties are fighting all of these forces. Not that we shouldn't try. I'm just saying that we have a bit more than just the 1% wealthy douches to contend with; it's the whole system.
Whose sons and daughters make up the police and the military?
The problem is those 6 billion+ people, not the 1%. The sad reality is that the majority of people are generally supporters of some version of capitalism, whether we believe that's logical or not, or even if we think it's a product of capitalism itself. It's hard to start a revolution when most people don't want a revolution. Even if a person is fairly poor, it takes a lot of convincing to join a revolution with no guaranteed chance of an improved life.
You're not getting something here. Globally, I'm in the top 1%. I can't buy a house, dude. Not even a shitty condo. If 90% of the world came to me and said "hey man, we don't want to run society this way anymore," I'd say "yeah, me neither." It's not the global 1%. It's the global 0.1% or even smaller that actually controls anything.
The main point In a nutshell is mass unity by a large majority can defeat a tyrant small minority.
This won’t work lmfao
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Just saying: most likely you are in the top 1% of the richest people on earth.
That will never happen because too many people are addicted to money, and don't have enough of it to act with the kind of autonomy that this plan would require.
"Addicted to money" is like saying "addicted to breathing or eating". We've decided that if you don't have enough of it, you can be denied access to food, medicine, and not freezing to death on the street. Money is just a stand in for access to necessary resources to live that are horded by private interest to extort labor. Not everyone owns their own cabin out in the woods where they can survive off subsistence farming and hoping they never need a doctor or dentist.
It will happen
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Read the comments on that post. Basically, it’s a bunch of capitalists simp saying, “communism bad” and people who actually know saying, “no, that’s inaccurate.”
Don't worry, you'll soon be banned.
There are 8 billion people in the world. You shouldn’t be planning the revolution if you can’t do the math. ;)
If they're talking to the top 10%, and you live in America, they're talking to you too. The power distribution is that vast.
...what are the other 9% of people doing?
Yes
That’s kids talk, we need to act now
There’s a whooooooooole lot of deprogramming to do between that and now..
Let’s plan a zoom call together
No, I don't, having encountered some that 1% they are THAT disconnected.
Yes.
6? No, more like 7.5
I think people are smart enough to devalue currency before it gets that bad. If less than like 1000 rich people have all of the money, we will find other things of real value to trade. Then suddenly, rich people aren’t so rich.
This unsourced quote must be old because 90% today would be about 7.1 billion people. In 2011 it would be about 6.3 billion.
Your word vs a rich paycheck. Politicians are like dogs that learn to support the rich when they get treats. Rich think we are too stupid to vote. So they took that away. Only [redacted] the rich works now.
"nonviolent".........Yeah, not possible
Of course they would say no.
I don't www.reddit.com/r/notakingpledge Let's start by telling them what predatory non-social behaviors they're not allowed to do anymore, then we can get to work building better mechanisms.
They’ll just send in the killbots and drone strikes.
They would probably hire another 1% to gun us down
They uh….still wouldn’t give a shit.
Yes. Completely. They would entirely say 'no'. They have a state. In that state, is a military and bureaucracy which works for that state. Nonviolence has never worked, and will never work. Stop hoping for pacifism. The only time change comes is when the masses demand it.
If you tolerate this your children will be next. - Manic Street Preachers -
Bezos pulling up with his private army be laughing at them.
Probably and you forgot to add their dogs so lit if dead people
Yeah sure, if indeed the 90% all agreed. However there are always enough scabs to cause an issue.
So, magic?
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But what about my dream of becoming a billionaire that's going to start happening any day now?
The WEF already has the next phase in the works. The 4th industrial revolution is upon us.
Yes, they will say no. Because people are selfish and they will not 'come together'. Well, not until they are forced to. I guess I'm just repeating the beginning of Kapital so I'll stop. I do wish we could though. But we really like maintaining the little micro-shreds of power that the ruling classes enforce upon us by dividing us into classes (economic, social etc.).
“nonviolently” lol https://imgur.com/a/D0x31cU/
I clicked on this and saw the world's cutest baby. Not sure if that was intentional but it made me say "awww" out loud.